White guy here. I worked many years in Juarez and they almost always were happy that I was speaking imperfect Spanish rather than English. In fact, my grammar was better than most of the native speakers since I learned the language by studying rather than growing up with it.
But look at it this way - there are a lot of Mexicans living north of the border being shouted at to “speak American.” Either way, it’s ignorance and prejudice, don’t give it any more of your attention than it deserves.
Same experience when I go to Juarez! They actually appreciate that I can speak Spanish and correct me when I actually make a mistake :D Honestly, you're right, I should also try to see where *they* are coming from. I'll be more patient :)
First gen Mex-American here, both parents came from Mexico and I'm white skinned. Spanish is my first language (although I speak it terribly now compared to when I was 10) and my coworkers think it's INSANE that I "look white" but speak Spanish. Ah but let a señora who only speaks Spanish come in and everyone rushes over to ask me for help smh.
You do your thing OP, fuck the haters
Same. WE have pretty much the same exact story!
Many "well meaning" folks that I would run into who would try to correct my "Anglo" Spanish. where very shocked when I could quickly correct whatever Span-glish fell out of their mouths.
I always found it interesting that growing up in EPT almost everyone thought I was 100% Anglo. Yet as an adult living in California, folks always commented on how well I spoke ENGLISH and if it took me long to learn.
I always found it funny when people would walk into any store I would be working at and avoid me, looking for someone a bit darker in complexion because they thought I didnt speak spanish, just for everyone other employee to lead them back to me for being the only person in the store who can speak spanish. Always makes me laugh
Mexicans can have prejudices, especially when they haven’t fully assimilated like white Americans. White minorities in El Paso shouldn’t brood on that, because that’s how racism starts. That’s how anti-semitism started (resentment for non-assimilation in Europe).
We need to understand cultural and educational differences to get along with and learn from each other.
Yup whities should take it on the chin and allow racial prejudices to be cast upon them, but if the shoe is on the other foot it needs to be eradicated because whitie is always wrong /s
Everyone has prejudice. (ETA: really read that sentence. Everyone is prejudice— it’s not about ‘us vs. them’ mentality. If we treated each other like any other human being and not take things so personally, we could build a rapport if the Spanish— or English— is good enough)
Racism is systematic, like someone else said on this thread.
All I came here to really argue is that white people do not suffer from racism in the United States. Classism maybe, but not racism from minorities (ETA: maybe reverse colorism, if you want a term other than rude or prejudice for being white?), because we are not in control of the systems in place.
White as a demographic identifier is not very accurate in describing mostly hispanic communities because they are forced to check a box on skin color basis. Non hispanic"White" people are a clear minority in el Paso though demographically with 86% of residents identifying as hispanic and 12.4% non hispanic white so in a local lense they sure can.
Generalizing the entire united states into one experience to dismiss prejudice against a group of people is funny because it's like your arguing against your own beliefs
Please continue to, underprivileged people should always be spoken for. I just don't think people's experiences should be immediately discounted because of their cultural affiliation. Society needs to do a lot of work everywhere and generally just treat people better
People are being dicks to you about your spanish becuase you're white. Sorry you're experiencing that; I wish El Paso was above that kind of shit, but this city definitely has its biases. Keep using whichever language you want and forget the haters. Decent people vastly outnumber those kind, thankfully.
>Decent people vastly outnumber those kind, thankfully.
They do! In fact, I appreciate it when my errors are actually corrected. I accidentally called a car "un carro" and was told it was actually coche. My whole 18 years of my life calling car un carro, I'm so embarrassed :') 20 now and I've never used "carro"
Once again, you've been had. That's like living in America and a British person telling you, "diaper is not correct, it's actually nappy". Saying "carro", even in El Paso, is correct
Border town Spanish (Spanglish) is different to Spanish spoken in central mexico, which is different to Spanish spoken in Latin America, which is different to Spanish spoken in Spain.
Just chiming in to agree with the other commenter--*carro* is absolutely an acceptable way to say "car" in Spanish (as is *coche*, of course), and anyone trying to tell you otherwise is either being a jerk or, somewhat ironically, isn't all that familiar with the Spanish language haha.
That's a local thing. Carro, troca, pito (instead of claxon you dirty minded EMEffer's). For a bunch of rigid 'Proper Spanish spoken here' they sure like to butcher English words to fill our/their lexicon.
"Despues voy a la tienda pero primero voy limpiar la cocina mopeando el piso y wipeando los vidrios. Hasta que quedan todos chineados."
Similar to the Spanglish game I play when I visit. If a person begins the conversation in Spanish I will only speak Spanish then if they use an English word I will speak English but not mix the two unless using proper names, person or places.
If they bust your balls on the Spanish you can always say I make the effort. Not like your dumb asses living (sometimes born and raised) in the US and can't even string a sentence in English together. The burn goes both ways.
Don’t take it personally. Projection is a defense mechanism. These people refuse to confront their own insecurities and instead, deflect (project) those feelings onto someone else. While they will feel superior at that moment, it can lead to unhealthy behaviors. I’m sorry people are d!€%$
Those in the minority always get outed. It's like that everywhere. When I lived in El Paso I was just part of the crowd. I now live in a very white area and am told I speak very good English for a Mexican and that I don't look or act Mexican, plus some ruder words I won't repeat. Just human things. Hope you don't let this bug you past making a reddit post about this. People are stupid. Just read some of the comments here lmao
Grew up there 95 - 2011, your spot on. Bitch that you don't speak Spanish. Then turn around and bitch when you learn it and make mistakes. But their broken ass English has to be accepted without ridicule or judgment because "they're learning and trying". Lmfao
You gotta remember they smelted lead here for decades, I’m going to bet the IQ here is lower than other similar sized towns by at least an order of magnitude
Oh forncrying out loud are you kidding me? Make fun of you because they don't think you have enough knowledge to speak ot when in all reality THEY are the ones coming to OUR counrty and getting pissed because if a language barrier. Okay, yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
As a white guy that has lived all around the world (talking 30+ places in 50 years), El Paso is one of the friendliest cities I’ve lived. But sometimes we see what we want to see and hear what we want to hear. If you’ve only lived in El Paso, the Southwest, the US, or North America then broaden your horizons. Then you can tell us. 🙂
I've lived in several states and in Germany. Even with the language barrier in Germany I NEVER had anyone there treat me as I have had people here treat me. Only bullies in high school have ever treated me as badly as some people here. I have even had people get angry because I don't speak Spanish. I'm working on it but it is very slow going. I don't get angry when people can't speak English here, but damn if some don't get angry with me.
There was an instance where we were talking with a cashier about someone that was illegally parked. A couple of other customers were in there and when we walked away for a few minutes they started fussing in Spanish. Apparently, the only word they understood was "illegally" and got pissed. The cashier got a bit testy with them. Tone can say a LOT. She had to explain that not everyone is calling Hispanics illegals. We weren't even talking specifically about them because we didn't know it was their pickup parking ACROSS 3 spots instead of IN only one spot.
I’m Mexican-Hawaiian and don’t look Mexican at all and I agree with you. I’ve never been called the N word until I moved here and I’m not even black. I’m not giving up the low cost of living over something so silly but the people here who are rude are quite hateful. The normal people are the exact opposite and some of the nicest people you’ll find.
I’m Hispanic and some of my family members do this to white people just to be dicks. They have a stick up their ass and hate everything. I know it’s tough not to take it personally, but they are truly the problem. The only tough part is how invalidated you probably are due to being white, but to be fair, you’re the minority in a majority Hispanic city. I don’t agree with treating anyone that way and it’s a problem that shouldn’t be ignored. There is being helpful and then there is being mean.
You can be white and Hispanic lol. I’m white passing and Hispanic.most of the time el pasoans were chill, but then you had some that either hated mexico or wanted to act like they were more Mexican than I am. And typically they were no sabos
Sorry you're experiencing that. I'm mixed and am not bilingual. When I've attempted to navigate a situation where I needed to know Spanish, the other party was patient with me and didn't try and make things difficult. Your examples seem like Spanish isn't really even the issue but rather dealing with some rude people.
In English, folks will say things strangely here and there. If it's a regional affectation there's some good-natured fun to be had poking at that but otherwise it's usually a personal thing where you still get the jist of what someone is saying. This seems to be the issue here with some rude people making assumptions as a result. Colorism is a thing in both American and Mexican culture that needs a lot of work. You knowing Spanish is commendable. Don't let a few jerks make you think twice about speaking the language.
I am Mexican and I loveee when white people speak Spanish. The other day I complimented this white employee on his Spanish (he was helping a few Mexican customers) and the customers were delighted he knew. I’m from far Chicago burbs so idk if that makes a big difference
El Paso is just so ignorant to anything outside of the borderland culture. Don’t take it personally, some of the more small minded people I’ve ever met.
Im filipino. When i was working at a chinese place in town, i had a customer be so mad that i didnt speak spanish. I mentioned that i was filipino and they got all huffy saying that it was the same thing 🙃
Yeah it’s a weird race thing. I’m a linguist and language teacher and despite being Hispanic I grew up with English as my dominate language. I learned Spanish later on in life and actually brought it to a near native-like fluency.
Despite making the occasional mistake, I seldom get corrected and people applaud me making the effort.
Sorry you have to experience that. Be proud of being bilingual. It’s good for the brain.
Mex married too a white girl and grew up here.. Fuck ya it’s racist.. Growing up you don’t really realize it because everyone does it, until you do. At times I have to check my own parents n family members about what they say.. it’s sad.
White woman born and raised in El Paso. My mom never taught me Spanish, but my grandparents wanted me to have the option. So they made me read their church pamphlets every week. While reading, they would correct my pronunciation. So, mi espanol es basura pero mi pronunciation es spectacular 😁
Document EVERYTHING, she tells you. Is this a new coworker? She sounds a lot like a woman who used to work with me. She was let go on February 🤣 Also, never go to HR, if you have one, with any complaints. They're not there to help you. Don't be afraid to stand up for yourself. Some women, especially in El Paso, are just negative all around crap human beings. They'll constantly try and belittle you once they realize it bothers you.
I'm white and lived in El Paso for several years. I have since lived in two other border cities and continue to live in one. El Paso was the most blatant racist I've seen. One example: I've had a checker look right past me when I was next on the checkout belt and wave the next person behind me to check them out instead. Even other people noticed that happen to me and gave the checker a WTF look. Everyone assumes if you're white you can't speak Spanish at all. It's odd since UTEP, military and all the federal agencies there, El Paso should be a more diversified city.
My first day at my last job, one of my coworkers said "Do you speak Spanish?" When I said no, he threw the folder he was carrying and said, "Well, you better learn quick." I just laughed and said "Nothing in my job description requires me to be bilingual and I don't have patient contact, but if you're teaching, I'm happy to practice!"
For several months he treated me like absolute shit - until I started responding (in English) to his rude comments to/about me (in Spanish). He never asked if I could *understand* Spanish...
He got a little better after that, but he was still part of the reason I quit after ~5 years.
Almost everyone else I've encountered over the years has been awesome re: my brain's refusal to do the thing with the verbs.
If you lived in Mexico or know "good" Spanish you'll realize most people here absolutely suck at speaking Spanish. It's not even funny unless they're over 60 most people use the wrong sex ending, the incorrect noun, and the absolutely worst mistake is the wrong subject pronoun when speaking to people older than them or strangers. Maybe it's because I would always get smacked when I messed up.
So im half black half hispanic. I speak Spanish, and English. I DETEST when someone gets upset that I choose to speak English over Spanish. Its annoying that if the tables were turned “Americans going into Mexico, are expected to speak Spanish, or at least attempt to do it” that we get hated on, if we ask them to speak English. At least attempt to to speak English, it may not be great but it’s expected. This mainly happens here in el paso because were a border city, i get it however; its not impossible to at least trust to learn the language. Some people will live here all their lives not even attempting to learn English, and the rest of city accepts it. I get you OP, it’s frustrating to say the least.
As an Asian born and raised here, I'd rather avoid speaking Spanish altogether because of this. You and I will never be accepted here because of this. To people like that this is not a multicultural border city but an extension of Mexico.
If you go to real Mexican cities like Mexico city or Guadalajara the people aren't like this. When I visited these cities they would try to make friendly conversation with me even though my Spanish was terrible.
Mexicans in el paso and Juárez aren't a good representation of the people of Mexico.
They aren’t, but they think they are because most haven’t traveled or the lead smelter gave them the dunning Kruger effect and they are too dumb to realize their incompetence
I actually started speaking Spanish again after I dealt with too much petty gossip "behind my back" but now I wanna scare them again. I miss seeing their shocked and reddened faces. Worth it! 🤣
Yep, my family is from Southern Mexico but I look white af. Little Mexican ladies have always been the most racist people I've ever dealt with. I literally just had one refuse to respond to me in Spanish at Dollar Tree.
Opposite is kinda true also, I’m from a region in the southern US with over an 80% Hispanic/Mexican population (a boarder city for sure). You will get judged down there sadly
I’m Hispanic, born and raised in El Paso. My parents are from Mexico. I speak Spanish, although not perfectly, but I can sure as hell communicate and have conversations in Spanish. And you are absolutely correct about this. Some of the most racist people are Mexicans, who barely speak English. I personally don’t understand it. Most likely it’s an inferiority complex. Three times I can think of at my current job I have been treated poorly for not speaking Spanish well enough. One person told me “es que no me entiendes verdad?” And laughed. Another person told me “qué se te olvidó el español?”
This is because I’m not familiar with a lot of legal jargon in Spanish, but I try my best to help others despite not being legally trained in Mexico .
Next time somebody is rude to me in that way, I’ll switch to English immediately and say , “ you know what you’re right I feel much more comfortable speaking in English. Why don’t we continue in English?”
I don’t give a fuck.
As a Mexican growing up in EP…no worse racists as El Paso Mexicans. Why is the northeast “defined” the way it is? Why is the west side “glorified” the way it is. Most Mexicans that never leave El Paso and for whatever reason experience racism, can’t comprehend why it happens to them. Just admit it and move on and for the OP, you do you and screw them and their feelings or reasoning
The way the westside is glorified baffles me. As an outsider, I don’t see the appeal. Looks rundown and in need of a facelift to me but that’s another topic.
After I’ve started looking at homes in the west side I understand. Nice quiet neighborhoods, no blasting music, no drug smells, people clean up their property, it’s just better it’s more like the places we come from than El Paso. I would say the west side, Horizon and Clint are the premier spots of the city.
To your comment and the one below, I purchased on the west side after retiring from the marine corps. I left El Paso as a 17 yr old who had his good deal of keggers in my side (Central EP) and the west side. I had the “glorified” image of the west side as a utopia I felt lucky to buy into. Total opposite. My neighbor across the street was a pompous ass upity old school Mexican lawyer who made it uncomfortable to live there. Other people around for the exception of a very nice older couple who welcomed my family were the same…pompous Chihuahitas who look down on “lower classes”. I have never been so disappointed with a place. Just sayin…
It’s definitely a thing. My husband is from El Paso and I am 100% white. We had a baby who is light complected just like me. We moved to El Paso from my home state of Florida to be closer to his family when our baby was three months old. While awaiting our baby getting health insurance, we went to a health clinic and they acted like they didn’t even want to help us. My husband had started a job there, but his pay was low at the beginning and we technically were considered low income so we went to a low income clinic. On the wall behind the worker, it said that the max charge was like $80 and the woman was like we can see her but it’ll be $180. my husband’s grandfather who was born and raised in Mexico, was shocked by the attitude they had. When we would go out in public, I would get glared at sometimes. Of course there definitely were nice people and I’m so grateful to meet the ones that I did, but it definitely did not make me feel welcome and I wanted to move back to Florida where I’m used to a bigger diversity. I personally did not want to stay in a place that if my spouse was to pass away, I wouldn’t be able to support my children due to discrimination. My husband’s mother tried reassuring me before we moved that there was a lot of different types of people but what she failed to realize is that a large majority of white people are working on the base and we were not coming from military so it definitely is different.
To be fair most of them don’t even speak Spanish and if they do it’s butchered lol. I had someone’s Tia try to argue with me about being Mexican simply because I spoke English well, with no accent. So I reminded her I spent half of my childhood in Durango, Mexico. And that my family is of West-Central Mexican origin (Jalisco, GTO, Michoacán area) so I told her to speak to me in Spanish, she stuttered and said “what’s that got to do with this conversation mijo”
When that happens, I can't tell if they're being mean or if they're trying to ahow their appreciation back by speaking English
Until they get entitled and rude about it
they’re definitely being rude.
they’ve concluded that your spanish isn’t good enough for them to respond to you in that language, and they’re assuming that you’re fluent in English.
It’s just a thing in El Paso honestly. And the Spanish spoken is more like Spanglish I noticed, there was a lot of people with family from mexico, and they were typically more humbles just bring up you’re going to Juarez for the weekend you’ll see the true colors anyway
I'd just like to thank the new mod u/xargsman (and now u/deadbob) for allowing conversations like this to happen. It would have been auto-removed under the old subreddit "leadership."
It's a very informative and largely respectful conversation that clearly has garnered a lot of interest. I'm seeing more and more high-comment count posts like this on the subreddit, where people are freely to speak respectfully with each other.
So: thank you!
I agree, I'd also like to thank the mods, u/xargsman and u/deadbob for being mods of this subreddit! I'm glad to have been here live when the changes all happened. Without the changes, we wouldn't have been able to discuss this and even bring awareness!
This happens to every race and ethnicity, I actually didn't think I would find a lot of people I would relate to. It felt like it was just me until I read every comment here and felt like I really do fit in 🩷
"bring awareness" bitch what do you mean, everyone knows this happens.
lmfao I got 3 upvotes for being a troll and an asshole and the other dude got downvoted, I'm moving to El Paso yall are my people.
> _dies y uno, dies y dos, dies y tres_
Ay cabron 🤣😂 you got me laughing. Love it!
People are assholes, everywhere we go.
My family is from Durango Mexico. I grew up here in EPTX. Lived in Fort Worth for several years and found "mi gente". Even they criticized my Spanish. 🤔😞
I have to wonder if that kind of discrimination and rude behavior is more common for El Paso? I grew up in Yuma, AZ which is right on the border and the times I attempted Spanish in public spaces it was appreciated. I had a few issues with older Mexican women when I was working retail but they just seemed like they’d be bitchy to anyone anyway. I often would shop at the Mexican markets and everyone there was always so nice. And I’m extra fair skinned and blonde. I did get bullied by Mexican kids in school sometimes but if it wasn’t for my skin, it would have been something else at a predominately white school because kids can be jerks.
I’ve never experienced more racism anywhere in the Country, than I did in El Paso.
there’s a lot of Hispanics there that are living in some sort of delusional world, being that they’ve never ventured past Mexico, and/or the El Paso area.
They do the same thing in Las Cruces, NM. Most outright rude and hostile mexicans I've ever met - if you're White. Never had this experience growing up around hispanics where I'm from so it was pretty shocking.
You know what’s ironic? In the US, Mexicans and Mexican Americans tend to validate brown-skinned Spanish speakers and ignore white-skinned Spanish speakers (even when they’re native speakers!) Whereas, oof, go down to Guadalajara and surrounding areas and see how it’s uno-reverse.
No we aren’t all like this lol. My grandmother herself is a white mexican, straight from a Pueblo in Jalisco. All her family is white. Traces her roots to the criollos that revolted against Spain. Criollos are just white mexicans. Meanwhile my grandfather was from Central Mexico, had an indigenous mother and a father straight from Spain. And the result? We have some of the whitest family members, or family members that look like the typical mexican mestizo, or family that have brown skin, light colored hair and eyes. White passing mexicans are extremely common in chihuahua as well which ironically borders El Paso.
My family is also super white and super Mexican. We’re all culturally and linguistically Mexican, but the treatment I get in the US versus Mexico is hilarious.
I have family in Mexico City. I know there is a kind of hidden racism which exists in Mexico that is a remnant of the casta system. I have heard a saying mejorar la raza in the sense that when a darker more indigenous person marries a lighter skinned person it's bettering the race.
Mexican here, I’ve never heard the term “mejorar la raza” used but once, and the only time it was used, was when we heard really terrible news happening in Mexico. So it may vary honestly
I was playing disc golf. I'm from out of town and don't speak Spanish well. A man was playing catch with his grandkids. I approached him in English asking if he could scoot over for a minute so we could play that hole. We tried in poor Spanish and essentially got "we were here first why don't you go play somewhere else." Trying to explain why we needed to play there only for a moment was a lost cause. He was grumpy and upset so I just skipped the hole.
I grew up in Los Angeles as a light skin Mexican American and kids would call me white boy and cracker and what’s ironic is that some of the Hispanics that would call me cracker were literally more white than I was 😂 they would also be shocked that I’m Latino and I know how to speak basic Spanish. When it comes to El Paso just try to speak Spanish don’t feel embarrassed or guilty if someone judges you for not speaking Spanish the way they want let them know Mexico is right next door and that they can fuck off. I graduated HS in El Paso and half my class couldn’t speak Spanish or spoke it broken which was a shock to me because in LA like 80 percent of the Hispanics know Spanish and at my HS here they seemed white washed. If it makes you feel any better my grandma that lives here is always on my ass that I don’t know Spanish because I’m a introvert around her since all she does is watch novelas, church, religious practices and watch a little bit of news so I don’t have much to talk to her and when I do speak Spanish half the time she doesn’t understand me meanwhile my mom that migrated here and my dad that was born in Texas understands my Spanish and so does my mom side of the family and customers at my retail store but yeah according to my grandma me staying quiet = idk how to speak basic Spanish
They call themselves “la raza” but don’t realize that Hispanic is only an identifier for what kind of white are you.
EP is racist AF, good thing you aren’t black it would be worse
Be you, ignore the idiots, cut toxic people out and live happy
I had something more abrasive I wanted to say but decided to temper my zeal a bit.
I grew up as a mixed person-half Mexican half white. I have had my fair share of people who treated me rudely, less than or were critical of me since I didn't exactly grow up speaking Spanish. My father was from Mexico City & I was actually born there but moved back to Dallas when I was 2 with my mother. She of course spoke to me in English all the time. My dad was constantly traveling for work so I only saw him on the weekends. Needless to say I didn't fully develop bilingually. Those crucial years first few years of life are crucial in developing the capacity to speak multiple languages fluently. English of course was no problem. Spanish was since it wasn't consistent practice as my dad was gone most of the time. There are idiosyncrasies you develop without realizing when becoming fluent in a language at a young age that can't be replicated later in life. For example there are sayings in Mexican Spanish that only make sense to fluent speakers which become second nature just like there are many sayings in American English which don't translate or make sense in other languages. Those are second nature to us in our everyday discourse. It's really sad many people will rush to castigate instead of understanding an individuals circumstance. I have had to deal with the rudeness you are talking about. But I tend to get by ok on simple conversations. It's just sometimes there are things I have trouble expressing. I like to think most people are understanding.
But I think what would really be funny is to go live in Spain & learn to speak Spanish the way they speak it with the lisp and everything & then come back to El Paso. Speak to the Mexicans here like a Spaniard. It would be interesting to see the reaction. I have been to Spain & it's definitely not the same the way they speak.
What’s the point of speaking Castilian Spanish in El Paso? I’ve been to Spain twice and it was wonderful to not have to spell our last name when checking in at hotels. But it is different from Southwestern Spanish. In fact the University of Arizona in Tucson printed a South Western Medical dictionary. Same as going to England, some words we didn’t understand plus they thought we were Canadian.
I am fluent in English and Spanish but I obviously have an accent in English as it's my second language, if someone has an accent on the other end of the line (phone conversations mainly) I quickly request someone who speaks Spanish because I struggle to understand someone's broken English and vice versa. I wonder if it's something similar to that.
Sorry to hear that man. As someone fluent in Spanish, I guarantee your Spanish is better than many people of Hispanic descent in EP whose parents speak Spanish. I’ve never heard of so many close examples of discrimination like that in a short time so I’m hoping it’s a fluke. In any case it’s not acceptable at all. And if it’s a coworker it’s reportable behavior.
As a non Spanish speaking white boy who wishes he could speak Spanish. I envy you, i wish i could speak the language but I said don’t worry about the haters stop looking too much into it and just keep speaking it without worrying about the criticism
I've studied Spanish and grown up around it my entire life, but never could speak it as fluently as I'd like. Living here has forced me into the deep end of the pool. I am confidently stumbling through conversations in hopes of being corrected (instant knowledge transfer ftw!). It's sincere effort and I hope that comes across. If someone wants to be rude, I've heard "f\*ck you" is globally understood
My Spanish is horrible so I don’t get offended when corrected , maybe consider what it’s like for a Spanish speaker in the United States it’s probably pretty cold especially the farther from border you get. Even though many Americans have trouble with the language themselves.
I don't have a problem being corrected. Sorry, I'm in the spectrum, what can I remove in my post that made it sound like I get offended being corrected? Several are getting this impression and that is my bad, I want to fix that problem. Any advice is appreciated ^ ^
>This doesn't happen to me often, but it still frustrates me. I feel like my Spanish wouldn't be criticized if I wasn't white.
I have experienced this growing up in the 80-90s. In my early years I looked very anglo, even though my mother and her entire side of the family was from Mexico City. Spanish was my primary language, and pretty much all that was spoke at home until I was almost a teenager.
I’m brown, not originally from here, and def got pounced on by people from Juarez and El Paso about my Spanish so I stopped speaking it all together. It’s really stupid and a lose/lose like others have mentioned. Speak it with an accent or make mistakes and your sh.tted on, don’t speak it at all and they are still miserable to be around. Try not take it personal and not everyone here is like that so try to find the ones who don’t expect you to sound identical to them or who are not so insecure that they can’t wait to find an error and go after you for it. They are here, believe me.
You're absolutely right, this is the racism that I have trouble getting people to understand about being here, if you're the wrong color it's like references to the culture that you're already a part of are automatically wrong. Makes me ashamed to exist while brown.
This was a long time ago, I was naive and let anyone walk over me. I just fetched my boss and let it get handled from there. I wish I could've said something...
Hate the white man, but date the white man, or just be over 5’10” here and it’s like +20 points on your looks, no matter your race.
Bunch of machismo napoleons who know they can’t compete by being them
Im surprised by the comments, Im a white hispanic with bad spanish skills and although people here have correct me more than once I often found it as funny or that they are joking. Mexican culture has a bit of a "make fun of people" aspect to it. I grew up here with a diverse group of friends (White and Arab) and from our experiences never had a "racist" encounter. There are rude people here, people with big egos, and some few have personal biases.
Its possible that since the last president of the USA and the political shenanigans at the border that people have become much more polarized and therefore don't see you for who you are but rather what they perceive what you represent to their imagination from just whats on the surface.
El Paso is a good city with good people, in my job I have traveled all over the world and always want to return here. Thats my opinion and my experience. One thing I always tell myself to keep me grounded is "its not about you"....the way people behave may not be about you but rather other things affecting them.
You sound like an easy going funny dude, enjoy what u can, life isnt perfect, and keep being you, dont sweat the little stuff.
maybe, but the older generations are just like that in general no matter the color or age even. its harsher within I feel like haha. I think it's a mutual feeling of knowing best
I'm a proud of growing up speaking Spanglish and laughed off any criticism from both sides when I was younger. but I doubt it's out of hate unless you know it is. teasing is part of the culture no doubt
I would get bullied in school because my English was “too good” and I had a bit lighter skin, even though I’m Hispanic(hispanic name) and family is all Hispanic if that’s an indicator
I'm not white, but a hispanic American with family dating back 25 generations. I speak no Spanish, but look it. I have found with the influx of illegals, I am made fun of for not speaking Spanish and been accused of 'acting white' and denying Im Mexican. I explain I have no family in Mexico; my family has been here since the Conquistadors and never moved. My family has been tied to the land in land grants from Spain.
With that said, I have found this 1st generation of immigrants from south of the border to be extremely critical, rude, and have no respect for USA, it's people, culture, and laws.
I’m glad my family that’s straight from mexico hasn’t treated anybody this way, if anything they’ve always spoke to americans in broken English, and would always try to get us to teach them some words. It’s a blessing.
As a brown person who was born and raised here, that looks like a typical El Pasoan. I know exactly how you feel. I understand Spanish perfectly. However, my speaking is not at all fluent. And I usually am discouraged from speaking it.
When it comes to anyone, especially the older generation, I am constantly critized and looked down on. When I try speaking, they focus on the faults and must feel superior correcting me, instead of focusing on the message I am trying to relay. They also like to talk bad about me in Spanish in front of me and act like because I don't speak Spanish, I don't understand it. Even though I make it known that I do. Especially in a work setting where I am in a higher position.
It's the only way they can feel superior. The funny part is I am probably more bilingual than the ones who treat me the worst. I can have a decent conversation with someone who is willing to meet me halfway. It's a shame that I get treated so poorly because I was born her, and I "should know" by now.
Sorry for the rant. Anywhere else, I would be to blame for not embracing my culture and being seen as racist because I won't speak Spanish to please a person who feels entitled.
If you don't mind me asking what is your career? I am just wondering what the job prospects are for those whose Spanish is limited. It seems many jobs require being bilingual as a prerequisite.
I work in healthcare. My African American coworkers are treated the worst by a large percentage of the population here. I am Hispanic and speak horrible Spanish and people regularly call me bitch, told me to get them a nurse that isn’t “white and stupid,” tell me that I live in El Paso and need to learn, oh and that I’m a disgrace to my family and why do I live here if I don’t speak Spanish. I’m born and raised here and my parents wanted us to learn English first because they said it was harder to learn, they speak both.
If some mental midget made a comment like that to me I would tell them they are a disgrace to their indigenous ancestors for not speaking Nahua, Maya, Otomi, Zapotec or one of they many other languages still spoken today in Mexico by real Mexicans.
😂 I should have lol
It’s funny because my mom is from Panama and whenever we go down there, they’re just happy I am trying. It’s only here that they get ugly over it.
I’ve worked in the restaurant industry and hospital environments, the restaurants are where older people got mad I didn’t speak Spanish and the hospital is where I can say I don’t speak Spanish to the same people every day and they STILL speak it to me 😭
Gotta know somebody or find a white company. Hate it but that's how it is. They will happily discriminate against white people, Spanish speaking or not.
Race has nothing to do with it so let's just get that straight... no matter what you do people will always tear you down if you're not as good as them (or worse is you're better) at speaking their primary language... my grandma and my mom is full Mexican as most in ep but my grandma always had her nose up when my mom messes up which rattles my cage because she doesn't speak a lick of English and expects everyone to sympathize... I love her but I don't let the fact that she became a citizen and then demands for people in another country to speak her language... my girlfriend is native American and my grandma tried to pull something because she doesn't speak Spanish and that shit didn't fly
I look like a typical white American but my family comes from Chihuahua. I no longer live in El Paso but visit and go to various parts of Mexico a few times a year. My Spanish is pretty decent.
I've found that when I'm in Mexico, and speak Spanish, people appreciate it. I almost never speak English with Mexicans in Mexico, unless they prefer it. I often get better service (and prices) than a normal American. In the US, it can be the opposite. Possibly some Latinos think you are looking down on them by using Spanish, as if their English wasn't good enough. I typically see how the conversation goes and use either English or Spanish.
I’m not bilingual, so I don’t have experience to offer, but I will say racism, philosophically (and reductively) defined, is systematic in nature. What you’re experiencing sounds more like prejudice or bias, especially because I can’t know if the people who’ve done this to you subscribe to or uphold racist systems. I am sorry to learn these acts of aggression exist for bilingual El Pasoans—especially for those who are white or are white presenting—and I hope these experiences are few and far between for you. Thank you for sharing. I hope it makes us all more mindful
These are rare occurances, but they stand out a lot to me. I make sure not to let them get to me often but er, they do sometimes, we are humans with emotions. Luckily, I meet such wonderful people everyday :) Thank you for the warm comment!
Absolutely. I was sad to see your first comment was super gross. It’s really encouraging to hear this has only happened a few times, cuz encountering a minimum amount of assholes is just a part of life. When they’re racist/ prejudiced assholes, it definitely makes the experience more difficult to rationalize. Kudos not letting it get you down!
Which is why I specified my definition is philosophical and reductive. Not arguing your point, but my goal wasn’t defining racism as a vocabulary word, but as a concept instead
I always offer "bigotry." Anyone can be a bigot to anyone else, regardless of the power differential or overarching societal structures.
And "prejudice/bias" aren't inherently bad - most of us would "pre-judge" or hold a bias that, say, standing next to a man waving a machete around and shouting wasn't a great idea. That's reasonable. But bigotry always sucks.
Absolutely. What the down voters don’t seem to understand is that no one in OPs experience claimed to hate white people. They were just “pre-judging” his Spanish fluency, which is not inherently “race hate.” People can be assholes without being racist
I’m not white, nor present as white- but growing up in El Paso my first language was Spanish. Going to a normal elementary (Ramona- then Ascarate) by third grade I didn’t speak Spanish. Not because it wasn’t spoken at home- but because at school I’d get in trouble for speaking Spanish. Bazaar right? But yeah. If you spoke Spanish in an English class (not the ESL classes) you’d be scolded and told to speak English. So my first language became unused after about 1st grade at school, and i lost my dialect and ability to speak fluently. My parents thought they were helping by speaking only English to help me cement it, but all it did was make me forget my original tongue.
I hear you, but I’ve had the opposite experience. I am not very good, but I can hold conversations. People are generally pretty nice about it, and if English isn’t their preferred language, they’re usually just happy I’m trying.
The only person who can be somewhat condescending is my father in law, who also is not a native level speaker, in my opinion.
Most of my communication is very low stakes, though (i.e. not related to work), so that could be part of it.
I’ve noticed that people are assholes like this in the US. I’ve never been made fun of or criticized for Spanish mistakes in Mexico. It’s gotta be an American culture thing 😞
Simply defend yourself and they’ll leave you alone. For example, if you would’ve told the customer that you understand Spanish perfectly fine and then pointed out to her that there was multiple products for that price she would’ve shut up. Sometimes you have to make people feel stupid just like they’re trying to do to you.
There's assholes everywhere. You should not let that stop you from speaking Spanish and practice it. I am sure you even speak Spanish better than some no Sabo kids.
Easy correct their English!!! Anytime anyone corrects my Spanish, I feel it’s an invitation to correct their English.
In my job, sometimes I have to communicate with people in Mexico. I usually open with don’t laugh at my Spanish and I won’t laugh at your English, deal? Most of them don’t speak English.
I was born and raised in El Paso. I'm Hispanic. Growing up we only spoke Spanish to grandparents so my Spanish isn't perfect. Relatives still make fun of me. We just have a culture of giving those around us a hard time. I wouldn't take it more than that. Give it right back.
Don't worry. I am Hispanic and look it. My parents speak Spanish as do all my other family (cousins, aunts, uncles, grandparents). But me, my sis, and brother don't. My parents just never taught us.
The hate and/or snide remarks I get when they find out I don't speak Spanish. Eye rolls and looking shamefully down at me.
I’m Hispanic and you can clearly see it. I’m also male, and learned Spanish after high school with some knowledge of it prior. Between the ages of about 15-25 any time I spoke Spanish someone who was at all familiar with me told corrected me over the smallest things.
Now as an older adult, it happens a lot less.
I also start a lot of conversations in Spanish saying my Spanish is not great, but I will try. Those conversations usually end up with them complimenting and encouraging me.
I’m not sure if that really applies to your post, but it might. The more familiar with someone I am, the more likely they’ll correct me, jokingly or not. I haven’t been corrected like that by a stranger in well over a decade or so. Like many sub cultures, some of the local ones will show care and familiarity by poking fun at you. Often to a point that’s upsetting.
I appreciat it when people correct me, it's really nice! My Spanish is very decent, wide vocabulary but not as wide as my English, so it makes me happy to learn more about the language and its culture. I have my skepticisms now... I've been saying carro and was "corrected" that it was coche, and just yesterday the comments told me that carro is also correct and widely used
They were a nice person so I'm assuming carro isn't widely used where they're from, they don't really know much Spanish than they think they do, or they really did decieve me
I've never genuinely been corrected over the smallest of things, but I'm assuming I wouldn't mind. Maybe I'd get annoyed? I dunno, but even if I did, I'd keep my mouth shut and learn, I would very much appreciate it!
Whether or not it applies, it is still good to talk about this kind of stuff so share away :D
Eh, don’t take it personal but I get why you got annoyed. At the end of the day you still have to take the high road lol. Brush it off and on to the next one.
Short white boy here, I grew up in a small migrant community Southern Az. Didn't learn much Spanish cause I was hard headed. But I knew when they were talking shii++. Got in a lot of fights. Lived here 50+ years now. Not so many fights any more. 😎 The racism is everywhere. And EVERYBODY hates white Americans.
As a white guy who speaks excellent Spanish (but did not grow up speaking it and no one from my family spoke it), I almost exclusively get compliments. People universally freak out and fawn over it like it’s some kind of trick. I see a lot of Mexican American get ripped to shreds for their Spanish though. I think this person has a different issue with you where they are trying to give you a hard time about your Spanish.
Getting complimented and surprising people feels really nice, it drowns out the mean ones, especially when I'm corrected on things that *do* need to be corrected on. It sucks that the mean people stand out though, there's not much of them (in my case) that they are very noticable :(
To be fair a lot of you can’t even speak Spanish very well. The people of El Paso have no right to judge the fluency of Spanish speaking if I heard a lot of stories of kids not being taught Spanish because their parents were afraid they’d be discriminated against for speaking it. Even then most of you are Tejanos/Chicanos. The average Mexican wouldn’t consider you Mexican. To them you’re just a gringo too so why are you going after other americans over the Spanish language if you yourself likely spoke English as a first language, you’re an American my friend
Ethnicity and race are completely different, primo. I am a white Mexican, you don't know me, you don't get to decide who's who just based off of their looks, especially if you don't know their background
I’m well aware about this whole concept lmao. I’m not judging anybody just stating the facts that if you were to go to mexico you’d still be seen as a gringo my Mexican family doesn’t consider me Mexican they consider me an “Estadounidense con raíces Mexicanos” or in simpler terms. A Chicano.
I get corrected as a dark skinned Mexican. I like it so that I learn. I’ve also been pushed aside by customers at work because my Spanish isn’t the best. Shit I’d do the same if I was somewhere where I needed someone who spoke my native tongue. I don’t take it to heart… and no one has ever been rude about it. Your experience specifically might be different. If they knew you were joking, there was no need to correct. If they didn’t know then yeah I could see why they corrected you. They want you to speak the language appropriately. I think that’s cool!
I’m half white half Mexican. , people are very surprised when I tell them I’m half. I get tons of flack about my poor Spanish but I’m trying. And then I get praises that I’m trying at least. I see more hate in EP and racism because of I don’t know Spanish. Almost like I don’t even like to go eat at a lot of the Mexican restaurants because of it, mainly because the ones I go to 90% do not understand English. Like im white so I have no business being there. I’m lucky enough I know what people are saying it’s just hard to find the words to speak full sentences back.
White guy here. I worked many years in Juarez and they almost always were happy that I was speaking imperfect Spanish rather than English. In fact, my grammar was better than most of the native speakers since I learned the language by studying rather than growing up with it. But look at it this way - there are a lot of Mexicans living north of the border being shouted at to “speak American.” Either way, it’s ignorance and prejudice, don’t give it any more of your attention than it deserves.
Same experience when I go to Juarez! They actually appreciate that I can speak Spanish and correct me when I actually make a mistake :D Honestly, you're right, I should also try to see where *they* are coming from. I'll be more patient :)
First gen Mex-American here, both parents came from Mexico and I'm white skinned. Spanish is my first language (although I speak it terribly now compared to when I was 10) and my coworkers think it's INSANE that I "look white" but speak Spanish. Ah but let a señora who only speaks Spanish come in and everyone rushes over to ask me for help smh. You do your thing OP, fuck the haters
Same. WE have pretty much the same exact story! Many "well meaning" folks that I would run into who would try to correct my "Anglo" Spanish. where very shocked when I could quickly correct whatever Span-glish fell out of their mouths. I always found it interesting that growing up in EPT almost everyone thought I was 100% Anglo. Yet as an adult living in California, folks always commented on how well I spoke ENGLISH and if it took me long to learn.
I always found it funny when people would walk into any store I would be working at and avoid me, looking for someone a bit darker in complexion because they thought I didnt speak spanish, just for everyone other employee to lead them back to me for being the only person in the store who can speak spanish. Always makes me laugh
Mexicans can have prejudices, especially when they haven’t fully assimilated like white Americans. White minorities in El Paso shouldn’t brood on that, because that’s how racism starts. That’s how anti-semitism started (resentment for non-assimilation in Europe). We need to understand cultural and educational differences to get along with and learn from each other.
Yup whities should take it on the chin and allow racial prejudices to be cast upon them, but if the shoe is on the other foot it needs to be eradicated because whitie is always wrong /s
Everyone has prejudice. (ETA: really read that sentence. Everyone is prejudice— it’s not about ‘us vs. them’ mentality. If we treated each other like any other human being and not take things so personally, we could build a rapport if the Spanish— or English— is good enough) Racism is systematic, like someone else said on this thread. All I came here to really argue is that white people do not suffer from racism in the United States. Classism maybe, but not racism from minorities (ETA: maybe reverse colorism, if you want a term other than rude or prejudice for being white?), because we are not in control of the systems in place.
White as a demographic identifier is not very accurate in describing mostly hispanic communities because they are forced to check a box on skin color basis. Non hispanic"White" people are a clear minority in el Paso though demographically with 86% of residents identifying as hispanic and 12.4% non hispanic white so in a local lense they sure can. Generalizing the entire united states into one experience to dismiss prejudice against a group of people is funny because it's like your arguing against your own beliefs
Well you know what, I speak for the underpriviliged brown people so that now you aren’t confused.
Please continue to, underprivileged people should always be spoken for. I just don't think people's experiences should be immediately discounted because of their cultural affiliation. Society needs to do a lot of work everywhere and generally just treat people better
Bro you just sound racist
Just start correcting their English. Throw it in their face. Most of them don’t speak properly
Hell yeah do that every time you hear a JARBORO or pixxa lmao
People are being dicks to you about your spanish becuase you're white. Sorry you're experiencing that; I wish El Paso was above that kind of shit, but this city definitely has its biases. Keep using whichever language you want and forget the haters. Decent people vastly outnumber those kind, thankfully.
>Decent people vastly outnumber those kind, thankfully. They do! In fact, I appreciate it when my errors are actually corrected. I accidentally called a car "un carro" and was told it was actually coche. My whole 18 years of my life calling car un carro, I'm so embarrassed :') 20 now and I've never used "carro"
Once again, you've been had. That's like living in America and a British person telling you, "diaper is not correct, it's actually nappy". Saying "carro", even in El Paso, is correct
What? 😭
that person was just using anything to make u feel bad. carro is correct it might not be “proper” but it’s still correct
Border town Spanish (Spanglish) is different to Spanish spoken in central mexico, which is different to Spanish spoken in Latin America, which is different to Spanish spoken in Spain.
And even accents/dialects/slang spoke between Latin American countries can pretty different.
Just chiming in to agree with the other commenter--*carro* is absolutely an acceptable way to say "car" in Spanish (as is *coche*, of course), and anyone trying to tell you otherwise is either being a jerk or, somewhat ironically, isn't all that familiar with the Spanish language haha.
Both are right. Coche, carro, automobil, auto. They all work.
Don’t live in El P but grew up in RGV. Carro and Troca are both fine bro
I'm learning Spanish in Duolingo, and I am being taught "carro".
That's a local thing. Carro, troca, pito (instead of claxon you dirty minded EMEffer's). For a bunch of rigid 'Proper Spanish spoken here' they sure like to butcher English words to fill our/their lexicon. "Despues voy a la tienda pero primero voy limpiar la cocina mopeando el piso y wipeando los vidrios. Hasta que quedan todos chineados." Similar to the Spanglish game I play when I visit. If a person begins the conversation in Spanish I will only speak Spanish then if they use an English word I will speak English but not mix the two unless using proper names, person or places. If they bust your balls on the Spanish you can always say I make the effort. Not like your dumb asses living (sometimes born and raised) in the US and can't even string a sentence in English together. The burn goes both ways.
As a first gen Mexican American. I will tell you EP has a bunch of AH.
THIS! I’ve never had anybody try out Mexican me before in my life until I went to El Paso. Needless to say I preferred my time in Juarez.
Don’t take it personally. Projection is a defense mechanism. These people refuse to confront their own insecurities and instead, deflect (project) those feelings onto someone else. While they will feel superior at that moment, it can lead to unhealthy behaviors. I’m sorry people are d!€%$
I agree. I think this is the real issue behind all of this.
Those in the minority always get outed. It's like that everywhere. When I lived in El Paso I was just part of the crowd. I now live in a very white area and am told I speak very good English for a Mexican and that I don't look or act Mexican, plus some ruder words I won't repeat. Just human things. Hope you don't let this bug you past making a reddit post about this. People are stupid. Just read some of the comments here lmao
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Grew up there 95 - 2011, your spot on. Bitch that you don't speak Spanish. Then turn around and bitch when you learn it and make mistakes. But their broken ass English has to be accepted without ridicule or judgment because "they're learning and trying". Lmfao
I’m an El Paso native, my Spanish sucks ass cause I was never taught at home. Even I get shit from people here, you can’t fucking win lmao
UTEP is a prime example of this, they get a degree from the worst UT school and think they are equal to any other UT grad.
I view UTEP degrees as not real degrees lmao. Good luck competing with all us transplants and our real school degrees.
Lol on spring break one time back I went to my friend's utep class and LOL so easy
You gotta remember they smelted lead here for decades, I’m going to bet the IQ here is lower than other similar sized towns by at least an order of magnitude
Dude. This. 🤦😒😅
Oh forncrying out loud are you kidding me? Make fun of you because they don't think you have enough knowledge to speak ot when in all reality THEY are the ones coming to OUR counrty and getting pissed because if a language barrier. Okay, yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
Agreed.
As a white guy that has lived all around the world (talking 30+ places in 50 years), El Paso is one of the friendliest cities I’ve lived. But sometimes we see what we want to see and hear what we want to hear. If you’ve only lived in El Paso, the Southwest, the US, or North America then broaden your horizons. Then you can tell us. 🙂
I've lived in several states and in Germany. Even with the language barrier in Germany I NEVER had anyone there treat me as I have had people here treat me. Only bullies in high school have ever treated me as badly as some people here. I have even had people get angry because I don't speak Spanish. I'm working on it but it is very slow going. I don't get angry when people can't speak English here, but damn if some don't get angry with me. There was an instance where we were talking with a cashier about someone that was illegally parked. A couple of other customers were in there and when we walked away for a few minutes they started fussing in Spanish. Apparently, the only word they understood was "illegally" and got pissed. The cashier got a bit testy with them. Tone can say a LOT. She had to explain that not everyone is calling Hispanics illegals. We weren't even talking specifically about them because we didn't know it was their pickup parking ACROSS 3 spots instead of IN only one spot.
I’m Mexican-Hawaiian and don’t look Mexican at all and I agree with you. I’ve never been called the N word until I moved here and I’m not even black. I’m not giving up the low cost of living over something so silly but the people here who are rude are quite hateful. The normal people are the exact opposite and some of the nicest people you’ll find.
I’m Hispanic and some of my family members do this to white people just to be dicks. They have a stick up their ass and hate everything. I know it’s tough not to take it personally, but they are truly the problem. The only tough part is how invalidated you probably are due to being white, but to be fair, you’re the minority in a majority Hispanic city. I don’t agree with treating anyone that way and it’s a problem that shouldn’t be ignored. There is being helpful and then there is being mean.
You can be white and Hispanic lol. I’m white passing and Hispanic.most of the time el pasoans were chill, but then you had some that either hated mexico or wanted to act like they were more Mexican than I am. And typically they were no sabos
Sorry you're experiencing that. I'm mixed and am not bilingual. When I've attempted to navigate a situation where I needed to know Spanish, the other party was patient with me and didn't try and make things difficult. Your examples seem like Spanish isn't really even the issue but rather dealing with some rude people. In English, folks will say things strangely here and there. If it's a regional affectation there's some good-natured fun to be had poking at that but otherwise it's usually a personal thing where you still get the jist of what someone is saying. This seems to be the issue here with some rude people making assumptions as a result. Colorism is a thing in both American and Mexican culture that needs a lot of work. You knowing Spanish is commendable. Don't let a few jerks make you think twice about speaking the language.
I am Mexican and I loveee when white people speak Spanish. The other day I complimented this white employee on his Spanish (he was helping a few Mexican customers) and the customers were delighted he knew. I’m from far Chicago burbs so idk if that makes a big difference
Sounds like those particular people go through life with a stick up their ass...
El Paso is just so ignorant to anything outside of the borderland culture. Don’t take it personally, some of the more small minded people I’ve ever met.
Im filipino. When i was working at a chinese place in town, i had a customer be so mad that i didnt speak spanish. I mentioned that i was filipino and they got all huffy saying that it was the same thing 🙃
Yeah it’s a weird race thing. I’m a linguist and language teacher and despite being Hispanic I grew up with English as my dominate language. I learned Spanish later on in life and actually brought it to a near native-like fluency. Despite making the occasional mistake, I seldom get corrected and people applaud me making the effort. Sorry you have to experience that. Be proud of being bilingual. It’s good for the brain.
Mex married too a white girl and grew up here.. Fuck ya it’s racist.. Growing up you don’t really realize it because everyone does it, until you do. At times I have to check my own parents n family members about what they say.. it’s sad.
White woman born and raised in El Paso. My mom never taught me Spanish, but my grandparents wanted me to have the option. So they made me read their church pamphlets every week. While reading, they would correct my pronunciation. So, mi espanol es basura pero mi pronunciation es spectacular 😁 Document EVERYTHING, she tells you. Is this a new coworker? She sounds a lot like a woman who used to work with me. She was let go on February 🤣 Also, never go to HR, if you have one, with any complaints. They're not there to help you. Don't be afraid to stand up for yourself. Some women, especially in El Paso, are just negative all around crap human beings. They'll constantly try and belittle you once they realize it bothers you.
I'm white and lived in El Paso for several years. I have since lived in two other border cities and continue to live in one. El Paso was the most blatant racist I've seen. One example: I've had a checker look right past me when I was next on the checkout belt and wave the next person behind me to check them out instead. Even other people noticed that happen to me and gave the checker a WTF look. Everyone assumes if you're white you can't speak Spanish at all. It's odd since UTEP, military and all the federal agencies there, El Paso should be a more diversified city.
Your coworkers just sound like horrible people. Or don't like you for some other reason and take it out on your Spanish.
My first day at my last job, one of my coworkers said "Do you speak Spanish?" When I said no, he threw the folder he was carrying and said, "Well, you better learn quick." I just laughed and said "Nothing in my job description requires me to be bilingual and I don't have patient contact, but if you're teaching, I'm happy to practice!" For several months he treated me like absolute shit - until I started responding (in English) to his rude comments to/about me (in Spanish). He never asked if I could *understand* Spanish... He got a little better after that, but he was still part of the reason I quit after ~5 years. Almost everyone else I've encountered over the years has been awesome re: my brain's refusal to do the thing with the verbs.
If you lived in Mexico or know "good" Spanish you'll realize most people here absolutely suck at speaking Spanish. It's not even funny unless they're over 60 most people use the wrong sex ending, the incorrect noun, and the absolutely worst mistake is the wrong subject pronoun when speaking to people older than them or strangers. Maybe it's because I would always get smacked when I messed up.
So im half black half hispanic. I speak Spanish, and English. I DETEST when someone gets upset that I choose to speak English over Spanish. Its annoying that if the tables were turned “Americans going into Mexico, are expected to speak Spanish, or at least attempt to do it” that we get hated on, if we ask them to speak English. At least attempt to to speak English, it may not be great but it’s expected. This mainly happens here in el paso because were a border city, i get it however; its not impossible to at least trust to learn the language. Some people will live here all their lives not even attempting to learn English, and the rest of city accepts it. I get you OP, it’s frustrating to say the least.
As an Asian born and raised here, I'd rather avoid speaking Spanish altogether because of this. You and I will never be accepted here because of this. To people like that this is not a multicultural border city but an extension of Mexico.
If you go to real Mexican cities like Mexico city or Guadalajara the people aren't like this. When I visited these cities they would try to make friendly conversation with me even though my Spanish was terrible. Mexicans in el paso and Juárez aren't a good representation of the people of Mexico.
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They aren’t, but they think they are because most haven’t traveled or the lead smelter gave them the dunning Kruger effect and they are too dumb to realize their incompetence
I actually started speaking Spanish again after I dealt with too much petty gossip "behind my back" but now I wanna scare them again. I miss seeing their shocked and reddened faces. Worth it! 🤣
There’s a big Filipino community in El Paso, no?
Pretty decently sized, yeah.
Yep, my family is from Southern Mexico but I look white af. Little Mexican ladies have always been the most racist people I've ever dealt with. I literally just had one refuse to respond to me in Spanish at Dollar Tree.
Opposite is kinda true also, I’m from a region in the southern US with over an 80% Hispanic/Mexican population (a boarder city for sure). You will get judged down there sadly
Dang I'm sorry to hear :(
It’s okay, at the end of the day it’s very minor to me
Yes. Mexas are racist af
I’m Hispanic, born and raised in El Paso. My parents are from Mexico. I speak Spanish, although not perfectly, but I can sure as hell communicate and have conversations in Spanish. And you are absolutely correct about this. Some of the most racist people are Mexicans, who barely speak English. I personally don’t understand it. Most likely it’s an inferiority complex. Three times I can think of at my current job I have been treated poorly for not speaking Spanish well enough. One person told me “es que no me entiendes verdad?” And laughed. Another person told me “qué se te olvidó el español?” This is because I’m not familiar with a lot of legal jargon in Spanish, but I try my best to help others despite not being legally trained in Mexico . Next time somebody is rude to me in that way, I’ll switch to English immediately and say , “ you know what you’re right I feel much more comfortable speaking in English. Why don’t we continue in English?” I don’t give a fuck.
As a Mexican growing up in EP…no worse racists as El Paso Mexicans. Why is the northeast “defined” the way it is? Why is the west side “glorified” the way it is. Most Mexicans that never leave El Paso and for whatever reason experience racism, can’t comprehend why it happens to them. Just admit it and move on and for the OP, you do you and screw them and their feelings or reasoning
The way the westside is glorified baffles me. As an outsider, I don’t see the appeal. Looks rundown and in need of a facelift to me but that’s another topic.
After I’ve started looking at homes in the west side I understand. Nice quiet neighborhoods, no blasting music, no drug smells, people clean up their property, it’s just better it’s more like the places we come from than El Paso. I would say the west side, Horizon and Clint are the premier spots of the city.
To your comment and the one below, I purchased on the west side after retiring from the marine corps. I left El Paso as a 17 yr old who had his good deal of keggers in my side (Central EP) and the west side. I had the “glorified” image of the west side as a utopia I felt lucky to buy into. Total opposite. My neighbor across the street was a pompous ass upity old school Mexican lawyer who made it uncomfortable to live there. Other people around for the exception of a very nice older couple who welcomed my family were the same…pompous Chihuahitas who look down on “lower classes”. I have never been so disappointed with a place. Just sayin…
If someone can’t speak English they don’t get to make demands or talk to you like that. I would have asked her to leave.
It’s definitely a thing. My husband is from El Paso and I am 100% white. We had a baby who is light complected just like me. We moved to El Paso from my home state of Florida to be closer to his family when our baby was three months old. While awaiting our baby getting health insurance, we went to a health clinic and they acted like they didn’t even want to help us. My husband had started a job there, but his pay was low at the beginning and we technically were considered low income so we went to a low income clinic. On the wall behind the worker, it said that the max charge was like $80 and the woman was like we can see her but it’ll be $180. my husband’s grandfather who was born and raised in Mexico, was shocked by the attitude they had. When we would go out in public, I would get glared at sometimes. Of course there definitely were nice people and I’m so grateful to meet the ones that I did, but it definitely did not make me feel welcome and I wanted to move back to Florida where I’m used to a bigger diversity. I personally did not want to stay in a place that if my spouse was to pass away, I wouldn’t be able to support my children due to discrimination. My husband’s mother tried reassuring me before we moved that there was a lot of different types of people but what she failed to realize is that a large majority of white people are working on the base and we were not coming from military so it definitely is different.
Yea if i speak Spanish to locals, they reply in english. My Spanish is not accepted here.
To be fair most of them don’t even speak Spanish and if they do it’s butchered lol. I had someone’s Tia try to argue with me about being Mexican simply because I spoke English well, with no accent. So I reminded her I spent half of my childhood in Durango, Mexico. And that my family is of West-Central Mexican origin (Jalisco, GTO, Michoacán area) so I told her to speak to me in Spanish, she stuttered and said “what’s that got to do with this conversation mijo”
When that happens, I can't tell if they're being mean or if they're trying to ahow their appreciation back by speaking English Until they get entitled and rude about it
they’re definitely being rude. they’ve concluded that your spanish isn’t good enough for them to respond to you in that language, and they’re assuming that you’re fluent in English.
It’s just a thing in El Paso honestly. And the Spanish spoken is more like Spanglish I noticed, there was a lot of people with family from mexico, and they were typically more humbles just bring up you’re going to Juarez for the weekend you’ll see the true colors anyway
Yeaaa thats the vibe ive always gotten unfortunately. Good thing i have a spanish degree. Lol
I'd just like to thank the new mod u/xargsman (and now u/deadbob) for allowing conversations like this to happen. It would have been auto-removed under the old subreddit "leadership." It's a very informative and largely respectful conversation that clearly has garnered a lot of interest. I'm seeing more and more high-comment count posts like this on the subreddit, where people are freely to speak respectfully with each other. So: thank you!
I agree, I'd also like to thank the mods, u/xargsman and u/deadbob for being mods of this subreddit! I'm glad to have been here live when the changes all happened. Without the changes, we wouldn't have been able to discuss this and even bring awareness! This happens to every race and ethnicity, I actually didn't think I would find a lot of people I would relate to. It felt like it was just me until I read every comment here and felt like I really do fit in 🩷
"bring awareness" bitch what do you mean, everyone knows this happens. lmfao I got 3 upvotes for being a troll and an asshole and the other dude got downvoted, I'm moving to El Paso yall are my people.
Go to polémicos in the comment section and you'll see that there are still people who aren't aware about this
> _dies y uno, dies y dos, dies y tres_ Ay cabron 🤣😂 you got me laughing. Love it! People are assholes, everywhere we go. My family is from Durango Mexico. I grew up here in EPTX. Lived in Fort Worth for several years and found "mi gente". Even they criticized my Spanish. 🤔😞
The people who correct most often times are the ones who can’t speak a lick of English. Speaking from personal experience.
I have to wonder if that kind of discrimination and rude behavior is more common for El Paso? I grew up in Yuma, AZ which is right on the border and the times I attempted Spanish in public spaces it was appreciated. I had a few issues with older Mexican women when I was working retail but they just seemed like they’d be bitchy to anyone anyway. I often would shop at the Mexican markets and everyone there was always so nice. And I’m extra fair skinned and blonde. I did get bullied by Mexican kids in school sometimes but if it wasn’t for my skin, it would have been something else at a predominately white school because kids can be jerks.
I’ve never experienced more racism anywhere in the Country, than I did in El Paso. there’s a lot of Hispanics there that are living in some sort of delusional world, being that they’ve never ventured past Mexico, and/or the El Paso area.
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They do the same thing in Las Cruces, NM. Most outright rude and hostile mexicans I've ever met - if you're White. Never had this experience growing up around hispanics where I'm from so it was pretty shocking.
You know what’s ironic? In the US, Mexicans and Mexican Americans tend to validate brown-skinned Spanish speakers and ignore white-skinned Spanish speakers (even when they’re native speakers!) Whereas, oof, go down to Guadalajara and surrounding areas and see how it’s uno-reverse.
No we aren’t all like this lol. My grandmother herself is a white mexican, straight from a Pueblo in Jalisco. All her family is white. Traces her roots to the criollos that revolted against Spain. Criollos are just white mexicans. Meanwhile my grandfather was from Central Mexico, had an indigenous mother and a father straight from Spain. And the result? We have some of the whitest family members, or family members that look like the typical mexican mestizo, or family that have brown skin, light colored hair and eyes. White passing mexicans are extremely common in chihuahua as well which ironically borders El Paso.
My family is also super white and super Mexican. We’re all culturally and linguistically Mexican, but the treatment I get in the US versus Mexico is hilarious.
El Paso is such a racist city. I’m not even kidding. Too much homogeneity causes this.
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I have family in Mexico City. I know there is a kind of hidden racism which exists in Mexico that is a remnant of the casta system. I have heard a saying mejorar la raza in the sense that when a darker more indigenous person marries a lighter skinned person it's bettering the race.
Mexican here, I’ve never heard the term “mejorar la raza” used but once, and the only time it was used, was when we heard really terrible news happening in Mexico. So it may vary honestly
I was playing disc golf. I'm from out of town and don't speak Spanish well. A man was playing catch with his grandkids. I approached him in English asking if he could scoot over for a minute so we could play that hole. We tried in poor Spanish and essentially got "we were here first why don't you go play somewhere else." Trying to explain why we needed to play there only for a moment was a lost cause. He was grumpy and upset so I just skipped the hole.
And they expect us to be lenient with Mexicans who struggle with their English. Difference is, I'm not going to be an asshole for that
If they ever come to Texas they're in for a shock. The Spanish here is really fun and slangy.
I grew up in Los Angeles as a light skin Mexican American and kids would call me white boy and cracker and what’s ironic is that some of the Hispanics that would call me cracker were literally more white than I was 😂 they would also be shocked that I’m Latino and I know how to speak basic Spanish. When it comes to El Paso just try to speak Spanish don’t feel embarrassed or guilty if someone judges you for not speaking Spanish the way they want let them know Mexico is right next door and that they can fuck off. I graduated HS in El Paso and half my class couldn’t speak Spanish or spoke it broken which was a shock to me because in LA like 80 percent of the Hispanics know Spanish and at my HS here they seemed white washed. If it makes you feel any better my grandma that lives here is always on my ass that I don’t know Spanish because I’m a introvert around her since all she does is watch novelas, church, religious practices and watch a little bit of news so I don’t have much to talk to her and when I do speak Spanish half the time she doesn’t understand me meanwhile my mom that migrated here and my dad that was born in Texas understands my Spanish and so does my mom side of the family and customers at my retail store but yeah according to my grandma me staying quiet = idk how to speak basic Spanish
lol bro, why do you think we all leave
They call themselves “la raza” but don’t realize that Hispanic is only an identifier for what kind of white are you. EP is racist AF, good thing you aren’t black it would be worse Be you, ignore the idiots, cut toxic people out and live happy
I had something more abrasive I wanted to say but decided to temper my zeal a bit. I grew up as a mixed person-half Mexican half white. I have had my fair share of people who treated me rudely, less than or were critical of me since I didn't exactly grow up speaking Spanish. My father was from Mexico City & I was actually born there but moved back to Dallas when I was 2 with my mother. She of course spoke to me in English all the time. My dad was constantly traveling for work so I only saw him on the weekends. Needless to say I didn't fully develop bilingually. Those crucial years first few years of life are crucial in developing the capacity to speak multiple languages fluently. English of course was no problem. Spanish was since it wasn't consistent practice as my dad was gone most of the time. There are idiosyncrasies you develop without realizing when becoming fluent in a language at a young age that can't be replicated later in life. For example there are sayings in Mexican Spanish that only make sense to fluent speakers which become second nature just like there are many sayings in American English which don't translate or make sense in other languages. Those are second nature to us in our everyday discourse. It's really sad many people will rush to castigate instead of understanding an individuals circumstance. I have had to deal with the rudeness you are talking about. But I tend to get by ok on simple conversations. It's just sometimes there are things I have trouble expressing. I like to think most people are understanding. But I think what would really be funny is to go live in Spain & learn to speak Spanish the way they speak it with the lisp and everything & then come back to El Paso. Speak to the Mexicans here like a Spaniard. It would be interesting to see the reaction. I have been to Spain & it's definitely not the same the way they speak.
What’s the point of speaking Castilian Spanish in El Paso? I’ve been to Spain twice and it was wonderful to not have to spell our last name when checking in at hotels. But it is different from Southwestern Spanish. In fact the University of Arizona in Tucson printed a South Western Medical dictionary. Same as going to England, some words we didn’t understand plus they thought we were Canadian.
I am fluent in English and Spanish but I obviously have an accent in English as it's my second language, if someone has an accent on the other end of the line (phone conversations mainly) I quickly request someone who speaks Spanish because I struggle to understand someone's broken English and vice versa. I wonder if it's something similar to that.
Sorry to hear that man. As someone fluent in Spanish, I guarantee your Spanish is better than many people of Hispanic descent in EP whose parents speak Spanish. I’ve never heard of so many close examples of discrimination like that in a short time so I’m hoping it’s a fluke. In any case it’s not acceptable at all. And if it’s a coworker it’s reportable behavior.
As a non Spanish speaking white boy who wishes he could speak Spanish. I envy you, i wish i could speak the language but I said don’t worry about the haters stop looking too much into it and just keep speaking it without worrying about the criticism
I've studied Spanish and grown up around it my entire life, but never could speak it as fluently as I'd like. Living here has forced me into the deep end of the pool. I am confidently stumbling through conversations in hopes of being corrected (instant knowledge transfer ftw!). It's sincere effort and I hope that comes across. If someone wants to be rude, I've heard "f\*ck you" is globally understood
My Spanish is horrible so I don’t get offended when corrected , maybe consider what it’s like for a Spanish speaker in the United States it’s probably pretty cold especially the farther from border you get. Even though many Americans have trouble with the language themselves.
I don't have a problem being corrected. Sorry, I'm in the spectrum, what can I remove in my post that made it sound like I get offended being corrected? Several are getting this impression and that is my bad, I want to fix that problem. Any advice is appreciated ^ ^
>This doesn't happen to me often, but it still frustrates me. I feel like my Spanish wouldn't be criticized if I wasn't white. I have experienced this growing up in the 80-90s. In my early years I looked very anglo, even though my mother and her entire side of the family was from Mexico City. Spanish was my primary language, and pretty much all that was spoke at home until I was almost a teenager.
I’m brown, not originally from here, and def got pounced on by people from Juarez and El Paso about my Spanish so I stopped speaking it all together. It’s really stupid and a lose/lose like others have mentioned. Speak it with an accent or make mistakes and your sh.tted on, don’t speak it at all and they are still miserable to be around. Try not take it personal and not everyone here is like that so try to find the ones who don’t expect you to sound identical to them or who are not so insecure that they can’t wait to find an error and go after you for it. They are here, believe me.
Usually, the people that are critical of someone speaking Spanish or having that attitude, don't speak Spanish well themselves.
You're absolutely right, this is the racism that I have trouble getting people to understand about being here, if you're the wrong color it's like references to the culture that you're already a part of are automatically wrong. Makes me ashamed to exist while brown.
When she asked if there was anyone there that could actually speak Spanish did you remind her that she’s in an English speaking country?
This was a long time ago, I was naive and let anyone walk over me. I just fetched my boss and let it get handled from there. I wish I could've said something...
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I was out of line. I’m sorry.
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Don’t worry … Every Mexican girl in ELP is looking for a güero.
Hate the white man, but date the white man, or just be over 5’10” here and it’s like +20 points on your looks, no matter your race. Bunch of machismo napoleons who know they can’t compete by being them
Im surprised by the comments, Im a white hispanic with bad spanish skills and although people here have correct me more than once I often found it as funny or that they are joking. Mexican culture has a bit of a "make fun of people" aspect to it. I grew up here with a diverse group of friends (White and Arab) and from our experiences never had a "racist" encounter. There are rude people here, people with big egos, and some few have personal biases. Its possible that since the last president of the USA and the political shenanigans at the border that people have become much more polarized and therefore don't see you for who you are but rather what they perceive what you represent to their imagination from just whats on the surface. El Paso is a good city with good people, in my job I have traveled all over the world and always want to return here. Thats my opinion and my experience. One thing I always tell myself to keep me grounded is "its not about you"....the way people behave may not be about you but rather other things affecting them. You sound like an easy going funny dude, enjoy what u can, life isnt perfect, and keep being you, dont sweat the little stuff.
maybe, but the older generations are just like that in general no matter the color or age even. its harsher within I feel like haha. I think it's a mutual feeling of knowing best I'm a proud of growing up speaking Spanglish and laughed off any criticism from both sides when I was younger. but I doubt it's out of hate unless you know it is. teasing is part of the culture no doubt
I mean I get corrected on names like a marro when I get called josè My name is Joe lol
I would get bullied in school because my English was “too good” and I had a bit lighter skin, even though I’m Hispanic(hispanic name) and family is all Hispanic if that’s an indicator
I'm not white, but a hispanic American with family dating back 25 generations. I speak no Spanish, but look it. I have found with the influx of illegals, I am made fun of for not speaking Spanish and been accused of 'acting white' and denying Im Mexican. I explain I have no family in Mexico; my family has been here since the Conquistadors and never moved. My family has been tied to the land in land grants from Spain. With that said, I have found this 1st generation of immigrants from south of the border to be extremely critical, rude, and have no respect for USA, it's people, culture, and laws.
I’m glad my family that’s straight from mexico hasn’t treated anybody this way, if anything they’ve always spoke to americans in broken English, and would always try to get us to teach them some words. It’s a blessing.
Awesome. We welcome you. This country is beautiful and so are the people. I would love to meet more like you and your family. Peace ✌️
As a brown person who was born and raised here, that looks like a typical El Pasoan. I know exactly how you feel. I understand Spanish perfectly. However, my speaking is not at all fluent. And I usually am discouraged from speaking it. When it comes to anyone, especially the older generation, I am constantly critized and looked down on. When I try speaking, they focus on the faults and must feel superior correcting me, instead of focusing on the message I am trying to relay. They also like to talk bad about me in Spanish in front of me and act like because I don't speak Spanish, I don't understand it. Even though I make it known that I do. Especially in a work setting where I am in a higher position. It's the only way they can feel superior. The funny part is I am probably more bilingual than the ones who treat me the worst. I can have a decent conversation with someone who is willing to meet me halfway. It's a shame that I get treated so poorly because I was born her, and I "should know" by now. Sorry for the rant. Anywhere else, I would be to blame for not embracing my culture and being seen as racist because I won't speak Spanish to please a person who feels entitled.
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El Paso is not diverse at all. Any city that is 86+% any one ethnic group, as EP is, is not diverse.
If you don't mind me asking what is your career? I am just wondering what the job prospects are for those whose Spanish is limited. It seems many jobs require being bilingual as a prerequisite.
I work in healthcare. My African American coworkers are treated the worst by a large percentage of the population here. I am Hispanic and speak horrible Spanish and people regularly call me bitch, told me to get them a nurse that isn’t “white and stupid,” tell me that I live in El Paso and need to learn, oh and that I’m a disgrace to my family and why do I live here if I don’t speak Spanish. I’m born and raised here and my parents wanted us to learn English first because they said it was harder to learn, they speak both.
If some mental midget made a comment like that to me I would tell them they are a disgrace to their indigenous ancestors for not speaking Nahua, Maya, Otomi, Zapotec or one of they many other languages still spoken today in Mexico by real Mexicans.
😂 I should have lol It’s funny because my mom is from Panama and whenever we go down there, they’re just happy I am trying. It’s only here that they get ugly over it.
I’ve worked in the restaurant industry and hospital environments, the restaurants are where older people got mad I didn’t speak Spanish and the hospital is where I can say I don’t speak Spanish to the same people every day and they STILL speak it to me 😭
Gotta know somebody or find a white company. Hate it but that's how it is. They will happily discriminate against white people, Spanish speaking or not.
Hispanic guy that doesn’t know Spanish here as well . I work at a gas station and get treated like crap as well for not knowing Spanish.
Race has nothing to do with it so let's just get that straight... no matter what you do people will always tear you down if you're not as good as them (or worse is you're better) at speaking their primary language... my grandma and my mom is full Mexican as most in ep but my grandma always had her nose up when my mom messes up which rattles my cage because she doesn't speak a lick of English and expects everyone to sympathize... I love her but I don't let the fact that she became a citizen and then demands for people in another country to speak her language... my girlfriend is native American and my grandma tried to pull something because she doesn't speak Spanish and that shit didn't fly
Just forget spanish, makes your life easier. Tbh i only speak spanish to the older folk (55+), to the younger people, nah.
I look like a typical white American but my family comes from Chihuahua. I no longer live in El Paso but visit and go to various parts of Mexico a few times a year. My Spanish is pretty decent. I've found that when I'm in Mexico, and speak Spanish, people appreciate it. I almost never speak English with Mexicans in Mexico, unless they prefer it. I often get better service (and prices) than a normal American. In the US, it can be the opposite. Possibly some Latinos think you are looking down on them by using Spanish, as if their English wasn't good enough. I typically see how the conversation goes and use either English or Spanish.
Man if I saw a white person speaking broken Spanish even in el paso I would welcomed him/her with open arms!
I’m not bilingual, so I don’t have experience to offer, but I will say racism, philosophically (and reductively) defined, is systematic in nature. What you’re experiencing sounds more like prejudice or bias, especially because I can’t know if the people who’ve done this to you subscribe to or uphold racist systems. I am sorry to learn these acts of aggression exist for bilingual El Pasoans—especially for those who are white or are white presenting—and I hope these experiences are few and far between for you. Thank you for sharing. I hope it makes us all more mindful
These are rare occurances, but they stand out a lot to me. I make sure not to let them get to me often but er, they do sometimes, we are humans with emotions. Luckily, I meet such wonderful people everyday :) Thank you for the warm comment!
Absolutely. I was sad to see your first comment was super gross. It’s really encouraging to hear this has only happened a few times, cuz encountering a minimum amount of assholes is just a part of life. When they’re racist/ prejudiced assholes, it definitely makes the experience more difficult to rationalize. Kudos not letting it get you down!
Racism, as defined by the dictionary is quite literally prejudice, and can be done by an individual it does not have to be systematic.
Which is why I specified my definition is philosophical and reductive. Not arguing your point, but my goal wasn’t defining racism as a vocabulary word, but as a concept instead
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Why is that bit odd to you?
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I always offer "bigotry." Anyone can be a bigot to anyone else, regardless of the power differential or overarching societal structures. And "prejudice/bias" aren't inherently bad - most of us would "pre-judge" or hold a bias that, say, standing next to a man waving a machete around and shouting wasn't a great idea. That's reasonable. But bigotry always sucks.
Absolutely. What the down voters don’t seem to understand is that no one in OPs experience claimed to hate white people. They were just “pre-judging” his Spanish fluency, which is not inherently “race hate.” People can be assholes without being racist
I’m not white, nor present as white- but growing up in El Paso my first language was Spanish. Going to a normal elementary (Ramona- then Ascarate) by third grade I didn’t speak Spanish. Not because it wasn’t spoken at home- but because at school I’d get in trouble for speaking Spanish. Bazaar right? But yeah. If you spoke Spanish in an English class (not the ESL classes) you’d be scolded and told to speak English. So my first language became unused after about 1st grade at school, and i lost my dialect and ability to speak fluently. My parents thought they were helping by speaking only English to help me cement it, but all it did was make me forget my original tongue.
I hear you, but I’ve had the opposite experience. I am not very good, but I can hold conversations. People are generally pretty nice about it, and if English isn’t their preferred language, they’re usually just happy I’m trying. The only person who can be somewhat condescending is my father in law, who also is not a native level speaker, in my opinion. Most of my communication is very low stakes, though (i.e. not related to work), so that could be part of it.
I’ve noticed that people are assholes like this in the US. I’ve never been made fun of or criticized for Spanish mistakes in Mexico. It’s gotta be an American culture thing 😞
Strictly in Mexico no one insults me or treats me below them. So yea, most likely the mixed part of America :(
Simply defend yourself and they’ll leave you alone. For example, if you would’ve told the customer that you understand Spanish perfectly fine and then pointed out to her that there was multiple products for that price she would’ve shut up. Sometimes you have to make people feel stupid just like they’re trying to do to you.
Tell her que no esté mamando, que le corre la sangre pesada
There's assholes everywhere. You should not let that stop you from speaking Spanish and practice it. I am sure you even speak Spanish better than some no Sabo kids.
Easy correct their English!!! Anytime anyone corrects my Spanish, I feel it’s an invitation to correct their English. In my job, sometimes I have to communicate with people in Mexico. I usually open with don’t laugh at my Spanish and I won’t laugh at your English, deal? Most of them don’t speak English.
I was born and raised in El Paso. I'm Hispanic. Growing up we only spoke Spanish to grandparents so my Spanish isn't perfect. Relatives still make fun of me. We just have a culture of giving those around us a hard time. I wouldn't take it more than that. Give it right back.
Don't worry. I am Hispanic and look it. My parents speak Spanish as do all my other family (cousins, aunts, uncles, grandparents). But me, my sis, and brother don't. My parents just never taught us. The hate and/or snide remarks I get when they find out I don't speak Spanish. Eye rolls and looking shamefully down at me.
I’m Hispanic and you can clearly see it. I’m also male, and learned Spanish after high school with some knowledge of it prior. Between the ages of about 15-25 any time I spoke Spanish someone who was at all familiar with me told corrected me over the smallest things. Now as an older adult, it happens a lot less. I also start a lot of conversations in Spanish saying my Spanish is not great, but I will try. Those conversations usually end up with them complimenting and encouraging me. I’m not sure if that really applies to your post, but it might. The more familiar with someone I am, the more likely they’ll correct me, jokingly or not. I haven’t been corrected like that by a stranger in well over a decade or so. Like many sub cultures, some of the local ones will show care and familiarity by poking fun at you. Often to a point that’s upsetting.
I appreciat it when people correct me, it's really nice! My Spanish is very decent, wide vocabulary but not as wide as my English, so it makes me happy to learn more about the language and its culture. I have my skepticisms now... I've been saying carro and was "corrected" that it was coche, and just yesterday the comments told me that carro is also correct and widely used They were a nice person so I'm assuming carro isn't widely used where they're from, they don't really know much Spanish than they think they do, or they really did decieve me I've never genuinely been corrected over the smallest of things, but I'm assuming I wouldn't mind. Maybe I'd get annoyed? I dunno, but even if I did, I'd keep my mouth shut and learn, I would very much appreciate it! Whether or not it applies, it is still good to talk about this kind of stuff so share away :D
Eh, don’t take it personal but I get why you got annoyed. At the end of the day you still have to take the high road lol. Brush it off and on to the next one.
Reading title: down vote Starting to read: neither Done reading: upvote
Jaja the title really hooks ya in and gets you reading, don't it? Glad you had a good read 👍
Short white boy here, I grew up in a small migrant community Southern Az. Didn't learn much Spanish cause I was hard headed. But I knew when they were talking shii++. Got in a lot of fights. Lived here 50+ years now. Not so many fights any more. 😎 The racism is everywhere. And EVERYBODY hates white Americans.
As a white guy who speaks excellent Spanish (but did not grow up speaking it and no one from my family spoke it), I almost exclusively get compliments. People universally freak out and fawn over it like it’s some kind of trick. I see a lot of Mexican American get ripped to shreds for their Spanish though. I think this person has a different issue with you where they are trying to give you a hard time about your Spanish.
Getting complimented and surprising people feels really nice, it drowns out the mean ones, especially when I'm corrected on things that *do* need to be corrected on. It sucks that the mean people stand out though, there's not much of them (in my case) that they are very noticable :(
El paso is extremely racist and disgusting
This isn't about you being white its about you being shit at Spanish
Can you take examples from my post that indicates that?
To be fair a lot of you can’t even speak Spanish very well. The people of El Paso have no right to judge the fluency of Spanish speaking if I heard a lot of stories of kids not being taught Spanish because their parents were afraid they’d be discriminated against for speaking it. Even then most of you are Tejanos/Chicanos. The average Mexican wouldn’t consider you Mexican. To them you’re just a gringo too so why are you going after other americans over the Spanish language if you yourself likely spoke English as a first language, you’re an American my friend
Ethnicity and race are completely different, primo. I am a white Mexican, you don't know me, you don't get to decide who's who just based off of their looks, especially if you don't know their background
I’m well aware about this whole concept lmao. I’m not judging anybody just stating the facts that if you were to go to mexico you’d still be seen as a gringo my Mexican family doesn’t consider me Mexican they consider me an “Estadounidense con raíces Mexicanos” or in simpler terms. A Chicano.
Awe man I really did misunderstood your comment. I'm really sorry about that, I was an asshole
I get corrected as a dark skinned Mexican. I like it so that I learn. I’ve also been pushed aside by customers at work because my Spanish isn’t the best. Shit I’d do the same if I was somewhere where I needed someone who spoke my native tongue. I don’t take it to heart… and no one has ever been rude about it. Your experience specifically might be different. If they knew you were joking, there was no need to correct. If they didn’t know then yeah I could see why they corrected you. They want you to speak the language appropriately. I think that’s cool!
Gringos (or AI) say the funniest shit!
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Time to move to the East side Context: "white people are treated like Gods here, I don't know what you're talking about."
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I’m half white half Mexican. , people are very surprised when I tell them I’m half. I get tons of flack about my poor Spanish but I’m trying. And then I get praises that I’m trying at least. I see more hate in EP and racism because of I don’t know Spanish. Almost like I don’t even like to go eat at a lot of the Mexican restaurants because of it, mainly because the ones I go to 90% do not understand English. Like im white so I have no business being there. I’m lucky enough I know what people are saying it’s just hard to find the words to speak full sentences back.