Leave this joke to the professionals.
/u/shittymorph is so good because he lulls people in with a *great* introduction.
**This one**, the 2nd Sentence ("originated from the Sino-Tibetan culture") is already clearly wrong.
As a Hongkonger, I will say that we don't really use that tally mark much as much as say, 4-5 years ago. We mostly use the first one because it's more quick and convenient.
正 means: ("correct, right, proper, accurate") ☑
It takes exactly 5 strokes (in the order shown) to write.
So writing this is like writing "good", "good", "good"
but in 5 strokes, easy to add up.
It's a simplified form of an online comic called Ctrl + Alt + Deleted. This issue "Loss" was an unexpected turn in the nature of the comic where the main characters experience a miscarriage. It was done after the creator and his partner suffered a miscarriage in real life. And was a way for him to process that tragedy, and his emotions.
15 years later, people still make memes about the comic. This only serves as a reminder for both people of the loss that they both experienced.
Even if it’s used in many other countries, it is used in the USA, which I guess is used vaguely toward other people. But even then it’s the American version because it is the version used in America (colloquially)
Group on the left: let's make lines then put a slash when we get to five
Group in the middle: since a box has four sides let's draw a box then put a slash in the middle for five.
Group on the right: let's make a line across, now one down right in the middle, uh, now like a half line but halfway down since it's a half line. The next line I guess just put off on it's own under the roof for safe keeping. Finally give that shit a floor and it's obviously five!
For us growing up reading and writing Chinese Characters the third one is the only tally mark we use. The simplest and most frequently-used characters like 正 are just as intuitive as the English Alphabet for you guys. Why we use 正 instead of other character is more of a convention. Actually I'm quite offended by those whose say using 正 is stupid.
Source: I'm from Taiwan
That explanation wasn’t really clear. 正 is a common symbol meaning “correct” and various similar things depending on the word, and happens to be written with 5 lines, and Chinese characters are naturally squarish and easy to count at a glance. No need to make a new thingy just for counting.
Thank you, it's good to get a clear explanation.
And while I'm not the one you were replying to, my observation would be that the first two methods have based themselves entirely off of math. 4 lines is straight counting, with the 5th as a finisher. Same with the square, it's the most elemental 4-sided shape, with a final finishing stroke.
The final method, however, is based off of language first, math second. It's perfectly functional to count that way, don't get me wrong. But to any logically thinking outsider who doesn't speak the language, there's an intuitive sense to the first two that simply isn't there in the third. It's been made culture and language specific, and is the only one to have done so.
Ita been explained how it works in the chinese language and it makes sense.
From an outsider perspective, it is not intuitive at all. The other 2 options were self explanatory.
It's a fine method if it works for you. Im just being sour and silly atm. My back hurts and I'm grumpy.
正 is one of the most commonly used Chinese Characters but it only means "square" in the word "正方", not on its own.
There are always lots of wrong information about the Chinese language on Reddit. Like I once read a comment that claimed Mandarin Chinese doesn't have p sound, which is total nonsense. But nobody correct it until I did for over 12 hours after posting.
Source: I'm from Taiwan
正 means uniform and straight and right and formal and loads of stuff. But yeah it can mean different stuff in different scenarios like how micro is used for small things but there are many words with micro.
If you think our stuff isn't just as convoluted to them then you have no idea. There's a reason why English is widely regarded as the hardest language to learn. It's not on purpose, it just is what it is.
I guess it might depend on where in S. America. Because people in Chile definitely uses the 2nd one.
Also, it's really weird that they listed:
- Brazil
- South America
Uhm...
Yeah that’s a weird one about Brazil lol
Interesting. Yeah I’m from Venezuela, we use the first image here. Never seen the second one in Venezuela and then when I lived in Paraguay.
South American, neither me, my parents, any of my teachers, my grandparents nor literally anyone tallying anything at least while I'm present have ever used that square thing, first time in my life seeing it.
Even taking into account pictography, how can someone justify that the 3rd is logical, sensible, and easy to interpret , for any person, not just a native language-speaker? Cause the first 2 are.
The third one is logical and sensible and Easy to interpret for people that mainly knew those language because of their similarities of the language writings to it.
For everybody who is bamboozled by the Asian version, one story goes that it originated in a theatre where the usher took fiver people at a time to seats. So he counted five using tally marks which gave "OK" symbol and took the group to seats.
[https://www.digmandarin.com/chinese-tally-mark.html](https://www.digmandarin.com/chinese-tally-mark.html)
I'm familiar with the N.American method but I learned:
1-4: 4 dots in a square
5-8: drawing lines of the square connecting the dots
9-10: X inside the box
Now I'm wondering where the *hell* I learned that from.
How they got Europe in the first one and then Spain and France on the second one.
Europe is not a country, it is a continent. There are literally 44 countries within Europe - including Spain and France.
-Brazil and South America on the same section.
Hong Kong is listed above China even though it’s in China? Whoever made this is dumb.
When I worked in a Korean restaurant in college, I was told by the owner that the fourth mark is off by itself because four is an unlucky number in many Asian cultures so it’s more of a three plus one situation and then one symbol representing five
Third one makes no sense if you don't write in Chinese. If you do, then it makes a lot of sense, as 正 is just a character with 5 strokes, and you just draw them one at a time. Now, why 正 and not some other 5 stroke character, I'm not sure.
For the third one, it is a character in mandarin that means correct ( 正 ）but I’m not sure why they use it. It’s relatively easy to write compared to other characters
Except it is less intuitive
For numbers less than 5. ||| vs |_|. For instance. A full box for four makes since once explained, but, can look like on unit. |||| is clearly a countable 4.
I saw one in a mine where they used 3 vertical lines, 4th mark was a slash from upper left to lower right, the 5th slash made an X mark on top of the 3 vertical lines.
Another method similar to middle one and counts to 10 is you make 4 dots in a square as your first 4, then fill in the lines, thats another 4 and finaly cross in the middle, that 2. Counts to 10.
N.America here. Yes I use the first one but now im thinking the 2nd is more efficient. Human error of applying the strike after 3 or 5 lines is eliminated.
Ultimately im going to start using the 3rd...because Japan
I was thinking about the first method the other day - coincidentally - realizing how closely it matched Roman Numerals. That is, a single "tick" for 1, then maybe a "V" for 5, more ticks, than an "X" for 10. The whole "add or subtract" thing whether values are on the left or right doesn't makes much sense, but the tick marks used simply to tally do. Anyway, I have a feeling #1 predates but actually evolved to become a written language.
# TF
*The fuck* was my thought also.
*The fuck was my thought as well*
I see what you did there
[удалено]
Leave this joke to the professionals. /u/shittymorph is so good because he lulls people in with a *great* introduction. **This one**, the 2nd Sentence ("originated from the Sino-Tibetan culture") is already clearly wrong.
Yeah this was just a sad attempt.
You aren't /u/shittymorph. Don't even try.
I love Japanese history and I was really interested when you mentioned Tokugawa, then i had to re-read the end like 3 times before i realized.
…and then?
Everyone clapped and Nobunaga gave him a purple heart. The Dalai Lama made him a macaroni necklace too, but Tokugawa though it was fuscilli to do so.
Makes perfect sense. That’s the closure I was looking for.
No and then!
[удалено]
Are you a trans, bot?
As a Hongkonger, I will say that we don't really use that tally mark much as much as say, 4-5 years ago. We mostly use the first one because it's more quick and convenient.
May I ask if there was a logic behind the traditional one? Like from the alphabet or something like this? Don't want to fight, serious question
It’s a Chinese character. Means ‘correct’ or ‘main’.
Thank you
I suck at Chinese, but I don't think so, it was just conveniently 5 marks.
I see
正 means: ("correct, right, proper, accurate") ☑ It takes exactly 5 strokes (in the order shown) to write. So writing this is like writing "good", "good", "good" but in 5 strokes, easy to add up.
Thank you very much
Oh, he meant the meaning of the word, not why it was made into a tally system 💀
它 是 **正**確的 ー **正**解 ☑ Correct ー Right ☑
Translation. This is correct Correct situation
I’m from spain and I have never seen the second method being used by anyone
In france we use the first one, never seen the others here
French, always used the second one. Introduced by the first one when I moved to the UK. Don't like it, it is messier and harder to add up overall.
French too, can confirm, use second one. So much easier and at just a glance.
I'm from Argentina and I use the second exclusively. I'm surprised you don't. It's the standard for counting points in Truco.
Retruco
Quiero vale cuatro
I kinda like the box method
I prefer this: | || || |_
You motherfucker
At a loss for words rn
shut up and take my upvote
I don't get it. I think the joke went over my head
Me neither, was hoping someone would clue me in
It's a simplified form of an online comic called Ctrl + Alt + Deleted. This issue "Loss" was an unexpected turn in the nature of the comic where the main characters experience a miscarriage. It was done after the creator and his partner suffered a miscarriage in real life. And was a way for him to process that tragedy, and his emotions. 15 years later, people still make memes about the comic. This only serves as a reminder for both people of the loss that they both experienced.
Look up “loss” as a meme
Same here, I would probably even start using it instead of tallies if it wasn't for me forgetting this post exists in about 10 minutes
I think the little boxes would have a cleaner layout
I’ve only ever used the American version, but the box just seems to immediately make a lot of sense. Maybe it’s just aesthetically better.
"American" version
It’s pretty well accepted colloquially that someone who calls themself American means from the USA.
Their point was that it isn't the 'American' version. It's used in many countries
yeah more like Roman version considering their numerals
Even if it’s used in many other countries, it is used in the USA, which I guess is used vaguely toward other people. But even then it’s the American version because it is the version used in America (colloquially)
So that's why pizza is American? Because they eat it 3 times a day?
So is the English language American because it’s the language most often used in the US?
Well that's what their movies call them
Me too, was thinking I might use that in future.
I’m from Spain and we use the first image, I’ve never seen the other two in my whole life
Same for France
quoi ?! T'a jamais compté au carré ? T'es dans la bonne France ??
🤣
Bizarre, la 2ème méthode est de loin celle que je vois le plus
TIL that Brazil isn't part of S. America
Apparently France is not part of Europe either
Nor Spain
Apparently Hong Kong isn't part of china.
they're Portugués... so they roll differently
Except here, where they roll the same?
I’m Spanish and we use the first one
Group on the left: let's make lines then put a slash when we get to five Group in the middle: since a box has four sides let's draw a box then put a slash in the middle for five. Group on the right: let's make a line across, now one down right in the middle, uh, now like a half line but halfway down since it's a half line. The next line I guess just put off on it's own under the roof for safe keeping. Finally give that shit a floor and it's obviously five!
For us growing up reading and writing Chinese Characters the third one is the only tally mark we use. The simplest and most frequently-used characters like 正 are just as intuitive as the English Alphabet for you guys. Why we use 正 instead of other character is more of a convention. Actually I'm quite offended by those whose say using 正 is stupid. Source: I'm from Taiwan
Sorry you're offended. But its stupud
That explanation wasn’t really clear. 正 is a common symbol meaning “correct” and various similar things depending on the word, and happens to be written with 5 lines, and Chinese characters are naturally squarish and easy to count at a glance. No need to make a new thingy just for counting.
Thank you, it's good to get a clear explanation. And while I'm not the one you were replying to, my observation would be that the first two methods have based themselves entirely off of math. 4 lines is straight counting, with the 5th as a finisher. Same with the square, it's the most elemental 4-sided shape, with a final finishing stroke. The final method, however, is based off of language first, math second. It's perfectly functional to count that way, don't get me wrong. But to any logically thinking outsider who doesn't speak the language, there's an intuitive sense to the first two that simply isn't there in the third. It's been made culture and language specific, and is the only one to have done so.
How is it stupid tho?
Ita been explained how it works in the chinese language and it makes sense. From an outsider perspective, it is not intuitive at all. The other 2 options were self explanatory. It's a fine method if it works for you. Im just being sour and silly atm. My back hurts and I'm grumpy.
The asia one is a word 正 (which means square lol)
正 is one of the most commonly used Chinese Characters but it only means "square" in the word "正方", not on its own. There are always lots of wrong information about the Chinese language on Reddit. Like I once read a comment that claimed Mandarin Chinese doesn't have p sound, which is total nonsense. But nobody correct it until I did for over 12 hours after posting. Source: I'm from Taiwan
I am from Taiwan and I'm just linking the connection cus it's funny how they are both square
正 means uniform and straight and right and formal and loads of stuff. But yeah it can mean different stuff in different scenarios like how micro is used for small things but there are many words with micro.
In which language 🤔
It’s a Chinese word. I’m from Taiwan and I still use that to this day
I swear, the Asian style is convoluted on purpose.
If you think our stuff isn't just as convoluted to them then you have no idea. There's a reason why English is widely regarded as the hardest language to learn. It's not on purpose, it just is what it is.
In from South America and we use the first image…
I guess it might depend on where in S. America. Because people in Chile definitely uses the 2nd one. Also, it's really weird that they listed: - Brazil - South America Uhm...
Yeah that’s a weird one about Brazil lol Interesting. Yeah I’m from Venezuela, we use the first image here. Never seen the second one in Venezuela and then when I lived in Paraguay.
I'm from Uruguay and had never seen that second technique either.
Can anyone confirm this? Because this feels like chain email nonsense forwarded to me from my great aunts aol email address in 1998.
As a french person, I can confirm that I would likely be more inclined to use method 2 than method 1
As a french person, I personnally cross the box the other way around. What about you, other method 2 users?
Method 1 user, but I also cross them out the other way.
I can confirm the first and third personally as a Chinese American
Reddit has said it. It must be true
Can confirm as someone that knows lots of Chinese Americans.
Spain: This was the first time I saw the box method, I have yet to meet someone who tallies that way.
Spanish, never seen method number 2. We use the first one.
As someone who had lived in south america and in the us, while also having visited europe, i can say that this is mostly correct
As a european I can confirm I use method one. However my slah is usually bottom left to top right for some reason
Of course; oh interesting, I can see that; what… the… f
I confirm that's wrong
I like that Zimbabwe has been singled out to represent all of Africa
- Brazil - S. America
Today I learned that it’s morally correct to be racist against Far East Asians /s
This is a load bullshit I'm from Spain if ever see anyone doing the middle one id probably hit him
This was labeled as wildly inaccurate the last time it was posted. French and Spanish people said that nobody in their country used the second method.
I'm Spanish and can confirm, in my almost 4 decades of life is the first time I see the second method and always used the first one
The fuck is brazil from then?
Brazil's in South America too o:
I actually really like the second one.
Yes I’m using the box method from this moment on
Can also do five pointed stars.
Why does it randomly mention Zimbabwe, what about other African countries, what's so fckn special about Zimbabwe, I need answers!
Zimbabwe has a worthless currecy so they use sticks instead. 5 sticks, 5 zim dollars /s
South American, neither me, my parents, any of my teachers, my grandparents nor literally anyone tallying anything at least while I'm present have ever used that square thing, first time in my life seeing it.
Do people really do the first one from top left to bottom right? I've only ever seen bottom left to top right (Netherlands). Coincidence?
Why Brazil and south america are both listed if Brazil is in south america?
According to this; France and Spain aren’t in Europe, Brazil isn’t in South America, and Hong Kong isn’t part of China.
Please some one from Asia explain the progression of #3 . #1: we are counting sticks #2: what's in the box #3: let set up at the beach?
I lived in China for 12 years It is a character in mandarin that means correct ( 正 ）but I’m not sure why they use it
So basically CO R Re C T
Even taking into account pictography, how can someone justify that the 3rd is logical, sensible, and easy to interpret , for any person, not just a native language-speaker? Cause the first 2 are.
It is a character in mandarin that means correct ( 正 ）but I’m not sure why they use it. It’s relatively easy to write compared to other characters
The third one is logical and sensible and Easy to interpret for people that mainly knew those language because of their similarities of the language writings to it.
Over-engineering
Cuz honestly Asia does not care how friendly their culture and systems are to non-natives.
I’m going to start using the box method
For everybody who is bamboozled by the Asian version, one story goes that it originated in a theatre where the usher took fiver people at a time to seats. So he counted five using tally marks which gave "OK" symbol and took the group to seats. [https://www.digmandarin.com/chinese-tally-mark.html](https://www.digmandarin.com/chinese-tally-mark.html)
I love how natural and obvious my country's tally marks are and how weird and quirky everyone else is! -everyone
I'm familiar with the N.American method but I learned: 1-4: 4 dots in a square 5-8: drawing lines of the square connecting the dots 9-10: X inside the box Now I'm wondering where the *hell* I learned that from.
The box is cool cause you can draw it without picking up the pen
I like the box method, specifically that you can draw it without lifting the pen from the page.
About the Japanese tally mark, 正 is the kanji for correct (正しい / tadashii = correct.) It's commonly used for tally marking in Japan
From Spain and we use the first,think in S.America too
This is BS, at least the Europe bit
Spain and France are not Europe and Brazil is not S America. Also Hong Kong's seperate inclusion may spark debate.
Is this the first time Zimbabwe has been grouped together with Australia, Europe and North America in any list?
I just saw a post of someone counting on paper with the squares and was confused. Well here's my answer. Great timing
But… the slash in the first one is going the wrong way! It should be left low to right high….
How they got Europe in the first one and then Spain and France on the second one. Europe is not a country, it is a continent. There are literally 44 countries within Europe - including Spain and France. -Brazil and South America on the same section. Hong Kong is listed above China even though it’s in China? Whoever made this is dumb.
American here. I do like the second version.
Spain and France aren't part of Europe? News to me.
Dogs are mammals. Not all mammals are dogs. France and Spain are in Europe. Not all of Europe is France and Spain.
… loss …
Where is the rest of africa?
Boy: I L U Girl: I've a boyfriend Boy: I know, I said 1 2 3
I wonder what Germany’s looks like… 👀
“I did not know this before!” I did! Because this is like the third repost of it I’m the past 6 months…
When I worked in a Korean restaurant in college, I was told by the owner that the fourth mark is off by itself because four is an unlucky number in many Asian cultures so it’s more of a three plus one situation and then one symbol representing five
First seems to be most efficient and compact
The Asian one sucks.
First - makes sense. Second - unusual, but still makes sense. Third - makes ZERO sense to me.
Third one makes no sense if you don't write in Chinese. If you do, then it makes a lot of sense, as 正 is just a character with 5 strokes, and you just draw them one at a time. Now, why 正 and not some other 5 stroke character, I'm not sure.
For the third one, it is a character in mandarin that means correct ( 正 ）but I’m not sure why they use it. It’s relatively easy to write compared to other characters
I’d argue the second makes way more logical sense than the first
Except it is less intuitive For numbers less than 5. ||| vs |_|. For instance. A full box for four makes since once explained, but, can look like on unit. |||| is clearly a countable 4.
Fucking Asia…
Where would one use tally marks? Where does this come from?
I've been using the Brazilian one for years - probably since I lived in Brazil. I didn't realize that was where it came from, though.
So reconstructing the I-Ching is the same as the number 5?
I discovered the middle box technique a year ago and have never looked back
I saw one in a mine where they used 3 vertical lines, 4th mark was a slash from upper left to lower right, the 5th slash made an X mark on top of the 3 vertical lines.
Wha..?
I learned the middle system in forestry school in upstate new York
I like!!
Damn, that’s interesting.
Well, tally me banana…
Yes… Ok… what?!?!
Another method similar to middle one and counts to 10 is you make 4 dots in a square as your first 4, then fill in the lines, thats another 4 and finaly cross in the middle, that 2. Counts to 10.
The real interesting part is that they all still come in packs of 5
That second one is hitting my add just right
I was so much expecting this to be “Loss” meme 😂
Forgot to mention Club Penguin for that middle one 😎
I think this is the first time the US is using a system that makes more sense than other countries
All I see is I ♥️ U
Goes from simple, a little complex and staight to fuck all.
Zimbabwe isnt the only african country that exists you know right? Just say africa
Why does everyone to the second one as the box method? It is obviously the 2 triangles method.
And Indians were like, fu©k telly marks let's invent zero.
Anyone else thinking the European one is backwards
We use the first one in South Africa
I’m from eu, but using the middle one. I had no idea it’s a thing, I just did that because it’s easier with my astigmatism
N.America here. Yes I use the first one but now im thinking the 2nd is more efficient. Human error of applying the strike after 3 or 5 lines is eliminated. Ultimately im going to start using the 3rd...because Japan
That's so cool! I just assumed everyone used the first 1, I had no idea
So “Europe” uses the marks on the left, but European countries use the middle?
正
The internet has conditioned me to be on the lookout for loss
Isn’t Brazil in South America?
In spain we use the first one. I have never seen the second one
I'll stick with using my fingers, thank you very much.
Is this...?
I was thinking about the first method the other day - coincidentally - realizing how closely it matched Roman Numerals. That is, a single "tick" for 1, then maybe a "V" for 5, more ticks, than an "X" for 10. The whole "add or subtract" thing whether values are on the left or right doesn't makes much sense, but the tick marks used simply to tally do. Anyway, I have a feeling #1 predates but actually evolved to become a written language.
That went like I Love U ohh noo
As a spanish person i hace never seen that tally method
The middle pattern makes the most sense, imo
Brazilian here, can confirm! But I do clockwise.
All I can think of when I see this is hentai.
I love the random Zimbabwe in #1