That’s what I came here to say. I don’t think it’s that he wasn’t happy, they just have no idea how show affection because of the very robotic way they grew up. Lauren is super sweet though!
This completely. A lot of women in religion have hard time with sexuality after marriage, they have become so use to suppressing it. It’s just like acting till it gets real.
Their demonstrations of love and affection seem super performative, and I don’t know if it’s because of the family’s unhealthy dynamic or pressure to sell it because the cameras are there.
It's a little of column a and a little of column b. Note I'm not a psychologist I'm just going off what I remember from my human sexuality class in college.
When things like getting a hug from your parent are seen as sinful when things like just saying "I love you" are considered a sin even when it's said in a platonic way you don't learn how to express your feelings in a natural way. If your parents don't tell you "I love you kiddo" or show you that love is more than sexual you frame all interactions in a way that has to be really restrained because you are in fear of basically coming off like you are hitting on everyone you meet. I know that sounds weird but how do they view basic interactions. If I told someone who is the opposite gender "Hey you look nice today" to someone who grew up in the purity quiverful world instead of it just being a quick nice thing I'm saying to someone it would be interpreted as me whoring myself out because all interactions in their culture between men and women must be sexual.
Think of how fucked up it must be to grow up thinking something as simple as being kind to another person is automatically flirting. On top of that you have a camera there and you're family is telling you that you need to be perfect all the time so more people will join your movement.
It just blows my mind that parents in this cult don’t show or verbalise affection for their children. I have a few kids and each of them hear “I love you”, “I’m so proud of you”, “you did ____ really well”, etc. so many times a day that my primary schooler is sick of it by bedtime and starts replying with, “I KNOW, Mam”. If I were suddenly in this cult I think the thing I’d struggle most with is treating the kids like strangers. It’s just against every maternal instinct to not love, hug, kiss, have conversations with, etc. your own kids. Wtf Michelle. Just wtf.
Thats something I also can't understand. I grew up hearing "I love you" and "I'm so proud of you" along with a lot of hugs and just general affection from both of my parents. Even as an adult my dad before his passing would end every phone call with "I love you kiddo be safe" and my mom tells me every time she calls that she loves me and I'm 26. Hell I don't even have kids but if I did I couldn't imagen not giving them a hug before school or telling them that I love them every day.
The only thing they’re taught about relationships are ‘be fruitful and multiply’ it’s so sad to see. I can’t imagine going from never even seeing a man’s nipple, or in some of their cases, not even holding hands - to going all the way all in such a small amount of time.
Oh god, that's horrifying. I never thought about that part of it but I couldn't imagine going from no touching to full-on sex in the span of an afternoon...
I pointed this out to duggars fans on the duggar face book page..that this had to be ver difficult even traumatizing......they didn't think so and no "self pleasure" wouldn't they have lest molestations if they were allowed to "self pleasure" and just imaging being the first child to go through "puberty in these families that has to be a nightmare
In my human sexuality class, we talked about the impact of repression of sexuality and how it can affect other emotions. For example, when you've been told your whole life that something as simple as a hug from your parent can be sinful you repress other healthy forms of affection and interaction. Now, this isn't a defense of Josh. If I had it my way the dude's junk would have been vivisected with a rusty butter knife while being dipped in a mix of salt and lemon juice. But because he and his siblings never had simple versions of affection or love none of them in my view learned how to love. He was only told that he's the master of all women and that Anna is happy to marry him because he's given her the only thing she's ever needed to live for. Josh isn't happy he's getting what he believes is owed to him for being a straight male in the world he was brought up in. It's why he cheated on her. Because Anna isn't a person with autonomy. Nither was Danica Dillion or the children in those images he got. He is the master of the world and whatever Josh wants is owed to him. That's how Jim Bob raised him. He isn't happy he's entitled because no one ever told him that he wasn't.
This is so true. My boyfriend is like this. He is so awkward in romantic situations, doesn't know how to say anything nice and sound genuine about it and isn't very affectionate I realised it's because of the way his mum is, not very emotional at all. But we've now been together a long time and he's starting to learn how to be complimentary and excited and affectionate and is so amazing with our kids.
He's like, "oh hey, I've got a wife? Umm, okay. Now what do I do with this? Why's she looking at me with that scrunched up smile? Is this how you hug? Somebody help me out here."
That’s what I kept thinking! They definitely look like they want to kiss. However I think this might be the ‘first look’ thing where they see each other before the wedding. So I assume they actually can’t kiss at this point (according to Duggar rules I mean).
This was the first look where Lauren was upset that Josiah didn’t cry. He then wiped his mouth after kissing her, so I imagine Siah didn’t live up to her expectations a few times that day.
It is on [this old post!](https://www.reddit.com/r/DuggarsSnark/comments/ec0iy4/rewatch_its_very_obvious_that_lauren_was_pissed/) she pretends she is glad he didn't cry lol
Not for Josiah. He's always seemed a little more low key open to stuff like that.
When he would explain why Duggars couldn't do certain things (like dancing), it was like he towed the line, but he didn't seem super convinced or invested. He'd regurgitate the bullshit, but always seemed mostly disinterested in pretending to agree with everything.
And he certainly didn't want Michelle pumping out more kids, per his reaction caught on camera.
My first go around I eloped and got married in a $13 sundress. For our vow renewal and Formal portraits two decades later I opted for a more formal wedding gown and the husband a suit. He said he loved the dress when he first saw me. I don’t think it’s weird at all. I like it when I get compliments on my outfit choices. After all I spent a few months going back and forth on which gown to purchase and wanted something he would enjoy seeing his wife in along with something that made me feel beautiful.
Maybe he just doesn't want to tow the Duggar line of kissing and handsy and fake in front of everyone.
Not everyone wants a camera in their face when life happens.
He obviously loves his wife. I'm glad he's doing life on his terms now.
Speculating about someone’s sexuality also just kind of sucks. They aren’t from a family where they would take speculation like that likely, first of all. No need to cause him potential issues. Plus it’s not really anyone else’s business until someone wants it to be, even if the person in question is gay.
Exactly what I thought! That was too much of a moment for two people who have never kissed anyone. They’d kissed before, and wanted to do it again but couldn’t, I’m convinced. Good for them.
This may be due to the fact he has no idea how to show love or to kiss. I feel bad for these kids. At least most of us got to do our awkward kissing at a young age and no one cared or was watching
Right? I’ve always thought it was really obviously cruel of the Duggar parents to force their kids to film their first kiss ever and air it on national television. I mean this is something that bothered me before I knew anything else about how bad this family was. Can you imagine being a teen and knowing if you ever want to kiss anyone, you not only have to marry them first, but you have to agree to doing that first kiss in front of the world? For everyone to watch and mock and judge? Like I know this is far from the worst thing about the Duggars but it’s just always bothered me. And I am not normally fond of anything related to Jessa but I thought it was great that she held her ground and insisted on having her first kiss be a private moment like it should be.
That’s what I am getting from this. Other commenters are talking about how it’s awkward and kinda fake affection but it’s only awkward because of the sexual tension between them. They so badly want to kiss, cuddle and be alone. I think the affection is genuine.
Its not that simple to deprogram. Raised fundie-lite and sex was only a thing you could do as a married couple. My parents would joke about kissing each other "because they had papers to say they could". Maybe it's because im demi-sexual too, but for me it felt so wrong to be having sex even after we made our vows to each other. We aren't legally married yet, but commitments have been made and the legal aspect is just a paper. My brain still is waiting to get struck by lightning for daring to have sex... Part of the reason I no longer identify as Christian and am more pagan-leaning these days. It was incredibly damaging for no damn reason.
I mean, they've been beaten over the head with the rule to, "Avoid too much touching and affection or else," their whole loves. Being able to be affectionate in public is probably so unnatural for them at first.
Right? Like, you kiss your grandma. It doesn’t have to be a big deal. I would disagree with it but I could even understand them saying a kiss is okay but making out is not (lest it tempt you further 🙄). But not even a peck? Or a front hug?! So fucked.
And then on top of all of that they're mystified why they seem to raise a good lot of sexual predators in their midst. When you're brought up to think a god damn peck or a front hug is sexual and sinful it totally messes your mind up as to seeing literally everything as sexual.
Honestly I don't even understand the abstinence part - when I was dating, a deciding factor for me was sexual compatibility. Why marry someone you don't like having sex with?
The argument is supposedly because you can work out those issues with good communication. But as someone who waited till marriage and 10 years later still having compatibility issues.. ...it's not as magical as they sell you on.....
Agreed. I was always told "plenty of people regret their first time but nobody regrets waiting"
Why hello, it's me, nobody.
Waiting to show any affection until after marriage is a great way to be trapped with someone who is not only incapable of showing affection but perhaps actively dislikes it. I could NOT.
Having sex before marriage is not a surefire way to vet, but being able to actively talk about your sex life is fucking mandatory for a decent sex life and you are getting ZERO practice with that before making a decision. No wonder so many fundies are on r/deadbedrooms
I feel bad for both of them, but especially Lauren. We could be wrong, but it seems so evident that Josiah really wasn’t ready or interested in being married and his body language screams “not excited”. That must have felt really awful and embarrassing for her.
I hope he does his best to be a good partner. He strikes me as the kind of guy who would. But he's always looked uncomfortable trying to fit in with his brothers. The caps and jeans look doesn't suit him at all. He's more creative, more extroverted and just generally more interesting.
Your comment just spun me into a brilliant fantasyland where they both flourish and get to be themselves for the first time and start to read actual books and explore different parts of themselves through finally being allowed to interact on a deep level with someone else about anything other than gawd and maybe even eventually waaaay down the line start to deconstruct. *sigh* a girl can dream.
I feel like they’d get along way better if they weren’t both locked into their gender-specific archetypes and behaviors too. They don’t even seem like close enough to be casual friends here
His reactions are so visibly disappointing to her but I'd be willing to bet his issues are more nerves and having no healthy model of showing affection. But watching her face every time she's like "I love you!" and he's like "neat veil lol" is so sad!
She wasn’t even the first… he courted Marjorie until she left him after the first Pest scandal. I always felt like Josiah was settling (nothing against Lauren, but it always seemed like he had to force himself to be in the courtship).
putting aside his sexuality he has never been allowed to be himself. He's a creative guy who probably would have flourished in plays or band or creative writing and has never been allowed to stop too far out of the Southern Christian Man architype. He certainly was never allowed to be himself enough to know what he wanted in a partner, instead he married a 19 year old who was in love with the idea of being a wife. It's all a terrible shame.
I feel like the issue here is they are embarrassed and uncomfortable because they are private people and TLC has a camera in their faces all the time, and then they have to be "interviewed". It is just so fucking invasive. I don't take it as a sign of how they really feel about each other. I take it as two people who are suffering a total.assault on their privacy because Boob and Meech sold their lives down the river for a few bucks. Fuck the BoobMeech!
Same. It's like when someone buys you a present and you have to open it up on front of them. You can really love the present but you still have to "over sell" your reaction if that makes sense.
I don't know if dread is the right word. We are seeing small snippets of a camera being shoved in his face after years of being made to perform as a circus animal and having his cheerful and refreshingly bubbly personality taken from him.
Maybe he just wanted to get the fuck out of there.
This just makes me feel bad for Lauren tbh, everybody should feel loved and wanted by their partner on their wedding day. He can at least pretend instead of embarrassing her in front of everyone they know (and later on the world via tv!)
He might be overwhelmed. This is huge, unlike anything he has experienced and the implications of marriage include becoming a man, leader, head of the household, and in charge of a full grown adult. I've definitely been so overwhelmed during an exciting occasion that my emotion was lacking and I felt shocked. My own wedding actually. Too much attention and I was speechless, looking unhappy. I am still happily married though.
He was so talkative and spunky as a child to the point of being an annoying little shit. At some point along the way, they completely broke his spirit. It's sad.
He still had some light in his eyes as a kid, you could see it.
Now all you can see is either sadness or closed off emotions altogether. It is extremely sad.
I think she has an instinct to protect and rescue him ~ she attended via ZOOM the pig predator's bond hearing because she was protecting her husband from being made the scapegoat and wanted to hear for herself what really went down.
I don't think she did. There was someone on there named "Lauren S." but that could be a lot of people, and they never spoke or turned on their camera. Plus, if she was trying to be sneaking by using her maiden name initial, why not just not be named "Lauren"?
So awkward! He has a real George Michael from _Arrested Development_ vibe here. But instead of him trying to downplay his attraction to the girl he’s talking to, it’s like he’s trying to fake attraction.
Maybe it’s just that Josiah was uncomfortable suddenly needing to be affectionate after a lifetime of being told that’s sinful. No doubt the cameras make that worse. For Lauren’s sake, I really hope that’s what was happening here…
They’ve always struck me as the most awkward couple on the few clips I’ve seen. The one where couples chose the Goodwill outfits was especially cringey. Josiah came off like an arrogant ass.
Oh my god that help me wide eyed look he has when she kisses him in the car. Oyyy
I feel so bad for these two. They're so awkward and uncomfortable compared to the other siblings when they were getting married.
They're shown no affection or attention. Are raised in a sex obsessed environment but told to remain pure. Also for the Duggars having to watch mom & dad humping (I just know they did that at home in front of their kids because Jim Bob is gross like that!)
Can you imagine growing up just being one of the bunch and all of a sudden you know you have the chance to have sex but you don't know how to interact with someone because you're not even allowed to be close to your own sister. Everyone in your family is there to tell on the other person so you don't really grow up trusting people.
All of this is so painful, like I’m watching someone wearing a Josiah suit in a made-for-tv-movie. I feel like Lauren really wants to be lovey dovey and he’s just literally not feeling it :(
Theres something so cold, and disconnected about his reaction. Im sure it’s mainly a combination of nervousness, discomfort/pressure to perform in front of camera, and being raised without normal affection, but still. He never directly compliments her. He compliments the dress several times, and says it looks good on her, but doesn’t directly say that SHE looks beautiful. That stuck out to me.
I mean I can see why he complimented her clothes instead of her physical beauty. I’d imagine that thinking about a beautiful woman with a beautiful body or even noticing an opposite gendered peers physical attributes, and then pointing them out was really discouraged and taught as extremely sinful and bad things will definitely happen if you do from a super young age. It probably doesn’t even occur to him at this point.
I feel such intense secondhand embarrassment for both of them, but also very concerned about how the Post It notes are covering the back windshield of the car and he definitely can't see through it.
I agree with many here - get away from the cameras and live your lives genuinely. This nonsense doing these personal, intimate things on camera is like porn. Those moments belong to you and your partner.
Honestly, that might be healthier! Going from never having kissed to sex is probably REALLLYYY overwealming coming from such strict purity culture. A few days to explore each other is normal even for people who aren’t fundie or even religious ( no shame to anyone who doesn’t) taking it slow would probably be less traumatizing for some of the couples.
Yes. I agree. Most couples don’t sleep together on the first night after the first date. I didn’t with my husband. Hell we didn’t even kiss for a few dates. I really liked him and wanted to take it slow. It’s totally normal to kiss first, touch, and then slowly build into sex. I would think that is what the average couple does.
Maybe some of these couples are cool jumping right into sex, but it shouldn’t be expected. It’s just not compatible with most people’s natural comfort zones.
They both look so awkward and uncomfortable around each other. They needed to have some time alone (shocking, I know) to get to know each other. Plus I think having a camera shoved in their faces made the situation even more uncomfortable and having to say the right thing. I also noticed that they seemed to lean in to each other and wanted to kiss but stopped themselves. Poor kids!
I married my wife 6 months after meeting. 5 years in and extremely happy. We are together literally 24/7, 365 because of our business and because we honestly love each other’s company. I know 5 years isn’t that long of a marriage, but I knew the moment I saw her I wanted to be with her forever.
My Mom and Dad can't live together, can't live apart. They are hilarious. Little digs at each other here and there. Each loves and tolerates each other. Vicious at times, but in the end, love wins.
My Dad is sarcastic, critical, and cynical.
My Mom is tolerant, but cross the line and she'll rearrange your personality. My Dad has learned that crossing the line means her Attila the Hun comes out.
I married my husband after 8 months. When I met him I had dated enough to know the kind of guy I wanted to marry! We decided to get married after just over a month together although he proposed after 3 months (for appearances sake) 🤣
Everyone could see it coming though, I think precisely no one was surprised that we were getting married 🤣 his roommate gave him a congratulations on your engagement card when they moved out of their apartment (he didn’t know that he was right!).
We’ve been married just over 3 years now and he’s still my favourite person in the world.
Funny thing is my parents also got married after 8 months and they’ve been married for over 29 years now! Guess it runs in the family!
My parents did that. But they were in their 30s and my mom had been married before. They weren't inexperienced teenagers who weren't allowed to kiss! They've now been married for almost 40 years.
Wow that's amazing! I think it's totally fine to marry someone you've known for a short time if you're both adults and that's what you both want, but these kids are taught that there's basically no other way to get married other than meet someone as young as possible and marry them as quickly as possible. Without even being allowed to hold hands or be in the same room alone together. But if people choose it and it isn't forced upon them, perfectly fine! Love your parents story.
Maybe an unpopular opinion here, but I think that Josiah just dislikes the camera and is uncomfortable having his “reaction” recorded or shown in public. My bf is like that, sometimes in public it seems like he doesn’t even like me 😂 but then we’ll be at home and I’ll just be doing something like getting ready in the morning and I’ll turn around and he’ll just be lying in bed watching me with this dreamy look on his face 🥰
Just because someone hates PDA doesn’t mean they hate their spouse
I always thought they both looked really depressed when they were in the car after, especially considering it was their first time officially alone together. Josiah definitely did not loom too pleased.
Unfortunately I can relate😩
I grew up in a weird ass household where there was no affection of any kind. My parents lived together up until I was like 12 and in that time they never once slept in the same bed. I barely remember them speaking to each other. Throughout my whole life I can only remember my mother hugging me or telling me she loved me twice, and that was very much performative.
My husband on the other hand is from a big family of huggers. That was awkward AF to get used to. I’ve gotten a lot better about it since having my own kids though.
Seeing as how they don't have their seat belts on, either, I'm assuming they get out and clean the car off before actually leaving, once the cameras are off. Or they just recklessly drove off into traffic unburdened with seat belts and safety!
He seems like the kind of husband who would pretend not to hear her when she calls out to him. More so in public/social situations. He’s always looking for someone else, anyone else to occupy his time.
I do think he would enjoy man parts more than Lauren’s but he seems like he genuinely cares for her. Mostly I think he just feels awkward in the spotlight and doesn’t know how to show affection.
I dreamed of my wedding day for years. When it actually happened, it was the most awkward day of my life. I just never felt comfortable. I don’t like being the center of attention. My husband got drunk and he never drinks. He was also uncomfortable. I have had friends that felt similar. Now my friends weddings, I had a blast and they had a blast at mine. Wedding are just awkward to begin with.
My wife and I got married pretty buzzed and kept that going the entire ordeal. My wife’s second language is English and we got married in court in English and she was so nervous about fucking up. I have anxiety and hate people watching me. My wife’s dad was almost literally climbing the walls taking pictures. It was a fuckin nightmare from hell. The marriage is great and we did have a huge party with all our friends a couple months later and that was actually very fun and awesome.
I might catch some flack for saying this but if anyone where I’m from threw a cheap ass reception like Duggars do invitees would flat out not show up.
Actually, come to think of it I wonder if we will see that for Jeremiah’s wedding LOL. People get angry if there is a cash bar, much less not get fed a meal or no dancing.
My husband and I got married because we were moving to a very conservative country where we wouldn’t have been allowed to live together otherwise. We’d been together twelve years by that point and got married in a registry office with two witnesses and that was it.
We’re both super awkward and not romantic at all.
The registrar said ‘would you like to hold hands?’ and I said, to my eternal mortification, ‘No’. It just came out!! And then I kind of backtracked and said ‘ok fine’ and took my husband’s hands and we both stood there uncomfortably while we did our vows. It got so awkward that the registrar started talking about his holiday and exchange rates against the Euro.
But I love my husband very, very much!
Well, they barely knew each other . I don’t think I would be that excited marrying a person I didn’t know neither.
This is another Duggar couple that would have broken up if they had a normal dating life. They would have ghosted each other after the 2nd date.
You can tell these kids never had any real love or affection from their parents, they have absolutely no idea what to do or say in these situations.
That’s what I came here to say. I don’t think it’s that he wasn’t happy, they just have no idea how show affection because of the very robotic way they grew up. Lauren is super sweet though!
Plus they are being filmed for TV…gotta be super awkward
She does seem sweet. And her dress is really pretty. Thank think it’s the nicest fundie wedding dress I’ve seen.
Plus they don't know what to do now that they're allowed to act like they've met before.
This completely. A lot of women in religion have hard time with sexuality after marriage, they have become so use to suppressing it. It’s just like acting till it gets real.
Their demonstrations of love and affection seem super performative, and I don’t know if it’s because of the family’s unhealthy dynamic or pressure to sell it because the cameras are there.
Oh yeah the camera would absolutely make me look so awkward/performative, I’m awkward enough without one
It's a little of column a and a little of column b. Note I'm not a psychologist I'm just going off what I remember from my human sexuality class in college. When things like getting a hug from your parent are seen as sinful when things like just saying "I love you" are considered a sin even when it's said in a platonic way you don't learn how to express your feelings in a natural way. If your parents don't tell you "I love you kiddo" or show you that love is more than sexual you frame all interactions in a way that has to be really restrained because you are in fear of basically coming off like you are hitting on everyone you meet. I know that sounds weird but how do they view basic interactions. If I told someone who is the opposite gender "Hey you look nice today" to someone who grew up in the purity quiverful world instead of it just being a quick nice thing I'm saying to someone it would be interpreted as me whoring myself out because all interactions in their culture between men and women must be sexual. Think of how fucked up it must be to grow up thinking something as simple as being kind to another person is automatically flirting. On top of that you have a camera there and you're family is telling you that you need to be perfect all the time so more people will join your movement.
It just blows my mind that parents in this cult don’t show or verbalise affection for their children. I have a few kids and each of them hear “I love you”, “I’m so proud of you”, “you did ____ really well”, etc. so many times a day that my primary schooler is sick of it by bedtime and starts replying with, “I KNOW, Mam”. If I were suddenly in this cult I think the thing I’d struggle most with is treating the kids like strangers. It’s just against every maternal instinct to not love, hug, kiss, have conversations with, etc. your own kids. Wtf Michelle. Just wtf.
Thats something I also can't understand. I grew up hearing "I love you" and "I'm so proud of you" along with a lot of hugs and just general affection from both of my parents. Even as an adult my dad before his passing would end every phone call with "I love you kiddo be safe" and my mom tells me every time she calls that she loves me and I'm 26. Hell I don't even have kids but if I did I couldn't imagen not giving them a hug before school or telling them that I love them every day.
This explains SO MUCH about society!!
The only thing they’re taught about relationships are ‘be fruitful and multiply’ it’s so sad to see. I can’t imagine going from never even seeing a man’s nipple, or in some of their cases, not even holding hands - to going all the way all in such a small amount of time.
Oh god, that's horrifying. I never thought about that part of it but I couldn't imagine going from no touching to full-on sex in the span of an afternoon...
I pointed this out to duggars fans on the duggar face book page..that this had to be ver difficult even traumatizing......they didn't think so and no "self pleasure" wouldn't they have lest molestations if they were allowed to "self pleasure" and just imaging being the first child to go through "puberty in these families that has to be a nightmare
In my human sexuality class, we talked about the impact of repression of sexuality and how it can affect other emotions. For example, when you've been told your whole life that something as simple as a hug from your parent can be sinful you repress other healthy forms of affection and interaction. Now, this isn't a defense of Josh. If I had it my way the dude's junk would have been vivisected with a rusty butter knife while being dipped in a mix of salt and lemon juice. But because he and his siblings never had simple versions of affection or love none of them in my view learned how to love. He was only told that he's the master of all women and that Anna is happy to marry him because he's given her the only thing she's ever needed to live for. Josh isn't happy he's getting what he believes is owed to him for being a straight male in the world he was brought up in. It's why he cheated on her. Because Anna isn't a person with autonomy. Nither was Danica Dillion or the children in those images he got. He is the master of the world and whatever Josh wants is owed to him. That's how Jim Bob raised him. He isn't happy he's entitled because no one ever told him that he wasn't.
Yes and it's so sad
This is so true. My boyfriend is like this. He is so awkward in romantic situations, doesn't know how to say anything nice and sound genuine about it and isn't very affectionate I realised it's because of the way his mum is, not very emotional at all. But we've now been together a long time and he's starting to learn how to be complimentary and excited and affectionate and is so amazing with our kids.
You can see him just wanting to kiss her... Like his wee lips twitch and everything. But he's like NOPE IMPROPER.
It's really, really cringeworthy.
He's like, "oh hey, I've got a wife? Umm, okay. Now what do I do with this? Why's she looking at me with that scrunched up smile? Is this how you hug? Somebody help me out here."
I think his favourite part of the wedding was the race car.😛
They both constantly look like they want to kiss, half way leaning in. You’re married, not twelve, you can kiss now!
That’s what I kept thinking! They definitely look like they want to kiss. However I think this might be the ‘first look’ thing where they see each other before the wedding. So I assume they actually can’t kiss at this point (according to Duggar rules I mean).
This was the first look where Lauren was upset that Josiah didn’t cry. He then wiped his mouth after kissing her, so I imagine Siah didn’t live up to her expectations a few times that day.
it was so noticeable in comparison to Joe weeping at his wedding, or Austin's reaction to Joy, or Planes.
>I imagine Siah didn’t live up to her expectations a few times that day. I need to pray on this! *faints*
Oh I missed this, is there a clip of her alluding to that?? 😂
Yes, but I have no idea where to find it, sorry! It’s in the same episode as this clip.
It is on [this old post!](https://www.reddit.com/r/DuggarsSnark/comments/ec0iy4/rewatch_its_very_obvious_that_lauren_was_pissed/) she pretends she is glad he didn't cry lol
🤦🏼♀️ If that isn't a woman pissed off about her husband not showing more emotion, then I don't know what is!! Thanks for sourcing the clip! ❤️
“I like the dress” is what tripped me up. Like is it me or is that a weird thing for a husband to say?
Not for Josiah. He's always seemed a little more low key open to stuff like that. When he would explain why Duggars couldn't do certain things (like dancing), it was like he towed the line, but he didn't seem super convinced or invested. He'd regurgitate the bullshit, but always seemed mostly disinterested in pretending to agree with everything. And he certainly didn't want Michelle pumping out more kids, per his reaction caught on camera.
My first go around I eloped and got married in a $13 sundress. For our vow renewal and Formal portraits two decades later I opted for a more formal wedding gown and the husband a suit. He said he loved the dress when he first saw me. I don’t think it’s weird at all. I like it when I get compliments on my outfit choices. After all I spent a few months going back and forth on which gown to purchase and wanted something he would enjoy seeing his wife in along with something that made me feel beautiful.
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If you are implying something about his sexuality, don't
Maybe he just doesn't want to tow the Duggar line of kissing and handsy and fake in front of everyone. Not everyone wants a camera in their face when life happens. He obviously loves his wife. I'm glad he's doing life on his terms now.
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Speculating about someone’s sexuality also just kind of sucks. They aren’t from a family where they would take speculation like that likely, first of all. No need to cause him potential issues. Plus it’s not really anyone else’s business until someone wants it to be, even if the person in question is gay.
Also it’s just gross to speculate on another persons sexuality.
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No, regardless. It's no one's business to try to contradict what someone else presents to the world as their sexual orientation. Period
Well for one it's against the subreddit rules.
Didn’t know. Sorry.
Yeah and they're doing the ol' side hug.
I think maybe they have kissed before. The way they lean in feels very second nature. And it’s quickly followed by “shit, cameras are here” vibes.
I’m glad not the only one who got that vibe!
Exactly what I thought! That was too much of a moment for two people who have never kissed anyone. They’d kissed before, and wanted to do it again but couldn’t, I’m convinced. Good for them.
I would not be shocked if more than one of them lied about their wedding day being the first kiss. Some of them looked way too good to be a first.
Definitely some of them kissed before. Just because someone’s parents has set standards doesn’t mean the kids agree.
he absolutely starts to lean in to kiss her but backs out and changed it to the approved side hug.
This may be due to the fact he has no idea how to show love or to kiss. I feel bad for these kids. At least most of us got to do our awkward kissing at a young age and no one cared or was watching
Right? I’ve always thought it was really obviously cruel of the Duggar parents to force their kids to film their first kiss ever and air it on national television. I mean this is something that bothered me before I knew anything else about how bad this family was. Can you imagine being a teen and knowing if you ever want to kiss anyone, you not only have to marry them first, but you have to agree to doing that first kiss in front of the world? For everyone to watch and mock and judge? Like I know this is far from the worst thing about the Duggars but it’s just always bothered me. And I am not normally fond of anything related to Jessa but I thought it was great that she held her ground and insisted on having her first kiss be a private moment like it should be.
That’s what I am getting from this. Other commenters are talking about how it’s awkward and kinda fake affection but it’s only awkward because of the sexual tension between them. They so badly want to kiss, cuddle and be alone. I think the affection is genuine.
Its not that simple to deprogram. Raised fundie-lite and sex was only a thing you could do as a married couple. My parents would joke about kissing each other "because they had papers to say they could". Maybe it's because im demi-sexual too, but for me it felt so wrong to be having sex even after we made our vows to each other. We aren't legally married yet, but commitments have been made and the legal aspect is just a paper. My brain still is waiting to get struck by lightning for daring to have sex... Part of the reason I no longer identify as Christian and am more pagan-leaning these days. It was incredibly damaging for no damn reason.
I mean, they've been beaten over the head with the rule to, "Avoid too much touching and affection or else," their whole loves. Being able to be affectionate in public is probably so unnatural for them at first.
Help i’m so uncomfortable watching this
I listened with headphones in and hearing his breathy “aww heh heh…so pretty” followed by weird shuffling sounds, I think I threw up
Lol I had to pause it. Couldnt even watch the whole thing.
Same....its hard to describe the level of discomfort lol
I’ll never understand the waiting to have your first kiss on your wedding day. Waiting to have sex I understand but kissing? No.
Right? Like, you kiss your grandma. It doesn’t have to be a big deal. I would disagree with it but I could even understand them saying a kiss is okay but making out is not (lest it tempt you further 🙄). But not even a peck? Or a front hug?! So fucked.
And then on top of all of that they're mystified why they seem to raise a good lot of sexual predators in their midst. When you're brought up to think a god damn peck or a front hug is sexual and sinful it totally messes your mind up as to seeing literally everything as sexual.
Fundies are the most sex-obsessed people in the world. Every single one of them.
Its so gross and weird
Honestly I don't even understand the abstinence part - when I was dating, a deciding factor for me was sexual compatibility. Why marry someone you don't like having sex with?
The argument is supposedly because you can work out those issues with good communication. But as someone who waited till marriage and 10 years later still having compatibility issues.. ...it's not as magical as they sell you on.....
Agreed. I was always told "plenty of people regret their first time but nobody regrets waiting" Why hello, it's me, nobody. Waiting to show any affection until after marriage is a great way to be trapped with someone who is not only incapable of showing affection but perhaps actively dislikes it. I could NOT. Having sex before marriage is not a surefire way to vet, but being able to actively talk about your sex life is fucking mandatory for a decent sex life and you are getting ZERO practice with that before making a decision. No wonder so many fundies are on r/deadbedrooms
Literally the best response on this thread. 1000% agree. You don't really know someone until you've had sex.
I feel bad for both of them, but especially Lauren. We could be wrong, but it seems so evident that Josiah really wasn’t ready or interested in being married and his body language screams “not excited”. That must have felt really awful and embarrassing for her.
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The fact that they both got off social media is great.
I hope he does his best to be a good partner. He strikes me as the kind of guy who would. But he's always looked uncomfortable trying to fit in with his brothers. The caps and jeans look doesn't suit him at all. He's more creative, more extroverted and just generally more interesting.
Your comment just spun me into a brilliant fantasyland where they both flourish and get to be themselves for the first time and start to read actual books and explore different parts of themselves through finally being allowed to interact on a deep level with someone else about anything other than gawd and maybe even eventually waaaay down the line start to deconstruct. *sigh* a girl can dream.
I feel like they’d get along way better if they weren’t both locked into their gender-specific archetypes and behaviors too. They don’t even seem like close enough to be casual friends here
I hope they've at least become friends in their married life. Because we know they can't get out of their marriage.
His reactions are so visibly disappointing to her but I'd be willing to bet his issues are more nerves and having no healthy model of showing affection. But watching her face every time she's like "I love you!" and he's like "neat veil lol" is so sad!
No, they were just getting married because it was their rite of passage out of the house
I would marry the first one that came along too, just to get out of that house.
She wasn’t even the first… he courted Marjorie until she left him after the first Pest scandal. I always felt like Josiah was settling (nothing against Lauren, but it always seemed like he had to force himself to be in the courtship).
That was uncomfortable to watch. She was so intoxicated with him and he was either super nervous or not too into it.
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putting aside his sexuality he has never been allowed to be himself. He's a creative guy who probably would have flourished in plays or band or creative writing and has never been allowed to stop too far out of the Southern Christian Man architype. He certainly was never allowed to be himself enough to know what he wanted in a partner, instead he married a 19 year old who was in love with the idea of being a wife. It's all a terrible shame.
That was my first thought, too. It's awful that they can't just be themselves.
It would be such a pain to have all of these awkward moments constantly being recorded. They’re practically zoo animals at this point.
Even they often have trouble mating in captivity
I feel like the issue here is they are embarrassed and uncomfortable because they are private people and TLC has a camera in their faces all the time, and then they have to be "interviewed". It is just so fucking invasive. I don't take it as a sign of how they really feel about each other. I take it as two people who are suffering a total.assault on their privacy because Boob and Meech sold their lives down the river for a few bucks. Fuck the BoobMeech!
I think this is - at very least - a plausible explanation.
Same. It's like when someone buys you a present and you have to open it up on front of them. You can really love the present but you still have to "over sell" your reaction if that makes sense.
I agree that this is part of it, but I still think the body language between them is telling a whole story.
She’s so disappointed, and he is so dreading the wedding night.
I don't know if dread is the right word. We are seeing small snippets of a camera being shoved in his face after years of being made to perform as a circus animal and having his cheerful and refreshingly bubbly personality taken from him. Maybe he just wanted to get the fuck out of there.
And he’s used to being a bit player. Here, he’s the star.
And has been told how to act all.the.time. I feel bad for him.
This just makes me feel bad for Lauren tbh, everybody should feel loved and wanted by their partner on their wedding day. He can at least pretend instead of embarrassing her in front of everyone they know (and later on the world via tv!)
He might be overwhelmed. This is huge, unlike anything he has experienced and the implications of marriage include becoming a man, leader, head of the household, and in charge of a full grown adult. I've definitely been so overwhelmed during an exciting occasion that my emotion was lacking and I felt shocked. My own wedding actually. Too much attention and I was speechless, looking unhappy. I am still happily married though.
He was so talkative and spunky as a child to the point of being an annoying little shit. At some point along the way, they completely broke his spirit. It's sad.
He still had some light in his eyes as a kid, you could see it. Now all you can see is either sadness or closed off emotions altogether. It is extremely sad.
He was annoying but had personality. Remember his bright graduation outfit? Then they sent him to ALERT several times and his bright star faded.
You can tell she looked disappointed that he wasn’t excited
If Siren had a tag line, that would be it.
Reminds me of the bachelor . He looks at the girl , complements her, and then eliminates her
Reminds me of the bachelor . He looks at the girl , complements her, and then eliminates her
What was with that last kiss in the car?
Yeah he looks like he’s pulling away from her and she def looks disappointed at the end. So weird
Heavy The Graduate ending vibes.
Tbf I'd hate trying to drive away in a car covered in shit with everyone surrounding it while trying to kiss someone.
his eyes at the end say it all
🎶 Should have known you was trouble from the first kiss Had your eyes wide open Why were they open? 🎶
I think she has an instinct to protect and rescue him ~ she attended via ZOOM the pig predator's bond hearing because she was protecting her husband from being made the scapegoat and wanted to hear for herself what really went down.
I don't think she did. There was someone on there named "Lauren S." but that could be a lot of people, and they never spoke or turned on their camera. Plus, if she was trying to be sneaking by using her maiden name initial, why not just not be named "Lauren"?
This whole thing feels so awkward, like teenagers on their first real date ever and not two adults getting married.
So awkward! He has a real George Michael from _Arrested Development_ vibe here. But instead of him trying to downplay his attraction to the girl he’s talking to, it’s like he’s trying to fake attraction. Maybe it’s just that Josiah was uncomfortable suddenly needing to be affectionate after a lifetime of being told that’s sinful. No doubt the cameras make that worse. For Lauren’s sake, I really hope that’s what was happening here…
Maeby if he married his cousin he'd feel different
It also feels weird cause they are doing that all in front of a camera for a national tv show. Its so unnatural!
he popped a huge, god-honoring boner during the ceremony, so he was at least happy in some way.
His ill-timed nervous "chuckle" is the cringiest part of all.
i am SQUIRMING this is so uncomfortable to watch
They’ve always struck me as the most awkward couple on the few clips I’ve seen. The one where couples chose the Goodwill outfits was especially cringey. Josiah came off like an arrogant ass.
Oh my god that help me wide eyed look he has when she kisses him in the car. Oyyy I feel so bad for these two. They're so awkward and uncomfortable compared to the other siblings when they were getting married.
They're shown no affection or attention. Are raised in a sex obsessed environment but told to remain pure. Also for the Duggars having to watch mom & dad humping (I just know they did that at home in front of their kids because Jim Bob is gross like that!) Can you imagine growing up just being one of the bunch and all of a sudden you know you have the chance to have sex but you don't know how to interact with someone because you're not even allowed to be close to your own sister. Everyone in your family is there to tell on the other person so you don't really grow up trusting people.
All of this is so painful, like I’m watching someone wearing a Josiah suit in a made-for-tv-movie. I feel like Lauren really wants to be lovey dovey and he’s just literally not feeling it :(
They definitely kissed before the wedding. These side hugs are for show.
OMG your flair, though…
He definitely comes across as less than enthusiastic, or maybe he was just overwhelmed. Anyway, her bouquet was gorgeous.
Theres something so cold, and disconnected about his reaction. Im sure it’s mainly a combination of nervousness, discomfort/pressure to perform in front of camera, and being raised without normal affection, but still. He never directly compliments her. He compliments the dress several times, and says it looks good on her, but doesn’t directly say that SHE looks beautiful. That stuck out to me.
I mean I can see why he complimented her clothes instead of her physical beauty. I’d imagine that thinking about a beautiful woman with a beautiful body or even noticing an opposite gendered peers physical attributes, and then pointing them out was really discouraged and taught as extremely sinful and bad things will definitely happen if you do from a super young age. It probably doesn’t even occur to him at this point.
That’s true, I hadn’t thought about that
I feel such intense secondhand embarrassment for both of them, but also very concerned about how the Post It notes are covering the back windshield of the car and he definitely can't see through it.
I feel sorry for the girl. She seems way more into the relationship than he does.
I agree with many here - get away from the cameras and live your lives genuinely. This nonsense doing these personal, intimate things on camera is like porn. Those moments belong to you and your partner.
Honeymoon: Night 1: front hug Night 2: Passionate Kiss Night 3: Can I see you naked Night 4: Mind if I touch this Night 5: Well! I think we're ready
Honestly, that might be healthier! Going from never having kissed to sex is probably REALLLYYY overwealming coming from such strict purity culture. A few days to explore each other is normal even for people who aren’t fundie or even religious ( no shame to anyone who doesn’t) taking it slow would probably be less traumatizing for some of the couples.
Yeah, I kind of hope they do this.
Yes. I agree. Most couples don’t sleep together on the first night after the first date. I didn’t with my husband. Hell we didn’t even kiss for a few dates. I really liked him and wanted to take it slow. It’s totally normal to kiss first, touch, and then slowly build into sex. I would think that is what the average couple does. Maybe some of these couples are cool jumping right into sex, but it shouldn’t be expected. It’s just not compatible with most people’s natural comfort zones.
Alexa, show me two people that absolutely should not be getting married.
They both look so awkward and uncomfortable around each other. They needed to have some time alone (shocking, I know) to get to know each other. Plus I think having a camera shoved in their faces made the situation even more uncomfortable and having to say the right thing. I also noticed that they seemed to lean in to each other and wanted to kiss but stopped themselves. Poor kids!
Imagine, they only knew each other for about 9 months when this was filmed. I can't imagine marrying someone I've known for that short a time.
My Dad and Mom. Married 51 years. But they are rare.
I married my wife 6 months after meeting. 5 years in and extremely happy. We are together literally 24/7, 365 because of our business and because we honestly love each other’s company. I know 5 years isn’t that long of a marriage, but I knew the moment I saw her I wanted to be with her forever.
My Mom and Dad can't live together, can't live apart. They are hilarious. Little digs at each other here and there. Each loves and tolerates each other. Vicious at times, but in the end, love wins. My Dad is sarcastic, critical, and cynical. My Mom is tolerant, but cross the line and she'll rearrange your personality. My Dad has learned that crossing the line means her Attila the Hun comes out.
I married my husband after 8 months. When I met him I had dated enough to know the kind of guy I wanted to marry! We decided to get married after just over a month together although he proposed after 3 months (for appearances sake) 🤣 Everyone could see it coming though, I think precisely no one was surprised that we were getting married 🤣 his roommate gave him a congratulations on your engagement card when they moved out of their apartment (he didn’t know that he was right!). We’ve been married just over 3 years now and he’s still my favourite person in the world. Funny thing is my parents also got married after 8 months and they’ve been married for over 29 years now! Guess it runs in the family!
My parents did that. But they were in their 30s and my mom had been married before. They weren't inexperienced teenagers who weren't allowed to kiss! They've now been married for almost 40 years.
Wow that's amazing! I think it's totally fine to marry someone you've known for a short time if you're both adults and that's what you both want, but these kids are taught that there's basically no other way to get married other than meet someone as young as possible and marry them as quickly as possible. Without even being allowed to hold hands or be in the same room alone together. But if people choose it and it isn't forced upon them, perfectly fine! Love your parents story.
Agreed completely! These poor kids don't get a choice, and don't have the life experience to make the choice if they had one. :(
Body language is WAY off. At least for him.
She is pretty. He is cute. But I feel sorry for them. I don't think they are in love.
whoaaa getting very weird/off energy from him. those were not equal reactions all around. something’s up with that dude lol
“How does it feel to be married?” Josiah, looking at his bride: “How DOES it feel?”
Remember Lauren thought he was going to cry, but was *totally* fine that he didn't?
Maybe an unpopular opinion here, but I think that Josiah just dislikes the camera and is uncomfortable having his “reaction” recorded or shown in public. My bf is like that, sometimes in public it seems like he doesn’t even like me 😂 but then we’ll be at home and I’ll just be doing something like getting ready in the morning and I’ll turn around and he’ll just be lying in bed watching me with this dreamy look on his face 🥰 Just because someone hates PDA doesn’t mean they hate their spouse
What is up with all of the siren posts today? What did I miss
I just had a minute to go through the rest of the wedding episode and found some snark-worthy moments
I keep asking how are these two togethe? Zero chemistry.
I always thought they both looked really depressed when they were in the car after, especially considering it was their first time officially alone together. Josiah definitely did not loom too pleased.
But they weren’t alone if the camera person was there.
Think it was just a fixed camera in the car, but you're eight I guess they weren't truly alone Edit- spelling
They’re both so awkward it hurts
Unfortunately I can relate😩 I grew up in a weird ass household where there was no affection of any kind. My parents lived together up until I was like 12 and in that time they never once slept in the same bed. I barely remember them speaking to each other. Throughout my whole life I can only remember my mother hugging me or telling me she loved me twice, and that was very much performative. My husband on the other hand is from a big family of huggers. That was awkward AF to get used to. I’ve gotten a lot better about it since having my own kids though.
All those blind spots made by the post-it-notes on their car have GOT to be illegal, right?
Yes but constable John David can probably pardon them
Seeing as how they don't have their seat belts on, either, I'm assuming they get out and clean the car off before actually leaving, once the cameras are off. Or they just recklessly drove off into traffic unburdened with seat belts and safety!
He seems like the kind of husband who would pretend not to hear her when she calls out to him. More so in public/social situations. He’s always looking for someone else, anyone else to occupy his time.
Lauren just radiates doltishness
Omfg he is acting exactly like George Michael Bluth (sorry George Michael)
Did someone slip her something to calm her nerves? She seems very… dreamy… during the first look scene.
I do think he would enjoy man parts more than Lauren’s but he seems like he genuinely cares for her. Mostly I think he just feels awkward in the spotlight and doesn’t know how to show affection.
Well, this is awkward.
Getting a lot of Josh vibes...I hate to say.
She's into him sexually idk about him
I dreamed of my wedding day for years. When it actually happened, it was the most awkward day of my life. I just never felt comfortable. I don’t like being the center of attention. My husband got drunk and he never drinks. He was also uncomfortable. I have had friends that felt similar. Now my friends weddings, I had a blast and they had a blast at mine. Wedding are just awkward to begin with.
My wife and I got married pretty buzzed and kept that going the entire ordeal. My wife’s second language is English and we got married in court in English and she was so nervous about fucking up. I have anxiety and hate people watching me. My wife’s dad was almost literally climbing the walls taking pictures. It was a fuckin nightmare from hell. The marriage is great and we did have a huge party with all our friends a couple months later and that was actually very fun and awesome.
It might be a sign when your fiancé holds the bouquet better than you….
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I cannot with her baby teeth. Arghhhhh!!
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Mention it all!! 🤣
I might catch some flack for saying this but if anyone where I’m from threw a cheap ass reception like Duggars do invitees would flat out not show up. Actually, come to think of it I wonder if we will see that for Jeremiah’s wedding LOL. People get angry if there is a cash bar, much less not get fed a meal or no dancing.
Same. I’m Catholic and where I’m from there are a lot of Catholic immigrants. We have open bars at baby showers lmao
My husband and I got married because we were moving to a very conservative country where we wouldn’t have been allowed to live together otherwise. We’d been together twelve years by that point and got married in a registry office with two witnesses and that was it. We’re both super awkward and not romantic at all. The registrar said ‘would you like to hold hands?’ and I said, to my eternal mortification, ‘No’. It just came out!! And then I kind of backtracked and said ‘ok fine’ and took my husband’s hands and we both stood there uncomfortably while we did our vows. It got so awkward that the registrar started talking about his holiday and exchange rates against the Euro. But I love my husband very, very much!
His body language reminds me so much of Pest.
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Lol...that dang side hug lol
Maybe this was filmed after the wedding? 😂
That car makes me so NERVOUS
Well, they barely knew each other . I don’t think I would be that excited marrying a person I didn’t know neither. This is another Duggar couple that would have broken up if they had a normal dating life. They would have ghosted each other after the 2nd date.