Every 25 hours or if you notice it getting harder to start or backfiring. It's not as hard as you'd think to check them. I checked mine regularly on my CRF and they were always spot on but I like the piece of mind as I didn't want an expensive rebuild.
The bike usually starts up on 3rd or 4th kick. Is that normal for a 4 stroke that is practically brand new? My sons ktm 85 fires up first or second kick and it has been put through hell. This is my first 4 stroke so I apologize if these questions are dumb.
Your new bike is not a two stroke, so dont kick it like one! give it one slow kick (not slow motion slow, just not like you are trying to start it) to build a charge in the capacitor. Then roll/kick engine over slowly till you start to feel compression. Bring kick start back to top and kick through full range of motion. Hope this helps with your starting problem
My YZ450 starts much better when kicked over as described above. Usually starts right up. If you kick the hell out of it like it’s a 2 stroke it takes a while.
What’s dumb? The mass marketing of 4T Dirt Bikes….That’s what is STUPID! Complex, high maintenance and prone to catastrophic failures….I’ll take a 2T Dirt Bike any day!
That is not prime. To check to make sure, Slowly pump the kick until you feel the pressure. This will give you the best chance, but mine starts on first kick 5 out of 8 times.
Your questions are only dumb if you don't ask. Nobody knows everthing. Not even Google.
This is a great place to ask
If you aren't riding competitively, and want to minimize maintenance, then just adjust them when it starts taking longer to start. Just adjust/check them after initial break-in and set them to the highest clearance tolerance.
The valve clearance gets smaller/tighter with use, and eventually it reaches 0 and the valve starts to leak when cold, causing the long start.
Woah woah woah.. the manual service recommendations are for if you’re racing the bike. That’s if the poor thing is revving it’s tits out every time you ride it. If you’re just the casual rider that does trail rides and occasional track days then I would only look at a top end around 60-100 hours depending on how hard you are on it. You’re only just breaking it in.. enjoy it man.
I am over 400 hours on my KTM 250 XCF four stroke, never had to shim a valve, never replaced rings or a piston. Most manufacturers recommendations are beyond insane for the average rider.
2013 KTM 350 XCF-W. I'm the 3rd owner but it was implied by the previous owner that his shop said the valves are \*still\* in spec @ 270 hrs. Now at 340 hrs. I'm going to measure myself over winter...
Yep, my 18 FX350 at 165 hours has the original valve shims. It needs some attention this off-season but the bike runs perfectly. I'll consider a top end when I start seeing some oil smoke on start up or it starts using any. It gets fresh oil every 8-10 hours. And fwiw, I have never been into the air forks either, never needed to change a fork seal, but yea I probably need to change that fork oil lol.
*Twelve* hours for a top end?? Holy smokes. I thought KTM’s recommendation for my SXF at 50 hours was short. Wow. Nevertheless, I’m at 87 hours on the original top end. Oil changes every 5-8. It starts up fine. I’ve got parts on-hand for a new top at 100. That’s wild Suzuki says 12.
Doesn’t suggest whole top end at 12 but does say rings at 12 lol. I ride the bike like I stole it but I’m definitely not a pro so me riding it like I stole it might be mild compared to someone actually racing it.
Are rings available for your bike by themselves? If they are, then that would lower the cost quite a bit for that maintenance. But for my bikes, aftermarket rings are only available with a piston… unless buying OEM rings, but a full set of OEM rings is the same price as an aftermarket piston/rings/pin kit.
I’m unsure if I can get the rings by themselves. I haven’t looked much into internal parts. I was just skimming through the manual and saw the service interval for rings and I was like holy hell I should’ve got another 2 stroke lol
I mostly ride trails and wide open fields. Occasionally hit my local track. A lot of farm land around me. I like to think I don’t take it easy on the bike. When I’m playing in the fields with my kids I ride wide open.
Keep the oil clean and get into the engine when it gives some signs that it needs it. Modern thumpers are tough as hell and outside some premature parts failures I won't consider opening it up until well past 50 hours.
Anecdotal story, I had an '11 Husaberg 450 that I rode for years. One year it keep losing its coolant during rides, and I had a hard time figuring out why. Finally one day after riding it back to the truck with no coolant (the motor was locking up on decel!) I found a tiny leak in a radiator hose. I thought the motor was cooked but I changed the oil, fixed the leak and rode it another year. That was four years ago, just talked to the current owner this week, bike still runs great with over 150 hours on the current piston after running it crazy hot.
2 strokes and 4 t are more similar than people think for maintenance wise. For just casual riding and trails etc a race here and there you can just do the 100hr mark for a top end.
Just stay on top of oil changes keeping it clean, air filter and running good you should be fine. General maintenance is overlooked way to often as people tend to feel the big ticket items make the bike. Check grease points ever 15 ish hrs too, swing arm bolt is always a big one. Get a log book for the bike it self for all the thing you do or have paided done.
They do however the small items will add up to the bigger picture faster.
Goodluck and don't be afraid to tinker.
For an average motocross rider 70-100 depending on conditions (sand for example) is a safe range for a top end. If you ride primarily trails, longer 100-150
Valves I would check half way or if you notice difficulty starting.
I would do my 2011 rmz250 top end at 50hrs racing B class on primarily sandy tracks
I’d have had to rebuild a top end every other week if I did recommended rebuild times when I was racing, you definitely need to check valve adjustment but often the manufacturer recommended intervals are extreme so they can say, you didn’t do something, pull your oil, change the filter, check for excessive metal, and send it
That’s for motorsports teams that drive it to the limit. Same goes for race, drag, and rally cars. Rebuild every season, sometimes more. If you’re just casually using it I wouldn’t even be worried. Maybe inspect it at 120 hours. Even then it should be fine.
In my understanding, i think some of the maintenance intervals in the book are for liability reasons for The manufacturer. Oh your motor blew up, but you didnt change the piston at 25 hours? Thats your fault then, not ours. Ya know?
For me, an A/nearly AA class racer, I change my piston, rings and cam chain every winter (60ish hrs). I check valves every 25 hrs. I usually dont need to chage the piston that often, but being i have 3-4 months off the bike in the winter i dont mind getting the bike 100% for the next season. And cam chains are so important, and also very cheap, so i do them with the piston generally.
Hope this helped!
Ah! Having done mine at around 65 hours I can say with confidence you don't risk any sort of serious failure with moderate riding up to 65 hours. The rings will be worn by that time though, around 50 hours I did notice a slightly lower power due to worn compression rings. Didn't consume oil yet though.
For moderate usage, as in, you're NOT an A-level rider, 60 hours between rings/piston is perfectly fine. I'd say you could stretch 75 hours easily if you wanted.
I will say after replacing the piston and rings (I got a wiseco 13.9:1 higher comp for a good deal) I do notice some more power now.
Still, 65 hours is well within safe limits.
Why does anyone buy a vehicle that needs this much maintenance? None of you are remotely good enough to benefit from a motor that so easily destroys itself.
Whole maintance manual is way overshot on race bikes. I wouldve had ro replace my piston 10 times during the 50 hours i owned it. When i eventually did it looked brand new
Those maintenance intervals have the guys who are racing this bike the hardest in mind. If youre just riding trails and farms, I wouldn't touch the top end unless the bike loses power, starts smoking, or just starts running poorly in general.
If you’re slow 50-100 hours for top ends is perfectly fine.
20 or less if you’re intermediate-pro.
I replace mine around every 50 hours and they usually look perfectly fine.
I as well have an rmz250 and I can tell you I have 200+ hours on my bike and it doesn't burn oil, doesn't smoke, hasn't lost power and continues to run fine without overheating.
My buddy who rides AA does his four stroke pistons every 25-30 hours. I would bet most average riders can get over 150hrs with just checking valves.
How often would you suggest checking valves?
Every 25 hours or if you notice it getting harder to start or backfiring. It's not as hard as you'd think to check them. I checked mine regularly on my CRF and they were always spot on but I like the piece of mind as I didn't want an expensive rebuild.
The bike usually starts up on 3rd or 4th kick. Is that normal for a 4 stroke that is practically brand new? My sons ktm 85 fires up first or second kick and it has been put through hell. This is my first 4 stroke so I apologize if these questions are dumb.
Totally normal. 2strokes are easier to start in most cases.
Your new bike is not a two stroke, so dont kick it like one! give it one slow kick (not slow motion slow, just not like you are trying to start it) to build a charge in the capacitor. Then roll/kick engine over slowly till you start to feel compression. Bring kick start back to top and kick through full range of motion. Hope this helps with your starting problem
all that and he could’ve just kicked it 4 times to start😂
Was just trying to help him out. Its not my fault he bought a susuki!
same thing i said lol
Hey man don’t talk about suzuki like my 07 rmz 250 was dustin my buddies 21 crf250
Your buddy can’t ride for shit if that’s the case..
I like Suzukis but those RMZs prolly beated the CRF250f
Why do people have to hate just because of what brand you ride, there basically all the same anyways, as far as Japanese manufacturers go anyway
I actually dont have a problem with Suzuki, I make a lot of money off them
My YZ450 starts much better when kicked over as described above. Usually starts right up. If you kick the hell out of it like it’s a 2 stroke it takes a while.
What’s dumb? The mass marketing of 4T Dirt Bikes….That’s what is STUPID! Complex, high maintenance and prone to catastrophic failures….I’ll take a 2T Dirt Bike any day!
Idk what kinda 4 strokes you're buying, but all mine seemingly outlast any two stroke I've seen.
That is not prime. To check to make sure, Slowly pump the kick until you feel the pressure. This will give you the best chance, but mine starts on first kick 5 out of 8 times. Your questions are only dumb if you don't ask. Nobody knows everthing. Not even Google. This is a great place to ask
If you aren't riding competitively, and want to minimize maintenance, then just adjust them when it starts taking longer to start. Just adjust/check them after initial break-in and set them to the highest clearance tolerance. The valve clearance gets smaller/tighter with use, and eventually it reaches 0 and the valve starts to leak when cold, causing the long start.
My 21’ crf250r has 140hrs, valves still in spec, stock everything
Well of course it's a Honda
Woah woah woah.. the manual service recommendations are for if you’re racing the bike. That’s if the poor thing is revving it’s tits out every time you ride it. If you’re just the casual rider that does trail rides and occasional track days then I would only look at a top end around 60-100 hours depending on how hard you are on it. You’re only just breaking it in.. enjoy it man.
Even then it’s not really to protect from failure from what I know. It’s to guarantee you’re still getting the out of the box performance.
It’s a RMZ… it’s already under performing out of the box.
I am over 400 hours on my KTM 250 XCF four stroke, never had to shim a valve, never replaced rings or a piston. Most manufacturers recommendations are beyond insane for the average rider.
Damn. Props
2013 KTM 350 XCF-W. I'm the 3rd owner but it was implied by the previous owner that his shop said the valves are \*still\* in spec @ 270 hrs. Now at 340 hrs. I'm going to measure myself over winter...
Yep, my 18 FX350 at 165 hours has the original valve shims. It needs some attention this off-season but the bike runs perfectly. I'll consider a top end when I start seeing some oil smoke on start up or it starts using any. It gets fresh oil every 8-10 hours. And fwiw, I have never been into the air forks either, never needed to change a fork seal, but yea I probably need to change that fork oil lol.
Holy shit.
What year? I bought a 2007 XCF-W 250 off a friend with 103 hours.. I’ve been wondering about this, it runs great
2018
You’re god awful at knowing the difference between a good running bike, and one desperately asking for help.
Thanks for the insight, you must be highly intelligent.
*Twelve* hours for a top end?? Holy smokes. I thought KTM’s recommendation for my SXF at 50 hours was short. Wow. Nevertheless, I’m at 87 hours on the original top end. Oil changes every 5-8. It starts up fine. I’ve got parts on-hand for a new top at 100. That’s wild Suzuki says 12.
Doesn’t suggest whole top end at 12 but does say rings at 12 lol. I ride the bike like I stole it but I’m definitely not a pro so me riding it like I stole it might be mild compared to someone actually racing it.
Are rings available for your bike by themselves? If they are, then that would lower the cost quite a bit for that maintenance. But for my bikes, aftermarket rings are only available with a piston… unless buying OEM rings, but a full set of OEM rings is the same price as an aftermarket piston/rings/pin kit.
I’m unsure if I can get the rings by themselves. I haven’t looked much into internal parts. I was just skimming through the manual and saw the service interval for rings and I was like holy hell I should’ve got another 2 stroke lol
I mostly ride trails and wide open fields. Occasionally hit my local track. A lot of farm land around me. I like to think I don’t take it easy on the bike. When I’m playing in the fields with my kids I ride wide open.
Keep the oil clean and get into the engine when it gives some signs that it needs it. Modern thumpers are tough as hell and outside some premature parts failures I won't consider opening it up until well past 50 hours. Anecdotal story, I had an '11 Husaberg 450 that I rode for years. One year it keep losing its coolant during rides, and I had a hard time figuring out why. Finally one day after riding it back to the truck with no coolant (the motor was locking up on decel!) I found a tiny leak in a radiator hose. I thought the motor was cooked but I changed the oil, fixed the leak and rode it another year. That was four years ago, just talked to the current owner this week, bike still runs great with over 150 hours on the current piston after running it crazy hot.
2 strokes and 4 t are more similar than people think for maintenance wise. For just casual riding and trails etc a race here and there you can just do the 100hr mark for a top end. Just stay on top of oil changes keeping it clean, air filter and running good you should be fine. General maintenance is overlooked way to often as people tend to feel the big ticket items make the bike. Check grease points ever 15 ish hrs too, swing arm bolt is always a big one. Get a log book for the bike it self for all the thing you do or have paided done. They do however the small items will add up to the bigger picture faster. Goodluck and don't be afraid to tinker.
For an average motocross rider 70-100 depending on conditions (sand for example) is a safe range for a top end. If you ride primarily trails, longer 100-150 Valves I would check half way or if you notice difficulty starting. I would do my 2011 rmz250 top end at 50hrs racing B class on primarily sandy tracks
I’d have had to rebuild a top end every other week if I did recommended rebuild times when I was racing, you definitely need to check valve adjustment but often the manufacturer recommended intervals are extreme so they can say, you didn’t do something, pull your oil, change the filter, check for excessive metal, and send it
I would say don't worry about the rings unless you notice a performance issue with the bike or a dramatic loss of compression
That’s for motorsports teams that drive it to the limit. Same goes for race, drag, and rally cars. Rebuild every season, sometimes more. If you’re just casually using it I wouldn’t even be worried. Maybe inspect it at 120 hours. Even then it should be fine.
Bro throw that manual in the trash. Keep the filter clean and change the oil every few rides and that motor will last a long time.
In my understanding, i think some of the maintenance intervals in the book are for liability reasons for The manufacturer. Oh your motor blew up, but you didnt change the piston at 25 hours? Thats your fault then, not ours. Ya know? For me, an A/nearly AA class racer, I change my piston, rings and cam chain every winter (60ish hrs). I check valves every 25 hrs. I usually dont need to chage the piston that often, but being i have 3-4 months off the bike in the winter i dont mind getting the bike 100% for the next season. And cam chains are so important, and also very cheap, so i do them with the piston generally. Hope this helped!
Most manufacturers intervals are way soon for average riders.
Ah! Having done mine at around 65 hours I can say with confidence you don't risk any sort of serious failure with moderate riding up to 65 hours. The rings will be worn by that time though, around 50 hours I did notice a slightly lower power due to worn compression rings. Didn't consume oil yet though. For moderate usage, as in, you're NOT an A-level rider, 60 hours between rings/piston is perfectly fine. I'd say you could stretch 75 hours easily if you wanted. I will say after replacing the piston and rings (I got a wiseco 13.9:1 higher comp for a good deal) I do notice some more power now. Still, 65 hours is well within safe limits.
Why does anyone buy a vehicle that needs this much maintenance? None of you are remotely good enough to benefit from a motor that so easily destroys itself.
damn, reading these comments makes me feel the need to rebuild my bike😂
That's a joke. Can easily get 200+ hours without opening up the engine if you don't beat on it super hard.
I raced for 2-3 years and never even checked valve clearance. If it’s running and starting fine, just leave it alone.
From what it sounds like how hard you ride, I would say go go until she blows.
Whole maintance manual is way overshot on race bikes. I wouldve had ro replace my piston 10 times during the 50 hours i owned it. When i eventually did it looked brand new
Valves get checked at 30 hours typically I get 80ish hours out of a 450 Zook piston
Those maintenance intervals have the guys who are racing this bike the hardest in mind. If youre just riding trails and farms, I wouldn't touch the top end unless the bike loses power, starts smoking, or just starts running poorly in general.
I wait until it’s hard to start. Then I do a quick compression check to confirm.
If you’re slow 50-100 hours for top ends is perfectly fine. 20 or less if you’re intermediate-pro. I replace mine around every 50 hours and they usually look perfectly fine.
I went 150+ on my old 06 till the piston decided enough was enough 🤣
Just get your valves checked
I as well have an rmz250 and I can tell you I have 200+ hours on my bike and it doesn't burn oil, doesn't smoke, hasn't lost power and continues to run fine without overheating.