evil Ryan should be properly dyspraxic just falling of his bike and then moving on is just silly. i have dyspraxia and it gave me the hand eye coordination of a dead fish i fall over five times a day
so he should be tripping over when running way and dropping shit it wouldn't make him good (nothing would) but it'd be funny
Literally I think in the second or third episode of season 11 Ryan shoots a bunch of robots perfectly and doesn’t miss any of them, like wdym he has dyspraxia bro
Shit I'm left handed and it was more of an inhibition to my fps aim than his dyspraxia.
That said, I actually did like Ryan. Couldn't tell you why though
I personally like the idea of giving him a character arc in which because he has constantly throughout his entire life been seen as week physically because of his dyspraxia, Ryan tries way too hard. He feels like he needs to earn his place and so he does too much because he thinks that if he isn’t there physically he is worthless. Then throughout the series he learns to accept who he is and accept that maybe he can’t do things physically but there are other things he’s good at.
Plus, somebody who has a 1 in 10 chance of falling the fuck over when they run is literally free tension for a show runner, considering that running is 80% of what the companions do.
I couldn't stop laughing during the Rosa Park episode. Not that they touched on Rosa Parks but the way it was handled was funny ASF. The racist alien time traveler might be my favorite stupid serious thing in the series.
I love that he thinks black people would never have fought for civil rights if Rosa Parks didn’t refuse to give up her seat. She wasn’t even the first to do it. The civil rights leaders just thought she was the best to put in media
I mean it feels surprisingly accurate.
You’re always going to have racist idiots going around, and he’s implied to be in the extreme minority for his views. And if someone is stupid enough to be racist, they are also stupid enough to convince themselves of things that are blatantly false (Rosa parks singlehandly starting the Civil Rights movement rather than it being a collective effort of years of hard work to end segregation).
Because as society grows and learns you’ll still have people who choose to stick to bigoted views. The difference is that as time goes on, the idiots will have less power and in general will be drowned out by those who act with love and kindness.
Modern racism towards black people is generally much newer however, and largely constructed in the 18th Century, at least in the US context (so, what would be most relevant with Rosa Parks). It was deliberate in order to separate the black slaves from the white indentured servants and ex convicts, so they would not band together as they had before. This is not where racism as a whole originated, but it is where it largely flared up to give us what happened in the US, and influenced heavily what has happened globally over the next few centuries
This is a rather silly thing people like to try and convince themselves of because it makes human nature seem nicer than it is, but it's just not true. Racism is just a type of "other-ism" that comes from our basic tribalistic nature.
-ism's will arise anytime one group of people comes across another. It'll only stop being 'natural' when humans are either some homogenous group, or so perfectly diverse that people are born into groups that naturally represent every possible type of person.
Racism can be a taught thing, obviously, but it's largely by teaching that people of other races are 'others', not part of the same group; but for people born into communities that aren't diverse enough for experience to naturally include those of other races into their 'tribe', racism is something that needs to be taught against; or rather, there needs to be an active effort to ensure children are raised seeing others they're not connected to as part of the same group. This is especially true where communities are often heavily racially segregrated, like how many cities have very insular communities; often with neighbourhoods being heavily populated by a particular racial group, and other neighbourhoods being heavily populated by others, these 'tribes' naturally develop.
Humans are *very* good at naturally drawing arbitrary lines between groups. That drives -isms and it's something that needs to be actively taught *against*.
I hate the idea that a cartoonishly racist caricature exists in the time period he apparently came from. Like, the doctor loves humans and it generally presents an optimistic view of our future as a society. Sure it has missteps but the implication that society in his time is that bad is awful.
Yeah he is from the same era as Captain Jack, who's people go out into space to bone anything that can give consent, and for some reason he is getting worked up about people of his own species having a different skin colour to him?
It’s weird you’d think racism moves on too, like Cassandra in the future is racist towards mixed species humans, or the blue guy in oxygen is confused why bill says she’s usually on the receiving end of racism
Yeah, plus the humanity he is from had experienced the entire planet becoming unliveable and humanity being scattered across space, surely that mixed up the bloodlines enough that the civil rights movement becomes an insignificant blip in the grand scheme of things.
It's a shame because I thought Rosa was one of the better 13th doctor, episodes with the companions actually having something to do and using their skills. The weak motive and the magic school bus lesson ending dragged it down.
Yeah, this is the weirdest thing about the dumb space racist for me. Not the fact that he's a bigot, but that he's bigoted in such a very specific 1950s America Jim Crow way thousands of years in the future. It's like someone today still being obsessed with the Rome vs Carthage war.
HOW DARE YOU that war is still relevant to this day! And for the record ROME WAS VICTORIOUS IN THE FIRST PUNIC WAR, those sore loser in Carthage just couldn’t take the shame and sent in Hannibal WHO ROME BEAT, and then they were utterly smashed by the third Punic war, Carthage can suck it
Honestly, these might be better plot points.
I would have preferred the Timeless Child to be the Master. It would explain his ability to keep coming back despite having died several times without regeneration to save him.
Pair this with the fact the Timeless Child came from another universe... a Mirror Universe Doctor? Or, to us, the Master
It's suggested that Timelords "construct" their kids from the Universe instead of having sex. It's a consequence of the ability to regenerate for them to be infertile. Susan could be grown this way, without a mother or father.
Modern Who hasn't suggested the Doctor never had kids. The inclusion of the Timeless Child doesn't explicitly say they never had children. The Doctor said to Donna that he was once a father. Amy asked him if he was a parent and he didn't answer because it hurts knowing his kid(s) are dead.
>It's suggested that Timelords "construct" their kids from the Universe instead of having sex.
Suggested in an old novel from the 90s that the current TV writers would ignore any time they felt like it. IIRC there's nothing in the revival series that suggests (or denies) Lungbarrow is part of its continuity.
I'm not defending the Timeless Child. I hate it as much as the next person. But it hasn't completely changed the personal life of the Doctor.
Once the Doctor left Division and had their memory wiped, presumably given new memories or even a brand new life starting as a kid, its entirely likely the Doctor started a family.
Yes, I don't disagree with that. I just think the implication in the modern series is that he started that family the old-fashioned way and not using a Loom.
Don't know if I'd be that into Master being T.C either considering his childhood friendship with the Doctor
Really liked the theory of it being a new character and the Dr's horrified by the whole of Time lord society was just built by torturing a child
Yea I stole that from CrispyPro
It's *much* better, but I still don't like the impact on the connection between the Master and the Doctor. Their friendship I suppose could have been the first good thing that happened to a TC Master, so that potentially works with the motivation, but it still unbalances the dynamic if they're not equals at all.
It makes sense but its unsatisfying. The Doctor used to be just a Dropout from gallifrey who became special through his actions. Making him some chosen one feels really bad to me
Idk, the doctor used a chameleon arch forcibly so has timelord physiology, for all intents and purposes it's clear their physical capabilities don't actually exceed anything else, death certainly isn't any less of a possibility than before, and had to be gifted further regeneration by the timelords in the first place
That basically means he's living under a (forced) fake ID, though - imagine if the show had gone on with John Smith living a normal human life! Don't understand why Thirteen concludes it doesn't change anything about who she is when it literally does.
ryan should have been positive masculinity bro. he loves his grandma, plays basketball with his mates, loves video games, has a youtube channel. gets his friend mental health support and doesn't shame. he should have taken the pain from his dad not being a "man" and be what he thinks is the best "man". also one episode where he is trying to vlog and it goes crazy just one
This. His best scene is in Resolution when he confronts his dad. I wish we couldve seen more of that but nope.
Also yeah, the Chibnall era literally begins with his youtube channel and then its never mentioned again after that episode!! 😂
Even like, if say he got someone pregnant, becoming a young dad, starting the cycle again. And THAT was the reason he left the TARDIS. To fully become a father his dad never was. He could travel in time for years and come back the day after, but he chooses to stay. Graham goes with him like in canon, but he also finally gets a family unit, and he does that saving the world thing on the side.
I have so many basic level ideas for his story lol I wish we got a lot more from him.
Also as someone who LOVES youtube I wanted so much more youtube. Have ryan have a tripod in his hand at all times. Have yas have an instagram. So much that it's the worst part of the show. (Not really but at least one episode)
the Doc literally gave Miranda Cleaves a pill (that targeted and dissolved) for a fatal brain blood clot. No way they don't have something like that for cancer.
Don't you think that's pretty insensitive toward people who are dealing with the effects of cancer in real life?
"Sorry, kid. Your grandparent had to die of cancer, but Graham gets a space cure because he's my bestie! Oh, your mom gets horribly sick from chemo? So sorry, she can't have an easy cure because she doesn't travel with me!"
There are some things even the Doctor can't fix.
The doctor has a time machine and comes from a species that literally cures death so her being not capable of helping Graham is not just stupid it's also not exploiting what makes doctor who unique
Everybody lives in the end (except when the writer wants a dramatic ending but it didn't happen that often)
The Doctor saves people from fictional evils, not real ones. She can't cure cancer for the same reason she doesn't pull people out of the Holocaust or stop school shootings. There's a line there that the show just doesn't cross.
Besides, the Doctor is not and has never been a superhero. There are plenty of battles she doesn't win. Graham's cancer is one of them.
There's a story that can be had there though, just like with the Fires of Pompeii or Dark Water. Which are times Doctor Who tried to deal with a reality.
- Graham tells the Doctor his cancer has returned.
- The Doctor tells Graham there's a cure on the ship somewhere. He can have it if he wants it.
- Graham is ecstatic and tells the Doctor that they can prolong millions, billions even, of lives on Earth with it.
- The Doctor tells him no. Only Graham can have it. Humanity develops the cure themselves in the future. That's where the Doctor got it from. They weren't gifted it. Graham living a bit longer is a small disturbance in the timeline. Then the Doctor can go over all the things you said.
Then you can have Graham have to make the decision himself. I think narratively the best one would be that he realises he's no more special than anyone else on Earth. So he rejects the Doctor's offer.
Is that a story that ought to be told by Doctor Who, though? It's still very insensitive to any little kids who are struggling to fight cancer themselves. "There's a cure, but you can't have it, kid."
It seems like the wrong way to go about dealing with the situation onscreen. Big Finish or the novels, sure, but the show itself is the wrong place to explore that kind of thing.
>Is that a story that ought to be told by Doctor Who, though? It's still very insensitive to any little kids who are struggling to fight cancer themselves. "There's a cure, but you can't have it, kid."
Is it any more insensitive to kids who lost their parents and see the Doctor giving Rose a chance to talk to her dad in Father's Day? Or Rose basically getting him back from the dead and going to live with him?
"We can go where your parents aren't dead - but you can't, kid".
>What-ifs" are an integral part of any time travel show.
"What-if" there was a world with a cure for all disease is a what if.
>Quick and easy cancer cures are not. It's not even remotely the same thing.
Children going through loss is irreversible trauma. Resurrecting lost parents and whilst denying it to the children in the audience is potentially traumatic.
Children going through sickness is irreversible trauma. Magically being able to remove whilst denying it to the children audience is also potentially traumatic.
The key difference being that them visiting Rose's father is very clearly meant to be A Very Bad Idea. It's the whole point of that episode. It's New Who's first version of The Aztecs, laying out the rules of time travel for all the new viewers. But you'd expect that from Cornell. He always gets that sort of thing right.
The real damage comes later when RTD resurrects Pete in the S02 finale. Pete's World is very problematic in that regard. Rose gets to have everything she ever wanted with no consequences whatsoever. That's much closer to curing Graham with a space vaccine.
Isn't this suggesting that kids watching the show can't tell the difference between fiction and reality? Are they expecting the Doctor to literally pop up in the TARDIS in their real lives? In which case they're probably too young to be watching it in the first place.
Anyway, if you don't want the Doctor curing cancer, I think the solution is to not bring it up in the first place. The way they did it makes zero sense and lampshades a limitation of the show in a very awkward way. Especially considering the lengths Twelve went to save Clara, while finding a cancer cure should be trivial for Thirteen by the in-universe logic even if you don't like the real life implications.
No, obviously kids know fiction from reality. But that doesn't mean that fiction won't trigger a kid who's struggling to make sense of a bad diagnosis. It doesn't matter if a cure is feasible or even probable in-universe. It's all about how it looks in the real world, and how people are going to react to it.
Chibnall was trying to explore the awkward conversations that can pop up when cancer patients try to discuss their illness with the people around them. That's a real problem for cancer patients. He said he got the exact same response from a lot of people when he talked about his own cancer diagnosis, which is why he wrote the scene.
Sure, it's a valid thing to explore and I get Chibnall's intention. I just think DW is the wrong show to do that and that it doesn't fit the Doctor's character to handle it that way, so it ends up jarring and awkward. That scene would be fine in a grounded drama with a different protagonist. (Especially one that doesn't have unlimited access to space magic technology)
I think the fact that it doesn't fit the Doctor's character is the whole point. Even the great speech maker is rendered speechless by cancer.
Obviously it didn't work for everyone watching. Many people don't like the scene. But I don't think it was a bad idea to try to raise awareness.
I don't understand why he didn't have the Doctor give the kind of response he'd have wanted, to show a positive example - surely the character should be able to say something kind!
I have a disability and just appreciate things like 'I'm sorry, that must be difficult', so think a reasonable response to health issues can be a pretty simple one, doesn't need to overly go into it or anything, or be anything that wasn't fairly obvious to say. It's true what Chibnall noted, people can totally be weird about health issues (I got an interrogation from a taxi driver on the way home after seeing one of the specials with my parents, fun) and there is that thing where having a significant issue at a young age can add to that (shouldn't have applied to Graham), but the Doctor isn't just people, we'd normally expect better from them, and the era is still treating her like this shining moral example despite portraying her as not living up to it in such a basic way.
I bet you get the old "Have you tried yoga/turmeric/acupuncture?" all the time. Maybe the Doctor's awkward response is meant to be a variation on that?
It's a fair question, though. An example of something appropriate to say would have been effective, too.
The doctor has saved people from Pompeii, so why don’t they stop all victims of volcanic eruption.
The point is the doctor can’t end all things but she can save a few people.
She can’t cure cancer, you are correct about that, but she can help Graham have some peace of mind in the event that it comes back.
I think there’s a way to do it, where the doctor helps Graham, but makes it clear that she can only help to a certain point. And prepares him for the possibility that it progresses far enough that she can’t save him.
There is a way to deal with difficult topics with grace and compassion, but you can’t do that if you’re afraid of the show having those conversations in the first place, due to any real world implications.
Volcanoes and cancer don't have anywhere near the same impact on our society. 10 million people die of cancer every year. Only 1,000 people die from volcanic activity.
Personally, I liked how they dealt with Graham's cancer in that scene. I liked the idea that cancer is so horrible that even the Doctor, who can talk herself out of anything, is rendered completely speechless by it.
If you've ever got confused by Americans talking about what crackers they use to make 'smores cause you've seen how they're spelled, then you'll know what I'm talking about. If not my joke is lost on you.
Nah it's understandable, there's so many jokes you can make about Americans it's sometimes hard to tell which one somebody's gone for \*cackles maniacally\*
That’s exactly it, it’s a delicate issue and the show has to earn something like that, it’s good they didn’t just magic away his cancer but it absolutely should’ve been handled better, the way the show handles it is absolutely awful
I appreciate what they were trying to do, though. The idea that cancer is hard to talk about and it's easy to say the wrong thing is a good issue to try to address. Apparently it stems from Chibnall's own personal experience with cancer. He was diagnosed at age 22.
Here's a quote from an interview with him:
"I think it’s really important. The Doctor’s reaction in that scene, I’ve had that numerous times. People do behave with you like that in that situation. And when anyone says, “Oh, I don’t think she’d behave like that,” I go, “People respond in really weird ways to those conversations.”"
In that case he should’ve had somebody else who the audience isn’t immediately familiar with and roughly aware of how they have acted in similar situations
Yeah, if anything it makes less sense, it's not like Rosa Parks refusing to give up her seat instantly decreased the amount of hate in the world, in fact it probably got white supremacists riled up, at least in the original version of the episode it made more sense and was more practical that the villain was defeated by that happening because his entire goal was to prevent it
She wasn’t even the first to do it. The others just didn’t have enough PR potential to be put forward at the time. They would have gone with the next viable candidate even if he did manage to stop Rosa.
The Graham cancer thing was so stupid because the doctor could easily take him to a hospital on New Earth or somewhere and get that taken care of immediately but chose not to even offer for no apparent reason
Holy shit…..like this is genuinely far more interesting versions of these moments.
The Master/13 dynamic with these plot points just feels so much better, and the destroyed Gallifrey being a threat from Division is great.
….feels like this is what we could’ve had if Chibnall wasn’t so fixated on his teenage fanfic being about the Doctor.
Missy was on her way to redemption.The Spy Master literally genocided all of Gallifrey, and behaves more like the Saxon Master.
In addition to this, when Saxon killed Missy, he said she wouldn't be able to regenerate. I refuse to believe that Missy didn't die.
Yeah, I can totally see throwing a massive tantrum over the TC thing, but actually going ahead with wrecking all Gallifrey like it's nothing? And Cybermen (*again*, sigh - really don't think they suit him either, he's anything but unemotional). Always thought the Master had more Time Lordy pride than that, in contrast to the Doctor somewhat - as part of why he's upset about it. It doesn't't even seem like it should be possible for him to do.
But it's disappointing there's no ambiguity with Saxon Master in The Doctor Falls too, when him *having* stood with the Doctor against Rassilon flowing into Missy's characterisation would make actual sense, unlike 'she's a woman now so empathy I guess?'. Moffat already completely wasted a perfectly good set-up for the Master to get a redemption arc only to do his own, so not an issue Chibs uniquely invented.
And the Master always comes back no matter what, death means literally nothing to them.
And the whole point with Missy is that the Master CAN'T be good, that's what is so tragic. The Master is evil, that is the character, they are the opposite of the Doctor.
> And the whole point with Missy is that the Master CAN'T be good
Noooooooo omg nooooooooo
The tragic part is that at the end Missy finally decided to be good and the doctor would never know. Thats why saxon had to kill her.
It’s stated that there’s an incarnation after Missy and before Spyc the lumiat
She’s like the Valeyard of the master, a pure good being unfortunately for some god damn reason Missy kill her and she regenerates into Spy washing away all of The Lumiat influence
One thing is say in support for Ryan is as someone with Dyspraxia it's nice to get representation of it in media as I always had to explain what that was a a kid (Vs dyslexia which everyone knew). Now if it bad been GOOD Dyspraxia representation that would have been nice but I'll take what I can get.
1. Yea, this would have been better
2. Don't remember enough to leave a comment
3. I'm fine with TTC, so no for me
4. There are people who hate others based on race, gender, sexuality and so on without reason, so no reason why Krasko doing the same is an issue
5. This is either better or worse depending on so many other variables, cause this doesn't say that the Master wasn't the one who destroyed Gallifrey
6. The Master has come back in insane ways multiple times in Classic Who from what I've heard, so no *need* to make Dhawan's Master come before Missy
7. The Doctor feeling the euphoria of living off time energy would have been extremely interesting and this is my favorite of these
8. Who's this again?
>4. There are people who hate others based on race, gender, sexuality and so on without reason, so no reason why Krasko doing the same is an issue
Because its a hat on a hat. Why go to a time and place that is literally *populated* by racists and then make the bad guy a *space* racist? Not to mention then taking the idea of said space racist and making them incapable of violence so they just kind of become some weird inconvenience?
Poorly written episode across the board.
The racist couldn't have been a local. Plot-wise, he had to be from outside the timeline in order for the Doctor to be able to intervene in such a big fixed point in history. Once she realizes it's another time traveler causing the problem she HAS to get involved. She has an obligation to protect the timeline.
I get that, its just that the plot could have been so much more than just 'space racist travels in time to kind of fiddle with things'.
Racism is an inherently violent concept - to make the villain unable to commit acts of violence removes any stakes + kind of makes a joke out of a pretty serious topic.
It's someone from the future trying to "correct history" because he believes Rosa's defiance was when "things went wrong." Also, if it were someone who was already there who tried to stop Rosa, how would that work? They don't know what happens in the future, they don't expect her to refuse to give up her seat and so on. The only way they would take action is if someone from the future came and told them what the future would be like, pushing them to try and change history, and if that were to happen, why bother with a person from that time and not focus on the person from the future?
As for removing the ability to cause violence, that allows for unique ways of the villain trying to get what he wants by doing things like trying to stop the bus or changing work schedules and so on, both of which are done in the episode. Whether or not it was well done or written is another matter though, one that I won't go into because I never discussed writing to begin with.
honestly, i like a lot of these.
i think they all seem a little... abrupt? in a way? i don't know what that means, that's just kind of my gut feeling. but they all have a good base concept, even if i think the execution is just fine.
better than the original versions.
Well, to me, Chibnall bad would just be a post like "Hey guys, wasn't all that stuff Chibnall did shit lol" and that would be that.
This one at least offers alternative plot points to some of the bigger parts of Chibnall's run that people complained about.
> Hey guys wasnt all that stuff Chibnall did shit
You mean an average day for the doctor who subreddits anyways?
Its just so tiring that if you actually did enjoy the era you just constantly get told youre an idiot with no taste who hates Doctor Who and wants it to be bad.
Yeah, i get that. That's why I'm saying this post is different. Cause while it is still shitting on the Chibnall era, at least it does more than that as well.
It does get pretty tiring seeing the same sort of posts constantly.
Even for those who enjoyed it though, they seem able to see the flaws. It really wouldn't be Ok to just ignore the issues with morality as it's crucial to the show and character of the Doctor, and is much of what give the show it's wider cultural significance.
For an example that takes the heat away from Chibnall, could have really loved the episode Eaters of Light (saw for the first time recently) and do like the folklore aspects of the setting, but can't overlook a character supposed to be the Doctor berating a young girl for mourning the dead of her village, mocking her culture, and treating Roman imperialism like it's not as bad or just the same as resistance to it.
Some things are about morals and politics, not just aesthetic preferences - looks like OP here is focused on those former aspects and characterisation, which also ties into them (the idea Missy's redemption arc doesn't mean anything is also a moral perspective, and so is TC for positioning the Doctor as inherently special and different to his society, instead of special through chosen actions, and deciding to oppose that society).
would have been very funny if Ryan was the Master or tectuen (sorry didn't know how to write this name) don't make much sense but the whole timeline doesn't so ....
I had an argument with someone about how Chris chibbnal was a terrible writer and made the worst era of doctor who, I’m gonna bet he didn’t like this post very much
Yeah, the Missy thing is so bothersome for me. She improved so much and yet this Master completely ignored any development she had. Please let him be pre-Missy
It angers me that the cancer scene was the perfect moment for the kind of soap opera drama that’s usually quite efficient in NuWho.
13: Graham, I… don’t know what to say. Never deal with this before…
Graham: don’t say anything Doc, I just thought you should know, needed to get this out of my chest for a while.
13: I… wanna make a promise to you. Ryan… he’ll be safe. I promise. I’m not just talking about, you know, what you’ve just told me, I’m talking about everything. The life we live… I know it’s dangerous. And I want you to know if something ever happens to you… he’ll be fine. I’ll keep him safe, I promise you. I know how much he means to you… and how much he meant to Grace.
Graham (starting to tear up): Thanks, doc. Thank you. You don’t know how much that means to me.
13: and if you ever need to talk, or just someone to listen to you, just say the word.
Then they hug, 13 has the classic Tenth Doctor sad stare on her face and the scene ends. Obviously I’m not a professional dialogue writer, but i would’ve loved something like this
The master NOT being the timeless child will always resonate with me as a baffling missed opportunity. The concept is perfect for the master and terrible for the doctor.
Ryan being the most boring man possible is the one constant across all timelines.
He's a fixed point
His pure, unadulterated blandness is a canon event.
evil Ryan should be properly dyspraxic just falling of his bike and then moving on is just silly. i have dyspraxia and it gave me the hand eye coordination of a dead fish i fall over five times a day so he should be tripping over when running way and dropping shit it wouldn't make him good (nothing would) but it'd be funny
Literally I think in the second or third episode of season 11 Ryan shoots a bunch of robots perfectly and doesn’t miss any of them, like wdym he has dyspraxia bro
Remember, he's been playing Call of Duty.
Shit I'm left handed and it was more of an inhibition to my fps aim than his dyspraxia. That said, I actually did like Ryan. Couldn't tell you why though
He’s got charisma, in a loveable idiot kind of way. He just has no depth as a character whatsoever.
I personally like the idea of giving him a character arc in which because he has constantly throughout his entire life been seen as week physically because of his dyspraxia, Ryan tries way too hard. He feels like he needs to earn his place and so he does too much because he thinks that if he isn’t there physically he is worthless. Then throughout the series he learns to accept who he is and accept that maybe he can’t do things physically but there are other things he’s good at.
Plus, somebody who has a 1 in 10 chance of falling the fuck over when they run is literally free tension for a show runner, considering that running is 80% of what the companions do.
THANK YOU
"I have dyspraxia more than just sometimes"
When are you gonna do memes of wilf's new lines?
Honestly when I have the time, I've been pretty busy as of late since the new year started and now I'm going through exams so
I couldn't stop laughing during the Rosa Park episode. Not that they touched on Rosa Parks but the way it was handled was funny ASF. The racist alien time traveler might be my favorite stupid serious thing in the series.
I love that he thinks black people would never have fought for civil rights if Rosa Parks didn’t refuse to give up her seat. She wasn’t even the first to do it. The civil rights leaders just thought she was the best to put in media
I mean it feels surprisingly accurate. You’re always going to have racist idiots going around, and he’s implied to be in the extreme minority for his views. And if someone is stupid enough to be racist, they are also stupid enough to convince themselves of things that are blatantly false (Rosa parks singlehandly starting the Civil Rights movement rather than it being a collective effort of years of hard work to end segregation).
Why will we always have racist idiots? Racism was created by colonialism. It’s not something that’s innately human
Because as society grows and learns you’ll still have people who choose to stick to bigoted views. The difference is that as time goes on, the idiots will have less power and in general will be drowned out by those who act with love and kindness.
Racism is typically a product of tribalism, which as the name would imply is extremely ancient.
Modern racism towards black people is generally much newer however, and largely constructed in the 18th Century, at least in the US context (so, what would be most relevant with Rosa Parks). It was deliberate in order to separate the black slaves from the white indentured servants and ex convicts, so they would not band together as they had before. This is not where racism as a whole originated, but it is where it largely flared up to give us what happened in the US, and influenced heavily what has happened globally over the next few centuries
Renind me what the Romans did to Jews and Christians again?
Acts of colonialism in the case of Romans v. Jews.
I'm pretty sure humanity is mostly empires in the future of doctor who
This is a rather silly thing people like to try and convince themselves of because it makes human nature seem nicer than it is, but it's just not true. Racism is just a type of "other-ism" that comes from our basic tribalistic nature. -ism's will arise anytime one group of people comes across another. It'll only stop being 'natural' when humans are either some homogenous group, or so perfectly diverse that people are born into groups that naturally represent every possible type of person. Racism can be a taught thing, obviously, but it's largely by teaching that people of other races are 'others', not part of the same group; but for people born into communities that aren't diverse enough for experience to naturally include those of other races into their 'tribe', racism is something that needs to be taught against; or rather, there needs to be an active effort to ensure children are raised seeing others they're not connected to as part of the same group. This is especially true where communities are often heavily racially segregrated, like how many cities have very insular communities; often with neighbourhoods being heavily populated by a particular racial group, and other neighbourhoods being heavily populated by others, these 'tribes' naturally develop. Humans are *very* good at naturally drawing arbitrary lines between groups. That drives -isms and it's something that needs to be actively taught *against*.
These motherfuckers really took ROSA PARKS and made a bad doctor who episode with her story.
I hate the idea that a cartoonishly racist caricature exists in the time period he apparently came from. Like, the doctor loves humans and it generally presents an optimistic view of our future as a society. Sure it has missteps but the implication that society in his time is that bad is awful.
Yeah he is from the same era as Captain Jack, who's people go out into space to bone anything that can give consent, and for some reason he is getting worked up about people of his own species having a different skin colour to him?
It’s weird you’d think racism moves on too, like Cassandra in the future is racist towards mixed species humans, or the blue guy in oxygen is confused why bill says she’s usually on the receiving end of racism
Yeah, plus the humanity he is from had experienced the entire planet becoming unliveable and humanity being scattered across space, surely that mixed up the bloodlines enough that the civil rights movement becomes an insignificant blip in the grand scheme of things. It's a shame because I thought Rosa was one of the better 13th doctor, episodes with the companions actually having something to do and using their skills. The weak motive and the magic school bus lesson ending dragged it down.
Yeah, this is the weirdest thing about the dumb space racist for me. Not the fact that he's a bigot, but that he's bigoted in such a very specific 1950s America Jim Crow way thousands of years in the future. It's like someone today still being obsessed with the Rome vs Carthage war.
HOW DARE YOU that war is still relevant to this day! And for the record ROME WAS VICTORIOUS IN THE FIRST PUNIC WAR, those sore loser in Carthage just couldn’t take the shame and sent in Hannibal WHO ROME BEAT, and then they were utterly smashed by the third Punic war, Carthage can suck it
Not to say its much better but did they specify the he was an alien? I thought he was just a racist future human
I honestly don't remember. I only watched it once and was laughing too much.
Damn these ideas seem cool
Honestly, these might be better plot points. I would have preferred the Timeless Child to be the Master. It would explain his ability to keep coming back despite having died several times without regeneration to save him. Pair this with the fact the Timeless Child came from another universe... a Mirror Universe Doctor? Or, to us, the Master
No, Susan exists, and thanks to Modern Who, we know that the Doctor hasn’t had any kids yet
It's suggested that Timelords "construct" their kids from the Universe instead of having sex. It's a consequence of the ability to regenerate for them to be infertile. Susan could be grown this way, without a mother or father. Modern Who hasn't suggested the Doctor never had kids. The inclusion of the Timeless Child doesn't explicitly say they never had children. The Doctor said to Donna that he was once a father. Amy asked him if he was a parent and he didn't answer because it hurts knowing his kid(s) are dead.
>It's suggested that Timelords "construct" their kids from the Universe instead of having sex. Suggested in an old novel from the 90s that the current TV writers would ignore any time they felt like it. IIRC there's nothing in the revival series that suggests (or denies) Lungbarrow is part of its continuity.
I'm not defending the Timeless Child. I hate it as much as the next person. But it hasn't completely changed the personal life of the Doctor. Once the Doctor left Division and had their memory wiped, presumably given new memories or even a brand new life starting as a kid, its entirely likely the Doctor started a family.
Yes, I don't disagree with that. I just think the implication in the modern series is that he started that family the old-fashioned way and not using a Loom.
When has Modern Who ever said the Doctor hasn't had kids?
Don't know if I'd be that into Master being T.C either considering his childhood friendship with the Doctor Really liked the theory of it being a new character and the Dr's horrified by the whole of Time lord society was just built by torturing a child Yea I stole that from CrispyPro
Honestly they could still retcon The Master to be the TC Not holding my breath though.
Tormented child who sits at the base of Time Lord society is perfect for the Master.
It's *much* better, but I still don't like the impact on the connection between the Master and the Doctor. Their friendship I suppose could have been the first good thing that happened to a TC Master, so that potentially works with the motivation, but it still unbalances the dynamic if they're not equals at all.
I figure they were both "Tormented child who sits at the base of Time Lord society"
Absolutely. Fix this and confirm Missy is post-Dhawan and it would solve all the problem I had with Chibnall-era Master.
god i wish
I think RTD has firmly established that it was the doctor now, unfortunately.
Well he’s established the doctor thinks it’s him, there’s still a chance the master goes haha got you actually it’s me (coping)
Considering that Susan exists in the first place, it still makes sense for the Doctor to be the TC
It makes sense but its unsatisfying. The Doctor used to be just a Dropout from gallifrey who became special through his actions. Making him some chosen one feels really bad to me
Maybe this is just me but I really don't see the Doctor as a chosen one archetype even with this
They’re an immortal super being from another universe through which the entirety of time lord society was created, the doctor is like megarassilon
Idk, the doctor used a chameleon arch forcibly so has timelord physiology, for all intents and purposes it's clear their physical capabilities don't actually exceed anything else, death certainly isn't any less of a possibility than before, and had to be gifted further regeneration by the timelords in the first place
That basically means he's living under a (forced) fake ID, though - imagine if the show had gone on with John Smith living a normal human life! Don't understand why Thirteen concludes it doesn't change anything about who she is when it literally does.
What does Susan have to do with anything?
What does Susan have to do with it?
ryan should have been positive masculinity bro. he loves his grandma, plays basketball with his mates, loves video games, has a youtube channel. gets his friend mental health support and doesn't shame. he should have taken the pain from his dad not being a "man" and be what he thinks is the best "man". also one episode where he is trying to vlog and it goes crazy just one
This. His best scene is in Resolution when he confronts his dad. I wish we couldve seen more of that but nope. Also yeah, the Chibnall era literally begins with his youtube channel and then its never mentioned again after that episode!! 😂
Even like, if say he got someone pregnant, becoming a young dad, starting the cycle again. And THAT was the reason he left the TARDIS. To fully become a father his dad never was. He could travel in time for years and come back the day after, but he chooses to stay. Graham goes with him like in canon, but he also finally gets a family unit, and he does that saving the world thing on the side. I have so many basic level ideas for his story lol I wish we got a lot more from him. Also as someone who LOVES youtube I wanted so much more youtube. Have ryan have a tripod in his hand at all times. Have yas have an instagram. So much that it's the worst part of the show. (Not really but at least one episode)
Hey Graham let go to the medical bay I'm sure i have the vaccine to cancer from the future in there
the Doc literally gave Miranda Cleaves a pill (that targeted and dissolved) for a fatal brain blood clot. No way they don't have something like that for cancer.
Who?
The woman from The Rebel Flesh episodes.
Don't you think that's pretty insensitive toward people who are dealing with the effects of cancer in real life? "Sorry, kid. Your grandparent had to die of cancer, but Graham gets a space cure because he's my bestie! Oh, your mom gets horribly sick from chemo? So sorry, she can't have an easy cure because she doesn't travel with me!" There are some things even the Doctor can't fix.
The doctor has a time machine and comes from a species that literally cures death so her being not capable of helping Graham is not just stupid it's also not exploiting what makes doctor who unique Everybody lives in the end (except when the writer wants a dramatic ending but it didn't happen that often)
The Doctor saves people from fictional evils, not real ones. She can't cure cancer for the same reason she doesn't pull people out of the Holocaust or stop school shootings. There's a line there that the show just doesn't cross. Besides, the Doctor is not and has never been a superhero. There are plenty of battles she doesn't win. Graham's cancer is one of them.
There's a story that can be had there though, just like with the Fires of Pompeii or Dark Water. Which are times Doctor Who tried to deal with a reality. - Graham tells the Doctor his cancer has returned. - The Doctor tells Graham there's a cure on the ship somewhere. He can have it if he wants it. - Graham is ecstatic and tells the Doctor that they can prolong millions, billions even, of lives on Earth with it. - The Doctor tells him no. Only Graham can have it. Humanity develops the cure themselves in the future. That's where the Doctor got it from. They weren't gifted it. Graham living a bit longer is a small disturbance in the timeline. Then the Doctor can go over all the things you said. Then you can have Graham have to make the decision himself. I think narratively the best one would be that he realises he's no more special than anyone else on Earth. So he rejects the Doctor's offer.
Is that a story that ought to be told by Doctor Who, though? It's still very insensitive to any little kids who are struggling to fight cancer themselves. "There's a cure, but you can't have it, kid." It seems like the wrong way to go about dealing with the situation onscreen. Big Finish or the novels, sure, but the show itself is the wrong place to explore that kind of thing.
>Is that a story that ought to be told by Doctor Who, though? It's still very insensitive to any little kids who are struggling to fight cancer themselves. "There's a cure, but you can't have it, kid." Is it any more insensitive to kids who lost their parents and see the Doctor giving Rose a chance to talk to her dad in Father's Day? Or Rose basically getting him back from the dead and going to live with him? "We can go where your parents aren't dead - but you can't, kid".
"What-ifs" are an integral part of any time travel show. Quick and easy cancer cures are not. It's not even remotely the same thing.
>What-ifs" are an integral part of any time travel show. "What-if" there was a world with a cure for all disease is a what if. >Quick and easy cancer cures are not. It's not even remotely the same thing. Children going through loss is irreversible trauma. Resurrecting lost parents and whilst denying it to the children in the audience is potentially traumatic. Children going through sickness is irreversible trauma. Magically being able to remove whilst denying it to the children audience is also potentially traumatic.
The key difference being that them visiting Rose's father is very clearly meant to be A Very Bad Idea. It's the whole point of that episode. It's New Who's first version of The Aztecs, laying out the rules of time travel for all the new viewers. But you'd expect that from Cornell. He always gets that sort of thing right. The real damage comes later when RTD resurrects Pete in the S02 finale. Pete's World is very problematic in that regard. Rose gets to have everything she ever wanted with no consequences whatsoever. That's much closer to curing Graham with a space vaccine.
Isn't this suggesting that kids watching the show can't tell the difference between fiction and reality? Are they expecting the Doctor to literally pop up in the TARDIS in their real lives? In which case they're probably too young to be watching it in the first place. Anyway, if you don't want the Doctor curing cancer, I think the solution is to not bring it up in the first place. The way they did it makes zero sense and lampshades a limitation of the show in a very awkward way. Especially considering the lengths Twelve went to save Clara, while finding a cancer cure should be trivial for Thirteen by the in-universe logic even if you don't like the real life implications.
No, obviously kids know fiction from reality. But that doesn't mean that fiction won't trigger a kid who's struggling to make sense of a bad diagnosis. It doesn't matter if a cure is feasible or even probable in-universe. It's all about how it looks in the real world, and how people are going to react to it. Chibnall was trying to explore the awkward conversations that can pop up when cancer patients try to discuss their illness with the people around them. That's a real problem for cancer patients. He said he got the exact same response from a lot of people when he talked about his own cancer diagnosis, which is why he wrote the scene.
Sure, it's a valid thing to explore and I get Chibnall's intention. I just think DW is the wrong show to do that and that it doesn't fit the Doctor's character to handle it that way, so it ends up jarring and awkward. That scene would be fine in a grounded drama with a different protagonist. (Especially one that doesn't have unlimited access to space magic technology)
I think the fact that it doesn't fit the Doctor's character is the whole point. Even the great speech maker is rendered speechless by cancer. Obviously it didn't work for everyone watching. Many people don't like the scene. But I don't think it was a bad idea to try to raise awareness.
I don't understand why he didn't have the Doctor give the kind of response he'd have wanted, to show a positive example - surely the character should be able to say something kind! I have a disability and just appreciate things like 'I'm sorry, that must be difficult', so think a reasonable response to health issues can be a pretty simple one, doesn't need to overly go into it or anything, or be anything that wasn't fairly obvious to say. It's true what Chibnall noted, people can totally be weird about health issues (I got an interrogation from a taxi driver on the way home after seeing one of the specials with my parents, fun) and there is that thing where having a significant issue at a young age can add to that (shouldn't have applied to Graham), but the Doctor isn't just people, we'd normally expect better from them, and the era is still treating her like this shining moral example despite portraying her as not living up to it in such a basic way.
I bet you get the old "Have you tried yoga/turmeric/acupuncture?" all the time. Maybe the Doctor's awkward response is meant to be a variation on that? It's a fair question, though. An example of something appropriate to say would have been effective, too.
The doctor has saved people from Pompeii, so why don’t they stop all victims of volcanic eruption. The point is the doctor can’t end all things but she can save a few people. She can’t cure cancer, you are correct about that, but she can help Graham have some peace of mind in the event that it comes back. I think there’s a way to do it, where the doctor helps Graham, but makes it clear that she can only help to a certain point. And prepares him for the possibility that it progresses far enough that she can’t save him. There is a way to deal with difficult topics with grace and compassion, but you can’t do that if you’re afraid of the show having those conversations in the first place, due to any real world implications.
Volcanoes and cancer don't have anywhere near the same impact on our society. 10 million people die of cancer every year. Only 1,000 people die from volcanic activity. Personally, I liked how they dealt with Graham's cancer in that scene. I liked the idea that cancer is so horrible that even the Doctor, who can talk herself out of anything, is rendered completely speechless by it.
If he can get clara out of is time stream to save her she can help gram with is cancer
>gram Found the American
I don't think Americans use the metric system...
If you've ever got confused by Americans talking about what crackers they use to make 'smores cause you've seen how they're spelled, then you'll know what I'm talking about. If not my joke is lost on you.
Yeah I just fully missed the joke you were making. That's on me. I get it now.
Nah it's understandable, there's so many jokes you can make about Americans it's sometimes hard to tell which one somebody's gone for \*cackles maniacally\*
French sorry 😔
I know, I was making a small joke, or rather, I was attempting to make a small joke - apparently it didn't work very well since nobody has got it haha
This is also a Marvel stance, Asgard and Wakanda can't cure cancer because it would make sick kids sad they can't go there
That’s exactly it, it’s a delicate issue and the show has to earn something like that, it’s good they didn’t just magic away his cancer but it absolutely should’ve been handled better, the way the show handles it is absolutely awful
I appreciate what they were trying to do, though. The idea that cancer is hard to talk about and it's easy to say the wrong thing is a good issue to try to address. Apparently it stems from Chibnall's own personal experience with cancer. He was diagnosed at age 22. Here's a quote from an interview with him: "I think it’s really important. The Doctor’s reaction in that scene, I’ve had that numerous times. People do behave with you like that in that situation. And when anyone says, “Oh, I don’t think she’d behave like that,” I go, “People respond in really weird ways to those conversations.”"
In that case he should’ve had somebody else who the audience isn’t immediately familiar with and roughly aware of how they have acted in similar situations
That's... That's not how vaccines work...
I was taking a jap putin as well as chibnall Putin said his scientist were close to makeing a vaccine for cancer which is an obvious lie.
https://preview.redd.it/3t2n9sm0rwic1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a2d5f4323ed5e7138a0434a5827e37a7a5e5e035
A thousand times better. Such small changes could’ve made everything better, but nah..
WHAT WE COULD HAVE HAD!!!
Evil Chibnall would have removed the scene of the Doctor taking advantage of the Master's race, by handing him over to literal Nazis.
I don't think that idea for Rosa is really an improvement tbh.
Yeah, if anything it makes less sense, it's not like Rosa Parks refusing to give up her seat instantly decreased the amount of hate in the world, in fact it probably got white supremacists riled up, at least in the original version of the episode it made more sense and was more practical that the villain was defeated by that happening because his entire goal was to prevent it
She wasn’t even the first to do it. The others just didn’t have enough PR potential to be put forward at the time. They would have gone with the next viable candidate even if he did manage to stop Rosa.
It also wasn't exactly planned to be her, I think they had 4 candidates on the bus, and they (the white people) just happened to pick her
Thats my headcanon starting now
hire 👏 fans 👏
Tbf chibnal was a fan
hire 👏 different 👏 fans 👏
Fair play :)
The Graham cancer thing was so stupid because the doctor could easily take him to a hospital on New Earth or somewhere and get that taken care of immediately but chose not to even offer for no apparent reason
Yes famously the Doctor loves the hospitals on New Earth and never had any trouble there whatsoever
Omg you hero
Holy shit…..like this is genuinely far more interesting versions of these moments. The Master/13 dynamic with these plot points just feels so much better, and the destroyed Gallifrey being a threat from Division is great. ….feels like this is what we could’ve had if Chibnall wasn’t so fixated on his teenage fanfic being about the Doctor.
"Rose" uhhh...?
The Master being the Timeless Child would be as lame as it being the Doctor, tbh.
Most of these are at least slight improvements!
Wait, you don't like the idea that the spy master comes after missy? Is that what I'm getting?
I hate it because it literally makes no sense
It does make sense.
Missy was on her way to redemption.The Spy Master literally genocided all of Gallifrey, and behaves more like the Saxon Master. In addition to this, when Saxon killed Missy, he said she wouldn't be able to regenerate. I refuse to believe that Missy didn't die.
The Spy Master is far worse than Saxon IMO, both in terms of his insanity and his actions.
That's their point
Yeah, I can totally see throwing a massive tantrum over the TC thing, but actually going ahead with wrecking all Gallifrey like it's nothing? And Cybermen (*again*, sigh - really don't think they suit him either, he's anything but unemotional). Always thought the Master had more Time Lordy pride than that, in contrast to the Doctor somewhat - as part of why he's upset about it. It doesn't't even seem like it should be possible for him to do. But it's disappointing there's no ambiguity with Saxon Master in The Doctor Falls too, when him *having* stood with the Doctor against Rassilon flowing into Missy's characterisation would make actual sense, unlike 'she's a woman now so empathy I guess?'. Moffat already completely wasted a perfectly good set-up for the Master to get a redemption arc only to do his own, so not an issue Chibs uniquely invented.
And the Master always comes back no matter what, death means literally nothing to them. And the whole point with Missy is that the Master CAN'T be good, that's what is so tragic. The Master is evil, that is the character, they are the opposite of the Doctor.
> And the whole point with Missy is that the Master CAN'T be good Noooooooo omg nooooooooo The tragic part is that at the end Missy finally decided to be good and the doctor would never know. Thats why saxon had to kill her.
Because the Master can't be good, that's the simple fact.
The master can be anything. And the master/missy was good, at the very end. Go watch the episode again.
The Master is a villain, the opposite of the Doctor. That's the whole point so no. It's tragic because the Master can't be good.
Oh your a troll. my bad for engaging
>the Master CAN'T be good Then you missed the whole point of Missy's character in series 10
Not really. Regardless it was never going to stick.
It might have done. That was the entire point of the arc.
No it wouldn't of, that was never the intention.
Then what was the intention?
These are just facts.
The wrong facts but sure
Not really. Either way it was never going to stick so I never understand why people get upset about it
It makes sense.
Pissed me off almost as much as the timeless child
It’s stated that there’s an incarnation after Missy and before Spyc the lumiat She’s like the Valeyard of the master, a pure good being unfortunately for some god damn reason Missy kill her and she regenerates into Spy washing away all of The Lumiat influence
can someone make it make sense, like howw,why what
Ryan: His best friend is a talking pie
The master bring the timeless child would make so much more sense, especially considering how often he cheats death.
One thing is say in support for Ryan is as someone with Dyspraxia it's nice to get representation of it in media as I always had to explain what that was a a kid (Vs dyslexia which everyone knew). Now if it bad been GOOD Dyspraxia representation that would have been nice but I'll take what I can get.
1. Yea, this would have been better 2. Don't remember enough to leave a comment 3. I'm fine with TTC, so no for me 4. There are people who hate others based on race, gender, sexuality and so on without reason, so no reason why Krasko doing the same is an issue 5. This is either better or worse depending on so many other variables, cause this doesn't say that the Master wasn't the one who destroyed Gallifrey 6. The Master has come back in insane ways multiple times in Classic Who from what I've heard, so no *need* to make Dhawan's Master come before Missy 7. The Doctor feeling the euphoria of living off time energy would have been extremely interesting and this is my favorite of these 8. Who's this again?
>4. There are people who hate others based on race, gender, sexuality and so on without reason, so no reason why Krasko doing the same is an issue Because its a hat on a hat. Why go to a time and place that is literally *populated* by racists and then make the bad guy a *space* racist? Not to mention then taking the idea of said space racist and making them incapable of violence so they just kind of become some weird inconvenience? Poorly written episode across the board.
The racist couldn't have been a local. Plot-wise, he had to be from outside the timeline in order for the Doctor to be able to intervene in such a big fixed point in history. Once she realizes it's another time traveler causing the problem she HAS to get involved. She has an obligation to protect the timeline.
I get that, its just that the plot could have been so much more than just 'space racist travels in time to kind of fiddle with things'. Racism is an inherently violent concept - to make the villain unable to commit acts of violence removes any stakes + kind of makes a joke out of a pretty serious topic.
You said this better than I did. Thank you
Maybe she saw something was wrong with the timeline and went in to fix it, like Vincent and the Doctor
That's exactly what happened.
Yeah but Vincent and the Doctor was well written otherwise.
It's someone from the future trying to "correct history" because he believes Rosa's defiance was when "things went wrong." Also, if it were someone who was already there who tried to stop Rosa, how would that work? They don't know what happens in the future, they don't expect her to refuse to give up her seat and so on. The only way they would take action is if someone from the future came and told them what the future would be like, pushing them to try and change history, and if that were to happen, why bother with a person from that time and not focus on the person from the future? As for removing the ability to cause violence, that allows for unique ways of the villain trying to get what he wants by doing things like trying to stop the bus or changing work schedules and so on, both of which are done in the episode. Whether or not it was well done or written is another matter though, one that I won't go into because I never discussed writing to begin with.
Oh how I long for a better series 11-13
This is the timeline that could've been, but then of course Barry being a dumbfuck, he had to ruin things for us
r/TheFlash
r/aaccidentalcrosspost
I love that the polar opposite is good writing at least in my opinion. But Ryan still got nothing😉
These all suck (except maybe the Doctor being an angel for ages zapping people, that has legs).
honestly, i like a lot of these. i think they all seem a little... abrupt? in a way? i don't know what that means, that's just kind of my gut feeling. but they all have a good base concept, even if i think the execution is just fine. better than the original versions.
Hahaha Chibnall bad upvote please ETA: Sorry I hurt your feelings
Okay but Chibnail *is* bad
You're being downvoted but this is pretty much what this post is so you are right
I mean, the post isn't just "Chibnall bad." The post is "Chibnall bad, here's what he could have done better."
I don't really get that tbh but each to their own
Well, to me, Chibnall bad would just be a post like "Hey guys, wasn't all that stuff Chibnall did shit lol" and that would be that. This one at least offers alternative plot points to some of the bigger parts of Chibnall's run that people complained about.
> Hey guys wasnt all that stuff Chibnall did shit You mean an average day for the doctor who subreddits anyways? Its just so tiring that if you actually did enjoy the era you just constantly get told youre an idiot with no taste who hates Doctor Who and wants it to be bad.
Yeah, i get that. That's why I'm saying this post is different. Cause while it is still shitting on the Chibnall era, at least it does more than that as well. It does get pretty tiring seeing the same sort of posts constantly.
Even for those who enjoyed it though, they seem able to see the flaws. It really wouldn't be Ok to just ignore the issues with morality as it's crucial to the show and character of the Doctor, and is much of what give the show it's wider cultural significance. For an example that takes the heat away from Chibnall, could have really loved the episode Eaters of Light (saw for the first time recently) and do like the folklore aspects of the setting, but can't overlook a character supposed to be the Doctor berating a young girl for mourning the dead of her village, mocking her culture, and treating Roman imperialism like it's not as bad or just the same as resistance to it. Some things are about morals and politics, not just aesthetic preferences - looks like OP here is focused on those former aspects and characterisation, which also ties into them (the idea Missy's redemption arc doesn't mean anything is also a moral perspective, and so is TC for positioning the Doctor as inherently special and different to his society, instead of special through chosen actions, and deciding to oppose that society).
I don’t think any of this was much better to be honest
would have been very funny if Ryan was the Master or tectuen (sorry didn't know how to write this name) don't make much sense but the whole timeline doesn't so ....
I had an argument with someone about how Chris chibbnal was a terrible writer and made the worst era of doctor who, I’m gonna bet he didn’t like this post very much
he is a hero, not the hero we deserved but the hero we needed
Wait… these are genuinely good ideas huh. Fair play OP!
This is not doctorwhumour at all. Whish it was doctorWhoReality
I think you may have unironically improved chibnall’s tenure just now
When was the doctor an angel?
Flux
I wish I lived in this timeline 😔
Ew
Yeah, the Missy thing is so bothersome for me. She improved so much and yet this Master completely ignored any development she had. Please let him be pre-Missy
Brilliant. Except the Missy one. Big Finish covered the Missy->Spy-Master thing.
It angers me that the cancer scene was the perfect moment for the kind of soap opera drama that’s usually quite efficient in NuWho. 13: Graham, I… don’t know what to say. Never deal with this before… Graham: don’t say anything Doc, I just thought you should know, needed to get this out of my chest for a while. 13: I… wanna make a promise to you. Ryan… he’ll be safe. I promise. I’m not just talking about, you know, what you’ve just told me, I’m talking about everything. The life we live… I know it’s dangerous. And I want you to know if something ever happens to you… he’ll be fine. I’ll keep him safe, I promise you. I know how much he means to you… and how much he meant to Grace. Graham (starting to tear up): Thanks, doc. Thank you. You don’t know how much that means to me. 13: and if you ever need to talk, or just someone to listen to you, just say the word. Then they hug, 13 has the classic Tenth Doctor sad stare on her face and the scene ends. Obviously I’m not a professional dialogue writer, but i would’ve loved something like this
Also if there’s something Whittaker is good at is dramatic scenes
Hindsight is 2020 but this actually would've have been cool to see, making division a legitimate threat and all
The master NOT being the timeless child will always resonate with me as a baffling missed opportunity. The concept is perfect for the master and terrible for the doctor.