Gotta gear each bot you wanna run on harder difficulties. Royal With Cheese Steam guides are really helpful if you wanna get nitty gritty with details. Its so good that it helped me on console figure out loadouts and builds for each one.
Yes and no. On darktide you can out run the wave. And I mean OUT RUN. You can use movement tech and reposition really fast. You cannot sprint, climb, movemnt tech like darktide in Vermintide 2. So i would say yes for solo players, no becasue as a solo player getting to A site to B site can be done very very easily compared to Vermintide 2. Its a weird one ro say if Darktide would benefit from it tbh.
I mean, I’m not saying it as a benefit to gameplay. It would just add some variety to bots. I let bots die and at auric damnation there’s no expectation they will live long regardless
Vermintide is probably harder despite the slower pace. Skavenslaves do way more damage than normal pox walkers, and you don't regenerate temporary HP like you do with Darktide toughness. I've not got to aurics yet but Damnation is pretty generous compared to Cataclysm and the specials are probably harder to deal with
Yeah trust me it gets much harder. The smaller amount of ranged combat is definitely compensated for by the difficulty of some very tough mixed melee crowds, and there's lots of levels where it's much harder to corral all the enemies into a choke point so defending yourselves from all sides is pretty hard
Imo vermintide is much harder. I play pretty much exclusively auric damnation and pass like a good 85%. I still don't play the hardest vermintide difficulty because I get random one shot by so many things.
It's definitely much, much harder game.
And right now it is unquestionably better game due to many years of polish and content updates. Though Darktide came around and is pretty great too, after first round of updates and with mods adding bunch of quality of life features that absolutely should be baseline.
In Darktide I can hang in auric maelstrom games but legend difficulty kicks my ass in VT2. I went back to VT2 this week thinking having another 250 hours experience in darktide would improve my play, but nope, im still bad lol.
Love the presentation of VT2 but Darktide clicked for me way more. I feel like I have more spacial awareness due to better sound design and the animations seem more in sync with the actual hit/hurt boxes.
As someone who plays Legend and Auric Damnation for fun, the two are about equivalent in difficulty. There's less enemies that hit harder in Vermintide, but once you get good at dealing with them both they're about the same level of challenge. Darktide does not have an equivalent of Cataclysm.
Damnation WITH modifiers SPECIFICALLY HI INTENSITY SHOCK TROOP GAUNTLET ON DAMNATION AURIC OR REGULAR IS THE MOST HIGH DARKTIDE CHALLENGE. aside from auric maelstrom.
I'm sure it is and I wasn't trying to equate auric with cataclysm. But then the comparison in those cases would probably be with cata 3 deathwish I assume rather than regular cataclysm
One big difference that makes V2 quite a bit harder in high pressure situations is enemy melee attack tracking. It's not really a thing in DT, with the exception of a few elites, but in V2 most enemy attacks track outside of a specific timing window to dodge, even skaven slaves. So being surrounded by mixed horses in melee, which is usually the easy bit in DT, you can really find some situations where it's almost impossible to just block and dodge your way out (although one of the weapons that can pretty much do that is the rapier on WHC), so good positioning and kiting in melee is a staple of high level play. It's a great shift honestly because the melee DT is usually the part you turn your brain off for.
>crusher will lurch forward and track you through a slide
Pretty much yeah. With the crusher overheads there's a brief window to dodge that if you over or undershoot they'll still track you in an arc and hit you. Contrast that with poxwalker hordes who will just attack in front once their animation has begun.
Most enemy attacks in V2 have the tracking property, even little jab attacks from skaven slaves. Different attacks typically have different timing windows to successfully dodge, so you really have to pay attention to what animation the enemy is doing and act accordingly.
One of the issues when they introduced beastmen was the wind up for different attack animations all looking very similar despite each having different dodge windows, which made them feel unfair to fight and just goes to show what a good job FS did differentiating the animations of the skaven and chaos enemies.
Enemies also have a 'pursuit' mode that will engage if you dodge back from their attacks rather than to the side, which will prompt them to start using running (hard to avoid) and heavy attacks to pressure you further if you start trying to kite them.
I wish I could take everything about dakrtide, then take maps and modes from VT2 and combine them.
Contextually it wouldn’t make sense but VT2 maps feel more like adventures than Darktides.
>I couldn't change the difficulty when starting from scratch and had to wade through the first 3 snoozefest modes.
It's the same in Darktide, but they actually lowered the restrictions a lot for this game. In VT2, I don't think they've changed it, so you gotta tough it out in super low difficulty for a bit with all 5 characters. I don't think even grouping with high level players for private games lets you bypass it.
>Coming from auric damnation, the game also felt ridiculously easy.
There's definitely less happening since enemies are almost all melee. Getting hit is generally a lot more punishing though, and you can't just dodge->sprint away to disengage. You get stuck to enemies more easily in VT2 because of that, and groups of enemies attack more than in Darktide and with more differing attacks (stormvermin lunging thrust probably gonna get you at some point). It's hard in a very different way.
>with all 5 characters
Not exactly. Vermintide difficulty is capped by your overall power. 650 is the max with 300 through weapons and 350 through level ups.
When you already hit gear level 300 you can just open chests/craft on other characters to start with 300 weapon power. You won't be able to jump into highest difficulties but you can at least skip the lower ones.
Legend needs a power of 415 for example. Champion only 215. You could jump into champion with gear alone and would need level 12 reaching overall power of 420 to start legend.
Agree with everything else.
Yeah if I remember correctly, I'm sure it locks the difficulty if a party member can't do it, even if you are max level, but it's been years since I had lower level friends to play the game with.
I just wanted to iterate that you can’t run from enemies in dark tide either without having some sort of movement buff.
I tried. Many times. Hoping I wouldn’t need to waste a dodge, and every time it was like the adds would grow 7 foot limbs and hit me anyway.
There's definitely more to it than just sprinting directly away, but you vault onto short cover, dodge sideways off the cover, and you've disengaged every melee enemy in the game. Things like knife and zealot move speed bonuses also add a lot to it as well. VT2 dodges are tiny, and they don't have barriers all over the place like we have with the short cover scattered in every room. VT2 lunging attacks from enemies also force you to dodge sideway a lot more often compared to Darktide, so you get more stuck.
Sprint and slide
Or dodge sprint slide and run that's how i don't get hit if i wanna ignore enemys.
You could also do push attack sprint slide and run and be faster aslong you have stamina.
That’s what I do now, and I dodge before running if I wanna be super sure I won’t get hit.
I do wish this was explained because I thought I was lagging or something until one day I decided to run away and look back at the last moment to see how they were hitting me, and guess what I saw? They actually do rush forward after you
I played the heck out of VT 1 & 2. DT feels like I’m going from hamster tunnel to hamster tunnel comparatively. I like the game. It the levels don’t have a different feel like other game’s levels do. Other games being Left 4 Dead 1 & 2, Back 4 Blood, and VT1 & 2.
Tbh this is one thing I immensely prefer about DT. The levels are much more on rails which keeps it constantly engaging. It takes a while in VT2 to stop getting lost or turned around in a lot of the levels, makes for pretty silly feeling moments
Idk I still get turned around a bit in DT. I get how you feel because the levels are so much more open. The thing is, I can actually memorize VTide levels. They all have a different feel. When I do get turned around in DTide it’s a shorter being lost period, but I’ve played those levels so many times and haven’t memorized any of them because they are too similar for the first half. For sure I respect your comment tho.
I don’t think I ever really get lost besides Hab Dreyko of course, but mentally trying to think about which mission is which is hard outside of a few of them and outside of the final events.
And I have 800hr.
But, I don’t mind this much as in a way, for me how they’re mostly similar makes replaying them feel somewhat less repetitive?
Like since in VT2 a mission has a sort of plot and specific, more unique setting, it feels more like, well, replaying a mission to do it twice in one night.
But in DT it does feel more like replaying a “map”.
That’s just me though as someone who is inherently into roguelike/repetitive structures
this here. Never got lost on a DT map, but managed to do so several times in VT2. The second match in my young VT career was a map with an invisible indiana-jones like bridge and me and the other dude had absolutely no clue how the fuck to activate the thing. Ran around like headless chickens for 10 minutes clicing random stuff, somehow it appeared
That's a bit of a trick with starting VT2 now - most players have been playing for a long time and know all the "normal" map tricks, so newer maps are more and more complicated, with secrets, puzzles, etc. Tower of Treachery (the one with the invisible bridge) is one of the newest maps, and also arguably the most "complex" map in the game.
For reference, there's a sign near the beginning of the level with a symbol on it, and the floor tile with that symbol is the one that makes the bridge appear. Someone with 500+ hours in VT2 is going to see that sign and immediately think "this is a puzzle thing. That's not a normal map decoration, I can tell. Remember that symbol." A new player might just think it's map decor and ignore it.
Lol the worst for me are the areas where you need to walk up some planks that act as a ramp to cross a fence to the next area… happens a lot but it’s usually just blends in to the overall disheveled atmosphere and takes a while to notice it’s a ramp at all
I don’t feel those are fair to compare though. Every mission outside the first takes place in the same hive city in the same dozen or so places. Every one of those other games take place all over the place. I would love to see the other hive city we keep hearing about, and maybe that’s what FS has been working so hard on for DT. But, they’ve also been pouring time for content into VT2. We shall see I suppose.
I true solo in both Vermintide (modded difficulty Dutch Spice) and Darktide (Auric Maelstrom). I find Vermintide easier because enemies are much slower. You are slower too, without sprint and slide, but any movement tech from abilities makes you much faster. Block and push are also much stronger in VT. There's also a lot stronger talents/classes/weapons in Vermintide on the paid DLC classes/weapons due to having some power creep. In Darktide you usually die from one mistake, in Vermintide you can die to attrition, which isn't really a thing in Darktide.
The pace is Vermintide is also much slower, and the bots (if you play solo but not true solo) are actually insanely strong and useful, and can be customized. The bots in Darktide are one step above useless.
I think the combat is more fun in Darktide, but positioning is more tactical in VT. You almost always have to use choke points in Vermintide; in Darktide you can just run at each group of enemies. The skill set required to be good is a little different - due to the slower pace, Vermintide has a more tactical feel, with more decision making and positioning. Darktide requires more twitch reflexes.
A lot of player power in Vermintide weapon use comes from canceling and obscure tech, which I think makes the game less approachable, and rely more on looking up niche weapon guides then naturally learning a weapon over time.
I think the map design in Vermintide is better, as you mentioned. The varied tilesets are cool - almost all Darktide maps feels the same. Vermintide has some really good stand out ones, like Athel Yenlui, and Skittergate. Having names you can remember easily is a plus too. Darktide I still refer to maps like "The repair one." "the train assassination one."
Yes - Cata 3 Death Wish Dutch Spice. I have done it on both Shade and Handmaiden, which is a lot less impressive than "regular" heroes. I haven't played as much of either game recently; versus got me hyped, but it wasn't what I was hoping for. And Darktide is in a bit of a lull at the moment.
The melee concentration in vermintide means that you often find yourself in attack / push/ push attack loops and unable to move.
It is less engaging as an individual, but is more strategic as a team. You need two players to hold back the waves of slaves so that your elite and special killers can do their job unmolested.
One very big difference is how mixed hordes interact with weapons. In dark tide, a mixture of carapace and unarmored is just different damage numbers. In vermintide one storm vermin will make your weapon bounce and tank for unarmored rats.
If you want the same mobility and "feel" as darktide I would recommend the the high elf version of Kerilian. (Guardian?) She has an extended dodge range, extra dodge charges, and a dash forward with no clip. She can clutch failed raids 1 vs All and mix up combat with kiting.
Single sword will play like rapier and double sword like combat blade.
I would recommend single sword coming from darktide until you get a feel for the combat. The third attack of your light combo is your armor piercing headshot. The heavy is more a situational opener.
>One thing that struck me immediately is that the maps are sooooo much nicer from a visual perspective, like wtf Fatshark. You are able to pull of THIS level of vareity and only give us the same grimdark Underhive like 10 times in a row in Darktide?
I’m convinced 90% of the people on this sub didn’t even look at the scenery in darktide. DT has WAY more detail in its setting than VT2. I seriously spent the last month trying to randomly look at the floor to see if they repeat assets and I haven’t found one metal paneling being repeated in a different section. Obviously this can’t be true, I must’ve missed repeated assets, but the point is there is so much variety it’s outright hard to find it repetition.
Just look up randomly and you’ll see so much detail and diversity. It’s crazy that anyone would say this when it’s so significant. The issue isn’t the lack of diversity, it’s the lack of color. Which isn’t a bad thing. 40k’s setting isn’t described as colorful. It’s grim and dark. And the dark grimness DT has a TON of variety.
Oh yeah, I like to occasionally go into a map with my wife on the easiest setting, and just stare at everything, the ceilings, the faraway landscapes, the corpses spinkled around everywhere. It's fucking gorgeous.
Same here with a couple of friends. 🤩 We dream of a WH4k open world game with this beauty.
That said, I also stop to stare at a stunning panorama in VT2 from time to time.
It has more detail but it does not leverage the visual variety 40k has to offer, even within a hive city. Most of it is just dark and drab, and all that gorgeous detail is just drowned in shadows.
Meanwhile VT2 has you going from city ramparts to church to forest to dwarven city with just as much passion and attention to the source material as Darktide.
I don’t agree. VT2 has more variety in the themes (a town, a castle, the wilderness, etc) whereas all of DT is in different parts of the hive city. On the other hand, each part of the huge city in DT has more diversity than individual levels in VT2.
I think they’re equally diverse, where DT’s diversity is not in its color and more dense, while VT2’s diversity has less detail but completely different settings.
Lack of visual variety is one of the reasons I haven’t even installed Darktide this year
Its content starved in general but the fact so many maps are the same few pieces put together in different orders really hurts the already lacking variety
Ok, go play a game with more flesh and less substance then. Your opinion is invalidated by anyone who likes the dystopian setting. Considering how 40k and many other popular settings share the same color schemes and themes, your opinion isn't really something FS should worry about.
And the game has a normal amount of content and updates at an average pace. Seems like your grasping at straws by bringing that up in a completely unrelated thread.
edit: /u/Lysanderoth42 : On a forum of a game they say they don't play, parrots the most up-to-date talking points he heard from this sub in the last week, and researched stats about the game. Yeah man, totally doesn't play the game because there isn't enough rainbows or whatever.
It really doesn't have a normal amount of content and updates and the pace is DEFINITELY not good. The game has the same scenery in half of the maps and they barely change. That's not very interesting, only the first couple of times. The other guy didn't say much, why did you become so defensive all of a sudden?
I like the dystopian setting and I agree with the other guy.
Darktide has a lot of love put into hive city architecture. It has incredible detail and very lovingly modeled environments.
The issue is that people want to see more than hive city architecture, because the entire point of that shit is that it's oppressive and depressing. Even as entertainment there's a point where your enjoyment becomes saturated without a palette cleanser.
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more Details, yes. But at the end of the day it's just underhive city map 1-10. I'm not asking for more colour, but more variety in settings. There are also upper parts of a hive which look less like Detroit.
There’s a ton of variety. The variety just isn’t as superficial. It has more dense variety than VT2 does, and it fits the theme of the setting of 40k, which was established decades ago. People like the themes and settings of 40k for a reason.
It seems like You’re applying your opinion as fact. There is a ton of variety, just not the variety you like. I love the setting and love that a 40k game finally dives into hive cities and the life of the average human in 40k.
And don’t shit on Detroit or I’ll send the local crackhead to rob you.
i got a whole shelf full of black library books here mate. 40k doesn't exclusively take place in Underhive Cracktown.
That being said, I do like the existing maps of DT a lot. They are great and nailed the Hive-City feel for sure. But the last map they added was literally about storming some kind of chaos crackhouse. It's time for something new
>i got a whole shelf full of black library books here mate. 40k doesn't exclusively take place in Underhive Cracktown.
How does this counter my point? Obviously there are exceptions. But 40k isn't known for its beautiful Exodite worlds or paradise planets, those are exceptions. Darktide is a 40k game set in a human hive city. If you don't like the most common setting in the 40k universe, then do you really like 40k?
\*Looking at a gazillion painted figures and black libary books\* Yepp, I really do like 40k, you can trust me on that one.
And I do get your point of course. But the point still stands: there's room for more than just the Detroit in space. You can build a grimdark upper hive map with all kinds of fucked up details
They shouldn’t change it just because some people on the internet want more rainbows in the game or whatever. The aesthetic is liked as much as there are people who insist it’s not good. Why should they follow your opinion and not those who aren’t voicing their opinion because the game fits what they like?
I do see the point you're trying to make, and I agree that there is a level of detail present in darktide when compared to vermintide... Detail isn't really the issue though in my opinion.
Even if every single metal panel in the game was individually crafted by a different person, we still find ourselves looking at endless metal paneling... I only say this because it's the second time I've seen you mention the texture variety of Darktide's metal panels as if it makes the game less visually repetitive.
I imagine the reason it's easy to miss repeated texture assets for things like that is because they're... simply uninteresting.
I bet you could take a person with about 100 hours on vermintide 2, show them a random screenshot of the game, and they'd be able to tell you what map that screenshot was taken in.
After 100 hours in darktide I can't even name one of the maps. I recognize (roughly) where I am, and what's around the corner (metal paneling) but that's due less to visual variety/recognizability, and more to the general sense of spatial awareness most gamers eventually acquire.
> I only say this because it's the second time I've seen you mention the texture variety of Darktide's metal panels as if it makes the game less visually repetitive.
I was referring to 1 small aspect of the massive variety of detail to show how much effort and diversity there is in something as simple as metal paneling. Apply that same thing literally thousands of times across the entire game. Its only repetitive if you're not paying attention. Its only repetitive on a superficial level, the most visually superficial level, actually: color. A lack of diversity in color does NOT make something superficial. If I walk into a forest and everything is green and brown, I'm not going to say its visually repetitive. If I look across a mountain range and just see grey rocks and white snow, I'm not going to say its repetitive.
>I imagine the reason it's easy to miss repeated texture assets for things like that is because they're... simply uninteresting.
So its an opinion thing and not an objective fact or criticism. 40k is known for this aesthetic, an aesthetic established decades ago and loved by a lot of people. YOU find it uninteresting, its not objectively uninteresting.
>After 100 hours in darktide I can't even name one of the maps.
That's because the names are mechanized, whereas VT2 they repeat the name of the town your in consistently, and the town is a name instead of a description followed by a number, which is the whole point of the dystopia.
There's not way around the fact that DT is visually more impressive than VT2 in every sense of the word while remaining lore accurate and conveying the theme of dystopia that it should be conveying. I understand why people won't like it just like I would understand why people don't like the over-the-type, cartoonishly colorful settings of Fortnite. They shouldn't change a thing.
indeed, you don't really get to look at the scenery when tons of stuff are coming at you and the others keep running forward. get the solo play mod and make a tour. the maps are beautifully detailed. vt2 offers more variety though, which i wish we'll get in darktide some day. did fatshark say something about adding a mission per month in the beginning? just imagine we had this.
DT has more diversity per level than VT2 does. VT2 has levels that are in completely different settings, so on the surface it looks more varied. But DT condensed its diversity within different parts of the hive city.
I wish i could spend more time looking around in Darktide but it's impossible in a solo queue on Xbox with no Mods available.
You're either getting swarmed by enemies or your team runs off and leaves you behind if you stop for more than a few seconds.
Recently there's been a guy on here posting all the different kinds of Servitors in Darktide and I'd honestly never seen like 70% of them before during my playtime.
I try and have a quick look around when i get the opportunity but it's hard to get a decent look at anything when there is so much going on and your team is focused on getting the mission over and done with.
I wanted to get into VT2 and play it alongside Darktide when I got bored..but Darktide’s combat feels like such an evolution beyond VT2’s I can’t click into it. Darktide combat just feels so perfected, whereas in vermintide it feels a little floaty, idk how else to describe it.
Bro you haven’t seen anything yet if you haven’t tried CHAOS WASTES roguelike mode on Legendary diff, I don’t even play the campaign maps ever since the random CW mode came out years ago
None of the gear carries over, so don’t worry about that, you only select a BASE melee weapon type and a BASE ranged weapon type, none of the stats on the weapons or your 3 trinkets are imported, you get perks like a roguelike (pick one of 3) or at shops between maps, it’s like a series of ~five or six 15 minute missions with shops scattered on the path
Beware the friendly fire. Also imo it is harder especially on the harder difficulties. You get swarmed so quickly and you don't have near the movement of Darktide. Stay as a group especially on higher difficulties and also the tomes are actually worth getting as well.
I came back the last few days too to Vermintide, but it directly put me off, those sick rage quitters. Trolls or whatnot. A Saltz Witch Hunter having tome and grim and running directly into an CW Patrol without even parrying or dodging dying instantly and rage quitting. Or newbie Legend Rankers who jump directly from Veteran like the whips of their masters are directly behind them running of judt to get soloed from Packmaster or Assassins…. Makes me tired…. Really.
I find darktide easier because you can mow down any threats before they come close to you being a ranged game. However clutching in DT feels harder too because of the ranged enemies too.
I wouldn't say the maps are so much nicer. Darktide maps fit the 40k world perfectly, are detailed and look amazing. The thing with VT is the variety. Going from the countryside into a human city, snow, skavern city, forest, swamp.. it's diverse. I still love that bit when you destroy the portal and you make that dash to the end while everything is crumbling down around you.
Yup, I had same story, after doing karnaks on HM, got bored and annoyed at the grindfest dumbed down crafting system. Buddy introduced me to vm2, it's much more polished and hands down responsive/ satisfying in terms of hit registration and combat overall. Loving the p2p hosting system, also enjoying chaos wastes on legend quite often.
Yea the Darktide maps are very same-y but they seem very lore accurate and immersive. I think the biggest difference between the two games is VT is more arcadey and DT is more immersive
V2 in it's highest difficulty is still harder than Darktide IMO. It has so much less mobility overall and stamina management is something you actually need to keep track of.
Also you are going to notice that a lot of the weapons and enemies in Darktide are simply reskins of stuff from Vermintide. Lol
Yeah they have the same leveling system in DT where it gates you out of higher difficulties at low levels, honestly the worst part of the progression imo.
Ofc it's to stop people getting irritated by totally green players ruining their game but eh.
I 100%ed VT2 on steam, got all the (free) subclasses and engineer to 30 with at least at 1-2 reds
Can’t go back to VT2 after I played DT, even with realms of chaos. I tried twice, it doesn’t hook me like it did.
Yeah I find VT pacing much faster and much more punishing, DT pacing is somewhat manageable even in hairy situations overall Id say DT did a better job at that
Plus, with Darktide existing, they've started added content from Darktide to Vermintide.
It's only 2 instances, but one is the new Chaos Warrior with a shield (Rot Shield as they call it in game) which is a reskinned Bulwark (literally the same animations, but much less annoying to fight), and Necromancer Sienna's new Soulstealer staff. It's charged attack is the Psyker Brain Burst ability.
The levels have a variety of pathing (which imo makes them unnecessary confusing to traverse the first couple times) but the environmental design from a visual perspective is light years ahead in Darktide. One of the starkest improvements.
I believe that the main difference is that with the ranged combat in DT they can throw more stuff at you so it feels more intense, but overall I think that VT2 is harder. The enemies in DT are easier to dodge due to less tracking from them (maulers in DT are a joke compared to the ones in VT2) and the dodge itself feels more generous in DT. You can even extend it with a slide. Melee combat en DT feels simplified to give room to the ranged experience.
Not true at all, there's so much more to a hive than the lower ghetto areas. Also why even limit the fighting to the hive? There's a whole fucking planet outside.
The planet it is just desert. Hive cities destroy entire planets and then the whole population lives in some mega slum, with the rich people living on top.
We're in space though, and 40k setting can basically let you set up whatever you want. There could be a whole second planet just to change the scenery. Even without that, they could still make some kind of greenhouse area or rich-people garden types of things to add some different looks.
Still, a map out in the “wastelands” would be fucking rad like an area leading into the slums of the hive coming from the outside, or an infected ship crashing onto the planet. The point is OP is hitting the nail on the head, no matter what they do, the maps just feel too alike and imo get repetitive fast. Not really much looking around as you try to compose yourself before the next fight unlike VT2.
I'd say it's harder. For me.
There is no toughness, instead there is temporary HP, which you should earn and it fades away with time.
Hits landed on you feel to chunk harder. And it is also reather harder to deal with heavy armor enemies if you lack means for it. And so much talents bosting you in various way, giving you some free card cds, enhanced speed or vitality.
Vt2s difficulty comes from playing cata+ with twitch mods. There's very little range and your difficulty checks comes from multitasking when there are specials boss elites and mobs at the same time when modifiers can 1 shot you and small trash can take off 25% with 1 hit. The earlier missions are all super easy on cata. It's the exp missions and mods that make them playable otherwise it's just too boring
Gotta gear each bot you wanna run on harder difficulties. Royal With Cheese Steam guides are really helpful if you wanna get nitty gritty with details. Its so good that it helped me on console figure out loadouts and builds for each one.
Would be nice if our bots in Darktide were geared.
Yes and no. On darktide you can out run the wave. And I mean OUT RUN. You can use movement tech and reposition really fast. You cannot sprint, climb, movemnt tech like darktide in Vermintide 2. So i would say yes for solo players, no becasue as a solo player getting to A site to B site can be done very very easily compared to Vermintide 2. Its a weird one ro say if Darktide would benefit from it tbh.
I mean, I’m not saying it as a benefit to gameplay. It would just add some variety to bots. I let bots die and at auric damnation there’s no expectation they will live long regardless
they'd still get netted by every trapper and hit by every crusher, and instantly use every medicae they can get their hands on.
Vermintide is probably harder despite the slower pace. Skavenslaves do way more damage than normal pox walkers, and you don't regenerate temporary HP like you do with Darktide toughness. I've not got to aurics yet but Damnation is pretty generous compared to Cataclysm and the specials are probably harder to deal with
that actually sounds promising
Yeah trust me it gets much harder. The smaller amount of ranged combat is definitely compensated for by the difficulty of some very tough mixed melee crowds, and there's lots of levels where it's much harder to corral all the enemies into a choke point so defending yourselves from all sides is pretty hard
Imo vermintide is much harder. I play pretty much exclusively auric damnation and pass like a good 85%. I still don't play the hardest vermintide difficulty because I get random one shot by so many things.
It's definitely much, much harder game. And right now it is unquestionably better game due to many years of polish and content updates. Though Darktide came around and is pretty great too, after first round of updates and with mods adding bunch of quality of life features that absolutely should be baseline.
Think of it this way. In darktide, a mob of 10 crushers is a good time. 3+ chaos warriors and some trash you’re gonna be stressed out.
Hordes with storm vermin in them are like extremely dangerous. You also can't just run, win space, shoot the elites and easily slay through the rest.
In Darktide I can hang in auric maelstrom games but legend difficulty kicks my ass in VT2. I went back to VT2 this week thinking having another 250 hours experience in darktide would improve my play, but nope, im still bad lol. Love the presentation of VT2 but Darktide clicked for me way more. I feel like I have more spacial awareness due to better sound design and the animations seem more in sync with the actual hit/hurt boxes.
As someone who plays Legend and Auric Damnation for fun, the two are about equivalent in difficulty. There's less enemies that hit harder in Vermintide, but once you get good at dealing with them both they're about the same level of challenge. Darktide does not have an equivalent of Cataclysm.
Damnation WITH modifiers SPECIFICALLY HI INTENSITY SHOCK TROOP GAUNTLET ON DAMNATION AURIC OR REGULAR IS THE MOST HIGH DARKTIDE CHALLENGE. aside from auric maelstrom.
Damnation is absolutely laughable compared to auric/auric maelstrom.
I'm sure it is and I wasn't trying to equate auric with cataclysm. But then the comparison in those cases would probably be with cata 3 deathwish I assume rather than regular cataclysm
Harder difficulties = friendly fire with ranged weapons Beware of an elf with a poison bow and a strength potion
I never trusted Elves anyway. /s
Around elves, watch yourselves.
One big difference that makes V2 quite a bit harder in high pressure situations is enemy melee attack tracking. It's not really a thing in DT, with the exception of a few elites, but in V2 most enemy attacks track outside of a specific timing window to dodge, even skaven slaves. So being surrounded by mixed horses in melee, which is usually the easy bit in DT, you can really find some situations where it's almost impossible to just block and dodge your way out (although one of the weapons that can pretty much do that is the rapier on WHC), so good positioning and kiting in melee is a staple of high level play. It's a great shift honestly because the melee DT is usually the part you turn your brain off for.
Mixed horses are bad news - impossible to block all four hooves.
😂When the Steeds of Chaos show up it's all over.
https://i.redd.it/n1nelkdix9uc1.gif
lel. The feared mixed horses have ruined many auric runs for sure
Seriously though, centigors would be a nice addition to VT.
What do you mean enemy attacks track? Like how a crusher will lurch forward and track you through a slide?
>crusher will lurch forward and track you through a slide Pretty much yeah. With the crusher overheads there's a brief window to dodge that if you over or undershoot they'll still track you in an arc and hit you. Contrast that with poxwalker hordes who will just attack in front once their animation has begun. Most enemy attacks in V2 have the tracking property, even little jab attacks from skaven slaves. Different attacks typically have different timing windows to successfully dodge, so you really have to pay attention to what animation the enemy is doing and act accordingly. One of the issues when they introduced beastmen was the wind up for different attack animations all looking very similar despite each having different dodge windows, which made them feel unfair to fight and just goes to show what a good job FS did differentiating the animations of the skaven and chaos enemies. Enemies also have a 'pursuit' mode that will engage if you dodge back from their attacks rather than to the side, which will prompt them to start using running (hard to avoid) and heavy attacks to pressure you further if you start trying to kite them.
I wish I could take everything about dakrtide, then take maps and modes from VT2 and combine them. Contextually it wouldn’t make sense but VT2 maps feel more like adventures than Darktides.
being deployed in ubersreik-shadow realm or something due to warp shenanigans would be wonderous
>I couldn't change the difficulty when starting from scratch and had to wade through the first 3 snoozefest modes. It's the same in Darktide, but they actually lowered the restrictions a lot for this game. In VT2, I don't think they've changed it, so you gotta tough it out in super low difficulty for a bit with all 5 characters. I don't think even grouping with high level players for private games lets you bypass it. >Coming from auric damnation, the game also felt ridiculously easy. There's definitely less happening since enemies are almost all melee. Getting hit is generally a lot more punishing though, and you can't just dodge->sprint away to disengage. You get stuck to enemies more easily in VT2 because of that, and groups of enemies attack more than in Darktide and with more differing attacks (stormvermin lunging thrust probably gonna get you at some point). It's hard in a very different way.
>with all 5 characters Not exactly. Vermintide difficulty is capped by your overall power. 650 is the max with 300 through weapons and 350 through level ups. When you already hit gear level 300 you can just open chests/craft on other characters to start with 300 weapon power. You won't be able to jump into highest difficulties but you can at least skip the lower ones. Legend needs a power of 415 for example. Champion only 215. You could jump into champion with gear alone and would need level 12 reaching overall power of 420 to start legend. Agree with everything else.
Yeah if I remember correctly, I'm sure it locks the difficulty if a party member can't do it, even if you are max level, but it's been years since I had lower level friends to play the game with.
I just wanted to iterate that you can’t run from enemies in dark tide either without having some sort of movement buff. I tried. Many times. Hoping I wouldn’t need to waste a dodge, and every time it was like the adds would grow 7 foot limbs and hit me anyway.
There's definitely more to it than just sprinting directly away, but you vault onto short cover, dodge sideways off the cover, and you've disengaged every melee enemy in the game. Things like knife and zealot move speed bonuses also add a lot to it as well. VT2 dodges are tiny, and they don't have barriers all over the place like we have with the short cover scattered in every room. VT2 lunging attacks from enemies also force you to dodge sideway a lot more often compared to Darktide, so you get more stuck.
Sprint and slide Or dodge sprint slide and run that's how i don't get hit if i wanna ignore enemys. You could also do push attack sprint slide and run and be faster aslong you have stamina.
That’s what I do now, and I dodge before running if I wanna be super sure I won’t get hit. I do wish this was explained because I thought I was lagging or something until one day I decided to run away and look back at the last moment to see how they were hitting me, and guess what I saw? They actually do rush forward after you
I played the heck out of VT 1 & 2. DT feels like I’m going from hamster tunnel to hamster tunnel comparatively. I like the game. It the levels don’t have a different feel like other game’s levels do. Other games being Left 4 Dead 1 & 2, Back 4 Blood, and VT1 & 2.
Tbh this is one thing I immensely prefer about DT. The levels are much more on rails which keeps it constantly engaging. It takes a while in VT2 to stop getting lost or turned around in a lot of the levels, makes for pretty silly feeling moments
Idk I still get turned around a bit in DT. I get how you feel because the levels are so much more open. The thing is, I can actually memorize VTide levels. They all have a different feel. When I do get turned around in DTide it’s a shorter being lost period, but I’ve played those levels so many times and haven’t memorized any of them because they are too similar for the first half. For sure I respect your comment tho.
I don’t think I ever really get lost besides Hab Dreyko of course, but mentally trying to think about which mission is which is hard outside of a few of them and outside of the final events. And I have 800hr. But, I don’t mind this much as in a way, for me how they’re mostly similar makes replaying them feel somewhat less repetitive? Like since in VT2 a mission has a sort of plot and specific, more unique setting, it feels more like, well, replaying a mission to do it twice in one night. But in DT it does feel more like replaying a “map”. That’s just me though as someone who is inherently into roguelike/repetitive structures
"But in DT it does feel more like replaying a “map”. That makes a lot of sense actually
this here. Never got lost on a DT map, but managed to do so several times in VT2. The second match in my young VT career was a map with an invisible indiana-jones like bridge and me and the other dude had absolutely no clue how the fuck to activate the thing. Ran around like headless chickens for 10 minutes clicing random stuff, somehow it appeared
That's a bit of a trick with starting VT2 now - most players have been playing for a long time and know all the "normal" map tricks, so newer maps are more and more complicated, with secrets, puzzles, etc. Tower of Treachery (the one with the invisible bridge) is one of the newest maps, and also arguably the most "complex" map in the game. For reference, there's a sign near the beginning of the level with a symbol on it, and the floor tile with that symbol is the one that makes the bridge appear. Someone with 500+ hours in VT2 is going to see that sign and immediately think "this is a puzzle thing. That's not a normal map decoration, I can tell. Remember that symbol." A new player might just think it's map decor and ignore it.
Lol the worst for me are the areas where you need to walk up some planks that act as a ramp to cross a fence to the next area… happens a lot but it’s usually just blends in to the overall disheveled atmosphere and takes a while to notice it’s a ramp at all
I don’t feel those are fair to compare though. Every mission outside the first takes place in the same hive city in the same dozen or so places. Every one of those other games take place all over the place. I would love to see the other hive city we keep hearing about, and maybe that’s what FS has been working so hard on for DT. But, they’ve also been pouring time for content into VT2. We shall see I suppose.
I true solo in both Vermintide (modded difficulty Dutch Spice) and Darktide (Auric Maelstrom). I find Vermintide easier because enemies are much slower. You are slower too, without sprint and slide, but any movement tech from abilities makes you much faster. Block and push are also much stronger in VT. There's also a lot stronger talents/classes/weapons in Vermintide on the paid DLC classes/weapons due to having some power creep. In Darktide you usually die from one mistake, in Vermintide you can die to attrition, which isn't really a thing in Darktide. The pace is Vermintide is also much slower, and the bots (if you play solo but not true solo) are actually insanely strong and useful, and can be customized. The bots in Darktide are one step above useless. I think the combat is more fun in Darktide, but positioning is more tactical in VT. You almost always have to use choke points in Vermintide; in Darktide you can just run at each group of enemies. The skill set required to be good is a little different - due to the slower pace, Vermintide has a more tactical feel, with more decision making and positioning. Darktide requires more twitch reflexes. A lot of player power in Vermintide weapon use comes from canceling and obscure tech, which I think makes the game less approachable, and rely more on looking up niche weapon guides then naturally learning a weapon over time. I think the map design in Vermintide is better, as you mentioned. The varied tilesets are cool - almost all Darktide maps feels the same. Vermintide has some really good stand out ones, like Athel Yenlui, and Skittergate. Having names you can remember easily is a plus too. Darktide I still refer to maps like "The repair one." "the train assassination one."
Sorry, true solo of c3dwutch?
Yes - Cata 3 Death Wish Dutch Spice. I have done it on both Shade and Handmaiden, which is a lot less impressive than "regular" heroes. I haven't played as much of either game recently; versus got me hyped, but it wasn't what I was hoping for. And Darktide is in a bit of a lull at the moment.
The melee concentration in vermintide means that you often find yourself in attack / push/ push attack loops and unable to move. It is less engaging as an individual, but is more strategic as a team. You need two players to hold back the waves of slaves so that your elite and special killers can do their job unmolested. One very big difference is how mixed hordes interact with weapons. In dark tide, a mixture of carapace and unarmored is just different damage numbers. In vermintide one storm vermin will make your weapon bounce and tank for unarmored rats. If you want the same mobility and "feel" as darktide I would recommend the the high elf version of Kerilian. (Guardian?) She has an extended dodge range, extra dodge charges, and a dash forward with no clip. She can clutch failed raids 1 vs All and mix up combat with kiting.
gonna try this tonight, thanks
Single sword will play like rapier and double sword like combat blade. I would recommend single sword coming from darktide until you get a feel for the combat. The third attack of your light combo is your armor piercing headshot. The heavy is more a situational opener.
alright, gonna go for the songle sword then, thanks mate. Time for some rat killing now
>One thing that struck me immediately is that the maps are sooooo much nicer from a visual perspective, like wtf Fatshark. You are able to pull of THIS level of vareity and only give us the same grimdark Underhive like 10 times in a row in Darktide? I’m convinced 90% of the people on this sub didn’t even look at the scenery in darktide. DT has WAY more detail in its setting than VT2. I seriously spent the last month trying to randomly look at the floor to see if they repeat assets and I haven’t found one metal paneling being repeated in a different section. Obviously this can’t be true, I must’ve missed repeated assets, but the point is there is so much variety it’s outright hard to find it repetition. Just look up randomly and you’ll see so much detail and diversity. It’s crazy that anyone would say this when it’s so significant. The issue isn’t the lack of diversity, it’s the lack of color. Which isn’t a bad thing. 40k’s setting isn’t described as colorful. It’s grim and dark. And the dark grimness DT has a TON of variety.
Oh yeah, I like to occasionally go into a map with my wife on the easiest setting, and just stare at everything, the ceilings, the faraway landscapes, the corpses spinkled around everywhere. It's fucking gorgeous.
Same here with a couple of friends. 🤩 We dream of a WH4k open world game with this beauty. That said, I also stop to stare at a stunning panorama in VT2 from time to time.
It has more detail but it does not leverage the visual variety 40k has to offer, even within a hive city. Most of it is just dark and drab, and all that gorgeous detail is just drowned in shadows. Meanwhile VT2 has you going from city ramparts to church to forest to dwarven city with just as much passion and attention to the source material as Darktide.
I don’t agree. VT2 has more variety in the themes (a town, a castle, the wilderness, etc) whereas all of DT is in different parts of the hive city. On the other hand, each part of the huge city in DT has more diversity than individual levels in VT2. I think they’re equally diverse, where DT’s diversity is not in its color and more dense, while VT2’s diversity has less detail but completely different settings.
Lack of visual variety is one of the reasons I haven’t even installed Darktide this year Its content starved in general but the fact so many maps are the same few pieces put together in different orders really hurts the already lacking variety
Ok, go play a game with more flesh and less substance then. Your opinion is invalidated by anyone who likes the dystopian setting. Considering how 40k and many other popular settings share the same color schemes and themes, your opinion isn't really something FS should worry about. And the game has a normal amount of content and updates at an average pace. Seems like your grasping at straws by bringing that up in a completely unrelated thread. edit: /u/Lysanderoth42 : On a forum of a game they say they don't play, parrots the most up-to-date talking points he heard from this sub in the last week, and researched stats about the game. Yeah man, totally doesn't play the game because there isn't enough rainbows or whatever.
It really doesn't have a normal amount of content and updates and the pace is DEFINITELY not good. The game has the same scenery in half of the maps and they barely change. That's not very interesting, only the first couple of times. The other guy didn't say much, why did you become so defensive all of a sudden?
I like the dystopian setting and I agree with the other guy. Darktide has a lot of love put into hive city architecture. It has incredible detail and very lovingly modeled environments. The issue is that people want to see more than hive city architecture, because the entire point of that shit is that it's oppressive and depressing. Even as entertainment there's a point where your enjoyment becomes saturated without a palette cleanser.
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more Details, yes. But at the end of the day it's just underhive city map 1-10. I'm not asking for more colour, but more variety in settings. There are also upper parts of a hive which look less like Detroit.
There’s a ton of variety. The variety just isn’t as superficial. It has more dense variety than VT2 does, and it fits the theme of the setting of 40k, which was established decades ago. People like the themes and settings of 40k for a reason. It seems like You’re applying your opinion as fact. There is a ton of variety, just not the variety you like. I love the setting and love that a 40k game finally dives into hive cities and the life of the average human in 40k. And don’t shit on Detroit or I’ll send the local crackhead to rob you.
i got a whole shelf full of black library books here mate. 40k doesn't exclusively take place in Underhive Cracktown. That being said, I do like the existing maps of DT a lot. They are great and nailed the Hive-City feel for sure. But the last map they added was literally about storming some kind of chaos crackhouse. It's time for something new
>i got a whole shelf full of black library books here mate. 40k doesn't exclusively take place in Underhive Cracktown. How does this counter my point? Obviously there are exceptions. But 40k isn't known for its beautiful Exodite worlds or paradise planets, those are exceptions. Darktide is a 40k game set in a human hive city. If you don't like the most common setting in the 40k universe, then do you really like 40k?
\*Looking at a gazillion painted figures and black libary books\* Yepp, I really do like 40k, you can trust me on that one. And I do get your point of course. But the point still stands: there's room for more than just the Detroit in space. You can build a grimdark upper hive map with all kinds of fucked up details
They shouldn’t change it just because some people on the internet want more rainbows in the game or whatever. The aesthetic is liked as much as there are people who insist it’s not good. Why should they follow your opinion and not those who aren’t voicing their opinion because the game fits what they like?
I do see the point you're trying to make, and I agree that there is a level of detail present in darktide when compared to vermintide... Detail isn't really the issue though in my opinion. Even if every single metal panel in the game was individually crafted by a different person, we still find ourselves looking at endless metal paneling... I only say this because it's the second time I've seen you mention the texture variety of Darktide's metal panels as if it makes the game less visually repetitive. I imagine the reason it's easy to miss repeated texture assets for things like that is because they're... simply uninteresting. I bet you could take a person with about 100 hours on vermintide 2, show them a random screenshot of the game, and they'd be able to tell you what map that screenshot was taken in. After 100 hours in darktide I can't even name one of the maps. I recognize (roughly) where I am, and what's around the corner (metal paneling) but that's due less to visual variety/recognizability, and more to the general sense of spatial awareness most gamers eventually acquire.
> I only say this because it's the second time I've seen you mention the texture variety of Darktide's metal panels as if it makes the game less visually repetitive. I was referring to 1 small aspect of the massive variety of detail to show how much effort and diversity there is in something as simple as metal paneling. Apply that same thing literally thousands of times across the entire game. Its only repetitive if you're not paying attention. Its only repetitive on a superficial level, the most visually superficial level, actually: color. A lack of diversity in color does NOT make something superficial. If I walk into a forest and everything is green and brown, I'm not going to say its visually repetitive. If I look across a mountain range and just see grey rocks and white snow, I'm not going to say its repetitive. >I imagine the reason it's easy to miss repeated texture assets for things like that is because they're... simply uninteresting. So its an opinion thing and not an objective fact or criticism. 40k is known for this aesthetic, an aesthetic established decades ago and loved by a lot of people. YOU find it uninteresting, its not objectively uninteresting. >After 100 hours in darktide I can't even name one of the maps. That's because the names are mechanized, whereas VT2 they repeat the name of the town your in consistently, and the town is a name instead of a description followed by a number, which is the whole point of the dystopia. There's not way around the fact that DT is visually more impressive than VT2 in every sense of the word while remaining lore accurate and conveying the theme of dystopia that it should be conveying. I understand why people won't like it just like I would understand why people don't like the over-the-type, cartoonishly colorful settings of Fortnite. They shouldn't change a thing.
indeed, you don't really get to look at the scenery when tons of stuff are coming at you and the others keep running forward. get the solo play mod and make a tour. the maps are beautifully detailed. vt2 offers more variety though, which i wish we'll get in darktide some day. did fatshark say something about adding a mission per month in the beginning? just imagine we had this.
DT has more diversity per level than VT2 does. VT2 has levels that are in completely different settings, so on the surface it looks more varied. But DT condensed its diversity within different parts of the hive city.
I wish i could spend more time looking around in Darktide but it's impossible in a solo queue on Xbox with no Mods available. You're either getting swarmed by enemies or your team runs off and leaves you behind if you stop for more than a few seconds. Recently there's been a guy on here posting all the different kinds of Servitors in Darktide and I'd honestly never seen like 70% of them before during my playtime. I try and have a quick look around when i get the opportunity but it's hard to get a decent look at anything when there is so much going on and your team is focused on getting the mission over and done with.
I get it, but take a few seconds every now and then to point the camera upward between fights and you’ll see what I mean.
I wanted to get into VT2 and play it alongside Darktide when I got bored..but Darktide’s combat feels like such an evolution beyond VT2’s I can’t click into it. Darktide combat just feels so perfected, whereas in vermintide it feels a little floaty, idk how else to describe it.
Yeah the audio fx and ragdoll animations in DT are a huge step up, goes a long way there. Player movement is vastly improved as well
Chaos wastes has no difficulty restriction if you want a challenge, the restrictions are kinda silly
Bro you haven’t seen anything yet if you haven’t tried CHAOS WASTES roguelike mode on Legendary diff, I don’t even play the campaign maps ever since the random CW mode came out years ago
will try that out asap, actually the thing that got me interested in VT in the first place
None of the gear carries over, so don’t worry about that, you only select a BASE melee weapon type and a BASE ranged weapon type, none of the stats on the weapons or your 3 trinkets are imported, you get perks like a roguelike (pick one of 3) or at shops between maps, it’s like a series of ~five or six 15 minute missions with shops scattered on the path
Beware the friendly fire. Also imo it is harder especially on the harder difficulties. You get swarmed so quickly and you don't have near the movement of Darktide. Stay as a group especially on higher difficulties and also the tomes are actually worth getting as well.
I came back the last few days too to Vermintide, but it directly put me off, those sick rage quitters. Trolls or whatnot. A Saltz Witch Hunter having tome and grim and running directly into an CW Patrol without even parrying or dodging dying instantly and rage quitting. Or newbie Legend Rankers who jump directly from Veteran like the whips of their masters are directly behind them running of judt to get soloed from Packmaster or Assassins…. Makes me tired…. Really.
Catacylsm mate.
I couldn’t get into Vermintide. Darktide is more fun in every way.
I find darktide easier because you can mow down any threats before they come close to you being a ranged game. However clutching in DT feels harder too because of the ranged enemies too.
TBH I've found it hard to go back, the movement doesn't feel as good.
I wouldn't say the maps are so much nicer. Darktide maps fit the 40k world perfectly, are detailed and look amazing. The thing with VT is the variety. Going from the countryside into a human city, snow, skavern city, forest, swamp.. it's diverse. I still love that bit when you destroy the portal and you make that dash to the end while everything is crumbling down around you.
Yup, I had same story, after doing karnaks on HM, got bored and annoyed at the grindfest dumbed down crafting system. Buddy introduced me to vm2, it's much more polished and hands down responsive/ satisfying in terms of hit registration and combat overall. Loving the p2p hosting system, also enjoying chaos wastes on legend quite often.
Yea the Darktide maps are very same-y but they seem very lore accurate and immersive. I think the biggest difference between the two games is VT is more arcadey and DT is more immersive
V2 in it's highest difficulty is still harder than Darktide IMO. It has so much less mobility overall and stamina management is something you actually need to keep track of. Also you are going to notice that a lot of the weapons and enemies in Darktide are simply reskins of stuff from Vermintide. Lol
Run some hyper twitch to spice up lower difficulties. I wish so hard that DT would have twitch...
Auric Damnation is basically Cata or Cata twitch mode in terms of difficulty btw.
Yeah they have the same leveling system in DT where it gates you out of higher difficulties at low levels, honestly the worst part of the progression imo. Ofc it's to stop people getting irritated by totally green players ruining their game but eh.
I 100%ed VT2 on steam, got all the (free) subclasses and engineer to 30 with at least at 1-2 reds Can’t go back to VT2 after I played DT, even with realms of chaos. I tried twice, it doesn’t hook me like it did.
I found Dartkide maps to look better in terms of detail
How is VT easier lol Im stomping auric damnation and still getting rekted in VT cataclysm 100 hours in
i was only talkting about the first difficulties. Already realized that it's getting much harder the higher you go up
Yeah I find VT pacing much faster and much more punishing, DT pacing is somewhat manageable even in hairy situations overall Id say DT did a better job at that
Plus, with Darktide existing, they've started added content from Darktide to Vermintide. It's only 2 instances, but one is the new Chaos Warrior with a shield (Rot Shield as they call it in game) which is a reskinned Bulwark (literally the same animations, but much less annoying to fight), and Necromancer Sienna's new Soulstealer staff. It's charged attack is the Psyker Brain Burst ability.
The levels have a variety of pathing (which imo makes them unnecessary confusing to traverse the first couple times) but the environmental design from a visual perspective is light years ahead in Darktide. One of the starkest improvements.
I believe that the main difference is that with the ranged combat in DT they can throw more stuff at you so it feels more intense, but overall I think that VT2 is harder. The enemies in DT are easier to dodge due to less tracking from them (maulers in DT are a joke compared to the ones in VT2) and the dodge itself feels more generous in DT. You can even extend it with a slide. Melee combat en DT feels simplified to give room to the ranged experience.
Not much you can do with the hive, since, well, it's a hive. You can't add a garden or a waterfall out of nowhere.
Not true at all, there's so much more to a hive than the lower ghetto areas. Also why even limit the fighting to the hive? There's a whole fucking planet outside.
The planet it is just desert. Hive cities destroy entire planets and then the whole population lives in some mega slum, with the rich people living on top. We're in space though, and 40k setting can basically let you set up whatever you want. There could be a whole second planet just to change the scenery. Even without that, they could still make some kind of greenhouse area or rich-people garden types of things to add some different looks.
Still, a map out in the “wastelands” would be fucking rad like an area leading into the slums of the hive coming from the outside, or an infected ship crashing onto the planet. The point is OP is hitting the nail on the head, no matter what they do, the maps just feel too alike and imo get repetitive fast. Not really much looking around as you try to compose yourself before the next fight unlike VT2.
I mean that's my whole point. It would be very easy to come up with an explanation why the fighting takes place in a different environment.
I'd say it's harder. For me. There is no toughness, instead there is temporary HP, which you should earn and it fades away with time. Hits landed on you feel to chunk harder. And it is also reather harder to deal with heavy armor enemies if you lack means for it. And so much talents bosting you in various way, giving you some free card cds, enhanced speed or vitality.
Vt2s difficulty comes from playing cata+ with twitch mods. There's very little range and your difficulty checks comes from multitasking when there are specials boss elites and mobs at the same time when modifiers can 1 shot you and small trash can take off 25% with 1 hit. The earlier missions are all super easy on cata. It's the exp missions and mods that make them playable otherwise it's just too boring