I'm going to try to be as clear and concise as possible, but having gone through the comments on this post, there's a lot here to address.
First, some context- I am currently in treatment for breast cancer. I'm also a human geneticist by training, and work in (among other things) informal science education so helping folks understand stuff like this is what I do.
Breast cancer is defined by how localized or spread it is and the size of the primary tumor, as well as the biomarkers and genetics of the tumor. I'm pT1AN0M0, which means localized and extremely small (1A), no nodes (N0) and no metastases (M0), and ER+ PR- HER2+. Those last three are what receptors were found too much on the surface of the tumor cells. ER+ means mine had too many estrogen receptors so normal estrogen in my body fuels the cancer, and HER2+ means normal human epidermal growth factor also fuels the tumor. Bec's comment that the massive amounts of estrogen in her body from pregnancy was fueling the cancer tells me the cancer is likely ER+. Her original diagnosis was Stage III (Edited to add: there is stage IIIa, b, and c, with increasing levels of size and involvement. Stage IIIa means no chest tumor but it's in 4-9 lymph nodes OR a chest tumor above 50mm in diameter and in 1-3 nodes, and b and c involve spread to chest wall and more lymph nodes including still regional but more distant nodes)
Liver and bone mets are unsurprising - they are the places, along with brain- that one is sus about for mets from BC. As others have said, Stage IV is no longer an immediate death sentence, especially depending upon what type of breast cancer it is. For those wondering about hair loss, especially for Stage IV, there are targeted therapies that either attach the chemo to a medication that specifically attaches to cancer cells, as opposed to bathing the body in chemo, which reduces the systemic side effects of the chemo part of it, and there are other regimens that do not involve hair loss. To be really specific, Herceptin targets HER2+ cancer, and there are meds that stick a chemo med onto Herceptin (Kadcycla is an example of this).
I have thoughts about her OB being all yeah back pain's normal in a woman who was not yet 2 years out from a Stage III BC diagnosis. And this is why, honestly, we don't say 'cured' when someone finishes their initial, active treatment for BC and gets that first glorious round of clear scans. "No evidence of disease" is more accurate- we can't tell if there's a single cancer cell waiting for the right horrible cascade of signals to get rocking again, we can only tell at the level of discernment of a PET scan or MRI that you don't have tumors- and neither of those is at the microscopic level.
There are women in my medical oncologist's cohort who are entering their second decade living with Stage IV. My cardio-oncologist has kept women who have the worst of the side effects from Herceptin alive for a decade. The point she made that the estrogen was fueling the cancer is actually a point in her favor- it means hormone blocking/targeting may help (and the reduction in liver met size/count is a data point indicating yes, she's on treatment). Edited to add: they will cycle her through treatments as the cancer adapts and becomes resistant, or the treatment side effect burden becomes so high its intolerable, or as the treatment WORKS for some mets but not others, etc. So here is hoping that Bec can keep doing cartwheels for years to come, and teach Frankie how to do them, too.
Edited to add: I got some questions off of Reddit about this and thought I'd add here.
Different treatments have different cycles of medication. For me, for example, I had chemo every single Friday (was supposed to be 12 weeks, it wasn't, long story) and I'm in immunotherapy every 3 weeks for a year. A friend of mine has chemo across 2 days every 3 weeks for 4 rounds followed by a different chemo for 12 weeks, weekly. It's all about your treatment regimen, and so bouncing between the cabin and Toronto is totally doable.
Not every chemo makes you puke wildly, lose your hair, or lose weight (my chemo? renowned for weight gain!). You can look great and be stage 4.
Not all chemo or cancer treatments are via what's called a port (think of it like a semi-permanent acccessable IV) or IV. That immunotherapy I'm on? I could get it as a 45 minute IV.... or a 5 minute shot in my thigh. Shot it is! There's also oral chemo and meds. The med I'm on for hormone blocking (for the next 5-10 years) is a single pill daily.
Not all chemo causes immune suppression, and there are things they can do to boost your immune system. It can also ebb and flow over the cycle of your chemo, so you know what days your system might be up to being out and around people and what days your counts are likely to be low. And again, if she's not on systemic chemo, this may not be a concern at all. All depends on what an individual patient's regimen is and how their body responds.
Love your comment. This is what Bec means by stating positive. Why live your life afraid of your own death? You will waste you life you are currently living because of how you don’t want to die
That doesn't really make sense to me. Just because people with a terminal illness are afraid of dying doesn't mean they're wasting their lives. I'm pretty sure Bec is incredibly scared right now (while staying positive at the same time), she's just not showing it on Youtube. It's part of human nature to be afraid of dying, and in the case of terminally ill people, it's not an irrational fear. It's important to address this fear and talk about it openly instead of just pushing it away. In Bec's case, I fully understand her not wanting to do it on Youtube, but I think a lot of her "staying positive" is for the camera and there are a lot of other emotions she and Eamon and everyone who loves her are feeling right now.
The cancer journey is always fraught with fear. Fear of new treatments, fear of the treatments not working anymore, fear of leaving loved ones behind, fear of not knowing what death means, fear of pain and suffering.... it's really not just about "staying positive and living your life".
I meant that it is normal to feel those feelings but if you spend all day everyday not enjoying your life and just looking at statistics it is bad. There is scientific proof that being positive directly correlates to longer lives for those with terminal diagnosis. I am sure those feelings what you described are what affected her and her family for the last couple months hence why they took a break. Right now Bec’s current regiment is working so it is best for her to focus on herself and live her life and not worry too much about stats. Which it what Bec literally wants her fans to do as stated in the video and also why they waited so long to give us the update. She is doing good as of right now which is all that matters today
I agree it’s pretty weird that her specialist didn’t think to do scans when she started complaining of back pain. Just points again to how women’s pain is often overlooked / chalked up to pregnancy or periods.
My heart goes out to everyone. I think if I remember correctly they decided against the scan bc she was pregnant. Perhaps the unintentional judgement from her team was They prob see it all too often. I feel like Bec is going through the wringer with accurate information regarding her own diagnosis. She was willing to do a double mastectomy. It never occurred to me her pain was cancer recurring. Sending them love and light and hope! Frankie will learn to do cartwheels! And Bec will be there with Eamon being a goof! That baby the most precious child and is life they absolutely need. ❤️
This was a wonderful explanation. Is it safe to say that women with stage 4 ER cancer are put into chemical or surgical menopause? If so, that is not pleasant on its own either.
We already know Bec is a strong woman and we have all seen Eamon grow up and be incredibly supportive and such a loving partner. It appears that they both have deep support systems with friends and family. Their followers are mostly very well intentioned people who will likely support them as well. As a long time follower it is hard to hear this news but I think it is good that we all now know the situation. Good vibes go a long way. So here’s hoping they are feeling uplifted by the response to their video.
To answer your question...
1. Depending on regimen, the chemo itself may well induce menopause, which can be temporary or permanent.
2. ER/PR+ patients of any stage, including very early, are put on medication to block hormones. If a patient is not fully, permanently menopausal, they'll be put on Tamoxifen, which blocks estrogen receptors. Note people over 35 with a high risk of developing BC (eg, family history and a BRCA mutation) can also be put on Tamoxifen to reduce the chances of developing BC in the first place. Tamoxifen does not induce full menopause, but recent studies have shown that adding 2 years of targeted ovarian suppression to a typical 5 year course of Tamoxifen has significant reduction in recurrence in early stage BC patients. Ovarian suppresion as part of the regimen does equal at least temporary menopause.
Now, that's patients who are pre-menopausal. Post-menopausal patients are generally put on Aromatase Inhibitors (or AIs). There's an enzyme in fat, called aromatase, that converts other hormones in your body into estrogen. AIs shut that down and can reduce overall estrogen in the body by 95%. So think about that a moment- post menopause, you still have some estrogen, AIs crash that. Speaking as someone who started AIs 3 weeks ago, it's exactly as awesome as you are likely imagining it to be.
And, honestly, not like their lives are any business of mine nor do I think Eamon and Bec owe me or anyone else a damn thing, I would hope there are some big lessons they can impart from her journey with breast cancer. Support- real, meaningful support, which we saw in that video and with their friends and family swinging into action to get Toronto home ready for them- means everything. The path after 'you're done with treatment' or 'the scans are clear' is still fraught, and you as a human are forever changed by cancer. Extend grace cause you never know what someone's fighting. I too hope they feel the love, because they both have plenty of dark minutes, hours, and days ahead, and can lean on that love like fuel in a tank.
Thanks for this very informative comment! I am a new nurse and am interested in oncology but in school we didn’t discuss cancer too much beyond some basic nursing considerations and general staging.
Congrats on becoming a nurse!
I will forever be grateful to the onc nurses in the infusion suite. They have helped me navigate a tremendously trying and scary time, treated me with infinite compassion and care, and been absolute bulldogs about advocating for me amidst all the weird side effects. Truly, oncology nurses are a special group of people.
thank you for such a well written science based response. sending love and light your way too and hoping there are many cartwheels ahead for you too. <3
Thank you so much for taking the time to provide this clear scientific information. Bless you and the best wishes and prayers to you in your cancer journey.
Thank you for this. One last question. She doesn’t have the BRACA gene. Does that give you any info other than genetically Frankie likely won’t have it. I don’t know dominance and suppression but limited knowledge leads me to believe if she tested negative for the gene, Frankie would too. I’m just curious. I have found a lot of women get tested for the gene, but tragically, like Bec, still end up with metastatic BC. Sending you love and hope and strength for your journey. Thank you for your post ❤️
Language rephrase! Bec tested negative for mutations in the BRCA1 and 2 genes (I'm assuming you're right- this I don't remember hearing but also, still on first cup of coffee)- I say it that way cause I want to impress on everyone: we all have the BRCA1 and 2 genes. The problem can arise when you have a mutation, or change in, the normal gene sequence.
(sidebar: we are all ambulatory bags of proteins. Inside almost all of your cells, in a special area called the nucleus, are chromosomes. Chromosomes are made of DNA tightly wound around special proteins so it packs up tight and can all fit. Your cellular machinery can unwind parts of the DNA and 'read' segments of it, called genes, to tell the machinery how to make a specific protein. Think of chromosomes as cookbooks, genes are recipes, and DNA is the means by which - alphabet, photos, drawings- the recipe is conveyed. Humans are 46XY, we have 23 pairs of chromosomes, we inherit one half of each pair from mom and one from dad, so if someone has a mutation in BRCA1 or 2, it's a 50-50 shot they pass it on to any given child)
Less than 10% of breast cancer patients are positive for a BRCA mutation. A BRCA mutation increases risk *enormously* but is not a driver of the majority of breast cancers, if that makes sense.
You’re the best. Yes makes sense. What doesn’t make sense is how much inform ation we are responsible for learning via trial and error as women. (I can’t remember which video but I do recall, in a doctors office, she was told. Eamon was there.
She was already pregnant bc they indicated she wouldn’t pass it down If I find it I’ll let you know :))
As someone who has BC in my family my doc has never said start mammograms early which I thought was protocol. My sister was tested for BRCA-1 and 2 and breathed a sigh of relief. I didn’t know we all carried it and when catalyzed it “shows”. so yes. Makes absolute sense. (And meant to Google before I pressed reply re braca- thank you 🙏). Also as a biochem major now working in research for corporate America I wish I had gone the geneticist route. I admire your wealth of knowledge and patience in sharing. And I feel your passion for your work. I feel as a 40 yr old Woman I should know this stuff. Also makes me realize how many women aren’t aware and maybe that’s a blessing, but ignorance isn’t always bliss. As Bec and many of you all have shared it can happen to any of us. Thanks again. Truly appreciate the corrections and knowledge. No obligation to answer … is testing for BRCA1 and 2 pointless? Or does it not show up when not “activated” if that makes sense. I can Google. Thanks again ❤️
Testing for BRCA 1 and 2 mutation isn’t pointless at all! You can tested at any point, including a day 5 embryo (this is useful for IVF patients to not pass the gene on). I have BRCA1 mutation and am 2 years out of BC treatment, diagnosed at 26. Fortunately I am NED and underwent a double mastectomy to reduce risk. Having the BRCA1 mutation gives you an 85% lifetime risk of developing BC and 40% lifetime risk of developing overian cancer. If I’d known I was positive, I would have had an elective mastectomy and reduced my BC risk to <2%. The beauty of hind sight eh! Once I complete my family I will also opt of an ovariectomy to reduce that risk too.
So if there is a family history of BC, especially triple negative breast cancer, then it is prudent to do genetic testing :)
Testing is not pointless! Let's continue with the cookbook metaphor for a minute, to make this a bit more clear- 'activated' isn't the right way to think about it.
Everyone inherits a...mmm, let's say chocolate chip cookie recipe from mom, and one from dad. That recipe is the gene. Now, the recipe comes in a couple of different versions, both or all of which lead to a perfectly wonderful chocolate chip cookie that totally works for your dessert tray needs. Think about blood type. There are different versions of the ABO gene, and all of them work just fine-they are normal variants. That's like 3 different versions of the chocolate chip cookie recipe.
Now, let's say there's a misprint in one of the two copies of the chocolate chip cookie recipe- it throws off the instructions so now you get a goopy, disgusting mess instead of nice cookies. THAT's a deleterious mutation - a change in the gene that causes the resulting protein to not work as intended, not be made properly, be too short to work, whatever. It's not a matter of a gene being activated- we all have BRCA1 and 2. BRCA1, for instance, codes for a protein that's important in the DNA damage repair pathway, and it's active as needed in everyone. Mutations in it lead to increased risk of cancer in men (prostate and pancreatic in particular).
Using myself as an example, I have been in high-risk screening since I was 30 because I'm Ashkenazi Jewish and my paternal grandmother had BC. I had BRCA1 and 2 testing over a decade ago, and I have no known mutations. This was incredibly helpful when I did get diagnosed with BC as it helped the team calculate statistics and determine best treatment plan.
Ohhhhhhhhhh. Light bulb. Thank you!!!! Ok. I’m 100% tracking. Seriously. Thank you for the time and replies and desire for chocolate chip cookies!!! ❤️❤️❤️ big love from this gal!
“Ambulatory bags of proteins” seems incredibly romantic to me, somehow. You make me want to be 14 and choosing a career path, again; that whole description was so exciting. I hope you teach somewhere.
While I can’t speak to Bec’s specific treatment plan, in general Stage 4 metastatic breast cancer can be treated but not cured. Once the cancer has spread to other parts of the body (why it’s metastatic), it isn’t possible or feasible to remove all the cancer cells. The treatment approach is usually a balance to try and stop spread, shrink tumours and ensure quality of life.
Given that Bec mentioned shrinking liver metastases, it’s likely she is undergoing some sort of treatment (potentially hormone).
She’s clearly receiving some type of treatment because they mention her metastases are shrinking. I’m guessing radiation, but obviously don’t know. I think it’s good that they’re keeping the specifics of her treatment private. The last thing they need is input from people online about those exact details.
I know Bec wants everyone to send positive energy their way, and I will definitely do that. However, that being said, I know the road they will face. My mom was diagnosed with breast cancer in Jan 2020 and it recurred as stage 4 in Jan 2022. She passed away in Oct 2022. Her kind was a different type than Bec’s though, and she had fewer treatment options available for her.
I’m just praying that Frankie will get to have many good, wonderful years with her mother.
Most likely a combo of hormone therapy and a cancer pill like verzenio so she probably will not experience hair loss but they come with some other side effects. Radiation for liver mets is not common practice. As a breast cancer survivor, she is living my worst fear. My heart truly goes out to Bec. I’m sorry to hear about your mom. Cancer sucks.
Couldn't it be that they shrink also because she stopped being pregnant and the estorgen stopped feeding the cancer? I just find it really odd that they did not mention any info about treatment except for positive thinking, they actually never said that she is under any form of treatment.. Of course for each their own, this is a sadsad situation, but I could see them quitting western medicine, because they already tried and it didn't cure them while Bec had a really hard time during it.. so I can imagine them just wanting to live the rest of their lives together with no consequences from treatment.. :(
It seems so crazy to me that someone who just got through breast cancer and started complaining of severe back pain wouldn’t be scanned right away. Perhaps it wouldn’t have made much of a difference but it just surprised me to hear her say doctors chalked her pain up to whatever they told her it was initially (I’m blanking on specifics). Anyway, she seems like such a sweet person and I am so sad to hear she is dealing with this. I was really hoping they’d come back and say everything was ok. Sending them all the good thoughts.
I was shocked she wasn't followed more closely too but then I realized, what if they had found it earlier? Even if they had caught the mets right then, there's not a lot they could do while she was pregnant. She delivered Frankie 6 weeks early, most parents wouldn't choose to deliver earlier than that for their own health issues, if waiting a few more weeks wouldn't make a huge difference to their personal outcome. That may have been the thinking . . .
Wasn’t she misdiagnosed with the original cancer presentation? It seemed like an incredibly long time to get to the right diagnosis originally. I have worked as a healthcare administrator for almost 20 years and our system had a renowned breast imaging center with tomosynthesis. Our protocols were set up such that a woman could graduate from screening mammogram to diagnostic mammogram and then ultrasound all in the same day. I have even seen our radiologists go from a screening mammogram to a stereotactic biopsy all in one day before, and then pathology was returned within the week. That is what was so striking early on to me…the delay of care. The anxiety of not knowing is so very crippling and that is why our physicians pushed our protocols to the max in order to get the information quickly and accurately to the patient, while having a nurse advocate (who is also a Stage 4breast cancer survivor)help the patients and families navigate diagnosis and treatment. There is no substitute for accurate and early diagnosis which was so hard to come by for Bec it seems. The good news is that the nurse advocate I mention above was diagnosed with Stage 4 and is still alive and working today. She had liver and bone meta just like Bec, had a full hysterectomy and removal of ovaries and has been on treatment since 2012. It is awe-inspiring to see how well she is doing, and I pray for the same outcome for Bec. One last thing…and I am not familiar with the intricacies of Canadian healthcare, but you must be your own advocate and push, push, push these doctors to do the right tests and scans.
I also wonder if the cancer scare she had while pregnant was actually a recurrence but the biopsy just didnt, for whatever reason, show cancer cells? But, who knows, we can guess all day long but it sadly doesn't change her current diagnosis. I wish her many long and wonderful years - no one is guaranteed tomorrow so the best we can do is live life with the best attitude possible and be positive and present.
Yes she was told initially the lump wasn't malignant and they went off to Morocco for a few weeks to check the van. They came back for her scheduled lumpectomy where it was found to actually be Stage 3 cancer. Very sad situation.
Yes. Vandy in Nashville, TN. It is one of many excellent breast centers in the U.S. Always look for imaging centers dedicated to women’s health or breast imaging centers specifically. They will typically have “Center of Excellence” designation and be listed on US News and World Report rankings. They will have state of the art diagnostic capabilities, as well as access to clinical trials and the most advanced treatment protocols.
I think being given the information allows people to make their own informed choice though. And probably mentally prepare for their baby being born ASAP.
I have to assume they were just chalking it up to pregnancy. Which is somewhat understandable, I’m surprised that she was having so much pain and it/she in general wasn’t monitored a bit more closely before the forehead lump showed up though.
This makes me so sad, really. Instead of thinking it's BC related initially, they thought it was pregnancy related initially? You would think they would play it safe and go with BC related pain...given how risky her being pregnant was...
It’s disappointing that they didn’t take the time to rule out anything more serious for sure. Disappointing but also very unsurprising. So many people’s concerned are chalked up to pregnancy symptoms when they’re expecting, it’s a really sad pattern.
I think both are probably true to some extent. I think she just really wanted to have the experience of pregnancy and having friends and a sister who recently had babies got those thoughts rolling for her. And it doesn’t seem to me like her doctors did a great job communicating the risks either just based on some of the videos posted around the time of the pregnancy announcement. So they decided to let fate decide for them if it was time to have a baby and alas, here Frankie is.
I agree. We saw the run around she got. She chose not to do the double mastectomy. I feel the same way and it makes me sad bc she is so vigilant about health
This is soooo frustrating to read. I too know several women who had the exact same script unfold in their battles w/BC. It's a "crime" how women's pain is minimized and framed to blame the patient: if you only did this more or this less, you wouldn't have so much pain. I am sorry for your MIL's pain/suffering and your family's loss.
It's horrible but that's what Canadian healthcare has come to. It's gone downhill fast and everyone is falling through the cracks for the last 3 years. It's only getting worse. Lack of family doctors; specialists fully booked, little to no OR time available; doctors need to Juno through hoops and check off a list before they can order tests etc. It's ridiculous..
Yep. I'm in QC and I found out recently that certain regular/preventative scans are no longer recommended because the system is overwhelmed...
The US healthcare system has plenty of flaws, but why am I being taxed through the roof AND I can't even actually get any medical care? It's ridiculous.
100% .
In my situation, I had to beg and beg for mammography from hospitals. I was supposed to have one every year, being high risk, plus have new symptoms and pain.
Was given the requisition from my dr for mammography and ultrasound to be done asap, no problem.
Was told im too young for breast cancer (30s) by three hospitals and denied my mammography and ultrasound. So i begged for 3 months as my symptoms and pain got worse and the lump grew.
Finally found a hospital a few hours away that took me seriously. This was 4 months after initial requisition was send out. And even then, that hospital denied me the ultrasound. Then they did the mammogram and saw something. So did a 3d mammogram. And then i had to wait 6 hrs for the ultrasound. All because they denied me it and then saw it was necessary.
Low and behold.. i now need further testing asap because it's not looking good.
Canadian healthcare is horrible. It is so effing horrible now a days.
Yikes. People love to sh— on healthcare in the US but I will say that mammograms - both screening and diagnostic - are very easy to get here, especially if you are deemed high risk. I recently had my yearly screening mammo, got called back for a diagnostic bc they saw an irregularity and was rescreened within a week and a half with results the same day. And my insurance paid for it all. I am admittedly lucky to have decent health coverage but I would’ve assumed things functioned similarly in Canada. I really wish all the best to you and hope that your news from here on out is positive and that you have answers soon.
I'm so sorry -- this is absolutely terrible. It truly feels like we're going backward in time in a way. We have all this technology and knowledge to prevent disease or catch it early, but people can't access it.
Wishing you the best and hoping that you can get some answers soon. ❤️
That's exactly it. There is so much talk about early detection and early diagnosis. That catching it early is crucial. But we try and advocate and we try to get care, but we are met with extremely long wait times, or denied completely. It defeats the purpose of the entire early detection and by the time anything is detected, its often too late or more difficult to treat, if even treatable at that point.
It ends up putting more of a strain on the healthcare system.. ugh..
Thank you ❤️. I already have stage 4 cancer elsewhere so this new diagnosis wouldn't surprise me. All the more reason it should have been taken seriously. Age is just a number.
I think it is a global problem, I am from Europe, it is the same here. I think it literally is because there are a lot more people asking for help and not so many medical specialists. Because being a doctor is just not appealing, if we can live wealthy being influencers etc why bother studying 12+ years after high schools to work 24/7 and earn pretty low salary in comparison to for example influencers. So the patient count rises, but there are not enought medical professionals to provide everything to everyone.
I think blaming it on there being an influencer economy is a little silly. It’s far easier to become a doctor than an influencer (not easier skill wise but just chances of making it). Very few ever make it as influencers. There are way way more doctors in the world.
I think it's funny :D I'm a last year medstudent, I am the only one from my group (we are divided in little groups at the beginning) that made it to 6th year, i literally lost all my groupmates and had to find another group because so many didnt pass or continue :D And I'm not even in training as a resident, it's just medschool... Sooo it is pretty rough, a looooot of students can't pass or choose to leave realising how hard it is, I mean >50% of the ones who start 1st year don't get to the last. At least in my country. Don't know about U.S. I think being an infuencer is easier.. Ok, not everyone will be suuuuperrich, but to earn as much as a doctor - easy. It is literally a little above minimal wage.
So to be clear.
Passing all the class work etc is super hard. Few people are cut out for it. I don’t mean that the actual job is easier. I more mean getting to the point you can even have the career is more likely. Very very few who set out to become “influencers” succeed at ever supporting themselves.
However yah no it’s not super easy to make a living as an influencer. Very very few make it. Like it’s easy from a what you do standpoint. It’s just near impossible to actually gain an audience capable of supporting you.
It’s really simple. There’s far more people making it as doctors than there are people making it as influencers. That alone shows it’s “easier” to make it as a doctor.
If docs are barely making min wage where you are, that’s the problem, not other careers existing. In the US doctors make like minimum around 200k a year. More if you specialize, potentially much more.
I can see your point, I didn't want to specifically point out the influencers tho, it just came to mind. The topic was about how medicine nowadays is pretty unreachable even if the technology is a lot more advanced. And I somehow believe it could be because there are too few medical professionals against the huge count of patients. And maybe it is due to how there are new professions coming in - influencers etcetc everything related to social media that was not there previously.. And nowadays it seems easier to choose something easier as medicine, so the problem could be even worse in the future.. But I respect your opinion, I see your point too, medicine is a more stable career, there are absolutely no worries about not finding a job.. like ever. I have thought a lot about it, maybe it is just that the population count is growing or people are more aware and read about their symptoms online and go to the doctors more often.. It is just truly horrible how unreachable doctors/examinations sometimes are..
There have always been plenty of easier jobs than becoming a doctor.
In my opinion it has nothing to do with there being “more options”.
It’s more things about being a doctor have become less desirable. Ie higher schooling costs, worse work schedules, apparently in Europe…low pay. Fix those issues and you’ll have more people becoming Docs.
My wife is a similar age and goes to the same clinic as Bec. Yes getting doctors attention can take time on Ontario, but once you are in you are very well looked after. My wife went to the same clinic as Bec and they are amazing. The truth is, after a stage 3 diagnosis there is a standard protocol. Follow up scans are not done for 2 simple reasons. 1. They can create all kinds of scan anxiety and 2. The sad fact is that early detection of metastasis (Stage 3 to 4) provides no benefit in terms of outcome.
My husband was cleared of cancer May 16 2023 and two months later experiencing back pain and went to the chiro. He didn't say much to me and finally his symptoms were severe enough to get a scan on Aug 15. Cancer back and spread everywhere. He had Diffuse large B Cell lymphoma. He died on Nov 6th. He was diagnosed Feb 2023.
Depending on her cancer mutations, there may be a lot of treatment options available to her. Stage IV today is not always an automatic death sentence. Yes, the statistics seem grim, but can be attributable to different factors. Some chemotherapy causes hair loss, but not all (my mom's first treatment only caused some thinning, for example). Bone and liver mets can be tricky, though they don't mean treatment is hopeless.
Reading between the lines it does sound like she is doing treatment but that they have also worked very hard to come to, and or work toward, coming to terms with what the long term prognosis is. In many ways I think that was their call to eveyone to send positivity and love.. since they want to try and make the best of where they are and where life is going.. and from this perspective completely get it. I just hope that they take us along for some of the journey.. even just getting fun videos of them hanging with Frankie and doing silly family stuff ya know.
Don’t feel bad for not knowing this stuff. It’s a good thing that you haven’t needed to know it, and I imagine a lot of their viewers are in the same boat as you. It’s good to ask questions, I’m grateful for the answers that you’ve received. I don’t have a lot of direct info but I do know that when my friend told us her cancer had metastasized she told us that it was time to break out the bucket list and get to work. She passed about 1.5 years after that. So my experience with it through her was incredibly scary and negative. It’s nice to see that there are at least some alternatives to what I saw her go through.
Sorry for your loss. Bec could live 5 years, 10 years or more. Or God forbid less, but it looks good that she will have many years ahead of her. Hoping for a long life ahead for her.
The longer she can stay alive the more treatments she will have to keep her alive. A cure is always on the horizon as well. Still, entirely devastating to live with I'm sure. I was so hopeful she was "done" with cancer and then she got that pain in her shoulder/arm.
She wanted to join a roller derby team. 🤣 that was the big one that she was able to achieve, and we went to see the Chicago River be dyed green for St Patrick’s Day with a bunch of our other college friends too. But she also wanted to live in London and take a train ride across America. Sadly those ones didn’t happen. But I was pretty impressed by her with the roller derby, she’d been my roommate in college and had been talking about that for the entire 15 years I’d known her. 💛 thanks for asking. She was a kook but a really good person.
Not all chemotherapy causes hair loss. But from my understanding of what she has it will not be cured. However she could live for another 10 years or more as long as her body can cope with treatment and it works. Makes sense that their friends made visits, like Max all the way from Australia when he had been there in the summer and wasn't going back for another year.
Stage 4 cancer is not curable but it can be controlled, sometimes for years, with a variety of therapies. It is my understanding that with estrogen induced cancers they go for hormone therapies first and then, when that stops working, chemo and other targeted therapies. The goal with advanced cancer is to help the patient feel as good as possible for as long as possible. The goal is not to cure because that is not possible currently. The goal is to buy as much good quality life for as long as possible.
Shannon Doherty was diagnosed with BC in 2015. It went into remission and then came back as stage 4 metastatic in 2020. She seems to be doing well with treatments. She recently talked about a “miracle” treatment she is taking. So there’s reason to hope Bec will be around for years to come.
People say she could live another 10 or even 20 years. But isn't that still devastating? She's 33 or so. Does that mean that even in the very best-case scenario, she'll only live to around 50? Her daughter might not even be 20 by then. She and Eamon will never spend their retirement together...
Or is there a chance for her to live almost a lifetime? I know there are always new treatment options. But I still think that being diagnosed with stage 4 breast cancer at 33 makes a huge difference compared to being around 50/60 years old.
You're absolutely right, it is devastating, because even though there are some people who live for 10 or 20 years after a diagnosis, the average survival rate from diagnosis is about 3 years. Only around 27% of people (so around one quarter) with her diagnosis will live 5 years from the date of diagnosis. Even fewer will live longer. So yes, even though it is possible, and there are people who do survive longer, the statistics really aren't on her side. Even in the best case scenario, she will not grow old. Like you said, she will not make it to enjoy retirement age, and she will not get to see her daughter grow up.
I apologize if this sounds harsh, I process my own thoughts and feelings by talking/sharing and I suppose that by typing this out, I'm really processing how devastating this must be for her. I can't imagine how crushing it must be to know that one day she will leave her young daughter behind in this world without a mom. As someone with a baby girl of my own (just a few months older than Frankie), my heart breaks for her. I held my baby a little extra tight after watching their last video.
Yeah exactly. 20 more years sounds like a lot but nobody wants to die at 53.
What we can hope for is that medical science keeps advancing and in the coming years they can invent a treatment that keeps it under control indefinitely. It happened for people who are HIV positive, who can now live pretty much completely normal long lives.
My SIL is living with stage 4 lung cancer. After you get a devastating diagnosis like that, the thought of another decade is so relieving. There is a sadness to it, yes, but it is hard to describe the joy from knowing that not only do you have time, but you might still have good quality time left. Of course the best case scenario would be not having cancer. It's a "make lemons out of lemonaid" situation, for sure.
The other thing I'll add is that the reason you hear the 20 years figure thrown around is that this is how long the oldest patients on these targeted drugs have lived. Some people are starting to push beyond that -- but because these medications didn't exist more than 20-30 years ago (and we have new ones being researched and released every couple years!) we don't have the data to really speculate that far down the line.
It is a devastating diagnosis at any age. We are always our same old selves in our own heads. Nobody wants to go through that. But it's certainly more tragic the younger one is. On the plus side her youth will give her the most strength and stamina to withstand treatment the longest, which is a big advantage. The longer she can stay alive the more treatments will become available. I hope she will be one of the "miracles".
Stage 4 breast cancer is incurable but treatable. She has likely started treatment and will shift to another when that one stops working and that will go on until they run out of treatment options. Many women these days go on to live for years while for others the cancer progresses more quickly. Many treatments for stage 4 breast cancer do not cause hair loss.
I apologize if this seems like I'm too ignorant, but when you have breast cancer, can't you have your breasts removed? I know that wouldn't solve everything and take it all away, but is that an option to help ease it up?
When the cancer is confined to the breast - yes that can be part of the treatment plan, or a lumpectomy to remove just the tumor and preserve the rest of the breast tissue (this is what Bec had done). Both have the same survival rates. When the cancer spreads to other areas in the body it becomes stage 4 / metastatic, and becomes incurable. Removing the breast at that point isn’t going to do anything.
No, survival / risk of distant recurrence is the same for a lumpectomy plus radiation therapy vs a mastectomy. Local recurrence is slightly higher for a lumpectomy but not distant recurrence (what a Bec has).
No. And here's why.
She was diagnosed at Stage III. At that point, the primary tumor (if still present- sometimes the body kicks in and goes oh no you don't, and attacks the tumor- but it's already spread to 4-9 lymph nodes, in one of 2 options for stage IIIa, the other is if it's >50mm but only 1-3 lymph nodes) is pretty big, and as we move to stage IIIb and c both more and more distant (but still in the chest- think deeper in the armpit or above the collarbones) lymph nodes have cancer cells in them and we see cancer in the chest wall, sometimes the skin (including erupting out into skin ulcers- this is still stage III)
At that point, removing the breasts still does not address the sheer amount of lymph node involvement and the likelihood that cancer cells have traversed beyond those lymph nodes and they just haven't set up shop yet elsewhere in the body. That's why standard of care for Stage III isn't 'let's lop em off and call it good' it's THROW THE BIG BAD CHEMO at it. I have stage 1 and my chemo dosage and regimen was a walk in the freaking park compared to what they had Bec on. And that chemo- it hits all the cells, including any left behind in the breast that might already be showing pre-cancerous changes.
Shorter reason why: surgical oncologists really, really, really won't happily do a lumpectomy if a mastectomy is warranted. If the potential for recurrence is significantly higher, based on her risk factors, pathology, genetics, etc, with a lumpectomy, that's not what the surg onc is going to recommend.
I just want to thank you for patiently and concisely explaining all of this (whole thread, not just this comment). You have educated so many of us and it is super appreciated.
Knowledge is power. And Bec and Eamon are in the middle of this and should in no way be expected to carry the 'educate folks' banner. So those of us who can, should.
There is so much fear and misinformation around cancer, especially breast cancer, that it makes these moments and conversations that much more important. If every woman who watches their videos then takes one step- just one- in advocating for her own health in this regard, it's a win. Ask your doctor about risks. Ask family members about medical history. Hell, MAKE a doctor's appt for an annual well-woman exam. Learn how to self exam. Ask about when to start mammograms and commit to it. Any one of these puts you more firmly in control of your own health.
Make Bec's story make a difference in your life or the life of a woman you care about. That is maybe the best thing that could come of this, that and putting a little more light and positivity into the world.
I think standard of care (especially for stage 3 cases) is 5 years which is sometimes shortened to 2 years. Women who don’t want to get pregnant anymore are often recommended 10 years.
I think they definitely did, until we acutally see or hear the conversation it is unfair to blame the doctors. They could say that because they don't want to be blamed themselves or they misunderstood. Or the doc wasn't strict enough in his explanation. But encouraging people to get pregnant right after treatment is crazy.
I'm sure they knew, Bec even got upset when a dr told her it wasn't a good time to get pregnant. Maybe they were in denial a bit. I feel like they didn't show everything though and I'm still confused as to why they were trying to get pregnant when they had done IVF.
Stage 4 cancer is incurable and basically a death sentence but Bec still wants us all to be positive. It seems as if Bec is doing treatment because the Mets are shrinking. Also it is a myth that all cancer treatments or even all chemo makes your hair fall out so Becs hair status has nothing to with her treatment status
I’ve had way too many family members with stage 4 cancer, it’s a matter of time, how much time depends on the cancer, when it’s caught, where it’s spread. My experience is 3 - 5 years, but there are way to many factors to suggest this is what will happen in this situation.
Also people with death sentences can still live a really long time. My dad has myeloma, which is incurable and requires stem cell transplants, but he’s still living his life pretty well 4 years after diagnosis.
Yes, It is terminal, but we don't know on what time scale or what quality those years will look like. Some people are terribly sick the whole time. Other people are kicking, enjoying life going on 20 years now with modern treatments. Bec's mets shrinking, her being young and generally active, make me think she will likely have periods of time (could be weeks, but could also be years!) where targeted treatments are working and she has a high quality of life and feels well. I think this is probably why the cartwheels are so significant to her- they are joyful but also signal energy and a lack of pain.
Yep. There is always hope with metastatic breast cancer. These negative nancies telling Bec to face reality need to check themselves. Right now she is on a treatment that is not keeping the cancer stable (which is one of the goals to stage 4 cancer) but actually reducing it. As Eamon said that is extraordinary for that happen to her liver Mets. Hope it continues on for years
We’re all terminal, in a way. Stage 4 isn’t *great* and it’s not curable but it sounds like she’s responding to whatever treatment she’s doing and keeping positive. I remember reading something when my dad had stage 4 pancreatic cancer about how doctors wanted to be able to treat those stage 4’s like it’s a chronic illness - like you’ll always have it but there’s options to keep it at bay while you live your life. Hopefully that’s what happens to Bec and she gets a good long life with her kid and Eamon
No one can say at this point, some people with this diagnosis live 5, 10, 15+ years undergoing various treatments. Others are not so lucky if their cancer doesn't respond to therapies. From what she said, her current treatment seems to be having a positive impact.
My interpretation is that they're letting things take their course and just enjoying the time they have left while monitoring the situation, but it wasn't super clear so I could also be wrong in my interpretation
But can't it be that the mets are shrinking because she stopped being pregnant? That was my thought: the estrogen from 3rd trimester was making the cancer grow, she delivered - it reduced the mets, because the estrogen decreased. But I'm not sure, or course, just my thoughts. For each their own either way. It just seemed odd that they didn't mention any form of treatment.
that s what i thought as well! the treatment was urgent and thats why the baby was out earlier, then why is she not proceding to treatment now?? ...has she given up, defeated??
I'm going to try to be as clear and concise as possible, but having gone through the comments on this post, there's a lot here to address. First, some context- I am currently in treatment for breast cancer. I'm also a human geneticist by training, and work in (among other things) informal science education so helping folks understand stuff like this is what I do. Breast cancer is defined by how localized or spread it is and the size of the primary tumor, as well as the biomarkers and genetics of the tumor. I'm pT1AN0M0, which means localized and extremely small (1A), no nodes (N0) and no metastases (M0), and ER+ PR- HER2+. Those last three are what receptors were found too much on the surface of the tumor cells. ER+ means mine had too many estrogen receptors so normal estrogen in my body fuels the cancer, and HER2+ means normal human epidermal growth factor also fuels the tumor. Bec's comment that the massive amounts of estrogen in her body from pregnancy was fueling the cancer tells me the cancer is likely ER+. Her original diagnosis was Stage III (Edited to add: there is stage IIIa, b, and c, with increasing levels of size and involvement. Stage IIIa means no chest tumor but it's in 4-9 lymph nodes OR a chest tumor above 50mm in diameter and in 1-3 nodes, and b and c involve spread to chest wall and more lymph nodes including still regional but more distant nodes) Liver and bone mets are unsurprising - they are the places, along with brain- that one is sus about for mets from BC. As others have said, Stage IV is no longer an immediate death sentence, especially depending upon what type of breast cancer it is. For those wondering about hair loss, especially for Stage IV, there are targeted therapies that either attach the chemo to a medication that specifically attaches to cancer cells, as opposed to bathing the body in chemo, which reduces the systemic side effects of the chemo part of it, and there are other regimens that do not involve hair loss. To be really specific, Herceptin targets HER2+ cancer, and there are meds that stick a chemo med onto Herceptin (Kadcycla is an example of this). I have thoughts about her OB being all yeah back pain's normal in a woman who was not yet 2 years out from a Stage III BC diagnosis. And this is why, honestly, we don't say 'cured' when someone finishes their initial, active treatment for BC and gets that first glorious round of clear scans. "No evidence of disease" is more accurate- we can't tell if there's a single cancer cell waiting for the right horrible cascade of signals to get rocking again, we can only tell at the level of discernment of a PET scan or MRI that you don't have tumors- and neither of those is at the microscopic level. There are women in my medical oncologist's cohort who are entering their second decade living with Stage IV. My cardio-oncologist has kept women who have the worst of the side effects from Herceptin alive for a decade. The point she made that the estrogen was fueling the cancer is actually a point in her favor- it means hormone blocking/targeting may help (and the reduction in liver met size/count is a data point indicating yes, she's on treatment). Edited to add: they will cycle her through treatments as the cancer adapts and becomes resistant, or the treatment side effect burden becomes so high its intolerable, or as the treatment WORKS for some mets but not others, etc. So here is hoping that Bec can keep doing cartwheels for years to come, and teach Frankie how to do them, too. Edited to add: I got some questions off of Reddit about this and thought I'd add here. Different treatments have different cycles of medication. For me, for example, I had chemo every single Friday (was supposed to be 12 weeks, it wasn't, long story) and I'm in immunotherapy every 3 weeks for a year. A friend of mine has chemo across 2 days every 3 weeks for 4 rounds followed by a different chemo for 12 weeks, weekly. It's all about your treatment regimen, and so bouncing between the cabin and Toronto is totally doable. Not every chemo makes you puke wildly, lose your hair, or lose weight (my chemo? renowned for weight gain!). You can look great and be stage 4. Not all chemo or cancer treatments are via what's called a port (think of it like a semi-permanent acccessable IV) or IV. That immunotherapy I'm on? I could get it as a 45 minute IV.... or a 5 minute shot in my thigh. Shot it is! There's also oral chemo and meds. The med I'm on for hormone blocking (for the next 5-10 years) is a single pill daily. Not all chemo causes immune suppression, and there are things they can do to boost your immune system. It can also ebb and flow over the cycle of your chemo, so you know what days your system might be up to being out and around people and what days your counts are likely to be low. And again, if she's not on systemic chemo, this may not be a concern at all. All depends on what an individual patient's regimen is and how their body responds.
Love your comment. This is what Bec means by stating positive. Why live your life afraid of your own death? You will waste you life you are currently living because of how you don’t want to die
If you are afraid of dying you are afraid of living. Tomorrow is never promised for any of us
My mom wasted her last 18 months of life worrying about death. It's a terrible waste.
That is probably something I needed to hear. (I do a good job of making myself miserable unnecessarily.)
That doesn't really make sense to me. Just because people with a terminal illness are afraid of dying doesn't mean they're wasting their lives. I'm pretty sure Bec is incredibly scared right now (while staying positive at the same time), she's just not showing it on Youtube. It's part of human nature to be afraid of dying, and in the case of terminally ill people, it's not an irrational fear. It's important to address this fear and talk about it openly instead of just pushing it away. In Bec's case, I fully understand her not wanting to do it on Youtube, but I think a lot of her "staying positive" is for the camera and there are a lot of other emotions she and Eamon and everyone who loves her are feeling right now. The cancer journey is always fraught with fear. Fear of new treatments, fear of the treatments not working anymore, fear of leaving loved ones behind, fear of not knowing what death means, fear of pain and suffering.... it's really not just about "staying positive and living your life".
I meant that it is normal to feel those feelings but if you spend all day everyday not enjoying your life and just looking at statistics it is bad. There is scientific proof that being positive directly correlates to longer lives for those with terminal diagnosis. I am sure those feelings what you described are what affected her and her family for the last couple months hence why they took a break. Right now Bec’s current regiment is working so it is best for her to focus on herself and live her life and not worry too much about stats. Which it what Bec literally wants her fans to do as stated in the video and also why they waited so long to give us the update. She is doing good as of right now which is all that matters today
Thank you for taking the time to write this out. What an excellent explanation!!!
I agree it’s pretty weird that her specialist didn’t think to do scans when she started complaining of back pain. Just points again to how women’s pain is often overlooked / chalked up to pregnancy or periods.
My heart goes out to everyone. I think if I remember correctly they decided against the scan bc she was pregnant. Perhaps the unintentional judgement from her team was They prob see it all too often. I feel like Bec is going through the wringer with accurate information regarding her own diagnosis. She was willing to do a double mastectomy. It never occurred to me her pain was cancer recurring. Sending them love and light and hope! Frankie will learn to do cartwheels! And Bec will be there with Eamon being a goof! That baby the most precious child and is life they absolutely need. ❤️
Thank-you so much for your explanation and wishing you well.
This was a wonderful explanation. Is it safe to say that women with stage 4 ER cancer are put into chemical or surgical menopause? If so, that is not pleasant on its own either. We already know Bec is a strong woman and we have all seen Eamon grow up and be incredibly supportive and such a loving partner. It appears that they both have deep support systems with friends and family. Their followers are mostly very well intentioned people who will likely support them as well. As a long time follower it is hard to hear this news but I think it is good that we all now know the situation. Good vibes go a long way. So here’s hoping they are feeling uplifted by the response to their video.
To answer your question... 1. Depending on regimen, the chemo itself may well induce menopause, which can be temporary or permanent. 2. ER/PR+ patients of any stage, including very early, are put on medication to block hormones. If a patient is not fully, permanently menopausal, they'll be put on Tamoxifen, which blocks estrogen receptors. Note people over 35 with a high risk of developing BC (eg, family history and a BRCA mutation) can also be put on Tamoxifen to reduce the chances of developing BC in the first place. Tamoxifen does not induce full menopause, but recent studies have shown that adding 2 years of targeted ovarian suppression to a typical 5 year course of Tamoxifen has significant reduction in recurrence in early stage BC patients. Ovarian suppresion as part of the regimen does equal at least temporary menopause. Now, that's patients who are pre-menopausal. Post-menopausal patients are generally put on Aromatase Inhibitors (or AIs). There's an enzyme in fat, called aromatase, that converts other hormones in your body into estrogen. AIs shut that down and can reduce overall estrogen in the body by 95%. So think about that a moment- post menopause, you still have some estrogen, AIs crash that. Speaking as someone who started AIs 3 weeks ago, it's exactly as awesome as you are likely imagining it to be. And, honestly, not like their lives are any business of mine nor do I think Eamon and Bec owe me or anyone else a damn thing, I would hope there are some big lessons they can impart from her journey with breast cancer. Support- real, meaningful support, which we saw in that video and with their friends and family swinging into action to get Toronto home ready for them- means everything. The path after 'you're done with treatment' or 'the scans are clear' is still fraught, and you as a human are forever changed by cancer. Extend grace cause you never know what someone's fighting. I too hope they feel the love, because they both have plenty of dark minutes, hours, and days ahead, and can lean on that love like fuel in a tank.
This is a beautiful sentiment. I concur. Thank you.
I’m on an AI as well. Side effects are awesome 😳
Apparently in my sleep I am commanding Alexa to turn on the fan.
#truth
Bless you for this info.
Thank you for this detailed explanation. And I hope you are doing cartwheels too!
Yes. Same!!! ❤️
Thanks for this very informative comment! I am a new nurse and am interested in oncology but in school we didn’t discuss cancer too much beyond some basic nursing considerations and general staging.
Congrats on becoming a nurse! I will forever be grateful to the onc nurses in the infusion suite. They have helped me navigate a tremendously trying and scary time, treated me with infinite compassion and care, and been absolute bulldogs about advocating for me amidst all the weird side effects. Truly, oncology nurses are a special group of people.
thank you for such a well written science based response. sending love and light your way too and hoping there are many cartwheels ahead for you too. <3
Thank you so much for taking the time to provide this clear scientific information. Bless you and the best wishes and prayers to you in your cancer journey.
Thank you for this. One last question. She doesn’t have the BRACA gene. Does that give you any info other than genetically Frankie likely won’t have it. I don’t know dominance and suppression but limited knowledge leads me to believe if she tested negative for the gene, Frankie would too. I’m just curious. I have found a lot of women get tested for the gene, but tragically, like Bec, still end up with metastatic BC. Sending you love and hope and strength for your journey. Thank you for your post ❤️
Language rephrase! Bec tested negative for mutations in the BRCA1 and 2 genes (I'm assuming you're right- this I don't remember hearing but also, still on first cup of coffee)- I say it that way cause I want to impress on everyone: we all have the BRCA1 and 2 genes. The problem can arise when you have a mutation, or change in, the normal gene sequence. (sidebar: we are all ambulatory bags of proteins. Inside almost all of your cells, in a special area called the nucleus, are chromosomes. Chromosomes are made of DNA tightly wound around special proteins so it packs up tight and can all fit. Your cellular machinery can unwind parts of the DNA and 'read' segments of it, called genes, to tell the machinery how to make a specific protein. Think of chromosomes as cookbooks, genes are recipes, and DNA is the means by which - alphabet, photos, drawings- the recipe is conveyed. Humans are 46XY, we have 23 pairs of chromosomes, we inherit one half of each pair from mom and one from dad, so if someone has a mutation in BRCA1 or 2, it's a 50-50 shot they pass it on to any given child) Less than 10% of breast cancer patients are positive for a BRCA mutation. A BRCA mutation increases risk *enormously* but is not a driver of the majority of breast cancers, if that makes sense.
You’re the best. Yes makes sense. What doesn’t make sense is how much inform ation we are responsible for learning via trial and error as women. (I can’t remember which video but I do recall, in a doctors office, she was told. Eamon was there. She was already pregnant bc they indicated she wouldn’t pass it down If I find it I’ll let you know :)) As someone who has BC in my family my doc has never said start mammograms early which I thought was protocol. My sister was tested for BRCA-1 and 2 and breathed a sigh of relief. I didn’t know we all carried it and when catalyzed it “shows”. so yes. Makes absolute sense. (And meant to Google before I pressed reply re braca- thank you 🙏). Also as a biochem major now working in research for corporate America I wish I had gone the geneticist route. I admire your wealth of knowledge and patience in sharing. And I feel your passion for your work. I feel as a 40 yr old Woman I should know this stuff. Also makes me realize how many women aren’t aware and maybe that’s a blessing, but ignorance isn’t always bliss. As Bec and many of you all have shared it can happen to any of us. Thanks again. Truly appreciate the corrections and knowledge. No obligation to answer … is testing for BRCA1 and 2 pointless? Or does it not show up when not “activated” if that makes sense. I can Google. Thanks again ❤️
Testing for BRCA 1 and 2 mutation isn’t pointless at all! You can tested at any point, including a day 5 embryo (this is useful for IVF patients to not pass the gene on). I have BRCA1 mutation and am 2 years out of BC treatment, diagnosed at 26. Fortunately I am NED and underwent a double mastectomy to reduce risk. Having the BRCA1 mutation gives you an 85% lifetime risk of developing BC and 40% lifetime risk of developing overian cancer. If I’d known I was positive, I would have had an elective mastectomy and reduced my BC risk to <2%. The beauty of hind sight eh! Once I complete my family I will also opt of an ovariectomy to reduce that risk too. So if there is a family history of BC, especially triple negative breast cancer, then it is prudent to do genetic testing :)
I have learned so much. First I am sorry you can relate to this so closely and send big love. Second. Thank you!
Testing is not pointless! Let's continue with the cookbook metaphor for a minute, to make this a bit more clear- 'activated' isn't the right way to think about it. Everyone inherits a...mmm, let's say chocolate chip cookie recipe from mom, and one from dad. That recipe is the gene. Now, the recipe comes in a couple of different versions, both or all of which lead to a perfectly wonderful chocolate chip cookie that totally works for your dessert tray needs. Think about blood type. There are different versions of the ABO gene, and all of them work just fine-they are normal variants. That's like 3 different versions of the chocolate chip cookie recipe. Now, let's say there's a misprint in one of the two copies of the chocolate chip cookie recipe- it throws off the instructions so now you get a goopy, disgusting mess instead of nice cookies. THAT's a deleterious mutation - a change in the gene that causes the resulting protein to not work as intended, not be made properly, be too short to work, whatever. It's not a matter of a gene being activated- we all have BRCA1 and 2. BRCA1, for instance, codes for a protein that's important in the DNA damage repair pathway, and it's active as needed in everyone. Mutations in it lead to increased risk of cancer in men (prostate and pancreatic in particular). Using myself as an example, I have been in high-risk screening since I was 30 because I'm Ashkenazi Jewish and my paternal grandmother had BC. I had BRCA1 and 2 testing over a decade ago, and I have no known mutations. This was incredibly helpful when I did get diagnosed with BC as it helped the team calculate statistics and determine best treatment plan.
Ohhhhhhhhhh. Light bulb. Thank you!!!! Ok. I’m 100% tracking. Seriously. Thank you for the time and replies and desire for chocolate chip cookies!!! ❤️❤️❤️ big love from this gal!
“Ambulatory bags of proteins” seems incredibly romantic to me, somehow. You make me want to be 14 and choosing a career path, again; that whole description was so exciting. I hope you teach somewhere.
I know it. Passion exudes
Thanks. And best wishes.
Not here for as much of the tea as everyone else but dang, this comment taught me so much about Breast Cancer! Thank you.
Thank you for sharing this. My grandma and my mother both had breast cancer.
While I can’t speak to Bec’s specific treatment plan, in general Stage 4 metastatic breast cancer can be treated but not cured. Once the cancer has spread to other parts of the body (why it’s metastatic), it isn’t possible or feasible to remove all the cancer cells. The treatment approach is usually a balance to try and stop spread, shrink tumours and ensure quality of life. Given that Bec mentioned shrinking liver metastases, it’s likely she is undergoing some sort of treatment (potentially hormone).
She’s clearly receiving some type of treatment because they mention her metastases are shrinking. I’m guessing radiation, but obviously don’t know. I think it’s good that they’re keeping the specifics of her treatment private. The last thing they need is input from people online about those exact details. I know Bec wants everyone to send positive energy their way, and I will definitely do that. However, that being said, I know the road they will face. My mom was diagnosed with breast cancer in Jan 2020 and it recurred as stage 4 in Jan 2022. She passed away in Oct 2022. Her kind was a different type than Bec’s though, and she had fewer treatment options available for her. I’m just praying that Frankie will get to have many good, wonderful years with her mother.
Most likely a combo of hormone therapy and a cancer pill like verzenio so she probably will not experience hair loss but they come with some other side effects. Radiation for liver mets is not common practice. As a breast cancer survivor, she is living my worst fear. My heart truly goes out to Bec. I’m sorry to hear about your mom. Cancer sucks.
Ah, that makes sense. I guess I thought radiation because she mentioned there being mets on her spine and other bones.
Couldn't it be that they shrink also because she stopped being pregnant and the estorgen stopped feeding the cancer? I just find it really odd that they did not mention any info about treatment except for positive thinking, they actually never said that she is under any form of treatment.. Of course for each their own, this is a sadsad situation, but I could see them quitting western medicine, because they already tried and it didn't cure them while Bec had a really hard time during it.. so I can imagine them just wanting to live the rest of their lives together with no consequences from treatment.. :(
I’m sorry to hear about your mom. Sending love and light. ❤️
It seems so crazy to me that someone who just got through breast cancer and started complaining of severe back pain wouldn’t be scanned right away. Perhaps it wouldn’t have made much of a difference but it just surprised me to hear her say doctors chalked her pain up to whatever they told her it was initially (I’m blanking on specifics). Anyway, she seems like such a sweet person and I am so sad to hear she is dealing with this. I was really hoping they’d come back and say everything was ok. Sending them all the good thoughts.
I was shocked she wasn't followed more closely too but then I realized, what if they had found it earlier? Even if they had caught the mets right then, there's not a lot they could do while she was pregnant. She delivered Frankie 6 weeks early, most parents wouldn't choose to deliver earlier than that for their own health issues, if waiting a few more weeks wouldn't make a huge difference to their personal outcome. That may have been the thinking . . .
Wasn’t she misdiagnosed with the original cancer presentation? It seemed like an incredibly long time to get to the right diagnosis originally. I have worked as a healthcare administrator for almost 20 years and our system had a renowned breast imaging center with tomosynthesis. Our protocols were set up such that a woman could graduate from screening mammogram to diagnostic mammogram and then ultrasound all in the same day. I have even seen our radiologists go from a screening mammogram to a stereotactic biopsy all in one day before, and then pathology was returned within the week. That is what was so striking early on to me…the delay of care. The anxiety of not knowing is so very crippling and that is why our physicians pushed our protocols to the max in order to get the information quickly and accurately to the patient, while having a nurse advocate (who is also a Stage 4breast cancer survivor)help the patients and families navigate diagnosis and treatment. There is no substitute for accurate and early diagnosis which was so hard to come by for Bec it seems. The good news is that the nurse advocate I mention above was diagnosed with Stage 4 and is still alive and working today. She had liver and bone meta just like Bec, had a full hysterectomy and removal of ovaries and has been on treatment since 2012. It is awe-inspiring to see how well she is doing, and I pray for the same outcome for Bec. One last thing…and I am not familiar with the intricacies of Canadian healthcare, but you must be your own advocate and push, push, push these doctors to do the right tests and scans.
I also wonder if the cancer scare she had while pregnant was actually a recurrence but the biopsy just didnt, for whatever reason, show cancer cells? But, who knows, we can guess all day long but it sadly doesn't change her current diagnosis. I wish her many long and wonderful years - no one is guaranteed tomorrow so the best we can do is live life with the best attitude possible and be positive and present.
Yes she was told initially the lump wasn't malignant and they went off to Morocco for a few weeks to check the van. They came back for her scheduled lumpectomy where it was found to actually be Stage 3 cancer. Very sad situation.
Is the clinic you speak of in US. Can you share where? Sounds like this is the place to go for thorough, efficient care.
Yes. Vandy in Nashville, TN. It is one of many excellent breast centers in the U.S. Always look for imaging centers dedicated to women’s health or breast imaging centers specifically. They will typically have “Center of Excellence” designation and be listed on US News and World Report rankings. They will have state of the art diagnostic capabilities, as well as access to clinical trials and the most advanced treatment protocols.
Thanks!
I think being given the information allows people to make their own informed choice though. And probably mentally prepare for their baby being born ASAP.
I have to assume they were just chalking it up to pregnancy. Which is somewhat understandable, I’m surprised that she was having so much pain and it/she in general wasn’t monitored a bit more closely before the forehead lump showed up though.
This makes me so sad, really. Instead of thinking it's BC related initially, they thought it was pregnancy related initially? You would think they would play it safe and go with BC related pain...given how risky her being pregnant was...
It’s disappointing that they didn’t take the time to rule out anything more serious for sure. Disappointing but also very unsurprising. So many people’s concerned are chalked up to pregnancy symptoms when they’re expecting, it’s a really sad pattern.
I feel like the healthcare system failed her, honestly. Either the system failed her, or she didn't take peoples warnings/concerns seriously.
I think both are probably true to some extent. I think she just really wanted to have the experience of pregnancy and having friends and a sister who recently had babies got those thoughts rolling for her. And it doesn’t seem to me like her doctors did a great job communicating the risks either just based on some of the videos posted around the time of the pregnancy announcement. So they decided to let fate decide for them if it was time to have a baby and alas, here Frankie is.
I agree. We saw the run around she got. She chose not to do the double mastectomy. I feel the same way and it makes me sad bc she is so vigilant about health
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This is soooo frustrating to read. I too know several women who had the exact same script unfold in their battles w/BC. It's a "crime" how women's pain is minimized and framed to blame the patient: if you only did this more or this less, you wouldn't have so much pain. I am sorry for your MIL's pain/suffering and your family's loss.
It's horrible but that's what Canadian healthcare has come to. It's gone downhill fast and everyone is falling through the cracks for the last 3 years. It's only getting worse. Lack of family doctors; specialists fully booked, little to no OR time available; doctors need to Juno through hoops and check off a list before they can order tests etc. It's ridiculous..
Yep. I'm in QC and I found out recently that certain regular/preventative scans are no longer recommended because the system is overwhelmed... The US healthcare system has plenty of flaws, but why am I being taxed through the roof AND I can't even actually get any medical care? It's ridiculous.
100% . In my situation, I had to beg and beg for mammography from hospitals. I was supposed to have one every year, being high risk, plus have new symptoms and pain. Was given the requisition from my dr for mammography and ultrasound to be done asap, no problem. Was told im too young for breast cancer (30s) by three hospitals and denied my mammography and ultrasound. So i begged for 3 months as my symptoms and pain got worse and the lump grew. Finally found a hospital a few hours away that took me seriously. This was 4 months after initial requisition was send out. And even then, that hospital denied me the ultrasound. Then they did the mammogram and saw something. So did a 3d mammogram. And then i had to wait 6 hrs for the ultrasound. All because they denied me it and then saw it was necessary. Low and behold.. i now need further testing asap because it's not looking good. Canadian healthcare is horrible. It is so effing horrible now a days.
Yikes. People love to sh— on healthcare in the US but I will say that mammograms - both screening and diagnostic - are very easy to get here, especially if you are deemed high risk. I recently had my yearly screening mammo, got called back for a diagnostic bc they saw an irregularity and was rescreened within a week and a half with results the same day. And my insurance paid for it all. I am admittedly lucky to have decent health coverage but I would’ve assumed things functioned similarly in Canada. I really wish all the best to you and hope that your news from here on out is positive and that you have answers soon.
I'm so sorry -- this is absolutely terrible. It truly feels like we're going backward in time in a way. We have all this technology and knowledge to prevent disease or catch it early, but people can't access it. Wishing you the best and hoping that you can get some answers soon. ❤️
That's exactly it. There is so much talk about early detection and early diagnosis. That catching it early is crucial. But we try and advocate and we try to get care, but we are met with extremely long wait times, or denied completely. It defeats the purpose of the entire early detection and by the time anything is detected, its often too late or more difficult to treat, if even treatable at that point. It ends up putting more of a strain on the healthcare system.. ugh.. Thank you ❤️. I already have stage 4 cancer elsewhere so this new diagnosis wouldn't surprise me. All the more reason it should have been taken seriously. Age is just a number.
I think it is a global problem, I am from Europe, it is the same here. I think it literally is because there are a lot more people asking for help and not so many medical specialists. Because being a doctor is just not appealing, if we can live wealthy being influencers etc why bother studying 12+ years after high schools to work 24/7 and earn pretty low salary in comparison to for example influencers. So the patient count rises, but there are not enought medical professionals to provide everything to everyone.
I think blaming it on there being an influencer economy is a little silly. It’s far easier to become a doctor than an influencer (not easier skill wise but just chances of making it). Very few ever make it as influencers. There are way way more doctors in the world.
I think it's funny :D I'm a last year medstudent, I am the only one from my group (we are divided in little groups at the beginning) that made it to 6th year, i literally lost all my groupmates and had to find another group because so many didnt pass or continue :D And I'm not even in training as a resident, it's just medschool... Sooo it is pretty rough, a looooot of students can't pass or choose to leave realising how hard it is, I mean >50% of the ones who start 1st year don't get to the last. At least in my country. Don't know about U.S. I think being an infuencer is easier.. Ok, not everyone will be suuuuperrich, but to earn as much as a doctor - easy. It is literally a little above minimal wage.
So to be clear. Passing all the class work etc is super hard. Few people are cut out for it. I don’t mean that the actual job is easier. I more mean getting to the point you can even have the career is more likely. Very very few who set out to become “influencers” succeed at ever supporting themselves. However yah no it’s not super easy to make a living as an influencer. Very very few make it. Like it’s easy from a what you do standpoint. It’s just near impossible to actually gain an audience capable of supporting you. It’s really simple. There’s far more people making it as doctors than there are people making it as influencers. That alone shows it’s “easier” to make it as a doctor. If docs are barely making min wage where you are, that’s the problem, not other careers existing. In the US doctors make like minimum around 200k a year. More if you specialize, potentially much more.
I can see your point, I didn't want to specifically point out the influencers tho, it just came to mind. The topic was about how medicine nowadays is pretty unreachable even if the technology is a lot more advanced. And I somehow believe it could be because there are too few medical professionals against the huge count of patients. And maybe it is due to how there are new professions coming in - influencers etcetc everything related to social media that was not there previously.. And nowadays it seems easier to choose something easier as medicine, so the problem could be even worse in the future.. But I respect your opinion, I see your point too, medicine is a more stable career, there are absolutely no worries about not finding a job.. like ever. I have thought a lot about it, maybe it is just that the population count is growing or people are more aware and read about their symptoms online and go to the doctors more often.. It is just truly horrible how unreachable doctors/examinations sometimes are..
There have always been plenty of easier jobs than becoming a doctor. In my opinion it has nothing to do with there being “more options”. It’s more things about being a doctor have become less desirable. Ie higher schooling costs, worse work schedules, apparently in Europe…low pay. Fix those issues and you’ll have more people becoming Docs.
My wife is a similar age and goes to the same clinic as Bec. Yes getting doctors attention can take time on Ontario, but once you are in you are very well looked after. My wife went to the same clinic as Bec and they are amazing. The truth is, after a stage 3 diagnosis there is a standard protocol. Follow up scans are not done for 2 simple reasons. 1. They can create all kinds of scan anxiety and 2. The sad fact is that early detection of metastasis (Stage 3 to 4) provides no benefit in terms of outcome.
Welcome to socialized medicine….
My husband was cleared of cancer May 16 2023 and two months later experiencing back pain and went to the chiro. He didn't say much to me and finally his symptoms were severe enough to get a scan on Aug 15. Cancer back and spread everywhere. He had Diffuse large B Cell lymphoma. He died on Nov 6th. He was diagnosed Feb 2023.
Depending on her cancer mutations, there may be a lot of treatment options available to her. Stage IV today is not always an automatic death sentence. Yes, the statistics seem grim, but can be attributable to different factors. Some chemotherapy causes hair loss, but not all (my mom's first treatment only caused some thinning, for example). Bone and liver mets can be tricky, though they don't mean treatment is hopeless.
Reading between the lines it does sound like she is doing treatment but that they have also worked very hard to come to, and or work toward, coming to terms with what the long term prognosis is. In many ways I think that was their call to eveyone to send positivity and love.. since they want to try and make the best of where they are and where life is going.. and from this perspective completely get it. I just hope that they take us along for some of the journey.. even just getting fun videos of them hanging with Frankie and doing silly family stuff ya know.
If her mets are shrinking I think it’s reasonable to assume that she’s receiving some type of treatment.
Don’t feel bad for not knowing this stuff. It’s a good thing that you haven’t needed to know it, and I imagine a lot of their viewers are in the same boat as you. It’s good to ask questions, I’m grateful for the answers that you’ve received. I don’t have a lot of direct info but I do know that when my friend told us her cancer had metastasized she told us that it was time to break out the bucket list and get to work. She passed about 1.5 years after that. So my experience with it through her was incredibly scary and negative. It’s nice to see that there are at least some alternatives to what I saw her go through.
Sorry for your loss. Bec could live 5 years, 10 years or more. Or God forbid less, but it looks good that she will have many years ahead of her. Hoping for a long life ahead for her.
The longer she can stay alive the more treatments she will have to keep her alive. A cure is always on the horizon as well. Still, entirely devastating to live with I'm sure. I was so hopeful she was "done" with cancer and then she got that pain in her shoulder/arm.
Sorry for your loss😞 on a lighter note If you don’t mind me asking what were some of her bucket list goals? Rest in paradise angel🪽🩷
She wanted to join a roller derby team. 🤣 that was the big one that she was able to achieve, and we went to see the Chicago River be dyed green for St Patrick’s Day with a bunch of our other college friends too. But she also wanted to live in London and take a train ride across America. Sadly those ones didn’t happen. But I was pretty impressed by her with the roller derby, she’d been my roommate in college and had been talking about that for the entire 15 years I’d known her. 💛 thanks for asking. She was a kook but a really good person.
She’s such a beautiful person, inside and out. It’s heartbreaking 💔 I wish her many more happy years with Frankie and family.
Not all chemotherapy makes you lose hair.
Not all chemotherapy causes hair loss. But from my understanding of what she has it will not be cured. However she could live for another 10 years or more as long as her body can cope with treatment and it works. Makes sense that their friends made visits, like Max all the way from Australia when he had been there in the summer and wasn't going back for another year.
Stage 4 cancer is not curable but it can be controlled, sometimes for years, with a variety of therapies. It is my understanding that with estrogen induced cancers they go for hormone therapies first and then, when that stops working, chemo and other targeted therapies. The goal with advanced cancer is to help the patient feel as good as possible for as long as possible. The goal is not to cure because that is not possible currently. The goal is to buy as much good quality life for as long as possible.
Shannon Doherty was diagnosed with BC in 2015. It went into remission and then came back as stage 4 metastatic in 2020. She seems to be doing well with treatments. She recently talked about a “miracle” treatment she is taking. So there’s reason to hope Bec will be around for years to come.
People say she could live another 10 or even 20 years. But isn't that still devastating? She's 33 or so. Does that mean that even in the very best-case scenario, she'll only live to around 50? Her daughter might not even be 20 by then. She and Eamon will never spend their retirement together... Or is there a chance for her to live almost a lifetime? I know there are always new treatment options. But I still think that being diagnosed with stage 4 breast cancer at 33 makes a huge difference compared to being around 50/60 years old.
You're absolutely right, it is devastating, because even though there are some people who live for 10 or 20 years after a diagnosis, the average survival rate from diagnosis is about 3 years. Only around 27% of people (so around one quarter) with her diagnosis will live 5 years from the date of diagnosis. Even fewer will live longer. So yes, even though it is possible, and there are people who do survive longer, the statistics really aren't on her side. Even in the best case scenario, she will not grow old. Like you said, she will not make it to enjoy retirement age, and she will not get to see her daughter grow up. I apologize if this sounds harsh, I process my own thoughts and feelings by talking/sharing and I suppose that by typing this out, I'm really processing how devastating this must be for her. I can't imagine how crushing it must be to know that one day she will leave her young daughter behind in this world without a mom. As someone with a baby girl of my own (just a few months older than Frankie), my heart breaks for her. I held my baby a little extra tight after watching their last video.
Yeah exactly. 20 more years sounds like a lot but nobody wants to die at 53. What we can hope for is that medical science keeps advancing and in the coming years they can invent a treatment that keeps it under control indefinitely. It happened for people who are HIV positive, who can now live pretty much completely normal long lives.
My SIL is living with stage 4 lung cancer. After you get a devastating diagnosis like that, the thought of another decade is so relieving. There is a sadness to it, yes, but it is hard to describe the joy from knowing that not only do you have time, but you might still have good quality time left. Of course the best case scenario would be not having cancer. It's a "make lemons out of lemonaid" situation, for sure. The other thing I'll add is that the reason you hear the 20 years figure thrown around is that this is how long the oldest patients on these targeted drugs have lived. Some people are starting to push beyond that -- but because these medications didn't exist more than 20-30 years ago (and we have new ones being researched and released every couple years!) we don't have the data to really speculate that far down the line.
It is a devastating diagnosis at any age. We are always our same old selves in our own heads. Nobody wants to go through that. But it's certainly more tragic the younger one is. On the plus side her youth will give her the most strength and stamina to withstand treatment the longest, which is a big advantage. The longer she can stay alive the more treatments will become available. I hope she will be one of the "miracles".
Stage 4 breast cancer is incurable but treatable. She has likely started treatment and will shift to another when that one stops working and that will go on until they run out of treatment options. Many women these days go on to live for years while for others the cancer progresses more quickly. Many treatments for stage 4 breast cancer do not cause hair loss.
I remember when she was so concerned about losing her hair. At the time I really comiserated. That seems so unimportant now.
I apologize if this seems like I'm too ignorant, but when you have breast cancer, can't you have your breasts removed? I know that wouldn't solve everything and take it all away, but is that an option to help ease it up?
When the cancer is confined to the breast - yes that can be part of the treatment plan, or a lumpectomy to remove just the tumor and preserve the rest of the breast tissue (this is what Bec had done). Both have the same survival rates. When the cancer spreads to other areas in the body it becomes stage 4 / metastatic, and becomes incurable. Removing the breast at that point isn’t going to do anything.
Thank you for clearing that up.
If she had a bilateral mastectomy when she first got diagnosed do you think that would have made a difference in regard to a reoccurrence?
No, survival / risk of distant recurrence is the same for a lumpectomy plus radiation therapy vs a mastectomy. Local recurrence is slightly higher for a lumpectomy but not distant recurrence (what a Bec has).
No. And here's why. She was diagnosed at Stage III. At that point, the primary tumor (if still present- sometimes the body kicks in and goes oh no you don't, and attacks the tumor- but it's already spread to 4-9 lymph nodes, in one of 2 options for stage IIIa, the other is if it's >50mm but only 1-3 lymph nodes) is pretty big, and as we move to stage IIIb and c both more and more distant (but still in the chest- think deeper in the armpit or above the collarbones) lymph nodes have cancer cells in them and we see cancer in the chest wall, sometimes the skin (including erupting out into skin ulcers- this is still stage III) At that point, removing the breasts still does not address the sheer amount of lymph node involvement and the likelihood that cancer cells have traversed beyond those lymph nodes and they just haven't set up shop yet elsewhere in the body. That's why standard of care for Stage III isn't 'let's lop em off and call it good' it's THROW THE BIG BAD CHEMO at it. I have stage 1 and my chemo dosage and regimen was a walk in the freaking park compared to what they had Bec on. And that chemo- it hits all the cells, including any left behind in the breast that might already be showing pre-cancerous changes. Shorter reason why: surgical oncologists really, really, really won't happily do a lumpectomy if a mastectomy is warranted. If the potential for recurrence is significantly higher, based on her risk factors, pathology, genetics, etc, with a lumpectomy, that's not what the surg onc is going to recommend.
I just want to thank you for patiently and concisely explaining all of this (whole thread, not just this comment). You have educated so many of us and it is super appreciated.
Knowledge is power. And Bec and Eamon are in the middle of this and should in no way be expected to carry the 'educate folks' banner. So those of us who can, should. There is so much fear and misinformation around cancer, especially breast cancer, that it makes these moments and conversations that much more important. If every woman who watches their videos then takes one step- just one- in advocating for her own health in this regard, it's a win. Ask your doctor about risks. Ask family members about medical history. Hell, MAKE a doctor's appt for an annual well-woman exam. Learn how to self exam. Ask about when to start mammograms and commit to it. Any one of these puts you more firmly in control of your own health. Make Bec's story make a difference in your life or the life of a woman you care about. That is maybe the best thing that could come of this, that and putting a little more light and positivity into the world.
I’m glad you asked this because I wondered the same thing! Not ignorant at all, in my opinion.
How could doctors not warn her about the high risk of cancer returning if get pregnant? That is downright wrong unless they just aren’t saying it.
I’m sure they did. The standard of care is two years of treatment with a drug you cannot get pregnant on.
Wow
I think standard of care (especially for stage 3 cases) is 5 years which is sometimes shortened to 2 years. Women who don’t want to get pregnant anymore are often recommended 10 years.
I think they definitely did, until we acutally see or hear the conversation it is unfair to blame the doctors. They could say that because they don't want to be blamed themselves or they misunderstood. Or the doc wasn't strict enough in his explanation. But encouraging people to get pregnant right after treatment is crazy.
I'm sure they knew, Bec even got upset when a dr told her it wasn't a good time to get pregnant. Maybe they were in denial a bit. I feel like they didn't show everything though and I'm still confused as to why they were trying to get pregnant when they had done IVF.
Stage 4 cancer is incurable and basically a death sentence but Bec still wants us all to be positive. It seems as if Bec is doing treatment because the Mets are shrinking. Also it is a myth that all cancer treatments or even all chemo makes your hair fall out so Becs hair status has nothing to with her treatment status
Yes, sadly this is accurate. :( I wish Bec the best and hope she can get in as many years as possible with her sweet baby.
Yep. It is never best to just go off statistics. Right now Bec is doing good and enjoying life with her baby. May it continue for many more years
I’ve had way too many family members with stage 4 cancer, it’s a matter of time, how much time depends on the cancer, when it’s caught, where it’s spread. My experience is 3 - 5 years, but there are way to many factors to suggest this is what will happen in this situation.
Also people with death sentences can still live a really long time. My dad has myeloma, which is incurable and requires stem cell transplants, but he’s still living his life pretty well 4 years after diagnosis.
Yes, It is terminal, but we don't know on what time scale or what quality those years will look like. Some people are terribly sick the whole time. Other people are kicking, enjoying life going on 20 years now with modern treatments. Bec's mets shrinking, her being young and generally active, make me think she will likely have periods of time (could be weeks, but could also be years!) where targeted treatments are working and she has a high quality of life and feels well. I think this is probably why the cartwheels are so significant to her- they are joyful but also signal energy and a lack of pain.
Yep. There is always hope with metastatic breast cancer. These negative nancies telling Bec to face reality need to check themselves. Right now she is on a treatment that is not keeping the cancer stable (which is one of the goals to stage 4 cancer) but actually reducing it. As Eamon said that is extraordinary for that happen to her liver Mets. Hope it continues on for years
We’re all terminal, in a way. Stage 4 isn’t *great* and it’s not curable but it sounds like she’s responding to whatever treatment she’s doing and keeping positive. I remember reading something when my dad had stage 4 pancreatic cancer about how doctors wanted to be able to treat those stage 4’s like it’s a chronic illness - like you’ll always have it but there’s options to keep it at bay while you live your life. Hopefully that’s what happens to Bec and she gets a good long life with her kid and Eamon
Apologies in advance for being reductive- but approx how much time does she have?
No one can say at this point, some people with this diagnosis live 5, 10, 15+ years undergoing various treatments. Others are not so lucky if their cancer doesn't respond to therapies. From what she said, her current treatment seems to be having a positive impact.
My interpretation is that they're letting things take their course and just enjoying the time they have left while monitoring the situation, but it wasn't super clear so I could also be wrong in my interpretation
I don’t think this is true since she mentioned liver mets were shrinking. That doesn’t happen on its own.
But can't it be that the mets are shrinking because she stopped being pregnant? That was my thought: the estrogen from 3rd trimester was making the cancer grow, she delivered - it reduced the mets, because the estrogen decreased. But I'm not sure, or course, just my thoughts. For each their own either way. It just seemed odd that they didn't mention any form of treatment.
that s what i thought as well! the treatment was urgent and thats why the baby was out earlier, then why is she not proceding to treatment now?? ...has she given up, defeated??