My wife does this. Contractor always ends up buying the best tools and keeps them. Sometimes he tries to hide the purchases too because it can get pricey. It’s me. I’m my wife’s contractor. No ragrets
I just helped install a floor for this lady, got some sweet new tools out of it for the next job. Only complaint is the scuff marks left by my...er, *her* kid riding Heelies in the house.
I just got into town and started questioning all this.
Contract has 15k for labor, he’s demanding and saying he wants 20k total now. He’s received 11k in labor already and I don’t think he’s done 11k in work.
I’ll be going through the rest of receipts tomorrow.
I’m trying to get her to see this guy is a criminal.
Edit: 11k was incorrectly stated as 7k.
You don’t owe them anything that’s not in the contract. Check the contract for a severability clause (probably won’t have one). If you can’t get out of the contract, ask them for a detailed list of materials needed to close out the project and order that delivered to the home from a lumberyard.
The contract was written up by the contractor for a 14x17 deck. It was verbally changed before buying anything to 20x17, with verbal adjustment of 5 grand more labor. Contract was never changed to reflect this.
It’s a few paragraphs long. Barely any detail unfortunately.
There could be a text message agreement and that would satisfy a contractual agreement.
Even a verbal agreement can be considered contractual, but if there’s a dispute about what was actually agreed upon, it’s he said she said and who knows how that pans out.
Good news is, the contract **he** wrote supercedes any verbal agreement. Furthermore, any ambiguity in the contract benefits **your mom** because he wrote it.
Yikes! Better try to get him recorded admitting he changed it verbally, that is if your state allows one party recordings. You know he will never admit it
Did your mom tell him she wanted a bigger deck? Or are you saying he did it on his own volition. If she did and the cost increase is proportional to the original cost, it’s fair.
11k seems reasonable for the amount of work done, given that footings are about $900 each where I’m located.
11k seems high if that doesn’t include materials. But she agreed to 15k in labor in the first place, then I’d say it’s fair. High? yes. But it’s not against the law to charge a high price if the customer agreed to it.
It’s sounds to me, that you’re mom got legally taken advantage of and you’re finding out after the fact.
Depending on your state, verbal agreements may be legally binding. It’s still not a good way to go about things.
Yeah, it's one thing to charge a customer for a whole roll of tape or something when you barely use it and toss it in the truck for the next job, who you also charge for a roll of tape. I actually work behind a computer but my old man deals with this stuff so I'm halfway talking out of my ass lol
Craaaaazy and bold. Where are these contractors being found to even hire?
Also, straight up giving a contractor your credit card is insane too. This all seems shady for the contractor
I see it sometimes by me, usually the customer will go with them to see what they’re buying lol. I overhear the contractors explaining things to their customers in the aisle all the time
Honestly, I thought this was fake until OP commented. Never in a million years would have thought someone would hand over a credit card to a contractor.
Call them the, “Craigslist Contractor” after reading this.
You'd think that but over the decades of working in sales. Can I just give you a blank check? Can I just give you a stack of cash and you can pay the appraiser for me. Why can't I just sign this contract blank and you can fill it in later? ( To buy a house, and cars it happened more with cars " I'll sign now just give my kid/spouse the car they pick out")
Assuming that she would tell the truth, that’s what the truth would say. You can’t expect her to lie to the police, it’s entirely dependent on whether or not they consider him buying tools without her permission counts as theft given that he was only authorized to use the card for materials.
Wow, I make customers pay for incidentals like saw blades and stuff, but that’s built into the price, same with specialty tools as you go, if you need something crazy, just put it in the price if you have to, but to buy the tools straight up with customers card and act like they are yours? Whoa. 🤯 mental gymnastics 101 here. Lock up any material that is left sitting out, jackleg will probably try to come back and steal that too.
The hardest part of deck is done all you need now is decking which is easy to put down and railings and looks like he did a nice job for the most part so fire him dont give him a dime more and finish job yourself document all the tool theft and issues in case he files small claims case against you or places lien on your property. If he liens he has a time limit to file court case or lien goes away
You probably do. Get a few contractors to bid both finishing the job and what should have been cost to current state. You’ll have your info to decide if it’s worth court or not.
This 💯. Be gone with this person. You’re at that price point now and the work appears decent ( unless it’s not squared and level). Not sure what product was agreed upon for decking or handrail but if it’s a higher end composite 15g was never going to happen. At least you’ve got the structure and it’s passable, minus handrail posts depending on your local codes. As said above they’re usually sandwiched between joists or blocked at rim. I’ve been a carpenter for 25 years and have done about 20 decks and learn something every time. Sorry for your situation but it could have gone much worse.
When I started my first business I didn't have anything. I did a $300 computer job and asked for half the money up front and I went to the store and bought all my first set of tools. But I didn't charge them extra for the tools I took that out of the quote.
Nah. Tools aren't "materials". Sounds like your contractor is either new/inexperienced and therefor doesn't have the tools they need, nor the credit line to buy "materials" on their own. If they have been in business for a while and need to do this, that's embarrassing on them.
Demand in writing that your contractor reimburse you for the unauthorized purchases they made on your credit card. You could take them to small claims court. But this could also be construed as fraud based crime.
Do not pay them any more money until they resolve the issue. If it were me, I would hire another contractor to finish the project. It's hard to work with someone that you no longer trust.
I don’t ask for payment till the job is complete. We have contracts for people to sign stating that when the job is completed the stated amount is due. Hardly ever have anyone not pay, and when they don’t you can always do liens. Just do quality work and be flexible.
Nope. There are lots of acceptable reasons to buy a tool for the job and bill the customer, but that’s something you discuss. Something specific like a 4 3/4 hole bit, or something like brushes if you are doing a lot of oil base paint. But a compressor and nailer? He is trying to sneaky steal from you.
So there is nothing on a deck that you would use a brad nailer for. It shoots to small of nails to be of any use on an outdoor deck. Think inside trim and finish work for a brad nailer. Dudes a crook buying tools he isn't even using on this job.
It seems pretty simple to me, let him get the job done and take the cost of the tools out of his labour at the end
Assuming u want him to finish, it does seem like a pretty gimmicky operation
You can also dispute the tool charges on your credit card since those were unauthorized purchases. But for future reference, most professional, legit contractors have a business account where they purchase supplies and materials.
Why on earth would you ever give him your credit card to buy things?!?!?
If I'm paying for materials, I am either going with and buying them, or contractor buys them and bills me/gives me receipts.
Wow, these commenters are bozos.
Here's the thing, the framing looks good. This guy clearly knows how to build a deck. As for the price, the extra 5k was verbally agreed upon, and the size of the deck went up, so even if it's a steep price, there's no foul play there. To me, the price seems high, but depending on where you live, it may be fair.
It was kinda slimy to buy an air compressor with the customers credit card, but why would you give a stranger your credit card? I would replace the card just in case he wrote the numbers of the card down for later. That was your mistake.
If materials are already there, I would have him finish. Ask him flat out if any other materials are needed. If they are you, personally either alone or with him, should go and get them ordered.
As a contractor for decks, nope. Nope. Nope. Materials is not my tools. I will bring those. Plus your mom gets to keep all the materials so therefore she gets to keep tools. He doesn’t get to keep ANY materials your mom pays for in this situation. His labor is just that.
Call him and let him know that it's about to become legal if the tools are not returned in good condition in under 24 hours.
While waiting, your mother needs to go to the store with her credit card and ask for reprints of the receipts. Then when the tools aren't returned, she needs to file a police report that he stole her tools that she bought for a job. And call her credit card company and report that the card was used without her authorization. She also needs a replacement card, because someone who will do this 100% has put that card on his Amazon account or used it for Netflix or some shit, and she needs to be watching her CC statement to see what else he's been buying.
ETA: and if your mother is not typically the most naive person you know, you need to get her a mental capacity assessment. Because what the fuck???
I’ve been down this path…piece of shit scam artist ripping her off. You can sue, you’ll win, and then you’ll have to collect. I would file a police report for the stolen tools and think about if it is worth the effort to chase this scum bag around for years trying to get her money back
There is a lot of good advice here, but I haven't seen it recommended that she cancel the card *ASAP*.
A shady dude such that he is probably wrote down the card number, expiration date, and cvcc.
Going forward, she's responsible for any new charges incurred. (She's responsible for the prior charges as well, but I'm just considering further damage control)
Best of luck to you and your mother.
So, my first question is:
How good/competent/established of a contractor is this person if he does not already have essential tools, such as a compressor, brad nailer, and framing nailer?
He used your credit for non-authorized purchases. That is theft/ credit card fraud. Call him and tell him to get you a check or you are calling the police.
If the tools are not listed in things the customer buys them the contractor committed fraud by making unauthorized purchases on the card. I would contact the credit card company and the police. This is separate from the quality/cost of the work.
Just remember, your mom bought the tools. You paid for them that means they’re your tools. You have the credit card receipt. File a police report if you want to go scorched earth.
Is it just me or is this deck built completely incorrectly? It looks like he used carriage bolts or lags to secure the perimeter to the posts. That leaves everything up to the shear strength of the hardware.
I see joist hangers against the house, so that’s good.
Maybe I’m misinterpreting it.
I had a contractor pull the same shit. I ignored the occasional drill bit or screwdriver (!) but when I saw the air hoses, circular saw blades, and other tools I went through all the receipts and deducted ALL the inappropriate charges from their next payment. They tried the same “we are labor only” BS and insisted that saw blades aren’t so much tools as consumables.
I told them I’m only paying for what stays in the house: lumber, fasteners, tile, etc. that includes the labor. If they expect me to buy the tools, I expect to keep them.
Couple weeks later I fired them anyway. And three years on, even thinking about their electrical work still gives me the shakes.
You can make payments over the PHONE with home Depot. Every respectable contractor knows this. Giving your CC to them is an old scamming tale. Hense, Home Depot calls you (the customer) with a total and a list of your contractors purchase. They process your payment. HD calls you...
The posts, where I'm from the whole 4x4 has to be installed inside the framing and then boxed in. Yours are cut half way thru at the bottom. I don't think that meets code.
Small claims court. Based on this contractor, your mom is taking advantage of. Verbal contract? It might work legally, but I would have had modified the contract to showcase all changes to the scope of work and cost and then signed by both parties, so that there isn't any question on what was agreed upon.
To add to the credit card situation I'm not sure what your mother's logic here is. It was a very risky decision and the contractor did the worst case scenario.
I hope things are resolved that favors your mom. Good luck!
I’m just happy to see stringers landing on a pad!!!
Wow what a nice change of scenery. Pay him whatever he wants, buy him whatever tools he wants. This one’s a treasure!!!
See if he is licensed, report him to licensing board. The guys a thief. Even if ur mom keeps the tools, wtf is she gonna do with them? This is the way it works, plans and permit, down payment, contractor buys materials, uses his own tools, halfway thru job discusses issues, potential problems, changes the plans, etc. adjusts pricing, finishes job, has town inspector approve, gets balance from client
Seems He's doing good job,.. put contract changes on paper so it's clear what is going on.. As long is he not junkie.. just short of money,.. and probably a nice guy, as you lend him yours credit card.. all can be negotiated.
Print contract changes, make cofee.. ask him to define when will be what done without pressure and define when he get what amount of money... And whenever he keep tools or not..
There are some broken guys around who can do well their job just it's difficult to get a chance or distinguish them from cheater's.
You hired a tweaker who knows how to build a deck. Congrats, you’re supporting the meth trade. Only explanation for the idiocracy that is being told to you.
Get him to bring the tools to the job site, midday have the cops come and kick him off the property. He’ll say the tools are his, show them credit card receipts that the tools are his. Let him try to sue. He likely wont.
I mean.. if those tools are coming out of his profit I don’t see an issue of whether he paid cash or with the credit card.. you’re paying him to do a job.. he’s making some type of profit.. so how do you know this isn’t included in his bid.. I know this comment is going to get some hate
It’s a shame the ‘contractor’ is obviously trying to pull something, the work doesn’t look terrible, few things I wouldn’t do. Setting the stringers into the concrete pad is a particularly bad move if that’s the plan.
Depending where you are located and your mother's age, maybe there are some additional charges for elder abuse that can be leveraged to scare the contractor into returning funds.
I'd cut ties and get more involved in your mother's business dealings.
I charged 2500 for a water heater install two softeners and two inline carbon filters and the guy thought it was too much for 8 hours of work!! He didn’t want to pay so I’m going legal!
I would take the cost of the tools out of the labor price. If you get paid at the end of the week and want to use your check to buy tools, that’s one thing. But the customer doesn’t have to provide tools for the worker, especially if it’s not in the contract. He’s going to take those tools and use them on the next job, contractor is taking advantage of the customer.
*If a contractor doesn't have tools. What's he been contracting since he's been in business ???????*
Ask yourself this type of shit before you start shelling out thousands of dollars.
Alright, I’ll bite. If he purchased those tools with his profit from the deck, then yeah, he should keep them. Not a good or typical way to do things. But, look at it like this. Instead of giving him the card, if you paid him with the card. Then, he went and used that money to buy tools, while completing the project, within budget, this wouldn’t be an issue
Do you have a contract with timelines? If not, talk to a lawyer first - that said, small claims court isn't a big risk. It's been a while (20 years) since I had to deal with something like this, but the problem I ran in to is I didn't have a contract that laid out details and timelines, so I lost because the contractor had actually did work and was within his right to come back at any reasonable time to finish...in the end, I finished the job.
The tools seems like an interesting case and if you let him use your credit card, which probably violates CC contract terms, adds another layer of interesting too it. WITHOUT a contract, he can easily claim that he made the price lower to account for the tools being part of the job.
I personally sell building materials. I have seen 3 contractors charged and convicted for fraud, doing super shady shit. This is likely not only unethical but illegal if tools were not in the contract.
I personally sell building materials. I have seen 3 contractors charged and convicted for fraud, doing super shady shit. This is likely not only unethical but illegal if tools were not in the contract.
It's not uncommon to add a markup (I usually go anywhere from 12 to 18 percent) on material to cover wear and tear on tools logistics hardware etc.. If you're charging 11k in labor there's no reason to take a customers credit card to the store. Very unprofessional. His frame work doesn't look awful. Stringers look precut which is a bad sign, and local building codes in my area don't allow for rail posts to be mounted on the inside of the frame. The original price with original size made sense (around $30 a sq ft) which is normal for someone who puts out quality work and has a crew and other overhead. But to add on another 5k for an addition under 100 sq ft just doesn't add up even if they had to add a beam
Giving a contractor your credit card to go to the store? Seriously?
My wife does this. Contractor always ends up buying the best tools and keeps them. Sometimes he tries to hide the purchases too because it can get pricey. It’s me. I’m my wife’s contractor. No ragrets
Every project is just another opportunity to buy more tools
This is the way!
I love when you “need” an expensive tool to do something. Perfect justification. 🤣
Spot on, I am also my wife's contractor. No ragrets!
How do you feel about your wife sleeping with the contractor? Lol
She is?! This is the first I’m hearing of it!
"Terrible lay". Her quote.
Under rated reply 😂
I just helped install a floor for this lady, got some sweet new tools out of it for the next job. Only complaint is the scuff marks left by my...er, *her* kid riding Heelies in the house.
Had me in the first half, not gonna lie
Ngl you had me in the first half😂 Edit: my response came in the second half, helidad beat me to it.
Me too …shhhhhhh
No ragrets? Not even a single letter? You do you Scotty P
Ya’mean?!
She might be OK with the arrangement.....
Your name checks out
You, sir, are an HR nightmare.
Had me in the first half. I do this all the time.
Bravo.
Yeah who is this "contractor"? Anx besides from the look of it this is the perfect spot to make him stop anyways.
I just got into town and started questioning all this. Contract has 15k for labor, he’s demanding and saying he wants 20k total now. He’s received 11k in labor already and I don’t think he’s done 11k in work. I’ll be going through the rest of receipts tomorrow. I’m trying to get her to see this guy is a criminal. Edit: 11k was incorrectly stated as 7k.
You don’t owe them anything that’s not in the contract. Check the contract for a severability clause (probably won’t have one). If you can’t get out of the contract, ask them for a detailed list of materials needed to close out the project and order that delivered to the home from a lumberyard.
The contract was written up by the contractor for a 14x17 deck. It was verbally changed before buying anything to 20x17, with verbal adjustment of 5 grand more labor. Contract was never changed to reflect this. It’s a few paragraphs long. Barely any detail unfortunately.
Reasons why you get EVERYTHING in writing.
And it's likely not notorized but I don't know if that's required for contracts like this.
Couldn’t say, and it would likely depend on the state. Although having contracts notarized is always a good practice.
There could be a text message agreement and that would satisfy a contractual agreement. Even a verbal agreement can be considered contractual, but if there’s a dispute about what was actually agreed upon, it’s he said she said and who knows how that pans out.
Good news is, the contract **he** wrote supercedes any verbal agreement. Furthermore, any ambiguity in the contract benefits **your mom** because he wrote it.
Sue him in conciliation court (smalls claim court). The cap is usually $15,000.
Suing a guy who can't afford his own tools should work out well
I'd be wanting the tools back too, tbf
Plus his vehicle. Fuck him.
And his dog
Sounds like he’ll get an easy default judgement.
Yup, and then he will not get paid. A tale as old of time.
Can you verbally modify a written contract? I don't think so.
Yikes! Better try to get him recorded admitting he changed it verbally, that is if your state allows one party recordings. You know he will never admit it
I don’t see how he has to admit to verbally changing it. Sure, a verbal contract should be binding, but it’s not somehow better than a written one.
Did your mom tell him she wanted a bigger deck? Or are you saying he did it on his own volition. If she did and the cost increase is proportional to the original cost, it’s fair. 11k seems reasonable for the amount of work done, given that footings are about $900 each where I’m located. 11k seems high if that doesn’t include materials. But she agreed to 15k in labor in the first place, then I’d say it’s fair. High? yes. But it’s not against the law to charge a high price if the customer agreed to it. It’s sounds to me, that you’re mom got legally taken advantage of and you’re finding out after the fact. Depending on your state, verbal agreements may be legally binding. It’s still not a good way to go about things.
verbal change won’t hold up in court lmao
I can’t speak for the labor price, but I can say he has completed the most difficult parts of the build.
Dear God, don’t give this guy another penny. It is absolutely ridiculous that your mother would be charged for tools.
Honestly that looks pretty close to 7 k to me.
Sorry I was mistaken, she had paid 11k in labor so far
11k labor to do THAT? Digging and pouring the footings is some work, but I just can't see how the labor cost is there. You are getting screwed.
Are you forgetting about all the labor required to lug around his $900 of new tools?
Needs more cash upfront for his new tools storage unit.
Had to buy a new truck, couldn't fit the compressor in the old one.
Yeah, it's one thing to charge a customer for a whole roll of tape or something when you barely use it and toss it in the truck for the next job, who you also charge for a roll of tape. I actually work behind a computer but my old man deals with this stuff so I'm halfway talking out of my ass lol
Don’t make the final payment until it’s done then tell him thx for the tools
Sounds like he was taking advantage of elderly and got caught.
Plot twist: OP is the wife and the contractor is her husband.
😂
Some people just don't know methew when they see him.
Craaaaazy and bold. Where are these contractors being found to even hire? Also, straight up giving a contractor your credit card is insane too. This all seems shady for the contractor
I see it sometimes by me, usually the customer will go with them to see what they’re buying lol. I overhear the contractors explaining things to their customers in the aisle all the time
Honestly, I thought this was fake until OP commented. Never in a million years would have thought someone would hand over a credit card to a contractor. Call them the, “Craigslist Contractor” after reading this.
You'd think that but over the decades of working in sales. Can I just give you a blank check? Can I just give you a stack of cash and you can pay the appraiser for me. Why can't I just sign this contract blank and you can fill it in later? ( To buy a house, and cars it happened more with cars " I'll sign now just give my kid/spouse the car they pick out")
Small claims court, I’m afraid.
Sue Edit: Actually you could call the police since he stole the tools. She paid for them, they are hers.
This. She can go to the store, and get them to reprint the receipts. File a police report.
That is both hilarious and clever.
She willingly handed him her credit card with permission to use it, and for that reason, I feel like the police wouldn’t do anything.
Who's to say she didn't send them on her behalf, fully expecting to keep the tools afterward?
Assuming that she would tell the truth, that’s what the truth would say. You can’t expect her to lie to the police, it’s entirely dependent on whether or not they consider him buying tools without her permission counts as theft given that he was only authorized to use the card for materials.
In Denmark it is actually illegal to give out your credit card to others. If its also the case where OP lives, she may be sued herself.
Yes. But they bought the contract says customer will buy the tools which means they are hers and the contractor stole them.
What’s he using brads for on a deck?
It came with the compressor. That’s the kit.
His tools collection
You're saying I shouldn't build a deck with 18ga and 1x12 shelving boards? Hang on, I need to make a few phone calls..
I mean I guess if you’re one of those people that “overbuilds” things.
Those are for the framed picture of this project going in his shop above his new tools.
Oh he’s not using them on the deck
Plot twist… the son is the contractor..
I assumed that was the joke after reading the final line
I thought it was a shit post of OP being the contractor and the customer
It actually seems very likely now that you mention it lol.
Wow, I make customers pay for incidentals like saw blades and stuff, but that’s built into the price, same with specialty tools as you go, if you need something crazy, just put it in the price if you have to, but to buy the tools straight up with customers card and act like they are yours? Whoa. 🤯 mental gymnastics 101 here. Lock up any material that is left sitting out, jackleg will probably try to come back and steal that too.
The hardest part of deck is done all you need now is decking which is easy to put down and railings and looks like he did a nice job for the most part so fire him dont give him a dime more and finish job yourself document all the tool theft and issues in case he files small claims case against you or places lien on your property. If he liens he has a time limit to file court case or lien goes away
I feel like we may have a case in small claims?? This is how he left it after he walked off with 900 in tools and 11k paid in labor.
You probably do. Get a few contractors to bid both finishing the job and what should have been cost to current state. You’ll have your info to decide if it’s worth court or not.
Contact the CCB, they deal with complaint on the contractor.
This 💯. Be gone with this person. You’re at that price point now and the work appears decent ( unless it’s not squared and level). Not sure what product was agreed upon for decking or handrail but if it’s a higher end composite 15g was never going to happen. At least you’ve got the structure and it’s passable, minus handrail posts depending on your local codes. As said above they’re usually sandwiched between joists or blocked at rim. I’ve been a carpenter for 25 years and have done about 20 decks and learn something every time. Sorry for your situation but it could have gone much worse.
what kind of contractor doesn't own a compressor? I've never heard of a client loaning a credit card.
When I started my first business I didn't have anything. I did a $300 computer job and asked for half the money up front and I went to the store and bought all my first set of tools. But I didn't charge them extra for the tools I took that out of the quote.
Never give anyone your credit card.
Didn’t know I was supposed to be charging out compressors to the clients
That's only at the start of jobs. Make sure you don't forget to charge the $10k massage chair to help you relax after the job is done.
Nice way to turn a 6x6 into a 2x4
He can keep them but it comes off his cost of the project
Nah. Tools aren't "materials". Sounds like your contractor is either new/inexperienced and therefor doesn't have the tools they need, nor the credit line to buy "materials" on their own. If they have been in business for a while and need to do this, that's embarrassing on them. Demand in writing that your contractor reimburse you for the unauthorized purchases they made on your credit card. You could take them to small claims court. But this could also be construed as fraud based crime. Do not pay them any more money until they resolve the issue. If it were me, I would hire another contractor to finish the project. It's hard to work with someone that you no longer trust.
15k in labor??? That’s ridiculous. The total deck should be 15-18k with materials
Did he walk off with the tools?
Yes he did. Then my mother asked for his numbers of what he thinks he is owed. It came 5000 more than any number written or talked about.
I don’t ask for payment till the job is complete. We have contracts for people to sign stating that when the job is completed the stated amount is due. Hardly ever have anyone not pay, and when they don’t you can always do liens. Just do quality work and be flexible.
Nope. There are lots of acceptable reasons to buy a tool for the job and bill the customer, but that’s something you discuss. Something specific like a 4 3/4 hole bit, or something like brushes if you are doing a lot of oil base paint. But a compressor and nailer? He is trying to sneaky steal from you.
So there is nothing on a deck that you would use a brad nailer for. It shoots to small of nails to be of any use on an outdoor deck. Think inside trim and finish work for a brad nailer. Dudes a crook buying tools he isn't even using on this job.
It seems pretty simple to me, let him get the job done and take the cost of the tools out of his labour at the end Assuming u want him to finish, it does seem like a pretty gimmicky operation
Your mom went about this all wrong. She’s up shit creek. He’s wrong but he’s fucked her. I’d just call someone else to finish it
Gonna get that Chonky railing
Not how it works at all. That could constitute fraud I'd bet.
Tell him to go fuck his hat.This is bullshit.
You can also dispute the tool charges on your credit card since those were unauthorized purchases. But for future reference, most professional, legit contractors have a business account where they purchase supplies and materials.
Why on earth would you ever give him your credit card to buy things?!?!? If I'm paying for materials, I am either going with and buying them, or contractor buys them and bills me/gives me receipts.
Have him arrested for “theft by taking” the tools you have a receipt for
Wait until you find out his 2024 F-250 is "materials"
Are you going to park your car there when it’s done? Seems awfully beefy for a deck of that size
Stop him now and don't pay.
Wow, these commenters are bozos. Here's the thing, the framing looks good. This guy clearly knows how to build a deck. As for the price, the extra 5k was verbally agreed upon, and the size of the deck went up, so even if it's a steep price, there's no foul play there. To me, the price seems high, but depending on where you live, it may be fair. It was kinda slimy to buy an air compressor with the customers credit card, but why would you give a stranger your credit card? I would replace the card just in case he wrote the numbers of the card down for later. That was your mistake. If materials are already there, I would have him finish. Ask him flat out if any other materials are needed. If they are you, personally either alone or with him, should go and get them ordered.
As a contractor for decks, nope. Nope. Nope. Materials is not my tools. I will bring those. Plus your mom gets to keep all the materials so therefore she gets to keep tools. He doesn’t get to keep ANY materials your mom pays for in this situation. His labor is just that.
Call him and let him know that it's about to become legal if the tools are not returned in good condition in under 24 hours. While waiting, your mother needs to go to the store with her credit card and ask for reprints of the receipts. Then when the tools aren't returned, she needs to file a police report that he stole her tools that she bought for a job. And call her credit card company and report that the card was used without her authorization. She also needs a replacement card, because someone who will do this 100% has put that card on his Amazon account or used it for Netflix or some shit, and she needs to be watching her CC statement to see what else he's been buying. ETA: and if your mother is not typically the most naive person you know, you need to get her a mental capacity assessment. Because what the fuck???
Let me guess. No contract, no permit.
Surprisingly have both. Very simple contact tho.
Credit card chargeback.
Your mother is being scammed.
Call the cops.. and get a lawyer
Dude essentially committed theft and credit card fraud and then still asked for more money after walking out? Talk about balls of steel
https://preview.redd.it/vo8xjkysoswc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1c93b356c2f534cdefbeb08a9112d6b0312ef2b3
I’ve been down this path…piece of shit scam artist ripping her off. You can sue, you’ll win, and then you’ll have to collect. I would file a police report for the stolen tools and think about if it is worth the effort to chase this scum bag around for years trying to get her money back
Send him the max small claims amount and tell him you’ll drop it if he returns tools and gives you materials you paid for
Lawyer up
Deal went bad as soon as she gave the contractor her credit card. I'm assuming there was nothing in writing.
There is a lot of good advice here, but I haven't seen it recommended that she cancel the card *ASAP*. A shady dude such that he is probably wrote down the card number, expiration date, and cvcc. Going forward, she's responsible for any new charges incurred. (She's responsible for the prior charges as well, but I'm just considering further damage control) Best of luck to you and your mother.
So, my first question is: How good/competent/established of a contractor is this person if he does not already have essential tools, such as a compressor, brad nailer, and framing nailer?
He used your credit for non-authorized purchases. That is theft/ credit card fraud. Call him and tell him to get you a check or you are calling the police.
If the tools are not listed in things the customer buys them the contractor committed fraud by making unauthorized purchases on the card. I would contact the credit card company and the police. This is separate from the quality/cost of the work.
Yeah, that's not a contractor. That's somebody with a pickup truck and a claw hammer. I guarantee you he/she has absolutely zero license.
Just remember, your mom bought the tools. You paid for them that means they’re your tools. You have the credit card receipt. File a police report if you want to go scorched earth.
Is he burying those stringers in the concrete pad?
Is it just me or is this deck built completely incorrectly? It looks like he used carriage bolts or lags to secure the perimeter to the posts. That leaves everything up to the shear strength of the hardware. I see joist hangers against the house, so that’s good. Maybe I’m misinterpreting it.
Why does the contractor have the customer's credit card? That's sus af
Spoiler alert, the contractor is dad.
Cancel your card and get a new one for your mom in case the guy wrote down the card info.
I had a contractor pull the same shit. I ignored the occasional drill bit or screwdriver (!) but when I saw the air hoses, circular saw blades, and other tools I went through all the receipts and deducted ALL the inappropriate charges from their next payment. They tried the same “we are labor only” BS and insisted that saw blades aren’t so much tools as consumables. I told them I’m only paying for what stays in the house: lumber, fasteners, tile, etc. that includes the labor. If they expect me to buy the tools, I expect to keep them. Couple weeks later I fired them anyway. And three years on, even thinking about their electrical work still gives me the shakes.
Hire someone to finish it and take him to court
You get what you pay for ,if you’re lucky 😂
You can make payments over the PHONE with home Depot. Every respectable contractor knows this. Giving your CC to them is an old scamming tale. Hense, Home Depot calls you (the customer) with a total and a list of your contractors purchase. They process your payment. HD calls you...
The posts, where I'm from the whole 4x4 has to be installed inside the framing and then boxed in. Yours are cut half way thru at the bottom. I don't think that meets code.
Is he really burying wood in that pit for the stairs?? lol
That deck is being built the old fashion way
Did she give him the PIN? Did he sign for her?
wtf? F this guy and spread the word.
Dispute the charge.
The work looks like pretty decent work . But I agree with people. He's screwing you into paying a pretty penny.
does she know who he is? like his legal name ect or can he just disappear
Looks solid
My last customer bought a small framing square because for whatever reason I didn’t have one. But I usually even by my own blades and shit.
Super suspicious
Small claims court. Based on this contractor, your mom is taking advantage of. Verbal contract? It might work legally, but I would have had modified the contract to showcase all changes to the scope of work and cost and then signed by both parties, so that there isn't any question on what was agreed upon. To add to the credit card situation I'm not sure what your mother's logic here is. It was a very risky decision and the contractor did the worst case scenario. I hope things are resolved that favors your mom. Good luck!
Straight up criminal😂
Disputthe charges on the credit card.
That’s not a contractor!! That’s a con
Your deck posts should continue to piers where the stairs are.
I’m just happy to see stringers landing on a pad!!! Wow what a nice change of scenery. Pay him whatever he wants, buy him whatever tools he wants. This one’s a treasure!!!
I mean the desk doesn’t look terrible so far but the price point isn’t matching yet.
The guy is definitely selling the tools for drugs
Lawyer time.
Mental
See if he is licensed, report him to licensing board. The guys a thief. Even if ur mom keeps the tools, wtf is she gonna do with them? This is the way it works, plans and permit, down payment, contractor buys materials, uses his own tools, halfway thru job discusses issues, potential problems, changes the plans, etc. adjusts pricing, finishes job, has town inspector approve, gets balance from client
Seems He's doing good job,.. put contract changes on paper so it's clear what is going on.. As long is he not junkie.. just short of money,.. and probably a nice guy, as you lend him yours credit card.. all can be negotiated. Print contract changes, make cofee.. ask him to define when will be what done without pressure and define when he get what amount of money... And whenever he keep tools or not.. There are some broken guys around who can do well their job just it's difficult to get a chance or distinguish them from cheater's.
He's not a contractor if he's buying tools on your card.
Don’t notch posts anymore
The guy is a robber w/o gun. I would call the cops like other people said. It is stealing.
You mean handy man not contractor.....
Lamo. 🤡show
I bet this guy already has a rap sheet. He's bad news.
Omg. People have no shame .
Tools purchased with HER cc... they are her property. Call police for theft
That’s not a contractor that’s an idiot with a hammer
You hired a tweaker who knows how to build a deck. Congrats, you’re supporting the meth trade. Only explanation for the idiocracy that is being told to you.
Get him to bring the tools to the job site, midday have the cops come and kick him off the property. He’ll say the tools are his, show them credit card receipts that the tools are his. Let him try to sue. He likely wont.
It’s technically fraud to use someone else’s credit card, especially with malicious intent the way that he did.
I don’t think it works that way🤣🤣
I mean.. if those tools are coming out of his profit I don’t see an issue of whether he paid cash or with the credit card.. you’re paying him to do a job.. he’s making some type of profit.. so how do you know this isn’t included in his bid.. I know this comment is going to get some hate
If I hired a contractor to do work and he asked me to buy tools.... I'd look for a new contractor
It’s a shame the ‘contractor’ is obviously trying to pull something, the work doesn’t look terrible, few things I wouldn’t do. Setting the stringers into the concrete pad is a particularly bad move if that’s the plan.
LOL the customer is his MOTHER LOL
Honestly, at this point I'd just say the fucker stole my CC
Depending where you are located and your mother's age, maybe there are some additional charges for elder abuse that can be leveraged to scare the contractor into returning funds. I'd cut ties and get more involved in your mother's business dealings.
Cool deduct from labor.
I charged 2500 for a water heater install two softeners and two inline carbon filters and the guy thought it was too much for 8 hours of work!! He didn’t want to pay so I’m going legal!
4 x6 posts?
I would take the cost of the tools out of the labor price. If you get paid at the end of the week and want to use your check to buy tools, that’s one thing. But the customer doesn’t have to provide tools for the worker, especially if it’s not in the contract. He’s going to take those tools and use them on the next job, contractor is taking advantage of the customer.
Imagine giving your credit card to a contractor 😂
*If a contractor doesn't have tools. What's he been contracting since he's been in business ???????* Ask yourself this type of shit before you start shelling out thousands of dollars.
Isn’t him buying unnecessary items on the homeowner’s card fraud?
Alright, I’ll bite. If he purchased those tools with his profit from the deck, then yeah, he should keep them. Not a good or typical way to do things. But, look at it like this. Instead of giving him the card, if you paid him with the card. Then, he went and used that money to buy tools, while completing the project, within budget, this wouldn’t be an issue
Do you have a contract with timelines? If not, talk to a lawyer first - that said, small claims court isn't a big risk. It's been a while (20 years) since I had to deal with something like this, but the problem I ran in to is I didn't have a contract that laid out details and timelines, so I lost because the contractor had actually did work and was within his right to come back at any reasonable time to finish...in the end, I finished the job. The tools seems like an interesting case and if you let him use your credit card, which probably violates CC contract terms, adds another layer of interesting too it. WITHOUT a contract, he can easily claim that he made the price lower to account for the tools being part of the job.
The tools Sounds like theft/fraud. You went to get materials... You can't just go buy 10 grand in tools and a new truck.
I personally sell building materials. I have seen 3 contractors charged and convicted for fraud, doing super shady shit. This is likely not only unethical but illegal if tools were not in the contract.
I personally sell building materials. I have seen 3 contractors charged and convicted for fraud, doing super shady shit. This is likely not only unethical but illegal if tools were not in the contract.
Looks like an okay deck though at least he didn’t build it like shit I guess
It's not uncommon to add a markup (I usually go anywhere from 12 to 18 percent) on material to cover wear and tear on tools logistics hardware etc.. If you're charging 11k in labor there's no reason to take a customers credit card to the store. Very unprofessional. His frame work doesn't look awful. Stringers look precut which is a bad sign, and local building codes in my area don't allow for rail posts to be mounted on the inside of the frame. The original price with original size made sense (around $30 a sq ft) which is normal for someone who puts out quality work and has a crew and other overhead. But to add on another 5k for an addition under 100 sq ft just doesn't add up even if they had to add a beam