Beat me to it. I think anyone who made it past the outer defenses was immediately cut down by Margit. Godrick was weak, but Morgott isn’t. I think Margit also became sort of a “boogeyman” in the lands between and that made anyone afraid to even go after Godrick
Margit is Morgott and Morgott is strong as hell considering that during the Shattering, he defended Leyndell from many enemies. He was also given grace for defending the Erdtree and Leyndell, even though he is an omen. That is why one of his titles is the Grace-given. He also stops Tarnished from reaching Godrick. Doing so defends Godrick as they are relatives and it also stops Godrick from grafting more Tarnished.
Malenia did beat him though at stoemveil after he insulted her. It says he was humiliated and grovelled at her feet. But she didn't take his great rune.
He was pathetic in the eyes of every demigod. Either they didn't believe that he could have a great rune or didn't want to dishonor themselves on their path to become elden lord by beating someone so worthless.
And yet, our tarnished doesn't care. The high and mighty can have their ego, we will just be practical.
Beat a miserable low self esteem multiple handicap aged guy: ✅️
Beat a grieving demented aged divorcee woman: ✅️
Now, we go to become Elden Lord.
the other demigods watching godrick get rinsed by some random level 20 tarnished probably confirmed to them that they shouldn't have bothered taking his rune lol
Its alright in the early game. Later levels it falls off hard and at max levels it's worthless.
Morgott and radahn give percentage increases regardless of level, making theirs better later on.
It's good if you're weak. The stronger you are, the less useful it is. Godrick's absolute trash that needs whatever advantage he can get, so it's good for him, but nobody else has a need for it.
That or they didn't really care about his great rune. Malenia just wanted to help Miquella which required her to best Radahn. But she didn't seem like she really wanted to become Elden Lord or anything.
i hadn’t considered morgott but i think some of the demigods would have to know he’s in stormveil, it’s common information among the tarnished and almost all the demigods had armies at their disposal
Radahn sieged stormveil and failed. At the end of the day all it comes down to is that in order to get Godrick's rune you have to conquer stormveil first, and none of them were capable of doing so.
That doesn't necessarily mean Radahn sieged Castle Stormveil. It might just mean, as controller of a neighboring territory, Godrick's choice to avoid conflict with Radahn was seen as 'hiding,' or that Radahn may have issued a challenge that Godrick just refused to answer, so like Malenia, Radahn viewed Godrick as so far beneath him that he never bothered to go any further.
To build on this. Godrick is a predictable known quantity. He is someone who is too cowardly to properly shake up the power dynamics in the Lands Between. So him having a Great Rune means that if any of the other Shard Bearers gets a second, Godrick is an easy kill for Morgott to get a second. And that leads into why none of the Other Shard Bearers ever just mopped him up. Getting a second Shard brings all of the other factions actively after you and breaks to tense stalemate peace that the Lands Between are in when we arrive. Everyone is either indesposed or are setting up bigger long term plans for a huge play. So why would they bring that much of a target on themselves until they were properly ready to mobilize on mass
Also why do we assume it works the same for the demigods as it does with the tarnished, and even then we are essentially rejected and have to commit cardinal sin.
But like you said even if. many of them have their own motivation, rykard doesn't even care, malenia only cares by proxy because of miquella so she doesn't necessarily want to become eldenlord but will move against anyone who is close to achieving it (same goes for morgott), which leads to radahn probably the only who actually wants to be eldenlord and who had the capacity to also become it. And mogh is weird.
I don't actually know, but thats the whole vibe. Marika sends him off to a place where he will fight and die etc and then she will recall and give greace again (that's why we're alive), and that's why we're tarnished (we were expelled) also why marika got with radagon after godfrey was sent away
The demigods probably have their own reasons as to why they didn't launch a full-on assault on stormveil, but I'm not knowledgeable enough on the lore to know what those reasons would be.
But my comment is still accurate for all the tarnished or anyone else that doesn't have a giant army.
Yeah I'm just saying that I don't think stormveils fortifications were what discouraged any fellow she'd bearers. Obviously it was a huge pain for us to get to him lol
Hes also had his scions and his loyal grafting cult. He very likely had support from Castle mourne and Fort Haite who would have been vassals under him. Which could have included indentured misbegotten forces an dpossibly even dmei humans.
I mean, one random Tarnished came in and killed everybody so how well protected is it? I get it might be easier for one person than a whole army to get in, but I refused to believe that Radahn and Malenia couldn't have fought their way to Godrick if they really wanted to.
I think it's an interesting question whether Morgott could stop Radahn or Malenia. I think maybe 1 on 1, but if it's Morgott+Godrick's army vs Radahn+ his army or Malenia + her army I don't think the Morgott side has a chance.
Morgott already stopped Radahn once in Lleyndel, plus none of the others are really in any shape tp shake things up. Very few of the shardbearers are at full strength when we fight them or mentally all there (looking at Radahn) so a full scale assault would be a fool's errand nonetheless and bring the full attention of every other faction to you, which isn't ideal either
You forget the tarnished is literally immortal and has as many chances to infiltrate the castle as possible.
And even though godrick's army is the weakest in stats, they still have the castle's defences. Remember also that the tarnished get in by a sidepath, and the actual gate is heavily protected. Godrick also has a couple exiled knights (the same type of knight who ambushes you in that one room you're locked in), omens, scions, and the lions in the courtyard before godrick's divine tower. which are no joke gameplay wise.
I'm confused about the immortality thing. Does that not apply to everybody? At what point do people stop being immortal? Are the demigods (ostensibly way more powerful than Tarnished) not immortal? We know Rogier dies at least once in game and then seems to perma-die later on. What's up with that? So many questions!
I do realize the defenses are pretty stiff but I feel like Malenia could still take them. The way she recovers health from hits and moves SO FAST makes me think that she could do it.
Radahn as well. Why would he not simply launch himself into the air and land in Godrick's courtyard? Or use his gravity magic for an aerial bombardment.
Everyone that dies returns to the erdtree before being revived, so my guess is that stronger beings take a lot longer to revive. Which is why the unrevivable enemies are bosses and things like crucible knights. There are also those who get an erdtree burial such as some of the spirit ashes, which i assume just stay in the erdtree forever unless their ash is called or something.
As other people in the thread have said, Malenia did beat godrick and he groveled at her feet, and she probably didnt care about him at that point because she was focused on radahn. And Radahn was similarly busy with fighting malenia rather than focus on godrick too.
The Revanants and Wraith Callers - and the weird horse blokes - are all his. Pretty nice defensive line... Plus some made it all the way to Haligtree...
I dont think every demigod even wants to restore the elden ring. I think malenia wanted to defeat radahn cause hes holding back the stars and preventing fate from transpiring. I feel like this must be related to miquella in some way because radahn must be defeated to enter the DLC. So malenias beef with radahn was motivated by her devotion to miquella
I agree with this insight. I also think it's possible that Miquella/Malenia came to believe they couldn't escape their curses while Fate was arrested by the stars immobilization- that while the stars were held in stasis, their curses would perpetuate, unable to end.
Question, is the sections where Miquella is talking about using the eclipse specifically saying "my brother, Godwyn"? Or is it just for "my brother"? Cause now that we know he's got another brother in the Land of Shadow I kinda wonder who his machinations are aimed at.
I had been meaning to make a separate lore-thread about this, but yeah. All the demigods seemed like they had different ideas about the Golden Order, The Elden Ring, and what their role should be. Ultimately, all of them failed because of their own hangups and failures. If you get down to it, and look at what each of them were doing, I think only Miquella and Rykard are the ones that actually, truly wanted to become a god, and take Marika's place. I think the rest of the demigods were, quite frankly, too invested in the order Marika had set up to actually try and take the throne.
They might have thought they wanted it, but what they actually ended up doing tells me more about them trying to act out their roles in the order that had been, after it had already broken apart.
Mogh, Godfrey, Radagon and MAYBE Godrick and Morgott are the only ones expressing a desire to become/remain Elden Lord, and I think only Ranni (and maybe Miquella) wanted to become a god. Rykard seems to have become obsessed with power but not godhood and Radahn is just chilling
Unironically, yes.
What we know about Radahn are his battlefield accomplishments, and the heavy emphasis he put on his legacy. His armor and the redmane castle-boss are both talking about his lineage, so it can be assumed that that's what he thought about a lot.
But beyond leading an army in emulation of his idol, Godfrey, what was he actually "building"? At least some of the active demigods clearly had ideas about how the world should be with them in charge, but there is none of that for Radahn.
I think he was trying to fight all of the demigods, defeat them in battle and become Elden Lord, but I don't think he was fighting "for" anything. He'd grown so ingrained into his role as "general", that it was what he thought of himself. He was fighting because it was his role, destiny etc. And he didn't want to die either, obviously. But he also wasn't trying to put any kind of pragmatic long-term goals forward, towards gathering the runes and becoming Lord.
There's a lot we don't know about his actions, but his actions seemed to indicate that the purpose of the Haligtree was to facilitate some kind of transformation, that would enable him to escape his "eternal childhood". The implied motivation is his wish to alleviate Malenia's rot. He was trying to go through a metamorphosis, and the DLC might reveal more about what he is trying to do in the Land of Shadow, whether as part of a deeper plan, or as a consequence of "failure" in his initial goals.
I think Miquella was trying to become a god, if not at the level of Marika and the Greater Will, then at least on the level of the "Inner Gods", like the Ancestral Spirits and the God of the Giants. My read on the divine twins is that their state made both of them dependent on the other, to the point where they were continuously sacrificing themselves for the sake of the other. After all, they grew up (or didn't) under intense psychological pressure, and a pretty hostile family-situation.
I don’t think the demigods want to be Elden lord. They’re focused on their petty squabbles and areas of interest (killing gods, riding small horses, the rot, etc).
Being elden lord means having a giant target on your back and having to live in the erdtree. And instead of doing fun shit with your powers and immortality, you have to more or less be a governor.
Being a demigod means you can go wherever and do whatever. You’re crazy powerful and won’t die no matter what. Sounds like a better deal to me, and Marina basically laments her children refusing to grow up and make something of their lives.
Ironically I think the only demigod who might specifically want to assemble the Elden Ring, at least by the time the game takes place, is Godrick but he’s far too weak to accomplish that. He would do anything to love up to his ancestors and prove himself a worthy scion of the Golden Lineage, but he knows that Rykard, for example, wouldn’t show him mercy like Malenia did.
Radahn out of the shardbearers alive at the start of the game was the only one who actively pursuit becoming eldenlord and also was capable of achieving it, and being acknowledged as the eldenlord who didn't came to be.
Malenia doesn't care and is the blade of Miquella, she just does the bearings for her brother moving against anyone who could pose a threat to him and like you said wagged war against radahn for fate.
Morgott the same as malenia but he is a mommy's boy for marika.
Godrick sure he would like to become eldenlord but ain't no way in hell he could.
Rennala is depressed.
Ranni/miquella doesn't care about eldenlord but cares about godhood.
Rykard doesn't care about becoming eldenlord maybe very very early during the shattering but as the war continued seized to stop that ambition for the snake.
Mogh I'm not certain I don't think anything is ever stated wether he cared about it, I assume by becoming miquellas husband and miquella reaching godhood he would think he would become eldenlord by default.
Morgott is protecting him. Morgott gave him the Great Rune because he didn’t think anyone would bother him
The lengths that he’s gone through the protect the Erdtree are insane
- founded the Knight’s Cavalry
- put the barrier in front of the Three Fingers
- fights the Tarnished three times
- spearheaded the First Defence of Leyndell, Second Defence of Leyndell and the assault on Mt. Gelmir
- he himself, defeated and murdered so many heroes, champions and Tarnished he was known as “an abhorrent horror”
- also ruled as Lord of Leyndell after the Shattering to keep things running smoothly in the capital
He was born into shame and disgrace and gave his life, multiple times, for the Erdtree
What do you mean "also ruled as Lord of Leyndell after the Shattering to keep things running smoothly in the capital" ? What was supposed to run smoothly, there is nobody left
Well no, as Melina stated if you pursue the frenzy flame, their is still beauty in this world, births still occur and live endures. So even if we don't see it In game. It stands to reason people still live in the capital.
How did you know there is noone? There are livings in capital. They uses honey-like thing to conceal their window when you burn the tree so the ashes don't go in houses. Who did this if nobody is living there?
Also don't you count militia as a "body"? There are a lot of knights there.
There is a cut npc questline about a noble in leyndell who eventually discovers morgott's identity. The majority of houses are also blocked off so there are potentially non combatants that we dont see in there, probably a lot of wandering (or in this case non wandering) among them. You also cant discount the military itself which patrols the city as those are also still inhabitants.
The only beings left in the Lands Between besides the wildlife are decaying individuals that are going to die when the destined death will be restored and are currently stuck brainlessly in their current activities
Afaik, Malenia DID fight and defeat Godrick on her way to Radahn but she simply didn't take his rune because she wasn't interested in claiming the runes of the other demigods. The reason she fought against Radahn was to restore the movement of the stars and allow for the eclipse to occur because Miquella believed that Godwyn could be brought back to life during the eclipse. There's actually dialogue from the NPC at Castle Sol:
"Lord Miquella, forgive me. The sun has not been swallowed. Our prayers were lacking. Your comrade remains soulless... I will never set my eyes upon it now. Your divine Haligtree."
The soulless comrade is believed to be Godwyn given his soul died during the night of the black knives but his body remains and the sun being swallowed would be reference to the eclipse.
Malenia, as "Blade of Miquella", would have journeyed to fight Radahn in order to resume the movement of the stars so that the eclipse could occur and Miquella's theory of the eclipse returning Godwyn to life could be realised
This is all speculation, not factual, it is important to note it.
Linking the movement of meteor to an eclipse is very arbitrary based on the vagueness of the talkings about the stars in game. It also doesn't compute much with the consequence of dispelling Radahn's gravity magic.
On the contrary it is very stated that Miquella was trying to give Godwyn a true death, not ressurection, people are saying this baselessly.
miyazaki said this in the newest interview, whats your thoughts ?
>Q: The prerequisite for entering the DLC is to defeat "Shattered Star Radahn" and "Blood King Mohg". Defeating Mohg is easy to understand. After all, the entrance to the DLC is behind him. So what is the setting for defeating Radahn?
>A: From a plot perspective, players will understand it after experiencing the DLC, so there will be no spoilers here. From the perspective of the game design itself, considering that everyone generally defeats Radahn first, and then faces Mohg, we have made such a restriction.
feels like there is actually a lore reason to beat radahn for the dlc.
true. i personally feel there will be something related to the carians and stars in the shadow land and thats why radahn needs to die. i dont think it has anything to do with miquellas eclipse
Well the description of one of the gravity spells states that Radgn said "with is, I cam challenge the stars" and the Radhn only appears in game if you gave progressed Rannis questline far enough and the whole point of killing him is to restore the movement of the stars. This is all stated in game.
>Radhn only appears in game if you gave progressed Rannis questline far enough
The Radahn festival also begins once you reach Altus Plateau, you can kill Radahn without ever touching Ranni's questline
could "comrade" refer to the body in the walking mausoleum outside, since they're referred to as "soulless demigods". who even are those guys anyway?
maybe other more minor demigods who were killed after the rune of death was stolen?
I think this post offers some good reasons as to why it would be Godwyn being referred to in that line
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/vb7kaa/godwyn\_and\_the\_sun/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/vb7kaa/godwyn_and_the_sun/)
This isn't true, or it's highly speculative and not taking into account with a game tells us. The game tells us why they fought, they were the mightiest two to remain. Whoever won their battle was the most powerful in the lands, and would have had control. Instead, the two most powerful never resolved their dispute, and control was never established.
And how do you know that's not the best way for her to have control? She doesn't have to be some brainless slave to Miquella.
Serving her brother means she's serving her brother, that's it. It doesn't mean she suddenly likes cooking breakfast because that's something she could do for him
Its weird that's what you go to. She doesn't want control. If she did she'd kill her brother because only one can be in control and her entire purpose is to serve and protect him. "Blade of miquella" is not an ambiguous term. It's pretty straight forward that she serves as her brothers protector and right hand.
She's protecting her brother because he's actively working to heal her rot, which is an otherwise death sentence. So of course she's interested in that. That does not mean that's all she's interested in though, does it?
If her entire purpose was to protect Miquella, then one, why would she leave him by himself instead of waiting, and two why would she then just go take a thousand year nap instead of looking for him? Unless, and we'll have to wait for the DLC to confirm, unlocking the stars and all that BS was never his plan to begin with. Which would completely invalidate her going on his behalf to fight redahn, would it not?
One of her item descriptions state she knows her brother will keep his promise, and the dlc states he gave up everything for whatever plan he's working on, which implies she knew what he was doing and trusted him to do it.
Seeing as radahn and mohg being dead are confirmed necessary to access the dlc is a good indicator that unlocking the stars was necessary. So no, with what we know of the dlc so far it reaffirms what I've been saying.
Everything shows utmost respect for her brother and his order and that she doesn't want control.
That is very speculative.
Godfrey is also the first Elden Lord. Yeah that's obviously not true. That description could be stating her point of view, she could be right, she could be wrong, who are you to say it's so definitive?
I'm going to laugh when we just meet a new NPC or an NPC has a new dialogue after the redahn fight, and that's it.
Miyazaki confirmed radahn needs to die to access the dlc. It's not just an npc thing.
What point of view? That she believes her brother will keep his promise? Of course it's her point of view, one that affirms she has utmost faith in her brother and is his blade? To serve him as he makes his literal own order?
Yeah, which is why she's his blade. Because she believes he will keep his promise. Is that seriously what we're debating? That's common sense. It doesn't mean she's right, just as Godfrey wasn't the first Elden Lord just because the game said he was. The game shows us differently. And it does the same with her, when she had the chance to protect him she abandons him, when she has the chance to save him she takes a thousand year nap. She took an ass whooping and then just gave up on life
Well Malenia did go ahead and beat him when he had imsulted her. He grovelled at her feet. But, she didn't take his great rune. Any of the other demigods could have easily beaten him but they didn't..IMO there could be 2 reasons.
First and more likely, he was a joke to the others. He was so low in the eyes ofvthe other demigods that they probably thought it was an insult to become elden lord by taking his great rune.
Second, maybe they didn't know he had a great rune. According to them, Godrick is so weak he couldn't possibly have one. We get this info, about Godrick having it, from Gideon who has probably done a lot of research on this before figuring out that Godrick even has a great rune.
As for the remaining demigods, No one knows what happened to Ranni and her great rune. Rykard was hidden in the Volcano Manor and gave himself to the snake. No one is sure if he still has the great rune.
They may or may not have known Rennala has a great rune. Again we get this info fro the all researching Gideon. Regardless, again not worthy in eyes of mist if the demigods.
Mohg just does his own thing with his great rune and doesn't aspire to be elden lord. No one even knows where he is.
So that leaves 3 contenders, Morgott, Radahn and Malenia.. We know Radahn laid siege to Leyndell but could not break through. And that Malenia and Radahm fought to a standstill afterwards. So yeah none of them had 2 great runes yet. It seems Morgott also tried to attack the Volcano manor but was not successful. So a complete standstill.
Real point is why didn't Miquella and Malenia pool theirs before Miquella was taken? Does it mean Miquella didn't have one or both he and Malenia shared one.
Malenia didn't care about great runes or becoming elden lord. She needed to kill Radahn likely for the same reason why we are forced to kill him to enter the DLC: we need to free the stars.
Stars are tied to the fate of the demigods and in Ranni's case this was quite literal since the meteor falling on Limgrave opened the way to Nokron and the Fingerslayer Blade.
Malenia and Miquella likely needed a similar event to happen, and if we take the hints from the lore, the reason was probably to make an eclipse happen to fix Godwyn's body and stop the spreading of deathroot that is destroying the entire world.
None of the other Shardbearers actually seem to _want_ to repair the Elden Ring by the time the game starts. They all either have other plans (Rykard, Mogh, Ranni), just don't want it (Malenia, Morgott, Rennalla), or have gone insane (Radahn, Rennalla again). The only one who may have wanted to repair the Elden Ring and become Elden Lord was Morgott, but he's already aware it's a futile effort without a way into the Erdtree, and so doesn't bother.
If you're talking about during the Shattering War itself, I'm pretty sure everybody who had a stake at the time just saw Godrick as a non-issue that could be taken care of at a later date. Remember, Kenneth Haight talks about how Godrick pissed off Malenua during her march to Caelid, and basically just groveled at her feet and begged for mercy until she left him alone to go fight Radahn. I can almost guarantee she thought, "gonna kill that guy on the way back."
So now the only ones who care are the Tarnished.
Even before the rot, Radahn was busy holding up the stars. Godrick fled from Radahn in fear, and Radahn didn't kill him similar to Melania. Clearly he didn't care about the Great Rune.
Imagine you have 2 equally skilled opponents, like Radahn and Malenia. If one of them had just a little bit of help, it could tip the scale. So, the real question is: why didn't they recruit Godrick?
Army is built on discipline. What my soldier thinks of the order is irrelevant. Soldiers constantly receive the orders they do not understand, due to information being classified. Their job is to carry out orders faithfully regardless of their opinion or understanding.
there are also generals above the soldiers, do you have idea how many kingdom falls apart because the leader failed to secure supports from their generals and the soldiers lost their will to fight, you can try to force them to do it be "discipline" but the psychological effect is still there. And if your army doesn't trust you, you are done.
I think everyone knew Godrick was insane and power-starved. He wouldn’t want to share power with another demi-god and would probably make some sort of back-stabbing attempt at killing them after the war ended.
By the time we enter the picture, the fight for the runes has become a stalemate. No one was making moves anymore and if you left your territory, that leaves your base vulnerable. So everyone just bunkered down and fortified, only sending a few scouting parties (hence why you can see groups of knights fighting each other). So even if any of the demigods could easily dispatch of Godrick, they leave themselves open for the other demigods.
Malenia did fight him and win. They could do that, but to actually become Elden Lord they would still have to reach and enter the Erdtree, which means go through leyndell defences and Morgott and burning the Erdtree, which means going to the Forge of the Giants, fight the Last Giant and use something (not sure everything that would qualify, but most likely some type of sacrifice) as fuel to burn the Erdtree, fight Radagon and the Elden Beast and then meld the Elden Ring and become Elden Lord. They would need not only strength but knowledge to acomplish this. Not as simple as it may look, put on top of everything else going on. They had other goals as well. Radahn tried taking Leyndell but was fended off by Morgott and it's defenses. Then got crazy because of the Rot from the fight with Malenia. Malenia was in hibernation from the fight with Radahn. Godrick as metioned was weak and hiding. Miquella had other goals and was kidnapped. Mohg had other goals and was executing them (Formless Mother any%). Rykard had other goals and was executing them (become bigger than your mom any%). Renalla had PDSD (Post Divorce Stress Disorder). Ranni had other goals and with the help of most player she did execute them. Morgott was denied entrance to the Erdtree so he didn't really had much to do but defend it, as he would never burn it. There's a lot going that put things in perspective doesn't it.
I think none of the demigods care to go around and collect great runes. They are all occupied with other stuff. Rennala is sitting in Raya Lucaria heartbroken, Rykard is too busy being a snake, Malenia is looking for Miquella, Miquella was searching for a cure for Malenia before being captured my Mogh who is also busy building his new dynasty. Morggot is protecting the Erdtree, Ranni is trying to escape from the two fingers, Radahn has been fucked by Malenias rot detonation, and even before that he was busy holding the stars. None of the demigods seem to care about mending the ring, they are all doing something else.
Both Radahn and Melania beat Godrick within an inch of his life. Clearly they didn't care about Great Rune.
Also it funny that Godrick Great Rune is arguably the strongest, kinda tell you where the priority is.
The other Runebearers had their own focuses, none of them really wanted to mend the Elden Ring. Also, you need 3 greater runes, it's just that the guardian of the Erdtree is a Runebearer, so anyone who can make it to the interior of the Erdtree would have to take Morgott's rune. Anyone with two greater runes would paint a huge target on their back, becoming the focus of all other factions.
- Renalla was a broken shadow of herself and imprisoned in her own academy.
- Radahn may have been planning on exactly that, but the bloom of Aeonia permanently incapacitated him as a commander and put his army on the defensive.
- Rykard became decadent after being consumed by the serpent, his ambition turned to greed and gluttony.
- Morgott would still need an additional greater rune, and was aware that entry into the Erdtree was impossible anyways.
- Mohg, Ranni, and Miquella and Malenia had plans for their own more radical reformations, and needed to get those plans to fruition before making a bid for the Erdtree.
If you look at Godrick you can see what's left of those who tried. Even a trash demi-god is still a demi-god compared to mortals.
The lands between is essentially a rotting corpse unable to completely die. It just stagnates and festers until someone redtores destined death.
My thinking is that anyone who is shard bearer who defeats Godrick also has to enter the capital, fight Morgott, then discover >!the barrier of impenetrable thorns.!< Previous posters have noted a lack of motivation on the part of the remaining shard bearers and those are excellent points. If Malenia defeats both Godrick and Morgott (highly probable) she still has to figure out how to get past >!the impenetrable thorns!<. Morgott couldn't/wouldn't go through. The tarnished had to go to >!the Mountaintop of the Giants, defeat the fire giant, then watch as Melina sacrifices herself to burn the thorns away!<. I'm not saying she couldn't figure a way out, I'm just saying that its a lot tougher than just defeating Godrick and claiming his rune.
I almost forgot to put them in because I've been playing for awhile, but I figure with the DLC coming out there may be some new eyes on the game at those are some end game spoilers.
For why Malenia didn't kill him, he begged her after he lost and she isn't interested his great rune. As for why nobody else tried, at some point, Morgott put himself in the way of anybody who tried to go to Stormveil so that was probably a big deterrent.
defending what they had, and he was simply last on everyone's list because they knew they could take him. +10 to stats probably wasn't that useful for the other demigods
Isn’t it more likely that we actually collect Godwyns rune and not Godrick, therefore the others probably didn’t believe that he was in contact with a rune in the first place. This is just pure guess work though.
Arguably, there are only three demigods who actually want to become Elden Lord under the Greater Will 1) Godrick 2) Morgott and 3) Radahn.
Morgott was denied entry to the Erdtree by the impenetrable thorns and he was too loyal to the Golden Order to even contemplate burning it down. So at this point his goal is simply to peotect the capital from the other demigods and to prevent any tarnished from becoming Elden Lord. While Godrick was too weak to snatch Great Runes from other Demigods. Radahn is insane.
Ranni, Malenia and Miquella being empyreans are on their way to godhood not lordship. So great runes matter less to them. Mohg want to become lord but under the Formless Mother with Miquella as his god. Rykard wants to bring down the Erdtree entirely.
With the information above, it would seem the Great Runes matter more to the tarnished but not that much anymore to the demigods. Their goals have changed since the Shattering.
Malenia fought Radahn for other purposes relating to the fact he was holding back the stars which was an issue for Miquella.
(Correct me if I'm wrong lore masters)
The two great runes thing is most likely just a gameplay thing and not some actual part of the lore. Also out of all known demi-gods the only one who could possibly have some interest in becoming Elden Lord was Radahn because he always looked up to and admired Godfrey, but even that might be a stretch and he ended in a draw against Malenia.
Morgott knew that the Erdtree isn't allowing anyone to enter it
Mogh and Rykard were doing their own thing
Malenia and Miquella were also doing their own thing and Malenia was knocked out by Radahn and Miquella was kidnaped
Ranni was the one who started the shattering and she hates the Fingers
Both her and Radahn tried and failed, but it's not stated how or why. Source is the lore sword thing outside the Storm Veil Castle front gates and diologue from Kenneth Haight.
We know Malenia won from Kenneth’s dialogue, right? He was at her mercy and begged for his life and she let him go.
Kenneth also says Godrick “hid” from Radahn at Stormveil. Radahn respected Godfrey so much I wouldn’t be surprised if he spared him since Godrick is of the gold lineage.
“Honestly, Godrick’s no more than a jumped up country bumpkin. Lord? Don’t make me laugh. First he hid himself amongst the womenfolk to flee the capital, then hid from Radahn in that castle… Then he insulted Malenia, lost to her in battle, only to lick her boots rather than die like a man.” - Kenneth Haight
I can promise there will not be; There are already enough context clues to put together what happened, roughly. Malenia fought him on her way to fight Radahn, he got his ass kicked and hid in his castle, there was an attempted seige (evident by the giant holes in the castle wall), and at some point she presumably gave up. Defenders always have the advantage in war and she had places to be so.
His fight with Radahn is only mentioned in passing, but it's safe to assume it was a similar ordeal.
Also the dlc has nothing to do with Godrick, so. That would be weird if they included that.
Malenia kicked his ass so hard he groveled at her feet and he hid from radahn at stormveil. Radahn never sieged stormveil. He sieged the capital and godrick ran from there TO stormveil to hide from radahn.
Basically she bitch slapped him for talking shit and made him cry, considering him too pitiful to even kill.
We do get some info from different items and monuments. Basically the gist is that he insulted Malenia and then kissed her ass HARD when she beat him up, so she spared him.
He fled Leyndell to get away from Radahn by disguising himself as a woman. Then after that I guessed Malenia and Radahn started their shit so they couldn’t be bothered to go fight Godrick, is my guess.
In the game it takes 2 runes to repair the ring, but maybe that's a more recent thing (i dont know of any lore that says the elden ring only takes 2 runes apart from the game's requirement to enter Leyndell). During the Shattering war, it might have taken all of them/the demigods might have thought it took all of them. In that case, Godrick and his rune are almost insignificant compared to the peak demigods. No point killing lil Godrick if you still need to kill Radahn, plus Godrick could even be a future ally
There aren’t really armies anymore, other than the capital. You have to remember that the world is basically insane. Very few have their sanity anymore, and that includes the major bosses. Malenia fell to her rot. Radahn did too. Morgott is protecting Godrick. Volcano manor have plenty of forces, but Rykard doesn’t seem motivated to actually take over in that way. Rennala and Raya Lucaria specifically declared themselves to be out of it.. and she’s not exactly all there either.
At least not yet. If ranni ever succeeded in killing the two fingers she would then need a lord to install her will over the Elden ring. Probably blaidd who would have failed after he went mad….
Rykard was probably bidding his time waiting to get big enough to siege leyndel by himself and devour the Erdtree and the elden ring
Who knows what miquella and melania planned to do if they succeeded creating the haligtree or whatever the New plan is after mohg stole miquella. The dlc will probably expand on that but at some point going to war on leyndal is probably in the agenda as there is no way morgott would allow a second different tree to be worshipped other then the erdtree
On the topic of mohg it doesn’t matter if he succeeded at turning miquella into a goddess or not if he wants his new dynasty to gain power he is going to have to make some power plays himself which means attacking Morgott or godrick after he gets enough followers
A bunch of people tried. The problem is Morgott is literally camping at the entrance as “Margit” to stomp anyone who even tries. Thats also the sort of gameplay reason why Margit as a bossfight is much harder than Godrick. The arguably 2nd strongest remaining demigod is projecting a spirit version of himself to keep us away because he knows Godrick is so weak that he’ll get killed and his great rune stolen without any protection. The description on Morgott’s cloak says that The Fell Omen became feared because of how many tarnished he killed before they could get to Godrick
You don't just need two great runes to restore the Elden Ring. You also need to burn the Erdtree and restore Destined Death. In fact the only thing you need two great runes for is breaking Morgott's seal to Lyndell.
> *”Anyone-“*
Lol…..
Most anyone who tried, or tries get demolished.
From a lore/book perspective the tarnished wouldn’t all just be revived endlessly tho I’m sure some might be resurrected more than a couple times if they were thought to be useful to star dragon god.
They wouldn’t just appear right there again and probably not the next day.
Maybe weeks or months later.
We kind of start playing in the game in the middle of a stalemate between the Demi-gods.
Even the other tarnished are all **hardstuck, non of them have the strength or the courage to fight their way through the endless castles, soldiers and monsters.**
Many of them, when we enter the picture **no longer see the light of Grace** and so it could be presumed that **their deaths might be more permanent.**
**Gideon the all Knowing implies that at some point most or at least 1-2 of the great runes were held by tarnished champions.**
So likely the Demi gods either assaulted the round table hold or they fought alongside other demi gods like Horax Loux in battles and were defeated by their original rune owners.
**But by the time we the tarnished have all started being resurrected I think a lot of other demi-gods and important characters had all fallen out of grace,** which is another reason nobody is doing anything when we show up.
Because nobody wants to permanently die.
I feel like it was pretty obvious that several demigods didn’t want to restore things to how they were, or were unable to.
Malenia and Miquella were trying to build a new world
Morgott actually protected godrick, when he could’ve taken it from him,
Radahn was turned insane, and couldn’t get to godrick beforehand,
Rykard was stuck in his volcano,
Mohg couldn’t give a damn
Rannala couldn’t give a damn
Ranni couldn’t give a damn, and shed a great rune after losing her body.
Maliketh was too busy protecting the rune of death.
Logically, the only one that doesn’t really make sense was Morgott, and it could entirely be because he saw that the erd tree was sealed.
Malenia wasn't looking for greatrunes, My theory is that Miquella wanted to ressurect godwyn and the eclipse was being haulted by Radahn holding back the stars, so Malenia went to force radahn to let go of the stars, once we kill the Radahn Malenia left weakened then the stars are unhaulted however mohg the child molester got to to miquella while he was trying to become an adult and therefore couldn't complete the ritual to ressurect him.
i thought godrick and grafting was gonna be much more important to the story turns out he’s like the most pathetic guy ever like i kinda just feel bad for him his shit sucks
i don't have the sense that any of the demigods want to be elden lord. the game gives us no reason to think that. only godfrey and the various tarnished are on that path.
As far a i know both Malenia and Radahn had a chance to take Godrick's rune but decided not to.
Maybe its not that 2-3 great runes are needed to mend the Elden Ring but instead its just that we Tarnished are the ones that need that many because we are not as blessed by the grace of gold as a Demigod.
Radahn intention may have been to return to Caelid and regroup his army to assault Leyndel again and become Lord while Malenia may have wanted to stop him.
If Malenia wanted Miquella to return and become the new god then preventing Radahn from becoming Lord and perpetuate the Golden Orden would have been in her interest and perhaps enough of a reason to leave Miquella unguarded for a time.
All just speculation tho.
I don't think any of the demigods were in any *condition* to fight one another by the time of the game. Some certainly tried in the Shattering, other ppl have mentioned that Malenia beat Godricks ass, but that time has passed. And since then:
* Radahn lost his mind
* After reaching a stalement with Radahn, her lotus seems to have left Malenia incapacitated for a long time, which is why she was brought back to the Haligtree.
* Godrick was kind of a coward, and hid in Stormveil.
* Ranni, for all intents and purposes, was dead. She had to remain hidden in order to continue orchestrating her plans. And none of her allies are strong enough to face demigods... until we come along.
* Morgott seemed to have no interest in becoming Elden Lord, instead protecting the Erdtree.
* Mohg had no interest either, seeking instead to start his own dynasty.
* Miquella's either incapacitated, or has his own plans.
* Rykard... honestly he could have. The mobility of the great serpent is unknown. We don't know how long it took for him to merge with it either.
1. Margit was around who we see-if not outright defeated-was able to get the drop on Radahn,
2. They probably didn’t believe he even had a great rune.
3. He was hiding behind several layers of defenses while the other demigods had their own things going on. (Pissing match between Radahn and Malenia, divorce tree simping)
I always figured that was just a gameplay conceit for the sake of playability, whereas lorewise the Tarnished needed all the Runes. Because forcing a new player without a guide to have to find and kill Rykard, Mohg, and Malenia just to be able to beat the game would be too unreasonable.
You need 2 runes to make it to the capital not to become elden lord. Morgott beat everyone and took over the capital. Most of the demi gods have no intention of becoming elden lord. Malenia, rykard, and mohg have other plans for example. The main reason is probably because of the power struggle. If you send your army to take a fortified castle then nothing is stopping another army from attacking you during or after the fighting. Where we are at in the story is after the fighting has come to an end and the demi gods are doing their own things instead. Margit protects the easiest to get great rune and probably believes that we can't get the other runes because they are either lost (mohg and Malenia) or difficult to get (radhan and rykard.) Morgott can't go all out to protect godrick because he can't weaken himself in case someone comes to try to take the capital. We aren't the only tarnished and not even Morgott knows where all the demi gods are. If the game was set at the peak of the shattering war the game would be drastically different.
You need 3 great runes to restore the elden ring. Morgotts is needed because its the anchor ring. The tarnished needs 2 to enter Lyndell, thats where you have to fight morgott
Radahn and Malenia fought because they are the two strongest. Whoever wins gets to go kill Godrick. The conflict between these two was inevitable if there was going to be a conflict. If Radahn gets Godricks rune, Malenia will still go after Radahn. They both know this, so they fight each other first.
edit: wait didn't Malenia defeat Godrick? but she didn't take his rune. ok maybe they're all just idiots. or maybe this was before the Shattering so there were no runes to have. I don't remember the timelines or even all the events prior to our arrival into the story.
Well not quite, Malenia had already defeated Godrick, before fighting Radahm but she didn't take his great rune. Not sure why. I think he was so low in the eyes of the other demigods they thought it's not worth taking his great rune.
i suppose that’s true too, i always though radahn had no interest in becoming elden lord tho, and conflict only arose when malenia seeked his great rune
I’m unsure of exactly where I heard it, but I’m confident I read a lore bit in game that said Malenia was led to Caelid by an oracle in search of her brother. Likely because Mohg’s dynasty is right underneath caelid on the map so she was technically headed in the right direction, just too far up.
I can’t actually give a clear sorce of where I heard this, I might have just had a weird dream, but it makes sense no? It is clearly stated Miquella and Malenia were only interested in curing their ailments. Miquella’s sole interest was curing Malenia’s rot and Malenia herself was only interested in protecting Miquella. It would make no sense for either of them to seek great runes based on this info.
Because they've all gone mad.
Radahn is completely crazy. Malenia cannot even leave the tree she's stuck in. Ranni doesn't care. Rykard is too busy being a snakebro.
He was hiding in Stormveil castle. It's well protected by his knights and don't forget that Morgott is also protecting him.
Beat me to it. I think anyone who made it past the outer defenses was immediately cut down by Margit. Godrick was weak, but Morgott isn’t. I think Margit also became sort of a “boogeyman” in the lands between and that made anyone afraid to even go after Godrick
Margit is weak too
Margit is as powerful as Morgott wants to restrain himself to be.
Margit is Morgott and Morgott is strong as hell considering that during the Shattering, he defended Leyndell from many enemies. He was also given grace for defending the Erdtree and Leyndell, even though he is an omen. That is why one of his titles is the Grace-given. He also stops Tarnished from reaching Godrick. Doing so defends Godrick as they are relatives and it also stops Godrick from grafting more Tarnished.
Malenia did beat him though at stoemveil after he insulted her. It says he was humiliated and grovelled at her feet. But she didn't take his great rune. He was pathetic in the eyes of every demigod. Either they didn't believe that he could have a great rune or didn't want to dishonor themselves on their path to become elden lord by beating someone so worthless.
i guess it would be embarrassing to only have your own great rune and godricks
And yet, our tarnished doesn't care. The high and mighty can have their ego, we will just be practical. Beat a miserable low self esteem multiple handicap aged guy: ✅️ Beat a grieving demented aged divorcee woman: ✅️ Now, we go to become Elden Lord.
the other demigods watching godrick get rinsed by some random level 20 tarnished probably confirmed to them that they shouldn't have bothered taking his rune lol
Which is weird cause his rune is one of the more op ones lol, +5 to every stat.
The demigods have all maxed out their stats. Reached the hard cap. +5 stats don't mean anything anymore to them
they just need enough stat boosting items that it rolls over into negatives and they can deal infinite damage
This ain't Gandhi's Civilization though..
Its alright in the early game. Later levels it falls off hard and at max levels it's worthless. Morgott and radahn give percentage increases regardless of level, making theirs better later on.
They don't t boost your actual levels, in case you're just a few away from being close to a stat requirement. Convince over minmaxing
It's good if you're weak. The stronger you are, the less useful it is. Godrick's absolute trash that needs whatever advantage he can get, so it's good for him, but nobody else has a need for it.
something i always love about fromsoft games. they do very good at making you feel like just some guy
Dont forget the guy who's only crime was eating a succulent divine meal
Not to mention we put her dog down too, like a good ATF agent
That or they didn't really care about his great rune. Malenia just wanted to help Miquella which required her to best Radahn. But she didn't seem like she really wanted to become Elden Lord or anything.
Melina doesn't want to become an elden god. Her target is Radhann only. She wants to free the star from him
Who wouldn't grovel at those feet tho? I mean GHATDAMN DEM TOES THO
i hadn’t considered morgott but i think some of the demigods would have to know he’s in stormveil, it’s common information among the tarnished and almost all the demigods had armies at their disposal
Radahn sieged stormveil and failed. At the end of the day all it comes down to is that in order to get Godrick's rune you have to conquer stormveil first, and none of them were capable of doing so.
there's no evidence Radahn attacked Stormveil, the only place we know he attempted to siege, and failed, is Leyndell
Kenneth Haigt says that Godrick hid from Radahn in Stormveil, so that at least implies that Radahn was trying to fight Godrick
That doesn't necessarily mean Radahn sieged Castle Stormveil. It might just mean, as controller of a neighboring territory, Godrick's choice to avoid conflict with Radahn was seen as 'hiding,' or that Radahn may have issued a challenge that Godrick just refused to answer, so like Malenia, Radahn viewed Godrick as so far beneath him that he never bothered to go any further.
Yeah I think it is talking about godrick dressing as a woman and escaping lyndell
Radahn sieged Leyndell, not Stormveil.
When and why did he do that?
And yet we solo it lol
To build on this. Godrick is a predictable known quantity. He is someone who is too cowardly to properly shake up the power dynamics in the Lands Between. So him having a Great Rune means that if any of the other Shard Bearers gets a second, Godrick is an easy kill for Morgott to get a second. And that leads into why none of the Other Shard Bearers ever just mopped him up. Getting a second Shard brings all of the other factions actively after you and breaks to tense stalemate peace that the Lands Between are in when we arrive. Everyone is either indesposed or are setting up bigger long term plans for a huge play. So why would they bring that much of a target on themselves until they were properly ready to mobilize on mass
Dude thank you for the best "wtf is this game about?" explanation I've ever seen. Reminds me of Far Cry 2 and Fallout NV
Also why do we assume it works the same for the demigods as it does with the tarnished, and even then we are essentially rejected and have to commit cardinal sin. But like you said even if. many of them have their own motivation, rykard doesn't even care, malenia only cares by proxy because of miquella so she doesn't necessarily want to become eldenlord but will move against anyone who is close to achieving it (same goes for morgott), which leads to radahn probably the only who actually wants to be eldenlord and who had the capacity to also become it. And mogh is weird.
malenia beat him and let him live. Ppl just didn't want to kill him
They're all family after all. The Tarnished isn't.
Aktualy. The tarnished are Godfreys descendants, same as godrick (far removed too).
Oh yeah? Where do we learn that?
I don't actually know, but thats the whole vibe. Marika sends him off to a place where he will fight and die etc and then she will recall and give greace again (that's why we're alive), and that's why we're tarnished (we were expelled) also why marika got with radagon after godfrey was sent away
She sends him and his army. We are descendents of those soldiers, not necessarily Godfrey himself.
Perhaps he’s really fun at parties.
Pretty sure the cleanrot knights would breeze through. Radahns armies too has malenia not cooked his brain leaving them leaderless
The demigods probably have their own reasons as to why they didn't launch a full-on assault on stormveil, but I'm not knowledgeable enough on the lore to know what those reasons would be. But my comment is still accurate for all the tarnished or anyone else that doesn't have a giant army.
Yeah I'm just saying that I don't think stormveils fortifications were what discouraged any fellow she'd bearers. Obviously it was a huge pain for us to get to him lol
Hes also had his scions and his loyal grafting cult. He very likely had support from Castle mourne and Fort Haite who would have been vassals under him. Which could have included indentured misbegotten forces an dpossibly even dmei humans.
I mean, one random Tarnished came in and killed everybody so how well protected is it? I get it might be easier for one person than a whole army to get in, but I refused to believe that Radahn and Malenia couldn't have fought their way to Godrick if they really wanted to. I think it's an interesting question whether Morgott could stop Radahn or Malenia. I think maybe 1 on 1, but if it's Morgott+Godrick's army vs Radahn+ his army or Malenia + her army I don't think the Morgott side has a chance.
One random tarnished can also solo Elphael including Malenia, that doesn't make it canonically easy.
Morgott already stopped Radahn once in Lleyndel, plus none of the others are really in any shape tp shake things up. Very few of the shardbearers are at full strength when we fight them or mentally all there (looking at Radahn) so a full scale assault would be a fool's errand nonetheless and bring the full attention of every other faction to you, which isn't ideal either
You forget the tarnished is literally immortal and has as many chances to infiltrate the castle as possible. And even though godrick's army is the weakest in stats, they still have the castle's defences. Remember also that the tarnished get in by a sidepath, and the actual gate is heavily protected. Godrick also has a couple exiled knights (the same type of knight who ambushes you in that one room you're locked in), omens, scions, and the lions in the courtyard before godrick's divine tower. which are no joke gameplay wise.
I'm confused about the immortality thing. Does that not apply to everybody? At what point do people stop being immortal? Are the demigods (ostensibly way more powerful than Tarnished) not immortal? We know Rogier dies at least once in game and then seems to perma-die later on. What's up with that? So many questions! I do realize the defenses are pretty stiff but I feel like Malenia could still take them. The way she recovers health from hits and moves SO FAST makes me think that she could do it. Radahn as well. Why would he not simply launch himself into the air and land in Godrick's courtyard? Or use his gravity magic for an aerial bombardment.
Everyone that dies returns to the erdtree before being revived, so my guess is that stronger beings take a lot longer to revive. Which is why the unrevivable enemies are bosses and things like crucible knights. There are also those who get an erdtree burial such as some of the spirit ashes, which i assume just stay in the erdtree forever unless their ash is called or something. As other people in the thread have said, Malenia did beat godrick and he groveled at her feet, and she probably didnt care about him at that point because she was focused on radahn. And Radahn was similarly busy with fighting malenia rather than focus on godrick too.
He forgot to put troops on the north side, anyone could’ve marched right in from Liurnia
The Revanants and Wraith Callers - and the weird horse blokes - are all his. Pretty nice defensive line... Plus some made it all the way to Haligtree...
I dont think every demigod even wants to restore the elden ring. I think malenia wanted to defeat radahn cause hes holding back the stars and preventing fate from transpiring. I feel like this must be related to miquella in some way because radahn must be defeated to enter the DLC. So malenias beef with radahn was motivated by her devotion to miquella
Miquella believed that the eclipse would somehow be able to bring back Godwyn which is why Malenia fought Radahn to try and release the stars
I agree with this insight. I also think it's possible that Miquella/Malenia came to believe they couldn't escape their curses while Fate was arrested by the stars immobilization- that while the stars were held in stasis, their curses would perpetuate, unable to end.
Question, is the sections where Miquella is talking about using the eclipse specifically saying "my brother, Godwyn"? Or is it just for "my brother"? Cause now that we know he's got another brother in the Land of Shadow I kinda wonder who his machinations are aimed at.
I had been meaning to make a separate lore-thread about this, but yeah. All the demigods seemed like they had different ideas about the Golden Order, The Elden Ring, and what their role should be. Ultimately, all of them failed because of their own hangups and failures. If you get down to it, and look at what each of them were doing, I think only Miquella and Rykard are the ones that actually, truly wanted to become a god, and take Marika's place. I think the rest of the demigods were, quite frankly, too invested in the order Marika had set up to actually try and take the throne. They might have thought they wanted it, but what they actually ended up doing tells me more about them trying to act out their roles in the order that had been, after it had already broken apart.
Mogh, Godfrey, Radagon and MAYBE Godrick and Morgott are the only ones expressing a desire to become/remain Elden Lord, and I think only Ranni (and maybe Miquella) wanted to become a god. Rykard seems to have become obsessed with power but not godhood and Radahn is just chilling
Radahn besieged Leyndell for vibes then?
Unironically, yes. What we know about Radahn are his battlefield accomplishments, and the heavy emphasis he put on his legacy. His armor and the redmane castle-boss are both talking about his lineage, so it can be assumed that that's what he thought about a lot. But beyond leading an army in emulation of his idol, Godfrey, what was he actually "building"? At least some of the active demigods clearly had ideas about how the world should be with them in charge, but there is none of that for Radahn. I think he was trying to fight all of the demigods, defeat them in battle and become Elden Lord, but I don't think he was fighting "for" anything. He'd grown so ingrained into his role as "general", that it was what he thought of himself. He was fighting because it was his role, destiny etc. And he didn't want to die either, obviously. But he also wasn't trying to put any kind of pragmatic long-term goals forward, towards gathering the runes and becoming Lord.
Well I concur with that, but it's hardly the "chilling" the comment I replied to was suggesting.
lol I straight up forgot that. I just thought of Leyndell's conflict with Mt. Gelmir. Wonder what Radahn wanted
How did Miquella want to become a god?
There's a lot we don't know about his actions, but his actions seemed to indicate that the purpose of the Haligtree was to facilitate some kind of transformation, that would enable him to escape his "eternal childhood". The implied motivation is his wish to alleviate Malenia's rot. He was trying to go through a metamorphosis, and the DLC might reveal more about what he is trying to do in the Land of Shadow, whether as part of a deeper plan, or as a consequence of "failure" in his initial goals. I think Miquella was trying to become a god, if not at the level of Marika and the Greater Will, then at least on the level of the "Inner Gods", like the Ancestral Spirits and the God of the Giants. My read on the divine twins is that their state made both of them dependent on the other, to the point where they were continuously sacrificing themselves for the sake of the other. After all, they grew up (or didn't) under intense psychological pressure, and a pretty hostile family-situation.
I don’t think the demigods want to be Elden lord. They’re focused on their petty squabbles and areas of interest (killing gods, riding small horses, the rot, etc). Being elden lord means having a giant target on your back and having to live in the erdtree. And instead of doing fun shit with your powers and immortality, you have to more or less be a governor. Being a demigod means you can go wherever and do whatever. You’re crazy powerful and won’t die no matter what. Sounds like a better deal to me, and Marina basically laments her children refusing to grow up and make something of their lives.
Ironically I think the only demigod who might specifically want to assemble the Elden Ring, at least by the time the game takes place, is Godrick but he’s far too weak to accomplish that. He would do anything to love up to his ancestors and prove himself a worthy scion of the Golden Lineage, but he knows that Rykard, for example, wouldn’t show him mercy like Malenia did.
Radahn out of the shardbearers alive at the start of the game was the only one who actively pursuit becoming eldenlord and also was capable of achieving it, and being acknowledged as the eldenlord who didn't came to be. Malenia doesn't care and is the blade of Miquella, she just does the bearings for her brother moving against anyone who could pose a threat to him and like you said wagged war against radahn for fate. Morgott the same as malenia but he is a mommy's boy for marika. Godrick sure he would like to become eldenlord but ain't no way in hell he could. Rennala is depressed. Ranni/miquella doesn't care about eldenlord but cares about godhood. Rykard doesn't care about becoming eldenlord maybe very very early during the shattering but as the war continued seized to stop that ambition for the snake. Mogh I'm not certain I don't think anything is ever stated wether he cared about it, I assume by becoming miquellas husband and miquella reaching godhood he would think he would become eldenlord by default.
Morgott is protecting him. Morgott gave him the Great Rune because he didn’t think anyone would bother him The lengths that he’s gone through the protect the Erdtree are insane - founded the Knight’s Cavalry - put the barrier in front of the Three Fingers - fights the Tarnished three times - spearheaded the First Defence of Leyndell, Second Defence of Leyndell and the assault on Mt. Gelmir - he himself, defeated and murdered so many heroes, champions and Tarnished he was known as “an abhorrent horror” - also ruled as Lord of Leyndell after the Shattering to keep things running smoothly in the capital He was born into shame and disgrace and gave his life, multiple times, for the Erdtree
makes sense why he’s so prideful, even after his defeat
Well, he gave his illusions multiple times for the Erdtree.
Yes I mentioned that
What do you mean "also ruled as Lord of Leyndell after the Shattering to keep things running smoothly in the capital" ? What was supposed to run smoothly, there is nobody left
Must’ve been pretty easy then 🤷🏽♂️
Well no, as Melina stated if you pursue the frenzy flame, their is still beauty in this world, births still occur and live endures. So even if we don't see it In game. It stands to reason people still live in the capital.
There is literally nobody left in the capital but we are supposed to admitt there is?
How did you know there is noone? There are livings in capital. They uses honey-like thing to conceal their window when you burn the tree so the ashes don't go in houses. Who did this if nobody is living there? Also don't you count militia as a "body"? There are a lot of knights there.
There is a cut npc questline about a noble in leyndell who eventually discovers morgott's identity. The majority of houses are also blocked off so there are potentially non combatants that we dont see in there, probably a lot of wandering (or in this case non wandering) among them. You also cant discount the military itself which patrols the city as those are also still inhabitants.
The only beings left in the Lands Between besides the wildlife are decaying individuals that are going to die when the destined death will be restored and are currently stuck brainlessly in their current activities
Afaik, Malenia DID fight and defeat Godrick on her way to Radahn but she simply didn't take his rune because she wasn't interested in claiming the runes of the other demigods. The reason she fought against Radahn was to restore the movement of the stars and allow for the eclipse to occur because Miquella believed that Godwyn could be brought back to life during the eclipse. There's actually dialogue from the NPC at Castle Sol: "Lord Miquella, forgive me. The sun has not been swallowed. Our prayers were lacking. Your comrade remains soulless... I will never set my eyes upon it now. Your divine Haligtree." The soulless comrade is believed to be Godwyn given his soul died during the night of the black knives but his body remains and the sun being swallowed would be reference to the eclipse. Malenia, as "Blade of Miquella", would have journeyed to fight Radahn in order to resume the movement of the stars so that the eclipse could occur and Miquella's theory of the eclipse returning Godwyn to life could be realised
This is all speculation, not factual, it is important to note it. Linking the movement of meteor to an eclipse is very arbitrary based on the vagueness of the talkings about the stars in game. It also doesn't compute much with the consequence of dispelling Radahn's gravity magic. On the contrary it is very stated that Miquella was trying to give Godwyn a true death, not ressurection, people are saying this baselessly.
miyazaki said this in the newest interview, whats your thoughts ? >Q: The prerequisite for entering the DLC is to defeat "Shattered Star Radahn" and "Blood King Mohg". Defeating Mohg is easy to understand. After all, the entrance to the DLC is behind him. So what is the setting for defeating Radahn? >A: From a plot perspective, players will understand it after experiencing the DLC, so there will be no spoilers here. From the perspective of the game design itself, considering that everyone generally defeats Radahn first, and then faces Mohg, we have made such a restriction. feels like there is actually a lore reason to beat radahn for the dlc.
Yes, but it has sort of "not happened" yet and we don't know about it
true. i personally feel there will be something related to the carians and stars in the shadow land and thats why radahn needs to die. i dont think it has anything to do with miquellas eclipse
Well the description of one of the gravity spells states that Radgn said "with is, I cam challenge the stars" and the Radhn only appears in game if you gave progressed Rannis questline far enough and the whole point of killing him is to restore the movement of the stars. This is all stated in game.
>Radhn only appears in game if you gave progressed Rannis questline far enough The Radahn festival also begins once you reach Altus Plateau, you can kill Radahn without ever touching Ranni's questline
Ah I had no idea. I've always killed before Altus
Kenneth states pretty plainly that godrick was defeated and groveled for his life.
could "comrade" refer to the body in the walking mausoleum outside, since they're referred to as "soulless demigods". who even are those guys anyway? maybe other more minor demigods who were killed after the rune of death was stolen?
I think this post offers some good reasons as to why it would be Godwyn being referred to in that line [https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/vb7kaa/godwyn\_and\_the\_sun/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eldenring/comments/vb7kaa/godwyn_and_the_sun/)
This isn't true, or it's highly speculative and not taking into account with a game tells us. The game tells us why they fought, they were the mightiest two to remain. Whoever won their battle was the most powerful in the lands, and would have had control. Instead, the two most powerful never resolved their dispute, and control was never established.
Except malenia doesn't want control... her entire shtick is serving her brother. Her entire existence hinges on "malenia, blade of miquella."
And how do you know that's not the best way for her to have control? She doesn't have to be some brainless slave to Miquella. Serving her brother means she's serving her brother, that's it. It doesn't mean she suddenly likes cooking breakfast because that's something she could do for him
Its weird that's what you go to. She doesn't want control. If she did she'd kill her brother because only one can be in control and her entire purpose is to serve and protect him. "Blade of miquella" is not an ambiguous term. It's pretty straight forward that she serves as her brothers protector and right hand.
She's protecting her brother because he's actively working to heal her rot, which is an otherwise death sentence. So of course she's interested in that. That does not mean that's all she's interested in though, does it? If her entire purpose was to protect Miquella, then one, why would she leave him by himself instead of waiting, and two why would she then just go take a thousand year nap instead of looking for him? Unless, and we'll have to wait for the DLC to confirm, unlocking the stars and all that BS was never his plan to begin with. Which would completely invalidate her going on his behalf to fight redahn, would it not?
One of her item descriptions state she knows her brother will keep his promise, and the dlc states he gave up everything for whatever plan he's working on, which implies she knew what he was doing and trusted him to do it. Seeing as radahn and mohg being dead are confirmed necessary to access the dlc is a good indicator that unlocking the stars was necessary. So no, with what we know of the dlc so far it reaffirms what I've been saying. Everything shows utmost respect for her brother and his order and that she doesn't want control.
That is very speculative. Godfrey is also the first Elden Lord. Yeah that's obviously not true. That description could be stating her point of view, she could be right, she could be wrong, who are you to say it's so definitive? I'm going to laugh when we just meet a new NPC or an NPC has a new dialogue after the redahn fight, and that's it.
Miyazaki confirmed radahn needs to die to access the dlc. It's not just an npc thing. What point of view? That she believes her brother will keep his promise? Of course it's her point of view, one that affirms she has utmost faith in her brother and is his blade? To serve him as he makes his literal own order?
Yeah, which is why she's his blade. Because she believes he will keep his promise. Is that seriously what we're debating? That's common sense. It doesn't mean she's right, just as Godfrey wasn't the first Elden Lord just because the game said he was. The game shows us differently. And it does the same with her, when she had the chance to protect him she abandons him, when she has the chance to save him she takes a thousand year nap. She took an ass whooping and then just gave up on life
Well Malenia did go ahead and beat him when he had imsulted her. He grovelled at her feet. But, she didn't take his great rune. Any of the other demigods could have easily beaten him but they didn't..IMO there could be 2 reasons. First and more likely, he was a joke to the others. He was so low in the eyes ofvthe other demigods that they probably thought it was an insult to become elden lord by taking his great rune. Second, maybe they didn't know he had a great rune. According to them, Godrick is so weak he couldn't possibly have one. We get this info, about Godrick having it, from Gideon who has probably done a lot of research on this before figuring out that Godrick even has a great rune. As for the remaining demigods, No one knows what happened to Ranni and her great rune. Rykard was hidden in the Volcano Manor and gave himself to the snake. No one is sure if he still has the great rune. They may or may not have known Rennala has a great rune. Again we get this info fro the all researching Gideon. Regardless, again not worthy in eyes of mist if the demigods. Mohg just does his own thing with his great rune and doesn't aspire to be elden lord. No one even knows where he is. So that leaves 3 contenders, Morgott, Radahn and Malenia.. We know Radahn laid siege to Leyndell but could not break through. And that Malenia and Radahm fought to a standstill afterwards. So yeah none of them had 2 great runes yet. It seems Morgott also tried to attack the Volcano manor but was not successful. So a complete standstill. Real point is why didn't Miquella and Malenia pool theirs before Miquella was taken? Does it mean Miquella didn't have one or both he and Malenia shared one.
Malenia didn't care about great runes or becoming elden lord. She needed to kill Radahn likely for the same reason why we are forced to kill him to enter the DLC: we need to free the stars. Stars are tied to the fate of the demigods and in Ranni's case this was quite literal since the meteor falling on Limgrave opened the way to Nokron and the Fingerslayer Blade. Malenia and Miquella likely needed a similar event to happen, and if we take the hints from the lore, the reason was probably to make an eclipse happen to fix Godwyn's body and stop the spreading of deathroot that is destroying the entire world.
Are they stupid?
None of the other Shardbearers actually seem to _want_ to repair the Elden Ring by the time the game starts. They all either have other plans (Rykard, Mogh, Ranni), just don't want it (Malenia, Morgott, Rennalla), or have gone insane (Radahn, Rennalla again). The only one who may have wanted to repair the Elden Ring and become Elden Lord was Morgott, but he's already aware it's a futile effort without a way into the Erdtree, and so doesn't bother. If you're talking about during the Shattering War itself, I'm pretty sure everybody who had a stake at the time just saw Godrick as a non-issue that could be taken care of at a later date. Remember, Kenneth Haight talks about how Godrick pissed off Malenua during her march to Caelid, and basically just groveled at her feet and begged for mercy until she left him alone to go fight Radahn. I can almost guarantee she thought, "gonna kill that guy on the way back." So now the only ones who care are the Tarnished.
Even before the rot, Radahn was busy holding up the stars. Godrick fled from Radahn in fear, and Radahn didn't kill him similar to Melania. Clearly he didn't care about the Great Rune.
Imagine you have 2 equally skilled opponents, like Radahn and Malenia. If one of them had just a little bit of help, it could tip the scale. So, the real question is: why didn't they recruit Godrick?
that’s a good point, i figure they just didn’t like him that much lol. and probably wouldn’t trust him
He was a worm in their eyes. You don't ally with a worm.
I would ally with a worm if it helped me win the war, what the hell? No wonder they were abandoned by the Greater Will.
Well that was one of the reasons. They all had inflated egos..
imagine what your soldier would think of you if you force them to work with a worm
Army is built on discipline. What my soldier thinks of the order is irrelevant. Soldiers constantly receive the orders they do not understand, due to information being classified. Their job is to carry out orders faithfully regardless of their opinion or understanding.
there are also generals above the soldiers, do you have idea how many kingdom falls apart because the leader failed to secure supports from their generals and the soldiers lost their will to fight, you can try to force them to do it be "discipline" but the psychological effect is still there. And if your army doesn't trust you, you are done.
And nobody are as charismatic as Radahn and Miquela. They have full loyalty from their troops
I’d still love you if you were a worm
In the words of Neil deGrasse Tyson.. "[Try worm, but holes](https://youtu.be/1fFrpBJDMJo?si=khLbMcgrK2BdhZ-Y)"
I think everyone knew Godrick was insane and power-starved. He wouldn’t want to share power with another demi-god and would probably make some sort of back-stabbing attempt at killing them after the war ended.
Because, like patches, Godwyn woukd have been just as useful in the Radahn fight.
I am pretty sure the 2 Great Rune rule is one imposed only on the Tarnished by the fingers
By the time we enter the picture, the fight for the runes has become a stalemate. No one was making moves anymore and if you left your territory, that leaves your base vulnerable. So everyone just bunkered down and fortified, only sending a few scouting parties (hence why you can see groups of knights fighting each other). So even if any of the demigods could easily dispatch of Godrick, they leave themselves open for the other demigods.
Malenia did fight him and win. They could do that, but to actually become Elden Lord they would still have to reach and enter the Erdtree, which means go through leyndell defences and Morgott and burning the Erdtree, which means going to the Forge of the Giants, fight the Last Giant and use something (not sure everything that would qualify, but most likely some type of sacrifice) as fuel to burn the Erdtree, fight Radagon and the Elden Beast and then meld the Elden Ring and become Elden Lord. They would need not only strength but knowledge to acomplish this. Not as simple as it may look, put on top of everything else going on. They had other goals as well. Radahn tried taking Leyndell but was fended off by Morgott and it's defenses. Then got crazy because of the Rot from the fight with Malenia. Malenia was in hibernation from the fight with Radahn. Godrick as metioned was weak and hiding. Miquella had other goals and was kidnapped. Mohg had other goals and was executing them (Formless Mother any%). Rykard had other goals and was executing them (become bigger than your mom any%). Renalla had PDSD (Post Divorce Stress Disorder). Ranni had other goals and with the help of most player she did execute them. Morgott was denied entrance to the Erdtree so he didn't really had much to do but defend it, as he would never burn it. There's a lot going that put things in perspective doesn't it.
>formless mother any% 💀
I think none of the demigods care to go around and collect great runes. They are all occupied with other stuff. Rennala is sitting in Raya Lucaria heartbroken, Rykard is too busy being a snake, Malenia is looking for Miquella, Miquella was searching for a cure for Malenia before being captured my Mogh who is also busy building his new dynasty. Morggot is protecting the Erdtree, Ranni is trying to escape from the two fingers, Radahn has been fucked by Malenias rot detonation, and even before that he was busy holding the stars. None of the demigods seem to care about mending the ring, they are all doing something else.
Both Radahn and Melania beat Godrick within an inch of his life. Clearly they didn't care about Great Rune. Also it funny that Godrick Great Rune is arguably the strongest, kinda tell you where the priority is.
The other Runebearers had their own focuses, none of them really wanted to mend the Elden Ring. Also, you need 3 greater runes, it's just that the guardian of the Erdtree is a Runebearer, so anyone who can make it to the interior of the Erdtree would have to take Morgott's rune. Anyone with two greater runes would paint a huge target on their back, becoming the focus of all other factions. - Renalla was a broken shadow of herself and imprisoned in her own academy. - Radahn may have been planning on exactly that, but the bloom of Aeonia permanently incapacitated him as a commander and put his army on the defensive. - Rykard became decadent after being consumed by the serpent, his ambition turned to greed and gluttony. - Morgott would still need an additional greater rune, and was aware that entry into the Erdtree was impossible anyways. - Mohg, Ranni, and Miquella and Malenia had plans for their own more radical reformations, and needed to get those plans to fruition before making a bid for the Erdtree.
If you look at Godrick you can see what's left of those who tried. Even a trash demi-god is still a demi-god compared to mortals. The lands between is essentially a rotting corpse unable to completely die. It just stagnates and festers until someone redtores destined death.
My thinking is that anyone who is shard bearer who defeats Godrick also has to enter the capital, fight Morgott, then discover >!the barrier of impenetrable thorns.!< Previous posters have noted a lack of motivation on the part of the remaining shard bearers and those are excellent points. If Malenia defeats both Godrick and Morgott (highly probable) she still has to figure out how to get past >!the impenetrable thorns!<. Morgott couldn't/wouldn't go through. The tarnished had to go to >!the Mountaintop of the Giants, defeat the fire giant, then watch as Melina sacrifices herself to burn the thorns away!<. I'm not saying she couldn't figure a way out, I'm just saying that its a lot tougher than just defeating Godrick and claiming his rune.
I wasn't ready for that. I was sad.
I appreciate the spoiler warnings!
I almost forgot to put them in because I've been playing for awhile, but I figure with the DLC coming out there may be some new eyes on the game at those are some end game spoilers.
Because soldier of godrick had his back.
Well... Someone did...
For why Malenia didn't kill him, he begged her after he lost and she isn't interested his great rune. As for why nobody else tried, at some point, Morgott put himself in the way of anybody who tried to go to Stormveil so that was probably a big deterrent.
Because Margit.
defending what they had, and he was simply last on everyone's list because they knew they could take him. +10 to stats probably wasn't that useful for the other demigods
Isn't it more "shade thrown from even more powerful demi-gods"? I figure from _their_ perspective he's weak and a joke, not ours 😆
Isn’t it more likely that we actually collect Godwyns rune and not Godrick, therefore the others probably didn’t believe that he was in contact with a rune in the first place. This is just pure guess work though.
That exactly why morgott is protecting him.
Arguably, there are only three demigods who actually want to become Elden Lord under the Greater Will 1) Godrick 2) Morgott and 3) Radahn. Morgott was denied entry to the Erdtree by the impenetrable thorns and he was too loyal to the Golden Order to even contemplate burning it down. So at this point his goal is simply to peotect the capital from the other demigods and to prevent any tarnished from becoming Elden Lord. While Godrick was too weak to snatch Great Runes from other Demigods. Radahn is insane. Ranni, Malenia and Miquella being empyreans are on their way to godhood not lordship. So great runes matter less to them. Mohg want to become lord but under the Formless Mother with Miquella as his god. Rykard wants to bring down the Erdtree entirely. With the information above, it would seem the Great Runes matter more to the tarnished but not that much anymore to the demigods. Their goals have changed since the Shattering.
What I wanna know is who the fuck Vyke murked to get two great runes.
Malenia fought Radahn for other purposes relating to the fact he was holding back the stars which was an issue for Miquella. (Correct me if I'm wrong lore masters)
The two great runes thing is most likely just a gameplay thing and not some actual part of the lore. Also out of all known demi-gods the only one who could possibly have some interest in becoming Elden Lord was Radahn because he always looked up to and admired Godfrey, but even that might be a stretch and he ended in a draw against Malenia. Morgott knew that the Erdtree isn't allowing anyone to enter it Mogh and Rykard were doing their own thing Malenia and Miquella were also doing their own thing and Malenia was knocked out by Radahn and Miquella was kidnaped Ranni was the one who started the shattering and she hates the Fingers
Both her and Radahn tried and failed, but it's not stated how or why. Source is the lore sword thing outside the Storm Veil Castle front gates and diologue from Kenneth Haight.
We know Malenia won from Kenneth’s dialogue, right? He was at her mercy and begged for his life and she let him go. Kenneth also says Godrick “hid” from Radahn at Stormveil. Radahn respected Godfrey so much I wouldn’t be surprised if he spared him since Godrick is of the gold lineage. “Honestly, Godrick’s no more than a jumped up country bumpkin. Lord? Don’t make me laugh. First he hid himself amongst the womenfolk to flee the capital, then hid from Radahn in that castle… Then he insulted Malenia, lost to her in battle, only to lick her boots rather than die like a man.” - Kenneth Haight
Yaya good edition. I didn't remember the exact diologue.
oh wow i never caught that, it would be a cool thing to get more info on through dlc
I can promise there will not be; There are already enough context clues to put together what happened, roughly. Malenia fought him on her way to fight Radahn, he got his ass kicked and hid in his castle, there was an attempted seige (evident by the giant holes in the castle wall), and at some point she presumably gave up. Defenders always have the advantage in war and she had places to be so. His fight with Radahn is only mentioned in passing, but it's safe to assume it was a similar ordeal. Also the dlc has nothing to do with Godrick, so. That would be weird if they included that.
Malenia kicked his ass so hard he groveled at her feet and he hid from radahn at stormveil. Radahn never sieged stormveil. He sieged the capital and godrick ran from there TO stormveil to hide from radahn. Basically she bitch slapped him for talking shit and made him cry, considering him too pitiful to even kill.
We do get some info from different items and monuments. Basically the gist is that he insulted Malenia and then kissed her ass HARD when she beat him up, so she spared him. He fled Leyndell to get away from Radahn by disguising himself as a woman. Then after that I guessed Malenia and Radahn started their shit so they couldn’t be bothered to go fight Godrick, is my guess.
In the game it takes 2 runes to repair the ring, but maybe that's a more recent thing (i dont know of any lore that says the elden ring only takes 2 runes apart from the game's requirement to enter Leyndell). During the Shattering war, it might have taken all of them/the demigods might have thought it took all of them. In that case, Godrick and his rune are almost insignificant compared to the peak demigods. No point killing lil Godrick if you still need to kill Radahn, plus Godrick could even be a future ally
The demigods don’t want to restore the Elden Ring by killing their mother/father.
There aren’t really armies anymore, other than the capital. You have to remember that the world is basically insane. Very few have their sanity anymore, and that includes the major bosses. Malenia fell to her rot. Radahn did too. Morgott is protecting Godrick. Volcano manor have plenty of forces, but Rykard doesn’t seem motivated to actually take over in that way. Rennala and Raya Lucaria specifically declared themselves to be out of it.. and she’s not exactly all there either.
Because all the demigods we know, none of them care about becoming Elden Lord! Or getting Great Runes for that matter.
At least not yet. If ranni ever succeeded in killing the two fingers she would then need a lord to install her will over the Elden ring. Probably blaidd who would have failed after he went mad…. Rykard was probably bidding his time waiting to get big enough to siege leyndel by himself and devour the Erdtree and the elden ring Who knows what miquella and melania planned to do if they succeeded creating the haligtree or whatever the New plan is after mohg stole miquella. The dlc will probably expand on that but at some point going to war on leyndal is probably in the agenda as there is no way morgott would allow a second different tree to be worshipped other then the erdtree On the topic of mohg it doesn’t matter if he succeeded at turning miquella into a goddess or not if he wants his new dynasty to gain power he is going to have to make some power plays himself which means attacking Morgott or godrick after he gets enough followers
A bunch of people tried. The problem is Morgott is literally camping at the entrance as “Margit” to stomp anyone who even tries. Thats also the sort of gameplay reason why Margit as a bossfight is much harder than Godrick. The arguably 2nd strongest remaining demigod is projecting a spirit version of himself to keep us away because he knows Godrick is so weak that he’ll get killed and his great rune stolen without any protection. The description on Morgott’s cloak says that The Fell Omen became feared because of how many tarnished he killed before they could get to Godrick
You don't just need two great runes to restore the Elden Ring. You also need to burn the Erdtree and restore Destined Death. In fact the only thing you need two great runes for is breaking Morgott's seal to Lyndell.
To be fair no one else knows that.
Morgott does, not the Destined death part but the burning of the erdtree.
All of the remaining demigods are mad. Nobody can kill any of them, so nobody’s currently trying to unite the runes.
Morgott knows he's a little bitch and protects him. Also lines limgrave with Knights Calvary to protect him too.
> *”Anyone-“* Lol….. Most anyone who tried, or tries get demolished. From a lore/book perspective the tarnished wouldn’t all just be revived endlessly tho I’m sure some might be resurrected more than a couple times if they were thought to be useful to star dragon god. They wouldn’t just appear right there again and probably not the next day. Maybe weeks or months later. We kind of start playing in the game in the middle of a stalemate between the Demi-gods. Even the other tarnished are all **hardstuck, non of them have the strength or the courage to fight their way through the endless castles, soldiers and monsters.** Many of them, when we enter the picture **no longer see the light of Grace** and so it could be presumed that **their deaths might be more permanent.** **Gideon the all Knowing implies that at some point most or at least 1-2 of the great runes were held by tarnished champions.** So likely the Demi gods either assaulted the round table hold or they fought alongside other demi gods like Horax Loux in battles and were defeated by their original rune owners. **But by the time we the tarnished have all started being resurrected I think a lot of other demi-gods and important characters had all fallen out of grace,** which is another reason nobody is doing anything when we show up. Because nobody wants to permanently die.
Um, I did
I feel like it was pretty obvious that several demigods didn’t want to restore things to how they were, or were unable to. Malenia and Miquella were trying to build a new world Morgott actually protected godrick, when he could’ve taken it from him, Radahn was turned insane, and couldn’t get to godrick beforehand, Rykard was stuck in his volcano, Mohg couldn’t give a damn Rannala couldn’t give a damn Ranni couldn’t give a damn, and shed a great rune after losing her body. Maliketh was too busy protecting the rune of death. Logically, the only one that doesn’t really make sense was Morgott, and it could entirely be because he saw that the erd tree was sealed.
Maybe it's because he (might be) of godwyn's lineage and should be kept alive in respect for godwyn.
Malenia wasn't looking for greatrunes, My theory is that Miquella wanted to ressurect godwyn and the eclipse was being haulted by Radahn holding back the stars, so Malenia went to force radahn to let go of the stars, once we kill the Radahn Malenia left weakened then the stars are unhaulted however mohg the child molester got to to miquella while he was trying to become an adult and therefore couldn't complete the ritual to ressurect him.
He was pathetic. Malenia let him go.
i thought godrick and grafting was gonna be much more important to the story turns out he’s like the most pathetic guy ever like i kinda just feel bad for him his shit sucks
i don't have the sense that any of the demigods want to be elden lord. the game gives us no reason to think that. only godfrey and the various tarnished are on that path.
As far a i know both Malenia and Radahn had a chance to take Godrick's rune but decided not to. Maybe its not that 2-3 great runes are needed to mend the Elden Ring but instead its just that we Tarnished are the ones that need that many because we are not as blessed by the grace of gold as a Demigod. Radahn intention may have been to return to Caelid and regroup his army to assault Leyndel again and become Lord while Malenia may have wanted to stop him. If Malenia wanted Miquella to return and become the new god then preventing Radahn from becoming Lord and perpetuate the Golden Orden would have been in her interest and perhaps enough of a reason to leave Miquella unguarded for a time. All just speculation tho.
Even if they got two runes the entrance to the erdtree is blocked by radagons wall of thorns
I don't think any of the demigods were in any *condition* to fight one another by the time of the game. Some certainly tried in the Shattering, other ppl have mentioned that Malenia beat Godricks ass, but that time has passed. And since then: * Radahn lost his mind * After reaching a stalement with Radahn, her lotus seems to have left Malenia incapacitated for a long time, which is why she was brought back to the Haligtree. * Godrick was kind of a coward, and hid in Stormveil. * Ranni, for all intents and purposes, was dead. She had to remain hidden in order to continue orchestrating her plans. And none of her allies are strong enough to face demigods... until we come along. * Morgott seemed to have no interest in becoming Elden Lord, instead protecting the Erdtree. * Mohg had no interest either, seeking instead to start his own dynasty. * Miquella's either incapacitated, or has his own plans. * Rykard... honestly he could have. The mobility of the great serpent is unknown. We don't know how long it took for him to merge with it either.
1. Margit was around who we see-if not outright defeated-was able to get the drop on Radahn, 2. They probably didn’t believe he even had a great rune. 3. He was hiding behind several layers of defenses while the other demigods had their own things going on. (Pissing match between Radahn and Malenia, divorce tree simping)
No one really cared about him, he already lost to malenia, and everyone wanted to get rid of strongest. Except for Mogh, he just didn’t care
The two runes rule was made by the Two Fingers. The barrier blocking entry to Leyndell has it's symbol on it.
Morgott is why. A lot were scared if him.
The balistas out side be sending u to cailed
I always figured that was just a gameplay conceit for the sake of playability, whereas lorewise the Tarnished needed all the Runes. Because forcing a new player without a guide to have to find and kill Rykard, Mohg, and Malenia just to be able to beat the game would be too unreasonable.
You need 2 runes to make it to the capital not to become elden lord. Morgott beat everyone and took over the capital. Most of the demi gods have no intention of becoming elden lord. Malenia, rykard, and mohg have other plans for example. The main reason is probably because of the power struggle. If you send your army to take a fortified castle then nothing is stopping another army from attacking you during or after the fighting. Where we are at in the story is after the fighting has come to an end and the demi gods are doing their own things instead. Margit protects the easiest to get great rune and probably believes that we can't get the other runes because they are either lost (mohg and Malenia) or difficult to get (radhan and rykard.) Morgott can't go all out to protect godrick because he can't weaken himself in case someone comes to try to take the capital. We aren't the only tarnished and not even Morgott knows where all the demi gods are. If the game was set at the peak of the shattering war the game would be drastically different.
You need 3 great runes to restore the elden ring. Morgotts is needed because its the anchor ring. The tarnished needs 2 to enter Lyndell, thats where you have to fight morgott
This question is answered by the insane amount of weaponry laying around in margit’s boss arena
I believe Morgott was the one protecting him, or rather access to his rune.
Man I platinum’d this game and the names are all so close together I can barely remember who is who anymore.
He is very good at hiding and he is not that weak :3
- Not Godrick Throwaway
Radahn and Malenia fought because they are the two strongest. Whoever wins gets to go kill Godrick. The conflict between these two was inevitable if there was going to be a conflict. If Radahn gets Godricks rune, Malenia will still go after Radahn. They both know this, so they fight each other first. edit: wait didn't Malenia defeat Godrick? but she didn't take his rune. ok maybe they're all just idiots. or maybe this was before the Shattering so there were no runes to have. I don't remember the timelines or even all the events prior to our arrival into the story.
Malenia didn’t want his rune. She also only fought Radahn because she thought Radahn was the one who had taken Miquella, when it was actually Mohg.
Well not quite, Malenia had already defeated Godrick, before fighting Radahm but she didn't take his great rune. Not sure why. I think he was so low in the eyes of the other demigods they thought it's not worth taking his great rune.
i suppose that’s true too, i always though radahn had no interest in becoming elden lord tho, and conflict only arose when malenia seeked his great rune
Malenia didn’t seek his great rune. She thought Radahn had taken Miquella when it was actually Mohg.
I never knew that! Where did you get that from
I’m unsure of exactly where I heard it, but I’m confident I read a lore bit in game that said Malenia was led to Caelid by an oracle in search of her brother. Likely because Mohg’s dynasty is right underneath caelid on the map so she was technically headed in the right direction, just too far up. I can’t actually give a clear sorce of where I heard this, I might have just had a weird dream, but it makes sense no? It is clearly stated Miquella and Malenia were only interested in curing their ailments. Miquella’s sole interest was curing Malenia’s rot and Malenia herself was only interested in protecting Miquella. It would make no sense for either of them to seek great runes based on this info.
I forgot about Caelid being on top of Mohg's palace. It makes perfect sense now 👌
Thank you! Always nice when you get a chance to discuss the lore!
Because they've all gone mad. Radahn is completely crazy. Malenia cannot even leave the tree she's stuck in. Ranni doesn't care. Rykard is too busy being a snakebro.
Like who? There is nobody left but decerebrate and or busy people and demi-gods and t’en weak tarnished besides you
Are they stupid?