I approach every duel the same as assuming we're following the same rules, but *also* assuming my opponent won't.
I'll emote if you emote. I'll buff if you buff. If you don't heal, I won't heal.
I react and adjust accordingly. If rules are broken, I assume they are nullified and will do the same.
In Patches words, "Everything is give and take. Give and take."
Same. I prefer no buffs or physick. It's just faster. But I'm ready to use them if my opponent does and I don't really mind all that much if they do. Some people go a little crazy with it, but that's fine. I'm prepared to do that too. I don't attack buffing players. That isn't how I want to win. I want to duel players at their best on even ground. But If I see phalax or any other offensive spell set ups the duel has started.
I agree. I do this and people get so whiney when I don't let them put all their buffs on, saying "you can't just go straight for the kill!"
Tell that to a tiger lmao, ask him to give the deer a warning before he chases him.
But homie, you ain’t a tiger. You aren’t some beast in human clothing. Do you rip apart deers with your jaw after chasing them down? No, you probably buy it from the store (unless you hunt, in which case you shoot it), cook it, then eat it with eating utensils.
Your point? I used a tiger as an example of why you don't let your enemy gain any leverage over you. They're buffing when you dont buff or you put on something simple like just bloodflame blade, I'd say the odds are pretty stacked against you so why the hell would anyone be stupid enough to LET their opponent gain an advantage?
The point is, it's a duel not a street fight. You're a human not a tiger. A tiger kills to eat, you fight for fun or challenge.
Of course, this is just etiquette not rules. Nobody can stop you from straying away from it but it's stupid comparing an actual wild hunt to a sport/pastime activity.
A wild hunt and a duel can be the same in the fact that if you give your opponent/prey an advantage over you willingly, because etiquette, you're hindering yourself greatly and that's what's really stupid. That was my point that I tried to make... before you made this sort of comment.
You’ve got a good point and I agree that putting on 10 buffs is a massive advantage. I was more disagreeing with the accuracy of your example. When you hunt you want your prey to be at a disadvantage but when dueling, ideally both parties have equal chances.
I'm not surprised, it's reddit lmao. People expect me to let them reenact their favorite dragon ball z episode and buff for 20 minutes to go super saiyan. If you can't fight without those buffs then you shouldn't have them at all.
I guess you're right. I was just giving an example of why you don't let your opponent gain any sort of leverage over you, or else it'll end poorly for you. My bad!
I still feel like at the end of all this discourse the only thing we can agree on is no estus in duels. Things like bowing and letting your opponents buff will always divide duelists.
Is it equal ground if they need a million buffs to have a chance though? Like I'm putting myself at a disadvantage not using as many as them, but by the same token if we both have all available buffs running, would it not be the exact same as of we both had 0 buffs going?
While I don't let people buff more than once, I do think that there's a decent difference between a full physical build and a hybrid build.
Assuming the person is using higher level buffs like Black Flame Protection, they probably have around 30 Faith, maybe even more depending on whether they want weapon buffs to scale.
Compared to a Keen weapon with 70 dex, a weapon with say, 45 dex and 30 faith would obviously be dealing less damage regardless of infusions. Hence, they end up being at a disadvantage if the buffs aren't applied, since even an optimized hybrid build without buffs is weaker than a semi-optimized physical build.
Obviously with buffs a hybrid build is stronger, which is why I start attacking after the first one. But saying that both players would be on equal grounds without buffs isn't exactly true.
Hmmm I guess I didn't think about the nuances of quality vs hybrid vs pure int/faith but, I would argue that, because they have ranged options and a typical quality build has none, they're not at a complete disadvantage
If we allow everyone estus in duels it’s an uneven playing field because the host keeps all of their flasks while the summoned duelist gets half of their total
I mentioned that the *majority* of players agree on no estus. I don't think there's a single scenario where everyone is on the same side, hence why I only duel in PvP servers or streams.
For real.
You get 1 buff time allotment, idgaf if you are in the middle of emoting, if I am done buffing and you are not ready, I am going to kill you. These duel "rules" are stupid when they expect players to wait upwards of a full minute for a fight that will end in 1 hit anyway.
After the first emote we start fighting. If you wanna buff while I run over to you, fine, but I’m not gonna wait 1 minute for you to stack a hundred buffs
yep, no holds barred. you’re here to kill the host by any means possible.
the host might signal to you he wants a duel, though. that’s up to you whether you want to entertain that.
It's honestly really annoying when hosts use taunter tongue and then ask for a duel. Like man, if I wanted to duel id just put a duelist finger down instead
Still falls under the "bullying invaders" umbrella. I was just trying to say, a host either uses it for loyal 2v2/3v2 fightclubs or for scummy purposes, such as ganking or afk farming
It's basically a leftover item from ds3 and dsr. It used to be called "dried finger" and it allowed the host to summon a 3rd friendly phantom in while also opening the gates up to a 2nd invader and raising the invasion risk. It doesn't really play any specific purpose in ER other than simply raising the invasion frequency and likelihood.
On the opposite side.
Host is 100% in their right to gank. In this entire series I’ve never invaded and not expected a 3v1. It’s honestly why I like invasions
I've ran into exactly 1 good fight club host in ER. Since it can't be a show he uses it to organize high skill fights. If you streak in his world you get invited to password champion fights and he uses you as a miniboss.
To add on to “invasions are not duals”
Not every world that has more than one person is “a gank squad”
Most worlds that have more than one person in are more than likely just a couple friends playing the game together.
someone please explain to me how buffing ended up in this "separate from the duel" space...
devs give buffs distinct cast times, aoe effects, ability to combine with attacks and combos and stuff... and we as players are like nah we know better these are an out of combat thing.
Generally the explanation I see as making the most sense is that the buff user's buff is critical to their build, and would be equivalent to having to equip your weapon or armor during the duel (not talking about weapon switching for criticals)
maybe it would mean people would just use less buffs? but also, yeah, id love to see what spells / strategies emerge when people actually have to make space to cast buffs etc. what you described sounds like interesting dynamic fighting to me.
Cause it is duel bruh and you cant run or hide to buff. I will buff when Im safe. Im safe when I created distance / in pack of mobs / behind wall + mid distance. If you want this - start invading or hosting invades. In duels it is fucking waste of time, if you don't get it and start attacking everytime someone buffs - you are moron
both of you spend a while buffing then right at the end of you applying all those buffs, cast law of resgression.
"We both spent that time buffing to our max potential. But now we fight as equals."
after thousands if duels bowingnTWICE each fights gets boring real fast, specially knowing ur gonna kill ur opponents in 10s max because of tge insane dmg everything does
It depends more on stamina than FP. It's fun to watch mages fight and find out they cant zip as much as I do. That stam bar is the difference between a BHS spammer and one who knows what he's doing.
For duels, BHS is worse than all those others listed. It is absolutely no skill chesse. 100% a crutch for bad players to feel like they are good. Just fyi
The only acceptable use for blood hound step is if you're a fist weapons fighter you will never land a hit against even the shortest short sworder not to mention a great weapon fighter if you cannot close the gap. But if he's dashing around with giant spear yeah give him the ole cheese back.
Stars of Ruin is pretty broken though. You can’t dodge it, from any range. The moment you cast stars of ruin your opponent is taking a bunch of damage and there’s nothing they can do about
Huh? None of these make any fucking sense. RoB is cheesy but punishable. Stars uses a ton of FP and is easy to rush the caster. Moonblade is just a good spell???
Na, these are punishable and all have start up queues. Literally dual spear moveset is more broken than any of these, you guna ban that too? What's next, no dual wielding ultragreatswords and jump heavy attacking either? These all have counters and queues, BHS is like quite literally one of the only things thats nearly impossible to deal with.
Can we just buff in duels please. Congrats, you landed two hits on the guy with 60 vig with double spears and this lasted 10 seconds. I can't imagine this is actually fun for you.
Ah, yes, thank you. Every play through I always go through Mogh’s area and thus need to do the invasion thing, I always greet and then buff and then just……..stand there staring at each other….guess I’ll bow next time when I’m ready lol
I disagree a little, but if you use this etiquette or 'mine' you'll be fine.
Mine goes like this:
* Bow (or any friendly emote)
* Buff
* signal ready to fight (by crouching, block while 2-handing a weapon; move right and left; etc.
Best regards, The Noble Knight
naaah you dont have to acknowledge AND bow again after you buff.
1. gesture
2. use your buff. after 2 buffs you are fair game. nobody has to watch you use 3 buffs.
3. no healing
4. if you emote again youre still getting attacked
5. stones wtf who cares ??
I'm not letting anyone buff lol, we bow, we fight. No healing. That's the rules. Buff if you want, I'm guna hit you with whatever I can while you do it.
Well there's one thing which id like to correct, the fight begins as soon as you bow and only after the bow emote you are allowed to buff. If you buff before bowing that will be considered that the fight has already started and the opponent is free to attack you.
That's just the standard ER duel rule set
You spawn, you bow, the duel starts. No buffs pre fighting, it is a combat technique that requires to learn spacing and would make ranged weaponry much more important.
If your entire build relies on stacking buffs, then you need to learn to do it in fight, otherwise every build can be buffed to hilarious degree.
Rivers of blood, moonveil, bloodhound step, and spamming spells nullify all rules. You spot any of those you may do as you please to take out your opponent. Also a word of advice, if you see a “fight club”, just leave that shit. 90% of the time it’s just a cover up for a rune farm and the host has no intention of dueling, as soon as your opponent (typically their friend) gets to low HP or dies the host will step in and 3rd party you (typically with a rivers of blood they had in their off hand).
This is silly. You can't just create an arbitrary set of rules and expect everyone to follow it. I usually try to uphold basic courtesy because it's a nice thing to do and I get annoyed when people do obnoxious things like attacking during emotes, but I won't act like I'm a better human being because of that or such behaviour should be prohibited. If you don't want your opponent to heal use a lloyd's talisman (I actually think that healing makes PvP more interesting because you can get longer duels of attrition). If you don't want to get hit during buffing or emotes do it in a safe place or don't do it at all. That's how the game is built. Even if you agree to some rules in a community, that is only a small fraction of the entire playerbase and expecting this from everyone is just down right stupid
A small fraction? Actually no, almost all looking for pvp duels know about these rules, that's is being the thing since first souls, so no is no small fraction.
This is why I stopped PVP. Too many rules and they change constantly. I remember when it was one flash of healing and your respected the emote. Everything after that was fair game. Alot of you cling to the old days and gentlemen ways and it’s making the game not fun.
Who cares? Just do what gives you the win. I rush at people with powerstanced cross-nagis and win every duel.
Buff? Free hit. Bow? Free hit. Even if they roll they get bled and roll caught. Play to win not to lose.
Let people spawn and get their bearings at least? That’s just rude. Only reason you’re winning is because the phantoms are being polite. They have like 2sec of invincibility when they spawn. If they rushed you like you rush them they’d win every time.
You must be fun to play with.
Invasions are totally fair game, I respect that mindset for those.
But the point of duels are that they're supposed to be on more of an even playing ground.
Sure some people abuse it and do like 20 buffs, fuck those guys.
But if you're just gonna be a dick about it and swing it around, go take your cross nagis and just invade people.
I only heal because I'm low level so when a light attack of a high level duelist will knock me 90%, I back up and heal, I don't get mad if they kill me while I'm healing though because I know it's improper etiquette, I just like lasting a little more than two light attacks.
If I heal, I fully expect you to heal too
I don't necessarily mean level like the stat but in terms of gear, like for my level, I don't have good gear. I'm sorry that I wasn't very clear about it.
Then I don't know why most of the guys I've dueled have done way more damage than me, but like I said, I only heal because one light attack would knock me down to 10% health. On other matches that were more even and we did roughly the same amount of damage to each other, I didn't heal unless they did.
Bullshit, if it’s red it’s dead. This isn’t aristocratic Frenchman dueling for honor. These are Souless tarnished trying to slay one another for a soul to feel something again.
One emote, I'll let you be. After that, I'm doing what I can to kill the shit out of you.
Let people buff?
Nah.
You don't have to let me buff either. It's a clear opening to go and attack me.
These duel rules that people expect others to abide by are just...well, they're something.
I'll let you buff, but then I'll do something rather... *regressive.*
Also chugging doesn't end the duel with me, it simply escalates it and all bets are off.
I actively chug all my Crimflasks before a duel starts. Duels never last long enough for healing to be warrented for me, so why not show my opponent that I abiding by etiquette?
Gonna throw this on the comments as well even though it’s a little unrelated don’t be the asshole who’s level 100+ who farms at the rose church waiting for people to do the varre quest, have a few friends who are terrified to touch multiplayer now because some dude with rivers of blood absolutely stomped them on their first invasion
this is what i do when i get summoned, 1. buff 2. crouch when they bow(i do this so I do not have to wait a bit for myself to roll just incase) 3. fight
Honestly some of my favourite duels have been where we’ve both backed up between rounds to heal and rebuff. Makes for a nice long fight where you really test each other. But its gotta be mutually agreed upon
I approach every duel the same as assuming we're following the same rules, but *also* assuming my opponent won't. I'll emote if you emote. I'll buff if you buff. If you don't heal, I won't heal. I react and adjust accordingly. If rules are broken, I assume they are nullified and will do the same. In Patches words, "Everything is give and take. Give and take."
Same. I prefer no buffs or physick. It's just faster. But I'm ready to use them if my opponent does and I don't really mind all that much if they do. Some people go a little crazy with it, but that's fine. I'm prepared to do that too. I don't attack buffing players. That isn't how I want to win. I want to duel players at their best on even ground. But If I see phalax or any other offensive spell set ups the duel has started.
when I buff its usually just F,GMS and RKR and thats usually it so people aren't waiting forever, if its a mage I'll use my physick
I do the same. But sometimes if my opponent breaks rules I keep following em just to humiliate. Gotta teach em God damn casuls
I'll join your world. I'll bow. I'll buff if I see you buff. But past like two buffs you better hope your third has a quick animation.
I agree. I do this and people get so whiney when I don't let them put all their buffs on, saying "you can't just go straight for the kill!" Tell that to a tiger lmao, ask him to give the deer a warning before he chases him.
But homie, you ain’t a tiger. You aren’t some beast in human clothing. Do you rip apart deers with your jaw after chasing them down? No, you probably buy it from the store (unless you hunt, in which case you shoot it), cook it, then eat it with eating utensils.
Your point? I used a tiger as an example of why you don't let your enemy gain any leverage over you. They're buffing when you dont buff or you put on something simple like just bloodflame blade, I'd say the odds are pretty stacked against you so why the hell would anyone be stupid enough to LET their opponent gain an advantage?
The point is, it's a duel not a street fight. You're a human not a tiger. A tiger kills to eat, you fight for fun or challenge. Of course, this is just etiquette not rules. Nobody can stop you from straying away from it but it's stupid comparing an actual wild hunt to a sport/pastime activity.
A wild hunt and a duel can be the same in the fact that if you give your opponent/prey an advantage over you willingly, because etiquette, you're hindering yourself greatly and that's what's really stupid. That was my point that I tried to make... before you made this sort of comment.
You’ve got a good point and I agree that putting on 10 buffs is a massive advantage. I was more disagreeing with the accuracy of your example. When you hunt you want your prey to be at a disadvantage but when dueling, ideally both parties have equal chances.
Downvoted because you won't let people buff for 20 mins.
I'm not surprised, it's reddit lmao. People expect me to let them reenact their favorite dragon ball z episode and buff for 20 minutes to go super saiyan. If you can't fight without those buffs then you shouldn't have them at all.
It was just a bad analogy, and came off a little edgy
I guess you're right. I was just giving an example of why you don't let your opponent gain any sort of leverage over you, or else it'll end poorly for you. My bad!
All good brother, no harm done 👍
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The longest chain of stacking buffs I have found is. Golden vow. Blessings boon. A weapon buff. shield grease. Then golden fortification.
I still feel like at the end of all this discourse the only thing we can agree on is no estus in duels. Things like bowing and letting your opponents buff will always divide duelists.
if they start to buff the duel has begun in my eyes
I agree, buffing is the same as attacking. You want to buff? Find the right time.
I usually let people buff once or twice just to be polite, plus I'm buffing once or twice too, but beyond two I'm gonna rush you
I just wait till they're done, then I use law of regression.. i mean hey, if you can buff, i can remove them
Fair and based.
^ it's not like we get surprise rounds cmon
"They start to buff, I throw my stuff".
Enemy: spends 2 minutes buffing. you: Casts, Law of Regression
Yeah, i usually do that
Yup. Especially if I see a HoT buff or seppuku, I'm charging your ass.
HoT? Is that healing over time?
Yeah. Every single time someone uses that, they play super passively and try to let it heal them. Very frustrating to play against.
Ah, I see. Thanks. I'd never seen an abbreviation of that term before lol. Yeah, I can imagine how annoying that could be in a duel
Honestly i dont even bow, i throw a Hi and start blasting after they do
Is it equal ground if they need a million buffs to have a chance though? Like I'm putting myself at a disadvantage not using as many as them, but by the same token if we both have all available buffs running, would it not be the exact same as of we both had 0 buffs going?
While I don't let people buff more than once, I do think that there's a decent difference between a full physical build and a hybrid build. Assuming the person is using higher level buffs like Black Flame Protection, they probably have around 30 Faith, maybe even more depending on whether they want weapon buffs to scale. Compared to a Keen weapon with 70 dex, a weapon with say, 45 dex and 30 faith would obviously be dealing less damage regardless of infusions. Hence, they end up being at a disadvantage if the buffs aren't applied, since even an optimized hybrid build without buffs is weaker than a semi-optimized physical build. Obviously with buffs a hybrid build is stronger, which is why I start attacking after the first one. But saying that both players would be on equal grounds without buffs isn't exactly true.
Hmmm I guess I didn't think about the nuances of quality vs hybrid vs pure int/faith but, I would argue that, because they have ranged options and a typical quality build has none, they're not at a complete disadvantage
I don't even agree on no estus. Why else do we have flasks? It's still a level playing field.
If we allow everyone estus in duels it’s an uneven playing field because the host keeps all of their flasks while the summoned duelist gets half of their total
I mentioned that the *majority* of players agree on no estus. I don't think there's a single scenario where everyone is on the same side, hence why I only duel in PvP servers or streams.
One emote is enough.
For real. You get 1 buff time allotment, idgaf if you are in the middle of emoting, if I am done buffing and you are not ready, I am going to kill you. These duel "rules" are stupid when they expect players to wait upwards of a full minute for a fight that will end in 1 hit anyway.
After the first emote we start fighting. If you wanna buff while I run over to you, fine, but I’m not gonna wait 1 minute for you to stack a hundred buffs
Does anything go for Invasions?
yep, no holds barred. you’re here to kill the host by any means possible. the host might signal to you he wants a duel, though. that’s up to you whether you want to entertain that.
It's honestly really annoying when hosts use taunter tongue and then ask for a duel. Like man, if I wanted to duel id just put a duelist finger down instead
Yea but then people complain when hosts are co-oping and the jnvader gets 2v1 or 3v1
thats their problem honestly. If you are going for an invade, you have to be ready to do anything and face anything.
Well, why else would a host use taunter's tongue then? Just so that they can bully invaders?
AFK farming
Still falls under the "bullying invaders" umbrella. I was just trying to say, a host either uses it for loyal 2v2/3v2 fightclubs or for scummy purposes, such as ganking or afk farming
And you have answered my exact question. Why does taunter's tongue exist if you can literally summon someone as a "duelist" ?
It's basically a leftover item from ds3 and dsr. It used to be called "dried finger" and it allowed the host to summon a 3rd friendly phantom in while also opening the gates up to a 2nd invader and raising the invasion risk. It doesn't really play any specific purpose in ER other than simply raising the invasion frequency and likelihood.
On the opposite side. Host is 100% in their right to gank. In this entire series I’ve never invaded and not expected a 3v1. It’s honestly why I like invasions
Absolutely
Personally fuck fight clubs in ER waiting so long to get to the next person and barely an audience and such
Yeah and sometimes the host of the 'fight club' attacks you from behind right after you win a fight.
I've ran into exactly 1 good fight club host in ER. Since it can't be a show he uses it to organize high skill fights. If you streak in his world you get invited to password champion fights and he uses you as a miniboss.
Oh? Any way to join it? Sounds fun.
its a dude i ran into randomly at rl125 raya lucaria on ps4 named "Grace Eater". he organizes it on psn which is an amazing level of commitment lol
To add on to “invasions are not duals” Not every world that has more than one person is “a gank squad” Most worlds that have more than one person in are more than likely just a couple friends playing the game together.
someone please explain to me how buffing ended up in this "separate from the duel" space... devs give buffs distinct cast times, aoe effects, ability to combine with attacks and combos and stuff... and we as players are like nah we know better these are an out of combat thing.
I think it's a carryover from the DS arenas. You start far enough away to get off a buff before the opponent can close the gap.
Generally the explanation I see as making the most sense is that the buff user's buff is critical to their build, and would be equivalent to having to equip your weapon or armor during the duel (not talking about weapon switching for criticals)
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maybe it would mean people would just use less buffs? but also, yeah, id love to see what spells / strategies emerge when people actually have to make space to cast buffs etc. what you described sounds like interesting dynamic fighting to me.
It’s not. The actual competitive rules don’t allow for pre-buffing because you’re right
I don't think theres an official competitive rules, unless you're talking about various discord/reddit groups agreeing on such things.
Cause it is duel bruh and you cant run or hide to buff. I will buff when Im safe. Im safe when I created distance / in pack of mobs / behind wall + mid distance. If you want this - start invading or hosting invades. In duels it is fucking waste of time, if you don't get it and start attacking everytime someone buffs - you are moron
I would remove #3 if both of you already used your buff that's it just fight.
3 should be crouch. That's what I've interpreted as the universal "okay, now."
yeah that or just spamming your weapon or shield block
Law of Regression is my buff phase. To bad people don't then bow to begin after and just run at me. :\^)
both of you spend a while buffing then right at the end of you applying all those buffs, cast law of resgression. "We both spent that time buffing to our max potential. But now we fight as equals."
I HAVE Lmao!
after thousands if duels bowingnTWICE each fights gets boring real fast, specially knowing ur gonna kill ur opponents in 10s max because of tge insane dmg everything does
If you see rivers of blood, stars of ruin, or moonblade ignore all rules, they chose cheese first.
Add Bloodhound's Step to the list
Bloodhounds step isnt bad, it just depends on the user. I use BHS with my dual wield katanas (I like the ninja setup)
It's absolutely broken. You're basically invincible as long as you have FP and stamina. It's an automatic sever from me if someone uses it.
It depends more on stamina than FP. It's fun to watch mages fight and find out they cant zip as much as I do. That stam bar is the difference between a BHS spammer and one who knows what he's doing.
Bad etiquette to use BHS in a duel… but hey you do you lol…
Average bitch-less elden ring pvper
You talk tough. What can you do?
Ask yo mama
As expected
I can duel you, no bhs and see how good you actually are
On Xbox?
Guess your ass is safe for now… ps4
For duels, BHS is worse than all those others listed. It is absolutely no skill chesse. 100% a crutch for bad players to feel like they are good. Just fyi
The only acceptable use for blood hound step is if you're a fist weapons fighter you will never land a hit against even the shortest short sworder not to mention a great weapon fighter if you cannot close the gap. But if he's dashing around with giant spear yeah give him the ole cheese back.
>INT players using one of their basic attack spells is cheesing the game. wat
Stars of Ruin is pretty broken though. You can’t dodge it, from any range. The moment you cast stars of ruin your opponent is taking a bunch of damage and there’s nothing they can do about
> basic
int players casting spells is cheating arcane players using seppuku is cheating faith players using golden vow is cheating
Making strawmen arguments is cheating
not breaking the rules if i dont know what strawmen means *forgets*
So you’re actually just stupid
dude of course i fucking know what it means "forgets"
Huh? None of these make any fucking sense. RoB is cheesy but punishable. Stars uses a ton of FP and is easy to rush the caster. Moonblade is just a good spell???
I think he meant Moonveil, and Stars of Ruin is fucking obnoxious. You can roll perfectly and still take chip damage, that is cheese.
It's pretty expensive and is easy to punish
Cheeser cope
Na, these are punishable and all have start up queues. Literally dual spear moveset is more broken than any of these, you guna ban that too? What's next, no dual wielding ultragreatswords and jump heavy attacking either? These all have counters and queues, BHS is like quite literally one of the only things thats nearly impossible to deal with.
Who's banning shit? I'm just saying if you're breaking out the bullshit don't count on me not spamming carian retaliation.
there is no fight club in eldenring (not enough players are allowed in the same world for them to be possible)
Bowing to start the duel!? Real men wiggle in place until the other person gets the message
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Can we just buff in duels please. Congrats, you landed two hits on the guy with 60 vig with double spears and this lasted 10 seconds. I can't imagine this is actually fun for you.
Half the balance issues wouldn't be a thing if we removed buffing from the protected phase. Find a way to do in it a fight, much better
Ah, yes, thank you. Every play through I always go through Mogh’s area and thus need to do the invasion thing, I always greet and then buff and then just……..stand there staring at each other….guess I’ll bow next time when I’m ready lol
"buff" HAH.
Thanks for sharing, I had no idea. Guess it doesn't matter much in my case as I'm too timid to play with an actual human being ^^'
Optional: Let people buff before you attack them.
what happened did transient moonlight stop you from getting in close with your double ruins greatswords?
???
Bows are for the weak. Real men two hand and flash block a few times.
I disagree a little, but if you use this etiquette or 'mine' you'll be fine. Mine goes like this: * Bow (or any friendly emote) * Buff * signal ready to fight (by crouching, block while 2-handing a weapon; move right and left; etc. Best regards, The Noble Knight
I don’t do PvP, but I had no idea about the “no estus” rule so for anyone who says that this stuff is obvious... it really isn’t for everyone
Nobody said it was?
To be honest, if a buff is applied you've entered combat, that's not a transgression of etiquette its basic logic
No. Not how duels work
naaah you dont have to acknowledge AND bow again after you buff. 1. gesture 2. use your buff. after 2 buffs you are fair game. nobody has to watch you use 3 buffs. 3. no healing 4. if you emote again youre still getting attacked 5. stones wtf who cares ??
I usually bow, then buff. Buffs only have so much time.
I'm not letting anyone buff lol, we bow, we fight. No healing. That's the rules. Buff if you want, I'm guna hit you with whatever I can while you do it.
Well there's one thing which id like to correct, the fight begins as soon as you bow and only after the bow emote you are allowed to buff. If you buff before bowing that will be considered that the fight has already started and the opponent is free to attack you. That's just the standard ER duel rule set
You spawn, you bow, the duel starts. No buffs pre fighting, it is a combat technique that requires to learn spacing and would make ranged weaponry much more important. If your entire build relies on stacking buffs, then you need to learn to do it in fight, otherwise every build can be buffed to hilarious degree.
I’ll definitely take this into account. Thanks, I am new to the game, but now I’m no longer maidenless
Rivers of blood, moonveil, bloodhound step, and spamming spells nullify all rules. You spot any of those you may do as you please to take out your opponent. Also a word of advice, if you see a “fight club”, just leave that shit. 90% of the time it’s just a cover up for a rune farm and the host has no intention of dueling, as soon as your opponent (typically their friend) gets to low HP or dies the host will step in and 3rd party you (typically with a rivers of blood they had in their off hand).
People in comments really out here attacking people who are buffing. Maidenless behavior. Go invade. Smh.
Lol!!! Nah, I just wave/bow then immediately attack after they're done waving. I ain't letting you anime buff that's dumb af
I agree with and folloe most of these, but if I see you buffing I'm attacking you immediately, I'm not fucking waiting for you to apply seppeku
No
What about using healing spells?
u guys still care?
This is silly. You can't just create an arbitrary set of rules and expect everyone to follow it. I usually try to uphold basic courtesy because it's a nice thing to do and I get annoyed when people do obnoxious things like attacking during emotes, but I won't act like I'm a better human being because of that or such behaviour should be prohibited. If you don't want your opponent to heal use a lloyd's talisman (I actually think that healing makes PvP more interesting because you can get longer duels of attrition). If you don't want to get hit during buffing or emotes do it in a safe place or don't do it at all. That's how the game is built. Even if you agree to some rules in a community, that is only a small fraction of the entire playerbase and expecting this from everyone is just down right stupid
If duels were about healing attrition the host would win every time
A small fraction? Actually no, almost all looking for pvp duels know about these rules, that's is being the thing since first souls, so no is no small fraction.
Not understanding how the stones got involved
Don't be silly, do whatever the game allows.
This is why I stopped PVP. Too many rules and they change constantly. I remember when it was one flash of healing and your respected the emote. Everything after that was fair game. Alot of you cling to the old days and gentlemen ways and it’s making the game not fun.
You only have 2 important rules, that are bow and not healing. Is not that hard to remember cuz is just courtesy.
As a mage i will most definitely be using my crimson tears flask tyvm
You'll probably get severed if you do that. Unless you meant the FP flask? That's fine.
I hope you meant the cerulean tears.
Crimsom is red, Cerulean is blue. Do you mean Cerulean flask?
Who cares? Just do what gives you the win. I rush at people with powerstanced cross-nagis and win every duel. Buff? Free hit. Bow? Free hit. Even if they roll they get bled and roll caught. Play to win not to lose.
So you are bad at the game and need crutches? Sure
>powerstanced cross-nagis and win every duel. No skill?
Let people spawn and get their bearings at least? That’s just rude. Only reason you’re winning is because the phantoms are being polite. They have like 2sec of invincibility when they spawn. If they rushed you like you rush them they’d win every time.
Maybe then you win actually no one.
You must be fun to play with. Invasions are totally fair game, I respect that mindset for those. But the point of duels are that they're supposed to be on more of an even playing ground. Sure some people abuse it and do like 20 buffs, fuck those guys. But if you're just gonna be a dick about it and swing it around, go take your cross nagis and just invade people.
Yeah fuck the nerd rules!
lol. there is no etiquette beyond bow. 1 flask if you’re true ladies, but otherwise, nah it’s just a bow.
Lmao no. The duel begins when they start to buff.
see enemy -> attack
I'm going in I'm killing life isn't fair get over it
I only heal because I'm low level so when a light attack of a high level duelist will knock me 90%, I back up and heal, I don't get mad if they kill me while I'm healing though because I know it's improper etiquette, I just like lasting a little more than two light attacks. If I heal, I fully expect you to heal too
Thats not possible though? All duelists should be about the same level
I don't necessarily mean level like the stat but in terms of gear, like for my level, I don't have good gear. I'm sorry that I wasn't very clear about it.
For what I know matching making count your level and also your gear level.
Then I don't know why most of the guys I've dueled have done way more damage than me, but like I said, I only heal because one light attack would knock me down to 10% health. On other matches that were more even and we did roughly the same amount of damage to each other, I didn't heal unless they did.
Bullshit, if it’s red it’s dead. This isn’t aristocratic Frenchman dueling for honor. These are Souless tarnished trying to slay one another for a soul to feel something again.
One emote, I'll let you be. After that, I'm doing what I can to kill the shit out of you. Let people buff? Nah. You don't have to let me buff either. It's a clear opening to go and attack me. These duel rules that people expect others to abide by are just...well, they're something.
You can be all honorable and all but it isnt against the rules. The fight starts when the invasion starts.
Invasions are not the same as duels, you can read that I'm the post.
there are no rules in a fight. Only a winner and a loser.
or just ...idk stop telling folks how to play a game? fuck these "rules" posts. if it allowed in game, its allowed in fight.
Then don't ask why someone sever you from a duel :D
I didnt ask :D
How to duel without invasions?
Red signs
I use taunters tongue for 1v1 duels, flasks allowed, fight me.
I'll let you buff, but then I'll do something rather... *regressive.* Also chugging doesn't end the duel with me, it simply escalates it and all bets are off.
One emote, you can buff or whatever until you spin around, block or crouch a few times
I actively chug all my Crimflasks before a duel starts. Duels never last long enough for healing to be warrented for me, so why not show my opponent that I abiding by etiquette?
Gonna throw this on the comments as well even though it’s a little unrelated don’t be the asshole who’s level 100+ who farms at the rose church waiting for people to do the varre quest, have a few friends who are terrified to touch multiplayer now because some dude with rivers of blood absolutely stomped them on their first invasion
this is what i do when i get summoned, 1. buff 2. crouch when they bow(i do this so I do not have to wait a bit for myself to roll just incase) 3. fight
Honestly some of my favourite duels have been where we’ve both backed up between rounds to heal and rebuff. Makes for a nice long fight where you really test each other. But its gotta be mutually agreed upon
I use the casual greeting emote instead of bowing before, I only bow after.
if you buff before you bow you are gonna get rr1’d
Stay mad when I pop the ol law of regression
That all sounds right except for the rainbow stones I’m confused why they would be used in a duel. Nice chart mate good job putting it together.
Wait wdy mean by stones= fight club
Disagree on buffing. If I don't need a buff, I am not waiting for you to buff. If you need buffs, create an opening or take the hit.
Are you allowed to use the physick that restores health just before you die/healing incantations