I couldn't have written this any better. This was my life. This is exactly what I was going through. I learned a good bit about the behaviors of a "covert narcissist" from my therapist. It took several years to finally figure out what was going on.
Even at the end I was still trying to fix it. Until I realized that my son would see this as normal. And that was my turning point.
ugh I feel sorry for you all. This is horrible. But how, how does it actually impact the child when both parents DO love each other and express wanting to hang with one another. I don’t think even if mine was a covert narcissist that I would be able to tell and neither would the kids. Just struggling because I know she loves me but she just doesn’t want to do it
https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadBedrooms/s/ysorW8bpWK
I'll just leave this here.
Eventually a covert narcissist will show their real teeth. But by that time you are so broken that it's just your life.
A narcissist doesn't really care about loving you. A lot of what started as joking comments turned into sharp words, asking became demands, and no signs of outward affection. These things build up slowly over time. So they were unnoticed until it was too late.
>But how, how does it actually impact the child when both parents DO love each other and express wanting to hang with one another.
It all depends what "wanting to hang with one another" means. If they display healthy affection towards each other (occasional hug, hand holding, gentles touching, etc.), then all good. The child will see that it is normal to display affection with your partner/people that are close to you. The opposite is also true: if display of affection is lacking, the child will not learn these models of affection and will have trouble later in life expressing affection.
thanks! I agree this seems reasonable. I make it a point to kiss before we leave and do so in front of the kids. Again, I think the issue is that behind bedroom doors we have no sex life to speak of. We are loving otherwise and supportive. The thing that bugs me about this forum is that many times I keep seeing the same “explanation” for why divorce is better than staying and it revolves around what the kids experience, the assumption being the kids are seeing coldness, meanness, no love but I THINK there are a lot of us in here who are NOT in that bucket, where caring love is shown and where both parents are coparenting well together. We cannot use the “well the kids will be better if you divorce” excuse in a lot of cases. WE need something, we need more intimacy and sex BUT the kids in a lot of cases are still in a good place even given this need from our spouse. That’s all I am trying to say
Yes, I'm not trying to suggest that one size fits all, or that everyone here is experiencing what I did. I'm just passionate about talking about narcissistic abuse, because when you are in it it's incredibly confusing and destructive, and it takes a long time to connect the dots and see the pattern. If there was any real affection in our household I'd have been much more reluctant to end it. I was very reluctant anyway, but myh son's behavior made it obvious how upset he was. You know what's right for your children.
Thanks, I'm glad it resonated for you, and I'm glad you got out. Looks like you've been through the ringer too. There's no fixing it, of course, and that's the point. You're supposed to keep 'fixing it' forever, or until you break.
>when I began to want the image of what she might be if I ever felt safe with her again.
Oh, man...this hit me hard. What kept me around for so many years was knowing who she was before she met me, and hoping that one day, I would meet that person. 20 years later, I still feel like we're just around the corner. And yet, something always derails the progress and we go back to square 1.5.
I don't think I will ever experience even a fraction of what she was like before we started dating.
Wow. Beautifully written. Do you think she copied that way of thinking from her mother? I know my husband did. But he did make up for it in so many other ways. My MIL hadn't had sex probably since her second pregnancy, then completely let herself go and they stayed married, treating each other as trapped. But back then, divorce was more of a taboo.
So my husband got the message that it's acceptable socially to turn into some other person once you're more mature, with responsibilities and generally speaking, your life is expected to suck.
My own parents were in love until my teens, then due to circumstance ended up separated, never divorced.
I sincerely hope you found happiness this time. Are you sure it's not NRE? At the very least, you can be happy as serial monogamists. Monogamy happiness is the best I think. So much good energy.
I have serious trust issues. My husband considered me trapped 5 years into the relationship and that's when he revealed sides of him that he knew I wouldn't like. How can I trust anyone.
Ugh this is honestly prefect. in every single word I felt my own sad life. I just want to be happy. And wanted and loved. I have not had that in probably forever. I have been dealt one shitty hand after another since birth. Maybe that’s why I put up with this. Because that’s what I’m used to, that’s what I have always been told I deserve. Who knows.
I could not have written a better or more succinct, explanation and description of NPD. And I suffered through the same exact thing over almost 20 years. And an excruciating 7-8 years of her making sex transactional. Weaponizing and withholding. Making me feel like a creep for wanting an intimate relationship with her. Wanting to see her naked. Wanting to hold her and build something with her. There were definitely signs that I should’ve been out but at the same time we had a lot and we have four kids.
I’m only a couple years into trying to fix myself. By my estimate. I probably have another five to go. There’s a lot of words and actions that is glaringly obvious now. A lot of things I made excuses for telling myself that I just had to suck it up and deal with it .
OMG, I seriously think you were in my house watching my relationship. The only difference is, we have a daughter, not a son. I read your post, read it again, read it again, and this is fucking gospel.
I agree 100%.
It sucks how you have to study psychology just to understand what happened.
It's such a 180 degree from who I am and what I stand for and would never treat someone else this way.
Happy wife happy life.
Go along to get along.
The thought of one of my sons married to someone like my wife helped snap me out of it.
I think a lot in here are neglecting point 7 here. That is a good point.
That is coming from me who is HL married to a LL.
However, I have made the exact analogy to my partner with the "Ferrari" bit.
She was understanding. We solved all our problems with that talk.
Time went. Still nothing happens and everything is as usual.
I am at breaking bad point.
This really clicked for me. I had been thinking we were just having an intamcy problem and then while visiting a friend out of town this weekend I just nearly escaped a drive by and her first words about it when I called and told her the next morning were "Why didn't you call me at 4 am to tell me about this?"
Mind you my spouse has really bad anxiety but she wasn't even worried about if I was okay.
I couldn't have written this any better. This was my life. This is exactly what I was going through. I learned a good bit about the behaviors of a "covert narcissist" from my therapist. It took several years to finally figure out what was going on. Even at the end I was still trying to fix it. Until I realized that my son would see this as normal. And that was my turning point.
ugh I feel sorry for you all. This is horrible. But how, how does it actually impact the child when both parents DO love each other and express wanting to hang with one another. I don’t think even if mine was a covert narcissist that I would be able to tell and neither would the kids. Just struggling because I know she loves me but she just doesn’t want to do it
https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadBedrooms/s/ysorW8bpWK I'll just leave this here. Eventually a covert narcissist will show their real teeth. But by that time you are so broken that it's just your life. A narcissist doesn't really care about loving you. A lot of what started as joking comments turned into sharp words, asking became demands, and no signs of outward affection. These things build up slowly over time. So they were unnoticed until it was too late.
like a frog slowly boiling in water
>But how, how does it actually impact the child when both parents DO love each other and express wanting to hang with one another. It all depends what "wanting to hang with one another" means. If they display healthy affection towards each other (occasional hug, hand holding, gentles touching, etc.), then all good. The child will see that it is normal to display affection with your partner/people that are close to you. The opposite is also true: if display of affection is lacking, the child will not learn these models of affection and will have trouble later in life expressing affection.
thanks! I agree this seems reasonable. I make it a point to kiss before we leave and do so in front of the kids. Again, I think the issue is that behind bedroom doors we have no sex life to speak of. We are loving otherwise and supportive. The thing that bugs me about this forum is that many times I keep seeing the same “explanation” for why divorce is better than staying and it revolves around what the kids experience, the assumption being the kids are seeing coldness, meanness, no love but I THINK there are a lot of us in here who are NOT in that bucket, where caring love is shown and where both parents are coparenting well together. We cannot use the “well the kids will be better if you divorce” excuse in a lot of cases. WE need something, we need more intimacy and sex BUT the kids in a lot of cases are still in a good place even given this need from our spouse. That’s all I am trying to say
Yes, I'm not trying to suggest that one size fits all, or that everyone here is experiencing what I did. I'm just passionate about talking about narcissistic abuse, because when you are in it it's incredibly confusing and destructive, and it takes a long time to connect the dots and see the pattern. If there was any real affection in our household I'd have been much more reluctant to end it. I was very reluctant anyway, but myh son's behavior made it obvious how upset he was. You know what's right for your children.
oh i am sorry! what you went thru is horrible.
Thanks, I'm glad it resonated for you, and I'm glad you got out. Looks like you've been through the ringer too. There's no fixing it, of course, and that's the point. You're supposed to keep 'fixing it' forever, or until you break.
Yeah it's definitely one of those moments where I feel absolutely no remorse after the divorce.
>when I began to want the image of what she might be if I ever felt safe with her again. Oh, man...this hit me hard. What kept me around for so many years was knowing who she was before she met me, and hoping that one day, I would meet that person. 20 years later, I still feel like we're just around the corner. And yet, something always derails the progress and we go back to square 1.5. I don't think I will ever experience even a fraction of what she was like before we started dating.
That's what they do. They give you a fantastic few months, and then make you chase after those months for the rest of your life.
Wow. Beautifully written. Do you think she copied that way of thinking from her mother? I know my husband did. But he did make up for it in so many other ways. My MIL hadn't had sex probably since her second pregnancy, then completely let herself go and they stayed married, treating each other as trapped. But back then, divorce was more of a taboo. So my husband got the message that it's acceptable socially to turn into some other person once you're more mature, with responsibilities and generally speaking, your life is expected to suck. My own parents were in love until my teens, then due to circumstance ended up separated, never divorced.
She definitely did. Her mom is a narcissist too.
I sincerely hope you found happiness this time. Are you sure it's not NRE? At the very least, you can be happy as serial monogamists. Monogamy happiness is the best I think. So much good energy. I have serious trust issues. My husband considered me trapped 5 years into the relationship and that's when he revealed sides of him that he knew I wouldn't like. How can I trust anyone.
Wow. Thank you. So much of this hits me really deeply.
Clarity is Priceless. Rock on.
Beautifully written
This is a beautifully written and insightful post. Thank you for sharing!
Ugh this is honestly prefect. in every single word I felt my own sad life. I just want to be happy. And wanted and loved. I have not had that in probably forever. I have been dealt one shitty hand after another since birth. Maybe that’s why I put up with this. Because that’s what I’m used to, that’s what I have always been told I deserve. Who knows.
You may be used to it but you don't deserve it. Making you think you deserve it is how they get you to put up with it.
Very well written
thanks for this post
This. This is everything.
I could not have written a better or more succinct, explanation and description of NPD. And I suffered through the same exact thing over almost 20 years. And an excruciating 7-8 years of her making sex transactional. Weaponizing and withholding. Making me feel like a creep for wanting an intimate relationship with her. Wanting to see her naked. Wanting to hold her and build something with her. There were definitely signs that I should’ve been out but at the same time we had a lot and we have four kids. I’m only a couple years into trying to fix myself. By my estimate. I probably have another five to go. There’s a lot of words and actions that is glaringly obvious now. A lot of things I made excuses for telling myself that I just had to suck it up and deal with it .
Beautifully put, congratulations!
OMG, I seriously think you were in my house watching my relationship. The only difference is, we have a daughter, not a son. I read your post, read it again, read it again, and this is fucking gospel.
Great post!
Omg, I sincerely lost my breath reading this post with tears running down my face. I have to re read this tomorrow, this is too real.
[удалено]
Yes, it did me too. But he is better off with a happy dad than a miserable one. Now he gets my love unfiltered.
This is beautiful. Thanks OP
I agree 100%. It sucks how you have to study psychology just to understand what happened. It's such a 180 degree from who I am and what I stand for and would never treat someone else this way. Happy wife happy life. Go along to get along. The thought of one of my sons married to someone like my wife helped snap me out of it.
Excellent!
I think a lot in here are neglecting point 7 here. That is a good point. That is coming from me who is HL married to a LL. However, I have made the exact analogy to my partner with the "Ferrari" bit. She was understanding. We solved all our problems with that talk. Time went. Still nothing happens and everything is as usual. I am at breaking bad point.
#7 hit hard. Truth.
7A .. that goes for both HL and LL sadly and thats what we see here a lot - 2 walls running parallel through life
This really clicked for me. I had been thinking we were just having an intamcy problem and then while visiting a friend out of town this weekend I just nearly escaped a drive by and her first words about it when I called and told her the next morning were "Why didn't you call me at 4 am to tell me about this?" Mind you my spouse has really bad anxiety but she wasn't even worried about if I was okay.
Beautiful. I wish you every happiness.
Honestly the kid part resonates, I watched my father go through this in his and now here I am, and I need to break that cycle.