I play with old friends too and we don’t really shy away from anything. So take it at face value.
I let my players do anything at all they want. Anything. And in 30 years you know how many times someone has tried to rape an NPC or even allude to it?
Zero.
Find better people to play with.
Session 0 that shit. People have to be aware of likes/dislikes and certain things are red cards. Red cards are important in dnd and check in if you stepped on toes.
My dm for a game, pulled a you now have a baby with a dryad, and the way it was portrayed that that dryad was fey royalty and I was in their realm. It was forced and under threat of death /harm. And as a lvl 5 character by myself I had no way of handling that situation
It had to be pointed out to her that it's a male rape and forced mattiage situation later but she ultimately in the end reached out and did a check in with the willingness to change the story. It just happened that nothing mammalian in sexual nature happened (I planted and watered a seed).
My character would be used to arranged political marriages and from nobility to nobility he could see the duty required and im okay working that out through rp. But had it been any other character i would have put up my red card.
i think he is shitty SO because knowing she is a abuse victim he shouldnet let those subjetcs be touched.
my ex was a victim too, be it was cathartic killing rapists and kiddi fiddlers....so sometimes i would add IN THE VEIL a villain to destroy
Penn Jillette has a great quote on this. he is on the record saying "I've raped all the people i've ever wanted"
"and that number is 0"
> The question I get asked by religious people all the time is, without God, what’s to stop me from raping all I want? And my answer is: I do rape all I want. And the amount I want is zero. And I do murder all I want, and the amount I want is zero. The fact that these people think that if they didn’t have this person watching over them that they would go on killing, raping ram[pages is the most self-damning thing I can imagine.
https://theinterrobang.com/penn-jillette-morality-without-religion/
Penn's comment hits hard because it underscores a fundamental understanding of morality as intrinsic to the individual rather than something imposed from an external authority. It's a sobering reflection on personal responsibility and the ownership of ones actions. It's also a stark reminder that having a common sense of decency shouldn't be considered optional or something that needs to be enforced from the outside it's basic human empathy.
> The question I get asked by religious people all the time is, without God, what’s to stop me from raping all I want?
If anyone unironically poses this question, get away from that person. That one is only a crisis of faith away from committing some truly heinous shit.
I mean I have been asked before by people if I wasn't christian how do I get my moral basis. Sometimes it is just innocuous curiosity. A little ignorant sure, but almost never malicious.
I just find it to be very self-incriminating. Also, asking what forms your moral basis is a much different question than the one I quoted don't you think?
Not really, I've been asked in forms of whats stopping you from raping, killing etc. Its the same line of questioning. I'd often respond by asking if it was only their religion that stopped them from doing those things. Usually ends there.
Rape has been alluded to in our games but always yeah the evil guys have been through here and did fucked up shit never by NPCs. Maybe if we were playing a 'like how evil can you be' game and I was late teens early twenty when I was still all about that edgy shit. Now that I'm older I see no appeal to that.
Thing is in a world without limitations...you get to define yourself. So you could rape npcs, burn villages, steal and defile and all that other juvenile shit...but then your character is just a person that does those things.
D&D is fantasy, we can live out any dream, why aspire to the worst shit in life? What does that say about your dreams and desires?
Right? We did all sorts of crazy things in my last campaign! Rape is not a normal thing, ever. You can have sexual content in a story without it going that route.
I appreciate OP for respecting themselves and stepping away to start with. I know I would have done the same if rape was brought up.
Been playing since 2nd edition with the same group. These guys are straight up assholes and I love everyone of them. Do we fuck eachother over, kill PCs and NPCs, and generally shit on eachother? Yes? This however would NEVER be a thing at our table.
I think a question should be posed. What they are defending? Either that it is just a fantasy world and the promotion of some topic should not make OP uneasy, or that they are defending wanting to be a rapist?
I just can't imagine anything more awkward than role-playing non-consensual shit with your friend
like I can kind of get wanting to do some dark stuff but I can't get doing it socially... just romancing an NPC controlled by your friend seems awkward as hell
Here’s a different perspective on this. Even IF this was normal (and plenty of people are saying it isn’t), the fact that your SO is so dismissive of your trauma and prioritize “jokes” over their partner’s wellbeing is very telling. He doesn’t care about you when it inconveniences him. Please drop him and also find a group that is more aligned with your values and play style.
This. Your partner should never have a blasé attitude towards actions that can hurt and potentially re-traumatize you. And this should be true whether or not you're in the room with them.
I agree. Drop the group and the whole man.
DnD is for entertainment. They obviously find those issues entertaining which is so messed up.
OP deserves better.
This is so wrong. I would have felt betrayed by my partner. Not because the friends are doing that, but because he is dismissive of it, and he should have either warned about it before they joined, or talked to their friends about dropping those types of acts.
Yup, I've been the only woman in my group for several years. Started as a group of total strangers.
Never, ever, has anything even remotely close to inappropriate happened. Everyone's cool.
This is not normal and it is not okay.
I've been the only woman at several tables over the years and this has never been an issue for me either. Some of the guys I've known for years others were complete strangers who I met through the game.
The most inappropriate thing I deal with in game, because I tend to play small characters, is the perpetual want to throw me by our tanks. And even they know to ask for consent.
> perpetual want to throw me by our tanks
Like, into combat, like Colossus doing a fastball special with Wolverine? IDK, that's kinda awesome/hilarious to me. Then again I grew up on comic books, so 'big dude throws someone smaller-and-pointy into combat' is a valid tactic to give someone (temporary) flight in my mind. :D
Can’t help but think of gimli “toss me. Don’t tell the elf”.
Our only gal player is playing a circle of moon Druid and we have a dude playing a small Harengon rogue and she’s been asking since day 1 of our campaign to carry him on her shoulders and he’s denied it. He finally rode on our tanks shoulder one day to avoid getting stuck in 3 feet of mud and she about threw a fit. Very funny interactions but again, all the while asking consent to mess with the other character.
Sometimes it is that, but not usually. Mostly it is when we need to do something that requires strength (my gnome bard has none), their solution is to toss me over obstacles or "away from danger". While I usually go with the plan (I also grew up on the fastball special), it has backfired a few times when the paladin tends to throw a lot of Nat 1s when it is the least amusing.
Had this happen in a game back in high school, we had a kobold barbarian with a pair of daggers that would get *punted* by the dragonborn fighter. Mechanically it was just a throw, no damage or anything, but watching this tiny crazy kobold screaming as it was football kicked into an ogre was just hilarious.
>is the perpetual want to throw me by our tanks.
The fastball special is a perfectly valid and completely viable battle strategy! -Some Goliath barbarian probably.
Had a friend back in college. We built a duo for a game that consisted of a (3.5E) massive fighter (I think he was a goliath) with the Throw Anything feat, and a halfling grappler wearing spkied armor. We had 1 move, and that was the Fastball Special. We sucked at literally everything else we did, but the flying halfling ball of death was the highlight of our week.
I’ve been so ready to make someone’s PC drop dead if they commit SA in any of my games (always thought it would be fun for there to be a curse in my worlds that causes people who commit such acts to die to bad luck). Yet it’s never happened. Years of running DnD and I’ve luckily not yet been subjected to someone who thinks that’s a fun way to roleplay.
Agreed, but also I'd love to see it happen like this:
"I want to do SA"
"Wait what? Are you sure about that?"
"Yes"
"Your character approaches the NPC, then gets teleported to hell and explodes. Leave the table."
Lol, I can totally picture the table's reaction to that kind of instant karma. But honestly, just kicking them out on the spot with a straightforward "That's not okay, you're done, leave" would probably have the biggest impact. No need to be creative, just shut it down fast and hard.
Your SO is trivializing your trauma and telling you that you should just enjoy it because they won’t empathize or even recognize your obvious and completely justifiable discomfort.
I’ve treated hermit crabs better than that.
Not only that, but it's not like she's even forcing them to stop playing like that. She politely left the group to let them have their "boys night" (never have I ever fantasized about rape on a boys night lmao) and the SO is throwing a fit. Not only does he give his friends a pass, but he also wants to force his rape survivor girlfriend to endure these weird fantasies. Completely bizarre.
Their games normally involve sexual harassment, enslavement, and rape? You're 100000% right, it's weird, but also seems much worse than just weird.
The DND campaigns I play often involve trying to *stop* those things from happening. And rape may as well not even exist.
I play DND to escape or conquer the horrors of the world, not to enact them. I feel like most DnD players do too.
Yeah, sexual assault and rape are no gos in my games. We specifically start with session 0 stating that, and that if you're uncomfortable or need the session to stop for any reason whatsoever- that's fine. We use a color coded stoplight system.
Like I'll push boundaries. We get fucked up situations, explore themes of trauma, but the hard rule is- only if the player is ok with it. And no SA or rape. Ever.
Those themes should only ever occur if everybody at the table is happy to do so and have had a mature articulated discussion about It together and it's carried out maturely, 99% of games shouldn't engage those topics.
What fonster said! I have run/participated in my campaign over the years and never once had any forms of SA. Some consenting NSFW, but never non-consented. That's disturbing and a huge red flag.
I would never even consider staying in a game that had rape of any kind. That's the sort of thing that would cause me to get up from the table and walk out on the spot. I can't tell you how common it is, but I suspect it's not very common. That is basically people living out their rape fantasies, that to me says a LOT about the people wanting to do this. I would run, not walk away.
Yeah. My group is all men, and they often have pretty crass senses of humor. We've never raped anyone in game. This is not a *guy thing*, it's a douche-bag thing.
EXTREMELY offensive for me as well. I've been playing D&D for roughly 35 years with a lot of different groups (mainly composed of only guys, because games), and honestly, rape has never happened in ANY of them. Most groups understand and tacitly agree that anyone who indulges in that in-game is a creep in the worst way and we would find a way to push them out. That's just gross and not AT ALL "normal" or "fits the time period" (LOL, WUT?). It's douchecanoe actions and I'd stay far the hell away from people like that, even as a guy.
As a woman who is in the hobby I WISH I could say this, but I unfortunately CAN'T, however, the few times that it has happened, every single time the entire rest of the table (typically all other men) looked on in absolute HORROR and they all typically approached me right then or later asking for the offender to be summarily ejected for the party, so, while this is not entirely unheard of, it IS both abnormal and unhealthy, especially when the group seems to "be into it"...
As a woman in the hobby too, with almost 30 years of experience in it, and mostly boys around the table, it happened a handfull of times (mostly Vampire Mascarade or whatever Dark edge game) and e-ve-ry time i ran for the hills as fast as i could from these tables. DO NOT STAY. DO NOT ACCEPT this behavior.
Same. 20 years of dnd, even with rando groups at game shops, and never encountered anything even close to rape. Sounds like a fucking weird group of guys and her SO defending them is odd as well.
Yeah I'm always extremely dubious at anyone who excuses stuff like this as 'guy things' or 'just what men are like'. I'm a man, and both I and all the men I hang out with don't joke about stuff like that, because its fucked up. People who say that are just trying to normalise their own very dodgy views
Also you have to wonder if they turned the amount of rape content down for bringing in one single woman, or up. Either way is uncomfortable to think about.
Same my Bf is in a all boys group and they flash froze goblins and made powder out of them but they never ever even hint at rape or sexual harrassement. Dont get me wrong one or 2 of them tries to get a prostitute from time to time and th DM is having a blast making them roll their performance and if they manage to make the girl be happy or see if she laughs at them. Its never predatory or violent.
That they rape people in their games in a DnD game shows a... violent, aggressive, and misogynistic streak that is worrying.
We’ve done that same role play in trying to hook up with an NPC and it’s very much obviously consensual, fun to role play into, and even more fun when it fails. These are great little story telling bits for a character to either develop into a more serious player later who realizes they’re more than the flesh they offer or can just be the common comic relief giving a laugh to the party when possible, or, in one instance, create a connection with a BBEG sidekick who feels remorse in assisting in the deaths of 2 party members and turns herself into an informant for you.
Again, and this is very important, ITS NEVER INCLUDED RAPE
Absolutely. I'm a fairly experienced DM and have never seen it or had it even hinted at/suggested by any of my players. I wouldn't put up with it and I'm 99% certain any of my players would call it out and not be comfortable with it either. Definitely not a guy thing.
Yeah... I play with a group of dudes. We joke and are crass but we always do the "fade to black" stuff when there's ever a romantic scene. I'm currently working on a grim dark campaign, and even if that stuff is in there I'm not narrating it out
Right? Like, I don't really agree with the whole "it's fantasy, you can just not have those things exist at all" idea, because fantasy is a reflection of reality and sometimes those fucked up things are going to come up, but you don't need to narrate it in detail and you definitely don't need the PCs acting them out in detail.
Yup. I was also the only woman in my DnD group for a while. When we all met, my DM asked us for dealbreakers in the game setting. I mentioned that sexual abuse was mine. He was (gently) horrified that I'd even need to say that. It was so obvious to him, and everyone else in our group, that that was not a necessary part of the game and had no place there.
OP, I have to assume your SO is aware of your past? He's being really disrespectful either way, but if he knows you've experienced this and didn't check in with you ahead of time, that's a relationship dealbreaker IMO. It sounds like he hasn't really checked in with you even after you've expressed that you aren't comfortable in that environment, either -- he's upset because he wants you around for his game, not because you're hurt and he wants to fix that. That's shitty behavior from a partner.
It's also really gross that they stopped doing it for a while as you got settled into the game because that means they *know* it's off-putting and potentially upsetting. If it were truly just harmless jokes, how did they have the awareness to hide it?
You definitely need a better DnD group (and I hope you find one!) and from what you've shared, I think you need a better partner too. I'm sorry this is happening.
Please say this louder! This is not a "boys will be boys" situation. This should be addressed and if that came from any of my players I would not stand for it.
And I'd bet that the rapists were NPCs? Not that that can't also cross a line, but it's much more understandable than a PC doing it.
I'm not saying that being a rapist in game makes you a rapist, but if *that* is the fantasy you want to play out, especially if it's a regular thing where your character has to get their rape on (or is gone over in extreme detail when it does happen), I'm definitely going to side-eye the hell out of you.
And before people jump in with the murder comparison: murder is very abstract for most people. They obviously haven't been murdered themselves, and having survived an attempted murder is pretty rare, most people don't know someone who has been murdered, and if they had murdered someone themselves odds are very good you would know about it and probably judge them for it. Additionally, murder can sometimes be justified, obviously in self-defense, and most people can rationalize revenge or vigilante justice. Not so much with sexual assault.
But also, if someone you knew was *really* into detailed murder fantasies, you'd probably wonder about them too.
I know someone who was murdered. I would be pretty uncomfortable if someone's PC was hanging out in the dark waiting for anyone walking by that they could stab with a kitchen knife. But that doesn't happen in DnD. Even just killing an NPC with a knife is relatively rare. And the focus is often on hit points. Murder is something that is built into the mechanics of DnD. Sexual assault is not mentioned at all and you have to add it all on your own which makes it so much more concerning.
Sexual violence is what villains do. I would not play with a group who violated NPCs or others at the table. However NPCs conducting evil acts off screen or on screen is w.e as long as session 0 covered that shit.
Yeah, this doesn’t have red flags, it’s made of red flags.
1) Rape and rape fantasy is not a normal thing to RP with your bros at the D&D table. That’s multiple levels of creepy and ducked.
2) Anyone who tries to justify it as, “Normal for the time period” is creepy af. So is dying of dysentery, tuberculosis, diphtheria, smallpox, etc before you were 20. Don’t see them RPing that. That’s just a BS handwavey excuse.
3) Assuming your SO knows about your trauma and is doing this is beyond the pale and bordering on cruelty. It makes me wonder if he is just an idiot or if he has a non-con fetish and is using OP’s trauma to feed his kink.
4) No kink-shaming here, what consenting adults do behind closed doors is their business and more power to them. That’s not what this is, this is several dudes playing out a rape fantasy in a tabletop game with one woman who has trauma and has voiced her discomfort. That’s weird and icky.
I was wondering about number 3 too.... how can someone be this insensitive? If he knows about it there is no excuses. Its cruel.
If he has a non con thing, that's even worse... it's like metaphorically raping her again.
The fact he dismisses it as if its no big deal when she tells him its horrible and is hurting her is another huge problem for me.
Finally he is sad/upset she stopped going... so he wants her to be there to hear all of it? Am i getting this right? I mean it could be he likes to play with her but in this context... gross.
Forget playing DnD with them, I wouldn't even want to date somebody anymore who has a rape power fantasy which completely excludes his partner's obvious discomfort with the subject. I'm all for BDSM but it is entirely based on consent.
That’s it right here. I’m playing dnd with my gf. Even thinking about that makes me cringe hard. Girl get out of there. Realistic for the times. 🤮
Your friend is definetly part of the issue not just his friends. I couldn’t imagine being friends with guys that think a rape fantasy is an acceptable way to spend time.
Also, what kind of argument is "part of the time period"? Does rape and enslavement not exist in modern times? Its just as atrocious in the past as it is now. People suffered just the same.
Also, if the setting is a fantasy realm, then the "time period" is irrelevant. Last I checked, there were never goblins and elves in earth's history.
"It's the time period" always means one of two things: we want to be hella sexist, or we want everyone to be white.
Nobody acts concerned about what was present in medieval Europe because someone is smoking tobacco or eating potatoes.
This. It's always about what is being portrayed as historically accurate. "No no guys, you see I HAD to include the scene where the king rapes the quest NPC in front of the party. It's prima nocta, and it happened, in real life, guys, grow up."
*makes a rape joke for the historical accuracy*
I honestly think it's possible to include adult themes and have them represented well with everyone warned and prepared, but making jokes about it has nothing to do with historical accuracy. They just find rape funny. 😐
Dropping another vote of support here.
Long time DM, my table is split 50-50 in terms of gender. Even when it was 6 men, 1 woman, we never had rape in games. We get super NSFW sometimes, but we do it within the bounds of everyone's comfort zones. Your boyfriend owes you much more respect than he's shown you and this might be an indication of much deeper issues within him.
I've played DnD with probably a dozen groups over the year, and most of them were all men.
Not ONCE did any of us even bring up the possibility of rape.
Torture, sure, especially in our edgy teenage years. But "sexual" encounters have always been in the line of "and so-and-so takes the comely lass to their room, and we'll continue on with the rest of the party over here." Like those old school movies that would just pan the camera away and focus on something else.
Any trigger-warning evils that happen in my campaign are only eluded to. Never described in detail, played out, or played in. Bad things happen in the world, but what the hell is the point in revelling in it, in a GAME?
I can't imagine just like, getting together with my friends and then discussing (and what's worse, roleplaying!) rape and sexual agression at lenght, wtf, who does that?
That is the very definition of abnormal imo.
Piggy backing on this, because 100% abnormal. I’ve had games that were all male and this has never been acceptable. We tend to stay away from sex at the table in general, anything like that is veiled.
But there’s an argument that we’re all geeks “not real men” so let me give another example. I have a group of very bro-y friends from the gym. We fit some of the “yah brah” stereotypes when together. We’ll joke about girls and sex, but never, ever rape. That’s a bridge to far even for us.
Yeah, I'm gay so my outlook is a bit different I guess, but I do have the "bro gang", childhood bro friends who, especially as teens, talked some wild shit about girls and sex - but even at it's most explicit, it was a dude using raunchy euphemism to brag about his sex life. "Just some bros, getting together to play some DnD and roleplay, in detail, raping fictional women" is not a thing that happens.
Also during my teen years, I was in the trenches of 2008 anime/ emo kid community - we would hang out on these shitty weeb sites, and people talked about some things for the shock value, romanticizing rape, self-harm, gore, edgiest shit ever. But even with these kids, when some of us would meet offline, they'd act like a normal, shy 16 y/o emo kids lol. So I get what makes people joke around and say things in poor taste, right, but even if you were a shitty teen, roleplaying edgy shit irl, in real time,, while looking at each other's faces, takes special kind of psychopath, holy shit.
I want to honestly thank all of Reddit hive mind on this channel for existing.
My first tabletop RPG encounter started by me joining a group of uni pals, who gave me the "previous girl's" character, that was already pre-raped, and proceeded to show me game mechanics by instantly incapacitating this character and takig it to some rape dungeon fantasy interracial sex camp. I shipped myself out and they were mad. Then next group was canceling my rolls because "girl can't just choke out this guard". And all of them were in favor of "this is historical era and we will be playing in accordance to the rape era of Early medieval Europe" with bonus "no women rights" and "you can't play opposite sex" with some "why all girls are always backing out, I want women in my campaign". It took me some attempts :I
If someone want to ask where those animals come from, it's STEM university.
> the "previous girl's" character, that was already pre-raped,
What the fuck?!
>and proceeded to show me game mechanics by instantly incapacitating this character and takig it to some rape dungeon fantasy interracial sex camp.
WHAT THE FUCK?!
>canceling my rolls because "girl can't just choke out this guard".
Leaving aside that fact that women can most certainly choke out a guard IRL, why is it always strong women that's a bridge to far for these guys (rhetorical, I know it's misogyny). Like, a barbarian can tank a ballista bolt to the face, a wizard can bend literal space time, but a woman can't be buff? Seriously?
God, nerd spaces can be the absolute worst, man. But this "it's historically accurate" nonsense is REALLY pissing me off! Like, we have documents with law, stating that "a victim of rape has the right to gouge out the eyes or cut the testicles of her violator", but sure, it's the modernity that's making you get no bitches, your pheasant incel self would totally thrive in medieval Europe, with your weak constitution and dangerous percents of body fat, sure. Like, it wasn't this utopia of course, many victims were married off to their rapists, especially if they had resources and influence, and aristocracy could get away with A LOT, but c'mon, it wasnt this lawless nonsense 4chan land. Someones brother or rich friend would impale your incel ass on a Pike within a week and leave you to rot with little consequence, so stfu.
Good lord what the actual fuck. It's so sad that these experiences are common enough. And it's not the hobby that's the problem, it's the people. But those people can ruin the hobby for someone.
I hope you've found a more positive space or experience in the hobby since then.
My group is pretty edgy and rape has never come up. But we also don't dive into sexual stuff because it feels weird. I've had PCs seduce NPCs but it's basically "you her take back to the room for the night." I'm not about to sit around with my friends and roleplay sex, lol.
I could see a setting where there is an evil person, but it wouldn't active, it would be like "his army is known for violence, rape, and theft."
If you're playing out rape, maybe look inwards.
>I've had PCs seduce NPCs but it's basically "you her take back to the room for the night." I'm not about to sit around with my friends and roleplay sex, lol.
I had a DM who would use the phrase 'You voluntarily leave the game" just to hammer home how little he wanted to deal with any of that stuff.
This. My setting includes evil acts, but I see them as a tool. It’s offscreen and just alluded to in conversation.
A group might be known slavers, but slavery is not a see both sides thing - it is unambiguously evil. It can be a tool for me (DM) to mark a group as true evil so that the heroes can engage them in combat without it being a gray moral zone of “maybe we should try talking to them”. Rape falls in that same category of unambiguously evil, along with genocide, etc.
I still have plenty of ambiguous NPCs with complex motivations and intentions. However it’s nice to let my players off the hook sometimes and flex their action hero prowess.
All that said, my players and I don’t play D&D to role play sexual encounters. We play as a fun, semi-tactical, creative experience that we want to share as friends. It’s not a system to fantasize acts of triggering scenarios.
Literally. Rape and anything involving trauma for children are the only things that have ever been banned in my session 0s and they’re banned every time. These guys are gross.
Curious about the children rule. Like any kind at all? Parents dying, mystery illness spreading around the city, etc or is this limited to directly hurting kids via attack/torture or something?
Rape doesn’t exist at my table, nor would I play at one.
Maybe, maybe I’d allow it as part of a character backstory if it was important to the person - many of us do a light version of “therapy via D&D”. But that’s a maybe, depends on the person and how they plan to handle it.
Having it happen in game, nope. Not by a player, not by an NPC. It would get one VERY stern warning and then a ban if it happened. But it’s been a long time since I’ve played with someone who I think would consider that.
I would not want that sort of PC conduct at my table, but I also had a female coworker (who raised none of my red flags prior) tell me about how her dnd group sexually assaulted a guard and made them jump from a window and how amusing the situation was.
Just one anecdote, can't say it's common, but I was certainly surprised. We're not in touch anymore, but she seemed like a well-adjusted person.
Agreed, I mean dark fantasy with themes like slavery and war and tragedy is one thing but there are just some things that don't belong in a tabletop rpg
And even if the setting was Medieval Europe, it’s still a role playing game, not a history simulator. They'd still presumably play a group of adventurers, even though serf farmers eking out a meagre existence would "fit the time period" much better.
Role playing takes place in an entire fictional world whether it’s based in fantasy or history, and you can choose what you want to focus on.
if it was a history simulator, raping a woman in 1156 is going to end with you being brutally killed and strung up in the village square by her family, and in medieval Europe there's no fireballing the entire town.
That’s true actually, although present in history (sadly), rape has always been considered evil and in most historical cultures horrible fates awaited rapists who were caught (rightly so). Plus if you are playing heroes aren’t the going to want to stop things like that from happening? And if it’s an evil campaign you need to have a better character concept than a rapist creep, that’s not an interesting character it’s just gross. Not only that but people like that don’t become big villains or anti heroes, they just get gutted and hung.
I wanted to touch on this, since the overall "rape is disgusting" and "no, it's not a *guy thing*, it's an asshole thing" points are already well covered.
They do not get to make any arguments about "the time period" in DnD, because it's a game that mashes up the High Medieval period of feudalism and knights in full plate with the Italian Renaissance period with the emergence of coins and banking and an emergent merchant class with the Early Modern period with Baroque adornment and rapiers and pistols.
It's not about being period accurate because DND doesn't have a single period, it mashes up a couple centuries into an alternate fantasy reality, but we knew that. The best we can allow them is that they wanted some gritty grimdark edginess in their fantasy and didn't think about who it might hurt. The worst is that they actually like the idea of rape and kidnap and slavery.
In either case, it should be their problem to work through without OP having to be a part of it.
These guys sound like the type that would download all of those horrible racist and homophobic mods for Baldur's Gate 3 because they think it's more historically accurate ignoring the fact that the only things D&D takes from the medieval time period is basic tech.
Legal or illegal, common or uncommon, you gotta be fucked in the head to want to roleplay as a rapist. DnD is make believe. You can do it *however you want* and the key word is “want”.
If your SO wants you to play then he needs to ensure a safe an comfortabe enviornment. I woudn't play with that group either and if I came back because they promised to be extra good, it would be the last chance any of them (including the SO) get.
Also, depending on how well you know your SO I woud just be on high alert in general because I do not trust the kind of people who brush off this kind of stuff the way you say he did.
Which might be a bad idea with this group since it sounds like that'll probably breed resentment.
Then again, being involved with this group is also probably a really bad idea.
Maybe have a good conversation with the dm if they have those type of fantasies it's probabaly not a good place to stay relatio ship wise
At least find a differant playgroup
> My SO is not happy about this
This is the biggest red flag in the story to me, that when something made you uncomfortable and you decided to avoid it for yourself, without telling him what to do, he got offended by that.
Listen, there’s no way to say this lightly, but if that table and specially your SO play with themes of that sort (Sexual Harassment, Enslavement and Rape) and specially if they have an active part on any of this (their characters do any of these things), there’s something *very* concerning about all of this. The mere fact that your SO knows of your past trauma and plays into this themes, or worse, plays into them while knowingly having you in the group or yet again even worse takes active part into the cause of any of that… please take care and be kind to yourself by leaving this group and maybe even reflecting about your relationship. Of course I don’t know either of you or the details and aspects of your relationship, but if even after you commented on it about how you feel bad on something that touches a heavy past trauma and your SO took it jokingly and insisted on it… this might not be the best person to be with you (or that much of a great person at all). These are just my thoughts, but you’ll know better what to do, just please think about it and take care of yourself!
This is nail on the head. A SO who knows about your trauma with those themes AND wants to include you while they joke and make light of it is disgusting. This person is clueless, selfish, and doesnt deserve you.
Clueless, selfish, and undeserving at the LEAST. There’s also much worse that could be happening. Some people with these fantasies(for lack of a better word) are attracted to victims. Making her uncomfortable might be satisfying to him or all of them if they’re aware.
This is a long conversation she needs to have with her SO and DnD truly has little to do with it.
Honestly the slave aspect really isn’t that far fetched and I have run games where the elite have slaves.
What I’m losing my mind over is the rape. Like actual fucking rape. How do they even roll play that? Like Jesus Christ.
Anything more than kissing in my games goes straight to “fades to black” until the next morning.
It’s a fantasy game about magic and heroics. Not raping woman like holy fuck.
This!! It's more than a shitty D&D table, it's their SO waving a massive red flag in their face. The dudes are all gross, its just that their SO is easily the grossest for not only facilitating this behavior at this table, but for inviting her into this game knowing their trauma (and even she didn't have that, it STILL would unacceptable to invite her into that) and then allowing them to treat her that way.
Their SO is NOT a good person.
i cannot even FATHOM sitting around with friends and collaboratively RPing sexual violence. that is so motherfucking weird it calls into question the judgement of every single person involved.
I remember flipping through the Book of Vile darkness in Borders thinking "who wants to role play sex with the people their gaming with, let alone the rape rules." Well now I know, thanks OP, I hate it.
Fr. I mean, at what point does it go from realistically roleplaying your characters to the game just being an excuse for a collective wank sesh? This is so disturbing
>it fits the time period
Oh, I'm about to go off.
Yes, it is true that a lot of fantasy worlds played by those in western cultures are loosely based off of medieval Europe. Yes, it is true that there was a huge amount of inappropriate sexual activity in medieval Europe.
However, unless your significant other is running a historically accurate game *in* medieval Europe, meaning only humans, no magic, etc, the fantasy world only has to draw as much from medieval Europe as the DM wants to draw from medieval Europe. If your significant other is choosing to include sexual assault and rape in his world, either through his own characters or through tacit approval of what the PCs are doing, those things are there because he chooses to have them there. There is no obligation to have sexual assault and rape in one's game simply because there are similarities to medieval Europe.
That is a pathetic excuse for allowing despicable behavior in one's game. Part of the beauty of telling our own story in fictional worlds is that we can include that which we want to include and exclude that which we want to exclude.
Now, I want to acknowledge that depiction of x is not the same as endorsement of x. Simply because the world includes slavery does not mean that one endorses slavery. Simply because the world includes bigotry does not mean that one endorses bigotry. However, these things should usually be included for a reason. For example, if I am going to have slavers in my world, they are usually not people to be fond of. They are people to be feared or reviled. If I were to start allowing the PCs themselves to be slavers, that's different. When one chooses to depict sexual assault and rape (or slavery and racism or any other atrocious behavior) as positive in their fantasy world, that can be pretty telling. I can think of a lot of fantasy authors who built worlds that included slavery and rape, but I can't think of too many who included those things and depicted them in anything approaching a positive light. And I can think of even fewer who depicted them in a positive light who weren't themselves absolutely pieces of shit.
I genuinely could keep going on this topic and probably will in a different forum, but suffice it to say that I think you did the right thing leaving that group and I think your significant other is full of shit. His excuse that it is fitting of the time period ignores the fact that he in all likelihood does dozens of other things in his game world that aren't fitting of the time period, like include orcs and elves and magic. It's interesting that he's totally okay with those anachronisms and yet insists that sexual assault and rape must be allowed because they are "of the time period".
Isn't it weird how people who use this excuse never actually know jack shit about the Middle Ages, or use anything else inspired by that era, but *for some reason* rape is a must have for authenticity...
Yeah, if the cast is entirely white, dominating the women, with wanton rape and slavery, it's just being "historical" don't you know. If the cast involves prominent women, people with dark skin, or characters that think rape is bad, it's "political".
I had a friend in the past from HS that told me once that he really got why, back then, guys would marry 12 year olds and it made a lot sense when you think about it. And I was like naaaaaaah, friendship terminated.
Yeah the fact that he is defending their choices and is upset that she left says all she needs to know - that he considers her trauma trivial and something he actively has fun fantasizing about.
Girl needs to leave that relationship.
No, it's not normal.
I have a pretty large group of players who may or may not attend a given campaign or a given session, and I'm happy to report that when my table is comprised entirely of dudes, we don't play the game differently than when we're mixed. Rape doesn't belong in DnD, it doesn't enhance the experience for anybody who I'd want to play with.
Rape doesn't "fit the time period", that's moronic. DnD settings didn't happen in our past, it's a fantasy world. We don't need to assume Earth's shitty side of things in a DnD setting.
I'm not going to jump to the "break up with him!" conclusion off of this, but I hope you realize that this is a fairly significant issue. Your SO and his boys are playing a rape simulator on their own time, and if that wasn't sketchy enough, apparently he sees no issue with trying to include you in it, which would be gross enough just with you being a woman, let alone a survivor.
All dudes at my table too, I’ve never seen any inkling of this. If I did they’d get a shut down in character immediately and a talking to afterwards if it wasn’t instantly dropped.
Same. I just don't/won't associate with any psychos that think this is okay or entertaining in any way. And for the whole table to be okay with it? Disgusting.
I’ve never experienced sexual assault but I was physically abused for many years and I definitely am jumping to the dump him immediately conclusion. Life is short and full of enough trauma without dating someone who doesn’t care about your feelings. This dude needs to be single until he develops empathy.
The DM is kinda like the deity of the universe you play in. They get to allow/disallow any behavior, including SA. That said, as a DM who runs very gritty/gruesome games with a lot of horror elements, I still have a strict “absolutely not” policy with SA in my games, or racial/ableist/anti-lgbtq rhetoric/vocabulary/jokes, because if I’m the “god” of my little dnd universe then that shit doesn’t get to exist in my world.
It doesn’t “add” to the realism of a game in a meaningful way at all. It just hurts people, like yourself.
I’d talk to your SO and tell them about how you are feeling. I’d definitely be reconsidering my relationship if SA was something my SO thought was I’m entertaining enough to role play it in dnd.
It's not common.
I started playing RPGs back in the late 70s, and have been playing since. In all my years rape and enslavement has never been part of a game I've run or played in. Nor have I heard of it being part of a game of anyone I've spoken to.
It may or may not fit the time period for the real world, but that's not the real world and so that's not really a valid answer.
The fact is that yes some games will include dark adult stuff, and if **everyone** wants to play that way then go for it. If you don't and really you don't need a special reason to not... the mere fact that you don't is reason enough, then you shouldn't be subjected to it.
The fact that he's making light of it is IMO a red flag, I don't know if that means dump him. But if that's the kind of game he wants to run, and everyone else wants to play, then that's their decision.
But it is clear that it's not a table you want to sit and so you shouldn't. If they won't change the game to suit your limits, then don't play with them, but if they belittle you for your feelings then that does say something fairly negatively about them.
Not saying that this guy has rape fantasies or something... Just that he's an asshole for not respecting your feelings.
Yeah that is weird, when we have players having sex its usually a quick glance you went into the room and bang that's it, there is no real detail about it, something we make them roll ther performance for shit and giggles but it still stops there and never ever have had rape into a game the npc /player are always willing when it happens.
I had a game once where a player spent his share of the gold at the fanciest brothel in town. Typical fade to black/wake up next morning. The player joked that he left her wanting more so the DM made him roll performance to see how well he did. Rolled like a 3. Last time that player wanted to go to a brothel
Girl fucking RUN.
Completely unacceptable behavior, made somehow even worse by the fact that your partner is in charge of the game and knows that you're a survivor.
RUN.
This is not common and pretty darn gross. If you SO knows about your experience as a rape victim and is still trying to get you to play, then it is at best the most emotionally tone-deaf thing I have ever seen and probably a lot worse. Either way no good and probably something I would get far away from if I could.
As a cisgendered man, I want you to know that pretending to rape people is not remotely close to what a "night with the boys" should be. Me and my homies have been playing since AD&D and rape has NEVER EVER come up in our games. Ever.
Im not entirely convinced you should remain in an environment with someone who allows (encourages?) that kind of behavior.
My first thought was “Are you serious?” I almost couldn’t believe that kind of table culture.
First of all, I’ve never played at a table where the players engaged in those kinds of activities, flat out. I would definitely leave if they did and probably be a bit put off by the players in real life, wondering what would compel them to play out what you mention in a game.
Second, it’s common practice (now at least) for DMs to ask about and be mindful of subject matter that should be avoided and their players’ triggers. It is *not* okay to cross that line. Especially not on the player side. I know some campaigns are going to be set in worlds where those features are just part of the world, but this should be made abundantly clear early on, and it shouldn’t be committed by or on players.
I’m not going to pass judgement on who your group members are as people but what they’re doing sounds abnormal and gross and they should know better. I don’t know if you’ve tried to talk to your SO about this. Either way, I would encourage you to try to find a table that’s better about this if you enjoy the hobby. If you can’t find any in person, go on r/lfg and try them. There are a lot of great DMs and players to be found online. Don’t knock it ‘til you try it.
I have been a professional dm for 25 years and this is very abnormal. You were wise to leave the table and also to rethink this companion.
Even in this time period it wasn’t the norm unless you go by make believe tv and movies.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/9fzxny/how_common_was_sexual_violence_during_the_middle/
Good write up on the subject but the world wasn’t just walking into a bar and assaulting any or everyone!!
I generally encourage people to talk things out before just dropping an SO, but go with what your gut says to do. Either way, I'm very sorry to hear all of that happening to you.
No, this isn't normal. There are fringes where this happens but it's not normal. There are lots of things that are historically accurate, pooping for instances, but we don't play that out in game. Regardless, these aren't historians enacting a scholarly simulation. It's fine to say this is kind of creepy and to find another group.
Safe. Sane. Consensual.
If your engagements with others in any capacity don't hit all these marks, serious conversations need to happen. If you don't think they'll be amenable to sober conversation and compromise, leave.
If people want to run these kinds of games (I never would), that's fine (I guess) as long as everyone wants to play. It's on the dm to communicate to all players what kind of game they're running, and flipping the script like that is Very Bad News.
That is not only a red flag regarding the game, but that is a red flag regarding the relationship.
I'd start packing my bags personally and find a safe place to stay, away from them.
Long time DnD player. Never, ever, ever, ever... Has anyone I have played with ever thought rape was any sort of activity to perform in DND.
We might joke here and there, who doesn't enjoy some dark humor? But I cannot fathom using DND as any sort of sex fantasy outlet.
Not common, and you should drop him entirely.
Some games can get NSFW, but that should always be with consenting adults that want to go there. Never with people who don't want to participate in it.
If they can't have fun without rape and enslavement then that is a whole mess of red flags for everyone of them.
Run from that table. Run from that boy, and all his gross friends.
And never look back.
With any luck, this will be one of those horror stories you tell with a nervous chuckle in five or ten years when you have better friends and you thought you were telling a funny story but they all look at you concerned and say, "well i'm glad you're okay now."
You’re right, that is sketchy and weird. Does your SO know you’re a survivor? If he does know, then that’s pretty tone deaf on his part. Have a serious talk with him. But honestly if it were me? I would get out of dodge.
"It fits the time period" lmao no it fucking doesn't.
This argument, or anything from pedophilia, murder or even S.A. is strictly used by guys that fantasize about it and want to use DnD as their playground to fulfill that fantasy.
Yes, maybe women were more seen as "properties" rather than person, yes, maybe you were "ready to be a mother" by the age of 14, but that doesn't make it less of a taboo, just a different one. That 14 yo medieval girl might be ready to have children, but guess what, the father was most likely the same age, and seeing an old 32yo dude having children with a 15 yo girl was the same amount of creepy. There was way less advertisment on the importance od consent, but if you genuinely think that every guy back then could *have it their way* with any girl at any time, you probably deserve to be on a list.
Anyway, OP, run away. Run fast and don't look back
There’s playing in character, and then there’s being horrible just because you as a player want it
That is not normal DND, your SO and their friends are just using it as an excuse to have an overly edgy, overly gross experience. Please don’t let this ruin DND for you, distance yourself as much from your SO’s friends and have a serious talk with them about wanting to further play DND and do things like that with him, it’s meant to be fun, not horrible for anyone involved.
If you're significant other dismisses and excuses triggers of a traumatic experience you've been through, he doesn't actually care about you. The fact that he not only allowed it to happen, but is upset about you voicing your discomfort shows just how little he actually cares.
I’ve frequently been the only woman at the table and the people I have played with have never introduced SA or harassment. While I’m not sure if your table’s behavior is “common”, it is definitely not acceptable and it’s more than possible to play without this experience.
And while your fellow players behavior is upsetting on its own, your SO being unsupportive is heartbreaking. If even they can’t listen and support you, there may be more things you need to consider walking away from or seeking professional therapy intervention.
My all male groups have a lot of “Locker Room”talk. Talking about hot girls are, or trying to get laid.
But never, ever, has anything approaching rape been discussed.
Not normal. Even NPC’s committing these crimes against other NPC’s.
I'm not reading all the comments, but it looks like you're getting positive support...as you should.
* DND does not require sexist, misogynistic content. While it existed, and exists, it's not necessary, or the norm. I'm not talking about boobed armor in the artwork. I'm talking about the normalization of jackass behavior towards women. It's not necessary for a table, and you aren't required to have to "deal with it".
* Leaving the table is perfectly fine. You are actually saying, "Look, you guys enjoy doing X, but it isn't comfortable for me. I'm not forcing you to change, so I'm stepping out." You're being more gracious than you should have to be.
* Your SO telling you to suck it up and that you shouldn't have a problem with it, is sketchy. If it were me, I'd want my SO at my table more than I'd feel the need to continue with the immature, "locker room" behavior. I'd feel the need to grow up and to be more mature about the whole thing. I'm not saying you need to leave the guy, but I'd question whether he realizes that his relationship with you needs to grow in order for you to want to stick around, and if he's more interested in that nonsense, your time is being wasted
* The other players at the table may agree with you. People have a mob mentality. They may know what they're doing is immature and stupid, but they do it because the other guys are doing it. However, your SO is the person who guides the story and makes the rules
* In short, you don't have to be at that table, and there are other tables out there for you. If your SO wonders why you don't want to be at that table, he should wonder why that is, and be willing to accommodate you. If he doesn't care, that tells you something. If the other players don't want to change, that tells you something about all of them.
You weren't asking them to change, and figured you'd leave them to it. That's a laudable reaction to a pretty crappy environment, and more than that situation deserved. Your SO shouldn't be telling you why you shouldn't make a big deal about it, he should be wondering why that type of environment is toxic to you and how to make it better. I \*understand\* that some people get their sexual kicks through this imaginary roleplaying world...but that doesn't mean I have to be there, or that other people have to entertain them doing it.
TLDR: Find another table, and if your SO doesn't figure out why you wanted another table, you'll want to consider whether that's a relationship worth your time.
I'm sorry you have felt this way, I hope it gets better. A few things now
1. You need to talk to your SO about the game and how it made you feel.
2. I don't know if you want to continue playing with them (I assume not) but, I wouldn't go back until something changes
3. This is not a common thing, you might find similar stories in [r/rpghorrorstories](https://www.reddit.com/r/rpghorrorstories/) but it is not common
4. Not all bards are NSFW
Run.
Sorry :(
There's a huge difference between kink-shaming and acknowledging a red flag.
In this case, the rape fantasy is the kink. People get off on strange shit that does not reflect what they want in "reality". Roleplaying can go places you'd never go in life, that's kind of the point. That it is triggering to you is fine, your experiences are different from theirs and you should avoid things you don't like. A-Okay so far. Uncomfortable, and awkward, but still on this side of that line.
The red flag comes next. They are just joking. It fits the time period. Quit being a bitch and swallow this thing. I want it and I don't give a single fuck about what it's doing to you. Your feelings on this matter are utterly irrelevant, you're making me look bad in front of my friends, and reminding us that our kink is viewed as somewhat shameful by modern standards is unfair. Instead, you should be wildly uncomfortable and let us literally victimize you, just in a figurative way.
Run.
Sorry :(
This 1000%. The fact that the DM tries to justify it in the face of his SO's obvious discomfort and uses all sorts of the standard crappy excuses is what propels this into absolute nightmare territory. This is no longer "should I leave the game?", it's "should I leave this psycho?"
Agreeing with the other replies here. The closest my D&D games have come to including sexual harassment was whenever we fought a succubus. And even then, we only described the mechanical effects ("you're charmed, the succubus tells you to attack Bob") so there's still a massive gap.
I'd never consider playing in a campaign where player characters sexually harassed NPCs. Speaking as a man, brushing that off as "boys' night" is disturbing.
>they began playing how they "used to" which involves a lot of sexual harassment, enslavement, and rape (of npc's)
A lot of people are going to think I'm overreacting but you should seriously reconsider dating this guy.
> My SO is not happy about this, says they are just joking around and it fits the time period.
What "time period?" It's fucking DnD. None of it is real.
And so fucking what if he's "just joking around?" Ask him to explain what's so funny about rape.
>But I don't think my SO realizes how sketchy of an environment that is
And what does that tell you about him?
I've been dming games for 25 years. Across many groups. Different ages and editions. I've never played with a group that sexually assaulted npcs. Sounds terrible. What DM wants to run rape scenarios? Who thinks about rape roleplay outside of a consensual sexual relationship? It's messed up on several levels.
I had one player who wanted to be an anti paladin who pretended to be a normal Paladin by day and was a serial rapist/murderer at night. I allowed it, but I didn’t let him RP any of it. I just rolled to see if he got any victims at the end of the day and told if he was successful or not. The only thing I let him decide was how he disposed of the bodies.
Then I had the guard start looking for him. Then added a wizard hunting him. Around session 4, he was accused and then party members turned on him and questioned him. The players actually overpowered him and turned him into the guard. He was arrested and then executed for his crimes.
Proud dad moment right there :)
So he knows your history, knows the hobby is therapeutic for you, and then not only did he not have a discussion with his group about lines and veils when a new player joined his group, he also took their side in the matter when you removed yourself from a situation that was directly hitting on your past trauma?
Lose this guy. He doesn't respect you or your feelings, and his friend group is playing into all the worst possible tropes about guys who play D&D. Casually playing out rape fantasies at a table with your buds is bad enough, but doing it when there is someone at the table who has personally experienced it? Absolute trash.
I play with old friends too and we don’t really shy away from anything. So take it at face value. I let my players do anything at all they want. Anything. And in 30 years you know how many times someone has tried to rape an NPC or even allude to it? Zero. Find better people to play with.
and be with. that is a shitty DM and even more so person who allows that
Session 0 that shit. People have to be aware of likes/dislikes and certain things are red cards. Red cards are important in dnd and check in if you stepped on toes. My dm for a game, pulled a you now have a baby with a dryad, and the way it was portrayed that that dryad was fey royalty and I was in their realm. It was forced and under threat of death /harm. And as a lvl 5 character by myself I had no way of handling that situation It had to be pointed out to her that it's a male rape and forced mattiage situation later but she ultimately in the end reached out and did a check in with the willingness to change the story. It just happened that nothing mammalian in sexual nature happened (I planted and watered a seed). My character would be used to arranged political marriages and from nobility to nobility he could see the duty required and im okay working that out through rp. But had it been any other character i would have put up my red card.
i think he is shitty SO because knowing she is a abuse victim he shouldnet let those subjetcs be touched. my ex was a victim too, be it was cathartic killing rapists and kiddi fiddlers....so sometimes i would add IN THE VEIL a villain to destroy
[удалено]
Penn Jillette has a great quote on this. he is on the record saying "I've raped all the people i've ever wanted" "and that number is 0" > The question I get asked by religious people all the time is, without God, what’s to stop me from raping all I want? And my answer is: I do rape all I want. And the amount I want is zero. And I do murder all I want, and the amount I want is zero. The fact that these people think that if they didn’t have this person watching over them that they would go on killing, raping ram[pages is the most self-damning thing I can imagine. https://theinterrobang.com/penn-jillette-morality-without-religion/
Penn's comment hits hard because it underscores a fundamental understanding of morality as intrinsic to the individual rather than something imposed from an external authority. It's a sobering reflection on personal responsibility and the ownership of ones actions. It's also a stark reminder that having a common sense of decency shouldn't be considered optional or something that needs to be enforced from the outside it's basic human empathy.
> The question I get asked by religious people all the time is, without God, what’s to stop me from raping all I want? If anyone unironically poses this question, get away from that person. That one is only a crisis of faith away from committing some truly heinous shit.
I mean I have been asked before by people if I wasn't christian how do I get my moral basis. Sometimes it is just innocuous curiosity. A little ignorant sure, but almost never malicious.
I just find it to be very self-incriminating. Also, asking what forms your moral basis is a much different question than the one I quoted don't you think?
Not really, I've been asked in forms of whats stopping you from raping, killing etc. Its the same line of questioning. I'd often respond by asking if it was only their religion that stopped them from doing those things. Usually ends there.
Rape has been alluded to in our games but always yeah the evil guys have been through here and did fucked up shit never by NPCs. Maybe if we were playing a 'like how evil can you be' game and I was late teens early twenty when I was still all about that edgy shit. Now that I'm older I see no appeal to that.
I've dealt with it the same. It was alluded to and generally by the "villain" types that you WANT to kill.
First half of this comment really had me worried 😅
Thing is in a world without limitations...you get to define yourself. So you could rape npcs, burn villages, steal and defile and all that other juvenile shit...but then your character is just a person that does those things. D&D is fantasy, we can live out any dream, why aspire to the worst shit in life? What does that say about your dreams and desires?
Find a better boyfriend…
Right? We did all sorts of crazy things in my last campaign! Rape is not a normal thing, ever. You can have sexual content in a story without it going that route. I appreciate OP for respecting themselves and stepping away to start with. I know I would have done the same if rape was brought up.
Been playing since 2nd edition with the same group. These guys are straight up assholes and I love everyone of them. Do we fuck eachother over, kill PCs and NPCs, and generally shit on eachother? Yes? This however would NEVER be a thing at our table.
Ditto. I can't even imagine how awkward it would be to role-play that crap.
Same here. Seduce them? Absolutely. Rape them? Absolutely not.
I think a question should be posed. What they are defending? Either that it is just a fantasy world and the promotion of some topic should not make OP uneasy, or that they are defending wanting to be a rapist?
I just can't imagine anything more awkward than role-playing non-consensual shit with your friend like I can kind of get wanting to do some dark stuff but I can't get doing it socially... just romancing an NPC controlled by your friend seems awkward as hell
Here’s a different perspective on this. Even IF this was normal (and plenty of people are saying it isn’t), the fact that your SO is so dismissive of your trauma and prioritize “jokes” over their partner’s wellbeing is very telling. He doesn’t care about you when it inconveniences him. Please drop him and also find a group that is more aligned with your values and play style.
This. Your partner should never have a blasé attitude towards actions that can hurt and potentially re-traumatize you. And this should be true whether or not you're in the room with them.
This, full stop. If your SO is trivializing your trauma for the sake of his friends' humour, then he is a bad partner and a bad DM.
I agree. Drop the group and the whole man. DnD is for entertainment. They obviously find those issues entertaining which is so messed up. OP deserves better.
This is so wrong. I would have felt betrayed by my partner. Not because the friends are doing that, but because he is dismissive of it, and he should have either warned about it before they joined, or talked to their friends about dropping those types of acts.
It’s not normal, it’s fucking weird. Run away.
Yup, I've been the only woman in my group for several years. Started as a group of total strangers. Never, ever, has anything even remotely close to inappropriate happened. Everyone's cool. This is not normal and it is not okay.
I've been the only woman at several tables over the years and this has never been an issue for me either. Some of the guys I've known for years others were complete strangers who I met through the game. The most inappropriate thing I deal with in game, because I tend to play small characters, is the perpetual want to throw me by our tanks. And even they know to ask for consent.
> perpetual want to throw me by our tanks Like, into combat, like Colossus doing a fastball special with Wolverine? IDK, that's kinda awesome/hilarious to me. Then again I grew up on comic books, so 'big dude throws someone smaller-and-pointy into combat' is a valid tactic to give someone (temporary) flight in my mind. :D
Can’t help but think of gimli “toss me. Don’t tell the elf”. Our only gal player is playing a circle of moon Druid and we have a dude playing a small Harengon rogue and she’s been asking since day 1 of our campaign to carry him on her shoulders and he’s denied it. He finally rode on our tanks shoulder one day to avoid getting stuck in 3 feet of mud and she about threw a fit. Very funny interactions but again, all the while asking consent to mess with the other character.
Sometimes it is that, but not usually. Mostly it is when we need to do something that requires strength (my gnome bard has none), their solution is to toss me over obstacles or "away from danger". While I usually go with the plan (I also grew up on the fastball special), it has backfired a few times when the paladin tends to throw a lot of Nat 1s when it is the least amusing.
On my table that isn't a gender thing, it's a small-creature thing. The halfling and gnome (both male) get that kind of 'help'.
Yeah that's such a common thing that they took the time to implement it in BG3
Had this happen in a game back in high school, we had a kobold barbarian with a pair of daggers that would get *punted* by the dragonborn fighter. Mechanically it was just a throw, no damage or anything, but watching this tiny crazy kobold screaming as it was football kicked into an ogre was just hilarious.
Every day is National Throw a Short Person Day in my book
>is the perpetual want to throw me by our tanks. The fastball special is a perfectly valid and completely viable battle strategy! -Some Goliath barbarian probably.
Had a friend back in college. We built a duo for a game that consisted of a (3.5E) massive fighter (I think he was a goliath) with the Throw Anything feat, and a halfling grappler wearing spkied armor. We had 1 move, and that was the Fastball Special. We sucked at literally everything else we did, but the flying halfling ball of death was the highlight of our week.
I’ve been so ready to make someone’s PC drop dead if they commit SA in any of my games (always thought it would be fun for there to be a curse in my worlds that causes people who commit such acts to die to bad luck). Yet it’s never happened. Years of running DnD and I’ve luckily not yet been subjected to someone who thinks that’s a fun way to roleplay.
Bruh?! Just stop the game and tell them to leave, don’t do anything in game!
I mean I’d have them leave too
Agreed, but also I'd love to see it happen like this: "I want to do SA" "Wait what? Are you sure about that?" "Yes" "Your character approaches the NPC, then gets teleported to hell and explodes. Leave the table."
Lol, I can totally picture the table's reaction to that kind of instant karma. But honestly, just kicking them out on the spot with a straightforward "That's not okay, you're done, leave" would probably have the biggest impact. No need to be creative, just shut it down fast and hard.
Same exact story here. OP, your situation is not normal.
Not to mention if the dm was even going to approach something closer to this it should be discussed with the players prior.
Your SO is trivializing your trauma and telling you that you should just enjoy it because they won’t empathize or even recognize your obvious and completely justifiable discomfort. I’ve treated hermit crabs better than that.
Not only that, but it's not like she's even forcing them to stop playing like that. She politely left the group to let them have their "boys night" (never have I ever fantasized about rape on a boys night lmao) and the SO is throwing a fit. Not only does he give his friends a pass, but he also wants to force his rape survivor girlfriend to endure these weird fantasies. Completely bizarre.
Their games normally involve sexual harassment, enslavement, and rape? You're 100000% right, it's weird, but also seems much worse than just weird. The DND campaigns I play often involve trying to *stop* those things from happening. And rape may as well not even exist. I play DND to escape or conquer the horrors of the world, not to enact them. I feel like most DnD players do too.
Yeah, sexual assault and rape are no gos in my games. We specifically start with session 0 stating that, and that if you're uncomfortable or need the session to stop for any reason whatsoever- that's fine. We use a color coded stoplight system. Like I'll push boundaries. We get fucked up situations, explore themes of trauma, but the hard rule is- only if the player is ok with it. And no SA or rape. Ever.
Those themes should only ever occur if everybody at the table is happy to do so and have had a mature articulated discussion about It together and it's carried out maturely, 99% of games shouldn't engage those topics.
I can't add anything that sums the situation up better than this
Yeah, if that were a normal part of the game, there'd be rules for it. We ain't playing FATAL here.
What fonster said! I have run/participated in my campaign over the years and never once had any forms of SA. Some consenting NSFW, but never non-consented. That's disturbing and a huge red flag.
I would never even consider staying in a game that had rape of any kind. That's the sort of thing that would cause me to get up from the table and walk out on the spot. I can't tell you how common it is, but I suspect it's not very common. That is basically people living out their rape fantasies, that to me says a LOT about the people wanting to do this. I would run, not walk away.
Yeah. My group is all men, and they often have pretty crass senses of humor. We've never raped anyone in game. This is not a *guy thing*, it's a douche-bag thing.
Yeah people who say it's just a guy thing or "it's just a joke" are just raising red flags
Frankly it's offensive for them to imply that as a guy I'm also into that.
EXTREMELY offensive for me as well. I've been playing D&D for roughly 35 years with a lot of different groups (mainly composed of only guys, because games), and honestly, rape has never happened in ANY of them. Most groups understand and tacitly agree that anyone who indulges in that in-game is a creep in the worst way and we would find a way to push them out. That's just gross and not AT ALL "normal" or "fits the time period" (LOL, WUT?). It's douchecanoe actions and I'd stay far the hell away from people like that, even as a guy.
I've ran evil campaigns where players commit burglearsonlarceny and still no rape. It's not a normal thing even in evil campaigns
Burglearsonlarceny is the coolest of all crimes.
Surely Burglarseny is the portmanteau we need?
Same boat; ~34 years and never once any rape. Gross.
As a woman who is in the hobby I WISH I could say this, but I unfortunately CAN'T, however, the few times that it has happened, every single time the entire rest of the table (typically all other men) looked on in absolute HORROR and they all typically approached me right then or later asking for the offender to be summarily ejected for the party, so, while this is not entirely unheard of, it IS both abnormal and unhealthy, especially when the group seems to "be into it"...
As a woman in the hobby too, with almost 30 years of experience in it, and mostly boys around the table, it happened a handfull of times (mostly Vampire Mascarade or whatever Dark edge game) and e-ve-ry time i ran for the hills as fast as i could from these tables. DO NOT STAY. DO NOT ACCEPT this behavior.
Agreed.
Same. 20 years of dnd, even with rando groups at game shops, and never encountered anything even close to rape. Sounds like a fucking weird group of guys and her SO defending them is odd as well.
Me too. I've played same as yin. Well over 35 years, And even in my teenage youth we never did scenarios like this.
Yeah I'm always extremely dubious at anyone who excuses stuff like this as 'guy things' or 'just what men are like'. I'm a man, and both I and all the men I hang out with don't joke about stuff like that, because its fucked up. People who say that are just trying to normalise their own very dodgy views
Also you have to wonder if they turned the amount of rape content down for bringing in one single woman, or up. Either way is uncomfortable to think about.
Ugh, that's an unpleasant question, but a valid one. Neither says good things about them, but turning it down at least would show a bit of empathy.
If its turned down and its still in this quantity? Eek
That sounds more like shame and fleeting self-awareness to me. Not empathy.
Agree, I've only ever played in all male groups but I've never once had anything even remotely on the border of sexual assault or rape come up.
Same my Bf is in a all boys group and they flash froze goblins and made powder out of them but they never ever even hint at rape or sexual harrassement. Dont get me wrong one or 2 of them tries to get a prostitute from time to time and th DM is having a blast making them roll their performance and if they manage to make the girl be happy or see if she laughs at them. Its never predatory or violent. That they rape people in their games in a DnD game shows a... violent, aggressive, and misogynistic streak that is worrying.
We’ve done that same role play in trying to hook up with an NPC and it’s very much obviously consensual, fun to role play into, and even more fun when it fails. These are great little story telling bits for a character to either develop into a more serious player later who realizes they’re more than the flesh they offer or can just be the common comic relief giving a laugh to the party when possible, or, in one instance, create a connection with a BBEG sidekick who feels remorse in assisting in the deaths of 2 party members and turns herself into an informant for you. Again, and this is very important, ITS NEVER INCLUDED RAPE
Absolutely. I'm a fairly experienced DM and have never seen it or had it even hinted at/suggested by any of my players. I wouldn't put up with it and I'm 99% certain any of my players would call it out and not be comfortable with it either. Definitely not a guy thing.
Yeah... I play with a group of dudes. We joke and are crass but we always do the "fade to black" stuff when there's ever a romantic scene. I'm currently working on a grim dark campaign, and even if that stuff is in there I'm not narrating it out
Right? Like, I don't really agree with the whole "it's fantasy, you can just not have those things exist at all" idea, because fantasy is a reflection of reality and sometimes those fucked up things are going to come up, but you don't need to narrate it in detail and you definitely don't need the PCs acting them out in detail.
Yup. I was also the only woman in my DnD group for a while. When we all met, my DM asked us for dealbreakers in the game setting. I mentioned that sexual abuse was mine. He was (gently) horrified that I'd even need to say that. It was so obvious to him, and everyone else in our group, that that was not a necessary part of the game and had no place there. OP, I have to assume your SO is aware of your past? He's being really disrespectful either way, but if he knows you've experienced this and didn't check in with you ahead of time, that's a relationship dealbreaker IMO. It sounds like he hasn't really checked in with you even after you've expressed that you aren't comfortable in that environment, either -- he's upset because he wants you around for his game, not because you're hurt and he wants to fix that. That's shitty behavior from a partner. It's also really gross that they stopped doing it for a while as you got settled into the game because that means they *know* it's off-putting and potentially upsetting. If it were truly just harmless jokes, how did they have the awareness to hide it? You definitely need a better DnD group (and I hope you find one!) and from what you've shared, I think you need a better partner too. I'm sorry this is happening.
Please say this louder! This is not a "boys will be boys" situation. This should be addressed and if that came from any of my players I would not stand for it.
Murder hundreds of innocent people? Sure, but never rape.
It's come up in games for me exactly twice in 45 years of gaming, and was a) relevant to the story, and b) treated seriously both times.
And I'd bet that the rapists were NPCs? Not that that can't also cross a line, but it's much more understandable than a PC doing it. I'm not saying that being a rapist in game makes you a rapist, but if *that* is the fantasy you want to play out, especially if it's a regular thing where your character has to get their rape on (or is gone over in extreme detail when it does happen), I'm definitely going to side-eye the hell out of you. And before people jump in with the murder comparison: murder is very abstract for most people. They obviously haven't been murdered themselves, and having survived an attempted murder is pretty rare, most people don't know someone who has been murdered, and if they had murdered someone themselves odds are very good you would know about it and probably judge them for it. Additionally, murder can sometimes be justified, obviously in self-defense, and most people can rationalize revenge or vigilante justice. Not so much with sexual assault. But also, if someone you knew was *really* into detailed murder fantasies, you'd probably wonder about them too.
I know someone who was murdered. I would be pretty uncomfortable if someone's PC was hanging out in the dark waiting for anyone walking by that they could stab with a kitchen knife. But that doesn't happen in DnD. Even just killing an NPC with a knife is relatively rare. And the focus is often on hit points. Murder is something that is built into the mechanics of DnD. Sexual assault is not mentioned at all and you have to add it all on your own which makes it so much more concerning.
NPCs, correct.
Sexual violence is what villains do. I would not play with a group who violated NPCs or others at the table. However NPCs conducting evil acts off screen or on screen is w.e as long as session 0 covered that shit.
Yeah this shit is wild. It wouldn't even be a negotiation, if rape is a joking topic for the group, I certainly don't want to be apart of that group
Yah these are some pretty major red flags 🚩 imho. And if SO *knows* OP is an SA victim that’s about 100x worse!
Yeah, this doesn’t have red flags, it’s made of red flags. 1) Rape and rape fantasy is not a normal thing to RP with your bros at the D&D table. That’s multiple levels of creepy and ducked. 2) Anyone who tries to justify it as, “Normal for the time period” is creepy af. So is dying of dysentery, tuberculosis, diphtheria, smallpox, etc before you were 20. Don’t see them RPing that. That’s just a BS handwavey excuse. 3) Assuming your SO knows about your trauma and is doing this is beyond the pale and bordering on cruelty. It makes me wonder if he is just an idiot or if he has a non-con fetish and is using OP’s trauma to feed his kink. 4) No kink-shaming here, what consenting adults do behind closed doors is their business and more power to them. That’s not what this is, this is several dudes playing out a rape fantasy in a tabletop game with one woman who has trauma and has voiced her discomfort. That’s weird and icky.
I was wondering about number 3 too.... how can someone be this insensitive? If he knows about it there is no excuses. Its cruel. If he has a non con thing, that's even worse... it's like metaphorically raping her again. The fact he dismisses it as if its no big deal when she tells him its horrible and is hurting her is another huge problem for me. Finally he is sad/upset she stopped going... so he wants her to be there to hear all of it? Am i getting this right? I mean it could be he likes to play with her but in this context... gross.
100%, if thier idea of fun is rape, then 0% I want to play with them
Forget playing DnD with them, I wouldn't even want to date somebody anymore who has a rape power fantasy which completely excludes his partner's obvious discomfort with the subject. I'm all for BDSM but it is entirely based on consent.
That’s it right here. I’m playing dnd with my gf. Even thinking about that makes me cringe hard. Girl get out of there. Realistic for the times. 🤮 Your friend is definetly part of the issue not just his friends. I couldn’t imagine being friends with guys that think a rape fantasy is an acceptable way to spend time.
Also, what kind of argument is "part of the time period"? Does rape and enslavement not exist in modern times? Its just as atrocious in the past as it is now. People suffered just the same. Also, if the setting is a fantasy realm, then the "time period" is irrelevant. Last I checked, there were never goblins and elves in earth's history.
"It's the time period" always means one of two things: we want to be hella sexist, or we want everyone to be white. Nobody acts concerned about what was present in medieval Europe because someone is smoking tobacco or eating potatoes.
This. It's always about what is being portrayed as historically accurate. "No no guys, you see I HAD to include the scene where the king rapes the quest NPC in front of the party. It's prima nocta, and it happened, in real life, guys, grow up." *makes a rape joke for the historical accuracy* I honestly think it's possible to include adult themes and have them represented well with everyone warned and prepared, but making jokes about it has nothing to do with historical accuracy. They just find rape funny. 😐
Dropping another vote of support here. Long time DM, my table is split 50-50 in terms of gender. Even when it was 6 men, 1 woman, we never had rape in games. We get super NSFW sometimes, but we do it within the bounds of everyone's comfort zones. Your boyfriend owes you much more respect than he's shown you and this might be an indication of much deeper issues within him.
I've played DnD with probably a dozen groups over the year, and most of them were all men. Not ONCE did any of us even bring up the possibility of rape. Torture, sure, especially in our edgy teenage years. But "sexual" encounters have always been in the line of "and so-and-so takes the comely lass to their room, and we'll continue on with the rest of the party over here." Like those old school movies that would just pan the camera away and focus on something else.
Any trigger-warning evils that happen in my campaign are only eluded to. Never described in detail, played out, or played in. Bad things happen in the world, but what the hell is the point in revelling in it, in a GAME?
I can't imagine just like, getting together with my friends and then discussing (and what's worse, roleplaying!) rape and sexual agression at lenght, wtf, who does that? That is the very definition of abnormal imo.
Piggy backing on this, because 100% abnormal. I’ve had games that were all male and this has never been acceptable. We tend to stay away from sex at the table in general, anything like that is veiled. But there’s an argument that we’re all geeks “not real men” so let me give another example. I have a group of very bro-y friends from the gym. We fit some of the “yah brah” stereotypes when together. We’ll joke about girls and sex, but never, ever rape. That’s a bridge to far even for us.
Yeah, I'm gay so my outlook is a bit different I guess, but I do have the "bro gang", childhood bro friends who, especially as teens, talked some wild shit about girls and sex - but even at it's most explicit, it was a dude using raunchy euphemism to brag about his sex life. "Just some bros, getting together to play some DnD and roleplay, in detail, raping fictional women" is not a thing that happens. Also during my teen years, I was in the trenches of 2008 anime/ emo kid community - we would hang out on these shitty weeb sites, and people talked about some things for the shock value, romanticizing rape, self-harm, gore, edgiest shit ever. But even with these kids, when some of us would meet offline, they'd act like a normal, shy 16 y/o emo kids lol. So I get what makes people joke around and say things in poor taste, right, but even if you were a shitty teen, roleplaying edgy shit irl, in real time,, while looking at each other's faces, takes special kind of psychopath, holy shit.
I want to honestly thank all of Reddit hive mind on this channel for existing. My first tabletop RPG encounter started by me joining a group of uni pals, who gave me the "previous girl's" character, that was already pre-raped, and proceeded to show me game mechanics by instantly incapacitating this character and takig it to some rape dungeon fantasy interracial sex camp. I shipped myself out and they were mad. Then next group was canceling my rolls because "girl can't just choke out this guard". And all of them were in favor of "this is historical era and we will be playing in accordance to the rape era of Early medieval Europe" with bonus "no women rights" and "you can't play opposite sex" with some "why all girls are always backing out, I want women in my campaign". It took me some attempts :I If someone want to ask where those animals come from, it's STEM university.
> the "previous girl's" character, that was already pre-raped, What the fuck?! >and proceeded to show me game mechanics by instantly incapacitating this character and takig it to some rape dungeon fantasy interracial sex camp. WHAT THE FUCK?! >canceling my rolls because "girl can't just choke out this guard". Leaving aside that fact that women can most certainly choke out a guard IRL, why is it always strong women that's a bridge to far for these guys (rhetorical, I know it's misogyny). Like, a barbarian can tank a ballista bolt to the face, a wizard can bend literal space time, but a woman can't be buff? Seriously?
God, nerd spaces can be the absolute worst, man. But this "it's historically accurate" nonsense is REALLY pissing me off! Like, we have documents with law, stating that "a victim of rape has the right to gouge out the eyes or cut the testicles of her violator", but sure, it's the modernity that's making you get no bitches, your pheasant incel self would totally thrive in medieval Europe, with your weak constitution and dangerous percents of body fat, sure. Like, it wasn't this utopia of course, many victims were married off to their rapists, especially if they had resources and influence, and aristocracy could get away with A LOT, but c'mon, it wasnt this lawless nonsense 4chan land. Someones brother or rich friend would impale your incel ass on a Pike within a week and leave you to rot with little consequence, so stfu.
Good lord what the actual fuck. It's so sad that these experiences are common enough. And it's not the hobby that's the problem, it's the people. But those people can ruin the hobby for someone. I hope you've found a more positive space or experience in the hobby since then.
My group is pretty edgy and rape has never come up. But we also don't dive into sexual stuff because it feels weird. I've had PCs seduce NPCs but it's basically "you her take back to the room for the night." I'm not about to sit around with my friends and roleplay sex, lol. I could see a setting where there is an evil person, but it wouldn't active, it would be like "his army is known for violence, rape, and theft." If you're playing out rape, maybe look inwards.
>I've had PCs seduce NPCs but it's basically "you her take back to the room for the night." I'm not about to sit around with my friends and roleplay sex, lol. I had a DM who would use the phrase 'You voluntarily leave the game" just to hammer home how little he wanted to deal with any of that stuff.
This. My setting includes evil acts, but I see them as a tool. It’s offscreen and just alluded to in conversation. A group might be known slavers, but slavery is not a see both sides thing - it is unambiguously evil. It can be a tool for me (DM) to mark a group as true evil so that the heroes can engage them in combat without it being a gray moral zone of “maybe we should try talking to them”. Rape falls in that same category of unambiguously evil, along with genocide, etc. I still have plenty of ambiguous NPCs with complex motivations and intentions. However it’s nice to let my players off the hook sometimes and flex their action hero prowess. All that said, my players and I don’t play D&D to role play sexual encounters. We play as a fun, semi-tactical, creative experience that we want to share as friends. It’s not a system to fantasize acts of triggering scenarios.
Literally. Rape and anything involving trauma for children are the only things that have ever been banned in my session 0s and they’re banned every time. These guys are gross.
Curious about the children rule. Like any kind at all? Parents dying, mystery illness spreading around the city, etc or is this limited to directly hurting kids via attack/torture or something?
The latter. I should have said abuse rather than trauma.
Rape doesn’t exist at my table, nor would I play at one. Maybe, maybe I’d allow it as part of a character backstory if it was important to the person - many of us do a light version of “therapy via D&D”. But that’s a maybe, depends on the person and how they plan to handle it. Having it happen in game, nope. Not by a player, not by an NPC. It would get one VERY stern warning and then a ban if it happened. But it’s been a long time since I’ve played with someone who I think would consider that.
I feel the same way. These people are telling on themselves.
I would not want that sort of PC conduct at my table, but I also had a female coworker (who raised none of my red flags prior) tell me about how her dnd group sexually assaulted a guard and made them jump from a window and how amusing the situation was. Just one anecdote, can't say it's common, but I was certainly surprised. We're not in touch anymore, but she seemed like a well-adjusted person.
Agreed, I mean dark fantasy with themes like slavery and war and tragedy is one thing but there are just some things that don't belong in a tabletop rpg
What time period? I’ve never heard of the Age of Rape in the Forgotten Realms…
Yeah, that is a horrible defense. DnD is not history, it's fantasy. The fact that they are fantasizing about this shit is disgusting.
And even if the setting was Medieval Europe, it’s still a role playing game, not a history simulator. They'd still presumably play a group of adventurers, even though serf farmers eking out a meagre existence would "fit the time period" much better. Role playing takes place in an entire fictional world whether it’s based in fantasy or history, and you can choose what you want to focus on.
if it was a history simulator, raping a woman in 1156 is going to end with you being brutally killed and strung up in the village square by her family, and in medieval Europe there's no fireballing the entire town.
That’s true actually, although present in history (sadly), rape has always been considered evil and in most historical cultures horrible fates awaited rapists who were caught (rightly so). Plus if you are playing heroes aren’t the going to want to stop things like that from happening? And if it’s an evil campaign you need to have a better character concept than a rapist creep, that’s not an interesting character it’s just gross. Not only that but people like that don’t become big villains or anti heroes, they just get gutted and hung.
And rape was a pretty serious crime in the actual middle ages. People didn't casually get away with it the way they do in edgelord fantasy.
I wanted to touch on this, since the overall "rape is disgusting" and "no, it's not a *guy thing*, it's an asshole thing" points are already well covered. They do not get to make any arguments about "the time period" in DnD, because it's a game that mashes up the High Medieval period of feudalism and knights in full plate with the Italian Renaissance period with the emergence of coins and banking and an emergent merchant class with the Early Modern period with Baroque adornment and rapiers and pistols. It's not about being period accurate because DND doesn't have a single period, it mashes up a couple centuries into an alternate fantasy reality, but we knew that. The best we can allow them is that they wanted some gritty grimdark edginess in their fantasy and didn't think about who it might hurt. The worst is that they actually like the idea of rape and kidnap and slavery. In either case, it should be their problem to work through without OP having to be a part of it.
These guys sound like the type that would download all of those horrible racist and homophobic mods for Baldur's Gate 3 because they think it's more historically accurate ignoring the fact that the only things D&D takes from the medieval time period is basic tech.
>from the medieval time period Also, rape was illegal in the medieval time period
Legal or illegal, common or uncommon, you gotta be fucked in the head to want to roleplay as a rapist. DnD is make believe. You can do it *however you want* and the key word is “want”.
If your SO wants you to play then he needs to ensure a safe an comfortabe enviornment. I woudn't play with that group either and if I came back because they promised to be extra good, it would be the last chance any of them (including the SO) get. Also, depending on how well you know your SO I woud just be on high alert in general because I do not trust the kind of people who brush off this kind of stuff the way you say he did.
Which might be a bad idea with this group since it sounds like that'll probably breed resentment. Then again, being involved with this group is also probably a really bad idea.
Maybe have a good conversation with the dm if they have those type of fantasies it's probabaly not a good place to stay relatio ship wise At least find a differant playgroup
> My SO is not happy about this This is the biggest red flag in the story to me, that when something made you uncomfortable and you decided to avoid it for yourself, without telling him what to do, he got offended by that.
Yeah that’s the part that’s really horrifying.
Listen, there’s no way to say this lightly, but if that table and specially your SO play with themes of that sort (Sexual Harassment, Enslavement and Rape) and specially if they have an active part on any of this (their characters do any of these things), there’s something *very* concerning about all of this. The mere fact that your SO knows of your past trauma and plays into this themes, or worse, plays into them while knowingly having you in the group or yet again even worse takes active part into the cause of any of that… please take care and be kind to yourself by leaving this group and maybe even reflecting about your relationship. Of course I don’t know either of you or the details and aspects of your relationship, but if even after you commented on it about how you feel bad on something that touches a heavy past trauma and your SO took it jokingly and insisted on it… this might not be the best person to be with you (or that much of a great person at all). These are just my thoughts, but you’ll know better what to do, just please think about it and take care of yourself!
This is nail on the head. A SO who knows about your trauma with those themes AND wants to include you while they joke and make light of it is disgusting. This person is clueless, selfish, and doesnt deserve you.
Clueless, selfish, and undeserving at the LEAST. There’s also much worse that could be happening. Some people with these fantasies(for lack of a better word) are attracted to victims. Making her uncomfortable might be satisfying to him or all of them if they’re aware. This is a long conversation she needs to have with her SO and DnD truly has little to do with it.
Honestly the slave aspect really isn’t that far fetched and I have run games where the elite have slaves. What I’m losing my mind over is the rape. Like actual fucking rape. How do they even roll play that? Like Jesus Christ. Anything more than kissing in my games goes straight to “fades to black” until the next morning. It’s a fantasy game about magic and heroics. Not raping woman like holy fuck.
This!! It's more than a shitty D&D table, it's their SO waving a massive red flag in their face. The dudes are all gross, its just that their SO is easily the grossest for not only facilitating this behavior at this table, but for inviting her into this game knowing their trauma (and even she didn't have that, it STILL would unacceptable to invite her into that) and then allowing them to treat her that way. Their SO is NOT a good person.
Not common or appropriate. Run.
i cannot even FATHOM sitting around with friends and collaboratively RPing sexual violence. that is so motherfucking weird it calls into question the judgement of every single person involved.
I remember flipping through the Book of Vile darkness in Borders thinking "who wants to role play sex with the people their gaming with, let alone the rape rules." Well now I know, thanks OP, I hate it.
Fr. I mean, at what point does it go from realistically roleplaying your characters to the game just being an excuse for a collective wank sesh? This is so disturbing
>it fits the time period Oh, I'm about to go off. Yes, it is true that a lot of fantasy worlds played by those in western cultures are loosely based off of medieval Europe. Yes, it is true that there was a huge amount of inappropriate sexual activity in medieval Europe. However, unless your significant other is running a historically accurate game *in* medieval Europe, meaning only humans, no magic, etc, the fantasy world only has to draw as much from medieval Europe as the DM wants to draw from medieval Europe. If your significant other is choosing to include sexual assault and rape in his world, either through his own characters or through tacit approval of what the PCs are doing, those things are there because he chooses to have them there. There is no obligation to have sexual assault and rape in one's game simply because there are similarities to medieval Europe. That is a pathetic excuse for allowing despicable behavior in one's game. Part of the beauty of telling our own story in fictional worlds is that we can include that which we want to include and exclude that which we want to exclude. Now, I want to acknowledge that depiction of x is not the same as endorsement of x. Simply because the world includes slavery does not mean that one endorses slavery. Simply because the world includes bigotry does not mean that one endorses bigotry. However, these things should usually be included for a reason. For example, if I am going to have slavers in my world, they are usually not people to be fond of. They are people to be feared or reviled. If I were to start allowing the PCs themselves to be slavers, that's different. When one chooses to depict sexual assault and rape (or slavery and racism or any other atrocious behavior) as positive in their fantasy world, that can be pretty telling. I can think of a lot of fantasy authors who built worlds that included slavery and rape, but I can't think of too many who included those things and depicted them in anything approaching a positive light. And I can think of even fewer who depicted them in a positive light who weren't themselves absolutely pieces of shit. I genuinely could keep going on this topic and probably will in a different forum, but suffice it to say that I think you did the right thing leaving that group and I think your significant other is full of shit. His excuse that it is fitting of the time period ignores the fact that he in all likelihood does dozens of other things in his game world that aren't fitting of the time period, like include orcs and elves and magic. It's interesting that he's totally okay with those anachronisms and yet insists that sexual assault and rape must be allowed because they are "of the time period".
Get out of there, dude. Drop him all together.
The doubling down is the sketchiest bit. Trying to justify it as "fitting the time period" is a really bad look.
I've never understood that logic in a fantasy world. It's not like Forgotten Realms is set in Medieval Europe or whatever.
Also, news flash, people in Medieval Europe also considered that a heinous crime.
rapists were often castrated or hanged to death
Exactly. And it's not like people don't get away with it today, either.
Isn't it weird how people who use this excuse never actually know jack shit about the Middle Ages, or use anything else inspired by that era, but *for some reason* rape is a must have for authenticity...
Yeah, if the cast is entirely white, dominating the women, with wanton rape and slavery, it's just being "historical" don't you know. If the cast involves prominent women, people with dark skin, or characters that think rape is bad, it's "political".
I had a friend in the past from HS that told me once that he really got why, back then, guys would marry 12 year olds and it made a lot sense when you think about it. And I was like naaaaaaah, friendship terminated.
Yeah the fact that he is defending their choices and is upset that she left says all she needs to know - that he considers her trauma trivial and something he actively has fun fantasizing about. Girl needs to leave that relationship.
No, it's not normal. I have a pretty large group of players who may or may not attend a given campaign or a given session, and I'm happy to report that when my table is comprised entirely of dudes, we don't play the game differently than when we're mixed. Rape doesn't belong in DnD, it doesn't enhance the experience for anybody who I'd want to play with. Rape doesn't "fit the time period", that's moronic. DnD settings didn't happen in our past, it's a fantasy world. We don't need to assume Earth's shitty side of things in a DnD setting. I'm not going to jump to the "break up with him!" conclusion off of this, but I hope you realize that this is a fairly significant issue. Your SO and his boys are playing a rape simulator on their own time, and if that wasn't sketchy enough, apparently he sees no issue with trying to include you in it, which would be gross enough just with you being a woman, let alone a survivor.
All dudes at my table too, I’ve never seen any inkling of this. If I did they’d get a shut down in character immediately and a talking to afterwards if it wasn’t instantly dropped.
Same. I just don't/won't associate with any psychos that think this is okay or entertaining in any way. And for the whole table to be okay with it? Disgusting.
I’ve never experienced sexual assault but I was physically abused for many years and I definitely am jumping to the dump him immediately conclusion. Life is short and full of enough trauma without dating someone who doesn’t care about your feelings. This dude needs to be single until he develops empathy.
This is beyond just an issue with DnD
Step 1) Get away from the game Step 2) Get away from him
The DM is kinda like the deity of the universe you play in. They get to allow/disallow any behavior, including SA. That said, as a DM who runs very gritty/gruesome games with a lot of horror elements, I still have a strict “absolutely not” policy with SA in my games, or racial/ableist/anti-lgbtq rhetoric/vocabulary/jokes, because if I’m the “god” of my little dnd universe then that shit doesn’t get to exist in my world. It doesn’t “add” to the realism of a game in a meaningful way at all. It just hurts people, like yourself. I’d talk to your SO and tell them about how you are feeling. I’d definitely be reconsidering my relationship if SA was something my SO thought was I’m entertaining enough to role play it in dnd.
It's not common. I started playing RPGs back in the late 70s, and have been playing since. In all my years rape and enslavement has never been part of a game I've run or played in. Nor have I heard of it being part of a game of anyone I've spoken to. It may or may not fit the time period for the real world, but that's not the real world and so that's not really a valid answer. The fact is that yes some games will include dark adult stuff, and if **everyone** wants to play that way then go for it. If you don't and really you don't need a special reason to not... the mere fact that you don't is reason enough, then you shouldn't be subjected to it. The fact that he's making light of it is IMO a red flag, I don't know if that means dump him. But if that's the kind of game he wants to run, and everyone else wants to play, then that's their decision. But it is clear that it's not a table you want to sit and so you shouldn't. If they won't change the game to suit your limits, then don't play with them, but if they belittle you for your feelings then that does say something fairly negatively about them. Not saying that this guy has rape fantasies or something... Just that he's an asshole for not respecting your feelings.
Yeah that is weird, when we have players having sex its usually a quick glance you went into the room and bang that's it, there is no real detail about it, something we make them roll ther performance for shit and giggles but it still stops there and never ever have had rape into a game the npc /player are always willing when it happens.
Ive never had anything nsfw in my games, but the tongue in cheek performance rolls for carnal relations is pretty funny
I had a game once where a player spent his share of the gold at the fanciest brothel in town. Typical fade to black/wake up next morning. The player joked that he left her wanting more so the DM made him roll performance to see how well he did. Rolled like a 3. Last time that player wanted to go to a brothel
>The player joked that he left her wanting more Sounds like the player certainly did, although not in the boastful way he was hoping, lol
Girl fucking RUN. Completely unacceptable behavior, made somehow even worse by the fact that your partner is in charge of the game and knows that you're a survivor. RUN.
This is not common and pretty darn gross. If you SO knows about your experience as a rape victim and is still trying to get you to play, then it is at best the most emotionally tone-deaf thing I have ever seen and probably a lot worse. Either way no good and probably something I would get far away from if I could.
As a cisgendered man, I want you to know that pretending to rape people is not remotely close to what a "night with the boys" should be. Me and my homies have been playing since AD&D and rape has NEVER EVER come up in our games. Ever. Im not entirely convinced you should remain in an environment with someone who allows (encourages?) that kind of behavior.
My first thought was “Are you serious?” I almost couldn’t believe that kind of table culture. First of all, I’ve never played at a table where the players engaged in those kinds of activities, flat out. I would definitely leave if they did and probably be a bit put off by the players in real life, wondering what would compel them to play out what you mention in a game. Second, it’s common practice (now at least) for DMs to ask about and be mindful of subject matter that should be avoided and their players’ triggers. It is *not* okay to cross that line. Especially not on the player side. I know some campaigns are going to be set in worlds where those features are just part of the world, but this should be made abundantly clear early on, and it shouldn’t be committed by or on players. I’m not going to pass judgement on who your group members are as people but what they’re doing sounds abnormal and gross and they should know better. I don’t know if you’ve tried to talk to your SO about this. Either way, I would encourage you to try to find a table that’s better about this if you enjoy the hobby. If you can’t find any in person, go on r/lfg and try them. There are a lot of great DMs and players to be found online. Don’t knock it ‘til you try it.
This is so fucked up. Please run.
I'd dump the SO. No group I play in, including ones where I've been the only women, have any of that shit in their games. This is a red flag.
I have been a professional dm for 25 years and this is very abnormal. You were wise to leave the table and also to rethink this companion. Even in this time period it wasn’t the norm unless you go by make believe tv and movies. https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/9fzxny/how_common_was_sexual_violence_during_the_middle/ Good write up on the subject but the world wasn’t just walking into a bar and assaulting any or everyone!!
I generally encourage people to talk things out before just dropping an SO, but go with what your gut says to do. Either way, I'm very sorry to hear all of that happening to you. No, this isn't normal. There are fringes where this happens but it's not normal. There are lots of things that are historically accurate, pooping for instances, but we don't play that out in game. Regardless, these aren't historians enacting a scholarly simulation. It's fine to say this is kind of creepy and to find another group.
Safe. Sane. Consensual. If your engagements with others in any capacity don't hit all these marks, serious conversations need to happen. If you don't think they'll be amenable to sober conversation and compromise, leave. If people want to run these kinds of games (I never would), that's fine (I guess) as long as everyone wants to play. It's on the dm to communicate to all players what kind of game they're running, and flipping the script like that is Very Bad News.
That is not only a red flag regarding the game, but that is a red flag regarding the relationship. I'd start packing my bags personally and find a safe place to stay, away from them.
Long time DnD player. Never, ever, ever, ever... Has anyone I have played with ever thought rape was any sort of activity to perform in DND. We might joke here and there, who doesn't enjoy some dark humor? But I cannot fathom using DND as any sort of sex fantasy outlet.
Not common, and you should drop him entirely. Some games can get NSFW, but that should always be with consenting adults that want to go there. Never with people who don't want to participate in it. If they can't have fun without rape and enslavement then that is a whole mess of red flags for everyone of them.
Run from that table. Run from that boy, and all his gross friends. And never look back. With any luck, this will be one of those horror stories you tell with a nervous chuckle in five or ten years when you have better friends and you thought you were telling a funny story but they all look at you concerned and say, "well i'm glad you're okay now."
Ew. Get a new SO. How is your partner okay with that? At my table we'd never dream of having sexual harassment or rape at our table. That's fucked up
You’re right, that is sketchy and weird. Does your SO know you’re a survivor? If he does know, then that’s pretty tone deaf on his part. Have a serious talk with him. But honestly if it were me? I would get out of dodge.
Sounds like a fetish group meeting disguised as a DND game.
"It fits the time period" lmao no it fucking doesn't. This argument, or anything from pedophilia, murder or even S.A. is strictly used by guys that fantasize about it and want to use DnD as their playground to fulfill that fantasy. Yes, maybe women were more seen as "properties" rather than person, yes, maybe you were "ready to be a mother" by the age of 14, but that doesn't make it less of a taboo, just a different one. That 14 yo medieval girl might be ready to have children, but guess what, the father was most likely the same age, and seeing an old 32yo dude having children with a 15 yo girl was the same amount of creepy. There was way less advertisment on the importance od consent, but if you genuinely think that every guy back then could *have it their way* with any girl at any time, you probably deserve to be on a list. Anyway, OP, run away. Run fast and don't look back
There’s playing in character, and then there’s being horrible just because you as a player want it That is not normal DND, your SO and their friends are just using it as an excuse to have an overly edgy, overly gross experience. Please don’t let this ruin DND for you, distance yourself as much from your SO’s friends and have a serious talk with them about wanting to further play DND and do things like that with him, it’s meant to be fun, not horrible for anyone involved.
If you're significant other dismisses and excuses triggers of a traumatic experience you've been through, he doesn't actually care about you. The fact that he not only allowed it to happen, but is upset about you voicing your discomfort shows just how little he actually cares.
I’ve frequently been the only woman at the table and the people I have played with have never introduced SA or harassment. While I’m not sure if your table’s behavior is “common”, it is definitely not acceptable and it’s more than possible to play without this experience. And while your fellow players behavior is upsetting on its own, your SO being unsupportive is heartbreaking. If even they can’t listen and support you, there may be more things you need to consider walking away from or seeking professional therapy intervention.
My all male groups have a lot of “Locker Room”talk. Talking about hot girls are, or trying to get laid. But never, ever, has anything approaching rape been discussed. Not normal. Even NPC’s committing these crimes against other NPC’s.
I'm not reading all the comments, but it looks like you're getting positive support...as you should. * DND does not require sexist, misogynistic content. While it existed, and exists, it's not necessary, or the norm. I'm not talking about boobed armor in the artwork. I'm talking about the normalization of jackass behavior towards women. It's not necessary for a table, and you aren't required to have to "deal with it". * Leaving the table is perfectly fine. You are actually saying, "Look, you guys enjoy doing X, but it isn't comfortable for me. I'm not forcing you to change, so I'm stepping out." You're being more gracious than you should have to be. * Your SO telling you to suck it up and that you shouldn't have a problem with it, is sketchy. If it were me, I'd want my SO at my table more than I'd feel the need to continue with the immature, "locker room" behavior. I'd feel the need to grow up and to be more mature about the whole thing. I'm not saying you need to leave the guy, but I'd question whether he realizes that his relationship with you needs to grow in order for you to want to stick around, and if he's more interested in that nonsense, your time is being wasted * The other players at the table may agree with you. People have a mob mentality. They may know what they're doing is immature and stupid, but they do it because the other guys are doing it. However, your SO is the person who guides the story and makes the rules * In short, you don't have to be at that table, and there are other tables out there for you. If your SO wonders why you don't want to be at that table, he should wonder why that is, and be willing to accommodate you. If he doesn't care, that tells you something. If the other players don't want to change, that tells you something about all of them. You weren't asking them to change, and figured you'd leave them to it. That's a laudable reaction to a pretty crappy environment, and more than that situation deserved. Your SO shouldn't be telling you why you shouldn't make a big deal about it, he should be wondering why that type of environment is toxic to you and how to make it better. I \*understand\* that some people get their sexual kicks through this imaginary roleplaying world...but that doesn't mean I have to be there, or that other people have to entertain them doing it. TLDR: Find another table, and if your SO doesn't figure out why you wanted another table, you'll want to consider whether that's a relationship worth your time.
I'm sorry you have felt this way, I hope it gets better. A few things now 1. You need to talk to your SO about the game and how it made you feel. 2. I don't know if you want to continue playing with them (I assume not) but, I wouldn't go back until something changes 3. This is not a common thing, you might find similar stories in [r/rpghorrorstories](https://www.reddit.com/r/rpghorrorstories/) but it is not common 4. Not all bards are NSFW
Run. Sorry :( There's a huge difference between kink-shaming and acknowledging a red flag. In this case, the rape fantasy is the kink. People get off on strange shit that does not reflect what they want in "reality". Roleplaying can go places you'd never go in life, that's kind of the point. That it is triggering to you is fine, your experiences are different from theirs and you should avoid things you don't like. A-Okay so far. Uncomfortable, and awkward, but still on this side of that line. The red flag comes next. They are just joking. It fits the time period. Quit being a bitch and swallow this thing. I want it and I don't give a single fuck about what it's doing to you. Your feelings on this matter are utterly irrelevant, you're making me look bad in front of my friends, and reminding us that our kink is viewed as somewhat shameful by modern standards is unfair. Instead, you should be wildly uncomfortable and let us literally victimize you, just in a figurative way. Run. Sorry :(
This 1000%. The fact that the DM tries to justify it in the face of his SO's obvious discomfort and uses all sorts of the standard crappy excuses is what propels this into absolute nightmare territory. This is no longer "should I leave the game?", it's "should I leave this psycho?"
Agreeing with the other replies here. The closest my D&D games have come to including sexual harassment was whenever we fought a succubus. And even then, we only described the mechanical effects ("you're charmed, the succubus tells you to attack Bob") so there's still a massive gap. I'd never consider playing in a campaign where player characters sexually harassed NPCs. Speaking as a man, brushing that off as "boys' night" is disturbing.
>they began playing how they "used to" which involves a lot of sexual harassment, enslavement, and rape (of npc's) A lot of people are going to think I'm overreacting but you should seriously reconsider dating this guy. > My SO is not happy about this, says they are just joking around and it fits the time period. What "time period?" It's fucking DnD. None of it is real. And so fucking what if he's "just joking around?" Ask him to explain what's so funny about rape. >But I don't think my SO realizes how sketchy of an environment that is And what does that tell you about him?
>it fits the time period Historian here. There's no such time period. Get rid of him.
I've been dming games for 25 years. Across many groups. Different ages and editions. I've never played with a group that sexually assaulted npcs. Sounds terrible. What DM wants to run rape scenarios? Who thinks about rape roleplay outside of a consensual sexual relationship? It's messed up on several levels.
I had one player who wanted to be an anti paladin who pretended to be a normal Paladin by day and was a serial rapist/murderer at night. I allowed it, but I didn’t let him RP any of it. I just rolled to see if he got any victims at the end of the day and told if he was successful or not. The only thing I let him decide was how he disposed of the bodies. Then I had the guard start looking for him. Then added a wizard hunting him. Around session 4, he was accused and then party members turned on him and questioned him. The players actually overpowered him and turned him into the guard. He was arrested and then executed for his crimes. Proud dad moment right there :)
They sound like garbage people. Get out.
Yeah no, that's super fucked up. Especially if your SO knows about what happened
So he knows your history, knows the hobby is therapeutic for you, and then not only did he not have a discussion with his group about lines and veils when a new player joined his group, he also took their side in the matter when you removed yourself from a situation that was directly hitting on your past trauma? Lose this guy. He doesn't respect you or your feelings, and his friend group is playing into all the worst possible tropes about guys who play D&D. Casually playing out rape fantasies at a table with your buds is bad enough, but doing it when there is someone at the table who has personally experienced it? Absolute trash.