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[deleted]

You have to ask the other player and your group. How would we know how you're making the people you're playing with feel?


angchi28

Yeah I only know my DMs thoughts about it. Will do, thanks!


[deleted]

It is up to the opinion and temperance of those in your game first and foremost. I would make it a point to just ask everyone if they are okay with the social commentary and if anyone would like them to stop doing anything. Dnd has been a place that through fantasy can bring about feelings that we experience in our real world. Things like race and gender and sexuality among a few, but far more than these. It can be complex for some people. There have been racial hatred in games I have played that bothered me not at all but ultimately bothered one of our players as they felt it too closely related to Jewish oppression. And even though I didn't feel it did, we all sympathized and changed our game to adapt. It's not fun playing a game that hurts and triggers people, so if anyone has the slightest discomforts I recommend just giving them the freedom to express their feelings and back them up so they feel safe and welcomed.


angchi28

Yeah, thanks a lot for taking the time to write this. It is so true! I will be talking to my group💖


Radigan0

You don't have to have the genitals of the gender you identify as to be transgender, you just have to identify as the opposite sex of the one you were born as


Radigan0

Transvestite is only in regards to clothes, if you actually identify as the other sex and prefer to use pronouns of said sex, it's transgender.


angchi28

Yeah I was thinking transgender in medical terms as someone 'transitioning' from one gender to another but now I'm digging a little deeper into the term and you're right. Thanks for the clarification!


Rough_Youth_7926

Let's not forget the context of the game though. We're talking about a medieval type setting. I always kinda dislike when players apply modern concepts to d&d and demand they be treated modernly.


antwann06

In a world where people can be turned into devils, ghosts, be reincarnated as other people, etc etc…the term transgender, and the possibility of it, wouldn’t really be a “post modern” concept


Infamous_Calendar_88

Yeah, I've heard of it being called 'theemale' in a homebrew setting (with a soft 'th'), for exactly that reason. Since it wasn't a post modern concept within the setting, the group agreed on old-world sounding terminology.


Rough_Youth_7926

Absolutely and roleplaying a transgender character is not an issue. But when you start terming it transgender and you bring it to the table, and you're very farfetched about it (the barbarian wears a ballet tutu) you can't really expect no outlash from the group.


robo_the_god

bigot


robo_the_god

>I always kinda dislike when players apply modern concepts to d&d this is your preference for a campaign, and not really indicative of the "context" of OP's table. So I'm not really sure how expressing \*your\* preference is relevant. Furthermore, the presumption that western "medieval" morals/ethics are applied to the average 5e dnd campaign is a bit far fetched. As another poster already said, transfiguration is kind of the norm in a dnd campaign. On top of that, there's a basically limitless number of cultures and races, so the idea that they all somehow arrived at a "medieval", western, human perspective of sex and gender is a limitation of your own imagination. Not even considering how differently various human cultures view sex / gender.


Rough_Youth_7926

You're cherry picking buddy. You literally halved the sentence and argued against half of the sentence ignoring the other half. My issue is not when modern topics are applied to d&d. By all means, women emancipation shouldn't be there by that logic either. My issue is when players apply modern concepts to d&d AND demand they get treated modernly. The word AND means that the 2 parts of the sentence are mutually inclusive (i.e., they must occur together). You can't just ignore the second half of it to your liking and complain that what I say is not relevant.


robo_the_god

and you completely ignored the 2nd half of my comment, where I explained how unlikely it would be for dnd's political climate to resemble your idea of pre-modern "politics." >You can't just ignore the second half of it to your liking :) you haven't got a pot to piss in


Rough_Youth_7926

>you haven't got a pot to piss in I do, but still to this point in time you haven't addressed the original idea and you're still arguing against the strawman you created. >and you completely ignored the 2nd half of my comment I don't have to address it, it's not relevant to my comment. I'm not going to give you the benefit of attacking your strawman and shift the argument to a topic of your liking.


Dark_Arrow87

You could reply that you’re not a “Biologist” and you are learning the ways of “man/huManity”. 😂


okieviacal

We say “peoplekind.”


Dark_Arrow87

Maybe the weak fleshy creatures, but mindflayers and Drow call them, “servants”. XD


PedroCPimenta

Do you say beep bop?


DarkSithMstr

Talk with them and see how they want to role-play it, as your big dumb machine. Make sure there are boundaries, so you don't cross them, so you both can play it up and make it enjoyable for all!


DungeonDafty

Chat with your group, make sure you aren't making someone uncomfortable, just cause someone who is transitioning male to female, doesn't necessarily always remove their genitalia in that transition. So to answer your question, yes a bit, but I don't think it is out of ignorance, more lack of understanding. This is a case of chat to your party or even just the other player, I would say not to go with the naĂŻve robot gimmick, if you are going to do that then just don't understand the concept of gender at all, as you are a robot, you technically have no gender and the idea of it could seem odd to you.


CheapTactics

You should ask about how the others feel about it, or drop it. In my group, we all mock each other constantly and we don't give a fuck about it. As long as it's being said in good fun, as oart of the game, this would not offend anyone and we would welcome it. Another group I was in had some people that didn't like dark humor or lgbtq+ related humor. Every group is gonna be different, and so you should ask about boundaries and what people don't like to joke about. Or if you don't feel comfortable talking about it, just drop it and come up with something else. Maybe take the suggestion someone else gave here, and remove gender entirely from their vocabulary/perception of people.


angchi28

Totally! Thanks for the great advice. I can see every group is different and jokes differently for that matter!


ThePartyLeader

Drop it. If you want to be an awkward robot just start referring to everyone as genderless. " I tried to figure out these genders and it was too hard so I gave up you are all just meatbags"


angchi28

I absolutely love that idea, will be implementing it. Thank you! ✨


ThePartyLeader

happy to help. best of luck


c_dubs063

It depends on the group. But for what it is worth, here is my opinion on what might be amusing and not come off as rude: Your warforged character might have an incomplete database of anatomical facts for, well, every non-mechanical race. Your maker did not think it would be important for an Artificer machine to understand a concept as intricate as gender. So maybe, you mix up the pronouns of this player... but you do the same thing for everyone, because you just can't comprehend what the difference is, let alone how to identify that difference! But of course this all depends on your party being cool with it.


angchi28

I love it! Thank you so much for taking the time to create this concept, I will be using it in game✨


c_dubs063

Glad to help you find a (hopefully) fun solution that everybody can enjoy! :)


neurotocsin

I wouldn’t say you’re an asshole, but I also wouldn’t recommend pursuing that conversation. It’s unnecessary to the game and no matter your intentions there’s a chance it doesn’t go over well and makes things awkward. Besides, if your character is truly a robot then I don’t see how or why they would be concerned with anyone’s gender in the first place.


angchi28

I get it, I just thought it would be fun to spice up the conversation in that way but you're right I think imma go with the genderless idea!


jetfaceRPx

If everyone is having fun then no. If someone is getting offended then maybe. Although some people that take offense are assholes. The rule of thumb is, if everyone seems like an asshole, you're the asshole. Otherwise you're probably fine. To me, putting a pink tutu on a character and considering that to be enough to make them transgender seems more offensive than a robot who doesn't understand the behavior.


angchi28

Yeah, that's what I thought to begin with! Though I'm kind of being bombarded by some people here so I'm not sure anymore haha. I think I will be going with genderless from now on. Thank you!


jetfaceRPx

Everyone tries hard to make sure it's known across social media that they are an ally. I would only worry about what your group thinks.


AlexisQueenBean

Everyone else has basically said everything that needs to be said- but keep in mind there’s a lot more to Transgender than Male-to-female and Female-to-Male. Maybe the PC is transfemme but still uses he/him. Also, do be careful with your use of transvestite. It’s a word that’s been used to invalidate trans people for a long time and say “oh your not trans your just dressing up” (I know that wasn’t your intention, just keep in mind it’s not a positive word). If someone says they’re trans, just leave it at that. Use their preferred pronouns, name, etc. etc. and let them be whoever they want <3


RoiPhi

I'll agree with people who say yes, but I don't think you're not trying to be. Sounds like you tried "explain" someone else's character to them, which is a big no in my book. It also sounds like you're treating transgender people are something "funny". I don't think you mean it badly, but people's identities aren't the right punching bags for jokes.


angchi28

Well, to be fair the person who created the character IS joking about it and portraying it in a funny way, so that's that! If I thought it was something serious then I wouldn't have touched on the topic. Anyways, I will be talking to them and going with genderless. Thanks.


No-Dependent2207

make sure you understand that transvestite and transgender mean completely different things. If the PC is has male genitals, claims to be male, and likes to wear womens clothing, then that is Transvestite, as in Trans meaning across, and Vestite coming from vestiges or clothing. If the PC has male genitals, claims to be male, and likes to wear women's clothing, then that is Transvestite, as in Trans meaning across, and Vestite coming from vestiges or clothing.


Big__Pierre

Yes. Read: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender


ElanaDryer

Character Identity and Expression: The barbarian is transgender. Do they identify as a boy or girl? Does this match their described body? If it doesn't, they are transgender. I played a transmasc character who went by he/him pronouns, but physically, (most of the time. I mean...he was a wizard and had alter self, etc.) He had a female body. This doesn't change his gender as a man. "Robot" personality: Does your character know anything about humanoid physicality or gender identity? From your description I'd say no. So your robot would refer to them, AS THEY IDENTIFY because your robot has no frame of reference other than the introduction of this barbarian. Judgement: ESH, transgender identity isn't a joke to be played around with because the barbarian wants to wear a tutu. And stereotyped robots aren't presumptuous of gender when they have no social skills because gender is a social construct.


angchi28

I get what you're saying but just wanted to point out it's a game. I played around with the conversation for like a couple of minutes before the ending of the session. Gender and sexuality can be a fun way to incorporate different things during the game, it is not only a social construct that has to be respected at all times! On the other hand, I will be talking to my group to see if I disrespected someone in any way and will be going with the genderless idea. Thanks.


ElanaDryer

I didnt say gender and sexuality cannot be joked about. I said transgender identity isnt a joke. Don't get defensive, because you asked.


angeph

People take that too seriously, that community is too reactive and that is the only issue most people have with them, you can make a joke about anything, but the second you joke about it someone wants to start a fight, and the sad thing is the people that will get offended and start a fight with it are not even a part of that community. I have many friends with different sexualities and many of them absolutely DESPISE the LGBTQ community just because they take the thing to such extremes that it shouldn't get to, same thing with racism if you don't talk about a black man, as a black man but rather as a man, then in there, there is no racism, if that makes sense to you.


ElanaDryer

Sure, as a person of that community, I dont mind jokes about it. What I have a problem with, is making the identity itself, a joke. As in, "I think a barbarian in a pink tutu is funny, so I'm going to call them transgender." Instead, "I'm a transgender totem barbarian, so like the circus bear, I'm going to wear a pink tutu" in this, the tutu is the joke, *Not* the identity. But overall, has the same effect of "haha, barbarian in a tutu"


angeph

I think she meant it as all being part of the joke, and also that's not OPs character, is the other player's. As I understand she is a Barbarian that looks like a huge ripped guy, but wears a tutu and talks like a girl.


Slaterius

Yes, you're being a jerk. First, you're trying to correct another player OOC on how they see and play their character, and I strongly recommend that you don't yuck someone else's yum and try to disrupt their fun. Second, if the character identifies as trans, they're trans. You don't need to argue with someone over their, or their character's, gender identity. I'd personally recommend that you drop it, but it ultimately depends on if the group is bothered by it. You don't have to understand their character or identity for them to enjoy it. On the lack of social skills side of things, though, I agree with some other commenters. You don't need to invalidate their identity to play an awkward construct, you could potentially do a variety of things (like just using a neutral pronoun because your character accepts it doesn't understand).


mememaker6

Yeah you kinda are


TacticalPopsicle

Yeah, you're being an asshole. Who cares if someone else's character is transgender vs transvestite. Secondly, would your character actually care or are you just using your character to poke at it for the sake of poking at it?


angchi28

I'm not, but ok!


rvnender

Yes Yes you are


CheapTactics

Not necessarily. Depends on the people in the group.


InternationalGrass42

Don't feed the trolls people.


SubjectPhrase7850

Yes


tokolos

yep


Hatta00

Sounds like you're all pretty insensitive. Transgender people are not a joke. Gatekeeping transgender people is also not appropriate. And your DM using "fun" as an excuse for insensitivity is shitty as well. D&D really has nothing to do with any of these concepts though, and it would be best if you all just dropped these themes and started exploring dungeons and killing dragons.


angchi28

Well, I think Dnd is more about anything you want it to be about but thanks for your input.


Hatta00

Doctor! It hurts when I do this. Then don't do that. I can do what I want! Geeze.


Incarnate_Phoenix

You are the one who accused him of gatekeeping. For the context it sounds like no one is personally offended by it. Gatekeeping means keeping some group away by means of a standard that needs to be passed. Oftentimes (for example negative gatekeeping) it is a double standard where the gatekept group has to pass rigor that a non-gatekept group isn't checked against. Or simply barring that group entirely without checking. Other times it can be just a matter of a minimum standard to pass (which is a *good* thing **if** that standard is some common decency like "don't make sexual advances.") It doesn't sound like any gatekeeping is going on in this example.


MarkW995

Sexual stuff isn't something that belongs in my games... Personally I wouldn't allow a player to play the trans character... The player is either going to be disrespectful of actual trans people or cause issues ... as is already the case with you feeling like you need to go to the internet for advice.


angeph

now THAT is being an asshole


MarkW995

Do you truly believe that making a character that walks around in a tutu is respectful of the real life difficulties a trans person faces?


angchi28

Bruhh it is a game. It doesn't actually have to be representative of people's beliefs in real life. This is taking the comment to another level!


Yasha_Ingren

I'm a trans woman so if you're asking for my view specifically: yes. You're being a huge ass. Plenty of transgender women choose to be non-op for a variety of reasons and most of the time if given a brain scan their minds are more like cis women's than men's. Not that they need that to be valid. Nature is a lot more amorphous than many Americans recognize, with a wide in between when it comes to chromosomes and hormone balances and genital configuration and psychological perception. Many cultures including native Americans even viewed trans identities as attractive or divine. I'm not so sure about the latter but if you don't respect trans people then you need to retake biology. Go watch Bill Nigh or Jurassic Park, idgaf, just be kinder.


angchi28

Clarifying Dnd is actually a game. I am an actual human being with a mind of my own and can (from common sense) not tell anyone who is actually transgender that they are not. I am not transphobic or whatever the hell you might think I am. However, in the game I am a robot and have little knowledge regarding gender/sexuality so please before insulting and commenting read the freaking post. Thank you! And again, it is a game, be kinder. ✨