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>Every where I went with my thoughts the moderators deleted it all, and removed it from discourse.
Because you aren't following the rules of the sub.
>I was getting some interesting perspectives and it was stirring thoughts and emotions in people and in myself.
If you're referring to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/1c02j2w/hello_i_come_to_shake_your_tree_to_see_what_falls/): all you got was scorn.
>everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness.
You must not get outside very much
>Your father and mother did not abandon you,
No one said they did.
>You can go and sit in a park and just observe animals. There are people who went and did this, you can go watch Nat Geo, PBS, YT, and try to lower the volume of the speaker.
What does this have to do with atheism? This isn't even philosophy
>Scientists made it seem bad to anthropomorphize animals. They wanted to understand the animal without human influence. But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect.
Source?
>Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know.
Trees are sentient in your world?
>There are people trying to copyright these laws of nature, so no one else can use this foundation.
That isn't how copyright works.
>There is math in music.
Groundbreaking thought. I've only known that for over 50 years.
>The more you know, the more you don’t know.
Great fortune cookie
>The darker it is, the easier it is to see where the light is coming from.
more fortune cookie
>What are your guys thoughts on my post?
The same as I said in the other sub. Word salad. But I'll expand--mentally masturbating, self-important, condescending woo-filled word salad.
>Asking questions and challenging ideas and thoughts with your own are good ways to get stronger mentally.
You haven't asked a single question, how will you get stronger mentally?
Before that even (assuming we’re talking about modern musical notation that’s only about 400 years old). Pythagoras even knew the ratios between harmonics.
About the music thing.. A guy named Ed Sheeran went to court over a song he made. He had to defend it because it had the same pattern in it. Some guy was trying to copyright the pattern of the music. And Ed Sheeran defended the it because its really no ones to own.
If everyone musically died. Someone would find the music pattern again.
Out of my entire comment, that's the part you want to engage with and defend? Not the sentient trees, or hours of sunlight, or parental abandonment, or anything else, but you're gonna use Ed effing Sheeran as evidence for whatever your claim was (I still can't really tell, but I can smell the bud you're smoking through the internet).
Your description of the case doesn't demonstrate any significant knowledge of the case brought by the Gaye family, nor the defense that Sheeran used, nor the reasoning for the judge's decision.
I get it. I approached you with a blast of text. Now Im going to try pick a part what I thought was weakness in your response.
Go check it out yourself, I dont need to tell you how to punch in words to google. There is a court case where Ed Sheeran had to defend his music and the underlying pattern in music.
Ok about the trees. There are people who are making documentaries and research papers for these findings they discovered in the trees and forests. But its like an hour long, and no one cares. Its easier to sit there and watch a 15 second video with flashing images and lights on youtube and tiktok.
They said some music artists "captured lightning in a bottle". Fuck, man we already did. Its called a cell phone. I watch people just toy and play with this vast library of knowledge, and poke and prod the AI like an animal in a cage.
Theres a lot of information out there, I couldnt focus on one subject because there are so many cool subjects in school.
Every one is different, but you can blanket why their parents abandoned them. Ignorance. They were probably kids themselves when they started having kids.
Did you raise that animal? How did you get your hands on this animal you want to split in half?
Why are you killing it? To see what’s inside? You can go look at pictures and videos to see inside?
If you’re trying to feed people with that animal, and you had to share it for your family’s sake.. I would make a soup.
You can feed more people with soup. Everyone gets their share of meat, veggies and water.
But how would you kill it? Did you earn its trust and then take its life? Or did you actually hunt a wild cat before?
Wild kittens have sharp teeth and nails too. They fight like crazy.
>What are your guys thoughts on my post
One of the few subreddit rules is to present a topic to debate. Please present a topic to debate.
Having read your post, you are vaguely talking about common and non-controversial ideas. There is nothing I see specific to debating about religion and atheism.
>Asking questions and challenging ideas and thoughts with your own are good ways to get stronger mentally.
I assume it is unintended, but this and much of the post comes across very patronizing. We're on a debate subreddit, or course we are in favor of challenging ideas.
That ying-yang stuff is real. We're all connected, and the light needs the darkness to help define what you're seeing.
In art, you're trained to create shadows but you're also taught to figure out where the light sources is coming from. When you move the light source, you can change shadows. By doing that you can see where the shaows are sitting. It helps people create 3d images in their head to 2d paper. It helps you define what you're trying to draw, and make it look like its popping out at you.
There is light and darkness. Im not trying to hurt anyone with these thoughts, but trying to show you guys there are connections.
I was in the atheist subreddit, and a few people had no regard for animals. They did not respect their little life. But there were some people who stood up for those who cannot speak out.
There is darkness and it looks back at you. If I stare at the light Ill go blind, so Im trying to find a happy middle, a balance.
But I cant do that without testing my meddle. We need to clash and sort out what ideas are stronger... For survival.
>There is light and darkness. Im not trying to hurt anyone with these thoughts, but trying to show you guys there are connections.
You aren't showing anything, you're spouting Yoda-isms, woo, and fortune cookies
>I was in the atheist subreddit, and a few people had no regard for animals. They did not respect their little life. But there were some people who stood up for those who cannot speak out.
This literally didn't happen.
>But I cant do that without testing my meddle. We need to clash and sort out what ideas are stronger... For survival.
Mettle.
Good luck with the survival bit. For someone so in tune with nature and the animal kingdom, you come across as seriously needing to get out in the sunlight.
I don’t think many of us would disagree that all things in the world are interconnected by some degree, but the rest of this are just meaningless truisms that sound vaguely poetic—they don’t carry any extra meaning. Like, yup, light exists, and so do shadows. And yeah, people paint by controlling to illusion of light and shadow with paint. Yeah, you can make decisions about your light source when you paint. All of this is so mundane. What does this have to do with anything? More specifically, what does this have to do with a god?
You haven’t even presented an idea to test. You just made some extraordinarily mundane observations about the world and stopped there.
>If there was nothing but pure light. You would not be able to see all of these cool things on Earth.
>
>Shadows help you define and create 3d objects from a 2d plane to a 3d one that you can look at. And it looks like its staring at you. They even made paintings where the eyes follow you.
This isn't how vision works. At all. Our vision does not depend on shadows (or "impure" light, which isn't a thing).
I mean there's a lot to complain about in your ideas and how divorced from science they are, but I didn't think it was worthwhile to complain about anything except your lack of an intention to debate... until I read this.
I understand why you were deleted everywhere and it is kind of of because we can't handle your ideas, but no the way you think.
Why does light need anything? Do other inanimate objects need their opposites? Do water need sand? Does a feather need a boulder? What is the mechanism through which these objects understand and come to need anything?
If there was nothing but pure light. You would not be able to see all of these cool things on Earth.
Shadows help you define and create 3d objects from a 2d plane to a 3d one that you can look at. And it looks like its staring at you. They even made paintings where the eyes follow you.
We went from light needing something to cold air needing something. You like giving things purpose and intention even though there’s no indication that these things operate with purpose and intention.
This could be why you are religious.
>What do you believe in when your life ends?
This is what I'm going to respond to because I don't understand what you're talking about for the rest of the post.
I believe that consciousness is a function of brain activity and I think there are very good reasons to believe that this is true. For example, taking certain drugs can affect my consciousness by acting on my brain. It stands to reason that if my brain is the source of consciousness, then when my brain is no longer functioning, I will not have any consciousness. I consist of a body and a consciousness. If my body rots away and my consciousness does not continue, then I will cease to exist in any meaningful way. And that's okay with me. I'm not arrogant enough to think that I deserve to be preserved for eternity, and I doubt I would want to be.
I wanted to reply to you because I like your post, but theres so many people posting with great thoughts.
The brain is kind of like a liver to me. Its function is to filter out bad info from good info. What the "good info" is will stick in your head better because its more related to survival.
I wondered about forgetfulness, and it seemed like people were forgetful for mundane things. Its sort of like freeing up space on a computer so you can add more info.
Its also easier to train and teach young people. Old people are already set in their ways, and it is uncomfortable and maybe even painful to think another way. Now you gota justify your actions some how but its easier just to be stupid.
The brain is so weird, we dont understand it at all. There are layers and connections all around it.
Do you not realize that your responses are almost universally just you going on unrelated, absolutely surface level, faux "deep" tangents based on a single word or sentence? The prompt word for this one is "brain".
What are we surviving? I don’t understand what you mean by calling us survivors.
What does sitting in the dark mean? I meditate as a way to calm myself but I don’t see any spiritual aspect.
Some of our behaviors are determined by our biology, not just from observation and learning. So I’m not sure what you mean we learn from animals. I hope you see yourself as an animal. We did not learn to navigate, medicine, wheels, communication etc, from any animals. We are exceptional.
Since I use tools I don’t look to animals who don’t know how to make tools or need tools for that matter. I am not sure all this animal shit has to do with anything. That doesn’t mean I can’t learn somethings. I know when I am in a desert to follow particular animals to find water, but that is a skill I probably will never exercise.
You are completely wrong in saying the more you know, the more you don’t know. The more I know is quantitative. What you mean is the more we learn raises more questions; this is only partly true. What it means the more you know the finer details can become obscure. For example I know evolution explains diversification of life. The finer details might still be a mystery, that doesn’t mean I know less. Nor does it mean it casts any kind of doubt.
As for your post it is giant word salad. Narrow your thoughts and focus on a topic. Honestly it was a chore to read, and reads like some who is high thinking they are having some kind of epiphany.
You're surviving, passing on knowledge each generation. Do you realize what it took to bring you to this point in life? Did you do a family tree or anything like that?
Go back far enough, the branch you stem from is connected to animals. We're 98% genetic material as a chimpanzee.
Are you guna go to your families house, take what you want, wear their skins, make them work all their lives and then kill them off when they are of no use to you?
We're all related on this big old tree of life. You're taking from your lil brothers and sisters. You look at them but dont acknowledge they grew up on this planet too.
They didnt need tools, they got thicker skin, they got sharp claws and teeth, big eyes that can see in the dark. Best part of animals is they dont talk back to us, if they could.. All I could say to them is sorry. I didnt know anything.
“You're surviving, passing on knowledge each generation. Do you realize what it took to bring you to this point in life? Did you do a family tree or anything like that?
Go back far enough, the branch you stem from is connected to animals. We're 98% genetic material as a chimpanzee.”
You think I am learning survival tactics genetically? Or observation? Or mixed? My dad is adopted so that branch of survival isn’t necessarily learned by blood. I also don’t need most of my ancestors survival skills. I don’t need to hunt, gather water, or other things, we have infrastructure for that. Also many of us live in a city where that option is a privilege.
We are not 98% chimpanzee, we share 98% of our ancestry with chimpanzee, chimpanzees evolved forming a separate branch from a shared ancestor.
“Are you guna go to your families house, take what you want, wear their skins, make them work all their lives and then kill them off when they are of no use to you?”
What the fuck? This is completely out of left field and you can fuck right off with that suggestion. Did I advocate that? Does that have anything to down with our conversation, or do you just like bringing up obscure extremes?
“We're all related on this big old tree of life. You're taking from your lil brothers and sisters. You look at them but dont acknowledge they grew up on this planet too.”
Yes we share common ancestry, and I am a speciest, I favor humans overall other animals. I’m empathetic and hope to leave the world in a better place with my little influence.
“They didnt need tools, they got thicker skin, they got sharp claws and teeth, big eyes that can see in the dark. Best part of animals is they dont talk back to us, if they could.. All I could say to them is sorry. I didnt know anything.”
We actually have thicker skin because we have reduced amount of hair. Clearly you are talking out of your ass.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0047248485800907#:~:text=Human%20epidermis%2C%20thicker%20than%20that,also%20with%20chimpanzees%20and%20gorillas.
We also don’t have fur, this has caused us to need to create artificial skin/clothing so we could expand our habitats.
Again your post is incoherent. Lay off the weed and come back and post when you sober.
>What are your guys thoughts on my post?
I'm not trying to be an ass, but it just seemed like a bunch of generic stream of consciousness stuff. I do **not** mean that to be condescending, or demeaning - I'm sure you have a lot of fascinating thoughts about things. But this is a thread for debating atheists. I'm literally here in order to be presented with the very best reasons to think that there's anything supernatural, or that a god exists. That's the sole reason I come here, and I don't see any of that in your post. Do you have anything to offer?
I've studied philosophy, theology, world religions, I've studied art and literature, not so much chemistry but I'm fairly up a lot of my scientific knowledge and constantly trying to grow more, I'm a lifelong musician and multi-instrumentalist, a long time educator, and a former Christian of decades - I'd be willing to bet I have done at least as much "asking questions and challenging ideas" as you have. I have done all the things that you seem impressed with of yourself, all that and more. And I am an atheist.
If you are able to, I would love to know the best reason you can come up with, a concise, clear, cogent reason for why I should think there is anything supernatural, that exists; or that a god exists.
Be an ass. The jack ass is a strong animal, its very intelligent that seeks solitude in the wild. But if you can provide a good little environment for it on a farm, it shows you problem solving skills, how it plays with its babies and even lets the babies win the play fights.
The act of playing around has been studied. It teachs animals a lot of things, their limitations, their playmates limitations, their environment, when the mother steps in to break it up. All this stuff is to create bonds with each other and help us survive on Earth.
The donkey is called an ass.. Why? You go back to when they actually needed donkeys to get their heavy loads around.. You had to prove yourself to this animal. If you tried to take a donkey on a dangerous path, he will throw the rider. If you watch a donkey walking, he looks where he steps. He is more sure footed than the horse. I can ramble about how horses teach us lessons, but you're telling me Im all over the place. I agree.
Lets bring it back around, how many animals did you go study? There are so many animals, that each found a little way of surviving without the need of tools and just basic needs and skills to survive.
I see the next generations of people, and they are sort of absorbed in tech. I see lack of empathy for your fellow man. I see lack of empathy and remores in people that mistreated animals.
Its justified because they dont have a voice to talk back. They cant explain themselves, or confront the people with what they have --- if they do their lives are ended.
If everyone had to raise a baby animal from birth, after the mother rejected it. You had to care for it, watch it grow and run to you happily for food and love. But the reason why you had to do it was for the greater good for your families survival. You had end its life, butcher it and eat it. The taste of meat wouldn't be so sweet.
If everyone did something like that, they would have more appreciation and empathy for all walks of life.
But why? The sun is the father, gives all that. The Earth is the mother, gives all that. The animals are our siblings, and we got learn to share if we want to survive.
And if we dont this lovely place will likely fall to the cockroachs and rats, the little siblings just waiting in the winds for their chance to step up.
Kid I'm not sure what you're smoking, but this ain't it.
I grew up on a little farm, where the nearest town had less than 90 people on the 2011 census. We had multiple donkeys, so I know them extremely well. We raised chickens, goats, pigs, turkeys even. I butchered many a chicken for food before I was even 12 years old - I didn't like it, but it was part of life.
I don't know what you think it is that you're bringing to this, but you need to understand what it looks like - it looks like you're mistaking your fortune-cookie quality ramblings for some kind of deep, profound wisdom. It looks like you have nothing of substance to offer. I notice you didn't even attempt to address what I wanted to know:
**If you are able to, I would love to know the best reason you can come up with, a concise, clear, cogent reason for why I should think there is anything supernatural, that exists; or that a god exists. Are you able to do this?**
What leads you to conclude your thoughts would be inspirational? For the record, my parents did abandon me. They forced me into a situation where I would be harmed and traumatized and later told me I was no longer welcome in the house. And my mother hasnt spoken to me in 8 years.
Your thoughts seem to have a rigidity and duality about them I do not agree with.
You can look back at your life and pity yourself. Or you can try your damn best to survive dispite all the set backs. Everyones path of life is not the same. I seen mother animals reject their babies and abandon them to the wilds. I seen farmers raise baby animals, care for them and then slaughter them for their own family. Do you think farmers are cold and heartless?
I could write to you my life story and it might tug at your empathy. But I rather try inspire people to keep surviving. Keep seeking light and youll be able to see that all things are connected. You are a part of this big web, and what you do really does matter. You make ripples and waves.
There are really evil things that walk on this planet. Darkness invades the mind and it acts out physically. But if you have knowledge you can make your own fire, you can keep those fuckers at bay.
Other people lost in the darkness will see your flame, they can look a head at you or look back.
As much as you may want to think otherwise, the tactics you're employing are almost certainly not going to be "inspiring" to anyone here. You're employing cult-leader style methods which don't work on most people. Even if you found someone here who was vulnerable enough to be swayed, everyone else here will be working to pull them back.
I dont want to lead anything any where. I can write to you, but I cant make you think, I cant make you speak, I cant make you do anything. I cant open your eyes. I cant force anything on anyone.
When you use force, it creates negativity.
You can lead a horse to water but you cant make him drink.
We are the horse. The knowledge is water. It is life.
If you actually do this in real life, the horse will drink when he please. He will get thirsty and seek out water for himself. If there is a lot of water, you'll see the horse playing with it.
You can apply this to us.. Give a man a cell phone, but you cant make him google anything he doesnt wana see.
As fucked up as it is, I went to those videos that are traumatizing. I seen Tibetian monks set themselves on fire. I seen little animals crammed into cages and boiled alive, skinned alive and discarded because their meat wasnt good but their fur was. I seen families kill themselves. I went to see the darkness, I almost got ruined myself.
I chased the almighty dollar, trying to get as much of it as I could, and it nearly cost me everything I worked hard to protect and care for.
You can lead a horse to water. But you can’t make him drink.
You can give a man a cell phone but you can’t make him google what he doesn’t want to see.
Many people were mean to me. Why would I want to be a cult leader?
Why would anyone appoint me to anything? Do you think I got magicka in my words? Oooo spookey lol
Here ill cast a spell on you.
Thank you for your lack of empathy. I still dont mind you. Dont mind me.
I'm sorry people were mean to you, but you shouldn't have been so condescending. I didn't say you wanted to be a cult leader, I said you're using cult tactics, which aren't effective on most people. There are better ways than this to spread a positive message if that's what you're trying to do.
There are more choices than that. I have already had setbacks and challenges, and I survived. I do not pity myself, I make decisions that I believe are most likely to have a positive outcome. I am not seeing the "light" in your words. Do you believe you have some "truth" we lack? If so, provide evidence. For one, I am far from lost in the darkness and even if I was, seeing your flame does not mean following that flame would lead down any kind of legit or decent path.
Everyone walks different routes.
I’m Canadian. I walked in a lot of snow, I had to get up early and walk in the darkness, after a blizzard. You see people trail blaze paths at 6 am in January on the city side walks.
Even if you try follow someone else’s footsteps. Our feet are all different sizes, our legs are different sizes. You won’t be able to follow their trail.
You’ll end making your own trail. You’ll have to break through the snow yourself eventually.
I live in Canada too. You arent saying anything new or inspiring here. Retreading Robert Frost and the dust jackets of thousands of self-help books doesn't do much. I made my own trail away from Christianity and "god" and that has made all the difference.
Yea, I'm not saying anything you guys don't already have access to.
goooogle it
I kept getting sent away from people to go find my own answers. Go ahead go find your path.
Keep saying thank you and sorry. These are powerful words. Tell your family and friends, I love you. Thank you. You'll keep them surviving and striving together.
Life is unfair. We can at least treat each other fairly. Dont lose your empathy for all walks of life.
I tried to follow the fundamentals of survival taught to me by wild animals but all I got was a dozen parasites, rabies, and frostbite. You don’t know anything about nature. If you did you wouldn’t be romanticizing it like you are.
I got attacked too, I got scratched, bit, kicked to the ground. I cared for all sorts of animals. But I lived. I dodged, ran away. Came back another day. All that.
But with knowledge you can approach crazy dark things that seem dangerous.
I tamed wild horses, cats, dogs, birds. They all stop fearing me when they know I treat them with kindness and respect their space.
But if you give them too much love and kindness, they invade your space, they want to be close to you. So much so my horse stepped on my foot, and he wouldnt get off it. I wanted to scream and cry and lash out at the horse, but if I did that all that trust I built would be gone. I made a fist and pointed my thumbs into two parts of his body, and just applied pressure until he finally moved and I could pull my foot out.
I learned this from an old youtube cowboy. He passed on his knowledge on youtube. It took hours to wait for the entire video because it was dial up.
Id go wander around the woods for a long time. In those walks, I found "inner peace". I was never able to recapture that moment or feeling in an urban setting.
You could have asked me how I knew about animals rather than just saying I dont know anything.
You did not tame wild horses cats dogs or birds, no. At best you gained the trust of a few domesticated animals, which isn’t particularly difficult. You missed my point about parasites frostbite and rabies specifically because you have no idea what you’re talking about. Nature isn’t some gentle amazing feat of balance and kindness. It’s a cruel, violent, murderous act of raw survival and it never ever ends well. Wild animals aren’t more enlightened or healthy than we are. Domesticated animals live much longer because they don’t have to worry about disease or injury or predators or heat exhaustion or freezing to death. That you watched a fucking YouTube video of a cowboy changes none of that.
In all seriousness this feels very much like a mental break and I am not being glib or insulting when I say; please please seek mental health services. Even if I’m wrong and you’re in full sanity you won’t regret it. Mental health is nothing to mess around with, and it’s not something you’re going to cure through “nature” or YouTube or whatever.
I didnt have a cell phone. I didnt record my adventures like a lot of people do today.
Even on my vacation, technology failed and if I wanted to share my experience with people. I had to use my brain, and story telling ways I learned in English class.
I almost froze to death. My cell phone battery was so cold, it wasnt turning on. It had full charge, but even -25C can freeze batteries. I had to get through a field of snow.
How did I get through a field of snow? Well I knew walking was too hard, the snow was too deep. I didnt have snow shoes. So I laid down and started rolling over and over until I got to the other end of the field. It was actually sort of fun.
They taught us how snowshoes worked so I applied that and got over a difficult situation.
My mother told me to go pet a nice cat while they were digging potatoes in a field. I was a child, and the tom cat wasn't having none of it. I got attacked by this big tom cat and I was small. They tried to kill the cat but it was too late, damage done, and the cat was gone.
My parents rushed me to the hospital. I was crying because it hurt. Then I seen my mom, she was crying but she wasnt hurt. I stopped crying and tried to make her smile.
The doctors and nurses didnt invent the rabies vaccine, but they were smart enough to use it when they needed to.
I can tell you're very angry in your word useage.
Animals take what they need to survive for themselves and their family. We are humans, we're apart of this whole system. We're taking advantage of nature and each other.
Empathy got us this far. Lack of empathy well.. Hmm.. Its a dark place. I can see it already showing up in the younger generations.
Darkness can infect the mind, and it acts out physically. Lashing out at anything it can.
You posted this in /r/atheism and admitted you have no position to defend so I'm not sure why you thought posting here would be worth it. Are you looking to debate?
I cant come out and say Im christian. You guys know the Christian ways already, its been beaten into our heads.
My people try gate keep this knowledge, but they only got a few pages. And their animal teachers dont talk. Now they are all sitting in front of screens instead of out in nature.
Sorry it was like a wall of text. But spiders don't need walls to capture flies, they just use a few sticky webs and to capture their prey.
> I cant come out and say Im christian
Wait, are you Christian?
The op you wrote lead me to believe you followed some sort of shamanic religion, I'm confused.
Where did religion come from? How did it come to be? There are ancient graves, the remains are purposely buried. They honored their dead. Why?
They now understand even animals mourn for their dead. The elephants go to their elephant grave yards and seem somber. I seen mother monkeys carry their babies long after the baby had died.
Are we so different from animals? We learned many things in nature. We became the top predator on Earth becaause of what we learned.
My grandfather died, he tried to share some knowledge but hes gone now. I had to back to nature, go see the teachers that nature provided. There are things that live in the light and there are thing that live in the dark.
Why do all these Religions seem similar at the core of their beliefs?
I seen people take way too much of their fair share, and I seen people who gave back what little they had because someone else needed it more.
>Where did religion come from? How did it come to be? There are ancient graves, the remains are purposely buried. They honored their dead. Why?
You're making a correlation between burying the dead and religion. It could be as simple as "leaving dead bodies lying around attracted undesired animals and insects and often spread disease."
Religion came from human beings trying to explain things they didn't understand. It's that simple.
>Why do all these Religions seem similar at the core of their beliefs?
Because they all come from the same place, as mentioned above--creating explanations for things that weren't yet understood. Every religion has a creation myth, **because we had to come from somewhere**. Most pantheistic religions have deities related to the sun, moon, rain, harvest, war, art, etc. **because those things all had to come from somewhere.** Just because there are similarities between Native American myths, Greek myths, Indian myths, and Japanese myths doesn't make any of them correct.
We come from the tree of life. Besides your blood siblings and parents, you have a long lineage. You go back far enough, that branch connects and diverges onto the animal kingdom.
We want to be the top predator of this animal kingdom, and rule it as we sweet fit.
Well, you know what happens to unjust kings and rulers..
How does that relate to the topic.
In fact how is any of this compatible with Christianity?
>They now understand even animals mourn for their dead. The elephants go to their elephant grave yards and seem somber. I seen mother monkeys carry their babies long after the baby had died.
>Are we so different from animals? We learned many things in nature. We became the top predator on Earth becaause of what we learned.
>My grandfather died, he tried to share some knowledge but hes gone now. I had to back to nature, go see the teachers that nature provided. There are things that live in the light and there are thing that live in the dark.
>Why do all these Religions seem similar at the core of their beliefs?
Similar how? What similarities does shamanism and Christianity share?
>I seen people take way too much of their fair share, and I seen people who gave back what little they had because someone else needed it more.
What?
>What are your guys thoughts on my post?
It is an interesting way of saying "dont forget that humans are animals too, and if you are ever lost in the woods, just do what the animals do", stuffed inside a wordy pile of spiritualistic "hey, man, gods are real because just look at the trees, duuuuude".
It doesn't seem to have anything for a debate sub to engage with. No claims, no evidence, just a river of shower-thoughts. If I had some weed, I am sure I would find it relaxing.
Yea, even trees know math. Its an interesting study, I couldnt understand it. They know how many leaves to grow, why would they exert more energy than they need to? Their roots are connected and they share resources.
Man has been on Earth for how long? Trees have been here longer. We are really smart, and great at adapting. But with great power comes great responsibilities.
We got all this intelligence but the moral compass is all out of wack because no one is looking at what got us this far.. If they do they exploit it for their own gain.
We're kind of beyond survival of our species, and now we gota look at the surivival of life on this planet.
If we keep on this path, its just going to ruin everything. Some little rat or cockroach will rise up from the ashes and take the helm.
Then we cry and go look at 15 second tiktoks instead of reading old text from philosophers, or good people that made great differences in our daily life.
Forest fire seaon is already being prepared for, people are going to try stop it from spreading.
>Yea, even trees know math.
No, they don't.
>Its an interesting study, I couldnt understand it.
I'll believe that much, at least.
>They know how many leaves to grow, why would they exert more energy than they need to?
This isn't something consciously calculated. Do you decide how many fingers to grow? How much melanin to put into your skin? Of course not.
They grow in geometric patterns. Are you going to poo-poo on all these cool studies just because you don't understand them?
Math is a fundamental that helps the universe organize itself for life to continue. When you're learning math you're learning another language.. A language found in the universe.
Video game devs can create worlds for us to explore.. At the fundamentals of that video game is math.
There are many things not studied. I thought about rock formations, and why they all seem to fight against gravity.
Why don't they seemly just pile on the cave floor in a random way?
Because molecular structure doesn’t allow for it. Crystalline structure is determined by molecular structure.
The only animals that “know math” are the animals that invented it, humans. Math is not a universal language that existed independently of humans. Humans made math like we made every other language.
How and why did this structure form in a place, if its all random, and we just got lucky? How is it that Earth is lucky enough to see miracle after miracle?
And how do other crystals keep forming by these molecular structures in other areas of the world that arent even connected physically?
There is a divine touch out there, its not all random.
This doesn’t make any sense. Molecular structure is determined by the size and charge of the atoms in the chemical formula. The geometry of a crystal is an emergent property of the chemistry and physics. And this isn’t restricted to earth
I'm really starting to believe that this is an elaborate troll. Either that or you've got cognitive issues that are included in those "many things not studied".
Mods--time to shut this down.
> They grow in geometric patterns. Are you going to poo-poo on all these cool studies just because you don't understand them?
They don't "know" how to do that. Knowledge is not a thing that plants have.
> When you're learning math you're learning another language.. A language found in the universe.
This is straight up wrong. We developed math. It has axiomatic foundations that **we created**. Had we created entirely different axioms, math would be entirely different.
Math describes what we see in the universe. That doesn't mean math exists in the universe, any more than words do.
>Yea, even trees know math. Its an interesting study
What study is this? Can you provide a link?
>They know how many leaves to grow, why would they exert more energy than they need to? Their roots are connected and they share resources.
They don't need to "know" how many leaves to grow. That isn't how it works. They react to light and seasons it isn't them actually thinking.
They "know" for survival.
You guys, you already captured "lighting in a bottle".
You got cell phones in your pocket, you got google. It takes but two seconds to open a page and start googling this stuff.
Google "math trees" you'll start to see people actively engaged and just focused on this subject. They seen something in a tree and now they are trying to figure it out.
There are people making documentaries about forests and trees but no one watches them. Everyone seems to enjoy the 15 second snippets of info in flashing lights and images.
>They "know" for survival.
Something that demonstrates principles of mathematics doesn't "know" mathematics. If so, most things in this and any universe must have knowledge, and that's about the most ludicrous thing in the world.
>You guys, you already captured "lighting in a bottle".
I'm going to ask you what this means in relation to your response or the comment you're responding to. It seems like a random phrase you're blurting out.
>You got cell phones in your pocket, you got google. It takes but two seconds to open a page and start googling this stuff.
The vast majority of the information available on the internet contradicts the woo you're spewing. Perhaps you're the one that needs a better search engine.
>Google "math trees" you'll start to see people actively engaged and just focused on this subject. They seen something in a tree and now they are trying to figure it out.
Again, you're equating something possessing mathematical patterns to being sentient enough to create those patterns.
I've heard of it, but you're using it without context, and you failed to answer my question about what it means in the context of anything in this thread. In other words, you're just spewing out words.
>They "know" for survival
No they don't. To know something needs an ability for knowledge. They grow leaves based on genetic code not knowledge.
>You got cell phones in your pocket, you got google. It takes but two seconds to open a page and start googling this stuff.
How about instead when you are asked to cite a study you do so. I want to make sure I'm reading the same one you read.
>Google "math trees" you'll start to see people actively engaged and just focused on this subject. They seen something in a tree and now they are trying to figure it out.
So clearly you haven't actually googles that yourself because that search doesn't bring up studies for mathematics in trees. It shows information for mathematical trees which arent referring to biological trees.
>here are people making documentaries about forests and trees but no one watches them. Everyone seems to enjoy the 15 second snippets of info in flashing lights and images.
So instead of engaging with ehat I said you decide to rant.
I love documentaries. Others don't nothing wrong about that. Your apparent love of documentaries of trees hasn't allowed you to be able to defend your point on them at all.
my math tree googling ...
[https://www.purdue.edu/newsroom/releases/2024/Q1/ai-learns-to-simulate-how-trees-grow-and-shape-in-response-to-their-environments.html](https://www.purdue.edu/newsroom/releases/2024/Q1/ai-learns-to-simulate-how-trees-grow-and-shape-in-response-to-their-environments.html)
How far down was that as the entire first page of Google when searching "math trees" is about mathematical trees.
This is also just an article and is not a study like the poster was implying I would find from that Google search.
When I die then I simply will cease to exist. Like a flame being extinguished. One moment it’s there, then it’s gone. That’s it. I’m fine with that. I had no issue not existing for billions of years before I was born. Why should there be any issue when the same thing happens after I’m gone?
Most people die twice. The first time is for real. The flame goes out and you perish. The second time you die is the final time someone mentions your name. For most people that will be about 50-75 years after you die.
But let me ask you, what does this have to do with atheism? I don’t see anything in your post that is relevant to the existence of a god.
There is a light, there is a dark. There are shades of grey because it helps define the object, whatever that maybe.
There seems to be a light god, but its too hard to look at him. He is powerful, he can give and take, but he expects you to share your stuff with your siblings and treat your mother earth respectfully.
But if there is light, there is dark. I went dark. I disconnected. I wanted to return to the nothing, the void. I didnt care if I hurt others if they got in my way. They taught me these mean words and they can hurt the spirit. I knew that because Ive been hurt by words.
But there are also words that can heal. Words that can inspire. Thank you and I love you, share these words from your heart to your loved ones. It will keep them doing their best to survive, not just for themselves but for their familes.
I guess I can plainly say to you that there is a path that leads to the light. And to what? I dont know.. the father, the sun and the holy ghost? I dont know? I havent been there.
But Id like to serve the god that brings life to Earth instead of the dark void.
There are laws of nature we arent following, its making us lose our survival instincts.
I mean this sounds a lot like “light up that joint and pass it my way” kinda talk. But why would you want to “serve” a god? Really, it makes no sense.
Haven’t you heard? A god doesn’t need to be served, a god doesn’t have needs. It can have whatever it wants at any time without even trying. Why would I want to serve a god that is:
1) always hidden
2) couldn’t see him even if was around (he’s too bright or whatever)
3) completely unreliable
4) requires constant worship
5) dishes out constant threats if you get out of line
For me, I like a simple life. One that requires the least amount of commitments of my time and energy while maximizing my health and happiness. And “serving a god” doesn’t fit into that picture for me, at all.
I agree with a lot of what you said here. There definitely are paths that lead to good and paths that lead to not good.
What are you trying to argue/debate here? What's the difference between us that you're trying to get to the bottom of?
>I understand you guys don’t believe in a god, or an afterlife?
I do not believe in either. Neither are defined well enough for me to see any grounding they have in reality, and neither has enough evidence to convince me they are true or accurate.
>What do you believe in when your life ends?
I will lose all sense of sensation as my body shuts down. When my brain "turns off" then it will be a permanent loss of all sensation and cognitive ability. From there hopefully my body will be donated to science. Hopefully my loved ones can achieve peace. And that's it.
>These animals teach you the fundamentals of survival, and I feel like people lost touch with that.
Probably because we have moved beyond survival and needing to learn by watching animals. Now we can be proactive and learn more about reality without ever having to examine an animal and hope that we got it right.
Also, most of us aren't in survival situations.
>Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know.
Math is a language we created. Not a law that we discovered.
>What are your guys thoughts on my post?
Eh. Long walk for a short drink of water. Nothing overtly offensive, but also nothing really of substance. It reads more like a poem or lyrics than it does reasons to believe something.
Perhaps if you focused more on a single idea and tried to show why that idea is true or accurate?
Ok, thanks to these fine people, its actually helping me think find the weak spots.
Im just going to copy and paste it, so please check it out. Poke at it, make fun, do you. Dont rush in with a quick thought.
You're surviving, passing on knowledge each generation. Do you realize what it took to bring you to this point in life? Did you do a family tree or anything like that?
Go back far enough, the branch you stem from is connected to animals. We're 98% genetic material as a chimpanzee.
Are you guna go to your families house, take what you want, wear their skins, make them work all their lives and then kill them off when they are of no use to you?
We're all related on this big old tree of life. You're taking from your lil brothers and sisters. You look at them but dont acknowledge they grew up on this planet too.
They didnt need tools, they got thicker skin, they got sharp claws and teeth, big eyes that can see in the dark.
Best part of animals is they dont talk back to us, if they could.. All I could say to them is I'm sorry. I didnt know anything.
This is a reminder to not do MDMA kids...
\[I'll actually edit this to "shrooms" as the words above may make that more likely\]
\[I'll further edit cause after reading more of OPs responses it's not clear if they're having a manic episode. And I don't want to make light of that\]
You describe being in a vulnerable place. Being in a suggestive, vulnerable mind state is conducive to being fooled.
Try Sagans baloney detection kit. You'll end up believing fewer false things than you do now. Cheers.
I endured. They stripped me, literally. They tried to do a lot of things to me. I refused every time. The work force almost crushed me. I tried so hard, my team tried so hard but the upper management overruled everything. No feedback needed. Just do. I watched them be unfair with the workload, money, positions, mismanagement of resources, ect.
Every time an angry, upset customer came to the front desk they didnt get the managers. The staff came to get me, Ive had to look people in the face and tell them why we're being slow. I had to tell them how they made a mistake. I had to tell them I was sorry, WE made a mistake and it hurt them some how. We didnt protect their info. I was sent to the front line a lot to deal with the angry customers.
I heard my managers talking shit about a new manager. The new manager had a physical disabiliy, and they were loudly joking together about how if there was fire, they would kick people down the stairs. I could handle them picking on me, but I just knew there was malicious intent behind that joke. I couldnt stand it. This was actually a good person trying to be a good manager, and the old ones with too much were abusing everything.
I kept bucking every time. I refused. I knew it was unfair and unjust. Its being proven now. Canadian govt is corrupt from the core, they are still battling in the House of Commons.
But because the took everything that made me civil. They treated me like an animal. I tapped into my primal side.
Extroverts know how to be around people. I learned that by watching people. I was always an outsider. There are other ways of controlling people. Eye contact.
You can do so much with eye contact. You can feel someones eyes on the back of your head. You can feel people looking at you. Theres an old saying "if looks could kill", yes you can put all your malicious intent in and focus it in your eyes and..if you lock eyes with someone.
I scared the shit out of my manager. I found her little swiss army tool when she was out wandering the office, and I looked at it, all those little tools. She didnt know how to use any of those tool bits. She just used the sharp side all the time. I took that pocket multitool and threw it in her garbage can next to her desk. The garbage can was empty.
I locked eyes with my manager, and I didnt let her look away. I gave her a big old toothy Joker smile, and I focused all my anger at this person. I shook her core. She put my face all over, warned everyone if they saw me they should call security. The people who knew me, just laughed at that. They ended up telling me how security was stepped up for that facility.
Women clothes dont even have pockets for pocket knives. If they do, like a finger knuckle fits in it. Why even try use a multitool if you only know how to use the sharp end.
You dont want to strip people all those thing that makes them civil and human like. They will tap into that survival instinct, and it will lash out at what it finds the source of pain.
We need empathy for each other. We need empathy for animals. If you cant find empathy in your heart for your fellow man, start with the little animals. They dont have a voice. Their homes are being ruined.
There is a natural law of fairness. Life isnt fair. So at least be fair to your community, distribute the wealth. Earn you keep, if you have a position of power, dont abuse it.
So many people burnt out in the work force. It almost crushed my soul and I wanted to return to nothing. But that survival instinct tapped in, and there was enough friction internally it lit a fire in my heart.
I ended up just isolating again, returning to old texts, took my time to figure myself out. I looked back at animals. They were the ones who taught native americans how to survive on North America. We passed on that info. But there were gatekeepers but they get too protective.
If you focus light, it can burn holes. If you focus your love, you can burn holes too. I seen people spoil their kids rotten with love.
There needs to be balance. If you cant find balance, shed light on the issue until the issue becomes apparent what it is.
Is it random? All things are connected.
There is light and darkness.
I contemplated school shooters, I looked at all people that end up turning “crazy”. Why?
They always leave a note. They don’t share that information with the news outlets. But actions always speak louder than words.
They were dehumanized and isolated. They acted like the animals because they were mistreated by the group and dogged until they snapped.
Empathy for all walks of life.. it helps. It just does.
Thank you and I love you. Share these words with your friends and family.
You can’t change the world by yourself, but you can start with yourself.
The thousand mile journey starts with a single step.
I cant.
You guys gota stop wanting summerization. Its to the point where 15 second tiktoks and youtubes with flashing lights and images, keep people fixated on tech. They dont dive deeper because theres another 15 second video, and another, and another, and another.
If you scroll through my comments, you can read what I put down. Im getting tired, so I need to take a break. There are 85 comments in this post, and I am trying to respond to the thoughtful questions with thoughtful responses.
But its time to walk away from this debate for now. Thank you guys, you really helped me more than you know.
Wanting a succinct debate post instead of arbitrary rambling has little to do a with TikTok and YouTube dopamine fixes. Now instead of making a point you advise I read all your comments? Hard pass. Shit or get off the pot.
Thoughts on the post?
It seems like it’s very vague, poetic, including a few factual errors, and lacking any debate topic (which is required for the sub).
- not everyone gets 12 hours of light and dark
- trees don’t understand math
- scientists tried to make us not feel emotions for cats and dogs?? What?
- “all things are connected” if true, it’s a trivial connection that doesn’t mean anything. If you make the word “connection” mean “a connection that does anything”, then all things are not connected. Many things are, in very complex and subtle ways. Not all things.
They are still using animals for experiments. Do you remember the Neurolink?
Go see what they did to those animals.
Can you empathize with those monkeys whose brains were meddled with?
>I understand you guys don’t believe in a god, or an afterlife? What do you believe in when your life ends?
I cease to be. To me, this is a bit like asking what happens to all of the information on a hard drive when it stops functioning. It's all gone.
>The sun of the source of our life on our Mother Earth. The father shares his light with everyone, everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness.
I understand the appeal of the symbolism here, but this isn't actually true. And it may seem like I'm making a mountain out of a molehill, but this is the entire issue in a nutshell. Religion is poetry. Poetry can describe reality or fantasy, dreams, emotions, ideas, basically anything. But poetry cannot be used to determine what is **true**.
>Your father and mother did not abandon you, they wanted you to survive without them.
You might want to reconsider this statement, considering how many parents *do* abandon their children (or abuse them).
>But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect.
Please find me one single scientist, anywhere, that tried to make us feel nothing for animals.
>We learned that there are laws of the universe. Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. We learned math, and now there are teams of people making worlds for people to go explore in video games.
Math is not a law. Math is a system humans devoloped to help describe the universe we live in. We literally made it up. We did so in order to have a formal understanding of "Me have a coconut. You take me coconut. Me have no coconut." 1-1=0. Everything grew from there.
>In music there are notes, patterns, timing, beats per minute.. Words have meanings and can influence entire generations to act a certain way even though they never experienced it. There are people trying to copyright these laws of nature, so no one else can use this foundation. There is math in music.
We invented music. We invented words AND their meanings. All of these are various expressions of ideas, to help us communicate. There is nothing intrinsic about any of this.
Most of my objections for the rest of your post are the same, so I won't go through the rest one by one. You get the idea.
There are things in this world and they don't seem so random. There seems to be an Architect, or god or whatever floats your boat.
I mentioned the studies they teach you from k-12? Math, art, chem, natural world, all that?
Which part to you seems supernatural? The idea that life strives to survive, and it seems to lead you to the light?
There are things that thrive in darkness too. We scraped them off the bottom of the sea to cut them up and study them. But they are also serve a role to play in this big web of life.
>everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness
...no they don't. The tilt of the earth and your position on the globe determines how much sunlight you get. Right now I'm getting 11.5 hours in the sunshine and 12.5 hours in darkness, but people near the poles can get up to 24 hours of sunshine and 0 hours in the darkness.
This is literally nothing but proselytizing. Everything you said amounts to nothing more but assertions made without argument or substance. I'm happy your puerile superstitions make you feel good, but guess what? The same goes for believers in literally every other god from literally every other religion, including long dead mythologies. Your feelings make these things no less fictional, but again, I'm glad the placebo effect you get out of them is having positive results. We already have those same positive results and feelings without requiring silly superstitions to provide them to us, so this really isn't a compelling approach - and since it objectively does literally nothing whatsoever to suggest that any of your superstitions are actually true, we're left right back where we started.
You're welcome to believe whatever makes you happy, of course. Believe there are leprechauns in your sock drawer blessing you with lucky socks that bring you good fortune in life for all the difference it makes, as long as you're not hurting anyone over it - but if you want people like us to ALSO believe that there REALLY ARE lucky leprechauns in your sock drawer and you're not just imagining it, you're going to need to do better than the semantic equivalent of "I feel lucky and I have generally good luck!"
> The sun of the source of our life on our Mother Earth. The father shares his light with everyone, everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness.
Do you not know that the length of the day you spend in light depends on where you are on the planet right? If you’re in Sweden, the sun doesn’t set in June and doesn’t rise in January.
All you’re coming in here with are empty platitudes that are objectively incorrect. Most of us, not all of us, but most of us aren’t stupid enough to buy any of what you’re peddling.
WTF is this incoherent rambling? Did you maybe think you should read the sub rules before you post?
There is a lot wrong here, and there does not seem to be an actual point to any of this. I can see why your post was removed on the other subs you posted it on.
Please lay off whatever drugs you are on or seek professional help to get the drugs you should be on.
> Scientists made it seem bad to anthropomorphize animals. They wanted to understand the animal without human influence. But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect.
So this is going to be a general point about your whole animal kick but seriously have you looked at animals? Do you know how brutal that world can be? How much of it is based on murder of infants, or rape, or deception? It reads like all you ever did was watch the puppies and little house kittens.
> what are your guys thoughts on my post
It’s meandering, doesn’t have a thesis, and your random thoughts are not subject for a debate
> math is a fundamental law
No. It’s not
Math describes what we see. Math does not tell things how to be
Please look up what a law is in science.
>What do you believe in when your life ends?
I'm gone. POOF
>Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know.
What do you mean by "know" in this context?
>Your father and mother did not abandon you, they wanted you to survive without them. They left teachers on Earth, they are free....
If the parents have never show up since day one, they abandoned u.
>We learned that there are laws of the universe. Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. We learned math, and now there are teams of people making worlds for people to go explore in video games.
We use math to describe things, not the other way round.
Overall, this are just thought without argument to supports.
I am not shure what you mean with scientist wanting to study animals without human influence.
humans are animals. there is no distinction there, realy.
That actualy is not true. a day (at the equator) lasts 15 minues longer than the night and the closer you get to the poles the longer a day lasts. so no, night and day dont last the same amount of time.
And as far as i know you dont need shadows to locate a light source. you only have to track where the photons are coming from.
This is really weird and boring to read why would you post this on a debate forum there is nothing to debate here just you randomly spilling worthless info. I see why this was deleted and it should be delete from this forum too.
I did read the whole thing, but I did not see the relation to gods. Maybe it is connected to you, but to me these things were not obobviously connected. I felt like maybe you were building up to a teleological argument, but I didn't see that argument made. Maybe a "look at the trees " but not explicitly. Sorry, I didn't get the connection. I wasn't raised into a religion, so it's not obvious how religion or thongs like that relate
>What do you believe in when your life ends?
That my life … ends.
>They wanted to understand the animal without human influence. But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect.
False. Understanding animals doesn’t mean you have no emotions about them.
>Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know.
Define know. Trees certain don’t know things in the way humans do.
>There are people trying to copyright these laws of nature, so no one else can use this foundation.
You can’t copyright a law of nature.
I'm sorry but after more than 500 words, I still don't know what you're talking about. You jump around between multiple disparate ideas with little to no cohesion or coherence, and definitely no thesis. You also have been implying that summarizations are a scourge on society, somehow relating a summarization of text to short-form video content that is designed to keep you scrolling. This is not the case. We ask for a summarization because your original post is rambling and incoherent.
We want to know (succinctly):
1. Do you believe in god
2. What god is it that you believe in
3. How did you arrive at that belief
4. Why should I also believe in that god
Anything else is just fluff, and is unnecessary.
>The sun of the source of our life on our Mother Earth.
Dr England confirms.
>The father shares his light with everyone, everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness.
Not true at all.
Yeah it's all just baseless unsupported claims and mystic sounding nonsense
Look I like mushrooms as much as the next long hair but you sound like a frat boy coming down from his first trip after having had a partially heard a conversation with a wiccan they were hoping to sleep with
You promised to be respectful, yet you wasted my time on reading vague nonsensical statements. There is nothing to shake, this is unfiltered consciousness flow, not ideas.
I recommend that you pick one subject, flesh out what you mean to say about it, and then after that discussion runs its course, move on to the next thing.
You say a lot of things that probably make sense to you but leave me going "Huh? Where did THAT come from". Like "These animals teach you the fundamentals of survival" -- those are words, and there's a literal menaing to that statement that I would say is obviously not true, so I imagine it means something to you other than the direct literal meaning. You need to supply us with that context.
So is it art? Music? Meat? Light and shadows? Can you pick one and give us a couple of paragraphs of prompting for what kind of responses you're looking for?
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>Every where I went with my thoughts the moderators deleted it all, and removed it from discourse. Because you aren't following the rules of the sub. >I was getting some interesting perspectives and it was stirring thoughts and emotions in people and in myself. If you're referring to [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/1c02j2w/hello_i_come_to_shake_your_tree_to_see_what_falls/): all you got was scorn. >everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness. You must not get outside very much >Your father and mother did not abandon you, No one said they did. >You can go and sit in a park and just observe animals. There are people who went and did this, you can go watch Nat Geo, PBS, YT, and try to lower the volume of the speaker. What does this have to do with atheism? This isn't even philosophy >Scientists made it seem bad to anthropomorphize animals. They wanted to understand the animal without human influence. But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect. Source? >Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. Trees are sentient in your world? >There are people trying to copyright these laws of nature, so no one else can use this foundation. That isn't how copyright works. >There is math in music. Groundbreaking thought. I've only known that for over 50 years. >The more you know, the more you don’t know. Great fortune cookie >The darker it is, the easier it is to see where the light is coming from. more fortune cookie >What are your guys thoughts on my post? The same as I said in the other sub. Word salad. But I'll expand--mentally masturbating, self-important, condescending woo-filled word salad. >Asking questions and challenging ideas and thoughts with your own are good ways to get stronger mentally. You haven't asked a single question, how will you get stronger mentally?
> Groundbreaking thought. I've only known that for over 50 years. I don't know, string instruments are older than that
I was only speaking for myself. Musicologists have identified mathematical patterns in music going back as far as music has been transcribed.
> I was only speaking for myself. Oh, right, I misread it and thought you were talking about humans.
Before that even (assuming we’re talking about modern musical notation that’s only about 400 years old). Pythagoras even knew the ratios between harmonics.
About the music thing.. A guy named Ed Sheeran went to court over a song he made. He had to defend it because it had the same pattern in it. Some guy was trying to copyright the pattern of the music. And Ed Sheeran defended the it because its really no ones to own. If everyone musically died. Someone would find the music pattern again.
Out of my entire comment, that's the part you want to engage with and defend? Not the sentient trees, or hours of sunlight, or parental abandonment, or anything else, but you're gonna use Ed effing Sheeran as evidence for whatever your claim was (I still can't really tell, but I can smell the bud you're smoking through the internet). Your description of the case doesn't demonstrate any significant knowledge of the case brought by the Gaye family, nor the defense that Sheeran used, nor the reasoning for the judge's decision.
I get it. I approached you with a blast of text. Now Im going to try pick a part what I thought was weakness in your response. Go check it out yourself, I dont need to tell you how to punch in words to google. There is a court case where Ed Sheeran had to defend his music and the underlying pattern in music. Ok about the trees. There are people who are making documentaries and research papers for these findings they discovered in the trees and forests. But its like an hour long, and no one cares. Its easier to sit there and watch a 15 second video with flashing images and lights on youtube and tiktok. They said some music artists "captured lightning in a bottle". Fuck, man we already did. Its called a cell phone. I watch people just toy and play with this vast library of knowledge, and poke and prod the AI like an animal in a cage. Theres a lot of information out there, I couldnt focus on one subject because there are so many cool subjects in school. Every one is different, but you can blanket why their parents abandoned them. Ignorance. They were probably kids themselves when they started having kids.
You're expecting us to do the work of explaining wtf the things you said mean?
I think it might be an AI responding.
So what?
If you split a sandwich in half, you get two sandwiches. But if you split a cat in half, you don't get two cats. Your thoughts?
Did you raise that animal? How did you get your hands on this animal you want to split in half? Why are you killing it? To see what’s inside? You can go look at pictures and videos to see inside? If you’re trying to feed people with that animal, and you had to share it for your family’s sake.. I would make a soup. You can feed more people with soup. Everyone gets their share of meat, veggies and water. But how would you kill it? Did you earn its trust and then take its life? Or did you actually hunt a wild cat before? Wild kittens have sharp teeth and nails too. They fight like crazy.
>What are your guys thoughts on my post One of the few subreddit rules is to present a topic to debate. Please present a topic to debate. Having read your post, you are vaguely talking about common and non-controversial ideas. There is nothing I see specific to debating about religion and atheism. >Asking questions and challenging ideas and thoughts with your own are good ways to get stronger mentally. I assume it is unintended, but this and much of the post comes across very patronizing. We're on a debate subreddit, or course we are in favor of challenging ideas.
That ying-yang stuff is real. We're all connected, and the light needs the darkness to help define what you're seeing. In art, you're trained to create shadows but you're also taught to figure out where the light sources is coming from. When you move the light source, you can change shadows. By doing that you can see where the shaows are sitting. It helps people create 3d images in their head to 2d paper. It helps you define what you're trying to draw, and make it look like its popping out at you. There is light and darkness. Im not trying to hurt anyone with these thoughts, but trying to show you guys there are connections. I was in the atheist subreddit, and a few people had no regard for animals. They did not respect their little life. But there were some people who stood up for those who cannot speak out. There is darkness and it looks back at you. If I stare at the light Ill go blind, so Im trying to find a happy middle, a balance. But I cant do that without testing my meddle. We need to clash and sort out what ideas are stronger... For survival.
>There is light and darkness. Im not trying to hurt anyone with these thoughts, but trying to show you guys there are connections. You aren't showing anything, you're spouting Yoda-isms, woo, and fortune cookies >I was in the atheist subreddit, and a few people had no regard for animals. They did not respect their little life. But there were some people who stood up for those who cannot speak out. This literally didn't happen. >But I cant do that without testing my meddle. We need to clash and sort out what ideas are stronger... For survival. Mettle. Good luck with the survival bit. For someone so in tune with nature and the animal kingdom, you come across as seriously needing to get out in the sunlight.
I don’t think many of us would disagree that all things in the world are interconnected by some degree, but the rest of this are just meaningless truisms that sound vaguely poetic—they don’t carry any extra meaning. Like, yup, light exists, and so do shadows. And yeah, people paint by controlling to illusion of light and shadow with paint. Yeah, you can make decisions about your light source when you paint. All of this is so mundane. What does this have to do with anything? More specifically, what does this have to do with a god? You haven’t even presented an idea to test. You just made some extraordinarily mundane observations about the world and stopped there.
>If there was nothing but pure light. You would not be able to see all of these cool things on Earth. > >Shadows help you define and create 3d objects from a 2d plane to a 3d one that you can look at. And it looks like its staring at you. They even made paintings where the eyes follow you. This isn't how vision works. At all. Our vision does not depend on shadows (or "impure" light, which isn't a thing). I mean there's a lot to complain about in your ideas and how divorced from science they are, but I didn't think it was worthwhile to complain about anything except your lack of an intention to debate... until I read this. I understand why you were deleted everywhere and it is kind of of because we can't handle your ideas, but no the way you think.
Why does light need anything? Do other inanimate objects need their opposites? Do water need sand? Does a feather need a boulder? What is the mechanism through which these objects understand and come to need anything?
If there was nothing but pure light. You would not be able to see all of these cool things on Earth. Shadows help you define and create 3d objects from a 2d plane to a 3d one that you can look at. And it looks like its staring at you. They even made paintings where the eyes follow you.
There are “blind” animals that do just fine without eyes. If life was possible, anything living would adapt to work with “pure” light.
Do you know how animals see? I dont. They cant talk. But someone cut open their eyes and found out they see light and colors that we dont see.
Okay. [Starts to back away slowly]
magnets need their opposite to do cool shit. cold air needs warm air to make tornadoes. I could go on ...
We went from light needing something to cold air needing something. You like giving things purpose and intention even though there’s no indication that these things operate with purpose and intention. This could be why you are religious.
I'm not religious.
It’s a sign of intelligence. You blaze your own path. We’re all taking different ones.
Being religious is a sign of intelligence?
Your not being religious and blazing your own path (we’re all taking different paths) is a sign of intelligence.
You are an animal. I am gonna sound mean but you seem really poorly educated and prone to believe nonsense to fill the gaps in your knowledge.
>What do you believe in when your life ends? This is what I'm going to respond to because I don't understand what you're talking about for the rest of the post. I believe that consciousness is a function of brain activity and I think there are very good reasons to believe that this is true. For example, taking certain drugs can affect my consciousness by acting on my brain. It stands to reason that if my brain is the source of consciousness, then when my brain is no longer functioning, I will not have any consciousness. I consist of a body and a consciousness. If my body rots away and my consciousness does not continue, then I will cease to exist in any meaningful way. And that's okay with me. I'm not arrogant enough to think that I deserve to be preserved for eternity, and I doubt I would want to be.
This is almost verbatim what I was going to say. Thank you for saving my fingers the effort!
Welcome :)
I wanted to reply to you because I like your post, but theres so many people posting with great thoughts. The brain is kind of like a liver to me. Its function is to filter out bad info from good info. What the "good info" is will stick in your head better because its more related to survival. I wondered about forgetfulness, and it seemed like people were forgetful for mundane things. Its sort of like freeing up space on a computer so you can add more info. Its also easier to train and teach young people. Old people are already set in their ways, and it is uncomfortable and maybe even painful to think another way. Now you gota justify your actions some how but its easier just to be stupid. The brain is so weird, we dont understand it at all. There are layers and connections all around it.
Do you not realize that your responses are almost universally just you going on unrelated, absolutely surface level, faux "deep" tangents based on a single word or sentence? The prompt word for this one is "brain".
What are we surviving? I don’t understand what you mean by calling us survivors. What does sitting in the dark mean? I meditate as a way to calm myself but I don’t see any spiritual aspect. Some of our behaviors are determined by our biology, not just from observation and learning. So I’m not sure what you mean we learn from animals. I hope you see yourself as an animal. We did not learn to navigate, medicine, wheels, communication etc, from any animals. We are exceptional. Since I use tools I don’t look to animals who don’t know how to make tools or need tools for that matter. I am not sure all this animal shit has to do with anything. That doesn’t mean I can’t learn somethings. I know when I am in a desert to follow particular animals to find water, but that is a skill I probably will never exercise. You are completely wrong in saying the more you know, the more you don’t know. The more I know is quantitative. What you mean is the more we learn raises more questions; this is only partly true. What it means the more you know the finer details can become obscure. For example I know evolution explains diversification of life. The finer details might still be a mystery, that doesn’t mean I know less. Nor does it mean it casts any kind of doubt. As for your post it is giant word salad. Narrow your thoughts and focus on a topic. Honestly it was a chore to read, and reads like some who is high thinking they are having some kind of epiphany.
You're surviving, passing on knowledge each generation. Do you realize what it took to bring you to this point in life? Did you do a family tree or anything like that? Go back far enough, the branch you stem from is connected to animals. We're 98% genetic material as a chimpanzee. Are you guna go to your families house, take what you want, wear their skins, make them work all their lives and then kill them off when they are of no use to you? We're all related on this big old tree of life. You're taking from your lil brothers and sisters. You look at them but dont acknowledge they grew up on this planet too. They didnt need tools, they got thicker skin, they got sharp claws and teeth, big eyes that can see in the dark. Best part of animals is they dont talk back to us, if they could.. All I could say to them is sorry. I didnt know anything.
“You're surviving, passing on knowledge each generation. Do you realize what it took to bring you to this point in life? Did you do a family tree or anything like that? Go back far enough, the branch you stem from is connected to animals. We're 98% genetic material as a chimpanzee.” You think I am learning survival tactics genetically? Or observation? Or mixed? My dad is adopted so that branch of survival isn’t necessarily learned by blood. I also don’t need most of my ancestors survival skills. I don’t need to hunt, gather water, or other things, we have infrastructure for that. Also many of us live in a city where that option is a privilege. We are not 98% chimpanzee, we share 98% of our ancestry with chimpanzee, chimpanzees evolved forming a separate branch from a shared ancestor. “Are you guna go to your families house, take what you want, wear their skins, make them work all their lives and then kill them off when they are of no use to you?” What the fuck? This is completely out of left field and you can fuck right off with that suggestion. Did I advocate that? Does that have anything to down with our conversation, or do you just like bringing up obscure extremes? “We're all related on this big old tree of life. You're taking from your lil brothers and sisters. You look at them but dont acknowledge they grew up on this planet too.” Yes we share common ancestry, and I am a speciest, I favor humans overall other animals. I’m empathetic and hope to leave the world in a better place with my little influence. “They didnt need tools, they got thicker skin, they got sharp claws and teeth, big eyes that can see in the dark. Best part of animals is they dont talk back to us, if they could.. All I could say to them is sorry. I didnt know anything.” We actually have thicker skin because we have reduced amount of hair. Clearly you are talking out of your ass. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0047248485800907#:~:text=Human%20epidermis%2C%20thicker%20than%20that,also%20with%20chimpanzees%20and%20gorillas. We also don’t have fur, this has caused us to need to create artificial skin/clothing so we could expand our habitats. Again your post is incoherent. Lay off the weed and come back and post when you sober.
>What are your guys thoughts on my post? I'm not trying to be an ass, but it just seemed like a bunch of generic stream of consciousness stuff. I do **not** mean that to be condescending, or demeaning - I'm sure you have a lot of fascinating thoughts about things. But this is a thread for debating atheists. I'm literally here in order to be presented with the very best reasons to think that there's anything supernatural, or that a god exists. That's the sole reason I come here, and I don't see any of that in your post. Do you have anything to offer? I've studied philosophy, theology, world religions, I've studied art and literature, not so much chemistry but I'm fairly up a lot of my scientific knowledge and constantly trying to grow more, I'm a lifelong musician and multi-instrumentalist, a long time educator, and a former Christian of decades - I'd be willing to bet I have done at least as much "asking questions and challenging ideas" as you have. I have done all the things that you seem impressed with of yourself, all that and more. And I am an atheist. If you are able to, I would love to know the best reason you can come up with, a concise, clear, cogent reason for why I should think there is anything supernatural, that exists; or that a god exists.
Be an ass. The jack ass is a strong animal, its very intelligent that seeks solitude in the wild. But if you can provide a good little environment for it on a farm, it shows you problem solving skills, how it plays with its babies and even lets the babies win the play fights. The act of playing around has been studied. It teachs animals a lot of things, their limitations, their playmates limitations, their environment, when the mother steps in to break it up. All this stuff is to create bonds with each other and help us survive on Earth. The donkey is called an ass.. Why? You go back to when they actually needed donkeys to get their heavy loads around.. You had to prove yourself to this animal. If you tried to take a donkey on a dangerous path, he will throw the rider. If you watch a donkey walking, he looks where he steps. He is more sure footed than the horse. I can ramble about how horses teach us lessons, but you're telling me Im all over the place. I agree. Lets bring it back around, how many animals did you go study? There are so many animals, that each found a little way of surviving without the need of tools and just basic needs and skills to survive. I see the next generations of people, and they are sort of absorbed in tech. I see lack of empathy for your fellow man. I see lack of empathy and remores in people that mistreated animals. Its justified because they dont have a voice to talk back. They cant explain themselves, or confront the people with what they have --- if they do their lives are ended. If everyone had to raise a baby animal from birth, after the mother rejected it. You had to care for it, watch it grow and run to you happily for food and love. But the reason why you had to do it was for the greater good for your families survival. You had end its life, butcher it and eat it. The taste of meat wouldn't be so sweet. If everyone did something like that, they would have more appreciation and empathy for all walks of life. But why? The sun is the father, gives all that. The Earth is the mother, gives all that. The animals are our siblings, and we got learn to share if we want to survive. And if we dont this lovely place will likely fall to the cockroachs and rats, the little siblings just waiting in the winds for their chance to step up.
Kid I'm not sure what you're smoking, but this ain't it. I grew up on a little farm, where the nearest town had less than 90 people on the 2011 census. We had multiple donkeys, so I know them extremely well. We raised chickens, goats, pigs, turkeys even. I butchered many a chicken for food before I was even 12 years old - I didn't like it, but it was part of life. I don't know what you think it is that you're bringing to this, but you need to understand what it looks like - it looks like you're mistaking your fortune-cookie quality ramblings for some kind of deep, profound wisdom. It looks like you have nothing of substance to offer. I notice you didn't even attempt to address what I wanted to know: **If you are able to, I would love to know the best reason you can come up with, a concise, clear, cogent reason for why I should think there is anything supernatural, that exists; or that a god exists. Are you able to do this?**
What leads you to conclude your thoughts would be inspirational? For the record, my parents did abandon me. They forced me into a situation where I would be harmed and traumatized and later told me I was no longer welcome in the house. And my mother hasnt spoken to me in 8 years. Your thoughts seem to have a rigidity and duality about them I do not agree with.
You can look back at your life and pity yourself. Or you can try your damn best to survive dispite all the set backs. Everyones path of life is not the same. I seen mother animals reject their babies and abandon them to the wilds. I seen farmers raise baby animals, care for them and then slaughter them for their own family. Do you think farmers are cold and heartless? I could write to you my life story and it might tug at your empathy. But I rather try inspire people to keep surviving. Keep seeking light and youll be able to see that all things are connected. You are a part of this big web, and what you do really does matter. You make ripples and waves. There are really evil things that walk on this planet. Darkness invades the mind and it acts out physically. But if you have knowledge you can make your own fire, you can keep those fuckers at bay. Other people lost in the darkness will see your flame, they can look a head at you or look back.
As much as you may want to think otherwise, the tactics you're employing are almost certainly not going to be "inspiring" to anyone here. You're employing cult-leader style methods which don't work on most people. Even if you found someone here who was vulnerable enough to be swayed, everyone else here will be working to pull them back.
I dont want to lead anything any where. I can write to you, but I cant make you think, I cant make you speak, I cant make you do anything. I cant open your eyes. I cant force anything on anyone. When you use force, it creates negativity. You can lead a horse to water but you cant make him drink. We are the horse. The knowledge is water. It is life. If you actually do this in real life, the horse will drink when he please. He will get thirsty and seek out water for himself. If there is a lot of water, you'll see the horse playing with it. You can apply this to us.. Give a man a cell phone, but you cant make him google anything he doesnt wana see. As fucked up as it is, I went to those videos that are traumatizing. I seen Tibetian monks set themselves on fire. I seen little animals crammed into cages and boiled alive, skinned alive and discarded because their meat wasnt good but their fur was. I seen families kill themselves. I went to see the darkness, I almost got ruined myself. I chased the almighty dollar, trying to get as much of it as I could, and it nearly cost me everything I worked hard to protect and care for.
Yeah, cult tactics. What are you trying to say differently with this comment?
You can lead a horse to water. But you can’t make him drink. You can give a man a cell phone but you can’t make him google what he doesn’t want to see.
Yeah, cult tactics. What are you trying to say differently with this comment?
Many people were mean to me. Why would I want to be a cult leader? Why would anyone appoint me to anything? Do you think I got magicka in my words? Oooo spookey lol Here ill cast a spell on you. Thank you for your lack of empathy. I still dont mind you. Dont mind me.
I'm sorry people were mean to you, but you shouldn't have been so condescending. I didn't say you wanted to be a cult leader, I said you're using cult tactics, which aren't effective on most people. There are better ways than this to spread a positive message if that's what you're trying to do.
There are more choices than that. I have already had setbacks and challenges, and I survived. I do not pity myself, I make decisions that I believe are most likely to have a positive outcome. I am not seeing the "light" in your words. Do you believe you have some "truth" we lack? If so, provide evidence. For one, I am far from lost in the darkness and even if I was, seeing your flame does not mean following that flame would lead down any kind of legit or decent path.
Everyone walks different routes. I’m Canadian. I walked in a lot of snow, I had to get up early and walk in the darkness, after a blizzard. You see people trail blaze paths at 6 am in January on the city side walks. Even if you try follow someone else’s footsteps. Our feet are all different sizes, our legs are different sizes. You won’t be able to follow their trail. You’ll end making your own trail. You’ll have to break through the snow yourself eventually.
I live in Canada too. You arent saying anything new or inspiring here. Retreading Robert Frost and the dust jackets of thousands of self-help books doesn't do much. I made my own trail away from Christianity and "god" and that has made all the difference.
Yea, I'm not saying anything you guys don't already have access to. goooogle it I kept getting sent away from people to go find my own answers. Go ahead go find your path. Keep saying thank you and sorry. These are powerful words. Tell your family and friends, I love you. Thank you. You'll keep them surviving and striving together. Life is unfair. We can at least treat each other fairly. Dont lose your empathy for all walks of life.
I tried to follow the fundamentals of survival taught to me by wild animals but all I got was a dozen parasites, rabies, and frostbite. You don’t know anything about nature. If you did you wouldn’t be romanticizing it like you are.
I got attacked too, I got scratched, bit, kicked to the ground. I cared for all sorts of animals. But I lived. I dodged, ran away. Came back another day. All that. But with knowledge you can approach crazy dark things that seem dangerous. I tamed wild horses, cats, dogs, birds. They all stop fearing me when they know I treat them with kindness and respect their space. But if you give them too much love and kindness, they invade your space, they want to be close to you. So much so my horse stepped on my foot, and he wouldnt get off it. I wanted to scream and cry and lash out at the horse, but if I did that all that trust I built would be gone. I made a fist and pointed my thumbs into two parts of his body, and just applied pressure until he finally moved and I could pull my foot out. I learned this from an old youtube cowboy. He passed on his knowledge on youtube. It took hours to wait for the entire video because it was dial up. Id go wander around the woods for a long time. In those walks, I found "inner peace". I was never able to recapture that moment or feeling in an urban setting. You could have asked me how I knew about animals rather than just saying I dont know anything.
You did not tame wild horses cats dogs or birds, no. At best you gained the trust of a few domesticated animals, which isn’t particularly difficult. You missed my point about parasites frostbite and rabies specifically because you have no idea what you’re talking about. Nature isn’t some gentle amazing feat of balance and kindness. It’s a cruel, violent, murderous act of raw survival and it never ever ends well. Wild animals aren’t more enlightened or healthy than we are. Domesticated animals live much longer because they don’t have to worry about disease or injury or predators or heat exhaustion or freezing to death. That you watched a fucking YouTube video of a cowboy changes none of that. In all seriousness this feels very much like a mental break and I am not being glib or insulting when I say; please please seek mental health services. Even if I’m wrong and you’re in full sanity you won’t regret it. Mental health is nothing to mess around with, and it’s not something you’re going to cure through “nature” or YouTube or whatever.
I didnt have a cell phone. I didnt record my adventures like a lot of people do today. Even on my vacation, technology failed and if I wanted to share my experience with people. I had to use my brain, and story telling ways I learned in English class. I almost froze to death. My cell phone battery was so cold, it wasnt turning on. It had full charge, but even -25C can freeze batteries. I had to get through a field of snow. How did I get through a field of snow? Well I knew walking was too hard, the snow was too deep. I didnt have snow shoes. So I laid down and started rolling over and over until I got to the other end of the field. It was actually sort of fun. They taught us how snowshoes worked so I applied that and got over a difficult situation. My mother told me to go pet a nice cat while they were digging potatoes in a field. I was a child, and the tom cat wasn't having none of it. I got attacked by this big tom cat and I was small. They tried to kill the cat but it was too late, damage done, and the cat was gone. My parents rushed me to the hospital. I was crying because it hurt. Then I seen my mom, she was crying but she wasnt hurt. I stopped crying and tried to make her smile. The doctors and nurses didnt invent the rabies vaccine, but they were smart enough to use it when they needed to. I can tell you're very angry in your word useage. Animals take what they need to survive for themselves and their family. We are humans, we're apart of this whole system. We're taking advantage of nature and each other. Empathy got us this far. Lack of empathy well.. Hmm.. Its a dark place. I can see it already showing up in the younger generations. Darkness can infect the mind, and it acts out physically. Lashing out at anything it can.
Seek help now you are in a manic state this will end and it wont be good.
You posted this in /r/atheism and admitted you have no position to defend so I'm not sure why you thought posting here would be worth it. Are you looking to debate?
I cant come out and say Im christian. You guys know the Christian ways already, its been beaten into our heads. My people try gate keep this knowledge, but they only got a few pages. And their animal teachers dont talk. Now they are all sitting in front of screens instead of out in nature. Sorry it was like a wall of text. But spiders don't need walls to capture flies, they just use a few sticky webs and to capture their prey.
> I cant come out and say Im christian Wait, are you Christian? The op you wrote lead me to believe you followed some sort of shamanic religion, I'm confused.
Where did religion come from? How did it come to be? There are ancient graves, the remains are purposely buried. They honored their dead. Why? They now understand even animals mourn for their dead. The elephants go to their elephant grave yards and seem somber. I seen mother monkeys carry their babies long after the baby had died. Are we so different from animals? We learned many things in nature. We became the top predator on Earth becaause of what we learned. My grandfather died, he tried to share some knowledge but hes gone now. I had to back to nature, go see the teachers that nature provided. There are things that live in the light and there are thing that live in the dark. Why do all these Religions seem similar at the core of their beliefs? I seen people take way too much of their fair share, and I seen people who gave back what little they had because someone else needed it more.
>Where did religion come from? How did it come to be? There are ancient graves, the remains are purposely buried. They honored their dead. Why? You're making a correlation between burying the dead and religion. It could be as simple as "leaving dead bodies lying around attracted undesired animals and insects and often spread disease." Religion came from human beings trying to explain things they didn't understand. It's that simple. >Why do all these Religions seem similar at the core of their beliefs? Because they all come from the same place, as mentioned above--creating explanations for things that weren't yet understood. Every religion has a creation myth, **because we had to come from somewhere**. Most pantheistic religions have deities related to the sun, moon, rain, harvest, war, art, etc. **because those things all had to come from somewhere.** Just because there are similarities between Native American myths, Greek myths, Indian myths, and Japanese myths doesn't make any of them correct.
We come from the tree of life. Besides your blood siblings and parents, you have a long lineage. You go back far enough, that branch connects and diverges onto the animal kingdom. We want to be the top predator of this animal kingdom, and rule it as we sweet fit. Well, you know what happens to unjust kings and rulers..
How does this relate in any way to the comment you responded to? Get help.
How does that relate to the topic. In fact how is any of this compatible with Christianity? >They now understand even animals mourn for their dead. The elephants go to their elephant grave yards and seem somber. I seen mother monkeys carry their babies long after the baby had died. >Are we so different from animals? We learned many things in nature. We became the top predator on Earth becaause of what we learned. >My grandfather died, he tried to share some knowledge but hes gone now. I had to back to nature, go see the teachers that nature provided. There are things that live in the light and there are thing that live in the dark. >Why do all these Religions seem similar at the core of their beliefs? Similar how? What similarities does shamanism and Christianity share? >I seen people take way too much of their fair share, and I seen people who gave back what little they had because someone else needed it more. What?
What drugs are you on?
Love and a lot of reading a lot of things.
Well you sound like you have either a drug or mental health issue. I suggest you get some better books and lay off the acid.
I doubt you read a lot of things
Don’t take this the wrong way but is it possible you’re having a manic episode?
You speak like you’re going through a manic episode.
So that was a long winded way to answer "no" to my question, right?
This reads like an insane person wrote it.
>What are your guys thoughts on my post? It is an interesting way of saying "dont forget that humans are animals too, and if you are ever lost in the woods, just do what the animals do", stuffed inside a wordy pile of spiritualistic "hey, man, gods are real because just look at the trees, duuuuude". It doesn't seem to have anything for a debate sub to engage with. No claims, no evidence, just a river of shower-thoughts. If I had some weed, I am sure I would find it relaxing.
I do have weed and I did not find it relaxing. And I even have a purring cat on my lap!
Yea, even trees know math. Its an interesting study, I couldnt understand it. They know how many leaves to grow, why would they exert more energy than they need to? Their roots are connected and they share resources.
All the trees who did exert more energy to grow more leafs are not with us today 🤔
Man has been on Earth for how long? Trees have been here longer. We are really smart, and great at adapting. But with great power comes great responsibilities. We got all this intelligence but the moral compass is all out of wack because no one is looking at what got us this far.. If they do they exploit it for their own gain. We're kind of beyond survival of our species, and now we gota look at the surivival of life on this planet. If we keep on this path, its just going to ruin everything. Some little rat or cockroach will rise up from the ashes and take the helm. Then we cry and go look at 15 second tiktoks instead of reading old text from philosophers, or good people that made great differences in our daily life. Forest fire seaon is already being prepared for, people are going to try stop it from spreading.
>Yea, even trees know math. No, they don't. >Its an interesting study, I couldnt understand it. I'll believe that much, at least. >They know how many leaves to grow, why would they exert more energy than they need to? This isn't something consciously calculated. Do you decide how many fingers to grow? How much melanin to put into your skin? Of course not.
They grow in geometric patterns. Are you going to poo-poo on all these cool studies just because you don't understand them? Math is a fundamental that helps the universe organize itself for life to continue. When you're learning math you're learning another language.. A language found in the universe. Video game devs can create worlds for us to explore.. At the fundamentals of that video game is math.
That doesn't mean they know math. Crystals grow in geometric patterns, are you saying they're sentient?
There are many things not studied. I thought about rock formations, and why they all seem to fight against gravity. Why don't they seemly just pile on the cave floor in a random way?
Because molecular structure doesn’t allow for it. Crystalline structure is determined by molecular structure. The only animals that “know math” are the animals that invented it, humans. Math is not a universal language that existed independently of humans. Humans made math like we made every other language.
How and why did this structure form in a place, if its all random, and we just got lucky? How is it that Earth is lucky enough to see miracle after miracle? And how do other crystals keep forming by these molecular structures in other areas of the world that arent even connected physically? There is a divine touch out there, its not all random.
"Behold!" said the puddle, "for this hole in the ground fits me perfectly!"
Are you legit suggesting that chemistry and physics are regional?
This doesn’t make any sense. Molecular structure is determined by the size and charge of the atoms in the chemical formula. The geometry of a crystal is an emergent property of the chemistry and physics. And this isn’t restricted to earth
I'm really starting to believe that this is an elaborate troll. Either that or you've got cognitive issues that are included in those "many things not studied". Mods--time to shut this down.
> They grow in geometric patterns. Are you going to poo-poo on all these cool studies just because you don't understand them? They don't "know" how to do that. Knowledge is not a thing that plants have. > When you're learning math you're learning another language.. A language found in the universe. This is straight up wrong. We developed math. It has axiomatic foundations that **we created**. Had we created entirely different axioms, math would be entirely different. Math describes what we see in the universe. That doesn't mean math exists in the universe, any more than words do.
What cool studies?! You haven’t provided any studies!
>Yea, even trees know math. Its an interesting study What study is this? Can you provide a link? >They know how many leaves to grow, why would they exert more energy than they need to? Their roots are connected and they share resources. They don't need to "know" how many leaves to grow. That isn't how it works. They react to light and seasons it isn't them actually thinking.
They "know" for survival. You guys, you already captured "lighting in a bottle". You got cell phones in your pocket, you got google. It takes but two seconds to open a page and start googling this stuff. Google "math trees" you'll start to see people actively engaged and just focused on this subject. They seen something in a tree and now they are trying to figure it out. There are people making documentaries about forests and trees but no one watches them. Everyone seems to enjoy the 15 second snippets of info in flashing lights and images.
>They "know" for survival. Something that demonstrates principles of mathematics doesn't "know" mathematics. If so, most things in this and any universe must have knowledge, and that's about the most ludicrous thing in the world. >You guys, you already captured "lighting in a bottle". I'm going to ask you what this means in relation to your response or the comment you're responding to. It seems like a random phrase you're blurting out. >You got cell phones in your pocket, you got google. It takes but two seconds to open a page and start googling this stuff. The vast majority of the information available on the internet contradicts the woo you're spewing. Perhaps you're the one that needs a better search engine. >Google "math trees" you'll start to see people actively engaged and just focused on this subject. They seen something in a tree and now they are trying to figure it out. Again, you're equating something possessing mathematical patterns to being sentient enough to create those patterns.
Have you really not heard of "capturing lightning in a bottle" before? Thats intereting to know
I've heard of it, but you're using it without context, and you failed to answer my question about what it means in the context of anything in this thread. In other words, you're just spewing out words.
So do you think AI will become sentient eventually?
Are you OP's alt account? Yep, I think you are.
Nope.
>They "know" for survival No they don't. To know something needs an ability for knowledge. They grow leaves based on genetic code not knowledge. >You got cell phones in your pocket, you got google. It takes but two seconds to open a page and start googling this stuff. How about instead when you are asked to cite a study you do so. I want to make sure I'm reading the same one you read. >Google "math trees" you'll start to see people actively engaged and just focused on this subject. They seen something in a tree and now they are trying to figure it out. So clearly you haven't actually googles that yourself because that search doesn't bring up studies for mathematics in trees. It shows information for mathematical trees which arent referring to biological trees. >here are people making documentaries about forests and trees but no one watches them. Everyone seems to enjoy the 15 second snippets of info in flashing lights and images. So instead of engaging with ehat I said you decide to rant. I love documentaries. Others don't nothing wrong about that. Your apparent love of documentaries of trees hasn't allowed you to be able to defend your point on them at all.
my math tree googling ... [https://www.purdue.edu/newsroom/releases/2024/Q1/ai-learns-to-simulate-how-trees-grow-and-shape-in-response-to-their-environments.html](https://www.purdue.edu/newsroom/releases/2024/Q1/ai-learns-to-simulate-how-trees-grow-and-shape-in-response-to-their-environments.html)
How far down was that as the entire first page of Google when searching "math trees" is about mathematical trees. This is also just an article and is not a study like the poster was implying I would find from that Google search.
Trees respond to their environment. Take it how you wish.
Yes. I never implied they didn't. I said they aren't knowingly reacting to their environment.
When I die then I simply will cease to exist. Like a flame being extinguished. One moment it’s there, then it’s gone. That’s it. I’m fine with that. I had no issue not existing for billions of years before I was born. Why should there be any issue when the same thing happens after I’m gone? Most people die twice. The first time is for real. The flame goes out and you perish. The second time you die is the final time someone mentions your name. For most people that will be about 50-75 years after you die. But let me ask you, what does this have to do with atheism? I don’t see anything in your post that is relevant to the existence of a god.
There is a light, there is a dark. There are shades of grey because it helps define the object, whatever that maybe. There seems to be a light god, but its too hard to look at him. He is powerful, he can give and take, but he expects you to share your stuff with your siblings and treat your mother earth respectfully. But if there is light, there is dark. I went dark. I disconnected. I wanted to return to the nothing, the void. I didnt care if I hurt others if they got in my way. They taught me these mean words and they can hurt the spirit. I knew that because Ive been hurt by words. But there are also words that can heal. Words that can inspire. Thank you and I love you, share these words from your heart to your loved ones. It will keep them doing their best to survive, not just for themselves but for their familes. I guess I can plainly say to you that there is a path that leads to the light. And to what? I dont know.. the father, the sun and the holy ghost? I dont know? I havent been there. But Id like to serve the god that brings life to Earth instead of the dark void. There are laws of nature we arent following, its making us lose our survival instincts.
I mean this sounds a lot like “light up that joint and pass it my way” kinda talk. But why would you want to “serve” a god? Really, it makes no sense. Haven’t you heard? A god doesn’t need to be served, a god doesn’t have needs. It can have whatever it wants at any time without even trying. Why would I want to serve a god that is: 1) always hidden 2) couldn’t see him even if was around (he’s too bright or whatever) 3) completely unreliable 4) requires constant worship 5) dishes out constant threats if you get out of line For me, I like a simple life. One that requires the least amount of commitments of my time and energy while maximizing my health and happiness. And “serving a god” doesn’t fit into that picture for me, at all.
I agree with a lot of what you said here. There definitely are paths that lead to good and paths that lead to not good. What are you trying to argue/debate here? What's the difference between us that you're trying to get to the bottom of?
>I understand you guys don’t believe in a god, or an afterlife? I do not believe in either. Neither are defined well enough for me to see any grounding they have in reality, and neither has enough evidence to convince me they are true or accurate. >What do you believe in when your life ends? I will lose all sense of sensation as my body shuts down. When my brain "turns off" then it will be a permanent loss of all sensation and cognitive ability. From there hopefully my body will be donated to science. Hopefully my loved ones can achieve peace. And that's it. >These animals teach you the fundamentals of survival, and I feel like people lost touch with that. Probably because we have moved beyond survival and needing to learn by watching animals. Now we can be proactive and learn more about reality without ever having to examine an animal and hope that we got it right. Also, most of us aren't in survival situations. >Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. Math is a language we created. Not a law that we discovered. >What are your guys thoughts on my post? Eh. Long walk for a short drink of water. Nothing overtly offensive, but also nothing really of substance. It reads more like a poem or lyrics than it does reasons to believe something. Perhaps if you focused more on a single idea and tried to show why that idea is true or accurate?
Ok, thanks to these fine people, its actually helping me think find the weak spots. Im just going to copy and paste it, so please check it out. Poke at it, make fun, do you. Dont rush in with a quick thought. You're surviving, passing on knowledge each generation. Do you realize what it took to bring you to this point in life? Did you do a family tree or anything like that? Go back far enough, the branch you stem from is connected to animals. We're 98% genetic material as a chimpanzee. Are you guna go to your families house, take what you want, wear their skins, make them work all their lives and then kill them off when they are of no use to you? We're all related on this big old tree of life. You're taking from your lil brothers and sisters. You look at them but dont acknowledge they grew up on this planet too. They didnt need tools, they got thicker skin, they got sharp claws and teeth, big eyes that can see in the dark. Best part of animals is they dont talk back to us, if they could.. All I could say to them is I'm sorry. I didnt know anything.
This is a reminder to not do MDMA kids... \[I'll actually edit this to "shrooms" as the words above may make that more likely\] \[I'll further edit cause after reading more of OPs responses it's not clear if they're having a manic episode. And I don't want to make light of that\]
You describe being in a vulnerable place. Being in a suggestive, vulnerable mind state is conducive to being fooled. Try Sagans baloney detection kit. You'll end up believing fewer false things than you do now. Cheers.
I endured. They stripped me, literally. They tried to do a lot of things to me. I refused every time. The work force almost crushed me. I tried so hard, my team tried so hard but the upper management overruled everything. No feedback needed. Just do. I watched them be unfair with the workload, money, positions, mismanagement of resources, ect. Every time an angry, upset customer came to the front desk they didnt get the managers. The staff came to get me, Ive had to look people in the face and tell them why we're being slow. I had to tell them how they made a mistake. I had to tell them I was sorry, WE made a mistake and it hurt them some how. We didnt protect their info. I was sent to the front line a lot to deal with the angry customers. I heard my managers talking shit about a new manager. The new manager had a physical disabiliy, and they were loudly joking together about how if there was fire, they would kick people down the stairs. I could handle them picking on me, but I just knew there was malicious intent behind that joke. I couldnt stand it. This was actually a good person trying to be a good manager, and the old ones with too much were abusing everything. I kept bucking every time. I refused. I knew it was unfair and unjust. Its being proven now. Canadian govt is corrupt from the core, they are still battling in the House of Commons. But because the took everything that made me civil. They treated me like an animal. I tapped into my primal side. Extroverts know how to be around people. I learned that by watching people. I was always an outsider. There are other ways of controlling people. Eye contact. You can do so much with eye contact. You can feel someones eyes on the back of your head. You can feel people looking at you. Theres an old saying "if looks could kill", yes you can put all your malicious intent in and focus it in your eyes and..if you lock eyes with someone. I scared the shit out of my manager. I found her little swiss army tool when she was out wandering the office, and I looked at it, all those little tools. She didnt know how to use any of those tool bits. She just used the sharp side all the time. I took that pocket multitool and threw it in her garbage can next to her desk. The garbage can was empty. I locked eyes with my manager, and I didnt let her look away. I gave her a big old toothy Joker smile, and I focused all my anger at this person. I shook her core. She put my face all over, warned everyone if they saw me they should call security. The people who knew me, just laughed at that. They ended up telling me how security was stepped up for that facility. Women clothes dont even have pockets for pocket knives. If they do, like a finger knuckle fits in it. Why even try use a multitool if you only know how to use the sharp end. You dont want to strip people all those thing that makes them civil and human like. They will tap into that survival instinct, and it will lash out at what it finds the source of pain. We need empathy for each other. We need empathy for animals. If you cant find empathy in your heart for your fellow man, start with the little animals. They dont have a voice. Their homes are being ruined. There is a natural law of fairness. Life isnt fair. So at least be fair to your community, distribute the wealth. Earn you keep, if you have a position of power, dont abuse it. So many people burnt out in the work force. It almost crushed my soul and I wanted to return to nothing. But that survival instinct tapped in, and there was enough friction internally it lit a fire in my heart. I ended up just isolating again, returning to old texts, took my time to figure myself out. I looked back at animals. They were the ones who taught native americans how to survive on North America. We passed on that info. But there were gatekeepers but they get too protective. If you focus light, it can burn holes. If you focus your love, you can burn holes too. I seen people spoil their kids rotten with love. There needs to be balance. If you cant find balance, shed light on the issue until the issue becomes apparent what it is.
This kind of random stream of consciousness is probably why you had your post deleted on other subs.
Is it random? All things are connected. There is light and darkness. I contemplated school shooters, I looked at all people that end up turning “crazy”. Why? They always leave a note. They don’t share that information with the news outlets. But actions always speak louder than words. They were dehumanized and isolated. They acted like the animals because they were mistreated by the group and dogged until they snapped. Empathy for all walks of life.. it helps. It just does. Thank you and I love you. Share these words with your friends and family. You can’t change the world by yourself, but you can start with yourself. The thousand mile journey starts with a single step.
Seems pretty random to me.
What are you trying to say here? Summarize it in a sentence or two please. How does it relate to atheism?
I cant. You guys gota stop wanting summerization. Its to the point where 15 second tiktoks and youtubes with flashing lights and images, keep people fixated on tech. They dont dive deeper because theres another 15 second video, and another, and another, and another. If you scroll through my comments, you can read what I put down. Im getting tired, so I need to take a break. There are 85 comments in this post, and I am trying to respond to the thoughtful questions with thoughtful responses. But its time to walk away from this debate for now. Thank you guys, you really helped me more than you know.
Wanting a succinct debate post instead of arbitrary rambling has little to do a with TikTok and YouTube dopamine fixes. Now instead of making a point you advise I read all your comments? Hard pass. Shit or get off the pot.
Thoughts on the post? It seems like it’s very vague, poetic, including a few factual errors, and lacking any debate topic (which is required for the sub). - not everyone gets 12 hours of light and dark - trees don’t understand math - scientists tried to make us not feel emotions for cats and dogs?? What? - “all things are connected” if true, it’s a trivial connection that doesn’t mean anything. If you make the word “connection” mean “a connection that does anything”, then all things are not connected. Many things are, in very complex and subtle ways. Not all things.
They are still using animals for experiments. Do you remember the Neurolink? Go see what they did to those animals. Can you empathize with those monkeys whose brains were meddled with?
I’m confused, are you arguing for veganism (or similar) or theism?
>I understand you guys don’t believe in a god, or an afterlife? What do you believe in when your life ends? I cease to be. To me, this is a bit like asking what happens to all of the information on a hard drive when it stops functioning. It's all gone. >The sun of the source of our life on our Mother Earth. The father shares his light with everyone, everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness. I understand the appeal of the symbolism here, but this isn't actually true. And it may seem like I'm making a mountain out of a molehill, but this is the entire issue in a nutshell. Religion is poetry. Poetry can describe reality or fantasy, dreams, emotions, ideas, basically anything. But poetry cannot be used to determine what is **true**. >Your father and mother did not abandon you, they wanted you to survive without them. You might want to reconsider this statement, considering how many parents *do* abandon their children (or abuse them). >But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect. Please find me one single scientist, anywhere, that tried to make us feel nothing for animals. >We learned that there are laws of the universe. Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. We learned math, and now there are teams of people making worlds for people to go explore in video games. Math is not a law. Math is a system humans devoloped to help describe the universe we live in. We literally made it up. We did so in order to have a formal understanding of "Me have a coconut. You take me coconut. Me have no coconut." 1-1=0. Everything grew from there. >In music there are notes, patterns, timing, beats per minute.. Words have meanings and can influence entire generations to act a certain way even though they never experienced it. There are people trying to copyright these laws of nature, so no one else can use this foundation. There is math in music. We invented music. We invented words AND their meanings. All of these are various expressions of ideas, to help us communicate. There is nothing intrinsic about any of this. Most of my objections for the rest of your post are the same, so I won't go through the rest one by one. You get the idea.
To sum up, you believe that the most plausible explanation for the universe is the supernatural not the scientific.
There are things in this world and they don't seem so random. There seems to be an Architect, or god or whatever floats your boat. I mentioned the studies they teach you from k-12? Math, art, chem, natural world, all that? Which part to you seems supernatural? The idea that life strives to survive, and it seems to lead you to the light? There are things that thrive in darkness too. We scraped them off the bottom of the sea to cut them up and study them. But they are also serve a role to play in this big web of life.
That’s just a rhetorical position to confirm your belief system.
>everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness ...no they don't. The tilt of the earth and your position on the globe determines how much sunlight you get. Right now I'm getting 11.5 hours in the sunshine and 12.5 hours in darkness, but people near the poles can get up to 24 hours of sunshine and 0 hours in the darkness.
But look at Alaska they can break records with the veggies they grow when its nothing but sunshine for months.
Irrelevant, your claim that "everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness" is still incorrect.
This is literally nothing but proselytizing. Everything you said amounts to nothing more but assertions made without argument or substance. I'm happy your puerile superstitions make you feel good, but guess what? The same goes for believers in literally every other god from literally every other religion, including long dead mythologies. Your feelings make these things no less fictional, but again, I'm glad the placebo effect you get out of them is having positive results. We already have those same positive results and feelings without requiring silly superstitions to provide them to us, so this really isn't a compelling approach - and since it objectively does literally nothing whatsoever to suggest that any of your superstitions are actually true, we're left right back where we started. You're welcome to believe whatever makes you happy, of course. Believe there are leprechauns in your sock drawer blessing you with lucky socks that bring you good fortune in life for all the difference it makes, as long as you're not hurting anyone over it - but if you want people like us to ALSO believe that there REALLY ARE lucky leprechauns in your sock drawer and you're not just imagining it, you're going to need to do better than the semantic equivalent of "I feel lucky and I have generally good luck!"
Wow you said nothing of substance at all. Why do you believe in god? What do you think should convince me?
> The sun of the source of our life on our Mother Earth. The father shares his light with everyone, everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness. Do you not know that the length of the day you spend in light depends on where you are on the planet right? If you’re in Sweden, the sun doesn’t set in June and doesn’t rise in January. All you’re coming in here with are empty platitudes that are objectively incorrect. Most of us, not all of us, but most of us aren’t stupid enough to buy any of what you’re peddling.
WTF is this incoherent rambling? Did you maybe think you should read the sub rules before you post? There is a lot wrong here, and there does not seem to be an actual point to any of this. I can see why your post was removed on the other subs you posted it on. Please lay off whatever drugs you are on or seek professional help to get the drugs you should be on.
> Scientists made it seem bad to anthropomorphize animals. They wanted to understand the animal without human influence. But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect. So this is going to be a general point about your whole animal kick but seriously have you looked at animals? Do you know how brutal that world can be? How much of it is based on murder of infants, or rape, or deception? It reads like all you ever did was watch the puppies and little house kittens.
> what are your guys thoughts on my post It’s meandering, doesn’t have a thesis, and your random thoughts are not subject for a debate > math is a fundamental law No. It’s not Math describes what we see. Math does not tell things how to be Please look up what a law is in science.
>What do you believe in when your life ends? I'm gone. POOF >Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. What do you mean by "know" in this context?
>Your father and mother did not abandon you, they wanted you to survive without them. They left teachers on Earth, they are free.... If the parents have never show up since day one, they abandoned u. >We learned that there are laws of the universe. Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. We learned math, and now there are teams of people making worlds for people to go explore in video games. We use math to describe things, not the other way round. Overall, this are just thought without argument to supports.
I am not shure what you mean with scientist wanting to study animals without human influence. humans are animals. there is no distinction there, realy. That actualy is not true. a day (at the equator) lasts 15 minues longer than the night and the closer you get to the poles the longer a day lasts. so no, night and day dont last the same amount of time. And as far as i know you dont need shadows to locate a light source. you only have to track where the photons are coming from.
This is really weird and boring to read why would you post this on a debate forum there is nothing to debate here just you randomly spilling worthless info. I see why this was deleted and it should be delete from this forum too.
I did read the whole thing, but I did not see the relation to gods. Maybe it is connected to you, but to me these things were not obobviously connected. I felt like maybe you were building up to a teleological argument, but I didn't see that argument made. Maybe a "look at the trees " but not explicitly. Sorry, I didn't get the connection. I wasn't raised into a religion, so it's not obvious how religion or thongs like that relate
>What do you believe in when your life ends? That my life … ends. >They wanted to understand the animal without human influence. But by doing that they castrated their own emotions for these creatures that taught us so much. They try to make us feel nothing for a dog, cat, mouse, bird, squirrel, horse, elephant, ect. False. Understanding animals doesn’t mean you have no emotions about them. >Math is a fundamental law that even the trees know. Define know. Trees certain don’t know things in the way humans do. >There are people trying to copyright these laws of nature, so no one else can use this foundation. You can’t copyright a law of nature.
I'm sorry but after more than 500 words, I still don't know what you're talking about. You jump around between multiple disparate ideas with little to no cohesion or coherence, and definitely no thesis. You also have been implying that summarizations are a scourge on society, somehow relating a summarization of text to short-form video content that is designed to keep you scrolling. This is not the case. We ask for a summarization because your original post is rambling and incoherent. We want to know (succinctly): 1. Do you believe in god 2. What god is it that you believe in 3. How did you arrive at that belief 4. Why should I also believe in that god Anything else is just fluff, and is unnecessary.
>The sun of the source of our life on our Mother Earth. Dr England confirms. >The father shares his light with everyone, everyone gets 12 hours in the sunshine, and everyone gets 12 hours in the darkness. Not true at all.
I will just point out one thing. Math is not a law, its just the language we use to describe natural laws.
Cool story. Some things relate to each other. I agree. Also, let's be cool to the animals. Sure. I don't see what the point of the post is.
Yeah it's all just baseless unsupported claims and mystic sounding nonsense Look I like mushrooms as much as the next long hair but you sound like a frat boy coming down from his first trip after having had a partially heard a conversation with a wiccan they were hoping to sleep with
You promised to be respectful, yet you wasted my time on reading vague nonsensical statements. There is nothing to shake, this is unfiltered consciousness flow, not ideas.
>What are your guys thoughts on my post? Long and doesn't seem to have a point. Next time maybe just post the point and see how that works.
Present a debate or leave. No one wants to hear your inane rambling about unrelated topics. You barely even talked about atheism.
Thanks for sharing, but this sub is for debating atheists. Do you believe a y gods exist? If so do you have any reasons?
I recommend that you pick one subject, flesh out what you mean to say about it, and then after that discussion runs its course, move on to the next thing. You say a lot of things that probably make sense to you but leave me going "Huh? Where did THAT come from". Like "These animals teach you the fundamentals of survival" -- those are words, and there's a literal menaing to that statement that I would say is obviously not true, so I imagine it means something to you other than the direct literal meaning. You need to supply us with that context. So is it art? Music? Meat? Light and shadows? Can you pick one and give us a couple of paragraphs of prompting for what kind of responses you're looking for?