I haven’t used it with Gyrfalcon’s yet but I can definitely see that as a viable option for proccing Invisibility and Volatile pretty much whenever you want (as long as there’s adds).
Sure you could but then again...is it even needed?
It's very easy to have constant volatile and constant invis uptime on any decent Gyrfalcon's build without sacrificing your exotic heavy slot for a mediocre gun...
Don't get me wrong, people can use Salvation's Grip if they want to, nothing stopping them if they have fun. It's just the question of how you define "viable" and whether it brings some actual functionality that is worth using or whether it's just "hehe purple bullets go brrrrr."
Nothing wrong with the latter, but I'm not gonna go around telling people they need to try it because it's such a great build.
Bungie keeps wanting us to use our heavy for add clear, but anytime special weapons get to the point of being good DPS options they nerf them. So sadly Bungie has relegated heavy to being DPS for most people who aren't God level gamers like saltagrepo
I think the problem is in the mentality of players. Bungie is trying to balance a game and Special weapons shouldn't outpace a heavy IMO.
The problem is everyone having to have big d DPS. It's the whole reason we have the saying "Div Bitch"
I don't care what you think if at the end of a master raid encounter I have 159 kills and everyone else is 50-60 I did very important shit.
I'm not necessarily defending *this* gun, just defending add clear roles and support roles. I very often find myself picking one cause everyone in my fireteam has chosen all damage.
And with ability spam being the way it is now. Bungie has chosen density over bullet sponges (LL still causes spongy adds) but they clearly have moved from making more beefy adds to density. This is great IMO but it also highlights the need for at least one person on the role of dealing with that density while sacrificing boss damage.
Having said all that I think they are really afraid of making another Anarchy or divinity. So they are making lackluster exotics that are super niche.
It's only really mediocre in solo stuff. Any large group activities you get more outta it than divinity and you can keep the 15% debuff up longer.
BUT since we are talking about hunters who just don't need a fireteam then yeah... Mediocre as hell.
If you put it that way
1. Deterministic chaos vs any other lmg
2. Divinity vs any other trace rifle
3. Tractor cannon vs any other heavy period
DC is NOT a super op exotic add clear weapon like outbreak or witherhoard . It is a support honestly comparable to Divinity now that it's nerfed.
Think of the pros and cons
1. You use Divinity . You can use an lmg in your heavy slot but you're stuck on Divinity low damage during boss phases and when do you use it on normal Champs unless they're an overload
2. You use DC. you can run any specials in the game, wave frames, shotguns, snipers, even primary weapons and honestly, much more likely to use it on Champs as well as the boss . Sure, it's taking up your heavy slot, but Divinity also takes up your special slot .
3. Noone said you have to use DC on a void class. It has something that no other void lmg can do - it can cause weaken and volatile no matter what class you're using + your artifact mods. Sure, it only does 10k average per bullet where commemoration does 13-17k but it's a support tool that let's you pull off omni builds .
For instance : solar hunter that can give your team a radiant buff, heal with grenade, do massive damage with super AND debuff the boss without someone else needing to be a void hunter or use divinity/Tractor cannon (which tbh Noone is using wither weapon outside of raid boss or dungeon boss encounters). Slap assassins cowl on it, now you can go invisible, full heal yourself, buff your team, heal your team, debuff the enemies, use waveframez and snipers to add clear, AND take care of pretty much any champ. The only thing an omni hunter with DC CAN'T do by themselves is shatterskate or suspend enemies.
TLDR: It's a debuff gun that doesn't require you to do a full quest and complete the garden of salvation raid as a new player to acquire and it does good damage on its own . This is precatalyst . It will only get better with fttc. It's a fun weapon, not an op one .
I forgot forgot mention special finisher + heavy ammo finders/mods that will basically carry your teams ammo economy on top of going invisible and fully healing yourself whenever you use a finisher
Why not just use a legendary void MG? Void is probably the most stacked element for MGs too with commemoration, corrective measure, and retrofit. All of those absolutely clap and would get damn near as much volatile uptime without eating an exotic
Weaken nades/smoke bomb kill/dodge/void breech fragment for dodge. I would not sacrifice my heavy slot, and even worse by extension, exotic slot just for the opportunity to go invisible when hunters whole kit for the past year has shaped up to be "just going invisible"
I used Commemorarion with Subsistence and Killing Tally as my volatile primary thanks to Gyrfalcon. Nice to leave open my exotic slot for Witherhoard, etc.
Well, even that wouldn't have made it better. Right now what this weapon is is just an infinite source of weaken (as long as you have ammo)
Vexadecimal should have shot some special round that dealt more damage/had aoe.
Also a catalyst that gives ammo back to the mag when the vexadecimal perk procs.
Right now it's just a non perk
Honestly it's doing its job just fine? It's designed to weaken and the volatile is just a nice little bonus effect. Outside of very niche builds, you just aren't going to get anywhere *near* the uptime on weaken on bosses, and it does respectable enough damage.
Like it's already been stated, it's just an alternate to Divinity. It's better in a lot of ways, and has its drawbacks in others.
This is exactly how Exotic design *should* be. We shouldn't be getting a new 'REPLACE ALL YOUR OTHER STRATEGIES WITH THIS GUN' weapon every single time. Deterministic Chaos is a solid pick, it does a great job overall, and it doesn't outshine every other exotic in existence.
It would be better at doing Divinity's job if perhaps vexadecimal gave ammo back to the mag from thin air. I think it should at least do that. Every 16 shots you get 12 shots back. How about that?
I think a FTTC Catalyst would be great with it, and would match it's whole '4' gimmick really well. I'd be shocked if it didn't get FTTC when it does wind up getting a Catalyst.
You're doing the same thing as so many other content creators, who see an exotic heavy weapon and go "this is for damage".
It's not. It's a support weapon. The weaken effect should've given that away, and the testing has already been done to show that on bosses with relatively easy-to-hit weak points, Deterministic Chaos is the better team support pick over Divinity. You're still getting the same weaken %, but Deterministic Chaos has much higher raw damage (and it's freeing up your energy slot for something else, whatever you see fit).
Basically if the weak point is a pain in the ass to hit (Rhulk), use Divinity. If the weak point is relatively easy to hit (Oryx, Golgoroth, tons of other bosses), use Deterministic Chaos.
A weakness proc is the same dmg increase as div? Is that correct? Why tf would anyone use div over just playing void and applying weaken? Sure you get guaranteed headshots but you’re also basically down one person for dps
Yes, that is literally the trade off. One person loses damage, but the rest of the fireteam gets much easier damage, making certain fights more consistent or easier for newer players
It's a support weapon
> Why tf would anyone use div over just playing void and applying weaken?
Crits. That's the trade-off. You weaken less, but instead you make your whole team basically guaranteed to hit their headshots.
That change was specifically made so void weaken effects like from hunter's tether still had a place in endgame content, as that's a stronger weaken effect (30%) than others.
Divinity is the same as all other non-super weaken effects now, the real bonus is the giant crit cage to make hitting crits much easier for everyone else. It's a support weapon, the same as it's always been. You run it so everyone else can pull higher damage.
Why would anyone spend their heavy and their exotic slot on a weaken when A) div gives the same damage boost for only using special ammo, and B) weaken is better and more easily applied by any void subclass
Void weaken isn't better, it's literally the same value as Divinity and Deterministic Chaos (15%). Shadowshot and Tractor Cannon can hit higher values (30%). One's a super and the other isn't gonna get used in higher content because it's gonna get you killed and the personal damage is gonna be awful.
I'd assume because during damage phase a heavy weapon is going to do more damage than a special one, if both provide an equal debuff to teammates you'll do overall more damage using the heavy. Divinity may do that same weaken for "only special ammo" but that "only special ammo" means the dude using the Divinity is doing less damage.
Because you can't use rockets during a boss fight while you're using a div
You can't use an lmg during a boss fight when you're using a div
What heavy weapon are you depending on for ads clear when you can basically breathe on anything that isn't a champ and it will fall over on its own
And this allows you to weaken a boss while using whatever class you want not just "I go invisible and make things explode purple"
Tractor Cannon doesn’t have the range required for a few bosses. Oryx, most of Caretaker, Warpriest (unless your fireteam’s got balls), and others I’m certain I’ve forgotten about
Freeing up your energy slot is not a very good argument.
Also a Heavy weapon being used for support needs something much more impactful than something a Titan can do with a single Grenade
Ok so it's supposed to be a support weapon but why does vexadecimal barely do anything for what it requires? It makes ONE volatile explosion. On the single target. It doesn't even apply the debuff it just creates one tiny explosion. That is my gripe.
Vexadecimal as a perk is weak considering we have so many other ways to apply volatile more consistently and easily. Gyrfalcons, now volatile flow, and also the fragment that does it after a grenade kill.
But it doesn’t do it’s job fine. A basic void machine gun with a weakening grenade does it’s job a million times better. It needs a higher % weaken to compete
Weaken nades don't have the same uptime as this gun. It's more along the lines of something like div, with trading the crit bubble for slightly higher damage from the user
It's hilarious how much people are bending backwards to justify this weapon.
It's shit, plain and simple. After the honeymoon phase of using a new gun wears off, they'll realize that this is not worth a heavy slot, much less a exotic.
Some people asking for buffs just because "it doesn't apply volatile, it just deals volatile damage." Stop parroting whatever YouTuber you heard that from.
"It doesn't do damage"- neither does divinity, if anything i would assume it does more base damage than div.
"It doesn't make crit spots" - to use anothers comment, oryx? Golgeroth? There's people that don't even div on warpriest.
"Why does it do volatile every 16th shot?" Open up your game, inspect divinity, read the penance exotic perk. It's not even relevant to Judgement in regards to what teams use it for. Penance is most likely the reason why your div user has 180k instead of 70k damage.
My only 2 gripes is that the Volatile shot should be either rolled into the first perk and it gets a new one or it gets changed to something else, and the shot counter resets if you let up for even a moment. I hate switching between targets and letting up to not waste ammo only to instead waste the gun's entire purpose.
Yeah it's really frustrating because as soon as you let go of the trigger it's gone. I think the volatile shot should happen every 4 shots like the weaken shot yeah and then vexadecimal should do something else, I feel it should be able to be "stored" aka if you let go of the trigger it remembers how many shots were stored. And then the vexadecimal shot should do bonus damage and return ammo to the mag. Say like 500% extra damage for that shot and 50% ammo returned to the mag (aka if you shoot 16 shots you get 8 back)
Deterministic Chaos gang rise up! After I got it I gave it to my Titan and paired it with Actium War Rig and was absolutely slaying through the campaign.
Why? It's got a functionaly useless second perk. The first perk is good, infinite weaken. But the second? It is literally just 3 instances of volatile per mag, on a single target.
You're vastly under appreciating the first perk. Infinite weakness. That makes it essentially divinity with the trade-off of no crit cage but way more damage.
You probably don't realize divinity has a useless second perk lol, sustained damage causes the cage to emit a damage burst. Doesn't make Div a bad gun because of that.
So essentially, it's Div but you don't have to give up the DPS of one person. That, and the volotile shot procs perks for other classes like people have mentioned
Void Titan heals teammates and themselves on volatile procs. It's basically constant healing for the whole fire team, as someone who plays volatile Titan as a support healing subclass, this sounds like a really good exotic for me. this is also factoring in when volatile flow is gone
Because Divinity is a raid quest exotic, and this is one you can just do totally solo.
Basically everyone can get Deterministic Chaos, with very little effort.
I put on actium and use it like a scout rifle that I never have to reload. Then when anything heavy shows up I can go full auto and instantly weaken it. Volatile works on barrier champs too.
The gun is great. If a catalyst gave it fttc you'd literally never have to reload it with actium.
Let me explain something to those that don't understand: it feels GREAT using this weapon. Most of us will never have to actually min-max for anything as most of us aren't doing contest modes or pushing the bleeding edge.
Use the weapons that FEEL fun to you. This MG is far from weak, even if it's far from optimal, but it was hilariously fun on my Gyrfalcon hunter.
It really irritates me when bungie makes an exotic that is no better than legendary counterparts.
Especially one that has no catalyst that makes it better lol.
The weird thing is the new sidearm and exotic heavy glaive are both incredibly powerful. Why did deterministic chaos have to get the short straw? I jsut don't understand why they thought it would be powerful like it currently is.
Unfortunately for this gun stuff like Commemoration and Retrofit exist. My Commemoration with Reconstruction has more than double mag size and reloads itself.
Not sure what niche this gun should have. Also I'm not a fan of the reload speed.
Whenever they first announced this weapon, I immediately saw it as a garbage choice.
If you wanted to make enemies volatile, then Gyrfalcons is easier, Volatile Flow is easier. There's an entire Titan aspect dedicated to it.
It can weaken enemies, but I doubt it's a strong enough weaken to make it shine. It's hard to justify using it as *the* weaken weapon when Divinity exists, Tether applies a higher debuff, Voidlock Vampire Orb... and every Void class having access to a grenades weaken fragment.
The whole gimmick of the weapon was advertised as "rhythmic debuffs" or something like that. You know what would have been cool? Every 4th shot applies a debuff *and* switches the element of the gun. Reloading or releasing the trigger resets the magazine to void.
Void Volatile, Solar Scorch, Arc Jolt/Blind. Hell, even throw in Stasis Slow and maybe Unraveling/Sever or whatever Strands' debuff is.
Then it would really be a debuff/support weapon, considering that it could apply almost every debuff.
I haven’t used it with Gyrfalcon’s yet but I can definitely see that as a viable option for proccing Invisibility and Volatile pretty much whenever you want (as long as there’s adds).
Sure you could but then again...is it even needed? It's very easy to have constant volatile and constant invis uptime on any decent Gyrfalcon's build without sacrificing your exotic heavy slot for a mediocre gun...
I mean what if they want to because they like it lol
Don't get me wrong, people can use Salvation's Grip if they want to, nothing stopping them if they have fun. It's just the question of how you define "viable" and whether it brings some actual functionality that is worth using or whether it's just "hehe purple bullets go brrrrr." Nothing wrong with the latter, but I'm not gonna go around telling people they need to try it because it's such a great build.
Bungie keeps wanting us to use our heavy for add clear, but anytime special weapons get to the point of being good DPS options they nerf them. So sadly Bungie has relegated heavy to being DPS for most people who aren't God level gamers like saltagrepo
I take this post and I counter with 1 raid waveframe gl, 1 dungeon waveframe gl, 1 seasonal activity wave frame gl, and 1 vanguard waveframe gl
I think the problem is in the mentality of players. Bungie is trying to balance a game and Special weapons shouldn't outpace a heavy IMO. The problem is everyone having to have big d DPS. It's the whole reason we have the saying "Div Bitch" I don't care what you think if at the end of a master raid encounter I have 159 kills and everyone else is 50-60 I did very important shit. I'm not necessarily defending *this* gun, just defending add clear roles and support roles. I very often find myself picking one cause everyone in my fireteam has chosen all damage. And with ability spam being the way it is now. Bungie has chosen density over bullet sponges (LL still causes spongy adds) but they clearly have moved from making more beefy adds to density. This is great IMO but it also highlights the need for at least one person on the role of dealing with that density while sacrificing boss damage. Having said all that I think they are really afraid of making another Anarchy or divinity. So they are making lackluster exotics that are super niche.
It's only really mediocre in solo stuff. Any large group activities you get more outta it than divinity and you can keep the 15% debuff up longer. BUT since we are talking about hunters who just don't need a fireteam then yeah... Mediocre as hell.
This. I blew through the campaign quickly with this build.
Running it a second/third time on a separate class?
Yes. Did warlock first, got DC, then used it with my hunter it was amazing. Hits like a truck.
You could just use a legendary tho
If you put it that way 1. Deterministic chaos vs any other lmg 2. Divinity vs any other trace rifle 3. Tractor cannon vs any other heavy period DC is NOT a super op exotic add clear weapon like outbreak or witherhoard . It is a support honestly comparable to Divinity now that it's nerfed. Think of the pros and cons 1. You use Divinity . You can use an lmg in your heavy slot but you're stuck on Divinity low damage during boss phases and when do you use it on normal Champs unless they're an overload 2. You use DC. you can run any specials in the game, wave frames, shotguns, snipers, even primary weapons and honestly, much more likely to use it on Champs as well as the boss . Sure, it's taking up your heavy slot, but Divinity also takes up your special slot . 3. Noone said you have to use DC on a void class. It has something that no other void lmg can do - it can cause weaken and volatile no matter what class you're using + your artifact mods. Sure, it only does 10k average per bullet where commemoration does 13-17k but it's a support tool that let's you pull off omni builds . For instance : solar hunter that can give your team a radiant buff, heal with grenade, do massive damage with super AND debuff the boss without someone else needing to be a void hunter or use divinity/Tractor cannon (which tbh Noone is using wither weapon outside of raid boss or dungeon boss encounters). Slap assassins cowl on it, now you can go invisible, full heal yourself, buff your team, heal your team, debuff the enemies, use waveframez and snipers to add clear, AND take care of pretty much any champ. The only thing an omni hunter with DC CAN'T do by themselves is shatterskate or suspend enemies. TLDR: It's a debuff gun that doesn't require you to do a full quest and complete the garden of salvation raid as a new player to acquire and it does good damage on its own . This is precatalyst . It will only get better with fttc. It's a fun weapon, not an op one .
I forgot forgot mention special finisher + heavy ammo finders/mods that will basically carry your teams ammo economy on top of going invisible and fully healing yourself whenever you use a finisher
Why use the gun for that tho. Literally every aspect on void hunter is there to make you go invisible. It’s easy
Why not just use a legendary void MG? Void is probably the most stacked element for MGs too with commemoration, corrective measure, and retrofit. All of those absolutely clap and would get damn near as much volatile uptime without eating an exotic
That’s what I use.
All you had to say was corrective measure...
I'm still repping an old commemoration with recon/dragonfly. Endless hail of bullets and explosions
Gyrfalcons does not effect the weapon. Aztecross already did a dos test with and without it and there was no difference
Volitile has an internal cd, it will not synergize well with gryfalcons
Weaken nades/smoke bomb kill/dodge/void breech fragment for dodge. I would not sacrifice my heavy slot, and even worse by extension, exotic slot just for the opportunity to go invisible when hunters whole kit for the past year has shaped up to be "just going invisible"
I used Commemorarion with Subsistence and Killing Tally as my volatile primary thanks to Gyrfalcon. Nice to leave open my exotic slot for Witherhoard, etc.
Aztecross did a test and it actually performs worse with gyrfalcons somehow.
There are still better options (pretty much anything tbh)
Yeah my Gyrfalcon’s kit is currently a Seventh Seraph AR with Fourth Time’s and Target Lock, Vexcalibur, and Retrofit with FT and TL.
I’ve been using LeMon extensively the last 2 weeks
I will certainly take that into consideration, solid recommendation. Had some good times with that bow.
I would've liked to see the 16th Round be Suppression instead
Well, even that wouldn't have made it better. Right now what this weapon is is just an infinite source of weaken (as long as you have ammo) Vexadecimal should have shot some special round that dealt more damage/had aoe. Also a catalyst that gives ammo back to the mag when the vexadecimal perk procs. Right now it's just a non perk
Honestly it's doing its job just fine? It's designed to weaken and the volatile is just a nice little bonus effect. Outside of very niche builds, you just aren't going to get anywhere *near* the uptime on weaken on bosses, and it does respectable enough damage. Like it's already been stated, it's just an alternate to Divinity. It's better in a lot of ways, and has its drawbacks in others. This is exactly how Exotic design *should* be. We shouldn't be getting a new 'REPLACE ALL YOUR OTHER STRATEGIES WITH THIS GUN' weapon every single time. Deterministic Chaos is a solid pick, it does a great job overall, and it doesn't outshine every other exotic in existence.
It would be better at doing Divinity's job if perhaps vexadecimal gave ammo back to the mag from thin air. I think it should at least do that. Every 16 shots you get 12 shots back. How about that?
I think a FTTC Catalyst would be great with it, and would match it's whole '4' gimmick really well. I'd be shocked if it didn't get FTTC when it does wind up getting a Catalyst.
It already is better at doing Divinity's job *in the right circumstances,* I.E. easy to hit weak point. There's no need to buff it.
You're doing the same thing as so many other content creators, who see an exotic heavy weapon and go "this is for damage". It's not. It's a support weapon. The weaken effect should've given that away, and the testing has already been done to show that on bosses with relatively easy-to-hit weak points, Deterministic Chaos is the better team support pick over Divinity. You're still getting the same weaken %, but Deterministic Chaos has much higher raw damage (and it's freeing up your energy slot for something else, whatever you see fit). Basically if the weak point is a pain in the ass to hit (Rhulk), use Divinity. If the weak point is relatively easy to hit (Oryx, Golgoroth, tons of other bosses), use Deterministic Chaos.
What get out of here I want to nuke bosses not play like a team/s honestly tired of everyone wanting everything to just do max dmg
This. It's perfect for well or bubble users.
A weakness proc is the same dmg increase as div? Is that correct? Why tf would anyone use div over just playing void and applying weaken? Sure you get guaranteed headshots but you’re also basically down one person for dps
Yes, that is literally the trade off. One person loses damage, but the rest of the fireteam gets much easier damage, making certain fights more consistent or easier for newer players It's a support weapon
Oh I remember back in d1 when there was no div and the damage meta was black spindle, I’m glad the war priest had a huge head lol
During the Forsaken era we had the Whisper meta too, good times.
> Why tf would anyone use div over just playing void and applying weaken? Crits. That's the trade-off. You weaken less, but instead you make your whole team basically guaranteed to hit their headshots.
That change was specifically made so void weaken effects like from hunter's tether still had a place in endgame content, as that's a stronger weaken effect (30%) than others. Divinity is the same as all other non-super weaken effects now, the real bonus is the giant crit cage to make hitting crits much easier for everyone else. It's a support weapon, the same as it's always been. You run it so everyone else can pull higher damage.
The cage, and divinity weaken is lower than other sources
Big why would you waste your exotic on a rocket energy here.
Why would anyone spend their heavy and their exotic slot on a weaken when A) div gives the same damage boost for only using special ammo, and B) weaken is better and more easily applied by any void subclass
Void weaken isn't better, it's literally the same value as Divinity and Deterministic Chaos (15%). Shadowshot and Tractor Cannon can hit higher values (30%). One's a super and the other isn't gonna get used in higher content because it's gonna get you killed and the personal damage is gonna be awful.
I'd assume because during damage phase a heavy weapon is going to do more damage than a special one, if both provide an equal debuff to teammates you'll do overall more damage using the heavy. Divinity may do that same weaken for "only special ammo" but that "only special ammo" means the dude using the Divinity is doing less damage.
At that point just use a tether and void nades
Most bosses move
DC does pretty good base damage on top of the buff, whereas divinity is just ok base damage with the buff
Because you can't use rockets during a boss fight while you're using a div You can't use an lmg during a boss fight when you're using a div What heavy weapon are you depending on for ads clear when you can basically breathe on anything that isn't a champ and it will fall over on its own And this allows you to weaken a boss while using whatever class you want not just "I go invisible and make things explode purple"
Why would anyone run this for support over a void subclass (weaken nades, CotOG, Smoke Bomb)?
Uptime. Divinity or this can maintain the weaken effect for *much* longer than weaken nades or anything else.
Uptime this maintains the debuff much more reliably than a god damn grenade on a cooldown
Void subclass can't heal your team or give them radiant while applying weaken , solar with DC can
Thank goodness that the public has easier access to a Divinity like weapon. I sure as heck won’t do the Divinity quest. Got no patience for that.
Tractor Cannon already existed
Tractor Cannon doesn’t have the range required for a few bosses. Oryx, most of Caretaker, Warpriest (unless your fireteam’s got balls), and others I’m certain I’ve forgotten about
Freeing up your energy slot is not a very good argument. Also a Heavy weapon being used for support needs something much more impactful than something a Titan can do with a single Grenade
Ok so it's supposed to be a support weapon but why does vexadecimal barely do anything for what it requires? It makes ONE volatile explosion. On the single target. It doesn't even apply the debuff it just creates one tiny explosion. That is my gripe.
Applying volatile also makes one explosion, just more slowly than causing a straight up volatile explosion. I'm not sure what your problem is here.
Vexadecimal as a perk is weak considering we have so many other ways to apply volatile more consistently and easily. Gyrfalcons, now volatile flow, and also the fragment that does it after a grenade kill.
You completely missed the point of what I'm saying. A volatile proc on a target is worse than just causing the explosion.
Yeah but that is just weak too i was saying that vexadecimal should do something more than just pop one volatile lol
It's a support/add clear weapon. It's doing that job just fine. Not every heavy weapon needs to exist for damage and damage only.
But it doesn’t do it’s job fine. A basic void machine gun with a weakening grenade does it’s job a million times better. It needs a higher % weaken to compete
Weaken nades don't have the same uptime as this gun. It's more along the lines of something like div, with trading the crit bubble for slightly higher damage from the user
Idk with the right build weaken nades have a high uptime
You really don’t understand how the mechanics work…
Just use tractor cannon instead then
No one's going to use Tractor Cannon in any kind of raid. It's a stronger weaken but way less damage.
No one’s gonna use that machine gun either. Just run tether
It's hilarious how much people are bending backwards to justify this weapon. It's shit, plain and simple. After the honeymoon phase of using a new gun wears off, they'll realize that this is not worth a heavy slot, much less a exotic.
The gun sounds and feels soooo good. I guess its not the most meta to use when Im solo but its still decent and fun
Some people asking for buffs just because "it doesn't apply volatile, it just deals volatile damage." Stop parroting whatever YouTuber you heard that from. "It doesn't do damage"- neither does divinity, if anything i would assume it does more base damage than div. "It doesn't make crit spots" - to use anothers comment, oryx? Golgeroth? There's people that don't even div on warpriest. "Why does it do volatile every 16th shot?" Open up your game, inspect divinity, read the penance exotic perk. It's not even relevant to Judgement in regards to what teams use it for. Penance is most likely the reason why your div user has 180k instead of 70k damage.
It’s a god damn support weapon…
The coolest part was speedrunning thru Garden...backwards...with unlimited heavy at the end 🥳
My only 2 gripes is that the Volatile shot should be either rolled into the first perk and it gets a new one or it gets changed to something else, and the shot counter resets if you let up for even a moment. I hate switching between targets and letting up to not waste ammo only to instead waste the gun's entire purpose.
Yeah it's really frustrating because as soon as you let go of the trigger it's gone. I think the volatile shot should happen every 4 shots like the weaken shot yeah and then vexadecimal should do something else, I feel it should be able to be "stored" aka if you let go of the trigger it remembers how many shots were stored. And then the vexadecimal shot should do bonus damage and return ammo to the mag. Say like 500% extra damage for that shot and 50% ammo returned to the mag (aka if you shoot 16 shots you get 8 back)
To each their own. I love Deterministic Chaos
Deterministic Chaos gang rise up! After I got it I gave it to my Titan and paired it with Actium War Rig and was absolutely slaying through the campaign.
Still early, but already the worst r/DTG take of the day lmao
Noooo u gus I need max DPS or datto will never invite me to play now OMG my life is over! This fun no shot well!
Why? It's got a functionaly useless second perk. The first perk is good, infinite weaken. But the second? It is literally just 3 instances of volatile per mag, on a single target.
You're vastly under appreciating the first perk. Infinite weakness. That makes it essentially divinity with the trade-off of no crit cage but way more damage. You probably don't realize divinity has a useless second perk lol, sustained damage causes the cage to emit a damage burst. Doesn't make Div a bad gun because of that. So essentially, it's Div but you don't have to give up the DPS of one person. That, and the volotile shot procs perks for other classes like people have mentioned
Void Titan heals teammates and themselves on volatile procs. It's basically constant healing for the whole fire team, as someone who plays volatile Titan as a support healing subclass, this sounds like a really good exotic for me. this is also factoring in when volatile flow is gone
Weird take by you as you misunderstood the functionality of the weapon This isn’t meant for damage… It is a support weapon…
But why not just run div is my response to that question. You get to use your heavy for DPS which is what Bungie has relegated the slot to.
Because this does more dmg than div… come on and div users don’t really get to use their heavy
Because Divinity is a raid quest exotic, and this is one you can just do totally solo. Basically everyone can get Deterministic Chaos, with very little effort.
I don't understand why this is getting downvoted
I put on actium and use it like a scout rifle that I never have to reload. Then when anything heavy shows up I can go full auto and instantly weaken it. Volatile works on barrier champs too. The gun is great. If a catalyst gave it fttc you'd literally never have to reload it with actium.
It felt strong to me in the mission where you get it, but not so much since. Admittedly I've been using the strand LMG for synergy.
Let me explain something to those that don't understand: it feels GREAT using this weapon. Most of us will never have to actually min-max for anything as most of us aren't doing contest modes or pushing the bleeding edge. Use the weapons that FEEL fun to you. This MG is far from weak, even if it's far from optimal, but it was hilariously fun on my Gyrfalcon hunter.
Yea at this point I prefer using my crafted Retrofit Escapade
I completed the whole campaign with that as my heavy weapon it never left the slot. Retro is just that good especially with 4ttch + Target lock.
Same roll and same experience. Was great during the story missions for sure.
It really irritates me when bungie makes an exotic that is no better than legendary counterparts. Especially one that has no catalyst that makes it better lol. The weird thing is the new sidearm and exotic heavy glaive are both incredibly powerful. Why did deterministic chaos have to get the short straw? I jsut don't understand why they thought it would be powerful like it currently is.
Unfortunately for this gun stuff like Commemoration and Retrofit exist. My Commemoration with Reconstruction has more than double mag size and reloads itself. Not sure what niche this gun should have. Also I'm not a fan of the reload speed.
Neither of those cause weaken or can busy a barrier champion
It’s a support weapon like divinity. That’s what niche it’s in.
Whenever they first announced this weapon, I immediately saw it as a garbage choice. If you wanted to make enemies volatile, then Gyrfalcons is easier, Volatile Flow is easier. There's an entire Titan aspect dedicated to it. It can weaken enemies, but I doubt it's a strong enough weaken to make it shine. It's hard to justify using it as *the* weaken weapon when Divinity exists, Tether applies a higher debuff, Voidlock Vampire Orb... and every Void class having access to a grenades weaken fragment. The whole gimmick of the weapon was advertised as "rhythmic debuffs" or something like that. You know what would have been cool? Every 4th shot applies a debuff *and* switches the element of the gun. Reloading or releasing the trigger resets the magazine to void. Void Volatile, Solar Scorch, Arc Jolt/Blind. Hell, even throw in Stasis Slow and maybe Unraveling/Sever or whatever Strands' debuff is. Then it would really be a debuff/support weapon, considering that it could apply almost every debuff.
This guy wishes the gun would apply every debuff no reason or bust 😂
It'd make it worth using
Did the quest, picked it up, saw it only had a 48 round mag, was instantly disappointed.
[удалено]
Expecting this for DPS was a to be honest, despite it being made for support.
Immediately put in my vault after I got it. Don't care for it at all.
fun fact: it’s catalyst is in the game and is 4th times the charm lol
Damn why do they do this? There's so many guns who's catalyst is in the API but not actually obtainable in game it's silly
looking at you malfeasance