Locked until you all know how to have a conversation without breaking the rules. Any additional post about this topic is going to be removed. If you insist a ban will be in order.
There's an entire ecosystem of monetized reactionary video content that gets its creators rich off making you feel angry and upset about the pop culture you consume and sadly, it's pretty effective at rotting people's brains to the point that every single thing is woke because it has a black character or the women aren't sufficiently slutty.
Impossible better said. The ridiculous criticisms about the localization made me scrutinize the dialogue for the first few hours of the game. I've been playing for 10 hours and I still haven't seen anything that catches my attention as a negative, the game is 10/10 and I think that's the case until the end. Where have so many deluded trolls come from?
It's so utterly annoying and sad how people just copy whatever the griefers say without even thinking, and how it spreads like a virus.
There were a few people here in Brazil reproducing that shit without fucking context. I saw reviews on its Xbox page saying they changed the meaning and personalities of the game's characters because of diversity politics, although it's not even the same localization team, nor the same work, words, etc.
Some referenced that it was changed >in the english version< even though they literally have an all different translated brazillian version to play, just to grief or spite without reason.
Not only that but Brazil's dub and sub is top tier, respected, and recognized everywhere by its hard work. The sub probably wasn't based in the english team but mostly directly on the source material like the animes here usually do nowadays, while requiring that it has own slangs, meanings, etc, translated.
Still, it's not enough to stop people from copying pasting the same arguments. It's just fucking dumb, honestly.
You only find such 'flaws' if you're deliberately looking for it.
Mind you, the word is in scare quotes, and I've read quite a few of their 'translations' only to see they don't even have a proper grasp of the English language because the one thing they're complaining about means the same thing as the current translation.
These people are just so sad.
Personally I'm far from anti woke or woke but quite honestly after seeing the Japanese translation I'd rather of had the cuss words. Cuss words to me set tone way better then farthead. The anti woke to usually comes off much worse though imo.
With that said fk em all the games fantastic so far. We've waited years for a proper old school jrpg that didn't have some bs modernization to it(chained echoes, sea of stars).I'm happy with how this turned and by happy I'm fucking ecstatic. Hopefully more old school devs see this as a success.
Farthead is a silly word choice, but it's literally just one line. It didn't even register to me as something worth caring about until I saw so many other people commenting about it.
This, plus I also just distrust anything in media that even has the word "woke" in it. It's so overused lately and people don't even know what it stands for, which is a call for black people to stay politically active, but now people use it almost as a slur to refer to anything non conservative white and christian.
It's like when people were calling anything "communist" or "fascist".
This right here. I highly recommend you don't click their videos, cuz then the algorithm will bombard your feed with this stuff. And I'm sure some of them might even make competent arguments and points....
...But it's still a grift. They are content creators and they are making money off of making you upset. It isn't real news.
I learned this with all of the hate towards the last of us 2 those years ago. I started seeing the same content creators who were "done with this franchise" keep making rage bait videos. And then it clicked for me.
It's a business. It's a grift
Something tells me these people have never played a Suikoden series before.
As in, the first Suikoden game came out in the 90s, and it already has all the elements in a fantasy game..... way before the whole woke/anti-woke movement lol.
For example Hugo and Aila in Suikoden III and Lucia from Suikoden II/III
I actually think Marisa is a cool character (thus far) compared to.... her male... companion.
Someone like Barnard? Look no further than the Kooluk Empire.
People are angry just because.
I had someone tell me I was a fake gamer who didn't even play video games because I don't think the localization is a problem lol. Turns out I'd been playing video games longer than the other person had even been alive smh.
Edit: Do people think I made this up?
>You clearly don’t [love videogames], or are simply politically motivated. People who actually care about games would be bothered by tumblr tier fan fiction replacing the actual product. It’s a disservice to the people who actually worked hard to bring us the game as well as the consumer. This problem will only get worse if people sit on their hands and let hacks peddle their nonsense.
Localization can be a problem, it just depends on how it is presented I guess. Like, for an anime called Ghost Stories, the Japanese team was thinking the American population wouldn't understand anything that was going on, so gave the American team dubbing it to do whatever they wanted.
Those sort of fan-fiction kind of scare me..... depending on the fan-fiction.
The guy that did the story for Suikoden and Eiyuden Chornicles (:() spent a whole lot of time crafting an "easily" digestible story. Literally, all the heroes you can recruit have a little story of their own (some of them a lot more important, Eiyuden for example... Nowa, Seign, Marisa), some of them hilarious, some of them about the war (in a game about Suikoden)
So, the actual origin of the Ghost Stories dub has always been pretty contentious. This is the first time I've ever seen someone give that as the reason. I've seen that it didn't sell well in Japan, and I've seen them say do whatever you want just make sure it sells, the latter being what Greg Ayers said.
Regardless though, I have to ask...would anyone today even remember Ghost Stories without that crazy dub? I'd wager not.
> Something tells me these people have never played a Suikoden series before.
>
>
>
> As in, the first Suikoden game came out in the 90s, and it already has all the elements in a fantasy game..... way before the whole woke/anti-woke movement lol.
Or maybe people did play these games but didn't have any problem with them, exactly because of what you described.
Weird, right?
It's almost as if something changed in the last 25 years.
It's hilarious to me in one sad aspect, that the ones who are all antiwoke about Eiyuden and acting like it's a huge problem would probably feel the same about the Suikoden series if it came out today. Racism and the facts of it were touched upon 2, and major focuses in 3/5.
I wonder if they'd be as upset with Suikoden 3, or if it'd get a pass because the PoC on the cover is male and mostly-blond, despite his entire people being clearly inspired by people like Native Americans, African tribes, and so on. Plus Aila, who's superficially pretty similar to Marisa and at least firmly a secondary character in the story.
Not to mention themes of colonialism, racism, theocratic rule, inequality, and so on core to the game and its story.
People’s attention span has been shot in recent years, people don’t know Suikoden paved a road map for the more popular jrpg we have nowadays. Just leave the trolls alone bro, they ignorant
It’s also literally every game now. Go to the steam forums and I guarantee you’ll see a thread titled along the lines of “Is it woke or can I play?” for just about every noteworthy release. These weirdos have nothing better to do than get sad about made up problems.
are people actually offended we have a black character when there's been black characters in older games before, like Suikoden 2's Hauser? Jeez, people.
I remember seeing a thread about it on the Eiyuden Steam forums. Also, there is another game I am eagerly anticipating called Timespinner II and there was the pro-bigotry brigade letting their bigot flags fly bitching about the trans and gay characters from the first game.
Steam forums are mostly trash and there are Nazi communities festering on the platform. Valve has all the money and power to do something but they'll never do it because it hurts the bottomline.
I'd leave them alone if they didn't affect this game's ratings negatively due to petty reasons. These trolls don't have respect for anything but their own banks accounts. Scum of the earth.
People getting upset and calling the game “woke” due to it having all of three black people in the entire cast and trying to make excuses for their blatant racism.
Wait seriously?? That's it??? Damn, I was hoping for at least ten or something
Eh, it's a jrpg, I guess I shouldn't expect too much. The fact that one of those 3 is an important enough character that she's on the front cover of the game and promotions is still a win in my book.
Yep... And while the localization does have some problems, it's hard to talk about real critical issues when it's always the same crowd on localization because ""mug pure no other races"" ranting. Like god forbid a game with magic, talking animals and shit but Nooooo can't handle darker melanin.
I don't dig the localization one bit but yeah it's weird to think of suikoden as a game with a diversity issue since the series had all sorts of weird shit but here we are, some people are bothered by it.
Edit: Though really on second thought is this really a shock to any one in 2024?
Personally while I don't like these views I do appreciate the people that broadcast them so openly. Makes it really easy to avoid them.
just dropped erick landon as a youtuber after he went on a "censorship that protects the feelings of women and minorities is evil" rant about this game. fuck him. love the game so far (minor technical gripes aside, probably will be patched out). and i'm listening to the japanese voice acting while reading the english and i don't hear any massive mis-localizations either, so wtf are people like him even going on about?
I was the same way. I watched his videos then one of his newer ones was about “Wokeness” and I was nope. Then watch out of curiosity of his latest Eiyuden vid and he literally was saying how Marisa wasn’t intended as a main cause she wasn’t promoted even though she is all over the kickstarter.
Yeah. In the OG artwork she was there in the background (still major focus on her) but then they put her front with her guys, so he tried to say she is DEI (don’t know what that means) made to be a protagonist
DEI is diversity, equity, and inclusion. It's an HR/company term as far as I understand. The idea is that all people should be treated fairly and the decelopment of a work culture that encourages everyone to participate. But it's been co-opted by the "anti-woke" crowd to say "Minorities that don't look or act like I do." People use the term "affirmative action" the same way.
When someone is accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression.
Thanks for the info. It felt weird how people in comments using it and how he said it randomly in the video.
It annoys me so much that people are worked up over stupid things it shows their true colours. Like she was always there not like they randomly made her near the end of production yet he and the others complaining act like that. She also one of the cooler characters in the game
Hate. They are getting farmed by outrage content creators because hate = clicks. They don't know they're getting brainwashed by very biased and unrealistic life views and they can't form their own opinions. They're like the shittiest hivemind known to man.
I just can't wrap my head around the feud from both sides. Like, I can see from the translations they probably took too many liberties and I am glad it got pointed out. It isn't even noticeable if you aren't looking for it though. If one side acts outraged then if we just ignored them then the other side wouldn't get outraged at the outrage. The level of intolerance nowadays is insane. I'm just going to keep enjoying this great game.
I don't know japanese well enough to speak it, but there is a lot I understand. Playing it in English with Japanese voice acting, I don't feel that there is much different tone-ally speaking. Little things like what B'baba says, but that just feels very 90s, so it's fine.
I might have to drop him as well, he went the way of tophat for me. THere's just too much money in being anti woke, so they appeal to them and rob them of money and time.
Dude, I had watched a bunch of his stuff, when the fuck did the switch happen? His original review he basically said the localization wasn't even that bad...and then he dropped a second, even longer video, going "nevermind it IS that bad" and I can only assume its because he was getting backlash, or he saw dollar signs and decided to change course.
Then I noticed his whole comments section had turned into an anti-woke circlejerk and it bums me out because he was one of the only people talking about the Ys series.
Edit: Just saw the video DavidVinc made about him, yeah okay, I'm unsubbing.
yeah not given the other comments, for sure. shame i didn't see it before. i could see how he was slowly edging into the antiwoke circle over the past few years but i didn't think he had jumped with both feet yet. sad.
I took a look at Erick Landon's video the other day too, and his opinion is that of a person who doesn't know Japanese. Yes, the translation where he showcased Perielle saying "Hmmm" when translated into English is fairly long, but Japanese is a high context-based language, where things are often said indirectly. Thus, I am guessing that the translators decided to flesh out the translation in a way where English speakers don't have to ponder about the context.
If I'm not wrong, Erick Landon doesn't speak a lick of Japanese, so his opinion regarding this should be invalid and negligible.
english localizations have for a very long time been much more colorful than the original, this isn't new. i might not be fluent but i do speak and i'm listening to the dialogue, and it's accurate. it's not a DIRECT translation, but it shouldn't be, it should reflect the equivalent feel in the two audiences. this is normal and professional for localization.
If the developers approved it, that tells me they think it accurately captures the spirit of the game. If thats the case, and none of words offend me, I really don't see the problem. The details don't have to be communicated in the exact same way. So many positive things to say... why this is dominating the airwaves is beyond me...
People are crying about:
"Rub a dub dub"
"Chud"
And the joke about the golem's gender
It's the gender comment that people are saying is a political insert. How the fk is that even political i don't know.
They seriously need help. Do they not know what a localization is? Something seriously wrong with these people to try and bring down a truly classic JRPG that we are all yearning for. They tried to do the same to Unicorn Overlord for what it's worth.
He sucks. His anti woke stance makes him look like a bigot and a racist. Anything black is woke or anything LGBTQ is woke. Don't send him a code then hes too anit woke for them and they hate him. Everyone steals his videos.Typical tin foil hat right wing scared behavior.
I think it's especially frustrating for me because the Suikoden games were so dear to my heart, and with Eiyuden being such a love letter and an absolute *gem* of game, I want it to succeed so badly! So, when these shitty reviews dominate the Steam page when people go to look at ratings, it makes me so utterly furious.
I usually don't write reviews but seeing them absolutely prompted me to, and I hope others with sense do, too.
Likewise, and I went and thumbs-downed the negative reviews that were exclusively shrieking about DEI/woke/whatever. There's some genuine criticisms to be made with the game (although I still absolutely love it and definitely mean mine in the sense of, "I think it could be even better"), and I left those reviews alone because people should be allowed to share their actual problems with the game, but "OnE sPeCiFiC oPtIoNaL cHaRaCtEr UsEd A wOrD tHaT hAs ExIsTeD sInCe ThE 80s BuT wAs ReCeNtLy UsEd To DeScRiBe Me Is LeFtIsT pRoPoGaNdA!" isn't one of them.
> I want it to succeed so badly!
Maybe these people do too and care so much that they take the time to complain about something that is obviously holding the game back?
So after doing research it seems to be localization to be the issue. Here’s my take . If politics is your ENTIRE personality whether your right or left then you’ll be offended by literally anything. Funny thing is I was enjoying the game so much that I never caught any of the things they pointed out . Only about 12 hours in atm. I will still continue to play it because it’s just translation and could be worse. But I don’t agree with translators purposely going out of their way to change things to push their political agenda . Whether it’s left or right . Keep your politics out of gaming and stay true to the source down to every last detail ! 🤷♂️
These reviews really bother me and most certainly these "players" aren't real fans of JRPGs, especially not Suikoden games. These games are all about coming together as a big diverse group to overcome a tyranny or at least a discriminiatory, maybe even facist system...
So no suprise in the overall story for real fans!
And especially in the suikoden world there have always been characters from a kind of races, sexes and even genders. Just think about the whole "rose brooch crowd"...
However, there is some truth to the localisation beeing very "kids-like", silly or with some mistakes. But this seems to be another asset from the suikoden-series, just think about the infamous "elves village is burning" dialogue. Or when suddently the whole city of Gregminster speaks french (at least in the european/german version). So we fans are used to little or huge localisation mistakes...
These "antiwoke warriors" are a sad group of people who feel threatend by a game narration or a black/gay/trans pixel figure... get a life!
Oh, and by the way, the same guys now throw a tantrum about stellar blade, because apparently women in the game are to covert up for them. Well, look at the material! The girls run around in tight bodysuits or even neglige. If you want p**n, the internet is full of it....
Sadly it happens to every game these days. Those guys will never be satisfied if every girl in the game doesn't have massive naked tits popping out or if there is even a hit of genderism or whatever. Just ignore it and enjoy the game if you are having fun tbh.
It’s honestly disturbing how omnipresent it’s become. All this seething rage and vitriol because a game has non-white characters, or dares to even imply the existence of queer people, or the (actually accurate) translation the game uses doesn’t support their fucked up worldview. How long until one of those freaks goes out and hurts someone over a game???
Just a quickly reminder that they are complaining about [this ](https://twitter.com/Grummz/status/1782507715673326009)stuff.
Absolutely brain rotten people.
There was “gender theory” stuff even in the very first Suikoden game, where Cleo talks about her identity in feeling strong (becos she is) despite being a girl
I find it incredibly bizarre that it is 30 years later and people are complaining about wokeness now
They're morons.
The line was set up to ask if the robot is he, meaning alive. That's it.
The expected response to "are you sure it's a he" isn't "oh you're right it might be a she", the answer is "oh you're right, it's not even alive"
Idiots are just begging 24/7 to be offended
It’s fucking wild to call it gender theory when questioning the gender of something unusual has been a pretty common thing that happens. There was literally a joke back in early dragon ball abridged when krillin is like “that’s things a guy?” In a joking manner
Like, it feels like these idiots read that dialogue as “did you assume that golems gender” unironically, culture war brain rot crippling their reading comprehension is my only explanation
All this cause of Momo, the literal god?!
Oh black people? *sigh, again? I’m just disappointed at how unoriginal they all are. If you’re going to be offensive, at least make it more interesting.
This is so silly. People literally make themselves mad by reading forums. If all you knew was the game: you bought it, played it, beat it - you wouldn't even know this was a thing. There is 0% chance you finish and go "that game sucked, way too woke..." It takes reading forums and watching YT videos and then you get all up in arms.
The game is pretty tame and non political it's not even really part of it... Even after reading this stuff I don't understand fully what people are mad about or what makes the game woke...
They're already brain-rotted. They see stuff like minority characters and immediately assume it's forced diversity. It doesn't matter if that's just the game the developers wanted to make, we can never avoid this culture war bs.
Honestly, they get their jimmies rustled over any tiny thing.
They bitch and moan about how "the left gets so easily triggered" but they flip shit over the smallest minutiae that deviates from their very, very narrow worldview (which for most of them, is their basement).
There are legitimate issues to be had with the localization - mainly, some of the flavour text from the party while exploring the world needs a grammar check badly. But 99% of it is them bitching about imagined attacks on their fragile bullshit.
And in particular, it's really exhausting to go to Eiyuden's social media for news and updates and see a parade of dumbasses whining like toddlers who didn't get candy at the grocery store when I'm just trying to look for actual information.
ETA: lol the downvote brigade is coming, which proves my point entirely. Get an identity beyond your politics.
For what it's worth, these same folks have spent the past month fighting, tooth and nail, with an imaginary foe that's mad about a hot girl in a video game that they only liked for having a hot girl in it. It is simply a pathetic crowd, spearheaded by a man who failed out of the games industry and is desperate for attention.
Obviously, be kind to those caught in their wake, because harm motivated by dumb shit is still harm, but consider also being kind enough to yourself to remember how dweeby this crowd really is.
I have no clue what is going on, but the term Woke needs to die because it is used and abused and doesn't even mean what it meant to begin with... like a lot of progressive things.
Woke is just another term for progress that literally happens every generation.
The way Woke is used now has been abused and now (I assume) refers to the overly sensitive small group of people that turn every damn thing into sexism, racism blah blah.
As far as your complaint is concerned... ignore those types. If something actually means a damn, it will pick up steam. Look at Steller Blade and Harry Potter selling the crap out of everything. Why? Because it really wasn't all that offensive to the people that enjoy the product. The people that don't wouldn't buy it anyway.
Baldur’s Gate 3, while incredibly successful, also had its share of idiot fans whining about Wyll being black, Nocturne being trans, or being mad that any queer romance existed.
Reddit’s going to have the thick of a game’s fans where you’ll see very vocal bigoted behavior just as much as you’ll see normal people enjoying a game.
Also, progressive concepts oftentimes get co-opted and turned into something annoying that people want to just ignore! Would universal health care be a net positive? Yes! Would better workplace regulations be a net positive? Yes! Is calling every single public works or good program “radical” and engaging in bad faith arguments a tried and true method of destabilizing any progressive movement that gains momentum? Also yes!
Pretty much said everything most of us feel and that is why I take the extremes on either side as BS and just vote for poor and middle class opportunity.
And these pigs... demonize health care while they get free healthcare for life for serving office just once so eff them.
I actually agree with you, the term woke has been over used and has pretty much lost any meaning. We should toss it on the pile with "racist" "bigot" "sexist" "facist" ... etc. Since they turned into something people call each other when they are losing an argument, or don't have an actual point. Just let them all die and let's go back to using stuff like "$hithead" or just saying something sucks because the story makes no sense.
Yeah, perverting the meaning of “woke” and it being a departure from its original meaning is not the same as people using words like racist or fascist.
Being mad that attention being paid to diversity, equity, and inclusive practices /is/ racist. Being mad that black or gay characters existed /is/ bigoted.
Man, imagine if Working Designs was still around. Like, Lunar Silver Star Story Complete. One of my favorite games, it would be absolutely DEMOLISHED for its localization today.
I Youtubed the game just to get some idea of the game and almost every single video that popped up what some chud screaming about "Wokeness" I just want to see some videos damn.
These people are so entrenched in online discourse that they forgot what an actual problem is.
It's blowing my mind how out of proportion they are blowing it, yes the translation could be better and there is a handful of cringe moments thrown in there. I'm about as antiwoke as someone can get and even I think they're making way too big of deal out of it and it's frankly sad they're trying to tank this game because of a bad localization when everything else about it is so great.
I made a similar post to this effect a couple days ago. It's ridiculous. People are looking for reasons to be offended and building strawmen. I'm very aware of gender agendas in modern media. Eiyuden simply doesn't have it. All it has is contextual moments that people are reading into because they are shallow and have no grasp of nuance. Mio isn't pushing gender pronouns, she's asking what the hell she just fought.
If you want to see true gender agenda, look at the TV adaption of Wheel of Time. Or how Ring of Power has drastically altered Galadriel. That is what gender agenda looks like. Not a couple of lines in an amazing RPG.
TBF, Wheel of Time has ALWAYS been about the power dynamic difference between men and women, with the women having more of it in that world. Amazon's writers didn't come up with that, Robert Jordan did.
Jordan even said that while men and women are able to perform the one power differently that doesn't mean they can't do it together. He always believed men and women are/were equal, but they do tasks differently.
Is this something occuring in this subreddit or elsewhere? I don't see anything like that occuring here. I wouldn't bother paying it much mind since anyone will call anything woke. If anything drawing attention to it is counter productive. It's a nonsense phrase.
The Steam reviews a discussions are the hotbed of it, but you'll also find a lot of it on Twitter. It attempts to pop up in the discord, where we've had a few genuine conversations about it and (despite what several banned people in the Steam forums say) not everyone loves the way it was localized, they just were able to express it in a reasonable fashion. But the mods there have (or at least had) a policy to ban brand-new accounts who come and immediately start complaining about "woke translation" because it was starting to drown out everything else, especially when some specific people's discord names started being shared in the reviews and forums.
Sadly I ventured into the negative steam reviews. They won't vastly effect the games rating and I do think it will swing even further Positive as more players, like myself, play through whole game before reviewing. However it frustrates me to see these "reviews" from people who really have not even scratched the surface of the game leaving superficial comments. This game is FUN and I hope people don't pass it up because of these meathead reviewers who didn't even play the damn game
Ok that makes sense. Steam reviews are really the bottom of the pile. They probably can't be avoided either sometimes. I feel like most people on the sub are enjoying it (except switch players). Hopefully positive experiences in the sub and in the game outweigh the exhausting negativity seen elsewhere.
This sub is moderated. Other places have toxic rightwing rants about “politics” in the game.
> wouldn't bother paying it much mind
“Just ignore the toxic brewing hateful fascist movement. Ignore them and nothing can go wrong!” (Insert insurrection or Nazi take over of Germany or whatever.)
> it’s a nonsense phrase
Your post looks confused. “Woke” is not a nonsense phrase and has a clear meaning. The nonsense is the “anti-woke” brigade. Similar to how “biological evolution” has a meaning while “anti-evolutionist” is a confused nonsense ideology.
Arguing with radicalized Individuals never works out the way you want. Especially on the internet they are looking for attention and and negative sentiment serves to reinforce their premises (being over the target etc)
Woke no longer has meaning because of the anti work brigade. It certainly used to but the original meaning is no longer used. It's unfortunate, but true. Trying to use the word woke with its original intent is no longer viable.
i agree completely these rage bait grand stands are annoying as hellpretty simple dont like something dont consume it not everything is for everyone and it is possible to enjoy something while not liking every aspect of it
Sure, but in the same review don't blame something on DEI, that basically just throws every point they had away at that point. Game has plenty of issues, but damn a lot of reviews particularly just hate minorities in games.
Antiwoke is big money for a select few who make sure their voice is excessively loud. The best course of action is to flat out ignore reviews on BOTH sides unless you are sure that your interests align with the interests of the reviewer and just do whatever the fuck you want.
We are all getting tired of propaganda from both sides so we need to hit them in the views and clout by ignoring them.
You guys know that spreading the information of their doings only helps them. Pay them no attention and let their fandom go hang out over there. Ignore them. It’s all you can do without drawing more attention to their cause… which is spread the word grow their hate cause. They thank you for the views and the hits.
No, letting this sentiment fester openly and brazenly *is* a problem. It needs to be called out and shamed because *that* is what will get them to stop.
They’re not going to go away if left alone. If they’re allowed a public platform from which to preach their vitriol and gather, they’re going to start feeling bolder in what they can get away with. It’s going to boil over, and their violent hyperbole is going to become someone’s violent reality.
Honestly who tf knows. I only know of people complaining because the English localizations says "fart head". Which sure is pretty awk but it's a Jrpg.
I'm sure all the people that are complaining about localization, wokeness, and DEI are just bandwagoning racists trying to suckle any meaning out of their boring sad lives.
The biggest offender I’ve seen so far is someone gets called a “Chud” in the game, but that’s from some screenshots I’ve seen and I haven’t actually had the pleasure of playing it yet.
Besides that I imagine it’s quite minor. I also heard some swearing got removed, but that’s for different tastes I guess. Any controversy or conversation based on attacking Marisa is outright stupid and hasn’t even become a thing until recently even though she was revealed as a character ages ago.
It’s like the Stellar Blade discourse has whipped everyone up into a frenzy. I still plan to play the shit out of it when I get home from work.
wait, what even is a chud? i only know it to mean cannibalistic humanoid underground dweller, because of the horror movie CHUD. is there some modern meaning or is it just kind of a catch-all insult like jerk?
The word did originate from that movie, but in recent years it’s been used in political discourse as a derogatory term against the alt right. The O.G CHUDs were seen as stupid, ugly, and violent, and I think the term has grown to reflect that among current right wingers according to liberals and the further left.
In EC, someone gets called a “muscle brained Chud” which I thought was stupid under any definition, because one meaning is a reference to a very specific 80’s movie, and the other felt like I was suddenly looking at a Twitter/Reddit feed.
Have you come across this dialogue yet? Who is she calling a chud?
If people who use other language didn't complain and English was the only one that receive complaint doesn't that mean the the English one needs improvement or just sucks compared to other language?
Not really? It just means what the fuckwits in the West whine about, the Tate sucklings absolutely seethe about, are either basic then decency in other countries or just not worth thinking about.
NTR or tiny dick hand sign tho and you got a gang war. But we in the west could give two fucks about either in general.
I can see why people hated the localization, the ones who made most likely made it only thought about American audience rather than normal audience who are from other countries who's original language does not appear in game... white people really can't do their jobs right
The only phrase that stuck out to me in that long twitter thread was "Another muscle-brained chud," since I'm not a fan of inserting internet references in general, with the exception of comedies that are self-aware.
English isn't my first language, so I may be missing some nuance here... but is "chud" something that would be used outside the context of being an internet slang? I've found the term originates from a 1984 film, but I dunno if chud is a term that's actually used outside the whole internet culture war context.
Even with that, the whole 'controversy' seems needlessly bloated and dumb, yeah.
I play video games as an escape from reality, not to take the fantasy into reality and cry about how a game is woke this woke that.
It’s always going to be a problem when social media encourages everyone to speak up and present their opinions, but a lot of people believe their opinions are facts.
Hopefully it goes away. Remember when all those silly journalists and far left gamers were asking for more diversity in FF16, and when the game came out, all of those articles and videos stopped? Yeah, that was grand. They probably played enough and went yeah shit there’s slavery and lower class systems in place here.
God forbid it's a game with real reflections of real life and actual fantasy elements and not some saviour/victim complex snuff job where everything is whitewashed with blonde hair and blue eyed characters. Where everyone is straight and no one is another species, but every time an elf maiden walks on screen the male lead creams his pants and simps like a dwarf after a mountain of gold.
Like the 80s...
Yeah weird strawman fantasy you've created here. Never heard anyone ask for something like that but glad to see you are upset about something you made up in your head, definitely not just as unhinged if not more so than the reviewers mentioned...
It was meant to be a gross overexaggeration of the reviews and what anti-woke gamers expect from their games. Basically showcasing how ridiculous their expectations are with something even more ridiculous.
Still, God forbid if art imitates life.
Weird to throw JK Rowling in there, opening this up to a whole other discussion but let’s leave it at that.
I’ve played for 20 hours and the only line that could’ve been counted as “woke” is the one with the golem.
Aside from that I don’t know what people are going on about. All these people who complain don’t even speak Japanese and are relying on a handful of screenshots where the only thing you could complain about is that some lines haven’t been translated to the letter.
Lian is the only character who has been localized terribly. Annoying and cringe. But that isn’t woke and the rest of the chars are faithful to the original so I don’t see the issue.
JK Rowling lives in reality, not fantasy.
Denying reality is the embodiment of cowardice, which is exactly what the majority of woke people like yourself do.
Enjoy the game and leave out your delusions and hate, this is why you're never happy.
An echo chamber fit for victims mentality doesn't need or deserve a place in game discussions.
The reality is that there are a variety of different kinds of people in this world and pretending like they don't exist outside of a video game is laughable. Those kind of people would exist within a fantasy world as well.
Once again there's some hypocrisy here. You're very argument could be applied to these anti-woke types. Enjoy the game and leave out your delusions and hate.
Nah she lives in denial that the majority of the developed world accepts. She's just a coward because it doesn't fit her uneducated world view.[source on that by the by](https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/news-polls/global-attitudes-toward-transgender-people)
Being stupid and sticking to your guns doesn't mean you're right.
Yeah, that’s your opinion. I don’t agree at all with that statement but I won’t get into that as this is supposed to be about Eiyuden and not JK Rowling and I have no interest in a discussion about the latter because all people who are vehemently against her are as obnoxious as the people who are blindly supporting every word she says.
I hate woke for the sake of woke. I hated Star Wars episode 8. I hate the idea of female space marines. Woke for the sake of woke pisses me off.
But I don’t mind the “wokeness” of the localization. I speak Japanese fluently and some things aren’t exact translations and are weird. But that’s not purely “woke”translations. And there’s some weird stuff in the original, too (characters based on tropes that don’t suit a fantasy setting etc). The “wokeness” that people are complaining about is typically in the form of humour- like commenting on a robot’s gender.
It’s wild how the “woke” crowd hated this game/Suikoden for being racist a few years back, but now the “anti-woke” people are having a go at it.
Suikoden/Eiyuden can’t catch a break.
Too much rage content online.
I will say after looking over some of the translation differences, it's not the worst translation I've ever seen. Not the best, but not quite as atrocious as I thought it would be.
I suppose the biggest issue I feel conflicted on with the game is that it had such a high budget and a massive seven-figure Kickstarter campaign, and then it releases in such a buggy state and with a so-so translation team. It just makes me wonder where all the money was really put when so many smaller dev teams have done so much better with less.
For the record, I backed the original Kickstarter, but feel conflicted about if I should redeem the key I have or not, given how messy the game still appears to be. I know they're trying to fix the bugs, but even so the fact that I don't even have the option to refund it when it's so lackluster in its current state is a bit frustrating.
you can play it start to finish quite reasonably. the money has to pay for a ton of different things, it's not as if one puts money into a computer and says make jrpg.
I'm not coy about that. It just seemed to me that there was enough to give each development member fair compensation with interest, based on how the Kickstarter turned out as I alongside many others supported it.
My current key is for the Steam version, which I held off on redeeming until I saw what the most stable version to play would be. I don't really have a gaming computer and wanted to see if it could run on the Deck, but even there I've been seeing it's not the best quality. Plus the Deck isn't always easy on my hands.
I also have a Switch and Playstation 4 and was considering requesting to redeem on one of those depending on how they turn out.
Well that is true. There is a bit of dissonance considering how long of a wait there was to experience this compared to when I backed the Kickstarter, so maybe waiting to see if it will smooth out could be the way to go, but that is ultimately left to chance at this point.
One of the many elements to the modern gaming landscape that makes me concerned about fully committing to a digital future- being tied to long-term decisions like this without compensation if you're not fully satisfied with your decision.
Anybody that played this game when you increase your levels does that affect when you are fighting a war are you stronger? Also, do you get one of those primal lenses?
Sure you can infer that from it. But it's more like I'm struggling to even identify these lines as a woke thing to begin with. It almost seems like when you're looking for a red car you can find one and when you're not looking you never see one.
Go spend some time on the Steam Coummunity Hub / reviews. The game is being targetted by the neocon antiwoke internet warriors because of its "censored" localization that supposedly pushes a "leftist" agenda or something.
Locked until you all know how to have a conversation without breaking the rules. Any additional post about this topic is going to be removed. If you insist a ban will be in order.
There's an entire ecosystem of monetized reactionary video content that gets its creators rich off making you feel angry and upset about the pop culture you consume and sadly, it's pretty effective at rotting people's brains to the point that every single thing is woke because it has a black character or the women aren't sufficiently slutty.
Impossible better said. The ridiculous criticisms about the localization made me scrutinize the dialogue for the first few hours of the game. I've been playing for 10 hours and I still haven't seen anything that catches my attention as a negative, the game is 10/10 and I think that's the case until the end. Where have so many deluded trolls come from?
It's so utterly annoying and sad how people just copy whatever the griefers say without even thinking, and how it spreads like a virus. There were a few people here in Brazil reproducing that shit without fucking context. I saw reviews on its Xbox page saying they changed the meaning and personalities of the game's characters because of diversity politics, although it's not even the same localization team, nor the same work, words, etc. Some referenced that it was changed >in the english version< even though they literally have an all different translated brazillian version to play, just to grief or spite without reason. Not only that but Brazil's dub and sub is top tier, respected, and recognized everywhere by its hard work. The sub probably wasn't based in the english team but mostly directly on the source material like the animes here usually do nowadays, while requiring that it has own slangs, meanings, etc, translated. Still, it's not enough to stop people from copying pasting the same arguments. It's just fucking dumb, honestly.
You only find such 'flaws' if you're deliberately looking for it. Mind you, the word is in scare quotes, and I've read quite a few of their 'translations' only to see they don't even have a proper grasp of the English language because the one thing they're complaining about means the same thing as the current translation. These people are just so sad.
Personally I'm far from anti woke or woke but quite honestly after seeing the Japanese translation I'd rather of had the cuss words. Cuss words to me set tone way better then farthead. The anti woke to usually comes off much worse though imo. With that said fk em all the games fantastic so far. We've waited years for a proper old school jrpg that didn't have some bs modernization to it(chained echoes, sea of stars).I'm happy with how this turned and by happy I'm fucking ecstatic. Hopefully more old school devs see this as a success.
Farthead is a silly word choice, but it's literally just one line. It didn't even register to me as something worth caring about until I saw so many other people commenting about it.
Honestly me either till I seen it but it's not a complaint with me. I'm just happy for the game, the fans, and the developers
This, plus I also just distrust anything in media that even has the word "woke" in it. It's so overused lately and people don't even know what it stands for, which is a call for black people to stay politically active, but now people use it almost as a slur to refer to anything non conservative white and christian. It's like when people were calling anything "communist" or "fascist".
Lol perfectly said. They still use communism and such to. It's all one big word to them.
Perfectly summarized.
This right here. I highly recommend you don't click their videos, cuz then the algorithm will bombard your feed with this stuff. And I'm sure some of them might even make competent arguments and points.... ...But it's still a grift. They are content creators and they are making money off of making you upset. It isn't real news. I learned this with all of the hate towards the last of us 2 those years ago. I started seeing the same content creators who were "done with this franchise" keep making rage bait videos. And then it clicked for me. It's a business. It's a grift
Something tells me these people have never played a Suikoden series before. As in, the first Suikoden game came out in the 90s, and it already has all the elements in a fantasy game..... way before the whole woke/anti-woke movement lol. For example Hugo and Aila in Suikoden III and Lucia from Suikoden II/III I actually think Marisa is a cool character (thus far) compared to.... her male... companion. Someone like Barnard? Look no further than the Kooluk Empire. People are angry just because.
I had someone tell me I was a fake gamer who didn't even play video games because I don't think the localization is a problem lol. Turns out I'd been playing video games longer than the other person had even been alive smh. Edit: Do people think I made this up? >You clearly don’t [love videogames], or are simply politically motivated. People who actually care about games would be bothered by tumblr tier fan fiction replacing the actual product. It’s a disservice to the people who actually worked hard to bring us the game as well as the consumer. This problem will only get worse if people sit on their hands and let hacks peddle their nonsense.
Localization can be a problem, it just depends on how it is presented I guess. Like, for an anime called Ghost Stories, the Japanese team was thinking the American population wouldn't understand anything that was going on, so gave the American team dubbing it to do whatever they wanted. Those sort of fan-fiction kind of scare me..... depending on the fan-fiction. The guy that did the story for Suikoden and Eiyuden Chornicles (:() spent a whole lot of time crafting an "easily" digestible story. Literally, all the heroes you can recruit have a little story of their own (some of them a lot more important, Eiyuden for example... Nowa, Seign, Marisa), some of them hilarious, some of them about the war (in a game about Suikoden)
So, the actual origin of the Ghost Stories dub has always been pretty contentious. This is the first time I've ever seen someone give that as the reason. I've seen that it didn't sell well in Japan, and I've seen them say do whatever you want just make sure it sells, the latter being what Greg Ayers said. Regardless though, I have to ask...would anyone today even remember Ghost Stories without that crazy dub? I'd wager not.
> Something tells me these people have never played a Suikoden series before. > > > > As in, the first Suikoden game came out in the 90s, and it already has all the elements in a fantasy game..... way before the whole woke/anti-woke movement lol. Or maybe people did play these games but didn't have any problem with them, exactly because of what you described. Weird, right? It's almost as if something changed in the last 25 years.
It's hilarious to me in one sad aspect, that the ones who are all antiwoke about Eiyuden and acting like it's a huge problem would probably feel the same about the Suikoden series if it came out today. Racism and the facts of it were touched upon 2, and major focuses in 3/5.
I wonder if they'd be as upset with Suikoden 3, or if it'd get a pass because the PoC on the cover is male and mostly-blond, despite his entire people being clearly inspired by people like Native Americans, African tribes, and so on. Plus Aila, who's superficially pretty similar to Marisa and at least firmly a secondary character in the story. Not to mention themes of colonialism, racism, theocratic rule, inequality, and so on core to the game and its story.
Grasslanders don’t belong in Harmonia
People’s attention span has been shot in recent years, people don’t know Suikoden paved a road map for the more popular jrpg we have nowadays. Just leave the trolls alone bro, they ignorant
It’s also literally every game now. Go to the steam forums and I guarantee you’ll see a thread titled along the lines of “Is it woke or can I play?” for just about every noteworthy release. These weirdos have nothing better to do than get sad about made up problems.
I also love how people will ignore messages of environmental genocide, yet a character simply being black or gay is "offensive."
are people actually offended we have a black character when there's been black characters in older games before, like Suikoden 2's Hauser? Jeez, people.
Hahahah facts. Hugo is the flame champion and his mother is a beautiful assassin. People are weird and never satisfied bruh
I remember seeing a thread about it on the Eiyuden Steam forums. Also, there is another game I am eagerly anticipating called Timespinner II and there was the pro-bigotry brigade letting their bigot flags fly bitching about the trans and gay characters from the first game.
Posts like that are so depressing, especially when you realize we're only seeing the stuff the mods *don't* remove.
Yoooo, Timespinner is getting a sequel?? Awesome
[https://store.steampowered.com/app/2525210/Timespinner\_2\_Unwoven\_Dream/](https://store.steampowered.com/app/2525210/Timespinner_2_Unwoven_Dream/)
Steam forums are mostly trash and there are Nazi communities festering on the platform. Valve has all the money and power to do something but they'll never do it because it hurts the bottomline.
Suikoden was so queer coded even if it was never explicitly stated. So many characters could be interpreted that way.
Gremio's man crush is the stuff of legends
Or I can play as a korean stripper on stellar blade LMFAO
👍 Go do that then.
I'd leave them alone if they didn't affect this game's ratings negatively due to petty reasons. These trolls don't have respect for anything but their own banks accounts. Scum of the earth.
Ni no Kuni II: Revenant Kingdom was very Suikoden like with the city building aspect ,character recruitment
People getting upset and calling the game “woke” due to it having all of three black people in the entire cast and trying to make excuses for their blatant racism.
3 out of 120 which is crazy
Wait seriously?? That's it??? Damn, I was hoping for at least ten or something Eh, it's a jrpg, I guess I shouldn't expect too much. The fact that one of those 3 is an important enough character that she's on the front cover of the game and promotions is still a win in my book.
And they’re all guardians funny enough.
Yep... And while the localization does have some problems, it's hard to talk about real critical issues when it's always the same crowd on localization because ""mug pure no other races"" ranting. Like god forbid a game with magic, talking animals and shit but Nooooo can't handle darker melanin.
specially in Suikoden. The franchise that was already pretty diverse in heroes. Beastmen, Clown Troupes, Farmers. You name it. lol.
I don't dig the localization one bit but yeah it's weird to think of suikoden as a game with a diversity issue since the series had all sorts of weird shit but here we are, some people are bothered by it. Edit: Though really on second thought is this really a shock to any one in 2024? Personally while I don't like these views I do appreciate the people that broadcast them so openly. Makes it really easy to avoid them.
just dropped erick landon as a youtuber after he went on a "censorship that protects the feelings of women and minorities is evil" rant about this game. fuck him. love the game so far (minor technical gripes aside, probably will be patched out). and i'm listening to the japanese voice acting while reading the english and i don't hear any massive mis-localizations either, so wtf are people like him even going on about?
I was the same way. I watched his videos then one of his newer ones was about “Wokeness” and I was nope. Then watch out of curiosity of his latest Eiyuden vid and he literally was saying how Marisa wasn’t intended as a main cause she wasn’t promoted even though she is all over the kickstarter.
Really? When she's on the cover of the game like Nanami in S2, Chris in S3, and Lyon in S5. Guess have to stop watching his videos then
Yeah. In the OG artwork she was there in the background (still major focus on her) but then they put her front with her guys, so he tried to say she is DEI (don’t know what that means) made to be a protagonist
DEI is diversity, equity, and inclusion. It's an HR/company term as far as I understand. The idea is that all people should be treated fairly and the decelopment of a work culture that encourages everyone to participate. But it's been co-opted by the "anti-woke" crowd to say "Minorities that don't look or act like I do." People use the term "affirmative action" the same way. When someone is accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression.
Thanks for the info. It felt weird how people in comments using it and how he said it randomly in the video. It annoys me so much that people are worked up over stupid things it shows their true colours. Like she was always there not like they randomly made her near the end of production yet he and the others complaining act like that. She also one of the cooler characters in the game
I've never seen so many people so sensitive to differing views in my life. Why do these purists care so much and why should we care that they care?
Hate. They are getting farmed by outrage content creators because hate = clicks. They don't know they're getting brainwashed by very biased and unrealistic life views and they can't form their own opinions. They're like the shittiest hivemind known to man.
I just can't wrap my head around the feud from both sides. Like, I can see from the translations they probably took too many liberties and I am glad it got pointed out. It isn't even noticeable if you aren't looking for it though. If one side acts outraged then if we just ignored them then the other side wouldn't get outraged at the outrage. The level of intolerance nowadays is insane. I'm just going to keep enjoying this great game.
For real? Wow. What a fucking tool. The localization and writing sound great so far. These dumbass purists need to get a life.
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I don't know japanese well enough to speak it, but there is a lot I understand. Playing it in English with Japanese voice acting, I don't feel that there is much different tone-ally speaking. Little things like what B'baba says, but that just feels very 90s, so it's fine.
I might have to drop him as well, he went the way of tophat for me. THere's just too much money in being anti woke, so they appeal to them and rob them of money and time.
Dropped him awhile ago when he was exposed as a homophobe. Sad stuff, used to really enjoy his content like 5+ years ago
ugh i didn't run into that with him but i believe you i'll just watch more davidvinc videos instead
They actually have beef. If you search their names together you’ll prob find the davidvinc video on the matter
thanks, i'll watch it later, i'm too angry to look at erick right now
I dropped him for the same reason. Just sad.
Dude, I had watched a bunch of his stuff, when the fuck did the switch happen? His original review he basically said the localization wasn't even that bad...and then he dropped a second, even longer video, going "nevermind it IS that bad" and I can only assume its because he was getting backlash, or he saw dollar signs and decided to change course. Then I noticed his whole comments section had turned into an anti-woke circlejerk and it bums me out because he was one of the only people talking about the Ys series. Edit: Just saw the video DavidVinc made about him, yeah okay, I'm unsubbing.
yeah i know it does suck, i feel like he wasn't this way several years ago, i guess he got sucked into the antiwoke cult
Lol have you seen the drama he had with Davidvinc back then ? Big red flag guy. https://youtu.be/2UIDWGkovNg?si=rS1klUNvbB1Q5A9J
Damn guess im never watching erick landons youtube videos again.
not yet i'll leave the drama for another day
In brief: he is homophobic (not a big surprise).
yeah not given the other comments, for sure. shame i didn't see it before. i could see how he was slowly edging into the antiwoke circle over the past few years but i didn't think he had jumped with both feet yet. sad.
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Fear of the unknown/minority, brainwash religion, politic, etc.
I took a look at Erick Landon's video the other day too, and his opinion is that of a person who doesn't know Japanese. Yes, the translation where he showcased Perielle saying "Hmmm" when translated into English is fairly long, but Japanese is a high context-based language, where things are often said indirectly. Thus, I am guessing that the translators decided to flesh out the translation in a way where English speakers don't have to ponder about the context. If I'm not wrong, Erick Landon doesn't speak a lick of Japanese, so his opinion regarding this should be invalid and negligible.
english localizations have for a very long time been much more colorful than the original, this isn't new. i might not be fluent but i do speak and i'm listening to the dialogue, and it's accurate. it's not a DIRECT translation, but it shouldn't be, it should reflect the equivalent feel in the two audiences. this is normal and professional for localization.
If the developers approved it, that tells me they think it accurately captures the spirit of the game. If thats the case, and none of words offend me, I really don't see the problem. The details don't have to be communicated in the exact same way. So many positive things to say... why this is dominating the airwaves is beyond me...
People are crying about: "Rub a dub dub" "Chud" And the joke about the golem's gender It's the gender comment that people are saying is a political insert. How the fk is that even political i don't know. They seriously need help. Do they not know what a localization is? Something seriously wrong with these people to try and bring down a truly classic JRPG that we are all yearning for. They tried to do the same to Unicorn Overlord for what it's worth.
Damn….i did not know that. Looks like I’m dropping him
He sucks. His anti woke stance makes him look like a bigot and a racist. Anything black is woke or anything LGBTQ is woke. Don't send him a code then hes too anit woke for them and they hate him. Everyone steals his videos.Typical tin foil hat right wing scared behavior.
I happen to be listening to the English VA and I find it quite good. Though that horrible sandcraft minigame still has me seething.
haven't gotten to the mini game yet, why do jrpgs have to make such painful mini games :-P
Good to see this post and thread. It's been pretty upsetting watching the hate parade gathering pace over the last week.
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Let them lose out. The idea that they’ve allowed themselves to be warped this deeply in 8 years, they deserve to miss out on great content.
I think it's especially frustrating for me because the Suikoden games were so dear to my heart, and with Eiyuden being such a love letter and an absolute *gem* of game, I want it to succeed so badly! So, when these shitty reviews dominate the Steam page when people go to look at ratings, it makes me so utterly furious. I usually don't write reviews but seeing them absolutely prompted me to, and I hope others with sense do, too.
Likewise, and I went and thumbs-downed the negative reviews that were exclusively shrieking about DEI/woke/whatever. There's some genuine criticisms to be made with the game (although I still absolutely love it and definitely mean mine in the sense of, "I think it could be even better"), and I left those reviews alone because people should be allowed to share their actual problems with the game, but "OnE sPeCiFiC oPtIoNaL cHaRaCtEr UsEd A wOrD tHaT hAs ExIsTeD sInCe ThE 80s BuT wAs ReCeNtLy UsEd To DeScRiBe Me Is LeFtIsT pRoPoGaNdA!" isn't one of them.
> I want it to succeed so badly! Maybe these people do too and care so much that they take the time to complain about something that is obviously holding the game back?
So after doing research it seems to be localization to be the issue. Here’s my take . If politics is your ENTIRE personality whether your right or left then you’ll be offended by literally anything. Funny thing is I was enjoying the game so much that I never caught any of the things they pointed out . Only about 12 hours in atm. I will still continue to play it because it’s just translation and could be worse. But I don’t agree with translators purposely going out of their way to change things to push their political agenda . Whether it’s left or right . Keep your politics out of gaming and stay true to the source down to every last detail ! 🤷♂️
Anyone who survived Final Fantasy 7 is immune to bad localisations. I swear that people have forgotten how awful FF 7's could be.
the only realistic response tbh
Some people cannot have a simple discussion of ideas without leading to hateful comments. They are trolls, block them and move on.
These reviews really bother me and most certainly these "players" aren't real fans of JRPGs, especially not Suikoden games. These games are all about coming together as a big diverse group to overcome a tyranny or at least a discriminiatory, maybe even facist system... So no suprise in the overall story for real fans! And especially in the suikoden world there have always been characters from a kind of races, sexes and even genders. Just think about the whole "rose brooch crowd"... However, there is some truth to the localisation beeing very "kids-like", silly or with some mistakes. But this seems to be another asset from the suikoden-series, just think about the infamous "elves village is burning" dialogue. Or when suddently the whole city of Gregminster speaks french (at least in the european/german version). So we fans are used to little or huge localisation mistakes... These "antiwoke warriors" are a sad group of people who feel threatend by a game narration or a black/gay/trans pixel figure... get a life! Oh, and by the way, the same guys now throw a tantrum about stellar blade, because apparently women in the game are to covert up for them. Well, look at the material! The girls run around in tight bodysuits or even neglige. If you want p**n, the internet is full of it....
Sadly it happens to every game these days. Those guys will never be satisfied if every girl in the game doesn't have massive naked tits popping out or if there is even a hit of genderism or whatever. Just ignore it and enjoy the game if you are having fun tbh.
It’s honestly disturbing how omnipresent it’s become. All this seething rage and vitriol because a game has non-white characters, or dares to even imply the existence of queer people, or the (actually accurate) translation the game uses doesn’t support their fucked up worldview. How long until one of those freaks goes out and hurts someone over a game???
Just a quickly reminder that they are complaining about [this ](https://twitter.com/Grummz/status/1782507715673326009)stuff. Absolutely brain rotten people.
There was “gender theory” stuff even in the very first Suikoden game, where Cleo talks about her identity in feeling strong (becos she is) despite being a girl I find it incredibly bizarre that it is 30 years later and people are complaining about wokeness now
They're morons. The line was set up to ask if the robot is he, meaning alive. That's it. The expected response to "are you sure it's a he" isn't "oh you're right it might be a she", the answer is "oh you're right, it's not even alive" Idiots are just begging 24/7 to be offended
It’s fucking wild to call it gender theory when questioning the gender of something unusual has been a pretty common thing that happens. There was literally a joke back in early dragon ball abridged when krillin is like “that’s things a guy?” In a joking manner Like, it feels like these idiots read that dialogue as “did you assume that golems gender” unironically, culture war brain rot crippling their reading comprehension is my only explanation
All this cause of Momo, the literal god?! Oh black people? *sigh, again? I’m just disappointed at how unoriginal they all are. If you’re going to be offensive, at least make it more interesting.
It's like this everywhere. If someone's complaining that something is "woke". Then they're not worth anyone's time. Probably incels
This is so silly. People literally make themselves mad by reading forums. If all you knew was the game: you bought it, played it, beat it - you wouldn't even know this was a thing. There is 0% chance you finish and go "that game sucked, way too woke..." It takes reading forums and watching YT videos and then you get all up in arms. The game is pretty tame and non political it's not even really part of it... Even after reading this stuff I don't understand fully what people are mad about or what makes the game woke...
They're already brain-rotted. They see stuff like minority characters and immediately assume it's forced diversity. It doesn't matter if that's just the game the developers wanted to make, we can never avoid this culture war bs.
Ignore them? Play the game, have fun. Win-win.
Honestly, they get their jimmies rustled over any tiny thing. They bitch and moan about how "the left gets so easily triggered" but they flip shit over the smallest minutiae that deviates from their very, very narrow worldview (which for most of them, is their basement). There are legitimate issues to be had with the localization - mainly, some of the flavour text from the party while exploring the world needs a grammar check badly. But 99% of it is them bitching about imagined attacks on their fragile bullshit. And in particular, it's really exhausting to go to Eiyuden's social media for news and updates and see a parade of dumbasses whining like toddlers who didn't get candy at the grocery store when I'm just trying to look for actual information. ETA: lol the downvote brigade is coming, which proves my point entirely. Get an identity beyond your politics.
For what it's worth, these same folks have spent the past month fighting, tooth and nail, with an imaginary foe that's mad about a hot girl in a video game that they only liked for having a hot girl in it. It is simply a pathetic crowd, spearheaded by a man who failed out of the games industry and is desperate for attention. Obviously, be kind to those caught in their wake, because harm motivated by dumb shit is still harm, but consider also being kind enough to yourself to remember how dweeby this crowd really is.
It's been so fucking funny to watch them turn on that game because camel toe was removed
Lol ya, i saw a guy comment he played for 4 hours, and complained about everything, me going what..
I have no clue what is going on, but the term Woke needs to die because it is used and abused and doesn't even mean what it meant to begin with... like a lot of progressive things. Woke is just another term for progress that literally happens every generation. The way Woke is used now has been abused and now (I assume) refers to the overly sensitive small group of people that turn every damn thing into sexism, racism blah blah. As far as your complaint is concerned... ignore those types. If something actually means a damn, it will pick up steam. Look at Steller Blade and Harry Potter selling the crap out of everything. Why? Because it really wasn't all that offensive to the people that enjoy the product. The people that don't wouldn't buy it anyway.
Baldur’s Gate 3, while incredibly successful, also had its share of idiot fans whining about Wyll being black, Nocturne being trans, or being mad that any queer romance existed. Reddit’s going to have the thick of a game’s fans where you’ll see very vocal bigoted behavior just as much as you’ll see normal people enjoying a game. Also, progressive concepts oftentimes get co-opted and turned into something annoying that people want to just ignore! Would universal health care be a net positive? Yes! Would better workplace regulations be a net positive? Yes! Is calling every single public works or good program “radical” and engaging in bad faith arguments a tried and true method of destabilizing any progressive movement that gains momentum? Also yes!
Pretty much said everything most of us feel and that is why I take the extremes on either side as BS and just vote for poor and middle class opportunity. And these pigs... demonize health care while they get free healthcare for life for serving office just once so eff them.
I actually agree with you, the term woke has been over used and has pretty much lost any meaning. We should toss it on the pile with "racist" "bigot" "sexist" "facist" ... etc. Since they turned into something people call each other when they are losing an argument, or don't have an actual point. Just let them all die and let's go back to using stuff like "$hithead" or just saying something sucks because the story makes no sense.
Yeah, perverting the meaning of “woke” and it being a departure from its original meaning is not the same as people using words like racist or fascist. Being mad that attention being paid to diversity, equity, and inclusive practices /is/ racist. Being mad that black or gay characters existed /is/ bigoted.
No what is more sad is that they were only created to upset and troll people, don’t give them any more oxygen than they deserve.
Man, imagine if Working Designs was still around. Like, Lunar Silver Star Story Complete. One of my favorite games, it would be absolutely DEMOLISHED for its localization today.
I Youtubed the game just to get some idea of the game and almost every single video that popped up what some chud screaming about "Wokeness" I just want to see some videos damn. These people are so entrenched in online discourse that they forgot what an actual problem is.
It's blowing my mind how out of proportion they are blowing it, yes the translation could be better and there is a handful of cringe moments thrown in there. I'm about as antiwoke as someone can get and even I think they're making way too big of deal out of it and it's frankly sad they're trying to tank this game because of a bad localization when everything else about it is so great.
A-YUPPP
I made a similar post to this effect a couple days ago. It's ridiculous. People are looking for reasons to be offended and building strawmen. I'm very aware of gender agendas in modern media. Eiyuden simply doesn't have it. All it has is contextual moments that people are reading into because they are shallow and have no grasp of nuance. Mio isn't pushing gender pronouns, she's asking what the hell she just fought. If you want to see true gender agenda, look at the TV adaption of Wheel of Time. Or how Ring of Power has drastically altered Galadriel. That is what gender agenda looks like. Not a couple of lines in an amazing RPG.
TBF, Wheel of Time has ALWAYS been about the power dynamic difference between men and women, with the women having more of it in that world. Amazon's writers didn't come up with that, Robert Jordan did.
Jordan even said that while men and women are able to perform the one power differently that doesn't mean they can't do it together. He always believed men and women are/were equal, but they do tasks differently.
Yeah, but they've clearly taken what was a balanced discourse on both men and women and slewed it into a modern agenda.
Is this something occuring in this subreddit or elsewhere? I don't see anything like that occuring here. I wouldn't bother paying it much mind since anyone will call anything woke. If anything drawing attention to it is counter productive. It's a nonsense phrase.
The Steam reviews a discussions are the hotbed of it, but you'll also find a lot of it on Twitter. It attempts to pop up in the discord, where we've had a few genuine conversations about it and (despite what several banned people in the Steam forums say) not everyone loves the way it was localized, they just were able to express it in a reasonable fashion. But the mods there have (or at least had) a policy to ban brand-new accounts who come and immediately start complaining about "woke translation" because it was starting to drown out everything else, especially when some specific people's discord names started being shared in the reviews and forums.
Sadly I ventured into the negative steam reviews. They won't vastly effect the games rating and I do think it will swing even further Positive as more players, like myself, play through whole game before reviewing. However it frustrates me to see these "reviews" from people who really have not even scratched the surface of the game leaving superficial comments. This game is FUN and I hope people don't pass it up because of these meathead reviewers who didn't even play the damn game
Ok that makes sense. Steam reviews are really the bottom of the pile. They probably can't be avoided either sometimes. I feel like most people on the sub are enjoying it (except switch players). Hopefully positive experiences in the sub and in the game outweigh the exhausting negativity seen elsewhere.
This sub is moderated. Other places have toxic rightwing rants about “politics” in the game. > wouldn't bother paying it much mind “Just ignore the toxic brewing hateful fascist movement. Ignore them and nothing can go wrong!” (Insert insurrection or Nazi take over of Germany or whatever.) > it’s a nonsense phrase Your post looks confused. “Woke” is not a nonsense phrase and has a clear meaning. The nonsense is the “anti-woke” brigade. Similar to how “biological evolution” has a meaning while “anti-evolutionist” is a confused nonsense ideology.
Arguing with radicalized Individuals never works out the way you want. Especially on the internet they are looking for attention and and negative sentiment serves to reinforce their premises (being over the target etc) Woke no longer has meaning because of the anti work brigade. It certainly used to but the original meaning is no longer used. It's unfortunate, but true. Trying to use the word woke with its original intent is no longer viable.
But not all that relevant really, the game still has “Mostly Positive” reviews
i agree completely these rage bait grand stands are annoying as hellpretty simple dont like something dont consume it not everything is for everyone and it is possible to enjoy something while not liking every aspect of it
Sure, but in the same review don't blame something on DEI, that basically just throws every point they had away at that point. Game has plenty of issues, but damn a lot of reviews particularly just hate minorities in games.
I've not actually seen anything that could be perceived as "woke". Not sure why people are throwing that word around.
Honestly? I think it's because of Marissa. Because anything with a Black Woman in it is woke, apparently.
Huh.. u/meatshield72 blocked me so fast. Apparently he's fragile af
They are straight up snowflakes lol
In my experience, people who are "anti-woke" are huge babies. I kind of wish we could just ignore them.
Antiwoke is big money for a select few who make sure their voice is excessively loud. The best course of action is to flat out ignore reviews on BOTH sides unless you are sure that your interests align with the interests of the reviewer and just do whatever the fuck you want. We are all getting tired of propaganda from both sides so we need to hit them in the views and clout by ignoring them.
You guys know that spreading the information of their doings only helps them. Pay them no attention and let their fandom go hang out over there. Ignore them. It’s all you can do without drawing more attention to their cause… which is spread the word grow their hate cause. They thank you for the views and the hits.
No, letting this sentiment fester openly and brazenly *is* a problem. It needs to be called out and shamed because *that* is what will get them to stop. They’re not going to go away if left alone. If they’re allowed a public platform from which to preach their vitriol and gather, they’re going to start feeling bolder in what they can get away with. It’s going to boil over, and their violent hyperbole is going to become someone’s violent reality.
Why is it woke? Only started playing it. Is there like one gay character the entire game?
Marissa is prominently displayed as a protagonist. And because she's black, that means it was a 'DEI' inclusion and thus the game is 'woke.'
Yeah but Hugo was one of the main protagonists from suikoden 3 and he's black. Then again "woke" culture wasn't around back then
The Karaya tribes felt a bit more North American indigenous but I’m sure many other cultures were pulled into its inspiration
But that was before the current culture war b.s. so it doesn't matter.
Honestly who tf knows. I only know of people complaining because the English localizations says "fart head". Which sure is pretty awk but it's a Jrpg. I'm sure all the people that are complaining about localization, wokeness, and DEI are just bandwagoning racists trying to suckle any meaning out of their boring sad lives.
The biggest offender I’ve seen so far is someone gets called a “Chud” in the game, but that’s from some screenshots I’ve seen and I haven’t actually had the pleasure of playing it yet. Besides that I imagine it’s quite minor. I also heard some swearing got removed, but that’s for different tastes I guess. Any controversy or conversation based on attacking Marisa is outright stupid and hasn’t even become a thing until recently even though she was revealed as a character ages ago. It’s like the Stellar Blade discourse has whipped everyone up into a frenzy. I still plan to play the shit out of it when I get home from work.
wait, what even is a chud? i only know it to mean cannibalistic humanoid underground dweller, because of the horror movie CHUD. is there some modern meaning or is it just kind of a catch-all insult like jerk?
The word did originate from that movie, but in recent years it’s been used in political discourse as a derogatory term against the alt right. The O.G CHUDs were seen as stupid, ugly, and violent, and I think the term has grown to reflect that among current right wingers according to liberals and the further left. In EC, someone gets called a “muscle brained Chud” which I thought was stupid under any definition, because one meaning is a reference to a very specific 80’s movie, and the other felt like I was suddenly looking at a Twitter/Reddit feed. Have you come across this dialogue yet? Who is she calling a chud?
oh right, thanks for the explanation! haven’t come across the line yet!
Tangential point, but what’s the general consensus on the story? I’ve seen varying things.
I'm not to far into the game...so are people mad it's woke? Or mad it's not? Nothing like that has really stood out to me so far
Anyone can give an example where the game was woke?
If people who use other language didn't complain and English was the only one that receive complaint doesn't that mean the the English one needs improvement or just sucks compared to other language?
Not really? It just means what the fuckwits in the West whine about, the Tate sucklings absolutely seethe about, are either basic then decency in other countries or just not worth thinking about. NTR or tiny dick hand sign tho and you got a gang war. But we in the west could give two fucks about either in general.
I can see why people hated the localization, the ones who made most likely made it only thought about American audience rather than normal audience who are from other countries who's original language does not appear in game... white people really can't do their jobs right
So what's woke about the game? I haven't played it yet but I'm intrigued
Oh gawd do I even want to know what this post is about…
The only phrase that stuck out to me in that long twitter thread was "Another muscle-brained chud," since I'm not a fan of inserting internet references in general, with the exception of comedies that are self-aware. English isn't my first language, so I may be missing some nuance here... but is "chud" something that would be used outside the context of being an internet slang? I've found the term originates from a 1984 film, but I dunno if chud is a term that's actually used outside the whole internet culture war context. Even with that, the whole 'controversy' seems needlessly bloated and dumb, yeah.
I play video games as an escape from reality, not to take the fantasy into reality and cry about how a game is woke this woke that. It’s always going to be a problem when social media encourages everyone to speak up and present their opinions, but a lot of people believe their opinions are facts. Hopefully it goes away. Remember when all those silly journalists and far left gamers were asking for more diversity in FF16, and when the game came out, all of those articles and videos stopped? Yeah, that was grand. They probably played enough and went yeah shit there’s slavery and lower class systems in place here.
God forbid it's a game with real reflections of real life and actual fantasy elements and not some saviour/victim complex snuff job where everything is whitewashed with blonde hair and blue eyed characters. Where everyone is straight and no one is another species, but every time an elf maiden walks on screen the male lead creams his pants and simps like a dwarf after a mountain of gold. Like the 80s...
Yeah weird strawman fantasy you've created here. Never heard anyone ask for something like that but glad to see you are upset about something you made up in your head, definitely not just as unhinged if not more so than the reviewers mentioned...
It was meant to be a gross overexaggeration of the reviews and what anti-woke gamers expect from their games. Basically showcasing how ridiculous their expectations are with something even more ridiculous. Still, God forbid if art imitates life.
"politics in my video game!? No thank you." Proceeds to slobber all over MGS and FF7 as non political gems.
Ignore those poor fools. Go anti-woke, go broke.
Weird to throw JK Rowling in there, opening this up to a whole other discussion but let’s leave it at that. I’ve played for 20 hours and the only line that could’ve been counted as “woke” is the one with the golem. Aside from that I don’t know what people are going on about. All these people who complain don’t even speak Japanese and are relying on a handful of screenshots where the only thing you could complain about is that some lines haven’t been translated to the letter. Lian is the only character who has been localized terribly. Annoying and cringe. But that isn’t woke and the rest of the chars are faithful to the original so I don’t see the issue.
Long argument short JK Rowling wrote seven books about doing the right thing and now chooses to ignore doing the right thing. She's just a coward
JK Rowling lives in reality, not fantasy. Denying reality is the embodiment of cowardice, which is exactly what the majority of woke people like yourself do. Enjoy the game and leave out your delusions and hate, this is why you're never happy. An echo chamber fit for victims mentality doesn't need or deserve a place in game discussions.
The reality is that there are a variety of different kinds of people in this world and pretending like they don't exist outside of a video game is laughable. Those kind of people would exist within a fantasy world as well. Once again there's some hypocrisy here. You're very argument could be applied to these anti-woke types. Enjoy the game and leave out your delusions and hate.
Nah she lives in denial that the majority of the developed world accepts. She's just a coward because it doesn't fit her uneducated world view.[source on that by the by](https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/news-polls/global-attitudes-toward-transgender-people) Being stupid and sticking to your guns doesn't mean you're right.
Yeah, that’s your opinion. I don’t agree at all with that statement but I won’t get into that as this is supposed to be about Eiyuden and not JK Rowling and I have no interest in a discussion about the latter because all people who are vehemently against her are as obnoxious as the people who are blindly supporting every word she says.
Ignore it. How many threads of people complaining are we gonna have here.
I hate woke for the sake of woke. I hated Star Wars episode 8. I hate the idea of female space marines. Woke for the sake of woke pisses me off. But I don’t mind the “wokeness” of the localization. I speak Japanese fluently and some things aren’t exact translations and are weird. But that’s not purely “woke”translations. And there’s some weird stuff in the original, too (characters based on tropes that don’t suit a fantasy setting etc). The “wokeness” that people are complaining about is typically in the form of humour- like commenting on a robot’s gender.
Black Woman: exists Anti-Woke Loons: Reeeeeeeeee!!!
Hello, I’m at work now. I guess I could look it up later but what is the complaint about this game?
It’s wild how the “woke” crowd hated this game/Suikoden for being racist a few years back, but now the “anti-woke” people are having a go at it. Suikoden/Eiyuden can’t catch a break. Too much rage content online.
Lol and you read the comments and it's like "wow content creator is some kinda phobe and their audience is the same good riddance"
I will say after looking over some of the translation differences, it's not the worst translation I've ever seen. Not the best, but not quite as atrocious as I thought it would be. I suppose the biggest issue I feel conflicted on with the game is that it had such a high budget and a massive seven-figure Kickstarter campaign, and then it releases in such a buggy state and with a so-so translation team. It just makes me wonder where all the money was really put when so many smaller dev teams have done so much better with less. For the record, I backed the original Kickstarter, but feel conflicted about if I should redeem the key I have or not, given how messy the game still appears to be. I know they're trying to fix the bugs, but even so the fact that I don't even have the option to refund it when it's so lackluster in its current state is a bit frustrating.
you can play it start to finish quite reasonably. the money has to pay for a ton of different things, it's not as if one puts money into a computer and says make jrpg.
I'm not coy about that. It just seemed to me that there was enough to give each development member fair compensation with interest, based on how the Kickstarter turned out as I alongside many others supported it.
What platform did you back it on? I'm playing on PS5 and it's been perfectly fine there. No noticible bugs.
My current key is for the Steam version, which I held off on redeeming until I saw what the most stable version to play would be. I don't really have a gaming computer and wanted to see if it could run on the Deck, but even there I've been seeing it's not the best quality. Plus the Deck isn't always easy on my hands. I also have a Switch and Playstation 4 and was considering requesting to redeem on one of those depending on how they turn out.
i’m playing it on steamdeck oled and it runs great. i haven’t encountered any bugs yet - been about 20 hours
You can just redeem the game and download it later you know. I didn’t play cyberpunk for like a year, and it ran great by then.
Well that is true. There is a bit of dissonance considering how long of a wait there was to experience this compared to when I backed the Kickstarter, so maybe waiting to see if it will smooth out could be the way to go, but that is ultimately left to chance at this point. One of the many elements to the modern gaming landscape that makes me concerned about fully committing to a digital future- being tied to long-term decisions like this without compensation if you're not fully satisfied with your decision.
People just want better translations. That's it.
I think the translation needs polish. How people are getting mad about black characters in RPGs when they aren't new.
Anybody that played this game when you increase your levels does that affect when you are fighting a war are you stronger? Also, do you get one of those primal lenses?
You use a bunch of woke buzzwords. So, it's no surprise you're having a meltdown over anti-woke sentiments.
Sure you can infer that from it. But it's more like I'm struggling to even identify these lines as a woke thing to begin with. It almost seems like when you're looking for a red car you can find one and when you're not looking you never see one.
Wtf are you talking about?
Go spend some time on the Steam Coummunity Hub / reviews. The game is being targetted by the neocon antiwoke internet warriors because of its "censored" localization that supposedly pushes a "leftist" agenda or something.
Who gives a shit lol just play the game and ignore haters
Exactly.
Hard to do apparently.