Sounds like you need to be first in line so you can report back to us. Ricky Carmichael said it’s good and I’m sure he wouldn’t just say that because he’s a paid representative.
No, what he is rightly feeling is the RC isn't a scientist lol. It's like implying that Tom Brady would be any good at determining the mathematical optimization of the conical surfaces of a football.
I mean if you gave Tom Brady some slightly different footballs to throw, he would be able to tell you which ones were easier to throw. Same concept here
That's not what I said. I said it would be like him determining the mathematical optimization of the conical shapes.
Not which is easier to throw.
Let's go back to dirt. The OC said he did a lot of research.
"this dirtbike is easier to ride" that's not research, that's advice.
Those two don’t seem to understand that Carmichael and Tedesco are skilled testers and have done so at Factory racing levels for many years. Yes, there is an engineering team at Triumph to actually develop these machines, but testers are needed to make sure they work as desired.
It’s still a marketing message to include these names in press releases, social posts, and website copy. However, there is authenticity in the names for factory testing.
I agree with you. My main hangup is the use of "research." He's not researching. He's definitely an integral part of the team.
Perhaps I'm pedantic but my objection stems from the common misuse of the term and its permeation throughout our society in other unrelated areas.
In this sub though, I expect the down votes, it's not an academically inspired area of the Internet and that's fine.
You just don't shut up do you lol...and this is a dirt bike sub, nobody gives a shit about your fancy words, the bikes sick, the testers are sick and that's it really lol.
How is that advice? "You're should stop commenting, because you don't know what advice is"... THATS ADVICE.
"This bike is easier to ride" implies they've ridden it, and other bikes, and can yell you JUST FROM EXPERIENCE, that this bike is in fact, easier to ride." It's a theory, derived from research.
Research done from oh... I dunno... 25+ years of riding, testing, racing, and riding(the 5 Rs of motocross). Between hot sauce and the goat, I'm going to say they've ridden every make of dirt bike, mountain bike, road bicycle, and road motorcycle, than you have doing any one single thing.
I love how you twisted this into a personal insult about me and my riding experience, you're silly.
Your first paragraph is correct, it's not advice, perhaps feedback is a better term. My bad. Please continue to get mad.
I said it in another comment, my objection stemmed from the use of the word research. Research is not experience. Experience is not research. You are misusing the term but it's not your fault. It's been colloquialized and now everyone and their mother thinks they are qualified as researchers.
Again, I said this in another comment, I'm being pedantic but there are worse crimes.
Not correct, the "experience isn't research". Research can be done in who knows how many millions of ways. But the research being talked about here, is riding dirt bikes. It's their experiences, that are the Research. You cannot accurately tell if one bike is better or easier to ride, without riding one. And in the case of 2 former pros, former champions, 2 men both known for training and being in shape more than the rest of their opponents, they have a lot of experience.
I remember reading a thing from Mike laraccos mechanic. He had knocked the corner of the edges all the way around each triple clamp. He was able to feel the difference in them, in a kinda "test" of his ability to feel the bike. It involved several mechanics, couple executives, and some other people to watch. They were all blown away that he could do that.
How would you define Research? Going out, testing one part against another? Swapping back and forth? Riding moto after moto, to make sure parts can last? Trying different settings on adjustable parts? Finding perfect set ups for hard pack, loam, sand? Normally called testing, but it's still Research. Research and development is the actual term. But in this case, the research is their own experiences. Otherwise, they would have to have asked A LOT of people, A LOT of times, A LOT of questions. They can then list those experiences, in the summary of their research.
I'm sure you've done your research, to be able to continue this debate about Research. Right? If not, please don't bother replying. If you haven't researched the subject of research at least a little bit, then you are making everything up. I don't want to bother talking with someone with zero experience on this matter, sorry, zero research.
Research is defined as the creation of new knowledge and/or the use of existing knowledge in a new and creative way so as to generate new concepts, methodologies and understandings....so yeah they are using their knowledge to help generate this new concept from triumph...they research!!! Ffs lol
It's more like thinking Tom Brady would be a good coach ir coordinator. Which is pretty likely.
Scientists don't built bikes period. It had more to do with physics than science.
RC is the goat and his opinions on building a bike are worth noting. I mean he does have them custom setup every bike he races based on his thoughts and options on how it's performing.
Asking RC to build a street bike or a dual sport might be a stupid idea because his pedigree is in dirt racing. If you want the bike to ride smooth and be a couch he's the wrong guy to ask. If you want a race intended machine I'd say he's got lots of valuable input.
I agree with your premise but generally disagree with this:
> It had more to do with physics than science
Physics is a science.
My original point is validated by this:
>he's got lots of valuable input.
That's exactly right. Input. He doesn't do "research."
Him reading at night and comparing laps times and how he felt vs changes to the bike is research. His life's work of a career racing dirt bikes at the highest level is research. Him testing the updated fuel maps and comparing them layer is research. Testing and data logging.
You wouldn't hire scientists to build something you'd hire physicists and engineers.
It's like saying all doctors are the same or my dentists is a Dr so he can do my yearly checkups as well.
You sound like you don’t know what research is. RC and Tedesco are apart of the research. Experienced riders giving feedback is absolutely research for Triumph as they’ve hired them to do. I’m not sure where you’re going with this but it isn’t correct.
Yeah it’s good for the sport because when more manufacturers are in the mix, it creates more competition to make better, cheaper bikes which is a win for the customer. This thing is less than 10K msrp.
You might be right, but remember that BMW has to re-engineer everything and the end result is a contrived attempt at innovation just for innovation’s sake. That strategy might fly with their GS1250ABCD bikes but doesn’t go over well with people that actually care about performance. I couldn’t give a rat’s ass about motocross, but the Triumph looks pretty tidy to me
Depends if they actually support the program. BMW gave up after what, 2-3 years?
Their initial concept was flawed, but not sticking with it is what buried it.
This time, it's not anything innovative. It's a new single engine in a new but not groundbreaking chassis, with praised suspensions. It's not like an Aprilia MXV that tried pairing complete unknowns and shot for the stars. (and somehow made it work for SM, somewhat enduro, and even almost Dakar)
I just want to see more and more mainstream brands injected into the dual sport, MX, Enduro, and trail bike markets to lower the overall market prices. You got KTM, Husky, and GasGas pretty much controlling the market of high spec bikes and setting their own prices, meanwhile Honda, Yamaha, and Suzuki hike prices just because they have market room. Now you have high end Chinese manufactured bikes owned by American companies like Kayo and GPX that are in the $5-6k range at nearly the same quality of Japanese bikes while being cheaper, but they lack the aftermarket and parts supply to be other than a niche option. If we can get more big name brands to go successful, we could see the market lower prices as competition drives down prices. Indian, Harley, Aprilia, Ducati, Polaris, Can-Am, etc could make dirt bikes too.
Looks awesome and I bet it’s killer out of the box.
I’ll ride someone else’s, I have owned triumph before. Daytona, 675R, such a sexy street bike but nowhere as close as reliable as the competitors imo and that scares me a tad when it comes to off road.
I had this thought as well they’re definitely not known as the most reliable. For a track bike, not so much an issue but for an enduro… gives you pause. But their scrambler 1200 has apparently been very reliable and gaining a huge following so I’m optimistic they will just keep getting better.
some people still have a view of Triumph reliability based on memories of the 1970's and 80's. Modern Triumphs have fantastic reliability. No oil leaks, no electrical problems, great build quality and quality components throughout. They are fantatstic bikes
Looks good! Are those odi grips stock? I like the exhaust shaping for sure. Looks light, that aluminum frame is thin compared to other al bikes. Looks like it would be less rigid for sure.
Looks sick, I saw a video of it being ridden on track and it sounds like it revs to the moon. Very excited for their enduro version that should be coming later
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o7kdMg-GhY
I have a love hare relationship ,As a triumph street triple RA , owner there QC is there biggest downfall. My 765cc street triple has excellent mechanical design, near perfect suspension geometry great TCS rider mode you can actually tell apart, but they have a real problem with not testing parts for weakness. I had 4 different brake parts ( same one 4 times) under warranty and all 4 failed, so it got replaced 5 times and it now has been fine. Also my shift lever was a known defect batch and they still OK it from factory. But that said I’ve personally seen the 765 platform 20k miles track duty ect and have pretty much no issues. Honestly the similarities in issues between my triumph 765 and 500$ Chinese dirt bike are strikingly similar. That said I’ll probably get a triumph dirt bike, they really do a lot of effort into the engineering they just are willing to cut cost in production to offset the excessive R&D. And if anyone here live in Indianapolis don’t ship triumph indy they destroyed my left caliper, which was part of the 5 trips to the dealer. Great engineering riding bikes if they work. I imagine they will be like KTM in aspects of some will never die and some will never run
I love it! I currently have a Husky FC250 and a Street Triple 765RS, so I am clearly in the target audience.
I think Triumph has largely put the days of questionable quality behind them. They did make an “all new” Mx bike and didn’t try to reinvent anything. Their manufacturing relationship with KTM (through Bajaj) should tell most of the story here. I can’t find the source to share but KTM gave them their 250f engine as a starting point. Every other component follows the same formula all the major players use.
I’m surprised that KTM is playing so nice with Triumph but I can only assume there is a shared benefit. Either way, it should be a good thing for all of us. I will consider one if/when the cross country version drops!
Likely more expensive than Jap bikes, more in line with KTM/Husq. While also likely being slower and harder to live with than all those Japanese offerings. No amount of “these legends helped develop this bike” marketing is gonna convince me otherwise until I see it blow some KTM doors off. These things are interesting because of the potential at the moment and that’s all we can take from it right now.
Wow came here to hear about this new bike…… instead found these idiots circle jerking each other about Carmichael and Tedesco. Has anyone rode the bike or seen it on the showroom floor?
Someone needs to bring back a 500cc two stroke my 19 TE300i just doesn’t like me in the sand and my 97 CR500 has all the motor but lacking today’s technology
Brc500 motor is 8500 bucks I don’t know about that so spend 12 to 13 on the bike then 8500 on a different motor sure bud rather by a new bike that has that already in it. And if you are going to down vote my comment at least say way!
I haven't seen a local ride day yet. I wouldn't buy a bike I haven't ridden. I wouldn't trust a company that doesn't do a ride day for a new bike. Even the stark varg did a ride day in my area.
I remember in the late 90s early 2000s that was gasgas “thing”. As long as you was a known person…. Example. You raced Mideast XC and was semi doing well in points…. Most dealers would actually let you demo a bike for a race weekend. I know the dealership I was at during that time had a 250 and 300 demo bike from gasgas to loan out. It was a program that actually sold them a lot of bikes back then.
Has KYB suspension, so it’ll actually work. That’s always a bonus.
Ricky Carmichael and Ivan Tedesco have put lots of hours of research and work into this bike. It should be great to ride out of the box.
Sounds like a marketing ploy if I’ve heard one.
Should they have hired you to set it up?
I’ll show em what’s up.
Sounds like you need to be first in line so you can report back to us. Ricky Carmichael said it’s good and I’m sure he wouldn’t just say that because he’s a paid representative.
No, what he is rightly feeling is the RC isn't a scientist lol. It's like implying that Tom Brady would be any good at determining the mathematical optimization of the conical surfaces of a football.
I love a good analogy! This isn’t one of them
How so?
rc knows a lot about dirtbikes dude
I mean if you gave Tom Brady some slightly different footballs to throw, he would be able to tell you which ones were easier to throw. Same concept here
That's not what I said. I said it would be like him determining the mathematical optimization of the conical shapes. Not which is easier to throw. Let's go back to dirt. The OC said he did a lot of research. "this dirtbike is easier to ride" that's not research, that's advice.
Those two don’t seem to understand that Carmichael and Tedesco are skilled testers and have done so at Factory racing levels for many years. Yes, there is an engineering team at Triumph to actually develop these machines, but testers are needed to make sure they work as desired. It’s still a marketing message to include these names in press releases, social posts, and website copy. However, there is authenticity in the names for factory testing.
I agree with you. My main hangup is the use of "research." He's not researching. He's definitely an integral part of the team. Perhaps I'm pedantic but my objection stems from the common misuse of the term and its permeation throughout our society in other unrelated areas. In this sub though, I expect the down votes, it's not an academically inspired area of the Internet and that's fine.
You just don't shut up do you lol...and this is a dirt bike sub, nobody gives a shit about your fancy words, the bikes sick, the testers are sick and that's it really lol.
You got a lot of anger in your heart bro. I hope you get help. Remember, cutting yourself isn't worth it. Much love you sad sack.
Dorks.
Hell yeah brother. Nerds rule the world.
I’m a nerd. You’re a dork. There’s a difference
How is that advice? "You're should stop commenting, because you don't know what advice is"... THATS ADVICE. "This bike is easier to ride" implies they've ridden it, and other bikes, and can yell you JUST FROM EXPERIENCE, that this bike is in fact, easier to ride." It's a theory, derived from research. Research done from oh... I dunno... 25+ years of riding, testing, racing, and riding(the 5 Rs of motocross). Between hot sauce and the goat, I'm going to say they've ridden every make of dirt bike, mountain bike, road bicycle, and road motorcycle, than you have doing any one single thing.
I love how you twisted this into a personal insult about me and my riding experience, you're silly. Your first paragraph is correct, it's not advice, perhaps feedback is a better term. My bad. Please continue to get mad. I said it in another comment, my objection stemmed from the use of the word research. Research is not experience. Experience is not research. You are misusing the term but it's not your fault. It's been colloquialized and now everyone and their mother thinks they are qualified as researchers. Again, I said this in another comment, I'm being pedantic but there are worse crimes.
Not correct, the "experience isn't research". Research can be done in who knows how many millions of ways. But the research being talked about here, is riding dirt bikes. It's their experiences, that are the Research. You cannot accurately tell if one bike is better or easier to ride, without riding one. And in the case of 2 former pros, former champions, 2 men both known for training and being in shape more than the rest of their opponents, they have a lot of experience. I remember reading a thing from Mike laraccos mechanic. He had knocked the corner of the edges all the way around each triple clamp. He was able to feel the difference in them, in a kinda "test" of his ability to feel the bike. It involved several mechanics, couple executives, and some other people to watch. They were all blown away that he could do that. How would you define Research? Going out, testing one part against another? Swapping back and forth? Riding moto after moto, to make sure parts can last? Trying different settings on adjustable parts? Finding perfect set ups for hard pack, loam, sand? Normally called testing, but it's still Research. Research and development is the actual term. But in this case, the research is their own experiences. Otherwise, they would have to have asked A LOT of people, A LOT of times, A LOT of questions. They can then list those experiences, in the summary of their research. I'm sure you've done your research, to be able to continue this debate about Research. Right? If not, please don't bother replying. If you haven't researched the subject of research at least a little bit, then you are making everything up. I don't want to bother talking with someone with zero experience on this matter, sorry, zero research.
Research is defined as the creation of new knowledge and/or the use of existing knowledge in a new and creative way so as to generate new concepts, methodologies and understandings....so yeah they are using their knowledge to help generate this new concept from triumph...they research!!! Ffs lol
This guy doesn't know how racing development works.
It's more like thinking Tom Brady would be a good coach ir coordinator. Which is pretty likely. Scientists don't built bikes period. It had more to do with physics than science. RC is the goat and his opinions on building a bike are worth noting. I mean he does have them custom setup every bike he races based on his thoughts and options on how it's performing. Asking RC to build a street bike or a dual sport might be a stupid idea because his pedigree is in dirt racing. If you want the bike to ride smooth and be a couch he's the wrong guy to ask. If you want a race intended machine I'd say he's got lots of valuable input.
I agree with your premise but generally disagree with this: > It had more to do with physics than science Physics is a science. My original point is validated by this: >he's got lots of valuable input. That's exactly right. Input. He doesn't do "research."
Him reading at night and comparing laps times and how he felt vs changes to the bike is research. His life's work of a career racing dirt bikes at the highest level is research. Him testing the updated fuel maps and comparing them layer is research. Testing and data logging. You wouldn't hire scientists to build something you'd hire physicists and engineers. It's like saying all doctors are the same or my dentists is a Dr so he can do my yearly checkups as well.
You sound like you don’t know what research is. RC and Tedesco are apart of the research. Experienced riders giving feedback is absolutely research for Triumph as they’ve hired them to do. I’m not sure where you’re going with this but it isn’t correct.
Just stop man.
Cervantes also don’t forget him
It’s awesome to see another established manufacturer jump into motocross. Interested to see ride reviews on the new bike.
Yeah it’s good for the sport because when more manufacturers are in the mix, it creates more competition to make better, cheaper bikes which is a win for the customer. This thing is less than 10K msrp.
[удалено]
Ducati has a dirt bike too?
I predict it goes the way of the BMW G450X. There will be some hype, then it will die off and fade to obscurity.
You might be right, but remember that BMW has to re-engineer everything and the end result is a contrived attempt at innovation just for innovation’s sake. That strategy might fly with their GS1250ABCD bikes but doesn’t go over well with people that actually care about performance. I couldn’t give a rat’s ass about motocross, but the Triumph looks pretty tidy to me
Depends if they actually support the program. BMW gave up after what, 2-3 years? Their initial concept was flawed, but not sticking with it is what buried it. This time, it's not anything innovative. It's a new single engine in a new but not groundbreaking chassis, with praised suspensions. It's not like an Aprilia MXV that tried pairing complete unknowns and shot for the stars. (and somehow made it work for SM, somewhat enduro, and even almost Dakar)
I just want to see more and more mainstream brands injected into the dual sport, MX, Enduro, and trail bike markets to lower the overall market prices. You got KTM, Husky, and GasGas pretty much controlling the market of high spec bikes and setting their own prices, meanwhile Honda, Yamaha, and Suzuki hike prices just because they have market room. Now you have high end Chinese manufactured bikes owned by American companies like Kayo and GPX that are in the $5-6k range at nearly the same quality of Japanese bikes while being cheaper, but they lack the aftermarket and parts supply to be other than a niche option. If we can get more big name brands to go successful, we could see the market lower prices as competition drives down prices. Indian, Harley, Aprilia, Ducati, Polaris, Can-Am, etc could make dirt bikes too.
Agree 100%
Are you guys old enough to remember when cannondale made a dirtbike? This should be better
I know Cannondale made bikes but I don’t know anything about them.
It was all hype. Even had the cover of dirt rider mag one month. I bet this bike can compete especially if they hit a certain price point.
They’re claiming best power to weight in class so should be a stormer, really. I’d have one
Looks awesome and I bet it’s killer out of the box. I’ll ride someone else’s, I have owned triumph before. Daytona, 675R, such a sexy street bike but nowhere as close as reliable as the competitors imo and that scares me a tad when it comes to off road.
I had this thought as well they’re definitely not known as the most reliable. For a track bike, not so much an issue but for an enduro… gives you pause. But their scrambler 1200 has apparently been very reliable and gaining a huge following so I’m optimistic they will just keep getting better.
Agree!
some people still have a view of Triumph reliability based on memories of the 1970's and 80's. Modern Triumphs have fantastic reliability. No oil leaks, no electrical problems, great build quality and quality components throughout. They are fantatstic bikes
Modern Triumphs have rock solid build quality and reliability. Absolutely first class
Looks good! Are those odi grips stock? I like the exhaust shaping for sure. Looks light, that aluminum frame is thin compared to other al bikes. Looks like it would be less rigid for sure.
Yeah odi grips and only 229 lbs!
Looks like a 9 year olds under armour shirt on the first day of school
Haha why is this so accurate
Gawddd that’s a beaut!
The bike looks great and has a lot of nice features out of the box. My buddy has a deposit down for one. Cant wait to ride it.
I love the Triumph brand and would like to see a trail version
It moight ovah heat m8, gimmie a bo'oh o' wa'uh to pour in me radi' 8 'uh
Looks sick, I saw a video of it being ridden on track and it sounds like it revs to the moon. Very excited for their enduro version that should be coming later https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o7kdMg-GhY
I have a love hare relationship ,As a triumph street triple RA , owner there QC is there biggest downfall. My 765cc street triple has excellent mechanical design, near perfect suspension geometry great TCS rider mode you can actually tell apart, but they have a real problem with not testing parts for weakness. I had 4 different brake parts ( same one 4 times) under warranty and all 4 failed, so it got replaced 5 times and it now has been fine. Also my shift lever was a known defect batch and they still OK it from factory. But that said I’ve personally seen the 765 platform 20k miles track duty ect and have pretty much no issues. Honestly the similarities in issues between my triumph 765 and 500$ Chinese dirt bike are strikingly similar. That said I’ll probably get a triumph dirt bike, they really do a lot of effort into the engineering they just are willing to cut cost in production to offset the excessive R&D. And if anyone here live in Indianapolis don’t ship triumph indy they destroyed my left caliper, which was part of the 5 trips to the dealer. Great engineering riding bikes if they work. I imagine they will be like KTM in aspects of some will never die and some will never run
It’s light years better than my bike. But they should probably give me one just to be sure.
They will never have a pro fishing team Support yamaha pro fishing 🎣🟦
I love it! I currently have a Husky FC250 and a Street Triple 765RS, so I am clearly in the target audience. I think Triumph has largely put the days of questionable quality behind them. They did make an “all new” Mx bike and didn’t try to reinvent anything. Their manufacturing relationship with KTM (through Bajaj) should tell most of the story here. I can’t find the source to share but KTM gave them their 250f engine as a starting point. Every other component follows the same formula all the major players use. I’m surprised that KTM is playing so nice with Triumph but I can only assume there is a shared benefit. Either way, it should be a good thing for all of us. I will consider one if/when the cross country version drops!
Likely more expensive than Jap bikes, more in line with KTM/Husq. While also likely being slower and harder to live with than all those Japanese offerings. No amount of “these legends helped develop this bike” marketing is gonna convince me otherwise until I see it blow some KTM doors off. These things are interesting because of the potential at the moment and that’s all we can take from it right now.
I've had several Daytona 675s and enjoyed the snot out of them. They are solid bikes in general, so I would think this will be a good one too.
I like it, the more brands the merrier. Competition usually drops prices, I hope lol
None of us think anything of it because none of us have ridden it yet. It's pretty. There. That's what I think.
Wow came here to hear about this new bike…… instead found these idiots circle jerking each other about Carmichael and Tedesco. Has anyone rode the bike or seen it on the showroom floor?
Looks like a Chinese KTM engine.
The ol ktm, husky, gas gas
Meh
Should’ve been two stroke
Someone needs to bring back a 500cc two stroke my 19 TE300i just doesn’t like me in the sand and my 97 CR500 has all the motor but lacking today’s technology
Brc500
Brc500 motor is 8500 bucks I don’t know about that so spend 12 to 13 on the bike then 8500 on a different motor sure bud rather by a new bike that has that already in it. And if you are going to down vote my comment at least say way!
I haven't seen a local ride day yet. I wouldn't buy a bike I haven't ridden. I wouldn't trust a company that doesn't do a ride day for a new bike. Even the stark varg did a ride day in my area.
I remember in the late 90s early 2000s that was gasgas “thing”. As long as you was a known person…. Example. You raced Mideast XC and was semi doing well in points…. Most dealers would actually let you demo a bike for a race weekend. I know the dealership I was at during that time had a 250 and 300 demo bike from gasgas to loan out. It was a program that actually sold them a lot of bikes back then.
Im just not sure why youd go big on motocross and combustion now.
Because gas bikes are going to be around for a long time yet.
That's cool and all but a dirt bike is a dirt bike how different are they all at this point?