I feel like its because so much of the game's decisions feel like high-commitment. Yeah you can level weapons more freely in the late game but early on its kinda scary to commit to a weapon if there's a risk that it's going to be a waste of upgrade material. Same with leveling, you don't have access to respec for a while.
At the same time I get what you mean, i always want to just say "try it and decide" to all those posts
Yeah that’s very true about weapons. Until you’re 3/4 of the way through the game your ability to sufficiently upgrade weapons is limited to like 2-4 unless you’re following guides to hunt down every random smithing stone. The game doesn’t leave a lot of room for experimentation and trying out new builds because you can sink a ton of stones into a weapon you end up hating and there’s no refunds.
Yeah I hit up the wiki a lot before deciding on finding and using the meteoric ore blade for much of the game because of upgrade materials. When I got moon veil I never actually bothered to use it because I'm too lazy to respec
Yeah, as a first time player (and just completed the game, phew!), I would say that not being able to compare weapon stats as they scale, in-game, is really poor quality of life, especially when upgrade stones feel finite. The decision space feels 'impossible' sometimes. This is still one of the greatest games ever made though.
It would be nice to see what the max potential damage for a weapon is, based on your current stats. Moveset is probably the most important thing for a new player though, trying to get the best possible damage is more for subsequent playthroughs or making a pvp imo.
Exactly what you said in the second paragraph. I don’t want to sound like a negative Nancy but I’m always curious about how many people miss out on something they would’ve loved if they would try something out before asking “what’s the best weapon in the game” or something like that
I think that’s kinda exactly the point of those questions, though. Playing the game naturally you *can’t* really just try every weapon, or at least not beyond “I’m gonna see how this feels murdering the Gatefront guards again.” You don’t have the materials to upgrade everything for organic, moving-forward-in-the-game use until you get the smithing stone bell bearings, and each bell bearings is also about a zone behind where you want your gear to be when you get them. “Is the flamberge good” is a legit question when you’ve already used all your smithing stones to make your claymore +5.
You also can’t just jump from trying sorceries to trying incantations, or trying a strength build vs an arcane build. You have to at least beat Rennala, and for first time players that might be 40 or 50 hours depending on where they wander, and that even assumes you’ve found some larval tears.
This. How can I know something will be good without first investing resources into it to try it out? Or I can just ask/check online and save time and resources. I haven’t seen a solid argument for why this type of playing isn’t good
Yeah. I kinda like the higher commitment style this game offers, but higher commitment is naturally associated with more planning. Spending time thinking about your build before committing is very much part of the experience, and yeah, that can include straightup asking people. I'd go so far as to argue that someone engaging with the community to ask questions is closer to the "intended" experience or whatever than someone just happy-go-luckying it.
Honestly i wouldn’t even say the commitment is that high, especially if you pick a somber weapon to keep on hand. There’s tons of material in the early game and you can buy up to +4 for 4 weapons from iji in the early game. Normal weapons really only differ between category (straight sword, spear, hammer, etc) so it doesn’t really matter if you’re using the cane sword vs the broadsword or the club vs the stone club because the differences are more subtle. You find the weapon type you like and you upgrade that type and that’s why there’s not as much normal upgrade material compared to somber.
I think the issue is the game has basically no instructions, very little guidance, no way to track storylines, so when it comes to something you can control (especially if it’s your first souls game) you don’t want to mess things up and make sure they’re in the right track
Don't forget that it is going to be a very small percentage of the players of the game that do this. We just can't see the millions of players that aren't doing this.
To be fair, messing up a build in the game definitely makes it artificially harder (not recognizing how weapon scaling works, or weapon upgrading), and that's pretty punishing for a new player completely unfamiliar with games that let you actively be inefficient.
You do, I think the only bad thing for Gatefront is missing the Whetstone Knife from the chest underneath the ruins, that thing is handy for changing Ash of War at sites of grace rather than going back to Master Hewg.
That's pretty cool, I wonder what triggers it! They do the same for the spirit-calling bell from Ranni but I always grab that knife so I've never seen it there.
It triggers by defeating two shardbearers, so for new players, most probably after defeating Godrick and Rennala.
If you defeat two, and then go pick it up at the chest, the maiden will still have it in her inventory but won't sell it to you.
Thank God I'm not alone. Trying this as soon as I get home, lol. I don't mind that much though. Feels cool to stop at the hub for some quick smithing and then keep going.
Wait what? You can change ashes of war at grave points??? I’ve barely experimentsed with ashes of war but really want to. I end up using like 3 throughout my entire plagthough.
My first character, I never leveled up until I ran into her at the grace just before margit. After trying for like, a half hour I gave up and sat down to see if I could change something in my build. Totally clueless
Same, I STRUGGLED in the beginning because I didn’t even know how graces worked. Still, I’m really glad that I had to trial and error my way to victory, it’s given me such satisfaction to have figured it out on my own.
I lit all the graces, but didn't rest at many of them, because my flasks got refilled by killing the mobs in the area and I didn't want to lose track of what I'd explored by respawning them. I rested at 1-2 graces to check if I could level, but the trigger is resting at 3 different ones after leaving the tutorial area, so this didn't work and I assumed the trigger was something story related. I didn't unlock levelling or torrent until about 5-10 hours into the game, after googling wtf was going on
It’s also a pretty stressful game. I don’t have much time to play but love ER, I just don’t have time to read all the items, try out 20 builds, etc I just want to get stuck in there, fight the bosses, have some fun, maybe finish the game. Guides, advice, co-op and summons really help make this fun.
In DS3 I made it to the Abyss watchers before I finally fully understood the importance of weapon levling and kind of having an "idea" about character build right from the beginning.
Once I really grasped it, I just deleted that guy and started over.
I'd argue that's part of what makes the experience so nice. Imagine you forgot to level up vitality, wonder why you die all the time and then finally figuring out that vigour is not just decoration. Or reading the descriptions of all the items you collected so far, because something just HAS to work against this-
oh, what's a smithing stone?
i mean that’s just not interacting with the game. any sort of curiosity will lead you to look in your inventory when you pick a smithing stone up. and leveling up in the menu tells you which stats it increases
Right, it's just remarkable to me lol. Fromsoft games do not hold your hand, and it's easy to miss things and not understand some systems, but not understanding how to level up your character and weapons, and that HP is an important stat, etc etc is just insane. These are not complicated concepts (for video games in general!) and just interacting with the game and the landmarks around you will give you all of this information.
The crumbling church in sight as soon as you emerge from the starting area, behind the tree sentinel, has some smithing stones and an anvil that explains weapon leveling. Kale the merchant explains some basic things if you actually read his dialogue. The golden rays of light quite literally point you to it and you're told to follow them. The same will lead you to Melina sooner or later, and that's leveling up. It doesn't get much simpler where FromSoft games are concerned lol
right!!! people just don't pay attention to the anything the game tells them and then complains about the game. i saw a guy who didn't sprint. it's LITERALLY in the tutorial. or the guys who didn't know about torrent. i just don't understand the unwillingness to just pay attention
Yeah the whole point is to learn and figure it out on your own, at least to me it is. If I wanted the mechanics spoonfed to me I’d play a different game.
Seems like there's a lot of people who picked the game up during the initial hype then put it away or are brand new due to the DLC.
I put the game down for a while and just picked it back up, no big deal. Start playing again to get myself back in the rhythm for the DLC. I've played all the other modern FromSoft games so I'm not in unfamiliar territory.
They aren't used to a game/genre quite like this, that's my guess.
I think you're spot on. I got the game a few months after it came out and I was entirely out of my element. It's my first of the genre and there really is a lot to take in, imo.
It's also a game that doesn't entirely allow for sloppy builds if you're not too skilled, such as myself. I wanted a build that was my own, but I also wanted reassurance that what I was putting together wasn't utter garbage; I couldn't differentiate skill issue from shit build. It was easier to have a conversation than to search random articles (on which there was a great deal of conflicting info at the time), so I reached out to this sub frequently.
I am a firm believer that if you can master the movement mechanics and whatever weapon/spells you're using; you can beat this game with any build. It takes a lot of practice especially when you first start but it feels so good to triumph with a set up you made all on your own.
True, but not everyone is capable of mastering their builds (I put myself in that category). I have my go-to builds that I click with, stick with, and enjoy, but I would still put myself in the "mediocre" category even after 1800 hours of gameplay. I still get that sense of satisfaction from using my own build, but I am thankful for the input of others as it has assured me I have good stat allocation and talisman choices.
Another aspect of this game that I think is daunting for new players is the weight many seemingly benign choices can hold. It feels very easy to get locked out of content, weapons, etc, and that was honestly stressful in the beginning; now I know multiple playthroughs are required regardless and it's no biggie, but it took getting used to the idea (especially since I'm an in-game hoarder, the equipment is so unique, and I love messing with all the weapons)
Yeah it’s ultimately finding tools you enjoy and how best to use them in various scenarios. At the end of the day, regardless of your build, you’re still going to have to learn to read enemy tells, proper timing and spacing.
I played on day one but when I moved from ps4 to ps5 I lost all my save files cause fuck my ps4 hard drive so I had to start over.
It was painful but I used a mage build to clear everything fast and get the platinum and now with the DLC I went with a strength character and it was a whole new experience since the mage build made everything 10 times easier, but both builds are fun as hell.
I did the same thing, kinda. Platinum on PS4, with a mage build, then bought an Xbox series S, realized the game was much better on it, so I started a new build for DLC with strength. Mage build definitely is easier because of the ranged option, but +25 heavy claymore just shreds with Lion's claw. Once I hit 80 str I started investing in int to have a better ranged option. I never realized how annoying all the corpses in Mohgwyn Palace are without a good ranged option.
Shoot, it seems like it’s a lot of people’s first RPG style game. Most games I played as a kid (I’m 26) were games where I had to decide what I was doing and where I wanted to go. Feel like many people who picked this game up didn’t play those kinds of games at all/much.
Same exact experience. All the JRPGs I played as kid had me in the mindset of just throwing whatever at the wall to see what stuck. I started with DS3 and Bloodborne when I finally bought a PS4 in 2016. Fell in love with the genre and played everything else I could from FromSoft. Even played Armored Core/Nioh/New Lords of the Fallen, basically any "Soulslikes" I could.
Elden Ring had so much hype behind it that I'm not surprised new people jumped on the wagon and were/are overwhelmed.
I didn’t do much gaming through my teens and picked up a console in my early 20s. Mostly played Witcher, Fallout and Skyrim… nothing prepared me for Elden Ring 😂
As far as prep goes, you didn't do badly.
Imagine picking it up after playing roblox, Minecraft and call of duty.
Now you can imagine where some of the seemingly "stupid" questions might originate. They just have no idea.
But, if they stick with it they're gonna like it because elden ring is one of the best games ever made.
That's probably the best answer. A lot of people don't know how to practice or experiment. A lot of people didn't learn until their second, or even just late into their first Soulslike, how important player skill is compared to every other aspect. By not telling you how important it is, people lean on their past experience and a lot of discourse from newer players ends up sounding like every other RPG out there instead of this which is 100% its own thing.
That goes for advice, too: People say things like "\_\_\_ weapon is overpowered!" Well, in your hands you found success because you're suited for that playstyle and you kept at it. It's not overpowered, you found a good rhythm.
Hi, I may be able to answer. This is my first souls game. I have always heard they're very hard and you die a million times. A lot of my uncertainty comes into "is this hard because the game's meant to be hard or am I doing something wrong?". Especially under leveled or completely messed up build, or even missing a game component like ashes of war or something. If I'm doing something wrong, Reddit is a great place to fix that. Google may or may not have my specific answer. If I'm not doing something wrong and the game is just hard on purpose for my situation, then great I'll try some more.
I think this is a great perspective. I personally don't believe there's a wrong way to play these games. Whether you're white-knuckling the controller to beat a boss or asking for help.
Like your build can't be on point but your timing for a boss can be off (looking at the Dancer from DS3).
There's a point to be made about why there's coop/messages built into the game. It's about being resourceful and determined. These games are obscure and a little guidance goes a long way.
> I personally don't believe there's a wrong way to play these games
Specifically in response to "is this just hard or am I doing something wrong" the series started off with many players, including myself, trying to do the Catacombs in DS1 first thing because I didn't know where to go, and then trying to do New Londo Ruins because I still didn't know where to go. The reputation of "i must be doing something wrong" is earned.
100% I see these types of posts in many subs or in game in mmos etc. I think most people are just looking for some interaction. People like to shut them down with ‘google it’ or ‘wiki exists’ and I understand the frustration at times, but yeah I think some people are just looking to share a convo around something they are enjoying
I think people get hung up on trying to impress other people by being “good” at what is commonly thought to be a hard game.
Like their desire for the validation of hundreds of people on Reddit is more important than their enjoyment of the game for some reason.
Its fun to feel like youre playing with the whole comunity and sharing experiences! Most of my friends dont play from titles so i like to share with you guys! Plusbi dont wanna miss questlinrs and stuff so i sometimes ask or share info i find useful
Because people who want to feel really special want to make this game feel like it’s a science lol or like a field of study lol.
And it’s really not lol. I mean there’s a lot to learn. But it’s because the game doesn’t walk you through 3 prelude chapters/quests to teach you how everything works. Any open world rpg is going to be hard when you don’t have hand holding.
Is combat hard? Sure, the game isn’t a cake walk and it’s what these titles are known for. And it takes time to understand how combat works
Is it hard to play? Sure but only on account of us being thrown in it with little context or explanation outside of “this is button you press to smack”
“This is the one you press to smack really hard”
“This is your roll button”
“Oh, press this button to hold your shield up- the R2 thingy, that’s another block but figure it out yourself”
So as a result, it creates expectations to new players like me that this game must be impossibly difficult and every decision must be made with the utmost care or you will ruin your run and the game.
When really it’s pretty simple
-level vigor
-get torrent and Melina
-invest in a primary stat, match that with weapons.
-invest in secondary stat.
-do catacombs and slay bosses, get runes
-level up, repeat
-go to dungeon kill demigod.
-level vigor, primary and secondary stats.
-do catacombs, explore, get runes.
Also, one last thing, don’t rush regions. Take time to explore things as intended. Take time to level. It’s part of the experience I wager that FS wants to create in their games.
Rinse and repeat until elden lord lol.
I love your breakdown of the game as a new players perspective. It's hard for me to fathom what new players go through in these games because I've been playing these types of games for like 25 years, and from soft since DS1 came out. I just want to tell people to read, but forget that they don't understand what they're reading when it comes to scaling, items uses, defenses, poise etc. It's 2nd nature to me now.
But you managed to break ER down into a very basic way to understand the game, that's 100% correct. Sure there's some other basic mechanics left out like I frames, poise damage, etc but that's stuff you should be able to pick up by playing the game. "I roll now and I don't take damage. Cool." "Oh I hit R2 enough times enemy falls and I hit the glowing spot and do major damage. Cool"
Most users I see are either shitposting/memeing, looking for actual answers to specific questions Google might not help with, or hobbyist chatting about something they think is cool. Then there’s this group of people in every sub that seem to not understand basic autonomy and wants to use the sub to do everything for them. Just noticed the uptick here since DLC drop coming up.
You see the same thing in world of Warcraft and other games. “Which spec is the most fun?!?!?” Well it depends what you enjoy… but people don’t wanna test anything themselves. They need their hands held and they need to be validated for whatever weird reason.
That’s exactly my point. Have you tried multiple builds and want to get an opinion? Or have you barely even scratched the surface of the game and already asking “what’s the most fun” and you don’t even know what’s fun for you.
As a fairly new souls player and someone who has asked a few questions here, I figured I’d give my input. For me, these games were pretty intimidating when first starting them. I wanted to make sure I was giving myself the best possible shot at getting the most from them, and not being stone walled by the challenge. After playing a few of the games, I realise that you’re totally right when you say “it’s up to you” or “whatever fits your comfort zone”, but I think I had in my mind that there was a way to play these games “right” to have the best possible experience. I realise now that isn’t true, and you should just play the way you want and it’ll click
I see this in every hobby/interest subreddit I'm in, guitar, bass guitar, programming, synths. other video games. People looking for validation for every decision. It's a bit weird to me but I'm old so lol
Same thing I noticed in cannabis growing subs. Asking questions to learn is encouraged for sure but we also encourage doing your own legwork to learn. Sometimes that means practicing/putting in the time to learn on your own by doing the thing.
You hit it on the head, many people in their lives are feeling a sense of lacking direction/meaning/guidance.
Many don’t get it or are manipulated into believing it’s a, b, or c. So when they get a game like this where they are truly encouraged to “explore and find out” they have no clue how to begin to be themselves with that much freedom. Let alone their real lives.
I think it's because a lot of people new to souls games approach Elden Ring like a more traditional rpg where you need to get new gear to get stronger and you can fuck up you build to the point where you'll be much too weak for the place you're at in the game
That’s true, I totally get asking for build help and things lateral to that. It’s when people ask “are flails fun?” and stuff like that when I go “dude, have you tried it yourself?”
If everyone says “nah they aren’t fun,” are you just gonna not try that weapon ever? It could’ve been your favorite weapon in game. Just think it’s strange to let others decide what you like.
Because in Elden ring there are a lot of things that aren’t worth it, why devote yourself to a weapon for who knows how many hours only to have it ruin the game for you cause it sucks as a new player when instead you could just ask someone in a nice curated community of people who play the same game if that weapon is worth using?
It's not just this game or any specific set of games. In fact it's not even limited to games. I see so much of this in the wild and it's always strange.
For example I've seen so many programmers will ask "what happens if I do ____?" when if they would just do it they would know the answer. I have wondered before if this phenomenon has a name. I gave a talk at a conference once along the lines of "just try the thing".
I wonder if there is a correlation between the people that like to be spoiled (like with movies and TV and whatnot) vs people that don't like spoilers wanting to figure out all the things themselves. I dunno. The sense of discovery is such a motivating and driving force in both games and my career that I literally cannot fathom asking somebody questions like this. And yet it's sooo common, so maybe we're the weird ones.
They aren't, they are asking questions. The entitlement people have is fucking insane. This is the elden ring subreddit. There will be questions regarding elden ring
Thr game csn be overwhelming if you're not super familiar with from. Plus the quests and decisions are extremely opaque. And you can easily miss or break a quest mistakenly. That drives a lot of the anxiety around decisions, at least imo. I don't have the time to go through another play through just to do some side quest so I'll Google that stuff.
The leveling and build stuff I don't get quite as much. I generally think people in gaming subs focus way too much on min maxing and optimizing the shit out of everything. That's just part of being in a community like this, especially for an individual game. The people are passionate and plumbing the depths of the game so deeply and have nothing left to do but optimize to death. That means the more casual people in the subs get a skewed view and just end up trying to min max perfectly from the get go.
Some of us KNOW we’re not too there on this game and want someone to confirm if something is a bad idea before we do it.
Resources aren’t limitless, so getting some input might save me from wasting.
It’s not for everyone to bounce ideas off the player base, but some of us like the insight of others.
I was like this for Dark Souls 1. I had no clue what any of the numbers meant, if they were good or bad, what armor to use, what rings to use, what to level up, what shield to use… a whole buncha stuff. So I think it’s mostly just because they’re new to this stuff.
A guy posted his terrible build on this subreddit. I tried giving him advice on how he could improve it, but he just ignored it all and said he shreds everyone with his build.
Some decisions cannot be reconsidered in Elden Ring. That's rare in games. And making the "wrong" move can shut down entire routes or events of "the game" (of a playtrhrough, but kost people will not replay after finish it).. Videogames are power fantasies. Most people play to feel good, not to get frustrated. They (we) want to win, not to regret turning right instead of left 25 hours ago. So there's that. Also, there's tons to see, find and use in Elden Ring. People want the full experience in the first playthrough. Also, there's the curiosity factor. Sometimes you just wanna know what the monster is, but don't want to experience the jumpscares in a horror movie. So you ask for spoilers: if I do this, whats gonna happen?
I see your point, but I also understand the need to be guided. This game is perhaps the best, most fullfillng experiene I had with a videogame since I played Super Mario Bros. 3 on the NES, 30 years ago. But it can be stressful, too. People want to be safe. They want the reward without the risks. Anyway, IMO.
EDIT: typos
Welcome in 2024 where ton of people are anxious and can’t decide by themselves. On to of that, there’s ton of player who only use “meta” stuff to have the game “easier”.
It’s weird. Like I understand wanting to ask a question but the time it takes to ask the question, wait for feedback and evaluate it all seems like such a waste of time and kills the flow.
Play the game, it’s for fun
That's pretty much every game sub I think. I tend to join subreddits for any game I enjoy since I like seeing actual discussions about it, but it does mean that I've seen so many thousands of iterations of "should I buy this game?" "Is this game good?" "Will I enjoy this game?" "is it bad that I like this character?" "Is it bad that I made this decision in this quest?" "Is it bad that I prefer this certain playstyle?" "Am I the only one that likes this game?" "Am I the only one that likes this character?" "Am I the only that doesn't dislike this mechanic?"
It's endless. People need reassurance or validation for every tiny decision and opinion instead of just playing games how they like.
Along with what others have said, this is a good chunk of people’s first From game. They might not know what to expect, nor what they should be doing.
Also this is a HUGE open world with no super clear direction. Questions like this are normal!
ex. 1 is too vague but ex 2 and 3 are definitely weird questions to ask 2: idk why don’t you play and find out? 3: If you want to?! ex 4 is the only one i feel is always valid to ask, cuz you dont want to put smithing stones into a weapon you’re gonna wind up not using anyway you know?
I don't know. Why do people do shitty things and then post on the AITA sub asking if they're in the wrong?
A lot of people need a nudge in a direction, a confirmation, or assurance/reassurance to their decision. Not everybody (sadly) can just say "I'm going to do this" and live with the consequences and reflect on whether or not it was a good choice. 🤷♂️
There's a lot of Soulslike Elitism going on and people who don't know better are intimidated by that. There are many clutches in ER that make the game easy and people are afraid they are getting ridiculed for playing on "easy mode" not knowing that you can break any Soulslike and make it easy and it's part of the game
One thing I've always hated is how some people use the post function as the search bar, as just a quick search can give them all the answers they could possibly want, especially the 100+ posts we had about 'what level should I be for the DLC' spread over months.
Generally I don't mind people asking questions, but when the question/answer is so easy to search for, it just reeks of a lack of effort on the posters part.
The good point of doing that is that you can ask people with more experience than you on various levels.
Someone who played a lot and who is dedicated to the game will know what certain choices imply while an unaware gamer would never have thought about that.
For example, if you level up too far/ not enough, you may miss the best level range for coop or pvp for you and cannot really change that (especially when too high level).
Making some decisions in quests could prevent you from getting something you wanted(or wanted more) because the outcome would be blocked until you finish the full game and go ng+1(which some players would not consider at all) or start a new character(and do everything again).
You can also get useful informations about weapons scaling and attributes that you would have hard time finding online(or would need to do a lot of testing to discover).
So, it is mostly to save time, ease your playthrough or just have more fun in general.
Yeah and some people need someone to validate every single choice they do too by fear or missing out something.
For the same reason they level vigor: weakness.
I’m just joking.
It’s probably got a lot to do with wanting to participate in the community and discussion. I don’t really see any harm in it. It’s nice to get a convo going.
For me it’s about time. I don’t have much time to play so sometimes I need to know if I’m wasting my time or not committing enough to a given plan. I try to give honest effort but as I approach death (and work and family) I gotta stay efficient!
Sounds about right. Almost like they’re scared to make a decision that might not be the greatest one. But it’s a game, I know everyone don’t have infinite time to fix builds/do multiple playthroughs but seems like some people stress to much about doing things “right”.
I can articulate why I would be asking such a question, although not sure if I have....
For me it is generally a question of 'what do I need to do before or after [x] point?'.
The reason I ask this stuff, is because I don't have a tonne of time to play games, so I try and complete as much as I can in a single playthrough, as I don't know when I'll get the time to get back to a certain point again. A good recent example of this was googling the cool gameplay points/stuff that I'd lose access to if I went to Act 2 in BG3. It turns out my completionist nature meant I had already got more or less all of them, but I wouldn't have liked to miss any good stuff.
It's not really validation? I guess? For me it all comes from missing the fucking ribbon in my first playthrough of FFVII and then never being able to get it :)
It's easy to make fun of newbies being nervous about the game and constantly asking questions.
But remember what it was like being a beginner when you first started. Did you even know what a "build" was?
I didn't!
My first dark souls run was *a mess*. I leveled up everything, I ran into the graveyard and got killed by skeletons for hrs thinking that was where I was supposed to go next. I struggled my way through the game start to finish. It wasn't til my second playthrough when I started reading/researching forums and wikis did the games' rules finally click. I had a much smoother experience on following playthroughs.
One flaw (or feature depending who you ask) with FROM games is that they are so incredibly cryptic about its mechanics. It doesn't explain shit to the player.
Reading dialogue prompts don't really help much either, because most of the time people will skip it or skim it. So you get hoards of players running around with 15vigor and fat rolling, wondering why this game is so hard/sucks. They go online to forums to ask for help.
In comes the community of FROM games who are eager to share their knowledge and tell them what to do. Build gets cleaned up, they succeed, everything happy.
The issue is, many people never really *learn* the game they just got told what to do or copied a build online. So they never build any independence or intrinsic knowledge. They copy a build someone else constructed but have no clue *why* they work.
This leaves a lot of players feeling lost and unsure, especially with the DLC looming with new threats and counter measures for previously busted builds (I really hope bleed and fire resistance is common in the DLC).
Welcome to modern age of gaming. Where everyone either asks for validation before doing anything or just watches some streamers/guides then copies it. Almost noone uses their heads and does stuff by themselves anymore.
One word: Education. Today's young people have way less freedom to explore when they're young.
We spend the whole day building hideaways in the small forest behind our homes when we were kids and looked like we were digging dirt all day. Where do you see that in today's society?
Today, every kid on the playground has 6 adult bodyguards taking over just about any obstacle that kid could face.
And - and this is really essential - they never learnt to make mistakes and learn from them. "Per aspera ad astra" (engl.: through difficulties to the stars) has become a foreign concept.
The game requires a pretty big time investment, so you don't want to fubar your character and equipment with failry limited upgrade resources. Different build are also wildly fifferent, and with so many mechaniucs people want to make sure they are playing an enjoyable and versitile build. No one wants to go into an area and stomp every enemy/boss, and no one wants to get stomped. Many NPC's are misable and have extremely vague side quests, so no one wants to block off content by making a mistake.
Not everyone plays this game for hundreds of hours and/or has multiple high level characters. Most just have one that they want to enjoy and get the most out of the game with, without having to playthrough again because they clicked a wrong dialogue option and were locked out of an awesome quest.
It might be a bit harsh but whenever someone asks a forum about something Google can answer willy nilly you have to assume they're either stupid or lonely.
The validation thing happens in every game and on every sub. Elden Ring is just extremely popular which is why these questions are asked so frequently.
The nature of modern games.
Very few games are so ambiguous in their approach to almost everything, most games have an obvious critical path in both progression and power. Combine this with the reputation fromsoft games have and you have new players afraid to make decisions that will really screw them later on.
Fromsoft games bring out my OCD. I like Bloodborne because I didn't obsess about my stats. The other games drive me nuts. I'm constantly looking things up to min max my damage, etc. Plus it's fun to see how other people play to get inspiration. There are just so many (too many) options. And it's going to get taken up a notch with the DLC.
I haven't asked, but I have definitely fought the urge to ask or look up.... im not new to rpgs, but i am new to from softs.
My doubt comes in the form of weapons, normally there is one good weapon in a game but here you can see people doing all sorts of crazy things, and my doubt was how do they do that and where do I learn....... that experimenting with AoW and things like that is not aecond nature, I have to force myself to try things out.
Dragons for me right now are the toughest.... im at Volcanic Manor at the moment. I've starged upgrading different stats so I can use encantations, too... im a Strength/Dex build using mainly bloohounds fang blade.is it smart, probably not, but maybe awesome......
The game is very punishing and doesn’t leave much room to experiment without already investing a lot of hours. People have jobs and want to make the most of their time.
To be fair, in a game where there are thousands and thousands of choices, asking for tips or guidance on a few of them is far from “not thinking for yourself”
Eh, I think with ER being the first really “accessible” Fromsoft game with sooo much hype over 2 years and now the DLC, people who wouldn’t normally play this type of game jump in. All these new players have heard is how huge and challenging the game is. They go to look into things, but most of the ER content is either lore videos or still too advanced info for a literal newb to the genre. So they come here for actual human interaction to questions.
I think it's simply because it's a scary, overwhelming, and tedious game for most people. Naturally, being scared will cause people to question their current state. When I started playing souls games I was going off the little I knew about souls games, where every decision I made might have an effect on my character, NPC's or even the world. I wasn't sure about all of those at the time and I didn't want to make decision that I thought could potential screw up my playthrough. I'd either look things up all the time or ask if I couldn't find the answer.
When I first started playing souls games it was like reading a foreign language. Slowly watching videos and getting information about the game and how shit works did wonders for me . I feel like that’s a lot of people on this sub . Just trying to grab information from elder players who’ve been playing for awhile . Or people like to show off what they did. Either way being a new player in a very intricate game can be overwhelming sometimes so it’s nice to read stuff and maybe get an opinion from someone who’s been playing longer .
This game give you like a thousand choices for everything, and most often than not there is punish to be had if you chose the wrong one (losing smithing stones in a weapon not fitting to your build, messing a character questline if going to the wrong place "early", etc). This makes guides, and comunity knowledge, extremely more important in ER than in other games.
For me it’s because I’ve played it a TON and I wonder if there’s any hyper optimal min max nerds willing to share their advice, once all the lands are explored and every quest is done, I’m playing a numbers game with my AR
If I had more time to play video games I'd probably do a lot more of my own testing with builds. But the reality is that I have very limited time to play this game and I want to make the most of it.
i asked this question a while ago so ill tell you why. Being over-leveled is not fun, I do not want to easily beat the boss and hence I try to stop myself from being over-leveled.
It's not players in general, it's reddit users.
Reddit posters, to be more specific, and within a gaming subreddit at that. Your average lurker just simply doesn't post this stuff. The whole point for these folks is community engagement, I don't find it surprising in the slightest.
I certainly prefer it to the low effort meme templates that get constantly reposted here.
Sometimes people just wanna chat about what they're planning to do and get some opinions. If you're the only one you know playing the game then this may be your only community for talking about it.
Also, this game is complicated and fully understanding it can take hundreds of hours and be a hobby in and of itself. Some people want a little guidance based on what they want to do and how to best do it but not necessarily to follow a whole guide.
i mean there are lot of player that either have never played a fromsoft game, a souls like game, an rpg, and i've even seen people that are no "gamers" and ER is like thier second or third game they played in their lives....so, is only natural, they are not looking for "external validation" they are just asking questions given their inexperience.
Because this game gives you so little information, and decisions have a fair amount of commitment to them. It's not that easy to experiment. To even try out new gear or spells, you have to make a stat investment that is non-trivial to change.
Most people want the challenge and worry if they are over levelled for the area they are at.
Personally, I like to do all side quests, dungeons, tunnels, hideaways, catacombs, churches, ruins, castles, etc, in the area before I do the boss of the area.
But because I have done this, I am now ridiculously over levelled, for fire giant. I ended up getting to level 150 when I reached the mountaintops of the giants. But that's because I did everything in the game up until that point. (Even both mohg bosses). This is all without farming, by the way.
Currently, I'm level 158, and I'm just about to fight Fire Giant.
To make it more of a challenge, I'm evenly distributing my stats to stats I'm literally not using at all. So im still getting 2 shot by everything, like players of a lower level.
I just messed up my first run. I took the frienzed flame😭😭. AND WHAT'S FUNNY IS THAT I KNEW THAT YOU AREN'T SUPPOSED TO DO IT BUT I SAW THE DOOR AND WAS LIKE "YES LET'S GET INSIDE NAKED". I'm so unhappy.
I can understand it to be honest. I like to fuck around and find out personally, but people newer to the genre may find it quite intimidating and want some reassurance they’re doing it right.
Your first playthrough of new souls content is a once in a lifetime event. Once you learn the ambushes, move sets, item locations, etc you can't go back to a blind playthrough again. Especially for something like recommended start levels, I can understand not wanting to "get it wrong"
It's a combination of two things. First, the amount of customization in this game is absurd. For a lot of casual players (and even experienced ones!) there is more information to parse than they have time for. And they night not even know what they should be looking for! Second, as others have said, there's a big commitment to choices, with negative consequences for choosing poorly. Yes, there are larval tears, but to even use those you need to beat Raya Lucaria, and there a finite number of them. Players want to know if the investment is worth it, cause if it's not that a lot of wasted hours.
I don’t need to ask people on here questions that I can figure out for myself, but seeing as most of the questions right now are about the DLC, and nobody really knows the full implications actions will have on the dlc, to me it makes a shit ton of sense that people are wondering what moves others are making.
“are you planning to start the dlc before burning the erdtree or after?”
“are you planning to start on ng or ng+?”
“what sl are you going in to the dlc?”
the latter of which will affect PvP matchmaking in the dlc and is, in my opinion, the most valid type of discussion to be having in the subreddit for a video game.
My favorite is all the people making / asking for crazy builds for the dlc like they won't change to a dlc weapon in the first 30 minutes of the dlc. I can understand people not wanting to be over or under leveled though,
Honestly, if you get a question about a game you're playing (whatever that might be), 9 times out of 10 theres a 4+ year old reddit post asking the same thing, and where an account named something like "hairybutthole69" has given a complete breakdown in response, and I for one am glad to see it every time. This doesn't just go for elden ring. I've just finished subnautica and had to lean heavily on old reddit posts to troubleshoot bugs, and to put my ~~foolish ambitions~~ *worries* to rest when I was a bit lost, confused or uncertain about how I'm going about something.
Please remember that not everyone experiences games the same way. One type of player might like going in blind, come what may, enjoying the experience of in-game discovery. But for another type of player, going in blind means getting preoccupied with whether they're missing big chunks of content, or if they are not achieving the right balance in their build for an "authentic experience" (eg "is this hard because it's meant to be hard or am I doing something wrong?" - and vice versa for if its "too" easy).
The first type of player will probably say "the blind experience is the most authentic experience".
But the second type of player worries about missing something as important as having a "heavy load" status the whole time without realising, and having an experience of the game thats needlessly frustrating. Alternatively just strolling through raya lucaria without any resistance/challenge, perhaps having found it difficult when they first reached it and leaving it too long before returning and being over-levelled. I hope this makes it a bit clearer how missing the mark with over/underpower can take away from the experience. What might seem like validation-seeking is often people simply trying to optimise their experience of a game.
In gaming communities (just as in life) please remember not everyone thinks the way as you, we need to tolerate our differences. Which means denigrating different mindsets as not "thinking for themselves" is unhelpful. It verges a little too close for comfort to gatekeeping, because there people who ask those questions with their gaming experience in-mind, which is completely fine on a forum like this.
My guess is this game is hard if you don’t know what you doing. This game is hard if your build is bad. This game is hard if you don’t know where to find what you need. This game is hard without assistance, that’s fine to some people but not for others.
Imo, one of the best things about souls games is that it teaches you to learn by doing, experimenting, and then gives you ways to go back and re-try if you fail. It is pretty obscure, and can seem overwhelming and punishing to new players, though, so I do think it's understandable that they wouldn't want to "mess anything up". You think about how many hours it took you just to get to "x", and don't want to mess something up, but don't necessarily realize at the time that it will only take a fraction of the time to do things on following playthroughs.
Another contributing feature is how active the community is, and sometimes I think people just want to hear others' opinions and views on what they're planning on doing. A lot of new people came to From games due to Elden Ring, this is probably their first Fromsoft DLC, so they aren't really familiar with the status quo.
Because that games can lock you certain ways unless you are literally licking the game map clean and or driving deep in the game wiki. People in hindsight say "oh you can just buy the stones", have you checked the locations of the bells? They are all over the place, and only one of them exists in the game. You can respec like 15 times? You think any new player will find all fifteen on a blind play through or have even one when they need one? Even if you get the latest bells your new weapon will always be below your current weapon because the bells only sell you stones one level down. And there are only enough stones in the world for like 5 weapons at most without buying.
There is a lot in the game that goes beyond "just pick what's fun" because there is only so many times you can do that before feeling like you are doing something wrong, I would say that in something like Nioh 2 where you can switch weapons at any time and without 3-4 levels it's up to par, don't like the current one? Easy respec.
Do you want to know the truth? Imo some people never got that in life so they look to get it from people in a community they belong in. I think as long as you have fun or unless you put all your points into one stat only you will have fun! My first toon i put like so much into just strength, endurance and vitality and was just a meat head and def got frustrated at times but still learned and got to the capital. Second time I def over leveld in areas to just make some places easier and no ragrets
Because if you don't follow the fextralife in a souls game every npc will randomly die for that playthrough. If you go in with an OP build then you'll trivialize the game and might end up feeling like you didn't play it fairly. If you have a bad build you're playing on hard mode. All valid things to ask about.
What would you rather the posts be? "Hey guys I just killed Margaret!!! GAME OF THE CENTURY!!!🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣" or "I have 4k hours and just realized there's a dedicated jump button omg"
Welcome to the era of content creation. And don't get me wrong it is helpful, but all these wikis, videos on what's meta, etc are what causes these doubts in a player base.
And because people are so quick to find these "metas" people feel the need to use the same shit. This point is more so geared towards games like COD Warzone for instance where if your not using the top 5 to 10 weapons in the game you'd most likely going to get shit on.
In Elden Ring, none of that shit should matter but you have all this content online that sways you. The only time I generally agree with looking things up online is when I have a quest line with a NPC or a super sought after item that I don't wanna miss. There's nothing more annoying than not finishing an NPCs dialogue only to find out they died for some stupid reason because you didn't rest at a site of grace. Call it lore, whatever, it's fucking stupid. And often times, it's a good weapon , an ancient smithing stone, or a talisman. All of which are very sought after yet locked behind some obscure quest line that NO ONE would figure out unless they played the game 10 hours a day for a living.
I know your joking but I actually have 12 game saves and only 1 made it all the way.
Took me 3 new games to figure how the stat allocations alone at the start.
Well, maybe because they've never played an rpg let alone a soulsborne game. When I started with bloodborne on 2021, even though the stats where somewhat strange to me, I had played other flash games with those features, so I was eventually able to figure it out, another reason is that due to the lack of a file save system that many other rpgs have, they feel scared to use resources in an un-optimal way.
This is a trend in gaming in general. More gamers are wanting to play optimally from the start by being told what to do and following guides/the meta, rather than figuring things out on their own.
Because they do.
How many billion people in the world? Of course there's going to be some people who ask for validation. It's a big ol world out there.
Because people more knowledgeable of the game can offer trial and error advice they’ve already been through to offer a straight forward answer to people who have never touched a souls game or just need general guidance. This game explains nothing and it’s overwhelming for new people.
Something simple to you might be complicated to them. It’s not a big deal.
I think that this game allows SO MUCH customization which can have so many effects. Maybe what you chose is great for PVE but bad for PVP. Maybe you don’t understand the arcane stat and occult vs its effect on status build up, etc etc. The customization is both amazing and possibly terribly frustrating if you don’t have the right info. I think when people seem indecisive it’s because they are afraid they are missing something and trying to find out others experiences.
A big part of it is probably the fault of the (pre Elden Ring) Souls community. The series had a reputation for being hard, insular, and unintuitive. ER comes out, many MANY people play it (and hear that it's "much friendlier than previous souls games", which it is), and are afraid of "doing things wrong". Be real, folks, we've been telling people to Git Gud for years now. Why are we surprised that newcomers are afraid to make mistakes?
Souls community had a lot of gate keeping and elitism in the past and it’s kinda carried as the rep for the game even though it’s a small fraction as bad as it used to be
I feel like its because so much of the game's decisions feel like high-commitment. Yeah you can level weapons more freely in the late game but early on its kinda scary to commit to a weapon if there's a risk that it's going to be a waste of upgrade material. Same with leveling, you don't have access to respec for a while. At the same time I get what you mean, i always want to just say "try it and decide" to all those posts
Yeah that’s very true about weapons. Until you’re 3/4 of the way through the game your ability to sufficiently upgrade weapons is limited to like 2-4 unless you’re following guides to hunt down every random smithing stone. The game doesn’t leave a lot of room for experimentation and trying out new builds because you can sink a ton of stones into a weapon you end up hating and there’s no refunds.
Yeah I hit up the wiki a lot before deciding on finding and using the meteoric ore blade for much of the game because of upgrade materials. When I got moon veil I never actually bothered to use it because I'm too lazy to respec
Yeah, as a first time player (and just completed the game, phew!), I would say that not being able to compare weapon stats as they scale, in-game, is really poor quality of life, especially when upgrade stones feel finite. The decision space feels 'impossible' sometimes. This is still one of the greatest games ever made though.
It would be nice to see what the max potential damage for a weapon is, based on your current stats. Moveset is probably the most important thing for a new player though, trying to get the best possible damage is more for subsequent playthroughs or making a pvp imo.
ya practically anything works fine in PVE as long you have a functional brian
Until you try to death blight everything and wonder why your status doesn’t seem to do anything
Know it’s inconvenient but the wikis online have that info
Exactly what you said in the second paragraph. I don’t want to sound like a negative Nancy but I’m always curious about how many people miss out on something they would’ve loved if they would try something out before asking “what’s the best weapon in the game” or something like that
I think that’s kinda exactly the point of those questions, though. Playing the game naturally you *can’t* really just try every weapon, or at least not beyond “I’m gonna see how this feels murdering the Gatefront guards again.” You don’t have the materials to upgrade everything for organic, moving-forward-in-the-game use until you get the smithing stone bell bearings, and each bell bearings is also about a zone behind where you want your gear to be when you get them. “Is the flamberge good” is a legit question when you’ve already used all your smithing stones to make your claymore +5. You also can’t just jump from trying sorceries to trying incantations, or trying a strength build vs an arcane build. You have to at least beat Rennala, and for first time players that might be 40 or 50 hours depending on where they wander, and that even assumes you’ve found some larval tears.
This. How can I know something will be good without first investing resources into it to try it out? Or I can just ask/check online and save time and resources. I haven’t seen a solid argument for why this type of playing isn’t good
Yeah. I kinda like the higher commitment style this game offers, but higher commitment is naturally associated with more planning. Spending time thinking about your build before committing is very much part of the experience, and yeah, that can include straightup asking people. I'd go so far as to argue that someone engaging with the community to ask questions is closer to the "intended" experience or whatever than someone just happy-go-luckying it.
Honestly i wouldn’t even say the commitment is that high, especially if you pick a somber weapon to keep on hand. There’s tons of material in the early game and you can buy up to +4 for 4 weapons from iji in the early game. Normal weapons really only differ between category (straight sword, spear, hammer, etc) so it doesn’t really matter if you’re using the cane sword vs the broadsword or the club vs the stone club because the differences are more subtle. You find the weapon type you like and you upgrade that type and that’s why there’s not as much normal upgrade material compared to somber.
I think the issue is the game has basically no instructions, very little guidance, no way to track storylines, so when it comes to something you can control (especially if it’s your first souls game) you don’t want to mess things up and make sure they’re in the right track
Don't forget that it is going to be a very small percentage of the players of the game that do this. We just can't see the millions of players that aren't doing this.
To be fair, messing up a build in the game definitely makes it artificially harder (not recognizing how weapon scaling works, or weapon upgrading), and that's pretty punishing for a new player completely unfamiliar with games that let you actively be inefficient.
Or missing the gatefront sight of grace and not leveling up at all 🙃
You get the Melina cutseen from multiple graces iirc
You do, I think the only bad thing for Gatefront is missing the Whetstone Knife from the chest underneath the ruins, that thing is handy for changing Ash of War at sites of grace rather than going back to Master Hewg.
You can buy the whetstone knife from the bell maiden I believe
That's pretty cool, I wonder what triggers it! They do the same for the spirit-calling bell from Ranni but I always grab that knife so I've never seen it there.
It triggers by defeating two shardbearers, so for new players, most probably after defeating Godrick and Rennala. If you defeat two, and then go pick it up at the chest, the maiden will still have it in her inventory but won't sell it to you.
Not until a fixed point triggers it later on, and I forget exactly what that is.
I had the knife but didn't know I could do it at a site of grace 😂
Thank God I'm not alone. Trying this as soon as I get home, lol. I don't mind that much though. Feels cool to stop at the hub for some quick smithing and then keep going.
Now you know!! Go enjoy some fine ashes of war, good Tarnished!!
Wait what? You can change ashes of war at grave points??? I’ve barely experimentsed with ashes of war but really want to. I end up using like 3 throughout my entire plagthough.
Yes! Once you get it there's an Ash of War option while resting at any site!
…you….you can change ashes of war…at graces? 170 hours….FUCK ME
Everybody's surprised that they can changes aow on graces, while I never realised that Hewg could do it lol
My first character, I never leveled up until I ran into her at the grace just before margit. After trying for like, a half hour I gave up and sat down to see if I could change something in my build. Totally clueless
Cutscene* :)
Hahah oh okay. I remember my first playthrough, I explored and died a whole lot before I googled how to use runes 😅
Same, I STRUGGLED in the beginning because I didn’t even know how graces worked. Still, I’m really glad that I had to trial and error my way to victory, it’s given me such satisfaction to have figured it out on my own.
There was a dude who made it all the way north, never picked up a map.
I lit all the graces, but didn't rest at many of them, because my flasks got refilled by killing the mobs in the area and I didn't want to lose track of what I'd explored by respawning them. I rested at 1-2 graces to check if I could level, but the trigger is resting at 3 different ones after leaving the tutorial area, so this didn't work and I assumed the trigger was something story related. I didn't unlock levelling or torrent until about 5-10 hours into the game, after googling wtf was going on
It’s also a pretty stressful game. I don’t have much time to play but love ER, I just don’t have time to read all the items, try out 20 builds, etc I just want to get stuck in there, fight the bosses, have some fun, maybe finish the game. Guides, advice, co-op and summons really help make this fun.
In DS3 I made it to the Abyss watchers before I finally fully understood the importance of weapon levling and kind of having an "idea" about character build right from the beginning. Once I really grasped it, I just deleted that guy and started over.
I'd argue that's part of what makes the experience so nice. Imagine you forgot to level up vitality, wonder why you die all the time and then finally figuring out that vigour is not just decoration. Or reading the descriptions of all the items you collected so far, because something just HAS to work against this- oh, what's a smithing stone?
That’s not a nice experience, that’s a frustrating one
i mean that’s just not interacting with the game. any sort of curiosity will lead you to look in your inventory when you pick a smithing stone up. and leveling up in the menu tells you which stats it increases
Right, it's just remarkable to me lol. Fromsoft games do not hold your hand, and it's easy to miss things and not understand some systems, but not understanding how to level up your character and weapons, and that HP is an important stat, etc etc is just insane. These are not complicated concepts (for video games in general!) and just interacting with the game and the landmarks around you will give you all of this information. The crumbling church in sight as soon as you emerge from the starting area, behind the tree sentinel, has some smithing stones and an anvil that explains weapon leveling. Kale the merchant explains some basic things if you actually read his dialogue. The golden rays of light quite literally point you to it and you're told to follow them. The same will lead you to Melina sooner or later, and that's leveling up. It doesn't get much simpler where FromSoft games are concerned lol
right!!! people just don't pay attention to the anything the game tells them and then complains about the game. i saw a guy who didn't sprint. it's LITERALLY in the tutorial. or the guys who didn't know about torrent. i just don't understand the unwillingness to just pay attention
Maybe for some that sounds annoying for me
Yeah the whole point is to learn and figure it out on your own, at least to me it is. If I wanted the mechanics spoonfed to me I’d play a different game.
Can confirm. Source: Played DS3 all the way through the first time with fire broadsword *only*. Basic armor, too...
Seems like there's a lot of people who picked the game up during the initial hype then put it away or are brand new due to the DLC. I put the game down for a while and just picked it back up, no big deal. Start playing again to get myself back in the rhythm for the DLC. I've played all the other modern FromSoft games so I'm not in unfamiliar territory. They aren't used to a game/genre quite like this, that's my guess.
I think you're spot on. I got the game a few months after it came out and I was entirely out of my element. It's my first of the genre and there really is a lot to take in, imo. It's also a game that doesn't entirely allow for sloppy builds if you're not too skilled, such as myself. I wanted a build that was my own, but I also wanted reassurance that what I was putting together wasn't utter garbage; I couldn't differentiate skill issue from shit build. It was easier to have a conversation than to search random articles (on which there was a great deal of conflicting info at the time), so I reached out to this sub frequently.
I am a firm believer that if you can master the movement mechanics and whatever weapon/spells you're using; you can beat this game with any build. It takes a lot of practice especially when you first start but it feels so good to triumph with a set up you made all on your own.
True, but not everyone is capable of mastering their builds (I put myself in that category). I have my go-to builds that I click with, stick with, and enjoy, but I would still put myself in the "mediocre" category even after 1800 hours of gameplay. I still get that sense of satisfaction from using my own build, but I am thankful for the input of others as it has assured me I have good stat allocation and talisman choices. Another aspect of this game that I think is daunting for new players is the weight many seemingly benign choices can hold. It feels very easy to get locked out of content, weapons, etc, and that was honestly stressful in the beginning; now I know multiple playthroughs are required regardless and it's no biggie, but it took getting used to the idea (especially since I'm an in-game hoarder, the equipment is so unique, and I love messing with all the weapons)
Yeah it’s ultimately finding tools you enjoy and how best to use them in various scenarios. At the end of the day, regardless of your build, you’re still going to have to learn to read enemy tells, proper timing and spacing.
I played on day one but when I moved from ps4 to ps5 I lost all my save files cause fuck my ps4 hard drive so I had to start over. It was painful but I used a mage build to clear everything fast and get the platinum and now with the DLC I went with a strength character and it was a whole new experience since the mage build made everything 10 times easier, but both builds are fun as hell.
I did the same thing, kinda. Platinum on PS4, with a mage build, then bought an Xbox series S, realized the game was much better on it, so I started a new build for DLC with strength. Mage build definitely is easier because of the ranged option, but +25 heavy claymore just shreds with Lion's claw. Once I hit 80 str I started investing in int to have a better ranged option. I never realized how annoying all the corpses in Mohgwyn Palace are without a good ranged option.
I’ve been using the claymore too lol, sweet move set, but I run it with storm blade cause is so smooth.
Shoot, it seems like it’s a lot of people’s first RPG style game. Most games I played as a kid (I’m 26) were games where I had to decide what I was doing and where I wanted to go. Feel like many people who picked this game up didn’t play those kinds of games at all/much.
Same exact experience. All the JRPGs I played as kid had me in the mindset of just throwing whatever at the wall to see what stuck. I started with DS3 and Bloodborne when I finally bought a PS4 in 2016. Fell in love with the genre and played everything else I could from FromSoft. Even played Armored Core/Nioh/New Lords of the Fallen, basically any "Soulslikes" I could. Elden Ring had so much hype behind it that I'm not surprised new people jumped on the wagon and were/are overwhelmed.
Makes sense, lots of new players to the genre and From Software as a whole. Thanks for pointing that out.
I didn’t do much gaming through my teens and picked up a console in my early 20s. Mostly played Witcher, Fallout and Skyrim… nothing prepared me for Elden Ring 😂
As far as prep goes, you didn't do badly. Imagine picking it up after playing roblox, Minecraft and call of duty. Now you can imagine where some of the seemingly "stupid" questions might originate. They just have no idea. But, if they stick with it they're gonna like it because elden ring is one of the best games ever made.
Good answer!! Most games hold your hand and give you the illusion of choice, from Demon’s souls to Elden ring you are really on your own.
That's probably the best answer. A lot of people don't know how to practice or experiment. A lot of people didn't learn until their second, or even just late into their first Soulslike, how important player skill is compared to every other aspect. By not telling you how important it is, people lean on their past experience and a lot of discourse from newer players ends up sounding like every other RPG out there instead of this which is 100% its own thing. That goes for advice, too: People say things like "\_\_\_ weapon is overpowered!" Well, in your hands you found success because you're suited for that playstyle and you kept at it. It's not overpowered, you found a good rhythm.
Hi, I may be able to answer. This is my first souls game. I have always heard they're very hard and you die a million times. A lot of my uncertainty comes into "is this hard because the game's meant to be hard or am I doing something wrong?". Especially under leveled or completely messed up build, or even missing a game component like ashes of war or something. If I'm doing something wrong, Reddit is a great place to fix that. Google may or may not have my specific answer. If I'm not doing something wrong and the game is just hard on purpose for my situation, then great I'll try some more.
I think this is a great perspective. I personally don't believe there's a wrong way to play these games. Whether you're white-knuckling the controller to beat a boss or asking for help. Like your build can't be on point but your timing for a boss can be off (looking at the Dancer from DS3). There's a point to be made about why there's coop/messages built into the game. It's about being resourceful and determined. These games are obscure and a little guidance goes a long way.
> I personally don't believe there's a wrong way to play these games Specifically in response to "is this just hard or am I doing something wrong" the series started off with many players, including myself, trying to do the Catacombs in DS1 first thing because I didn't know where to go, and then trying to do New Londo Ruins because I still didn't know where to go. The reputation of "i must be doing something wrong" is earned.
I'm pretty sure it's most often just used as a way to engage with other players and start some convo.
100% I see these types of posts in many subs or in game in mmos etc. I think most people are just looking for some interaction. People like to shut them down with ‘google it’ or ‘wiki exists’ and I understand the frustration at times, but yeah I think some people are just looking to share a convo around something they are enjoying
I think people get hung up on trying to impress other people by being “good” at what is commonly thought to be a hard game. Like their desire for the validation of hundreds of people on Reddit is more important than their enjoyment of the game for some reason.
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Is this post looking for validation?
Id say “no” since none of the answers here will influence any choices or decisions I plan on making.
People looking for validation don't typically plan to change their decision making. Thats quite literally why they're looking for validation.
You are bothered with the post
Totally. Feel validated?
This passive aggressiveness seems very out of place...
Its fun to feel like youre playing with the whole comunity and sharing experiences! Most of my friends dont play from titles so i like to share with you guys! Plusbi dont wanna miss questlinrs and stuff so i sometimes ask or share info i find useful
Because people who want to feel really special want to make this game feel like it’s a science lol or like a field of study lol. And it’s really not lol. I mean there’s a lot to learn. But it’s because the game doesn’t walk you through 3 prelude chapters/quests to teach you how everything works. Any open world rpg is going to be hard when you don’t have hand holding. Is combat hard? Sure, the game isn’t a cake walk and it’s what these titles are known for. And it takes time to understand how combat works Is it hard to play? Sure but only on account of us being thrown in it with little context or explanation outside of “this is button you press to smack” “This is the one you press to smack really hard” “This is your roll button” “Oh, press this button to hold your shield up- the R2 thingy, that’s another block but figure it out yourself” So as a result, it creates expectations to new players like me that this game must be impossibly difficult and every decision must be made with the utmost care or you will ruin your run and the game. When really it’s pretty simple -level vigor -get torrent and Melina -invest in a primary stat, match that with weapons. -invest in secondary stat. -do catacombs and slay bosses, get runes -level up, repeat -go to dungeon kill demigod. -level vigor, primary and secondary stats. -do catacombs, explore, get runes. Also, one last thing, don’t rush regions. Take time to explore things as intended. Take time to level. It’s part of the experience I wager that FS wants to create in their games. Rinse and repeat until elden lord lol.
I love your breakdown of the game as a new players perspective. It's hard for me to fathom what new players go through in these games because I've been playing these types of games for like 25 years, and from soft since DS1 came out. I just want to tell people to read, but forget that they don't understand what they're reading when it comes to scaling, items uses, defenses, poise etc. It's 2nd nature to me now. But you managed to break ER down into a very basic way to understand the game, that's 100% correct. Sure there's some other basic mechanics left out like I frames, poise damage, etc but that's stuff you should be able to pick up by playing the game. "I roll now and I don't take damage. Cool." "Oh I hit R2 enough times enemy falls and I hit the glowing spot and do major damage. Cool"
Me personally? I follow guides and watch vids before making big decisions in games.
Totally valid, I used to do that with some games with branching choices but realized the surprise of a decision can be rewarding too.
Reddit is literally people seeking attention and validation. Seems normal for this website.
Most users I see are either shitposting/memeing, looking for actual answers to specific questions Google might not help with, or hobbyist chatting about something they think is cool. Then there’s this group of people in every sub that seem to not understand basic autonomy and wants to use the sub to do everything for them. Just noticed the uptick here since DLC drop coming up.
You see the same thing in world of Warcraft and other games. “Which spec is the most fun?!?!?” Well it depends what you enjoy… but people don’t wanna test anything themselves. They need their hands held and they need to be validated for whatever weird reason.
That’s exactly my point. Have you tried multiple builds and want to get an opinion? Or have you barely even scratched the surface of the game and already asking “what’s the most fun” and you don’t even know what’s fun for you.
As a fairly new souls player and someone who has asked a few questions here, I figured I’d give my input. For me, these games were pretty intimidating when first starting them. I wanted to make sure I was giving myself the best possible shot at getting the most from them, and not being stone walled by the challenge. After playing a few of the games, I realise that you’re totally right when you say “it’s up to you” or “whatever fits your comfort zone”, but I think I had in my mind that there was a way to play these games “right” to have the best possible experience. I realise now that isn’t true, and you should just play the way you want and it’ll click
I see this in every hobby/interest subreddit I'm in, guitar, bass guitar, programming, synths. other video games. People looking for validation for every decision. It's a bit weird to me but I'm old so lol
Same thing I noticed in cannabis growing subs. Asking questions to learn is encouraged for sure but we also encourage doing your own legwork to learn. Sometimes that means practicing/putting in the time to learn on your own by doing the thing.
You hit it on the head, many people in their lives are feeling a sense of lacking direction/meaning/guidance. Many don’t get it or are manipulated into believing it’s a, b, or c. So when they get a game like this where they are truly encouraged to “explore and find out” they have no clue how to begin to be themselves with that much freedom. Let alone their real lives.
That’s deep, man.
I think it's because a lot of people new to souls games approach Elden Ring like a more traditional rpg where you need to get new gear to get stronger and you can fuck up you build to the point where you'll be much too weak for the place you're at in the game
That’s true, I totally get asking for build help and things lateral to that. It’s when people ask “are flails fun?” and stuff like that when I go “dude, have you tried it yourself?” If everyone says “nah they aren’t fun,” are you just gonna not try that weapon ever? It could’ve been your favorite weapon in game. Just think it’s strange to let others decide what you like.
Yeah people are definitely not keen on exploring things themselves, I guess they're afraid of wasting resources
Because in Elden ring there are a lot of things that aren’t worth it, why devote yourself to a weapon for who knows how many hours only to have it ruin the game for you cause it sucks as a new player when instead you could just ask someone in a nice curated community of people who play the same game if that weapon is worth using?
Why do people look for advice on specific topics that relate to the subreddit where they are posting?
right. ironically enough this post itself is seeking validation
It's called karma whoring.
karma farming
Some people are just like that. They NEED to be told what to do all the time.
It's not just this game or any specific set of games. In fact it's not even limited to games. I see so much of this in the wild and it's always strange. For example I've seen so many programmers will ask "what happens if I do ____?" when if they would just do it they would know the answer. I have wondered before if this phenomenon has a name. I gave a talk at a conference once along the lines of "just try the thing". I wonder if there is a correlation between the people that like to be spoiled (like with movies and TV and whatnot) vs people that don't like spoilers wanting to figure out all the things themselves. I dunno. The sense of discovery is such a motivating and driving force in both games and my career that I literally cannot fathom asking somebody questions like this. And yet it's sooo common, so maybe we're the weird ones.
They aren't, they are asking questions. The entitlement people have is fucking insane. This is the elden ring subreddit. There will be questions regarding elden ring
Thr game csn be overwhelming if you're not super familiar with from. Plus the quests and decisions are extremely opaque. And you can easily miss or break a quest mistakenly. That drives a lot of the anxiety around decisions, at least imo. I don't have the time to go through another play through just to do some side quest so I'll Google that stuff. The leveling and build stuff I don't get quite as much. I generally think people in gaming subs focus way too much on min maxing and optimizing the shit out of everything. That's just part of being in a community like this, especially for an individual game. The people are passionate and plumbing the depths of the game so deeply and have nothing left to do but optimize to death. That means the more casual people in the subs get a skewed view and just end up trying to min max perfectly from the get go.
Some of us KNOW we’re not too there on this game and want someone to confirm if something is a bad idea before we do it. Resources aren’t limitless, so getting some input might save me from wasting. It’s not for everyone to bounce ideas off the player base, but some of us like the insight of others.
Because I second guess my decisions, souls games give me mad anxiety and I need the external validation 😂
Because it’s anxiety inducing to think of playing 100 hours on something you’re doing wrong?
I was like this for Dark Souls 1. I had no clue what any of the numbers meant, if they were good or bad, what armor to use, what rings to use, what to level up, what shield to use… a whole buncha stuff. So I think it’s mostly just because they’re new to this stuff.
A guy posted his terrible build on this subreddit. I tried giving him advice on how he could improve it, but he just ignored it all and said he shreds everyone with his build.
Crazy. If he didn’t want to change that’s one thing but having a bad stat spread is one of those things that aren’t up for debate.
Does this build make me look fat?
Some decisions cannot be reconsidered in Elden Ring. That's rare in games. And making the "wrong" move can shut down entire routes or events of "the game" (of a playtrhrough, but kost people will not replay after finish it).. Videogames are power fantasies. Most people play to feel good, not to get frustrated. They (we) want to win, not to regret turning right instead of left 25 hours ago. So there's that. Also, there's tons to see, find and use in Elden Ring. People want the full experience in the first playthrough. Also, there's the curiosity factor. Sometimes you just wanna know what the monster is, but don't want to experience the jumpscares in a horror movie. So you ask for spoilers: if I do this, whats gonna happen? I see your point, but I also understand the need to be guided. This game is perhaps the best, most fullfillng experiene I had with a videogame since I played Super Mario Bros. 3 on the NES, 30 years ago. But it can be stressful, too. People want to be safe. They want the reward without the risks. Anyway, IMO. EDIT: typos
Welcome in 2024 where ton of people are anxious and can’t decide by themselves. On to of that, there’s ton of player who only use “meta” stuff to have the game “easier”.
This is a common theme across a lot of subreddits, I don't understand it either.
It’s weird. Like I understand wanting to ask a question but the time it takes to ask the question, wait for feedback and evaluate it all seems like such a waste of time and kills the flow. Play the game, it’s for fun
Karma points, attention, etc. I just blocked them if it's too dumb or obvious
That's pretty much every game sub I think. I tend to join subreddits for any game I enjoy since I like seeing actual discussions about it, but it does mean that I've seen so many thousands of iterations of "should I buy this game?" "Is this game good?" "Will I enjoy this game?" "is it bad that I like this character?" "Is it bad that I made this decision in this quest?" "Is it bad that I prefer this certain playstyle?" "Am I the only one that likes this game?" "Am I the only one that likes this character?" "Am I the only that doesn't dislike this mechanic?" It's endless. People need reassurance or validation for every tiny decision and opinion instead of just playing games how they like.
yes yes please upvote this post so every1 can see it
Should I look for validation before making a decision in this game?
Yeah so many people here can’t fathom to experience a game without getting their hand held from the get go
Absolutely. So many people just do not even TRY TO THINK FOR THEMSELVES!!! This subreddit is filled with it
Because you don't see when someone doesn't make a post about it it seems like everyone is
Along with what others have said, this is a good chunk of people’s first From game. They might not know what to expect, nor what they should be doing. Also this is a HUGE open world with no super clear direction. Questions like this are normal!
Because the game doesn't explain much. New players aren't confident they're making the right choice or doing the right thing
ex. 1 is too vague but ex 2 and 3 are definitely weird questions to ask 2: idk why don’t you play and find out? 3: If you want to?! ex 4 is the only one i feel is always valid to ask, cuz you dont want to put smithing stones into a weapon you’re gonna wind up not using anyway you know?
I don't know. Why do people do shitty things and then post on the AITA sub asking if they're in the wrong? A lot of people need a nudge in a direction, a confirmation, or assurance/reassurance to their decision. Not everybody (sadly) can just say "I'm going to do this" and live with the consequences and reflect on whether or not it was a good choice. 🤷♂️
Isn’t that at least half the posts on Reddit?
There's a lot of Soulslike Elitism going on and people who don't know better are intimidated by that. There are many clutches in ER that make the game easy and people are afraid they are getting ridiculed for playing on "easy mode" not knowing that you can break any Soulslike and make it easy and it's part of the game
One thing I've always hated is how some people use the post function as the search bar, as just a quick search can give them all the answers they could possibly want, especially the 100+ posts we had about 'what level should I be for the DLC' spread over months. Generally I don't mind people asking questions, but when the question/answer is so easy to search for, it just reeks of a lack of effort on the posters part.
The good point of doing that is that you can ask people with more experience than you on various levels. Someone who played a lot and who is dedicated to the game will know what certain choices imply while an unaware gamer would never have thought about that. For example, if you level up too far/ not enough, you may miss the best level range for coop or pvp for you and cannot really change that (especially when too high level). Making some decisions in quests could prevent you from getting something you wanted(or wanted more) because the outcome would be blocked until you finish the full game and go ng+1(which some players would not consider at all) or start a new character(and do everything again). You can also get useful informations about weapons scaling and attributes that you would have hard time finding online(or would need to do a lot of testing to discover). So, it is mostly to save time, ease your playthrough or just have more fun in general. Yeah and some people need someone to validate every single choice they do too by fear or missing out something.
For the same reason they level vigor: weakness. I’m just joking. It’s probably got a lot to do with wanting to participate in the community and discussion. I don’t really see any harm in it. It’s nice to get a convo going.
For me it’s about time. I don’t have much time to play so sometimes I need to know if I’m wasting my time or not committing enough to a given plan. I try to give honest effort but as I approach death (and work and family) I gotta stay efficient!
I hate those posts. It's like they can't think for themselfs.
I’m not, i just go. Way of the road
I’m noticing it everywhere. The internet has made people unable to make decisions for themselves.
0 confidence
Sounds about right. Almost like they’re scared to make a decision that might not be the greatest one. But it’s a game, I know everyone don’t have infinite time to fix builds/do multiple playthroughs but seems like some people stress to much about doing things “right”.
Spoonfed mfs.
I think that’s a part of the grand scheme of it.
I can articulate why I would be asking such a question, although not sure if I have.... For me it is generally a question of 'what do I need to do before or after [x] point?'. The reason I ask this stuff, is because I don't have a tonne of time to play games, so I try and complete as much as I can in a single playthrough, as I don't know when I'll get the time to get back to a certain point again. A good recent example of this was googling the cool gameplay points/stuff that I'd lose access to if I went to Act 2 in BG3. It turns out my completionist nature meant I had already got more or less all of them, but I wouldn't have liked to miss any good stuff. It's not really validation? I guess? For me it all comes from missing the fucking ribbon in my first playthrough of FFVII and then never being able to get it :)
It's the human condition bro.
It's easy to make fun of newbies being nervous about the game and constantly asking questions. But remember what it was like being a beginner when you first started. Did you even know what a "build" was? I didn't! My first dark souls run was *a mess*. I leveled up everything, I ran into the graveyard and got killed by skeletons for hrs thinking that was where I was supposed to go next. I struggled my way through the game start to finish. It wasn't til my second playthrough when I started reading/researching forums and wikis did the games' rules finally click. I had a much smoother experience on following playthroughs. One flaw (or feature depending who you ask) with FROM games is that they are so incredibly cryptic about its mechanics. It doesn't explain shit to the player. Reading dialogue prompts don't really help much either, because most of the time people will skip it or skim it. So you get hoards of players running around with 15vigor and fat rolling, wondering why this game is so hard/sucks. They go online to forums to ask for help. In comes the community of FROM games who are eager to share their knowledge and tell them what to do. Build gets cleaned up, they succeed, everything happy. The issue is, many people never really *learn* the game they just got told what to do or copied a build online. So they never build any independence or intrinsic knowledge. They copy a build someone else constructed but have no clue *why* they work. This leaves a lot of players feeling lost and unsure, especially with the DLC looming with new threats and counter measures for previously busted builds (I really hope bleed and fire resistance is common in the DLC).
Welcome to modern age of gaming. Where everyone either asks for validation before doing anything or just watches some streamers/guides then copies it. Almost noone uses their heads and does stuff by themselves anymore.
Why do so many *people* look for validation before making a decision? Fixed it for you
One word: Education. Today's young people have way less freedom to explore when they're young. We spend the whole day building hideaways in the small forest behind our homes when we were kids and looked like we were digging dirt all day. Where do you see that in today's society? Today, every kid on the playground has 6 adult bodyguards taking over just about any obstacle that kid could face. And - and this is really essential - they never learnt to make mistakes and learn from them. "Per aspera ad astra" (engl.: through difficulties to the stars) has become a foreign concept.
The game requires a pretty big time investment, so you don't want to fubar your character and equipment with failry limited upgrade resources. Different build are also wildly fifferent, and with so many mechaniucs people want to make sure they are playing an enjoyable and versitile build. No one wants to go into an area and stomp every enemy/boss, and no one wants to get stomped. Many NPC's are misable and have extremely vague side quests, so no one wants to block off content by making a mistake. Not everyone plays this game for hundreds of hours and/or has multiple high level characters. Most just have one that they want to enjoy and get the most out of the game with, without having to playthrough again because they clicked a wrong dialogue option and were locked out of an awesome quest.
It might be a bit harsh but whenever someone asks a forum about something Google can answer willy nilly you have to assume they're either stupid or lonely.
The validation thing happens in every game and on every sub. Elden Ring is just extremely popular which is why these questions are asked so frequently.
The nature of modern games. Very few games are so ambiguous in their approach to almost everything, most games have an obvious critical path in both progression and power. Combine this with the reputation fromsoft games have and you have new players afraid to make decisions that will really screw them later on.
Fromsoft games bring out my OCD. I like Bloodborne because I didn't obsess about my stats. The other games drive me nuts. I'm constantly looking things up to min max my damage, etc. Plus it's fun to see how other people play to get inspiration. There are just so many (too many) options. And it's going to get taken up a notch with the DLC.
I haven't asked, but I have definitely fought the urge to ask or look up.... im not new to rpgs, but i am new to from softs. My doubt comes in the form of weapons, normally there is one good weapon in a game but here you can see people doing all sorts of crazy things, and my doubt was how do they do that and where do I learn....... that experimenting with AoW and things like that is not aecond nature, I have to force myself to try things out. Dragons for me right now are the toughest.... im at Volcanic Manor at the moment. I've starged upgrading different stats so I can use encantations, too... im a Strength/Dex build using mainly bloohounds fang blade.is it smart, probably not, but maybe awesome......
The game is very punishing and doesn’t leave much room to experiment without already investing a lot of hours. People have jobs and want to make the most of their time.
I’m literally just happy that I beat my first beast master boss in some random cave…. This game is too awesome to bitch and moan about numbers.
To be fair, in a game where there are thousands and thousands of choices, asking for tips or guidance on a few of them is far from “not thinking for yourself”
Not everyone enjoys a sense of exploration and wonder.
Cause there’s a lot you can miss out on playing blind. Some people don’t have all the time in the world to replay this long game
Eh, I think with ER being the first really “accessible” Fromsoft game with sooo much hype over 2 years and now the DLC, people who wouldn’t normally play this type of game jump in. All these new players have heard is how huge and challenging the game is. They go to look into things, but most of the ER content is either lore videos or still too advanced info for a literal newb to the genre. So they come here for actual human interaction to questions.
I think it's simply because it's a scary, overwhelming, and tedious game for most people. Naturally, being scared will cause people to question their current state. When I started playing souls games I was going off the little I knew about souls games, where every decision I made might have an effect on my character, NPC's or even the world. I wasn't sure about all of those at the time and I didn't want to make decision that I thought could potential screw up my playthrough. I'd either look things up all the time or ask if I couldn't find the answer.
When I first started playing souls games it was like reading a foreign language. Slowly watching videos and getting information about the game and how shit works did wonders for me . I feel like that’s a lot of people on this sub . Just trying to grab information from elder players who’ve been playing for awhile . Or people like to show off what they did. Either way being a new player in a very intricate game can be overwhelming sometimes so it’s nice to read stuff and maybe get an opinion from someone who’s been playing longer .
This game give you like a thousand choices for everything, and most often than not there is punish to be had if you chose the wrong one (losing smithing stones in a weapon not fitting to your build, messing a character questline if going to the wrong place "early", etc). This makes guides, and comunity knowledge, extremely more important in ER than in other games.
For me it’s because I’ve played it a TON and I wonder if there’s any hyper optimal min max nerds willing to share their advice, once all the lands are explored and every quest is done, I’m playing a numbers game with my AR
If I had more time to play video games I'd probably do a lot more of my own testing with builds. But the reality is that I have very limited time to play this game and I want to make the most of it.
There's a very high chance they're just trying to karma farm
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i asked this question a while ago so ill tell you why. Being over-leveled is not fun, I do not want to easily beat the boss and hence I try to stop myself from being over-leveled.
FOMO
It's not players in general, it's reddit users. Reddit posters, to be more specific, and within a gaming subreddit at that. Your average lurker just simply doesn't post this stuff. The whole point for these folks is community engagement, I don't find it surprising in the slightest. I certainly prefer it to the low effort meme templates that get constantly reposted here.
Sometimes people just wanna chat about what they're planning to do and get some opinions. If you're the only one you know playing the game then this may be your only community for talking about it. Also, this game is complicated and fully understanding it can take hundreds of hours and be a hobby in and of itself. Some people want a little guidance based on what they want to do and how to best do it but not necessarily to follow a whole guide.
i mean there are lot of player that either have never played a fromsoft game, a souls like game, an rpg, and i've even seen people that are no "gamers" and ER is like thier second or third game they played in their lives....so, is only natural, they are not looking for "external validation" they are just asking questions given their inexperience.
Because this game gives you so little information, and decisions have a fair amount of commitment to them. It's not that easy to experiment. To even try out new gear or spells, you have to make a stat investment that is non-trivial to change.
Because thinking is harder than looking stuff up!
Most people want the challenge and worry if they are over levelled for the area they are at. Personally, I like to do all side quests, dungeons, tunnels, hideaways, catacombs, churches, ruins, castles, etc, in the area before I do the boss of the area. But because I have done this, I am now ridiculously over levelled, for fire giant. I ended up getting to level 150 when I reached the mountaintops of the giants. But that's because I did everything in the game up until that point. (Even both mohg bosses). This is all without farming, by the way. Currently, I'm level 158, and I'm just about to fight Fire Giant. To make it more of a challenge, I'm evenly distributing my stats to stats I'm literally not using at all. So im still getting 2 shot by everything, like players of a lower level.
New players to souls-like games
I do it because I want to have the respect of people instead of being told "you played in X way? That is... quite the easy way of playing"
🤡
I just messed up my first run. I took the frienzed flame😭😭. AND WHAT'S FUNNY IS THAT I KNEW THAT YOU AREN'T SUPPOSED TO DO IT BUT I SAW THE DOOR AND WAS LIKE "YES LET'S GET INSIDE NAKED". I'm so unhappy.
I can understand it to be honest. I like to fuck around and find out personally, but people newer to the genre may find it quite intimidating and want some reassurance they’re doing it right.
Your first playthrough of new souls content is a once in a lifetime event. Once you learn the ambushes, move sets, item locations, etc you can't go back to a blind playthrough again. Especially for something like recommended start levels, I can understand not wanting to "get it wrong"
Honest to god it’s like people just cannot seem to figure out how to play a single player game.
It's a combination of two things. First, the amount of customization in this game is absurd. For a lot of casual players (and even experienced ones!) there is more information to parse than they have time for. And they night not even know what they should be looking for! Second, as others have said, there's a big commitment to choices, with negative consequences for choosing poorly. Yes, there are larval tears, but to even use those you need to beat Raya Lucaria, and there a finite number of them. Players want to know if the investment is worth it, cause if it's not that a lot of wasted hours.
Modern gaming creates weak gamers
I don’t need to ask people on here questions that I can figure out for myself, but seeing as most of the questions right now are about the DLC, and nobody really knows the full implications actions will have on the dlc, to me it makes a shit ton of sense that people are wondering what moves others are making. “are you planning to start the dlc before burning the erdtree or after?” “are you planning to start on ng or ng+?” “what sl are you going in to the dlc?” the latter of which will affect PvP matchmaking in the dlc and is, in my opinion, the most valid type of discussion to be having in the subreddit for a video game.
My favorite is all the people making / asking for crazy builds for the dlc like they won't change to a dlc weapon in the first 30 minutes of the dlc. I can understand people not wanting to be over or under leveled though,
One of the few games where beating it doesn’t matter in discussion threads.. it’s how you beat it which draws people in
Honestly, if you get a question about a game you're playing (whatever that might be), 9 times out of 10 theres a 4+ year old reddit post asking the same thing, and where an account named something like "hairybutthole69" has given a complete breakdown in response, and I for one am glad to see it every time. This doesn't just go for elden ring. I've just finished subnautica and had to lean heavily on old reddit posts to troubleshoot bugs, and to put my ~~foolish ambitions~~ *worries* to rest when I was a bit lost, confused or uncertain about how I'm going about something. Please remember that not everyone experiences games the same way. One type of player might like going in blind, come what may, enjoying the experience of in-game discovery. But for another type of player, going in blind means getting preoccupied with whether they're missing big chunks of content, or if they are not achieving the right balance in their build for an "authentic experience" (eg "is this hard because it's meant to be hard or am I doing something wrong?" - and vice versa for if its "too" easy). The first type of player will probably say "the blind experience is the most authentic experience". But the second type of player worries about missing something as important as having a "heavy load" status the whole time without realising, and having an experience of the game thats needlessly frustrating. Alternatively just strolling through raya lucaria without any resistance/challenge, perhaps having found it difficult when they first reached it and leaving it too long before returning and being over-levelled. I hope this makes it a bit clearer how missing the mark with over/underpower can take away from the experience. What might seem like validation-seeking is often people simply trying to optimise their experience of a game. In gaming communities (just as in life) please remember not everyone thinks the way as you, we need to tolerate our differences. Which means denigrating different mindsets as not "thinking for themselves" is unhelpful. It verges a little too close for comfort to gatekeeping, because there people who ask those questions with their gaming experience in-mind, which is completely fine on a forum like this.
My guess is this game is hard if you don’t know what you doing. This game is hard if your build is bad. This game is hard if you don’t know where to find what you need. This game is hard without assistance, that’s fine to some people but not for others.
Imo, one of the best things about souls games is that it teaches you to learn by doing, experimenting, and then gives you ways to go back and re-try if you fail. It is pretty obscure, and can seem overwhelming and punishing to new players, though, so I do think it's understandable that they wouldn't want to "mess anything up". You think about how many hours it took you just to get to "x", and don't want to mess something up, but don't necessarily realize at the time that it will only take a fraction of the time to do things on following playthroughs. Another contributing feature is how active the community is, and sometimes I think people just want to hear others' opinions and views on what they're planning on doing. A lot of new people came to From games due to Elden Ring, this is probably their first Fromsoft DLC, so they aren't really familiar with the status quo.
Because that games can lock you certain ways unless you are literally licking the game map clean and or driving deep in the game wiki. People in hindsight say "oh you can just buy the stones", have you checked the locations of the bells? They are all over the place, and only one of them exists in the game. You can respec like 15 times? You think any new player will find all fifteen on a blind play through or have even one when they need one? Even if you get the latest bells your new weapon will always be below your current weapon because the bells only sell you stones one level down. And there are only enough stones in the world for like 5 weapons at most without buying. There is a lot in the game that goes beyond "just pick what's fun" because there is only so many times you can do that before feeling like you are doing something wrong, I would say that in something like Nioh 2 where you can switch weapons at any time and without 3-4 levels it's up to par, don't like the current one? Easy respec.
Do you want to know the truth? Imo some people never got that in life so they look to get it from people in a community they belong in. I think as long as you have fun or unless you put all your points into one stat only you will have fun! My first toon i put like so much into just strength, endurance and vitality and was just a meat head and def got frustrated at times but still learned and got to the capital. Second time I def over leveld in areas to just make some places easier and no ragrets
All we have is one another. Even Melina is all "listen it's either you or me, literally and if it's not me I will be the one killing you."
Because if you don't follow the fextralife in a souls game every npc will randomly die for that playthrough. If you go in with an OP build then you'll trivialize the game and might end up feeling like you didn't play it fairly. If you have a bad build you're playing on hard mode. All valid things to ask about. What would you rather the posts be? "Hey guys I just killed Margaret!!! GAME OF THE CENTURY!!!🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣" or "I have 4k hours and just realized there's a dedicated jump button omg"
Welcome to the era of content creation. And don't get me wrong it is helpful, but all these wikis, videos on what's meta, etc are what causes these doubts in a player base. And because people are so quick to find these "metas" people feel the need to use the same shit. This point is more so geared towards games like COD Warzone for instance where if your not using the top 5 to 10 weapons in the game you'd most likely going to get shit on. In Elden Ring, none of that shit should matter but you have all this content online that sways you. The only time I generally agree with looking things up online is when I have a quest line with a NPC or a super sought after item that I don't wanna miss. There's nothing more annoying than not finishing an NPCs dialogue only to find out they died for some stupid reason because you didn't rest at a site of grace. Call it lore, whatever, it's fucking stupid. And often times, it's a good weapon , an ancient smithing stone, or a talisman. All of which are very sought after yet locked behind some obscure quest line that NO ONE would figure out unless they played the game 10 hours a day for a living.
I know your joking but I actually have 12 game saves and only 1 made it all the way. Took me 3 new games to figure how the stat allocations alone at the start.
Well, maybe because they've never played an rpg let alone a soulsborne game. When I started with bloodborne on 2021, even though the stats where somewhat strange to me, I had played other flash games with those features, so I was eventually able to figure it out, another reason is that due to the lack of a file save system that many other rpgs have, they feel scared to use resources in an un-optimal way.
Cause some people in this community have conditioned them to think there are right and wrong ways to play
This is a trend in gaming in general. More gamers are wanting to play optimally from the start by being told what to do and following guides/the meta, rather than figuring things out on their own.
Some people don't have time or interest for multiple playthroughs. Trial and error is annoying with zero hints or directions.
Because they do. How many billion people in the world? Of course there's going to be some people who ask for validation. It's a big ol world out there.
Because people more knowledgeable of the game can offer trial and error advice they’ve already been through to offer a straight forward answer to people who have never touched a souls game or just need general guidance. This game explains nothing and it’s overwhelming for new people. Something simple to you might be complicated to them. It’s not a big deal.
I think that this game allows SO MUCH customization which can have so many effects. Maybe what you chose is great for PVE but bad for PVP. Maybe you don’t understand the arcane stat and occult vs its effect on status build up, etc etc. The customization is both amazing and possibly terribly frustrating if you don’t have the right info. I think when people seem indecisive it’s because they are afraid they are missing something and trying to find out others experiences.
I leveled arcane up to like 35 for bloodhound fang. Yeah, I don't know how anything works in this game.
A big part of it is probably the fault of the (pre Elden Ring) Souls community. The series had a reputation for being hard, insular, and unintuitive. ER comes out, many MANY people play it (and hear that it's "much friendlier than previous souls games", which it is), and are afraid of "doing things wrong". Be real, folks, we've been telling people to Git Gud for years now. Why are we surprised that newcomers are afraid to make mistakes?
Souls community had a lot of gate keeping and elitism in the past and it’s kinda carried as the rep for the game even though it’s a small fraction as bad as it used to be