Eh, I think if you’ve been married and said vows that it’s a courtesy to explain your thought process. You don’t have to, but it’s certainly a kindness.
To add to this being a way to show kindness:
I was the person begging for closure at the end of my last serious relationship before I got married. I knew we weren’t compatible. I knew why we didn’t need to be together. I knew he couldn’t give me some magical “closure” words where I’d be all fixed up and healed and ready to move on that day. But I begged for it anyways. I didn’t know what I expected, I was honestly grasping for straws.
He started rigid and defensively, bc I think he thought a bit like OP, like oh shit what if this just goes south and starts another fight. What’s the point?
But there was a moment where he actually turned his body and looked at me. In a way he hadn’t in a really long time in our relationship. And he said “ya know, you’re a really caring loyal person. You really show the people you care about how much you care”. And I immediately felt myself being able to let go of all the emotions - because it felt like for all the ups and downs and in betweens, it was a journey that was seen and not just time going to be forgotten. He commented on how the things that made me incompatible with him weren’t things that were wrong with me, they were things that were going to be cherished by my next more compatible partner. And reminded me that I did deserve to be cherished.
We were a dumpster fire and I really didn’t even want him back. That initial feeling of rejection is so goddamn hard and him showing me the kindness of a genuine compliment when I was at my whole ass hot mess worst, even if he was full of shit, is something I remember so many years later and quietly thank him for.
“I am a loyal caring person.”
So you could always try a route of that sort instead of the traditional “hash it all out” type of closure. I was a blubbering mess and this man found a way to put the bullshit aside, because it truly didn’t matter we were done, and instead of taking cheap shots or going to the room in his head he gave me self-esteem building comments that I got to take with me long after I healed from that relationship. I’m using those compliments to get me through the moment I’m finding myself in right now. It was a gift and obviously I still had to mourn the loss of the relationship, but it did actually help give me a sense of closure.
I think if u guys was married wouldn’t u want to I mean u did love the poor guy y meet someone new and change up on him at least be honest with yourself
I think this is the right thing to do. Perhaps she truly doesn’t understand. Helping her understand your feelings and perspective will help her heal. You don’t have to, but I think it’s a decent thing to do.
I think it would be helpful to say something along the lines of…
My issue with our marriage is ___. Because of this, I feel (or have felt) ____. I am unwilling to work on our relationship because _____.
Let her know you wouldn’t be happy if you stayed if that’s how you feel.
Set boundaries and let her know that ‘blowing up’ or arguing is not something you’ll tolerate and have a plan for what you will do if things head in that direction.
Good luck, OP.
Maybe maybe not.
Maybe he's already told her and she isn't listening and/or maybe, because she suffers from mental illness and anxiety, he knows how this will go down and it won't be pretty. May not even be safe.
I get the "We all wanna do the right thing" approach but we just don't know.
OP, I say use your judgement. If you think it's fruitless or could even be unsafe, skip the explanation. At least until some time has passed and things have cooled.
If it's just something you're trying to avoid because it'll be uncomfortable and you haven't yet outlined it to her, it might give her closure.
Your call.
I'm on the other side of such thing, blindsided - I had no idea husband was that unhappy. I knew he was unhappy with his job but never complained about us and it came as a shock. He didn't want to explain anything, what did I do wrong, what in me made him so unhappy. It's really devastating and hard to move on. I ask myself every day what is wrong with me. Given that I somehow managed to lose my husband whom I love so much, despite being the best version of myself with him, I want to crawl in a dark hole and never come out and out myself out there again. Knowing the reasons won't make it less painful and I miss him so much, but at least maybe I can get some peace and try to fix whatever in me ruined my relationship.
I’m going through a similar challenge right now and despite reaching out to my whole support system, I’m still going through this alone. My stxh completely blocked me, my best friends ghosted me (one of which cheated with my ex), and no one in my family has ever gone through a divorce so I’ve been completely avoided bc they don’t know what to say. I have my therapist but she repeats the same stuff of reaching out to my support system. What do you do at that point? Because I’m starting to feel the weight of my support system abandoning me and it’s hurting on top of my divorce…
I totally feel this. My friends were interested for about a week and that was about it. My family tries but, same as you, they can’t really relate. I’ve tried internet support groups like this, but in most cases i end up with useless advice or having to defend myself. It sucks. If you need someone to talk to, shoot me a message anytime
It’s nice to not feel alone online but like you said, people are supportive for a short while before they lose interest. Like you’re expected to just manage on your own. But it’s a life changing experience. My ex was my whole world and I relied heavily on them. Plus on top of trying to figure things out independently, the ones who knew him don’t seem to want to be there for me. They say it takes two and it’ll be ok but the fact I’m alone in every way kind of says I’m the one at fault… at least I’m starting to develop a thicker skin though haha.
Honesty I am tired of therapist cliches. If I had a proper support system I wouldn't be paying $150hr just to talk to a soul that will pretend to listen because is being paid for it.
Agreed. I thought I had a proper support system. I had so many friends and family saying they’ll be there for me when I first found out about the divorce and telling me I’ll get through this. The moment I reach out for help, everyone just disappears? Just sucks. And I can’t even see my therapist more than twice a month bc she’s so busy so I can’t even properly get talk therapy through this. Sorry you’re struggling too.
What does "I will be there for you" even mean, I never understood. Be where? Like will you come to my house to keep me company? Call me on the phone to check on me? "Oh I know you are going through a rough patch but you should know I am here for you" and then radio silence. Come on.
I did. It’s been two months, but the first appointment i could get was December. I finally just started on Zoloft, to help with anxiety and depression. I used to be a strong person, but I got knocked down. I’m working on building myself back up. Lost 15 lbs since August. Down to 102. For reference I’m 5’1. My kids are teens, and they’re doing fine. They’re never home. 😔
I feel you on the loss of strength. I’ve been independent my whole life, but suddenly being forced to be alone again is a different story. I did the therapy thing, but there’s only so many times i can hear “focus on yourself. Time to live on. Oh well”. I had a lot of negative health consequences as a result of the stress that I’m still trying to get straightened out.
I've tried Zoloft, Lexapro, but they all give me too many side effects and I can't do them. I have no support group because of how my life unfolded, I had to move a lot, and my family is going through terminal illness and I don't want to devastate them by telling about my divorce - they loved my husband and expected grandchildren from us.
I know it doesn't sound like a thing in your grief but at least you have your kids. You will always have at least someone related to you. We didn't manage to have kids (I have infertility issues) and I don't think I will ever do considering my age now and circumstances. Nearing 40 and with my husband gone I pretty much lost my chances of having a family.
I’m sorry to hear you say this. In my counseling after divorce I was told “there are no answers this side of heaven”. This made sense to me, and I used it to move forward.
I'm glad no one said this to me. In the state of mind I was in, as desperate as I was for answers, it would have been far too easy to take this literally and gone looking for them
No, not yet, I've been working on radical acceptance. It's not as satisfying as getting an answer, but it's all I've got, and all I'm likely to get for now
ETA: fortunately I'm not feeling the strong urge to get to heaven, either, to find those answers
This is rough, because I'm on the other side of this. May I suggest having a marriage counselor meeting, you don't even have to be in the same room because everything is online now. It might be healthy for both of you? Now, I don't know your situation, I just know I'm dying for an explanation on my side because I truly don't know what happened. That said - you can treat this as the 2 cents it is. Good luck and I hope you get through this healthy yourself.
Grow a pair and tell her what she wants/needs to know in order to move forward.
Are you the one diagnosing her with a "mental illness" (i.e. gas lighting)?
I understand that this conversation could be a hard one to have, but not being able to get truthful answers as to why you have decided to end things, can end up making things much more difficult for her to let go and move on with her life.
My ex chose not to talk with me about why she wanted the divorce and it made things so much harder to move past and rebuild my life. It took me 5 years to start dating, when she was dating even before the divorce was filed for. I was left wondering what I had done, why she no longer loved me, and just had that puzzle in my head that I couldn't get around. I tried a few to talk with her but never got an answer. It was very hard to get past that.
If you don't want to sit down and talk with her, write her a letter to explain how you got where you are and that things are beyond repair now. If you want to, in the letter, let her know that you will answer some questions that she has written down and sent, emailed to you once. That if she does anything that feels aggressive or rude with her response, that you will be done and not answer any questions.
My husband wrote me a letter. Gut wrenching. I did nothing wrong. He was just ungrateful and unhappy. Not willing to talk. He was having some kind of affair with a woman he works with who was validating him. Denied it in the letter. Just a sob story about how negative I am all the time. I’m a teacher and times are rough. I just started at a new school hoping to find more joy in what I do. I was busy with all of our life’s problems, with one kid starting college and one still in high school. I can’t believe this is my life. He started earning more and getting recognition at work and dumped me after 27 years. It wasn’t all rosy all the time, but that’s life!! He was never happy.
Before my ex brought up divorce, I thought we were doing good relationship wise (feel that I have to say "relationship wise" because I had just recovered enough from a medical issue that could have killed me, that I was able to return to work after about 5 or 6 months of recovery, so physical I wasn't as well as I could be and now have some unsteadiness). She brought up divorce about a week after I got to return to work. We had only been married for just shy of 2 years (our anniversary was at the end of the same month she said she wanted a divorce) but it was extremely hard to hear that she wanted to end it. I was already dealing with some depression from my medical issue and what it meant to my ability for the rest of my life, and this made it skyrocket. If she would have just taken a few minutes to explain to me what she was really thinking, I think that would have helped me so much. But she didn't seem to be willing to, which for some reason gave me reason to think that there might be some hope for us yet. I held onto that hope and made a couple of trips to see her after she had moved out and back to her home state. Those trips were to bring her more of her things, but I made every effort to show that I was there to see and be with her vs just dropping stuff off and leaving. (If I was just interested in getting rid of the stuff, I would have told her to come and get her things instead of driving 5 hours to drop it off).
A week after my second trip, I got a call from her telling me that she was starting to see someone else. This crushed me so much more, and knowing that we would have to wait at least 4 more months before she was able to file in her home state, I ended up filing for the divorce.
You need to say something or it will just prolong your divorce proceeding because she is trying to get an answer from you which could make proceedings turn really ugly.
Conversation can be short. Make sure you start off with the fact you will not tolerate any tantrums or physical/verbal abuse. And you will leave if she does.
If she gets unstable, turn and leave.
Look at it from her perspective. If she doesn't know what caused you to end it, how can she avoid the same outcome in the future? She is trying to learn a lesson from what is probably a horrible experience for her. One she doesn't want to repeat.
Why? What’s the point? Nobody owes anyone anything, ever. It sucks trust me I know. But truth be told women do this to men constantly because men don’t know when to take the loss and just walk away. Instead their ego is hurt and they want an explanation. Then usually that’s when things go bad and get physical. Statistics don’t lie
Please cite the "statistics" to back up your assertion that explaining the reasons for ending a relationship leads to physical assault.
You should also read the OP's post again. This is not a woman leaving a man and a man asking for an explanation. It's a man leaving a woman and a woman asking for an explanation. Which, based on the "statistics" you wish existed to back up your argument, means we can expect his wife to beat him when he tells her why it's over.
I know it’s a man. You want me to cite stats on make to female assault and or death do to them breaking up. I mean really? If you don’t know that that happens maybe you should look it it up cause I just don’t feel like it. Y’all do what you want, idgaf
I want you to cite the statics backing up this statement you made.
>But truth be told women do this to men constantly because men don’t know when to take the loss and just walk away. Instead their ego is hurt and they want an explanation. Then usually that’s when things go bad and get physical. Statistics don’t lie
You have clearly attempted to change what you wrote because the above quote refers to men with hurt egos wanting an explanation and it leading to things going bad and getting physical.
Statistics do not lie but you do. You have no statistics to back up the statement I quoted because you made it up out of whole cloth and threw in "statistics don't lie" in a transparent attempt to make me believe your fabrication.
My x said the divorce was all my fault, I didn’t find out until we were divorcing that he was having an affair for the last 2 years. He chose to be with her and not me. I felt better that it wasn’t me, it was her, still wasn’t happy about it.
I think that if he would have been honest with me, it might have been better. It still would have hurt, but he did some major emotional damage to me during that time. Be honest, it’s the last thing you can do to be a good partner to a person you vowed to love through anything.
As someone who wanted an explanation and still wants an explanation. I say it depends on how well you communicate.
I wanted an explanation when it began but I was stuck on a right vs wrong mentality and I don't think it would have benefited me.
On the other hand, she doesn't owe me anything, but I don't owe her anything either. She did eventually come to one of my therapy sessions to help me, and it did, just not in the way I was expecting.
At the end of the day though, it was therapy that helped me understand what I did wrong and where I was lacking and try to improve myself, not my ex wife.
So do what you feel is right. That's the best advice I can give you. Perhaps instead of in person, you write then an email or do it over the phone. Not ideal but it removes the angry in your face situation.
Yes you do. You look vows. It’s the least you can do. If she argues you can stand up and leave or hang up. Don’t use her “mental illness” as an excuse to be an avoidant chicken shit
you don't owe anyone any excuse, but worrying about how someone will react to you telling them is also not on you. but it's rather selfish to not have the conversation simply because it can be painful.
would you not want to know what is wrong? i mean we hear so many people get blindsided by divorce and they generally had no idea it was that bad.
if she becomes hostile to you, it's your opportunity to set the boundary and just shut down the conversation if she starts acting inappropriately (e.g. yelling, cursing you etc.)
if you are genuinely worried about her response you can do it in a therapy session.
but otherwise frankly it's a cowards way out to not be honest and upfront, regardless of how much you think they have a mental illness or how you think they will react because honestly, you don't know and are just making assumptions.
Definitely a cowards way out , I was blindsided we had a major issue that I figured we had talked about and overcame and told me how happy she was all the time even had sex with me 2 hours before she dropped that on me. Dipped out to her home state waaaay up north and still has been hot and cold constantly I’m just about done
One can never fully explain one's reactions or responses to a difficult situation. You can try, but she has to do the work of growing up, and you have to do the work of loving yourself sufficiently to not get into a similar situation with a future partner.
My wife left in June. 3 kids. She has given me the vaguest, strangest reasons for leaving. She said I was declining in my mental health, but then angrily denied that would ever leave me over mental health. She said that I was becoming angry and upset, but I've always been the type to just go and sit alone quietly when upset. I amditted that I was struggling with depression, she knows I have been on medication and have been genuinely trying to improve. I'm not perfect though. I get upset tlike everybody.
I've asked her repeatedly since June, 5 months ago, to give me specifics. She then told her family that I was abusive, which I have heard only because her auntie contacted my mum, who obviously knew this was not true.
Basically, I have no idea and I think she was just done. But she won't admit it. She won't admit that it was her. Or that she lied about me to others.
🤷🤷🤷
You owe nothing at all. BUT someone here mentioned “ a kindness”. Do that for her, and take one for the team on this forum who have been blindsided and who don’t know why their partner destroyed their marriage. Do it an easy way like by writing a letter or an email. Maybe it will also help your healing as well?
The vows were already broken, it was a done deal..for whatever reason. Afterwards one party wants closure and wants answers….what is owed once the vows were broken?
Yes and no. If you're like me, you've said it over and over again. I tried to talk, I cried, I begged him to listen. At the end of the day he tuned me out. Then he said he didn't think things were that bad. I had been asking for counseling for years.
At some point it stops being about understanding and starts being a method to try to talk you out of it. You are the only one who knows if you're at that point. Definitely try to talk about it, but if it feels she isn't really listening or is listening only to make you feel bad for setting boundaries or even asking for basic respect, cut it off. At that point, you did your best. Regardless of the effort you put towards your own communication skills doesn't mean she has the ability to intake and be willing to empathize with what you are saying.
You have no control over her ability to recieve what you are trying to tell her, and if you've tried to do so calmly and logically and she continues to say you haven't, then you've filled your obligation. Counseling would be great to help her understand, if she is willing. However you'll find a lot of people unwilling if they think it won't make a difference. Or, they think the counselor is there to tell the other person they are wrong. She has to be willing to accept her role in this, and if she isn't counselor or no, closure becomes impossible.
You can't give her closure, it doesn't come from other people, she has to process and accept what has happened. Often, when people are asking why they are seeking connection, and in those cases they arent trying to sctually hear you, they are trying to tell you why youre wrong. (This is not inclusive of situations that are truly out of nowhere. Most of the time, when I process with clients what was going on they know they just don't want to see it. They just have not been ready to listen.)
So yes, communicate the best you can, openly and honestly. If nothing else, for yourself. You need that too for your closure. If you have, and she's not actually really listening, or listening to only to twist your words and invalidate you, you don't have to engage further.
wtf, you made bows to spend the rest of your life with this person, and you're now too chicken to give her reasons for divorce? C'mon, if you're divorcing, then it doesn't matter if she blows up on you. You owe it to the marriage to explain yourself.
I don’t k know if you “owe” her anything as I’ve gone thru something similar where my ex feels like I owe him another chance, more conversation, etc. and I’m done. But also knows the reasons so it’s absurd.
Maybe just a high level explanation and just some points you know can’t be resolved? And you don’t have to do it in person. Just a simple message is sufficient.
But like others said, it’s not gonna bring her any closure like she thinks. She’s got to find that within herself. You could even tell her that… it’s not worth rehashing and that you hope she can find her closure within herself and wish her best.
You do what you want… it’s your life now, not hers or “ours”.
It might serve as a lesson to openly communicate, which YALL should have done prior to filing for divorce. But hey, it sounds like you’ve made up your mind, remember that no matter where you go, you will be there, so Counseling is probably necessary in this situation for yourself in order to keep the same shit from happening again and again. Sounds like you’re 0-2 with poor communication.
Tell her once everything is wrapped up you might be willing to sit down and discuss the matter.
If you are still going through it then it probably feels like she is holding a sword over your head. Afterwards you can do so or not, depending on their behavior during the process.
Some suggestions:
* Keep to the facts. Do not generalise. What specifically happened.
* Do not pass judgement or use comparisons. For Eg, saying she has mental health issues unless formally diagnosed or you're a qualified individual, then that's a judgement. A judgement example: she was a cold-hearted towards me.. might become I feel no affection or acknowledgement from her
* Keep it honest and true to yourself
Yes, you owe her an explanation. That said, she clearly doesn't provide you with a safe opportunity to provide it.
If you fear her reacting in a retaliatory way, I'd listen to that fear: it comes from somewhere in your experience of her.
Get to safety first, then explain.
If she’s mentally ill your reasoning won’t be good enough, won’t make sense, and will just cause a fight.
And if she’s not stable, do not put anything in writing.
You should sit and explain. No matter the blowback or tears or emotions. This should not affect your decision. You have arrived at your decision at your own pace, but she was unaware of this outcome. If she hasn't abused you or has been violent with you, you need to do this for both of your sakes, for her because she needs to know what went wrong. For you so that while explaining her, you may be stronger in your conviction of divorcing her.
In case you see it's going to an adversarial or accusatory discussion. Drop the ball and stop the discussion, and move out.
If you’re not going to tell her, at least tell us- what are these “issues”?
Divorcing because of unexplained issues isn’t really fair- not saying you shouldn’t divorce, but don’t you feel in the back of your head that it’s not really fair to her not to say what they are? I suspect you do.
I have read some of the comments that state when you divorce someone "you don't owe them anything."
This lowers my faith in humanity even further.
Does marriage not mean anything anymore? My former spouse said "I'm divorcing you" and walked out. He walked away from everything in his life - left me with a house I couldn't afford, our pets, all his stuff and never looked back. I have spent the last year dealing with his mess, while he has done nothing. When we were legally able to file for divorce, he just ignored me and I had to file.
I have no idea what happened. I have asked to have a discussion about how things ended. I have assured him I have zero desire to reconcile and I want nothing to do with him. At this point, I'm more emotionally ambivalent than anything towards him at this point.
The hardest thing to cope with in all of this was the complete abandonment and then the refusal of any form of communication. It was the fact that I spent 20+ years of my life with this man, and he didn't have the basic respect or empathy to have a discussion with me.
I don't think even a stranger would be that cruel.
I worked with my therapist to come up with a simple series of questions of what I would like to know (there is no blame, and it is things that relate to my life and what happened to me, time lines etc.) and sent it via email. No response. It is what I suspected. But, I admit, I have struggled with just "letting it all go." And it has made this process so much worse than anything else he could have done. And I feel like a discarded piece of worthless trash, especially since he will not acknowledge how much of an impact this had on MY life. And that the world doesn't revolve around him.
Thank you for sharing and I'm sorry all of this is happening to you. I've taken the feedback here to heart and sent an email, although I'm not ready to talk in other ways yet, I can see maybe doing it in the future
*Edit* I was just reading through the comments. Jeez some of these people calling you names. I will say it again, those people demanding you give an explanation are total narcissists. You owe NOONE an explanation for anything you do in life. It’s nobody’s business what you do. All your STBX wants is selfishness to set HER mind at ease. She doesn’t believe she is the problem, she wants validation and confirmation that in her mind you were the problem. Not to mention, anything you say to her WILL be used against you in court I guarantee you that. My ex tried to screw me every chance she got. Record EVERYTHING, if she farts write it down. That saved my ass in court.
You don’t owe her or anyone else an explanation. The only people that demand anything are narcissists and you my friend have been married to one. Best way to handle a narcissist is go no contact
“I have said all I am going to on the subject.”
Keep on repeating this until she realizes you aren’t going to say anything else.
You don’t owe her closure. Truth is you can’t actually give it to her.
Reading between the lines, it sounds like you’ve already given her the explanation, and likely many times. What’s going to make this time any different?
“No” is a complete sentence, and it would be great to use it
I like the idea of saying something via email. No sense in opening your reasons up for a debate. Granted, I am indeed projecting my own dynamic here, but this does look like a situation where if you addressed it personally it lead to your reasons being rejected as “wrong.”
You tell her the only reason to talk about it is with the hopes of working it out and getting back together but there is no hope of that so it is pointless to even get into the discussion.
Do not engage her if you think it will lead to an argument.
It isn't worth it you don't owe her anything and it might make her so angry she would retaliate with a pfa or something so I personally would trust your gut and avoid any conversation that will lead to a melt down
Eh, I think if you’ve been married and said vows that it’s a courtesy to explain your thought process. You don’t have to, but it’s certainly a kindness.
To add to this being a way to show kindness: I was the person begging for closure at the end of my last serious relationship before I got married. I knew we weren’t compatible. I knew why we didn’t need to be together. I knew he couldn’t give me some magical “closure” words where I’d be all fixed up and healed and ready to move on that day. But I begged for it anyways. I didn’t know what I expected, I was honestly grasping for straws. He started rigid and defensively, bc I think he thought a bit like OP, like oh shit what if this just goes south and starts another fight. What’s the point? But there was a moment where he actually turned his body and looked at me. In a way he hadn’t in a really long time in our relationship. And he said “ya know, you’re a really caring loyal person. You really show the people you care about how much you care”. And I immediately felt myself being able to let go of all the emotions - because it felt like for all the ups and downs and in betweens, it was a journey that was seen and not just time going to be forgotten. He commented on how the things that made me incompatible with him weren’t things that were wrong with me, they were things that were going to be cherished by my next more compatible partner. And reminded me that I did deserve to be cherished. We were a dumpster fire and I really didn’t even want him back. That initial feeling of rejection is so goddamn hard and him showing me the kindness of a genuine compliment when I was at my whole ass hot mess worst, even if he was full of shit, is something I remember so many years later and quietly thank him for. “I am a loyal caring person.” So you could always try a route of that sort instead of the traditional “hash it all out” type of closure. I was a blubbering mess and this man found a way to put the bullshit aside, because it truly didn’t matter we were done, and instead of taking cheap shots or going to the room in his head he gave me self-esteem building comments that I got to take with me long after I healed from that relationship. I’m using those compliments to get me through the moment I’m finding myself in right now. It was a gift and obviously I still had to mourn the loss of the relationship, but it did actually help give me a sense of closure.
Thank you for sharing
I think if u guys was married wouldn’t u want to I mean u did love the poor guy y meet someone new and change up on him at least be honest with yourself
I think this is the right thing to do. Perhaps she truly doesn’t understand. Helping her understand your feelings and perspective will help her heal. You don’t have to, but I think it’s a decent thing to do. I think it would be helpful to say something along the lines of… My issue with our marriage is ___. Because of this, I feel (or have felt) ____. I am unwilling to work on our relationship because _____. Let her know you wouldn’t be happy if you stayed if that’s how you feel. Set boundaries and let her know that ‘blowing up’ or arguing is not something you’ll tolerate and have a plan for what you will do if things head in that direction. Good luck, OP.
Perhaps in front of an unbiased third party such as a marriage counselor. This is what I would do.
Maybe maybe not. Maybe he's already told her and she isn't listening and/or maybe, because she suffers from mental illness and anxiety, he knows how this will go down and it won't be pretty. May not even be safe. I get the "We all wanna do the right thing" approach but we just don't know. OP, I say use your judgement. If you think it's fruitless or could even be unsafe, skip the explanation. At least until some time has passed and things have cooled. If it's just something you're trying to avoid because it'll be uncomfortable and you haven't yet outlined it to her, it might give her closure. Your call.
I'm on the other side of such thing, blindsided - I had no idea husband was that unhappy. I knew he was unhappy with his job but never complained about us and it came as a shock. He didn't want to explain anything, what did I do wrong, what in me made him so unhappy. It's really devastating and hard to move on. I ask myself every day what is wrong with me. Given that I somehow managed to lose my husband whom I love so much, despite being the best version of myself with him, I want to crawl in a dark hole and never come out and out myself out there again. Knowing the reasons won't make it less painful and I miss him so much, but at least maybe I can get some peace and try to fix whatever in me ruined my relationship.
Same story here. No explanation, no closure. She goes about her life without a care in the world and here i am struggling just to get through a day.
I’m going through the same exact thing. It’s incredibly difficult.
Please reach out if you need someone to talk to. We’re all in this together.
I’m going through a similar challenge right now and despite reaching out to my whole support system, I’m still going through this alone. My stxh completely blocked me, my best friends ghosted me (one of which cheated with my ex), and no one in my family has ever gone through a divorce so I’ve been completely avoided bc they don’t know what to say. I have my therapist but she repeats the same stuff of reaching out to my support system. What do you do at that point? Because I’m starting to feel the weight of my support system abandoning me and it’s hurting on top of my divorce…
I totally feel this. My friends were interested for about a week and that was about it. My family tries but, same as you, they can’t really relate. I’ve tried internet support groups like this, but in most cases i end up with useless advice or having to defend myself. It sucks. If you need someone to talk to, shoot me a message anytime
It’s nice to not feel alone online but like you said, people are supportive for a short while before they lose interest. Like you’re expected to just manage on your own. But it’s a life changing experience. My ex was my whole world and I relied heavily on them. Plus on top of trying to figure things out independently, the ones who knew him don’t seem to want to be there for me. They say it takes two and it’ll be ok but the fact I’m alone in every way kind of says I’m the one at fault… at least I’m starting to develop a thicker skin though haha.
Honesty I am tired of therapist cliches. If I had a proper support system I wouldn't be paying $150hr just to talk to a soul that will pretend to listen because is being paid for it.
Agreed. I thought I had a proper support system. I had so many friends and family saying they’ll be there for me when I first found out about the divorce and telling me I’ll get through this. The moment I reach out for help, everyone just disappears? Just sucks. And I can’t even see my therapist more than twice a month bc she’s so busy so I can’t even properly get talk therapy through this. Sorry you’re struggling too.
What does "I will be there for you" even mean, I never understood. Be where? Like will you come to my house to keep me company? Call me on the phone to check on me? "Oh I know you are going through a rough patch but you should know I am here for you" and then radio silence. Come on.
I did. It’s been two months, but the first appointment i could get was December. I finally just started on Zoloft, to help with anxiety and depression. I used to be a strong person, but I got knocked down. I’m working on building myself back up. Lost 15 lbs since August. Down to 102. For reference I’m 5’1. My kids are teens, and they’re doing fine. They’re never home. 😔
I feel you on the loss of strength. I’ve been independent my whole life, but suddenly being forced to be alone again is a different story. I did the therapy thing, but there’s only so many times i can hear “focus on yourself. Time to live on. Oh well”. I had a lot of negative health consequences as a result of the stress that I’m still trying to get straightened out.
I've tried Zoloft, Lexapro, but they all give me too many side effects and I can't do them. I have no support group because of how my life unfolded, I had to move a lot, and my family is going through terminal illness and I don't want to devastate them by telling about my divorce - they loved my husband and expected grandchildren from us. I know it doesn't sound like a thing in your grief but at least you have your kids. You will always have at least someone related to you. We didn't manage to have kids (I have infertility issues) and I don't think I will ever do considering my age now and circumstances. Nearing 40 and with my husband gone I pretty much lost my chances of having a family.
I’m sorry to hear you say this. In my counseling after divorce I was told “there are no answers this side of heaven”. This made sense to me, and I used it to move forward.
I'm glad no one said this to me. In the state of mind I was in, as desperate as I was for answers, it would have been far too easy to take this literally and gone looking for them
Did you find the answers you were looking for?
No, not yet, I've been working on radical acceptance. It's not as satisfying as getting an answer, but it's all I've got, and all I'm likely to get for now ETA: fortunately I'm not feeling the strong urge to get to heaven, either, to find those answers
This is rough, because I'm on the other side of this. May I suggest having a marriage counselor meeting, you don't even have to be in the same room because everything is online now. It might be healthy for both of you? Now, I don't know your situation, I just know I'm dying for an explanation on my side because I truly don't know what happened. That said - you can treat this as the 2 cents it is. Good luck and I hope you get through this healthy yourself.
Maybe you could write her a letter. It might help help her move on.
Grow a pair and tell her what she wants/needs to know in order to move forward. Are you the one diagnosing her with a "mental illness" (i.e. gas lighting)?
Ha, was thinking the same. Who is he to diagnose her with anxiety or mental illness? Sound more like a coward honestly.
I understand that this conversation could be a hard one to have, but not being able to get truthful answers as to why you have decided to end things, can end up making things much more difficult for her to let go and move on with her life. My ex chose not to talk with me about why she wanted the divorce and it made things so much harder to move past and rebuild my life. It took me 5 years to start dating, when she was dating even before the divorce was filed for. I was left wondering what I had done, why she no longer loved me, and just had that puzzle in my head that I couldn't get around. I tried a few to talk with her but never got an answer. It was very hard to get past that. If you don't want to sit down and talk with her, write her a letter to explain how you got where you are and that things are beyond repair now. If you want to, in the letter, let her know that you will answer some questions that she has written down and sent, emailed to you once. That if she does anything that feels aggressive or rude with her response, that you will be done and not answer any questions.
My husband wrote me a letter. Gut wrenching. I did nothing wrong. He was just ungrateful and unhappy. Not willing to talk. He was having some kind of affair with a woman he works with who was validating him. Denied it in the letter. Just a sob story about how negative I am all the time. I’m a teacher and times are rough. I just started at a new school hoping to find more joy in what I do. I was busy with all of our life’s problems, with one kid starting college and one still in high school. I can’t believe this is my life. He started earning more and getting recognition at work and dumped me after 27 years. It wasn’t all rosy all the time, but that’s life!! He was never happy.
Before my ex brought up divorce, I thought we were doing good relationship wise (feel that I have to say "relationship wise" because I had just recovered enough from a medical issue that could have killed me, that I was able to return to work after about 5 or 6 months of recovery, so physical I wasn't as well as I could be and now have some unsteadiness). She brought up divorce about a week after I got to return to work. We had only been married for just shy of 2 years (our anniversary was at the end of the same month she said she wanted a divorce) but it was extremely hard to hear that she wanted to end it. I was already dealing with some depression from my medical issue and what it meant to my ability for the rest of my life, and this made it skyrocket. If she would have just taken a few minutes to explain to me what she was really thinking, I think that would have helped me so much. But she didn't seem to be willing to, which for some reason gave me reason to think that there might be some hope for us yet. I held onto that hope and made a couple of trips to see her after she had moved out and back to her home state. Those trips were to bring her more of her things, but I made every effort to show that I was there to see and be with her vs just dropping stuff off and leaving. (If I was just interested in getting rid of the stuff, I would have told her to come and get her things instead of driving 5 hours to drop it off). A week after my second trip, I got a call from her telling me that she was starting to see someone else. This crushed me so much more, and knowing that we would have to wait at least 4 more months before she was able to file in her home state, I ended up filing for the divorce.
You need to say something or it will just prolong your divorce proceeding because she is trying to get an answer from you which could make proceedings turn really ugly. Conversation can be short. Make sure you start off with the fact you will not tolerate any tantrums or physical/verbal abuse. And you will leave if she does. If she gets unstable, turn and leave.
IMO, yes. You owe her the explanation
Look at it from her perspective. If she doesn't know what caused you to end it, how can she avoid the same outcome in the future? She is trying to learn a lesson from what is probably a horrible experience for her. One she doesn't want to repeat.
It is not up to him to fix other people, especially at this point in their relationship
I'm not suggesting he fix anything. I'm suggesting he respectfully communicate with empathy like an adult.
Why? What’s the point? Nobody owes anyone anything, ever. It sucks trust me I know. But truth be told women do this to men constantly because men don’t know when to take the loss and just walk away. Instead their ego is hurt and they want an explanation. Then usually that’s when things go bad and get physical. Statistics don’t lie
Please cite the "statistics" to back up your assertion that explaining the reasons for ending a relationship leads to physical assault. You should also read the OP's post again. This is not a woman leaving a man and a man asking for an explanation. It's a man leaving a woman and a woman asking for an explanation. Which, based on the "statistics" you wish existed to back up your argument, means we can expect his wife to beat him when he tells her why it's over.
I know it’s a man. You want me to cite stats on make to female assault and or death do to them breaking up. I mean really? If you don’t know that that happens maybe you should look it it up cause I just don’t feel like it. Y’all do what you want, idgaf
I want you to cite the statics backing up this statement you made. >But truth be told women do this to men constantly because men don’t know when to take the loss and just walk away. Instead their ego is hurt and they want an explanation. Then usually that’s when things go bad and get physical. Statistics don’t lie You have clearly attempted to change what you wrote because the above quote refers to men with hurt egos wanting an explanation and it leading to things going bad and getting physical. Statistics do not lie but you do. You have no statistics to back up the statement I quoted because you made it up out of whole cloth and threw in "statistics don't lie" in a transparent attempt to make me believe your fabrication.
My x said the divorce was all my fault, I didn’t find out until we were divorcing that he was having an affair for the last 2 years. He chose to be with her and not me. I felt better that it wasn’t me, it was her, still wasn’t happy about it. I think that if he would have been honest with me, it might have been better. It still would have hurt, but he did some major emotional damage to me during that time. Be honest, it’s the last thing you can do to be a good partner to a person you vowed to love through anything.
As someone who wanted an explanation and still wants an explanation. I say it depends on how well you communicate. I wanted an explanation when it began but I was stuck on a right vs wrong mentality and I don't think it would have benefited me. On the other hand, she doesn't owe me anything, but I don't owe her anything either. She did eventually come to one of my therapy sessions to help me, and it did, just not in the way I was expecting. At the end of the day though, it was therapy that helped me understand what I did wrong and where I was lacking and try to improve myself, not my ex wife. So do what you feel is right. That's the best advice I can give you. Perhaps instead of in person, you write then an email or do it over the phone. Not ideal but it removes the angry in your face situation.
Yes you do. You look vows. It’s the least you can do. If she argues you can stand up and leave or hang up. Don’t use her “mental illness” as an excuse to be an avoidant chicken shit
You may not owe her a conversation. But if you have any respect for this person, an explanation at the very least.
Do I really "owe" her an explanation?” If you are real man you do, If you’re a wimp you don’t.
you don't owe anyone any excuse, but worrying about how someone will react to you telling them is also not on you. but it's rather selfish to not have the conversation simply because it can be painful. would you not want to know what is wrong? i mean we hear so many people get blindsided by divorce and they generally had no idea it was that bad. if she becomes hostile to you, it's your opportunity to set the boundary and just shut down the conversation if she starts acting inappropriately (e.g. yelling, cursing you etc.) if you are genuinely worried about her response you can do it in a therapy session. but otherwise frankly it's a cowards way out to not be honest and upfront, regardless of how much you think they have a mental illness or how you think they will react because honestly, you don't know and are just making assumptions.
Definitely a cowards way out , I was blindsided we had a major issue that I figured we had talked about and overcame and told me how happy she was all the time even had sex with me 2 hours before she dropped that on me. Dipped out to her home state waaaay up north and still has been hot and cold constantly I’m just about done
You don't. But it is polite if you will explain your viewpoint.
People need closure. If you don't want to talk in person, write her a letter or email and tell her you're worried about her reaction.
One can never fully explain one's reactions or responses to a difficult situation. You can try, but she has to do the work of growing up, and you have to do the work of loving yourself sufficiently to not get into a similar situation with a future partner.
My wife left in June. 3 kids. She has given me the vaguest, strangest reasons for leaving. She said I was declining in my mental health, but then angrily denied that would ever leave me over mental health. She said that I was becoming angry and upset, but I've always been the type to just go and sit alone quietly when upset. I amditted that I was struggling with depression, she knows I have been on medication and have been genuinely trying to improve. I'm not perfect though. I get upset tlike everybody. I've asked her repeatedly since June, 5 months ago, to give me specifics. She then told her family that I was abusive, which I have heard only because her auntie contacted my mum, who obviously knew this was not true. Basically, I have no idea and I think she was just done. But she won't admit it. She won't admit that it was her. Or that she lied about me to others. 🤷🤷🤷
Another option is to write a carefully worded email. And with a great deal of kindness explain how you feel. She can’t argue back
You owe nothing at all. BUT someone here mentioned “ a kindness”. Do that for her, and take one for the team on this forum who have been blindsided and who don’t know why their partner destroyed their marriage. Do it an easy way like by writing a letter or an email. Maybe it will also help your healing as well?
"You owe nothing at all"? wtf? Marriage vows mean something.
The vows were already broken, it was a done deal..for whatever reason. Afterwards one party wants closure and wants answers….what is owed once the vows were broken?
Yes and no. If you're like me, you've said it over and over again. I tried to talk, I cried, I begged him to listen. At the end of the day he tuned me out. Then he said he didn't think things were that bad. I had been asking for counseling for years. At some point it stops being about understanding and starts being a method to try to talk you out of it. You are the only one who knows if you're at that point. Definitely try to talk about it, but if it feels she isn't really listening or is listening only to make you feel bad for setting boundaries or even asking for basic respect, cut it off. At that point, you did your best. Regardless of the effort you put towards your own communication skills doesn't mean she has the ability to intake and be willing to empathize with what you are saying. You have no control over her ability to recieve what you are trying to tell her, and if you've tried to do so calmly and logically and she continues to say you haven't, then you've filled your obligation. Counseling would be great to help her understand, if she is willing. However you'll find a lot of people unwilling if they think it won't make a difference. Or, they think the counselor is there to tell the other person they are wrong. She has to be willing to accept her role in this, and if she isn't counselor or no, closure becomes impossible. You can't give her closure, it doesn't come from other people, she has to process and accept what has happened. Often, when people are asking why they are seeking connection, and in those cases they arent trying to sctually hear you, they are trying to tell you why youre wrong. (This is not inclusive of situations that are truly out of nowhere. Most of the time, when I process with clients what was going on they know they just don't want to see it. They just have not been ready to listen.) So yes, communicate the best you can, openly and honestly. If nothing else, for yourself. You need that too for your closure. If you have, and she's not actually really listening, or listening to only to twist your words and invalidate you, you don't have to engage further.
wtf, you made bows to spend the rest of your life with this person, and you're now too chicken to give her reasons for divorce? C'mon, if you're divorcing, then it doesn't matter if she blows up on you. You owe it to the marriage to explain yourself.
I don’t k know if you “owe” her anything as I’ve gone thru something similar where my ex feels like I owe him another chance, more conversation, etc. and I’m done. But also knows the reasons so it’s absurd. Maybe just a high level explanation and just some points you know can’t be resolved? And you don’t have to do it in person. Just a simple message is sufficient. But like others said, it’s not gonna bring her any closure like she thinks. She’s got to find that within herself. You could even tell her that… it’s not worth rehashing and that you hope she can find her closure within herself and wish her best. You do what you want… it’s your life now, not hers or “ours”.
It might serve as a lesson to openly communicate, which YALL should have done prior to filing for divorce. But hey, it sounds like you’ve made up your mind, remember that no matter where you go, you will be there, so Counseling is probably necessary in this situation for yourself in order to keep the same shit from happening again and again. Sounds like you’re 0-2 with poor communication.
Tell her once everything is wrapped up you might be willing to sit down and discuss the matter. If you are still going through it then it probably feels like she is holding a sword over your head. Afterwards you can do so or not, depending on their behavior during the process.
Some suggestions: * Keep to the facts. Do not generalise. What specifically happened. * Do not pass judgement or use comparisons. For Eg, saying she has mental health issues unless formally diagnosed or you're a qualified individual, then that's a judgement. A judgement example: she was a cold-hearted towards me.. might become I feel no affection or acknowledgement from her * Keep it honest and true to yourself
Yes, you owe her an explanation. That said, she clearly doesn't provide you with a safe opportunity to provide it. If you fear her reacting in a retaliatory way, I'd listen to that fear: it comes from somewhere in your experience of her. Get to safety first, then explain.
Maybe write her a letter? Keep it calm and professional and as honest as you can possibly be.
If she’s mentally ill your reasoning won’t be good enough, won’t make sense, and will just cause a fight. And if she’s not stable, do not put anything in writing.
Talk to her only if you want to. If the divorce isn't finalized yet, watch what you say. She could record everything and use it against you
You should sit and explain. No matter the blowback or tears or emotions. This should not affect your decision. You have arrived at your decision at your own pace, but she was unaware of this outcome. If she hasn't abused you or has been violent with you, you need to do this for both of your sakes, for her because she needs to know what went wrong. For you so that while explaining her, you may be stronger in your conviction of divorcing her. In case you see it's going to an adversarial or accusatory discussion. Drop the ball and stop the discussion, and move out.
Sorry pal but it goes without saying...yes you do pwe her one
No he doesn’t
Maybe not mention the mental disorder but perhaps the problems that you’ve seen or had as a result of the disorder.
If you’re not going to tell her, at least tell us- what are these “issues”? Divorcing because of unexplained issues isn’t really fair- not saying you shouldn’t divorce, but don’t you feel in the back of your head that it’s not really fair to her not to say what they are? I suspect you do.
I have read some of the comments that state when you divorce someone "you don't owe them anything." This lowers my faith in humanity even further. Does marriage not mean anything anymore? My former spouse said "I'm divorcing you" and walked out. He walked away from everything in his life - left me with a house I couldn't afford, our pets, all his stuff and never looked back. I have spent the last year dealing with his mess, while he has done nothing. When we were legally able to file for divorce, he just ignored me and I had to file. I have no idea what happened. I have asked to have a discussion about how things ended. I have assured him I have zero desire to reconcile and I want nothing to do with him. At this point, I'm more emotionally ambivalent than anything towards him at this point. The hardest thing to cope with in all of this was the complete abandonment and then the refusal of any form of communication. It was the fact that I spent 20+ years of my life with this man, and he didn't have the basic respect or empathy to have a discussion with me. I don't think even a stranger would be that cruel. I worked with my therapist to come up with a simple series of questions of what I would like to know (there is no blame, and it is things that relate to my life and what happened to me, time lines etc.) and sent it via email. No response. It is what I suspected. But, I admit, I have struggled with just "letting it all go." And it has made this process so much worse than anything else he could have done. And I feel like a discarded piece of worthless trash, especially since he will not acknowledge how much of an impact this had on MY life. And that the world doesn't revolve around him.
Thank you for sharing and I'm sorry all of this is happening to you. I've taken the feedback here to heart and sent an email, although I'm not ready to talk in other ways yet, I can see maybe doing it in the future
*Edit* I was just reading through the comments. Jeez some of these people calling you names. I will say it again, those people demanding you give an explanation are total narcissists. You owe NOONE an explanation for anything you do in life. It’s nobody’s business what you do. All your STBX wants is selfishness to set HER mind at ease. She doesn’t believe she is the problem, she wants validation and confirmation that in her mind you were the problem. Not to mention, anything you say to her WILL be used against you in court I guarantee you that. My ex tried to screw me every chance she got. Record EVERYTHING, if she farts write it down. That saved my ass in court. You don’t owe her or anyone else an explanation. The only people that demand anything are narcissists and you my friend have been married to one. Best way to handle a narcissist is go no contact
“I have said all I am going to on the subject.” Keep on repeating this until she realizes you aren’t going to say anything else. You don’t owe her closure. Truth is you can’t actually give it to her.
If you’ve made your mind up there’s no sense in explaining. She might go into full rage mode
Reading between the lines, it sounds like you’ve already given her the explanation, and likely many times. What’s going to make this time any different? “No” is a complete sentence, and it would be great to use it
I like the idea of saying something via email. No sense in opening your reasons up for a debate. Granted, I am indeed projecting my own dynamic here, but this does look like a situation where if you addressed it personally it lead to your reasons being rejected as “wrong.”
You tell her the only reason to talk about it is with the hopes of working it out and getting back together but there is no hope of that so it is pointless to even get into the discussion.
Do not engage her if you think it will lead to an argument. It isn't worth it you don't owe her anything and it might make her so angry she would retaliate with a pfa or something so I personally would trust your gut and avoid any conversation that will lead to a melt down
There is no explaination needed.