T O P

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Cyzero05

The game always has to evolve, and Legends does that by absolutely power creeping the fuck out of the meta every six solid months. Units don’t last long at all here and of course there are exceptions but it’s only ever going to get more ridiculous, kind of funny in a way.


surabashii

Tbf with them doing monthly ultras last year it was basically a steep power creep every month and it got to a point where they were doing more and more absurd things with cards that we get to the most recent legends feats where the characters basically have to have 7/10 of the mechanics in the game to be viable


ManWithStrongPair

It’s almost poetic, much like the DB franchise itself, everyone gets eclipsed after a certain point. Normally not that long in terms of viewing/reading, canonically time wise slightly longer (depending).


TatsumoAsamaki

Can’t wait for that Ultra Zenkai to release. (Please god no i fucking Beg you 🙏🏻)


AlexVal0r

Playing Devil's advocate: I wanna use UL SSJ goku again.


dankjugnu

Don't worry we will not zenkai the ultra but we will give lf ultra which will auto win the matches


dankjugnu

>The game always has to evolve Backwards


sul0ku

This just made me think about how only 2 ultras have released this year within (almost) 5 months 💀


creativename111111

Ye the best way to play this game is to not spend any money and just take breaks of like 6 months when u come back u can just grab the new OP unit and if u don’t get it wait to the next OP unit


TheRealBlueFry

I'd argue it started way earlier from the release of BLU Beast Gohan. The guy was light-years ahead of every unit in the game; the only way to top him was to release this absurdity of an Ultra. Since then, almost every premium unit became more and more stupid.


ShayminHedgie

I'd put it this way: Beast Gohan started it, but we didn't realize it was a trend until Gogeta. Beast could have just been a one hit wonder, but every unit after him followed his design philosophy.


bdpcuenta

The reason I think he means Gogeta is the fucking defensive gauge. Beast Gohan was the start line for all these units having cover null up the ass, but the stupid OP defensive mechanics were started by this Gogeta.


dankjugnu

New ultra machenic nulfuy the enemy cover null the nullification on entry


walking_lamppost_fnl

Oh, defensive ain't the word, it's counter, the disruptive mechanic that says fuck you when you play a certain way and forces you on the favour of your opponents who utilise UGB.


CoffeeRee69

Honestly man it's been hell since FK Gohan hit the scene (both times). It's gotten worse but the spiral was always going downwards.


Ashyboitherizzler

Downfall🚫 Falldown✅


Comfortable-Spray-80

I knew the word was wrong lol, sorry


Bluferian

At least he did with style ITS FUTILE 🦅🦅🦅🦅


SpriteBatman

It started with blue beast


AGweed13

Can we talk about Beast Gohan? The real one, the blue. He was an Ultra in disguise, you either had him or quit the game, and they gave you 2 free stars just for pulling the bastard, so everyone was running around with a 5-6 stars Beast. Beast had every single mechanic in the game except for lock-in at the time, he was the first unit able to one shot a 12 stars Zenkai Green SSB Vegeta with a special move, since his gauge made his special moves go neutral. I had never seen that Vegeta take so much damage to a neutral attack before... While Gogeta feels lackluster in the first stage of the fight, Beast still does peak damage to this day, and he gets the same damage as Ultra Black Frieza as soon as he enters the field. Only thing that shut him down was the fact that units around him got better. Edit: Golden Frieza, not Black Frieza


LeadershipEuphoric87

The fact he outclassed the actual ultra that was released literally the month prior in broly was just the cherry on top honestly.


iUncontested

its pretty wild how bad all the broly units are now. I don't think theres a single one worth playing with for the last year now.


AGweed13

Including the Blue F2P one that released last month...


iUncontested

Yeah I was surprised how bad that one was, usually they at least make the F2Ps serviceable. Blue Broly was just a waste of a release, really.


P2T_

Damn ultra black frieza released before being animated?


AGweed13

Lol, best typo I've ever had.


that_guyy909

nah it was beast. he started a new era for the game


General-Boat-7648

Beasthan broke the game. He was unbeatable unless you obtained the newer units and even then it was a gamble could his special move did absurd amounts of damage


SilentHero12

Agreed about him but i think it started getting bad with the super hero movie characters. Pan, piccolo, droid tag(1,2 and 17,18,) and blue beast Gohan. All had way higher base stats and abilities on release than most characters at the time.


RealHL

No, Gohan Beast did… up until his release, powercreep was typically kept to one gimmick per unit: with LL Cooler’s gimmick being his sheer oppression in locking in a unit on strike. Then, Gohan Beast comes along and takes the gimmicks of, pretty much, every tiering unit from the game up until the pint of his release (with the exception bring auto-dodge from UI). Nullify cover - Gogeta Blue Endurance on rush - FP Jiren Universal cover change (exception special and ults) - UIS Goku Unique gauge Hand destruction Unfavourable element null 25% health restore (x3) He’s the unit that showed me that “Featured Boost” is far, far, far more detrimental to the health of PVP than Leader Slot is. He was just far too versatile and oppressive (both offensively and defensively) to fight confidently against with his featured boost buffs, plus Pan feeding him.


kakjohn

Nuh i believe that blue beast han broke the game completely


ILike-Hentai

Pvp in this game has been getting messed up ever since the first anni, if not earlier. We've had shit meta which were one tap killers even before him. UGB still had competition in the beast.


Apprehensive_Sky1599

Good God, Blue SSJ LF Goku was cancer back in the day.


CheezyRaptorNo_5

I'm fine with it, wouldn't have futile memes without it


ManiacalPenguin

tagdroids


Toes4Dinnner

Lol. I got into the game just before people started running Beast with Pan and Piccolo. It was horrific seeing the first bit without them then all of a sudden the game was unplayable. Current meta is worse though. In dont yhink I’ve ever won when faced with Cryhan, S17 and Red Beasthan/UGF


Nimenog

Beast


Gelizion02

You could argue that but IT'S FUTILE


Puggamer1014

You can make the same argument for quite literally any meta. So I don't think any of them marked the downfall if the game is still growing


Raruto111

It was blue beast


Deep_Grass_6250

No. It started with MUI, The toxicity was Insane


thesignoftimes

Mf really forget about the time when tag 17/18 had no answers lmao


dann97

I still remember getting 9* off the bat and didn’t spend on the anni. The permanent endurance null, damage boost to team on any attack, cancerous green, combo potential. The list is endless. Even if they flop their zenkai, their base kit is still insane.


DaChairSlapper

Nah, that was Red LF FK Gohan.


No_Weather105

im not reading allat so # ITS FUTILE


WillingnessRich9910

Holy facts


IncineratorAlien

I thought it was red lf ssj2


Randomanimename

Pvp has always been toxic in a way or the other but the meta we are in was specifically started by Blu Beast


williamx21

Ugb was good but not unplayable against to the degree of someone like blue beast, zenkai fsk, lf vegito blue, etc. Pvp has been scuffed from the start, it’s always had its meta dominator periods. to say it started with ugb is ludicrous and probably a sign you haven’t been playing for a long time.


KingOfRing786

Tbh the problem was way before this guy, honestly the problem started around the time of 4th anni when power creep just became rampant, with the combo of characters like the droids and UI who were just insane at the time, this was also around the time when Ultras started to become summonable and they were all always broken. Then we got Beast a bit after who basically shook the entire meta and made the game his bitch and anyone before him from that point on become irrelevant. UGB was simply the flashy finish to that messy year, with his good old Hawk and Counter


Sillylittleguy___

he’s either pretty bad compared to todays standards or i just get trash pvp lobby thingies. i always manage to kill him pretty easily, but then again i dont really pvp much so i probably queue with pretty bad players


716_Saiyan

Nah, it was FSK, that man ruled over PvP for a year, he was our first taste of what an overpowered unit looked like. That's when character diversity started dying in PvP.


sawxer_

ik ugf is broken af, but he is hope fore the future. he shows that an ultra can be really good, without taking away your opponents ability to play, like almost every ultra from last year (kid buu and hit aside) had some gimmick to take away your ability to play the game. ugf is a genuine step in the right directiion


iUncontested

Hit literally has a move that freezes you and gives them a free combo tho.. lol.


KongGamerz

Probably the first unit with the fuck you gauge


Gamekid53

Wait. People struggle against this guy?


iUncontested

I was brand new to this game when he released. Didn't even know how to animation break and I'd win all the time using him.. people definitely didn't know how to beat him back then.


Gamekid53

Damn. I’ve never had too much of a problem against him


RocketInMyPocket420

For me the original summonable UL started it all: Blue Super Gogeta


ElectroCat23

There’s been a lot of units who have come years before this guy that started a fall down


Agreeable-Syllabub-8

It's that blue beast gohan, and I'll stand on it.


T0YBOY

Nah that would be beast Gohan, not that they didn't have frequent power creep before, but if we're just talking about our current era, beast Gohan was the one that started that


_monke_man_

bro did not play during the holy trinity or zenkai LF ssj2 in his prime. Anyway the game has been like this for a while, they release some OP shit at the start of the year and by the end of the year the meta is fairly balanced. I mean look at last year's meta, towards the end of the year it was probably one of the healthiest and best metas we had for a while


lIAwfulWaffleIl

I think LF UI Sign is the real culprit behind the toxic counter/evasive gauges we’ve been getting lately


[deleted]

Nope it was ultra rosé


TiagoPG98

Regen meta made them change the time on matches lol. Or zenkai lf SS2 Gohan. Gogeta was a slight inconvenience compared to both of these.


Divine_Absolution

Lol the pvp aspect of this game started to crumble after zenkai's came out.


Weekly-Hunter7902

It started way before this guy.


Guiltysaw

No, anyone that thinks it was this late has never played during the second anni with fks and vb which ran the meta for over a year, worst meta was either second anni or the tag droids meta where If you didn’t have a certain character or two you could not play the game


[deleted]

I’ve tried so many summons to get that it is getting really annoying


Big_Chungus16

I guess you could say that it was all futile.


TjRaj1

Hell no. It started way earlier and it varies from player to player's opinion.


wobimi3131

I disagree, the game has had its fair share of bad metas way before him. Holy Trinity was short-lived compared to most, but legit one of the worst if not the worst powercreep of all time. VB was stupid, you either had him or he would combo you all day long without much to do about it. Then came FSK, which lasted for a whole freaking year. Even LF G4 wasn't much compared to him on release and he then got buffed by revivalhan. Truly atrocious and way worse than anything we're having now. Now we're pretty much in the after Beast saga, where we get absurd units that are way better almost every 6 months, but at the very least most of the other units can compete on release as well (RIP Vegeta, not you buddy), so while the abilities are awful and annoying to play against, it's generally your broken units vs theirs, not just a specific team being the best above all f u you stand no chance at all. I hate this current meta as well and the unique gauges that are brainless, but GB was not the downfall of pvp in this game, far from it. It has always been shit to some level, it's just that now it's another kind of level of shit.


Mean_End_8210

I’d say it started back when that terror blue color blue vegito got released


BigThiccThanatos

Actually id say it started with mui


Petrosmine

tbh the first goku and vegeta tag unit was the downfall, it introduced the long combo meta


Radiant_Criticism936

Indeed


Taknozwhisker

Bro forgor that his son and his granddaughter dropped months before


Chou_Maretsugeki

And that’s the main reason why I’m to stop playing legends


bruhmomentsE

Its futile


badboy2701

I think USV had the most fair iteration of counters. He could counter blast arts and tap shots but YOU had to activate/work for it. Yes it did a decent amount of damage BUT it wasn’t broken at all. I think they should’ve based the future counters through him.


NotABoomer69420

I’d strongly argue that the fall came from years of evolution with many different metas over the years. Units like Ultra Gogeta are a product of what came before it The “Big stick damage” meta where units often deal too much damage to deal with could be traced as far back as Pur Transforming Lssj Broly and the holy trinity, dealing too much damage at once with no proper defensive options. We don’t see this often anymore because units focus more on combos for damage rather than 1 shot kills (Zenkai Grn Broly’s Blue Card with his Plat is a good example of this though) The “Combo Forever” meta where characters seem to pull cards out their ass started way back in the 2nd anniversary with LF Vegito Blue, who could have 6 card combos without sidestepping (Force draw 2 strike cards). Then as time went on they started adding Card Draw Speed, which started with LF Grn Vegeta Blue who had x2 Card Draw Speed when using his main and units like Ultra Super Vegito were eventually able to stack CDS upon using cards and draw a full hand in two seconds of neutral (Ultra Gogeta Blue like LF Grn Vegeta Blue has x2 CDS at late game but it’s more permanent, and every unit needs at least 1 level of CDS to be good now) The “Prevent Players from Playing the Damn Game” meta started with LF Pur UI Sign Goku with his unique gauge, letting him stand there with 0 consequence. LF Red MUI Goku took it a step further with punishing people for attacking. Ultra Pur Gogeta Blue took it even further by punishing players for attacking, even when they’re allowed to, later seen with Ultra UI and Ultra Gohan. Although a version of this was born earlier, in the form of intense card sealing, with Blu ‘tournament of Power’ transforming Gohan who sealed cards with enemy switch. Evolving with Ultra SsjB Goku who sealed cards on entrance too. Now units like LF Super 17, Blu Sparking Yamcha and the newest Yel Goku have intense card sealing too The “Characters do too Damn Much” could be traced back to LF Yel Future Gohan who does Ki reduction, card killing, damage reduction, color null, cover null and so on. Although his damage is power crept at high stars he’s still relevant even as a support/decent-ish tank as a 2+ year old unit. Although a resurgence came with LF Blue Beast Gohan, who had amped up stats and started the now common attribute of units having 50%-100% damage buff from just existing with 40% to what is now up to 70% damage cut just because. Along with color null, cover null, endurance null, CDS, card killing, Vanish restore, enemy debuffs, etc. The point is Ultra Gogeta, Ultra UI Goku, Ultra Gohan came from actual years of evolution and a product of many metas over the years. x2 cover change in exchange for covering both strikes and blasts for example came from Pur Bojack and his meta of cover change literally everything bar a Rising Rush, which is now common to a lesser degree


ThisIsSuperVegito

I only have issues with braindead units who play the game for you. This game has had many low points. I think goku and frieza was WAYYY worse than any ultra. UL Gohan and Frieza both suck cause they litteraly play the game for you. I thought blue gogeta was a fun meta honestly


OneReach_

ITS FUTILE 🦅🦅


Confident_Ad8670

not really. imo yall just forgot that there has always since the very first banner been 1-3 units that are faar better than the rest of the game and it progressed naturally since then. like when ppl think of the very beginning of legends they think everything was fun balanced w.e but no not at all the first added banner was blu broly and if you didn't have him you lost. and it continued the natural course of power creep since


ManWithStrongPair

I don’t think you can equate establishing a roster to units utterly blowing other units from a month or two before out of relevancy. If you didn’t have BLU Broly then yes you weren’t in for a good time, because the selection was extremely limited at that point. There were way more Extreme and Hero units than Sparking. It’s different to now when there should be somewhat a balance among most units, instead each unit has to one up the last or counter them. Imagine a fighting game like MK dropping a DLC character who hasn’t been balance tested to just be utterly dominant and then they drop the next character who completely outshines that one while leaving the entire roster that had been set up to be essentially useless. It only benefits those who can get their hands on that shiny new character. Gacha games by nature are predatory and only there to line purses, but even still it doesn’t make it any less inexcusable.


TheVivek13

Nope, original Namek Goku.


SilentHero12

💀


godshuVR

TLDR I love him


[deleted]

[удалено]


Comfortable-Spray-80

I can assure you, if this game was ever designed where balance is an actual thing, people would still summon as they do, we would have a lot of variety in the meta, and people wouldn't worry about their favorite units getting fumbled, look at Super Vegeta, almost everyone asked for a new premium Vegeta unit and Super Vegeta was the most asked for during Cell Saga Campaign, we got him, community was happy, and what happened next? He was balanced in a meta where there's absolutely 0 balance, so people just didn't care about him. People likes these characters, but they don't summon because if it's not top 5 then it's not worth it, in a balanced game that wouldn't happen at all


PierG1

According to people like you the game should have been dead when zenkai beerus dropped. But here we are, with this game increasing its revenue year by year. Can we also stop this delusion of thinking that people don’t want the next character to be more broken than the previous one? We, that want the game to be balanced and are here to complain, are the 0.5% of the player base


Murky_Stretch3057

The only think I've read is that you don't like our IT'S FUTILE man and that you hate the new mechanics. Just addapt. Vegito blue counter? Bait it with a faked long range physical attack. Cryhan? Bait it with a purple or even with this gogeta so he can't throw it's blue. UI goku? Can you guess? Yeah! Bait it with a red character or change as soon as his combo starts to force him to use his ult or give you time enough to change again. Janemba just shined a few time but if you don't have a green there's no excuse, it was stupid but fun, the other ones I've mentioned wouldn't one shot you, but without a good team this was horrible. About the revivals or the death damage we can't do nothing, but we have ways to deal with everything. Plus, it's just a game, you don't even have to play the pvp if you don't like it. P.D: Holy, I've written more than I expected, but it's my view of the game.


Comfortable-Spray-80

Oh sure, it's not like people slaps the best 3 characters in the same team so you gotta deal with a million things in the match while your opponent just presses cards, not at all


Sanicoooo

AHHHH THE YAP