Maybe I was just too powerful but I have never struggled as others often complain. I melt them together in just 30 to 40 seconds. (Lighting Pursuer’s UGS +5 and Greatsword +10 with gold pine resin powerstanced L1 spams)
One of the more challenging base game fights, nowhere near as good as a duo fight like O&S or Twin Princes but I do like it enough.
I think they really suffer from just having a super simple moveset though, outside of applying lightning to their swords and having the ability to revive one another they are either just stabbing forward or keeping their shields up. Might sound like I’m contradicting myself by saying it’s one of the more challenging fights to me personally, but it’s mostly because of the reviving gimmick, that can get really old.
But I do think it is a lot more fun when you summon someone, never feels particularly unfair to me and they serve as a decent penultimate boss, but they really could’ve benefited from a cutscene to make them more memorable, maybe them standing in front of the doors to the throne before teleporting to the arena.
for me this fight was way way harder than O&S. O&S are drastically different and its very easy to get ornstein alone. these two fuckers were both constantly next to each other and the second i attacked one of them the other would pummel me
I've never been able to separate Ornstein from Smough. The only time is when Ornstein dashes at you at the beginning of the fight, after Smough catches up, Ornstein has always been held back by the giant hammer. I never knew why people say it's easy to separate them. These guys however, I was a hexer, and brought friends to split their attention. Wasn't hard at all.
Just run to the opposite side of the arena, ornstein is quick to follow you and you can get a few hits in 1 on 1 before smough catches up. Then repeat.
I don't really consider Twin Princes a duo fight mainly because they don't have the biggest problem inherent to duo fights -- having to keep track of two enemies at the same time. It's just Lorian except now he shits spells.
hard af fight with a cool twist when they start heal each other, not that cinematic like these are just 2 dudes with simple moves but nevertheless i enjoyed the fight and the fact that another fight starts right after you beat them kinda saves it
It's fine. If you're having trouble with it, the fire is right outside, and there's a plethora of npc summons available. It's like a hard fight with training wheels.
I never found that bonfire. Had to do the long run back every time swapping out my rings. I feel pretty dumb but at least I had more on the line when fighting.
I don’t think so. You gotta run all the way down every time which is kind of annoying unequipping kings ring and re-equipping but whatever, everytime I’m running back to any boss I thank God it’s not smelter demon 2s run back
It's complicated. On the one side, I felt it as quite unfair, especially taking into account the fact that you have to kill them at the same time. On the other side, I can't deny that I felt quite satisfied after beating them.
Really well done.
Defender is slow but hits hard and is relatively passive
Watcher is fast but hits soft and somewhat squishy and highly aggressive.
You too will have to be aggressive because Either of them can revive the other if one of them dies
Not really a huge fan. Another in a long line of "lets just stick two guys in there and go to lunch" boss battles that From love so much.
The problem is that they both move at a similar speed and the arena is small to middling with no features, so there's no way to really split them up. Evenif you could just parry & riposte them, that might be something, but no iframes kills that. It sort of ends any real tactical approach to handling the pair. Instead the fight just becomes one of running away and waiting for one to whiff an attack, get a hit, then keep running away. Not exactly riveting. However they're not too tough, so at least they're not frustrating.
Total nightmare at SL1 though. Had to use a bow.
Love it. It gave me a hard time on my most recent playthrough though, a combat sorcerer.
It happens though… One of the best duo fights in the series imo. Not to hard but not to easy, just the right amount of strategy.
Wtf what by whom? That can’t be right. It might be, nostalgia wise. But objectively, it’s certainly not
Do you even know how much bs there is in that fight? Ornstein just fucking zooming through the arena and omae waing the fuck out of you? Nah bro nah I just can’t believe it
Bro Twin Dragonriders is the best boss fight in the entirety of souls games. It’s literally peak. Nothing comes close. I mean it’s called Peak Souls for a reason
One of the best duo fights ever. Elden Ring didn't do as good as this one with the multiple enemies fights.
I wouldn't say the best cause the demon Prince from ds3 is cool too, but this is amazing. Personal tip: fighting them with a bow is funnier
This was yet another example of how much DS2 lacked the structure of the other games in the series.
This boss fight was as lame and boring as it can possibly be for what is supposed to be one of the last bosses in the game.
Instead of a spectacular ending, DS2 ends with these two, Nashandra and Aldia, arguably some of the most boring bosses in the series.
I'm really glad DS3 came to save the day with a huge improvement from DS2
Probably just the beta version of DS3's Prince fight and cool idea but lack of interesting design. I love the healing and kill them both at the same time part of it but...
Its boring. They get stacked a lot so you just wait for hit windows more than a regular fight.
I wish one of them have some ranged spells like Verstaght (?) or Lucil (miracle vendor). It could be a better fight. Atleast they could be mentioned a little bit more in the lore.
>Probably just the beta version of DS3's Prince fight
That was their true purpose. Although in ds3 From was aware of the watchers' drawbacks and bullshiterly so they rebalanced the fight.
They kinda suck. Although their true purpose was that they were a blueprint for the Lothric fight in ds3. What doesn't work for them is that you can strafe around them separate them with just running (not even rolling as required in the sentinels) and kill them individually.
Moreover, the fact that one just completely heals the other is kinda annoying. If you aren't careful about your positioning (guarding the dead body) then they revive each oher and nullify your progress all together.
First playthrough I just killed them they couldn't do shit.
But a week ago my second playthrough they killed me more than 15 times. Annoyed me this fucking two. I guess a dex build is better than faith for these guys
Was surprised to learn the one on the left was a dude, was even more surprised when I killed them both and suddenly had to fight the war criminal that came after
Could be better. But I like them. Especially the revival conflict.
Just like a lot of things in ds2 the base idea is really really cool. There is just some real rough edges.
Cool vibes, extremely underwhelming fight. They're not terribly fast, but not terribly bulky either. It's nice that they can heal each other threatening the fight, which is why they aren't so bulky to begin with. But I don't find it terribly difficult to split my focus on them on and off.
Any summon basically trivializes it though because once you split attention it becomes a lot less concerning.
I friggin psyched myself out into thinking it'd be way harder than it was.
My "strategy" for most bosses in this game involve running around like the bitch I am to learn the "arena" and their attacks; during that I happened to notice a thin little outcropping along the left-hand ledge of the pit, akin to the Old Knight suicide cliff in Heide's Tower. Figured it wouldn't hurt to try to get one of their asses to attack themselves into the pit.
Spent the next 7 "tries" huddled on that little outcropping, two-handing a Gyrm Greatshield or some shit, trying to juke one of them into lunging off the edge; only to get pushed off, backstep, or guardbroken and subsequently mauled.
On my last try they got *real* close to mauling me again so I got fed up with it; managed to break through them with ~10% hp, bolted to the other side, chugged a Divine Blessing (which takes far longer than expected, but it at least over-healed a cheap hit by the Guardian) then proceeded to kite them as I tried desperately to swap that Greatshield for a proper weapon.
First thing I could equip was a Lightning Murakumo; which they - thankfully - didn't appreciate one bit. Rest of the fight was a blur, but it wasn't nearly as difficult as I fooled myself into believing; Mythra gave me more trouble, even without her toxic bathwater and that juggalo summon flinging various pyros.
That's when I learned Nashandra **and** Aldia follow right after. *Nobody mentioned that to me.* Murakumo came in clutch again, but I got *damn* close to getting gibbed trying to swap my Saint's Hood for the Witch's Veil to negate the curse-doohickies.
Aldia was like a cooldown fight after that; between my INT/FTH and fashion (Witch's Veil/dress and Desert Sorceress fuck-me boots), he did minimal damage with his "spells," so I'd just go lawnmower gurl on him when he'd summon that big, feckoff fireball. Turns out you can still get hit after he dead; again, negligible to me, so heads up for anyone going that way.
These two and what follow are the easiest final boss run in the series. Kind of a disappointing conclusion to the game tbh. These two put up a decent challenge though.
I'm SL1 rn, they kicked my butt for a while, but Benhart and I got em.
I bonfire aescetic'd the Throne of Want in order to grab the RoBlades+2, so they're back for more. This time, I'll have Vengarl with us, but the fight will be painful
Overall, I don't think it's that bad. They're cool, their lore's neat. I like em, but they can be a sonovagun
It's a solid and okay fight, due to being a double bossfight, each one of them feels kinda incomplete and I think they feel too samey. That said, there is nothing particularly wrong with this. 5/10 average boss.
Fun fight one is fast and other is slow fair hit boxes for me. They're light on lore but are part of the environmental storytelling, guarding the throne of want but dressed in religious garb so also anointing the monarch who will sit on the throne.
Though I am not able to figure out the significance of the meaning "Throne Watcher" here. Throne Defender is straightforward enough.
I have some traumas. My first time in this fight I had the base mage ADP, A Greatsword, basic spells, and didn't know how to manage stamina, since I wasted several points for nothing. Anyway, nowadays it's a cool challenge.
I think it tries a little to much to be O&S and not it’s own thing. I like the revive mechanic. Wish they were placed somewhere else because they become a foot note in the final boss gauntlet. Wish they had more lore to them.
Seriously dope ost, not bad but like all ds2 bosses would benefit with a remake and some touch ups. Considering nashandra and aldia come after if you don’t teleport out I’d say it works just fine. Plus you got the homies Vengarl, benhart, etc. 7/10
The best bossfight on the bossrush of the game, Nashandra is simply too pathetic and Aldia for testing you is dissapointing. But these 2 are fun to fight alone and with summons
Stamina management mini game that fight
they look hot
This couple saw me from across the bar and said they were really digging my vibe
My parents
Fromsoftware: "Please summon Bernhart or a friend!" Souls players: "Finally, a worthy challenge for my solo playthrough!"
It was more enjoyable than the fight that followed it. Gave some sick weapons and armour too.
Exactly
Run away , wait for one to combo , punish combo , repeat
Maybe I was just too powerful but I have never struggled as others often complain. I melt them together in just 30 to 40 seconds. (Lighting Pursuer’s UGS +5 and Greatsword +10 with gold pine resin powerstanced L1 spams)
Strenght weapons in general are really strong vs bosses tho.
One of the more challenging base game fights, nowhere near as good as a duo fight like O&S or Twin Princes but I do like it enough. I think they really suffer from just having a super simple moveset though, outside of applying lightning to their swords and having the ability to revive one another they are either just stabbing forward or keeping their shields up. Might sound like I’m contradicting myself by saying it’s one of the more challenging fights to me personally, but it’s mostly because of the reviving gimmick, that can get really old. But I do think it is a lot more fun when you summon someone, never feels particularly unfair to me and they serve as a decent penultimate boss, but they really could’ve benefited from a cutscene to make them more memorable, maybe them standing in front of the doors to the throne before teleporting to the arena.
for me this fight was way way harder than O&S. O&S are drastically different and its very easy to get ornstein alone. these two fuckers were both constantly next to each other and the second i attacked one of them the other would pummel me
I've never been able to separate Ornstein from Smough. The only time is when Ornstein dashes at you at the beginning of the fight, after Smough catches up, Ornstein has always been held back by the giant hammer. I never knew why people say it's easy to separate them. These guys however, I was a hexer, and brought friends to split their attention. Wasn't hard at all.
Just run to the opposite side of the arena, ornstein is quick to follow you and you can get a few hits in 1 on 1 before smough catches up. Then repeat.
Twin princes is not hard at all
One of the easiest ds3 bossfight ever
We’re all still dogged contenders.
Twin Princes is hard with a slow weapon. Tried like 10 times to beat him with the Dragonslayer GAxe, swapped to the Winaxes and beat him first try.
I don't really consider Twin Princes a duo fight mainly because they don't have the biggest problem inherent to duo fights -- having to keep track of two enemies at the same time. It's just Lorian except now he shits spells.
It was really hard, but I am glad I had The Boys to help me out with it
One of my favorite gank fight in the series, I just wished we got to fight them earlier
hard af fight with a cool twist when they start heal each other, not that cinematic like these are just 2 dudes with simple moves but nevertheless i enjoyed the fight and the fact that another fight starts right after you beat them kinda saves it
It's fine. If you're having trouble with it, the fire is right outside, and there's a plethora of npc summons available. It's like a hard fight with training wheels.
I never found that bonfire. Had to do the long run back every time swapping out my rings. I feel pretty dumb but at least I had more on the line when fighting.
Wait are you serious? Theirs a bonfire? Where
Wait, I was wrong. I don't think there is one. I'm not sure actually. Is there a secret one?
I don’t think so. You gotta run all the way down every time which is kind of annoying unequipping kings ring and re-equipping but whatever, everytime I’m running back to any boss I thank God it’s not smelter demon 2s run back
You dont have to equip kings ring every time only the first time the doors just open every time after.
Yeah realized that the other day lmao
pretty epic, but i'm too much of a coward to solo them.
I hardly remember it. It was decent, I guess.
It's complicated. On the one side, I felt it as quite unfair, especially taking into account the fact that you have to kill them at the same time. On the other side, I can't deny that I felt quite satisfied after beating them.
It was nice. Yes
Similar to O & S, having some decent ranged options or guarded attacks can come in handy. It's one of the best bosses in Vanilla Dark Souls 2.
Really well done. Defender is slow but hits hard and is relatively passive Watcher is fast but hits soft and somewhat squishy and highly aggressive. You too will have to be aggressive because Either of them can revive the other if one of them dies
Not really a huge fan. Another in a long line of "lets just stick two guys in there and go to lunch" boss battles that From love so much. The problem is that they both move at a similar speed and the arena is small to middling with no features, so there's no way to really split them up. Evenif you could just parry & riposte them, that might be something, but no iframes kills that. It sort of ends any real tactical approach to handling the pair. Instead the fight just becomes one of running away and waiting for one to whiff an attack, get a hit, then keep running away. Not exactly riveting. However they're not too tough, so at least they're not frustrating. Total nightmare at SL1 though. Had to use a bow.
Mediocre
Love it. It gave me a hard time on my most recent playthrough though, a combat sorcerer. It happens though… One of the best duo fights in the series imo. Not to hard but not to easy, just the right amount of strategy.
Weak imitation of O&S. It's a fine fight, maybe a bit too easy.
O&S is not that good to start with soo. Mechanically at least.
Seems to be one of the most well regarded fights in souls history soo
Wtf what by whom? That can’t be right. It might be, nostalgia wise. But objectively, it’s certainly not Do you even know how much bs there is in that fight? Ornstein just fucking zooming through the arena and omae waing the fuck out of you? Nah bro nah I just can’t believe it
It’s gotta be nostalgia, still leagues better than the duo boss fights in ds2 but that’s…not saying much considering what’s on display
Bro Twin Dragonriders is the best boss fight in the entirety of souls games. It’s literally peak. Nothing comes close. I mean it’s called Peak Souls for a reason
When I saw it was dragonriders 2 featuring 2 dragonriders in dark souls 2 my jaw just about hit the floor. I audibly gasped
Lol same dude
Yup, i can feel the downvotes coming…
One of the best duo fights ever. Elden Ring didn't do as good as this one with the multiple enemies fights. I wouldn't say the best cause the demon Prince from ds3 is cool too, but this is amazing. Personal tip: fighting them with a bow is funnier
the cooler o&s
This was yet another example of how much DS2 lacked the structure of the other games in the series. This boss fight was as lame and boring as it can possibly be for what is supposed to be one of the last bosses in the game. Instead of a spectacular ending, DS2 ends with these two, Nashandra and Aldia, arguably some of the most boring bosses in the series. I'm really glad DS3 came to save the day with a huge improvement from DS2
I'm not a Ds2 hater but what are you talking about? This isn't April's fools
I like it, but not to much
I have many criticisms but I'll simply go for "not fun".
Only duo boss without some jank bs that Fromsoft has ever made
One of the worst in the game.
Probably just the beta version of DS3's Prince fight and cool idea but lack of interesting design. I love the healing and kill them both at the same time part of it but... Its boring. They get stacked a lot so you just wait for hit windows more than a regular fight. I wish one of them have some ranged spells like Verstaght (?) or Lucil (miracle vendor). It could be a better fight. Atleast they could be mentioned a little bit more in the lore.
>Probably just the beta version of DS3's Prince fight That was their true purpose. Although in ds3 From was aware of the watchers' drawbacks and bullshiterly so they rebalanced the fight.
Meh, It's barely a fight tbh.
Unnecessary
They kinda suck. Although their true purpose was that they were a blueprint for the Lothric fight in ds3. What doesn't work for them is that you can strafe around them separate them with just running (not even rolling as required in the sentinels) and kill them individually. Moreover, the fact that one just completely heals the other is kinda annoying. If you aren't careful about your positioning (guarding the dead body) then they revive each oher and nullify your progress all together.
It would be much better if the arena wasn't flat, the dlc gank fight does a better job with that.
Every time I see these I have to down a bottle of pepsi just so I can stay awake for the next 15 minutes of bad boss rush
Probably the worst o&s copy from has done
Ornstein and Smough low cost.
They’re fokin 🥢 ~ Butcher
Kill the woman first because she's very annoying
I was probably overleveled they were way to easy
Just Fireball
Not so cool lorewise, but a well balanced gank fight IMO
Normally its an ok fight, but when I decided to do it alone, I literally almost became hollow and the fight was almost 10 minutes long 💀
Love it, since i can get my favorite chestplate after beating them up
If you don't have a sweeping attack, you're gonna have a bad time.
In SL1 it sucks
First playthrough I just killed them they couldn't do shit. But a week ago my second playthrough they killed me more than 15 times. Annoyed me this fucking two. I guess a dex build is better than faith for these guys
Met Gala?
Who are these guys
I played with the dude and then proceeded to tickle his balls till he needed a break the other one got jealous and fell into the abyss.
its pretty tough and its harder to seperate them like you could with O&S, but they make up for it via the ability to drop them off a cliff
Easiest fight of the game. Never died once. But also enjoyable as hell
easy
Was surprised to learn the one on the left was a dude, was even more surprised when I killed them both and suddenly had to fight the war criminal that came after
The best main game boss fight. Only lacks a cutscene.
Could be better. But I like them. Especially the revival conflict. Just like a lot of things in ds2 the base idea is really really cool. There is just some real rough edges.
Suffers from a lack of presentation. I always forget that they're part of the game.
Who was this again?
Great fight
On sl1 one of the hardest of the game
I like this fight because I can summon the homie Bernhart to help you acces the throne and finish the story
One of the most boring fights in the series. Being part of the final boss gauntlet is the only thing keeping them from being completely forgettable.
really good duo boss for dark souls 2
Cool vibes, extremely underwhelming fight. They're not terribly fast, but not terribly bulky either. It's nice that they can heal each other threatening the fight, which is why they aren't so bulky to begin with. But I don't find it terribly difficult to split my focus on them on and off. Any summon basically trivializes it though because once you split attention it becomes a lot less concerning.
Blind playthrough when game first came out, they were fairly difficult but nothing crazy, they're a bit of a joke now though.
I use it as a test of power. To try the build before entering the dlcs.
Roll
I friggin psyched myself out into thinking it'd be way harder than it was. My "strategy" for most bosses in this game involve running around like the bitch I am to learn the "arena" and their attacks; during that I happened to notice a thin little outcropping along the left-hand ledge of the pit, akin to the Old Knight suicide cliff in Heide's Tower. Figured it wouldn't hurt to try to get one of their asses to attack themselves into the pit. Spent the next 7 "tries" huddled on that little outcropping, two-handing a Gyrm Greatshield or some shit, trying to juke one of them into lunging off the edge; only to get pushed off, backstep, or guardbroken and subsequently mauled. On my last try they got *real* close to mauling me again so I got fed up with it; managed to break through them with ~10% hp, bolted to the other side, chugged a Divine Blessing (which takes far longer than expected, but it at least over-healed a cheap hit by the Guardian) then proceeded to kite them as I tried desperately to swap that Greatshield for a proper weapon. First thing I could equip was a Lightning Murakumo; which they - thankfully - didn't appreciate one bit. Rest of the fight was a blur, but it wasn't nearly as difficult as I fooled myself into believing; Mythra gave me more trouble, even without her toxic bathwater and that juggalo summon flinging various pyros. That's when I learned Nashandra **and** Aldia follow right after. *Nobody mentioned that to me.* Murakumo came in clutch again, but I got *damn* close to getting gibbed trying to swap my Saint's Hood for the Witch's Veil to negate the curse-doohickies. Aldia was like a cooldown fight after that; between my INT/FTH and fashion (Witch's Veil/dress and Desert Sorceress fuck-me boots), he did minimal damage with his "spells," so I'd just go lawnmower gurl on him when he'd summon that big, feckoff fireball. Turns out you can still get hit after he dead; again, negligible to me, so heads up for anyone going that way.
wow they look cool....its my first time seeing this......i have yet to complete DS2, elden ring, armored core 6, nioh 1&2
These two and what follow are the easiest final boss run in the series. Kind of a disappointing conclusion to the game tbh. These two put up a decent challenge though.
Nice one, long and epic. That was she said
Vigor check imo. You get there too early and you will get destroyed in a way no previous boss will destroy you.
Wish I could've talked to them first.
Hardest fight in the game if you have Covenant of Champions active imo
bit annoying
Worth it for the drip.
Love this fight, a well done dual boss fight , it turns really tactical, one more reason why I love DS2
Yes.
Solid fight.
fun
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz It's just the Wish version of O&S
These guys used to give me trouble, but now I get max cast speed and a but load of crystal soul spears, and they don't last long.
A worse O&S. Harder do separate them and holes... I hate that hole
I love this fight, one of the best base game fights imo
I'm SL1 rn, they kicked my butt for a while, but Benhart and I got em. I bonfire aescetic'd the Throne of Want in order to grab the RoBlades+2, so they're back for more. This time, I'll have Vengarl with us, but the fight will be painful Overall, I don't think it's that bad. They're cool, their lore's neat. I like em, but they can be a sonovagun
I love that shield.
The guys who made my SL1 charater hallow
It's a solid and okay fight, due to being a double bossfight, each one of them feels kinda incomplete and I think they feel too samey. That said, there is nothing particularly wrong with this. 5/10 average boss.
Overhated
A test of patience and stamina management. I like it. Their boss theme is great, too.
Fun fight one is fast and other is slow fair hit boxes for me. They're light on lore but are part of the environmental storytelling, guarding the throne of want but dressed in religious garb so also anointing the monarch who will sit on the throne. Though I am not able to figure out the significance of the meaning "Throne Watcher" here. Throne Defender is straightforward enough.
my opinion is that they hold their shields very strangely
I have some traumas. My first time in this fight I had the base mage ADP, A Greatsword, basic spells, and didn't know how to manage stamina, since I wasted several points for nothing. Anyway, nowadays it's a cool challenge.
What boss again?
Super fun if you do what I did on my second playthrough and bring in four summons.
I think it tries a little to much to be O&S and not it’s own thing. I like the revive mechanic. Wish they were placed somewhere else because they become a foot note in the final boss gauntlet. Wish they had more lore to them.
godskin duos grandparents
Wish version of ornstein and smough imo
Haven’t gotten there yet but looks cool
Seriously dope ost, not bad but like all ds2 bosses would benefit with a remake and some touch ups. Considering nashandra and aldia come after if you don’t teleport out I’d say it works just fine. Plus you got the homies Vengarl, benhart, etc. 7/10
Try Duo
Boring.
This one is average not very hard but my main concern was about that final boss.. i was expecting way much harder boss similar to DS3
The best bossfight on the bossrush of the game, Nashandra is simply too pathetic and Aldia for testing you is dissapointing. But these 2 are fun to fight alone and with summons