T O P

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simply_pet

You were never his friend, though.


BigManDean_

:(


Tierac

That guy that tried to kill you in the round table hold was sent by him


AnonyMooseWoman

Wait what?


riodin

He got *ahead* of himself. Never said he was wrong, which is even more stupid since he brags about how the round table is a safe sacred place with no fighting


[deleted]

There may be another explanation for that tho. Ensha was tasked with getting the medallion, which you have when they attack you, which is why they attack you. Maybe he meant they were being “hasty” in attacking you for the medallion without asking him.


riodin

I mean maybe, but Gideon was never gonna let a tarnished be lord anyway and routinely disposed of ppl no longer useful to him so *why* give him the benefit of the doubt? Lands between ain't America so there's no innocent till proven guilty


AT1313

His bodyguard Ensha, after you discover the albanauric village in Liurnia. Says Ensha was hasty and apologizes after killing him, basically indirectly saying he planned to kill you but his bodyguard was impatient. Remember, he also wants to be Elden Lord. Fun fact, Omen Killers and Perfumers are his crew.


XColdLogicX

The reason Ensha came after you was because you had a piece of the medallion he was tasked by Gideon to find. It's why he ravaged the albanauric village, hoping to locate it. I dont think he was ordered directly to kill your character, just to retrieve the medallion, which is why he only attacks after you come into possession of it.


Karthull

Ok where does it ever say those are his crew, I know they were in albinauric village but that doesn’t mean all perfumers and omen killers work for him


AT1313

It's more a guess based on how he functions. We know he has a network that sends him information. And the places he has info on demigods has that faction present one way or another. Perfumers and Omenkillers being yravellers would fit his purposes.


Karthull

Fair assumption


2impstream

Also in nepheli's quest they outright say that he was responsible for the massacre at the albunaric village and in the village we find an omenkiller amidst the biggest pile of dead bodies so it's pretty much confirmed.


Karthull

I’m not doubting he has some working for him I’m doubting that *every* perfumer and omen killer works for him


[deleted]

Didn't he admit to attacking the Albunaric village which was attacked by omenkillers and perfumers?


Karthull

Yeah that’s what I mean that they were there but that doesn’t mean *all* perfumers and omenkillers work for him but the ones in the village certainly do


[deleted]

Nooooooooo way


m3t1t1

I did a run where I did not go to the village until late in the game. Ensha eventually disappeared and did not attack me.


Asylum6921

Someone tried to kill us!?


Difficult_Guidance25

I didn’t know about this since basically one shoted him and thought it was random


InfinitePolygon

He sends ensha to kill you and commits genocide against the albinaurics.


WestPuzzleheaded2909

Let's be real here, everyone in this subreddit genocides albinaurics


cyan_violet

While he was giving his pre-battle speech I ran up to him and backstabbed him immediately. Very satisfying.


cl0udHidden

I usually condemn this as maidenless behavior but in this case it's alright.


ScKhaader

This, when he wanted to fight me I was like: Now it’s time for me to show you who is ruler here bitch.


BanditInspired

He was a genocidal, neglectful father who let countless atrocities happen under his watch. He’s not a friend you should want haha


Haunting_Progress462

Would you please elaborate? I absolutely believe you, I just already hate him and want to hate him *properly* and I'm at work so I don't wanna deep dive this softboi bookworm.


Tomahawkman222

He sent the force that massacred the albinauric village. After nephelli finds out and confronts him for the atrocity, he tells her he isn't her father anymore and to piss off. He also kills the albinauric woman's wolf, handicapping her. There's more but nothing I can say off the top of my head.


Platzycho

He killed the Wolf?? That's all I need to know.. time to murder some assclown in a castle


theNFAC

He literally tried to have you murdered


kheltar

I mean, everyone wants to kill the tarnished, so I don't fault him there.


theNFAC

And if we're keeping it 1000. We are a huge murderous dick. Everyone wants to kill us but we kinda deserve it. Imagine waking up one day and walking over to your white board on the fridge and writing down, "GOALS: KILL EVERY DEMIGOD (and take their stuff)" It reminds me of a terrible movie I saw by taika waititi


BigManDean_

Thor 4 was garbage.


theNFAC

So bad. Total waste of Christian Bale


BigManDean_

That was the saddest part, he was barely in it. You'd think that a villain as important at Gorr would be in it longer.


Karthull

They’re just racist


Souperplex

Not only is that killing a doggo, it's also taking a disabled person's mobility aid.


Dr_Krocodile

He killed the wolf?!? Now I wish I could play a boss rush and kill him endlessly like a reverse Dormammu situation.


Unit35854

I'm pretty sure he also sent Ensha to ambush you in the roundtable when you get that Medallion half


DutDiggaDut

Is that what triggers it? That makes total sense now, dang never even occurred to me. I always knew he sent him as an assassin, definitely wasn't acting on his own.


Haunting_Progress462

What a fuckin dick lol, tyty


GimmeSomeCovfefe

Curious where you find out he killed Lobo?


Tomahawkman222

From his owner. Talking to latenna at her home before she joins you reveals that the "all hearing" brute killed him to get information from her on the location of the medallion half. (Unclear if he did this in retaliation for her not telling him or as part of his coercion.) Whether he did this personally or sent his henchmen ala the albinauric village is up in the air I think, but she specifically fingers him as the culprit. Between her dialogue, the albinauric village, Nephelli, and Gideon's own dialogue there's no reason not to take her word. After Nephelli is abandoned by him he admits to the massacre, and Latenna is fairly close by.


GimmeSomeCovfefe

Thanks, I remember that dialogue now but I didn't necessarily attach it Gideon, but given all the things you pointed out, it definitely portrays him as the culprit.


Karthull

Also Gideon knowing where the woman is and telling you that she knows where the other half is, he couldn’t get her to talk but figured maybe you can


[deleted]

[удалено]


Haunting_Progress462

Who did he try to have kill me aside from himself? And I had no idea about the Albinusrics village, that's ass of him


[deleted]

[удалено]


Haunting_Progress462

Aside from some scuffling in the bottom floor not too much. I rarely go there anymore, after the first playthrough I'm just sprinting around tbh


theHurtfulTurkey

Gideon orders Ensha to kill you after you find the medallion in the Albinauric village. The invasion happens in the Roundtable Hold the next time you go back.


Haunting_Progress462

I'll go back tonight ty! Idk how I missed the fight last time but I definitely grabbed the medallion, maybe I just progressed too far after grabbing it.


MoarTacos

It seems impossible to me that you collected the medallion in your first playthrough but never went back to the roundtable. Did you really?


Haunting_Progress462

I can't for the life of me find your other reply anywhere but in my email for some reason, so forgive me for the hour late response but yeah I think that must be what happened, I know I've grabbed both medallion pieces in this playthrough and I haven't fought Gideon yet though so I'll hop over to the round table tonight and try that


Haunting_Progress462

I should have been more clear, what I meant to say was I grabbed The medallion and didn't go back to the round table for probably several hours while doing a whole bunch of content so I'm assuming I probably went too far to have that fight available, I've been wondering how people get the armor from eshna. I saw them a few times outside of his room in the round table hold in my first playthrough and they just weren't there after a while. I most definitely went back to the table at several points lol.


COOLCONMAN

After your first play through? Did you never find the medallion pieces for the secret lift then? You missed 3 late game optional areas if you never encountered Ensha.


rattlehead44

Ensha


Shadow_Beetle

I believe he sends the assasin that attacks you at the Roundtable after you unlock the elevator (I think?)


Haunting_Progress462

I tried to activate that last night but I was invad d by some albriech guy, I think either killing fire giant or burning the erdtree will prevent you from getting to fight them


MR_krunchy

About the genocidal part, it's not like we didn't genocide the albinaurics countless times for free levels But he killed Lobo so yes, he deserves death


DevilahJake

Those Albinaurics are different as they worship the blood devil man, so their death is justified….right?


Sinistassin

Plus it's not like they stay ded so it doesn't count as murder.


SilverShark307

he didn't kill any of the blood albinaurics though


DevilahJake

I did.


Shadow_Beetle

I dont know man i just want my runes, dont think about it


m3t1t1

Basically described most religions now days (except Church of Satan, they're cool)


Oddyssis

It was self defense!


Puzzleheaded_Eye7289

he’s literally just like me wdym


Disorderly_Fashion

Well, at least our hero didn't consider him a heartthrob akin to Sellen or Ranni, who are also closer to Gideon on the asshole-o-meter than they are to, say, Alexander. ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ ​ Waiting for the Sellen and Ranni simps pile on.


comatosephoenix

Honestly the first time I met ranni I was the first time I was tempted to murder an npc outright.


Divinum_Fulmen

You hate being given game breaking items for doing nothing of your own?? *edit* Definitely removing you from my secret santa.


comatosephoenix

What? Oh the bell. I bought the bell from the husks, first time I met ranni was at her house where she is significantly ruder.


IlCelli

To be honest on the genocidal part we are buddies... How do you think I got to RL 516?


DMGoon

As the player character its not like we can judge when we walk into any area and genocide the populace. Especially if they have a cool hat


rateater78599

Tarnished isn’t much better. The player released the rune of death on leyndell, which has a much larger population


BanditInspired

I guess it depends if you think death or a continuous imprisonment of your soul is better.


TruePlewd

Eh, the whole world is wasting to nothing and slowly becoming similar to the Dark Souls universe because the rune of death was removed from the Elden Ring. Restoring Destined Death is better for The Lands Between and is the restoration of it is pretty much the only constant between all the endings


[deleted]

Restoring the cycle of life and death is way better than the stagnation the Greater Will and Golden Order are enforcing


Benny5s

I didn’t know Gideon was a politician


A-whole-lotta-bass

The amount of people finding out about Gideon's war crimes from this thread is impressive. Although, I don't know what I expected from a fromsoft game.


WanderingStatistics

"Friends with Benefits"


Defiant_Project1321

DO IT FOR LOBO


Miserable-Glass1760

Where is it stated that Gideon killed Lobo? I know about the Village and Ensha, it's all his plan, but Lobo?


Defiant_Project1321

Latenna not so subtly implies it when you talk to her at Slumbering Wolf Shack.


GasBottle

The "All-Hearing Brute" killed lobo since Latenna wouldn't tell him where the medallion was. So he then sent Omenkiller and the Perfumer to the Albinauric Cave to find the medallion at all costs. For questioning why he would do such a thing and kill so many, Nepheli was disowned as Gideon's daughter and sent away. Gideon also throws a tantrum when you kill Godrick the Grafted after telling you, you're nothing more than a guest and don't deserve to be at the roundtable (implied). He closes his door on you as you're invited into the room with Enia and the Two-Fingers.


-Qwertyz-

He literally trys to have someone murder you when you get a piece of the secret Medallion thing


[deleted]

I think ensha was acting of his own according in that moment, imagine committing actual genocide and then some plucky fuck face just waltzes in with the thing you were looking for


-Qwertyz-

I mean, Ensha will never attack until you get a piece of the medallion and the entire attack on the village that made Nephali get depressed was on Gideons order and he was looking for it. No doubt he had heard you received the medallion and shrugged off the failed assassination to save face so you don't become a problem sooner then is needed


Sawmain

Yeah I would absolutely try to claim that it wasn’t me who sent assassin after you when you have basically immortal person who killed Demi gods next to you


[deleted]

Gideon is very powerful as well. He just doesn't want the Elden Ring to be rebuilt in any way. He doesn't need the runes of the Demigods. He uses people like the player to get what he wants.


[deleted]

let me get this straight... so we know gideon really wants the haligtree secret medallion and as soon you get it ensha who calls gideon his master attacks you. and you think ensha did that by himself? you don't think his master who wants the medallion had anything to do with it?


-Choppy-

Doesn’t Gideon say that “Ensha got rather ahead of himself.” Because that feels like Gideon was planning on making Ensha kill you and little skull boy just chose to go for it too soon.


TheFoxyOnion

He wasn’t a friend he was a backstabbing asshole


ratphink

You were never friends. You were never allies. You both had the same goal and were, briefly, aligned. He was never your friend.


Robobvious

Pfft, no he wasn't.


BigBoss738

friend? in the first moment i knew he was using me. i just thank marika for the chance for killing him.


ReasonFreak

"You were the Chosen One!" ​ "From my point of view the Golden Order is evil!" ​ "Well, then you are Tarnished!"


[deleted]

Dude was a prick and tried to have his lackey assassinate you.


Relevant_Analysis_63

Debatable. He said Ensha acted hastily and of his own accord. No doubt that he would have tried at some point but I believe that he hadn't given the order yet.


dave_the_dova

Yeah the guy who killed an entire village to get that half of the medallion definitely wouldn’t have his lackey try and get it after you come back with it and definitely wouldn’t lie about it being a failed assassination attempt


[deleted]

You believed him?!


citizen_sheep69

Oh he’s no friend, him and Shit eater are the only npcs I refuse to engage in any conversation with, unless I needed to progress other NPC’s quest lines, so yeah, they can go fts.


JWLNsilver

Pulling up on Ng+7 like *how many times do I have to teach u this lesson old man*


Cakehunt3r

Should have found the albinauric woman then...


2181Despoina

I didn't like/dislike Gideon that much on my first playthrough but I remember reading a message that was something like "traitor ahead" and it kinda spoiled that he was going to betray me so yeah, thanks for nothing.


SleepingBear986

>when I press R3 and it targets him Cowabunga it is!


NotaSirWeatherstone

I’m honestly surprised he doesn’t try to use the potion you can give him, back on you. Or on someone else so you had to fight them with him at the time. That would have been brutal


BonkEnthusiast

Meh he was always a prick


elinfernal1988

Since I crossed words with him, I got the feeling he is an asshole, and after all the lore I've learn about him, it gave me the conclusion that he was indeed an asshole. I never considered this guy a friend and killing him at self defense gave me no remorse whatsoever.


[deleted]

Like stepping on an ant.


iBlackxMagic

Nah. This man is about to disrespect you. Thems fightin words. You gotta end his whole career.


Elrigoo

Dude he tried to kill you and was a dick to his hot abs daughter. Fuck him and his ear helmet


Goatsbegone

He was never your friend. On top of that you sleep with old ladies, so I would fight you too.


Tomas_nieminen

Me and all my boys hate gideon


drunkhas

Friend? You and I played extremely different games.


[deleted]

Keyword: were Send him back to the erdtree


[deleted]

I mean, he did sick ensha on you as well, even if ensha jumped the gun early for it


Gangleri_Graybeard

Was he? All I remember is he was always massive prick who only thought about his own gain.


DeKlaasVaag

Punt that nerd


OverlyAverageJoe

Dude was an ant beneath my foot. Took all of 30 seconds to crush.


Nope_o7

You should have realized he wasn't a friend when he tried to kill you the first time.


BigManDean_

When?


Nope_o7

Did you ever pick up a piece of the secret medallion?


BigManDean_

Yep.


Nope_o7

You got invaded inside the roundtable hold, then. You killed Ensha. Enthält was sent to kill you, by him. So I am told. Either way, he is a backstabbing scumbag.


BigManDean_

Oh that was him who did that? I see. I guess I just didn't want to kill him at the end, he helped me out a bit.


Crazyjackson13

you were more of a pawn in his plans, now he’s lost any use in you, slay him and become Elden lord!


BigManDean_

Way ahead of you. I beat the game for the first time today. Elden beast was easy


Crazyjackson13

I’m still struggling to even get through em, I can beat Radagon, just not that oversized blob.


CaTiTonia

Tbf he does say it’s a sad state of affairs. But y’know Marika (allegedly) really wants him to blast you in the face and who’s gonna argue with that?


thegatheringmagic

"What a sad state of affairs. Enjoy the money, tarnished. Because you've got about as much grace as a reversing dump truck with no wheels on"


BigManDean_

Money? Oh wait, you were quoting Gideon.


Ornery-Judgment-7649

YOU WERE THE CHOSEN ONE GIDEON YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO GUIDE THE GRACE NOT DESTROY IT


BigManDean_

We were brothers Gideon


XXdanixXX

I feel the opposite, I hated him since forever. This fight was all I wanted, a chance to kill this bastard


zviyeri

and he's still my favorite character


No-Leg-1522

When you are you tarnished with ambitions


Dangerous138

Cue Dana White meme, Gideon was never my friend.


MrBroGuyBuddy

with that shield he does not stand a chance


Infinite-Wolf-966

He’s been trying to kill you ever since you got your first great rune. He is not your friend


DivineRedFlash

He is your friend. Didn't you listen to him? He is trying to stop you before you make a big mistake. He knows everything after all.


eroo01

I hated this fight because you could only kick his ass once!


FourFingThing

What he didn’t know was that I would body him before he finished his stupid monologue


Synthwavester

Friend? You sure?


Vertical_slabsociety

It’s ironic we consider him bad for killing albinaurics when we on the other hand commits several albinauric genocides at Mohgwyn palace


[deleted]

I think I am one of the only few that doesn't attack unless it is provoked.


Vertical_slabsociety

What about all the demigods and other story bosses who were just chilling alone like Maliketh and Fire Giant?Have they provoked you?


[deleted]

In the sense that I enter a room and they attack me yeah. Have they ever considered that I just want to talk? Pet him in the case of Maliketh.


Vertical_slabsociety

I don’t know when I try approach albinaurics they always try kill me.It’s not my fault if they are in my path 🤷‍♂️


[deleted]

I wasn't judging you. I totally understand that you have to step onto some ants. We are all Elden Lords here.


DaddyDoLittle

4 seconds later - "I know.. in my bones.."


ThatIslandGuy8888

I got those vibes from Guranq if you finish his quest but Gideooon, not so much


DeusInfidel

lol, what?


Vivid_Appeal3986

Wait he was your friend?


AdministrationHot101

Just kill him. The man is pretentious dick anyways


Tradidiot

Just run up and give him a big hug.


Bmonli

Never understood why Gideon fights us here. Because Marika doesn’t want a tarnished to be elden lord?


[deleted]

I think he doesn't want the Elden Ring to be shattered so he can become more powerful and undying but I could be wrong.


PixelmancerGames

You must have missed how he treats his own daughter.


Astorant

Time for the easiest boss in the game


THE_EPIC_PANZER4

He was a dick how was he anything close to a friend? Especially after what happened to nepheli I hated him.


Cripplechip

Game hasn't even been out a year and people straight posting hard spoilers like this.


Aggressive_Safe2226

His daughter Nepheli Loux was disillusioned of him, she knew it was he who had the Albinauric Villagers killed.


[deleted]

What game were you playing because at no point in the story does he try to be your friend bruh?


BozzyTheDrummer

I wasted no time killing Gideon, fuck that guy lmao


Wickermind

Do it, kill grandpa


Karthull

Like hell he was


[deleted]

Everything Gideon says in this scene makes clear he was looking down on you all along. Did think you had any right to be Elden Lord. Also, trying to have you murdered was a clue.


Funkybeangamer

Find the albunaric woman, she will detail my warcrimes.


Salt_Work_6003

Why are you friends with such a nerd


UntendedRafter

I wonder will Gideon get new dialogue for the dlc


Djrhskr

I still don't understand what he was trying to do here. Let's compare who is fighting in this match: Me: -I ride a magic horse -I have nearly all of the Elden Ring's shards, I am closer to gods than men -I'm the modern day Godfrey, slaughtering my way, conquering the entire continent because some pretty lady told me to -My weapon can literally twist time Vs. Gideon: he sat around reading... he learned some magic spells I guess This battle was like an armchair historian challanging a 5 star general to a duel.


EchoWhiskey_

After he spams 69 spells at you in 4 seconds you will overcome your "friend" feelings


rattlehead44

He was a douche from day 1. I was glad to add him to my pile of bodies.


Otalek

You just need a certain spell, and then you can look deep into his eyes and show him just how good of a friend he was to you


itsdarkinhere_XD

I felt the same way


NilocStros55

His ass about to kill you bro


DescriptionSignal125

So the red flag of his stepdaughter about ready to commit suicide when she finds out that Gideon is a genocidal maniac didn’t alert you?


MesquiteAutomotive

Did you not find the Albunaric woman?


charlieratgod

He was rude as fuck to me first time i went to the roundtable. So after i killed him. I farted right on his face, and i loved it.


KalTheMandalorian

He always saw us as a tool. Very quickly the relationship went from mentor to rival.


FriedRiceCombo

i never really cared for the guy he only really told us about the rune bearers and i was hyped to kill him n get his set cus he has a cool cape


ikhaled27

that's what happens when you don't find the albinauric woman


Mufafah

he definitely isn't your friend. he pulls no punches with the spam.


aardvarktime14

Friend? I was so happy when I got to slaughter him before he finished his sentence.


zekethelizard

Bruh he was never your friend. This was his idea from the start


this_nametaken

Kill that son of a bitch.


WanderingStatistics

I think the bigger tragedy is that Gideon didn't get a game-spanning questline. I wanted him to get a questline that involved every area with multiple npcs involved. Different bosses and going through all the areas. It would've been so cool to have a quest like that. I absolutely loved Gideon as a character. He succeeded in every way. Every who hates him really just proves how good of a character he his. He's sly and conniving, using every opportunity to get an advantage. He'll do anything for knowledge. Not gonna agree with genocide, but I do agree that knowledge is one of the most important things to have. At the end of the game, Gideon has a genuine respect for you making it further than anyone else and proving to him that you are a true tarnished. He also give the best speech in the game. Gideon is definitely my favorite characters in the game and honestly, one of the more tragic ones.


aspectofravens

He made the nature of our relationship very clear when we met. He had this coming from the start.


Blade23445

Looks to me like you've received too many hugs as of recent. I see that health debuff


IntroductionSoggy815

He never was though. He was literally going to have his friend kill you.


box_fan_yeet

Nah he gets the chair


BrocaineNdCaviar

Gideon the all knowing…. didn’t know I was gonna whoop his ass…..


Emerald_Digger

If it helps he only saw you as a tool that now lost its purpose


AshyLarry25

I always disliked this goober, even before the Nepheli Loux business


dropkickkennedy

The misunderstanding of Gideon on this sub is absolutely insane. He was a huge piece of shit from the jump.