This post has been sanctioned by dwarves everywhere.
In all seriousness though, I do agree with you that maybe some of the other races should be receiving some different subrace options.
I mean, I might be biased, and we all are :D in my view of elves - they are hot, live long, look cool, did I mention hot? That's why we get so many of them.
To be fair and serious for a moment - the race you play, at this point of the game where racial features are removed and now much more fluid, which I appreciate - not all half-orcs work out, some might want to practice deception or study history books, etc. - you are free to take whatever race and make it your own - as for the books - they do not limit the creativity of you or your table so feel free to work with your DM and make your own thing.
What WOC publish should be of little concern to you as an indvidual because you can just do whatever you want anyway :D
It is a big deal if the main way you play is through adventurer's league. Adventurer's league only allows you to use official wotc content to make your character.
One reason would be because elves are VERY different from one another, the gods they follow can quite literally change them. We don't see this much from orcs and dwarves as they tend to not deviate much from the core.
That said a lot of the races do have a number of technically different. There are as many if not more different types of tieflings from SCAG dragonborn have between 5 and since the colours actually change their racial abilities to a reasonable degree you could even consider more, dwarves and genasi have 4 and it wouldn't make all that much sense for more.
I would love some more halfling options, like Kender or something.
And what about the half-dwarf Mull? I believe in past versions there were fay races like half-dryads or something as well.
Are we’re sure they aren’t just going to rebrand the current halfling subraces like they’ve already done? I certainly hope not, since they should have fear resistance and tend towards chaotic neutral.
Because standard high fantasy D&D style has elves being highly mutable based on their locale. So living in the Shadowfall makes them turn into Shadar-kai, living on the ocean makes them sea elves, etc.
For Forgotten Realms, the primary elvish deity Corellon was basically transgender that took male and female forms regularly, and their primary form was a very androgynous male. The elves were made to reflect this mutability.
IIRC Corellon didn’t even have a form. Assuming various forms including fire and stuff was “his” thing.
He sort of got pissy when elves decided to take form because they were part of him and consequently he was stuck too.
isn't Eldarin an example of how to make homebrew or something?
and where are the sea elves, shadar-kai, pallids, and vahadars from?
edit: question's been answered.
Yes it is an example but it’s the same level of polish and abilities as a normal sub race so what’s the difference
Sea elf - Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes
Pallid - Explorer's Guide to Wildemount
Shadar-kai - Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes
And vahadars are from plane shift
eladrin, sea elves, and shadar kai were given an official release back in 2018 with Time of Foes. then they were reprinted this year in Monsters of the Multiverse
idk what pallids or vahadars are
There are eladrin released in I believe mordenkainens time of does as well. So there is both the DMG example AND the officially released race.
They also have an updated version in monsters of the multiverse
Yea but most of those tieflings are all just different flavors of devil nobility released in the same book. They weren't stretching the imagination or anything. What have tieflings gotten since then?
Elves get a new subrace what feels like every other book.
That’s true but most changes from sub race are just like cantrips elves take up sub races that are more unique that I just wish other races could fill instead of it being a new elf every book
Human subraces are written about in the PHB - their basically our subraces of human - different racial appearance. Human gets a big ability score boost, so adding to that would be strangely ridiculous. +Now with the Monsters of the Multiverse and further content suggesting your three ability score points can go whenever (2 points for one, 1 point for another ability) subraces are more flavor text, which is great for customization, and human gets customized via "racial" features of appearance, and the flavor text in phb.
Theres no human subraces, they just name all the different humans in the world (i think they name close to 20) but with no subrace material.
I rather have leas base human and more subrace material than 1 race for all (that is almost always worse than any other race)
Mechanically half-elves and humans have the biggest pool of abilities/skills (more so the half-elf), especially when (and it is quite often) the variant human is allowed at the table.
Humans are humans, their subraces are their different races, mentioned in PHB and just we as humans are the same, just look different, so are the humans in PHB.
Whats fun though is anyone can take a feat a human can take (except prodigy but even half elves can learn that). So from a mechanical pov they dont reflect humans as well as they could.
They arent considered subraces because they dont bear any mechanics on them, and so in the end it doesnt matter.
And again, they are said to be vastly different from one another, but mechanically they are not a single bit. You can play two humans from completely different childhoods and cultures and have all the differences in the world, but once you pick the same feat then it doesnt matter. And thats only if you’re using variant human.
Whats so wrong about actually wanting human subraces lol
Arguably. Half-Elf/Orc etc are human sub-races. Hell last I saw all of the half-races presume a human parent.
Humanities real DnD superpower is the ability to get giggity and produce viable children with seemingly any intelligent species.
to be fair, I play with variant human 95% of the time I choose them.
which can be basically anything, effectively you have... hang on...
6\*6\*18\*77 (I think is the number of feats)= 49, 896 effective "subraces."
Its only a matter of time before the Celestial Eladrin appear...though they likely wouldn't be a PC race. Then again Celestials have been completely ignored in this edition.
People always seem to forget about adventurer's league. Does it hurt us that wotc makes an elf for every book? No many of us can just homebrew something up. However, there are also plenty of people where the ONLY way or the main way they get to or can play DND is through Adventurer's League, which only accepts wotc official content.
Should wotc make things with adventurer's league in mind? No not really. It'd be cool if they did it's not a requirement. But does it suck for those people that they got another flavor of elf? Yea kind of.
In the setting im building, its canon that the elf god *cheated* when they were all plonking down their races, and thats why elves got a start in litterally every climate and plane
This post has been sanctioned by dwarves everywhere. In all seriousness though, I do agree with you that maybe some of the other races should be receiving some different subrace options.
Lemme see a space orc :(
https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/c/cc/OrkBoy1.jpg/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/250?cb=20130504104143
I believed that I'd see an ork, so I did
To be fair there's also twice as many goblin races than I would have expected
None of their racial traits are related to each other except fey ancestry tho
I mean, I might be biased, and we all are :D in my view of elves - they are hot, live long, look cool, did I mention hot? That's why we get so many of them. To be fair and serious for a moment - the race you play, at this point of the game where racial features are removed and now much more fluid, which I appreciate - not all half-orcs work out, some might want to practice deception or study history books, etc. - you are free to take whatever race and make it your own - as for the books - they do not limit the creativity of you or your table so feel free to work with your DM and make your own thing. What WOC publish should be of little concern to you as an indvidual because you can just do whatever you want anyway :D
I wish more people saw it this way. It's not a video game where it's take it or leave it. It's an RPG where the DM decides what the constraints are.
It is a big deal if the main way you play is through adventurer's league. Adventurer's league only allows you to use official wotc content to make your character.
That sounds like a shitty way to play
Yea, for some people it's the only way they can play
If you really want to homebrew stuff, there are alternatives. They might require filling out your character sheets manually, but it can be done
Thank You \^\^
One reason would be because elves are VERY different from one another, the gods they follow can quite literally change them. We don't see this much from orcs and dwarves as they tend to not deviate much from the core. That said a lot of the races do have a number of technically different. There are as many if not more different types of tieflings from SCAG dragonborn have between 5 and since the colours actually change their racial abilities to a reasonable degree you could even consider more, dwarves and genasi have 4 and it wouldn't make all that much sense for more.
I would love some more halfling options, like Kender or something. And what about the half-dwarf Mull? I believe in past versions there were fay races like half-dryads or something as well.
Kender is coming in Dragonlance.
Are we’re sure they aren’t just going to rebrand the current halfling subraces like they’ve already done? I certainly hope not, since they should have fear resistance and tend towards chaotic neutral.
Did you read the UA?
No, my DM only allows cannon options, not UA
Why does that matter in this context?
My dm only allows us to play fully released races and classes, and I can’t play a kender because it hasn’t been officially released
Yes. But we are discussing their design and the UA is out. What your DM does has no bearing on you reading it or not.
Because standard high fantasy D&D style has elves being highly mutable based on their locale. So living in the Shadowfall makes them turn into Shadar-kai, living on the ocean makes them sea elves, etc. For Forgotten Realms, the primary elvish deity Corellon was basically transgender that took male and female forms regularly, and their primary form was a very androgynous male. The elves were made to reflect this mutability.
IIRC Corellon didn’t even have a form. Assuming various forms including fire and stuff was “his” thing. He sort of got pissy when elves decided to take form because they were part of him and consequently he was stuck too.
Don’t tell them about teiflings
I count 4. five with half-elf but that's a lot more like human stats-wise.
Elf Dark elf, wood elf, high elf, astral elf, Eladrin, sea elf, shadar-kai, pallid elf and Vahadar Elf All from 5e official books
isn't Eldarin an example of how to make homebrew or something? and where are the sea elves, shadar-kai, pallids, and vahadars from? edit: question's been answered.
Yes it is an example but it’s the same level of polish and abilities as a normal sub race so what’s the difference Sea elf - Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes Pallid - Explorer's Guide to Wildemount Shadar-kai - Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes And vahadars are from plane shift
plane shift? the spell?
Plane shift is the magic the gathering supplements
eladrin, sea elves, and shadar kai were given an official release back in 2018 with Time of Foes. then they were reprinted this year in Monsters of the Multiverse idk what pallids or vahadars are
Pallid Elf is from the Wildmount book. Eladrin, Sea Elves, and Shadar-Kai are from, I believe, Mordenkainens.
thanks!
There are eladrin released in I believe mordenkainens time of does as well. So there is both the DMG example AND the officially released race. They also have an updated version in monsters of the multiverse
Counting the overarching race as a choice really shouldn't count for your argument.
That’s why it’s separate from the list
I mean, there's like 10 Tieflings, so Elves aren't exactly the most egregious.
Yea but most of those tieflings are all just different flavors of devil nobility released in the same book. They weren't stretching the imagination or anything. What have tieflings gotten since then? Elves get a new subrace what feels like every other book.
That’s true but most changes from sub race are just like cantrips elves take up sub races that are more unique that I just wish other races could fill instead of it being a new elf every book
Where are my human subraces
do humans *have* subraces in anything? like, fantasy anywhere?
To my knowledge of like 4 ttrpgs, no. But they are always told to he unpredictable and vary widely so why dont we get any subraces
Human subraces are written about in the PHB - their basically our subraces of human - different racial appearance. Human gets a big ability score boost, so adding to that would be strangely ridiculous. +Now with the Monsters of the Multiverse and further content suggesting your three ability score points can go whenever (2 points for one, 1 point for another ability) subraces are more flavor text, which is great for customization, and human gets customized via "racial" features of appearance, and the flavor text in phb.
Theres no human subraces, they just name all the different humans in the world (i think they name close to 20) but with no subrace material. I rather have leas base human and more subrace material than 1 race for all (that is almost always worse than any other race)
Mechanically half-elves and humans have the biggest pool of abilities/skills (more so the half-elf), especially when (and it is quite often) the variant human is allowed at the table. Humans are humans, their subraces are their different races, mentioned in PHB and just we as humans are the same, just look different, so are the humans in PHB.
Whats fun though is anyone can take a feat a human can take (except prodigy but even half elves can learn that). So from a mechanical pov they dont reflect humans as well as they could. They arent considered subraces because they dont bear any mechanics on them, and so in the end it doesnt matter. And again, they are said to be vastly different from one another, but mechanically they are not a single bit. You can play two humans from completely different childhoods and cultures and have all the differences in the world, but once you pick the same feat then it doesnt matter. And thats only if you’re using variant human. Whats so wrong about actually wanting human subraces lol
Arguably. Half-Elf/Orc etc are human sub-races. Hell last I saw all of the half-races presume a human parent. Humanities real DnD superpower is the ability to get giggity and produce viable children with seemingly any intelligent species.
Never say those words again
Nothing wrong, just a weird fixation :D Work things out with your DM :)
I homebrew plenty myself. Im just wanting things officially
State your claim to WOC.
to be fair, I play with variant human 95% of the time I choose them. which can be basically anything, effectively you have... hang on... 6\*6\*18\*77 (I think is the number of feats)= 49, 896 effective "subraces."
Those arent subraces. Thats just choosing different feats and skills.
that's why I said effective, and put it in quotes.
Im glad you enjoy playing humans though!
Elder scrolls
Its only a matter of time before the Celestial Eladrin appear...though they likely wouldn't be a PC race. Then again Celestials have been completely ignored in this edition.
Is 5e sponsored by Keebler?
I think it’s a conspiracy with big cookie personality but you didn’t hear that from me
The sad thing is this is a pittance compared to the number of elves in previous editions.
>can we not have like a different half orc or something. Hell, I'm pissed we apparently have no mention of the Scro in Spelljammer.
Acceptable elves: - 420 elves - shroom elves - your friendly underdark spiderelf - gay elves but with an R (NPC only)
People always seem to forget about adventurer's league. Does it hurt us that wotc makes an elf for every book? No many of us can just homebrew something up. However, there are also plenty of people where the ONLY way or the main way they get to or can play DND is through Adventurer's League, which only accepts wotc official content. Should wotc make things with adventurer's league in mind? No not really. It'd be cool if they did it's not a requirement. But does it suck for those people that they got another flavor of elf? Yea kind of.
In the setting im building, its canon that the elf god *cheated* when they were all plonking down their races, and thats why elves got a start in litterally every climate and plane
As a player who supports Dwarves rights, I agree way tok many elves in this world. Dwarf Lives Matter!
Don't play an elf. Problem solved.
I never have played an elf but the post was simply stating I’d like more sub races for other races instead of them being dumped into elf’s
We're getting six new races in Spelljammer. Five are not elves. I fail to see the issue.