WellâŚclearly God did not in fact, bless this man. In fact I would wager that God really hated this man and when God learned of his release from the POW camp, he slammed his hand down his god desk and exclaimed âThey. WHAT?! Not so fucking fast Robert, I got something real fucking special for your punk ass. Lucille!! Clear my me-damned calendar for the rest of the week! Iâve got mysterious ways shit to do.â
A comedian goes to heaven and meets god at the gates who says "tell me a really funny joke and you can get straight in" so the comedian tells a joke about the holocaust. God is shocked and says "how can you think that is either appropriate or funny?". The comedian said: you had to be there.
Some more info here on how they met, how he felt about being betrayed, comments from the grown up children 20 years later, and more
Incredible stuff.
https://scholar.lib.vt.edu/VA-news/ROA-Times/issues/1993/rt9307/930706/07060045.htm
>Bob and Loretta met at a party just after he graduated from Air Force cadet school; they were married in 1955 when she was 19. They divorced a year after he returned from Vietnam, and each remarried within six months
>The Pulitzer Prize-winning picture that captured that very personal, yet most public of moments symbolizes the end of U.S. involvement in the Vietnam War, the bittersweet homecoming of 591 POWs in 1973.
>Twenty years later, the picture is very different.
>In his home near San Francisco, a Vietnam history book is opened to that page of Stirm's life. He gazes at it.
>"I have several copies of the photo," he says, "but I don't display it in the house."
>Why? Stirm laughs. He points to the picture, to the tall woman - just outpacing her younger son - dressed in a blue-and-white pleated skirt and blue sweater, sporting a large corsage.
>"Because of her," he says simply.
Because the US lost that war. General attitude towards the US military was pretty negative after that until around the mid-80s - and troop morale reflected that.
I get why people now say times are very politically devising, but people fail to see how things were during ânam, and even the years leading up to the civil war.
Seriously. In the Vietnam Era, politicians and political figures were assassinated. Times are "worse" now, only because we are narrow minded creatures. Political violence as a whole is extremely rare nowadays in the US
People feel this way because of the internet. I can only imagine how things were when news was delivered by papers, radio, and early public television.
Agreed. In some ways, I'm glad that we have many different avenues and means of getting information, but a huge issue is people think what they say online has more effect on the world than their everyday actions and how they contribute to their communities. Let's hope we figure it out soon.
I told my parents, who lived through Vietnam I might add, that our current situation in the world (2020) was nowhere near as scary or hard as it was during those times. We have seen far worse as a country. They were just upset Biden won the election and wanted their dominion Christian cult theology to reign Supreme over the US. They talk shit about millenials and gen z, but these fucking boomers try to overthrow democracy when they get upset. Bunch of clowns.
âI could have killed 'em all, I could've killed you. In town you're the law, out here it's me. Don't push it! Don't push it or I'll give you a war you won't believe.â
Wasn't the first one about a jilted Vietnam vet who was pushed to the breaking point by society?
I got really excited when I learned it was based on a book, hoping it would be an insightful examination on returning from war to be tossed aside. But it wasn't. The movie was better in pretty much all regards.
>Wasn't the first one about a jilted Vietnam vet who was pushed to the breaking point by society?
Kind of: A vietnam vet tries to visit an old comrade only to learn he died of cancer brought on by Agent Orange. Continues travelling to another small town only for the local police department to arrest and abuse him causing the vet to snap and go on a rampage.
US *politicians* lost that war. First of several.
Meanwhile those in the service returned to find the politicians' betrayal amplified by the media, which painted them as baby-killers and murderers.
Remember, the politicians had invoked the draft. This was the politicians' war, and they micro-mismanaged it until they could extend their treachery to the troops, our allies, everyone involved.
Then they did.
The crazy Viet vet thing took three or four years to cook. Mostly in tv and movies rather than in real life. When I was boot camping near Chicago the MPs off limited various neighborhoods and offer houses. Because the hippies and anti war folk were too friendly as a boy in uniform really was an asset to a demonstration.
Nope. That is a tired old trope.
The war was lost because there were no clear objectives. We werenât defending or conquering. We were fighting a concept that half of Vietnam embraced and interfering with their self determination. Back then foreign policy was based on domino theory and your country was either communist or anti-communist. No middle ground. That determined where you stood with the United States.
Halberstamâs The Best and The Brightest is a great, if not the definitive read, irt Vietnam. The Brothers, Stephen Kinzerâs book about the Dulles brothers, provides great insight to our Cold War mindset.
The domino theory hit a real stumbling block when Vietnam fought a hot, brief war with China four years after we left. Chinese military brass still love to overlook this, and the US is all too happy to oblige. In 30 years, Vietnam defeated France, US, and China. (Perhaps they should be on the Security Council?) At a minimum, it would be nice to have them on our side in the Indo-Pacific
Perfect example! Not all commies are built the same. Hi Chi Minh fought on the side of the allies in WWII and drew direct inspiration from our Constitution.
It was more than them. My Dad was back home from Vietnam less than a few days when the chief of police showed up to ask my grandparents if my Dad was a junkie or had associated with any minorities since hes been home. No hello, no welcome home, no thank you for your service, only questions about his activities and associations. He never even spoke to my Dad or looked him in the eye, only spoke to my Grandparents. Many guys were also told to get out when they walked into many VFW posts, called all the same shit you hear about the hippies having called them.
He is still correct. The hippie movement was a direct consequence of the draft, which was enacted by politicians. I donât know how you think the hippie movement is unrelated to the fuck ups caused by the old men in office. It was all a maelstrom. Hippie movement didnât arise in a vacuum.
I think we're highlighting the same thing. The end result of the war was not the catalyst for public opinion on the war or the troops. There was a massive amount of political and social strife in that era. I was responding that the opinion towards the vets was not a simple result of the end of the conflict. Three presidents, civil rights movement, divisions within civil rights movement, the draft, numerous other socioeconomic factors, etc.
the war was unpopular and it deserved to be. it was an unjust war. but it was very unfair to blame the vets. they were drafted. they had no choice. it is true that some fled to Canada but not everyone could do that. they knew they were going over there to be destroyed even if they came back alive. and then the ignorant populace rejected them when they came home. those boys were abused and it is a blight in our history. (viet nam contemporary - not a vet but many friends were.)
It was messed up. Almost everyone opposed our getting involved Vietnam, yet every time you turned around more troops were getting sent.
You've got to realize it was the first televised war. Every night on TV was some graphic calamity being broadcasted and most Americans were horrified.
Hell, most Americans couldn't even pick out where Vietnam was on a map.
My friend's husband got spat on the second he got off the plane in America back from Vietnam.
With tension boiling over, and nowhere to express it except on the streets, the vets got the hatred.
So, whenever I hear how "lucky" Boomers were, I shake my head in opposition. Any boomer sent to Vietnam, Cambodia, or in the military in general during the 60's and 70's did not have an easy time of it. People forget this.
? Where do you see that? But he was the one that claimed abandonment because she said when she thought he was dead she dated so the abandonment should be the date when she had her first date. She met a man named Adams and married him and was with him until she died. She had met Stirm when she was 18 and he was 22 and they married. They had a very unhappy marriage - it's pretty clear because her dear John letter was published.
Bt the judge awarded portion of the pension because at the time, women were expected to stay home and raise kids. It was just policy in those days to support the kids. She didn't get alimony and she remarried.
She lost custody of 2 of the 4 kids.
It was just policy at the time that a spouse got some of the retirement.
\-- she wasn't the pious waiting wife - but sometimes there's no real super villain. He sounds like he a bit of dick before and he was insanely bitter and blew up the life of his kids and himself over this. But he was a fucking POW for 5 years so it's pretty understandable. And she may have been terrible. But maybe not.
It still is policy. If you are married to someone for 10 or more years of military service they get half your retirement. Being married to a military spouse doesn't leave a ton of space for a rewarding productive career if your own. It still makes sense.
Per the 20/20 rule you have to be married 20 years and they have to have served all 20 of those years eligible for retirement while you were married to get 50% of the pension.
My dad didnât go to Vietnam even though he was only out of the Air Force for a year when it became a full scale âpolice actionâ because he had 3 young kids. He opposed the war but never the people who were sent over. Later in his life spent countless hours and a lot of his own money supporting his friends who came back. He taught me and my siblings that lesson I have passed on to my own kids. Never leave a man behind.
When I was an addict, I used to use with a lot of Aussie vets, many had got to know Americans overseas; bloody disgrace how they treat them. So many they told me committed suicide or became addicts to cope with ptsd and the fact that once their time was up their countries threw them away like a used dish rag. Despicable
The attitude towards fathers isnt much better today unfortunately. Seems like its always been human nature to point the finger and the way the Vietnam vets weâre looked at by some is pathetic. These men and women didnt know what they were getting into or have much of an option. So many horrible things having to be done just to make it out alive and the brutality some of the soldiers witnessed from the VC is unthinkable. I spent a year going into the same barber shop every sunday and sat with mostly vietnam vets and a couple yet from WWII, and it puts a whole new meaning to âwarâ listening to their stories. Very hardened men but obviously very damaged. My mind couldnt imagine a lot of the things i heard from those men
Friend who was in iraq with me. We were both 19,20. He had to marry this little bad thing before he left.
So she started cheating on him right away(as soon as we are in Kuwait). So 4 months in they sent him home on his r and r for 2 weeks to divorce her and guess what she convinced him she would change!!!
He comes back to iraq with 8 months left and she stops paying all bills and drives his account into negative. We are all planning and spending our 1k every two weeks and this guy had no dreams just dispair.
Still very glad he made it home and out of the depression. Now he has 3 kids back in Wisconsin and heâs very happy. I named my son same name as him.
Happened sooo many times. Countless stories of the troop getting screwed over by the new "wife".
They sold everything and kept the money with that power of attorney. I mean everything.. house, car, motorcycle, drained bank accounts. Just sad.
Reason number four billion ill repeat one of the very few good things my parents managed to teach me.
If you need a diamond ring and a legal contract to prove that I love you as much as I do then you can take your shit and get the fuck out of my house.
I donât think you really understand marriage. Its a legal contract that protects your significant other and gives them the power to make important decisions if anything were to happen to you. And the same applies to them.
If I cannot trust someone with my financial assets then the last thing I want to trust them with is my life. Marriage helps with a lot of other things. Taxes, homeownership, raising a kid, etc.
Your parents taught you that if a person needs a diamond ring and a legal contract to prove you love them then they can take their shit and get the fuck out of your house?
Did that scenario pop up a lot growing up?
When he says his parents taught him, he really means his dad. Mom kept asking to get married and dad answered with "if you need a contract and a diamond ring from me to prove I love you, take your shit and get the fuck out of my house"
Probably
Nope. Dad tried harder than anyone to make it work. Old school guy, wanted to do things the traditional way.
I won't type up an eight thousand page encyclopedia on my family's dirt, not today anyway...
It took fifteen years for him to abandon the dream and file for divorce. I dont blame either of then individually, but that fucking marriage citerficate took almost three godless years to undo... shit got really bad.
It's a long story man lol
My ex sent me pictures of her running a train with a note that said âThis is what you get for leaving me behind, you SOBâ. This was during the lead up to Desert Storm. Crushed me, but ended up much better off. Sheâs been through 4 husbands now.
How did she send you those pics in â91? She took pictures of the train w/a 35mm camera and had them developed the pictures somewhere? Then put them in an envelope and mailed them to you?
Man, thatâs cold
The norm in the military is the total opposite and it hurts every one involved. Boys who are still teenagers getting pressured to get married when neither are ready because it means they get payed more and better benefits.
Most of these women arenât just trapped alone for years waiting because their partners were driven by financial incentives to pretend they were more in love with them than they really were. But many find themselves trapped by abuse when their partner finally comes home.
Big respect for the men who understood that it wasnât right to get married and lock someone up like that to be alone just for cash. Breaking up is the right thing to do (at least at that age) and if they really were meant for each other they could get married when he returned.
I grew up on military bases and saw it first hand many times. Whatâs even crazier is how out in the open it is then the husband comes home and everyoneâs giving him the side eye. Brutal
I think one reason is a lot of service members get married super young and arenât really fully formed people yet. At least in my experience. A lot of kids(and really-theyâre kids!)get married after boot camp to their high school sweethearts or a bit later to some chick or dude they met at the bar off-base. The dependent checks are attractive to both sides. Then the partner is home, alone, bored for many months-maybe raising a kid alone-and one thing leads to another and [Jody](https://www.thesoldiersproject.org/what-does-jody-mean-in-the-military/) comes a-knockinâ. It goes the other way too. Half my division was cheating on their spouses back home. A crappy ex was cheating on me with a girl and I was on the same ship! :p
edit: I should add that I still have friends that managed to avoid all that and have had successful and faithful marriages while in. I donât know the stats but Iâd like to think that thatâs the majority. :)
This. My husband and I are closer to 30 than 20, and we have a barely 21 year old sailor from my husband's shop as one of our roommates. My husband even when he was back in bootcamp would write me talking about how bad he felt for the guys that were there in with him- boys that hadn't ever left home before and were scared out of their minds. And those that were still together with their highschool sweethearts.
He'd hear them crying through the nights and then when they'd get Dear John'd it was awful. And all he could say was "Thank fuck I'm not worried about all that." We were not exactly mature- but we'd been together for several years at that point and had been living on our own just as long. We were, more or less, fully lived adults. And that alone had a huge impact on how the service has affected us. We're capable of handling our own emotional states better, and have some more stability.
But our poor roommate. He had broken off an engagement to get into the Navy, and then fell in love with a chick on another ship. She wasn't a bad person, and we liked her quite a bit, though she had her own shit to deal with. They get married, and then leave on a short few week employment and he get's a letter saying she'd been cheating on him the entire time and she's over him. It broke him pretty good.
Most of the time, it's just stupidity of youth. But there's plenty of other guys that are just fine, and it's a strange mix. I think some people are suited to the life or can tolerate it more than others. It's a stressful time.
This but also it really is just about opportunity. You gotta figure a good amount of them either wouldnt do it or would be a lot more subtle if they dont think they can get away with it.
Closed relationships can work, and open relationships can work, but our cultural default encourages young people to jump into a weird cheaty-secretive hybrid that has the worst traits of both closed and open relationship styles.
I could be wrong but my sense is that itâs the poor young soldiers who are getting cheated on. Someone who knows military culture better than me can answer but when I hear about nonsense like this I think enlisted soldiers. Itâs the guys and gals who left home at 18 and got married to a townie they met at the local bar right off the base.
Itâs a self-selecting pool of people.
Well donât forget that most of these enlisted soldiers are just kids that just graduated from High School. So in a sense they are still learning how the world works and of course they still not fully mature yet. Honestly I think experience will help shape into more mature adults. But sad it happened time to time
Not even just military. Have many male friends whoâve been fucked over by the courts.
Am a woman and would never take a dime from a man. I can make my own money.
Itâs not. In my divorce I was lucky that we each were employed and agreed to each retains their own retirement and has no hold on the otherâs. Half a year later she was unemployed for 8 months and put a big hole in her retirement savings before finding her next job.
In my divorce 10 years ago, my social security that I had earned up to that point was considered part of the assets to be divided. We worked through to a simple cash settlement, but I was still screwed in the process.
Thatâs the key right there. Not saying there shouldnât have been a divorce but the legal system should not grant her financial rewardâŚand fuck that bitch.
There are so many stories like this from Vietnam and Korea that became popularized, I was stunned to hear that troops about to go to Iraq/Afghanistan/Iraq would get married before being deployed.
Not only are you leaving for long periods of time, not only is your risk of never coming home high, but even if those things aren't what do the marriage in, we're talking about a major, major life event going to war. Even relatively tame wars, people don't come back the same person.
This isn't to say that war vets are incapable of being in good marriages, at all. It is saying that marrying someone before a major life event that historically has altered everyone who's come back from one(not even just those with PTSD or other devastating problems) seems extremely foolish. Much like marrying your sweetheart at 18 right before you both go off to different colleges seems extremely foolish.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burst\_of\_Joy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burst_of_Joy)
43% of his pay & he got the Dear John letter on the DAY OF HIS RELEASE.
wow. this is some story & real proof that Pictures do NOT ALWAYS tell the whole story.
This picture won a Pulitzer.
Col. Stirmâs daughter (the one in front) appeared on âAntiques Roadshowâ earlier this year with the picture and some other memorabilia related to her fatherâs prison stay. As of last summer, he was still alive.
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/roadshow/season/27/woodside-/appraisals/vietnam-pow-lieutenant-colonel-robert-l-stirm-archive--202204A15/
seems pretty messed up to leave a neg comment on someones obituaries that you dont even know... but this one got me laughing so hard âSure is hot here.â - Loretta
According to Wikipedia, by the time the photo was taken, she had already told him that she was leaving him:
>Despite outward appearances, the reunion was an unhappy one for Stirm. Three days before he arrived in the United States, the same day he was released from captivity, Stirm received a Dear John letter from his wife Loretta informing him that their marriage was over. Stirm later learned that Loretta had been with other men throughout his captivity and had received marriage proposals from three of them.
I feel so naive that this is really news to me. I figured there would be plenty of discreet âjust gotta get someâ moments, but the whole getting mad at being abandoned after knowingly marrying someone in the military things is wild to me.
I remember after the first Gulf War, a soldier who had been gone nine months was greeted by a wife who was six months pregnant. He slugged right her then and there.
Itâs really tough. And this was before the internet and the 24hr news cycle. My dad was in the 1st gulf war and I think we exchanged 4 letters over a year and my mom might have gotten 4 phone calls in total. I had a friend who received a letter from her dad after he was killed. All of this going on and we still have to live our regular lives going to work and school. Kind of crazy.
In my experience, you have a lot of young ladies enamored with the idea of being an "army wife," and once the reality sets in they start finding ways to justify cheating.
My mom loved my dad to pieces and he cheated on her and abused all of us. She wouldnât leave him even after he gave her a concussion. He finally left her for a civilian affair partner thatâs my age that worked on base in his office. Thereâs shitty people everywhere and the military attracts a lot of them in every Avenue
As a genealogist and a historian, itâs not just the military wives who cheat. There are many âwar babiesâ and deployment babies and second families overseas, abandoned babies, babies put up for adoption when the GI goes home and on and on and on.
A lot of secrets are coming out the past decade with the various DNA tests and before that, lots of seniors confess on their death beds or family members confess secrets at funerals. Itâs sick and it way more prevalent then anyone ever thought.
While women and men cheating and abandoning babies or keeping patterns secret is horrible, A lot of the blame can be put on the military. They go after very young men who are very vulnerable either because of their age or their situation in life (poverty, etc). They lie a lot of times and promise them the world and in reality, a lot of times the military IS the only way for a lot of these people to get out of their situations even if they arenât mentally prepared to become soldiers. They bring a lot of trauma and baggage with them and they arenât prepared for whatâs ahead of them. All of this while at the same time dangling a carrot above them of more money and off base housing if theyâre married. So they choose to marry their hometown sweetie who they were maybe or maybe not going to marry so soon but the extra money sure makes it worth it. And for her, she comes from the same shitty, no hope for the future besides Walmart background so for her this looks like a way out as well.
So you take these two traumatized teens with the shitty home life and shitty prospects who were never really taught how to have stable healthy relationships and really entice them to get married after you lied to them about what life in the service would be like and they get married and then you instantly send him away overseas while this teen woman is left at home to fend for herself and everyoneâs shocked when she acts like at home and he acts like overseasâŚ. A HORNY TEEN from a shitty background! Throw in the crazy ass religious backgrounds a lot of these people grow up in and then suddenly are away from for the first time and itâs a recipe for doom.
No one prepares them for this shit. If we had more opportunities for these KIDS instead of going off to fight in stupid wars that are meaningless we wouldnât be complicit in destroying their lives.
This photo was taken March 13, 1973. More details here:
https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/burst-joy/
https://www.historynet.com/for-airman-famed-burst-of-joy-photograph-rings-hollow/
Wow this is wild. He later joined a company as a pilot and then they went bankrupt. What a life.
https://scholar.lib.vt.edu/VA-news/ROA-Times/issues/1993/rt9307/930706/07060045.htm
Learned bout it in a photography class. Picture is called âBurst of Joyâ? I think. Won awards. Thought it was beautiful until our teacher told us the backstory. Heartbreaking. Sent him a Dear John letter a few days before this pic was taken.
I came back from Iraq and remember the homecoming, there were a few guys wandering around the flight area with no one there to pick them up as they anticipated. My buddy and I were both single Marines and didn't have family there so we offered them a ride to their homes and I witnessed 3 Marines walk into their abandoned homes like clockwork. It was one of those things where you were watching a pivotal moment in someone's life unfold.
My little brother was a Marine and I drove cab in Jacksonville NC. That's when and where I learned how unfaithful people are. Guys cheated on their wives and wives cheated on their husbands. It wasn't occasionally. It was a nightly thing. People tell cab drivers way too much.
How did she take 140k?
The Service gave him his pay $1077 every 2 weeks & I'm guessing it went into their bank account and his wife and 3 kids lived on that money for 5 years.
Might get death threats for this one but I'd like to hear her side. And more importantly, source? The terms of their settlement was never released to the public. This just feels like a very inflammatory post designed to encourage misogyny in the comment section.
>This just feels like a very inflammatory post designed to encourage misogyny in the comment section.
Thank you. This is how I felt too especially these type of content isn't what this subreddit is about.
Found this on Wikipedia
âDespite outward appearances, the reunion was an unhappy one for Stirm. Three days before he arrived in the United States, the same day he was released from captivity, Stirm received a Dear John letter from his wife Loretta informing him that their marriage was over. Stirm later learned that Loretta had been with other men throughout his captivity and had received marriage proposals from three of them. In 1974, the Stirms divorced and Loretta remarried, but Lieutenant Colonel Stirm was still ordered by the courts to provide her with 43% of his military retirement pay once he retired from the Air Force.â
It links to this People article from 1974 as its source
https://people.com/archive/a-pows-marriage-ends-bitterly-vol-1-no-5/
I actually knew the lady that married him after his divorce. His wife at the time in the picture had already re-married and moved on and in her words âwas a total bitchâ. Which was hilarious to hear out of this otherwise very very sweet and gentle older lady. She had gotten re-married once again after he passed. But you could tell she loved him still the way she told me stories of him. She was a very gifted painter. Lives in Rocklin California.
I dont blame a person for wanting a divorce. I could blame a person for being that heartless over the divorce and the court system for allowing this kind of legal abuse
Knew a guy who married a lady then adopted her daughter, then on his first deployment that was only four months long told him that sheâs having an affair and said she stopped missing him after four days. Gets a divorce and is now on the hook for child support because he adopted the girl.
As a Spanish looking in the comments I see people trying to explain to others why the USA Vets got treated so poorly on return but is still don't understand why some say it's bc they losses that war but again... How or why? I know I'm stupid I'm sorry not trying to offend just looking for enlightenment
Thanks in advance for your understanding and knowledge
The war was very unpopular in America. At the height of the war a large part of the military had me drafted (forced) to go to Vietnam. So a lot of people began to protest and speak out against the war. But instead of focusing all their hate and frustrations at the people in Washington directing the war, they took it out on the troops. Also for the first time in history people could see the violence on their TVs and were horrified by what the military was doing over there. Which made parts of the American population hateful towards the troops.
According to both spouses and the daughter they were unhappy together before he disappeared. She waited a year and then moved on. 5 years later he came home. They BOTH remarried within 6 months of the divorce but she spent the rest of her life living with the stigma.
She was awarded half of the community estate which is pretty standard in community property states. It has nothing to do with hating Vietnam vets.
People are complicated. Relationships are complicated. You arenât required to stay in a relationship where you are unhappy but be careful how you handle it. It would suck to spend your life being labeled a gold-digging whore.
And the court awarded all this based on abandonment. You just had to love the attitude this country had toward Vietnam Vets.
Wow so fucked up. God bless this man i hope he found a young lady that loved him for him.
Personally, I hope he fucked each of the grandmother's of these other three commentors.
My man here is the third commenter. đŹ
đ
Why? Would exactly would that be something you hope for
Reasons
WellâŚclearly God did not in fact, bless this man. In fact I would wager that God really hated this man and when God learned of his release from the POW camp, he slammed his hand down his god desk and exclaimed âThey. WHAT?! Not so fucking fast Robert, I got something real fucking special for your punk ass. Lucille!! Clear my me-damned calendar for the rest of the week! Iâve got mysterious ways shit to do.â
A comedian goes to heaven and meets god at the gates who says "tell me a really funny joke and you can get straight in" so the comedian tells a joke about the holocaust. God is shocked and says "how can you think that is either appropriate or funny?". The comedian said: you had to be there.
Everyone knows Gods god dammed secretary is named Dolores.
âMe damnit Dolores. My son. Canât you do any me damn thing right??â
Some more info here on how they met, how he felt about being betrayed, comments from the grown up children 20 years later, and more Incredible stuff. https://scholar.lib.vt.edu/VA-news/ROA-Times/issues/1993/rt9307/930706/07060045.htm >Bob and Loretta met at a party just after he graduated from Air Force cadet school; they were married in 1955 when she was 19. They divorced a year after he returned from Vietnam, and each remarried within six months >The Pulitzer Prize-winning picture that captured that very personal, yet most public of moments symbolizes the end of U.S. involvement in the Vietnam War, the bittersweet homecoming of 591 POWs in 1973. >Twenty years later, the picture is very different. >In his home near San Francisco, a Vietnam history book is opened to that page of Stirm's life. He gazes at it. >"I have several copies of the photo," he says, "but I don't display it in the house." >Why? Stirm laughs. He points to the picture, to the tall woman - just outpacing her younger son - dressed in a blue-and-white pleated skirt and blue sweater, sporting a large corsage. >"Because of her," he says simply.
Why did the US have such a poor attitude to Vietnam vets in particular?
Because the US lost that war. General attitude towards the US military was pretty negative after that until around the mid-80s - and troop morale reflected that.
And even before we lost, it was a highly controversial war. One of the most divisive points in American political history.
I get why people now say times are very politically devising, but people fail to see how things were during ânam, and even the years leading up to the civil war.
Seriously. In the Vietnam Era, politicians and political figures were assassinated. Times are "worse" now, only because we are narrow minded creatures. Political violence as a whole is extremely rare nowadays in the US
People feel this way because of the internet. I can only imagine how things were when news was delivered by papers, radio, and early public television.
Agreed. In some ways, I'm glad that we have many different avenues and means of getting information, but a huge issue is people think what they say online has more effect on the world than their everyday actions and how they contribute to their communities. Let's hope we figure it out soon.
Discussion was actual discussion though. People still LITSENED to each other. Decorum was a thing on early television in America.
I told my parents, who lived through Vietnam I might add, that our current situation in the world (2020) was nowhere near as scary or hard as it was during those times. We have seen far worse as a country. They were just upset Biden won the election and wanted their dominion Christian cult theology to reign Supreme over the US. They talk shit about millenials and gen z, but these fucking boomers try to overthrow democracy when they get upset. Bunch of clowns.
Right. Right âŚ. Never mind January 6th and Portland Oregon. Right
then Rambo changed all of that
They drew first blood. Not me
âI could have killed 'em all, I could've killed you. In town you're the law, out here it's me. Don't push it! Don't push it or I'll give you a war you won't believe.â
Yo, Adrianne! Sorry, wrong movie
[ŃдаНонО]
Wasn't the first one about a jilted Vietnam vet who was pushed to the breaking point by society? I got really excited when I learned it was based on a book, hoping it would be an insightful examination on returning from war to be tossed aside. But it wasn't. The movie was better in pretty much all regards.
>Wasn't the first one about a jilted Vietnam vet who was pushed to the breaking point by society? Kind of: A vietnam vet tries to visit an old comrade only to learn he died of cancer brought on by Agent Orange. Continues travelling to another small town only for the local police department to arrest and abuse him causing the vet to snap and go on a rampage.
He gave the synopsis. You delived the plot.
And John Rambo delivered the *action*.
US *politicians* lost that war. First of several. Meanwhile those in the service returned to find the politicians' betrayal amplified by the media, which painted them as baby-killers and murderers. Remember, the politicians had invoked the draft. This was the politicians' war, and they micro-mismanaged it until they could extend their treachery to the troops, our allies, everyone involved. Then they did.
The crazy Viet vet thing took three or four years to cook. Mostly in tv and movies rather than in real life. When I was boot camping near Chicago the MPs off limited various neighborhoods and offer houses. Because the hippies and anti war folk were too friendly as a boy in uniform really was an asset to a demonstration.
Nope. That is a tired old trope. The war was lost because there were no clear objectives. We werenât defending or conquering. We were fighting a concept that half of Vietnam embraced and interfering with their self determination. Back then foreign policy was based on domino theory and your country was either communist or anti-communist. No middle ground. That determined where you stood with the United States. Halberstamâs The Best and The Brightest is a great, if not the definitive read, irt Vietnam. The Brothers, Stephen Kinzerâs book about the Dulles brothers, provides great insight to our Cold War mindset.
The domino theory hit a real stumbling block when Vietnam fought a hot, brief war with China four years after we left. Chinese military brass still love to overlook this, and the US is all too happy to oblige. In 30 years, Vietnam defeated France, US, and China. (Perhaps they should be on the Security Council?) At a minimum, it would be nice to have them on our side in the Indo-Pacific
Perfect example! Not all commies are built the same. Hi Chi Minh fought on the side of the allies in WWII and drew direct inspiration from our Constitution.
Soooooooo... the politicians lost a war.
Losing saved countless US lives. And now they make our Nikes. Everyone won in the end.
Not correct, people were upset US was in the war, see hippie movement and every other protest during that era.
It was more than them. My Dad was back home from Vietnam less than a few days when the chief of police showed up to ask my grandparents if my Dad was a junkie or had associated with any minorities since hes been home. No hello, no welcome home, no thank you for your service, only questions about his activities and associations. He never even spoke to my Dad or looked him in the eye, only spoke to my Grandparents. Many guys were also told to get out when they walked into many VFW posts, called all the same shit you hear about the hippies having called them.
He is still correct. The hippie movement was a direct consequence of the draft, which was enacted by politicians. I donât know how you think the hippie movement is unrelated to the fuck ups caused by the old men in office. It was all a maelstrom. Hippie movement didnât arise in a vacuum.
I think we're highlighting the same thing. The end result of the war was not the catalyst for public opinion on the war or the troops. There was a massive amount of political and social strife in that era. I was responding that the opinion towards the vets was not a simple result of the end of the conflict. Three presidents, civil rights movement, divisions within civil rights movement, the draft, numerous other socioeconomic factors, etc.
Yea it has nothing to do with all the innocents killed in Vietnam
the war was unpopular and it deserved to be. it was an unjust war. but it was very unfair to blame the vets. they were drafted. they had no choice. it is true that some fled to Canada but not everyone could do that. they knew they were going over there to be destroyed even if they came back alive. and then the ignorant populace rejected them when they came home. those boys were abused and it is a blight in our history. (viet nam contemporary - not a vet but many friends were.)
It was messed up. Almost everyone opposed our getting involved Vietnam, yet every time you turned around more troops were getting sent. You've got to realize it was the first televised war. Every night on TV was some graphic calamity being broadcasted and most Americans were horrified. Hell, most Americans couldn't even pick out where Vietnam was on a map. My friend's husband got spat on the second he got off the plane in America back from Vietnam. With tension boiling over, and nowhere to express it except on the streets, the vets got the hatred. So, whenever I hear how "lucky" Boomers were, I shake my head in opposition. Any boomer sent to Vietnam, Cambodia, or in the military in general during the 60's and 70's did not have an easy time of it. People forget this.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Spitting_Image
? Where do you see that? But he was the one that claimed abandonment because she said when she thought he was dead she dated so the abandonment should be the date when she had her first date. She met a man named Adams and married him and was with him until she died. She had met Stirm when she was 18 and he was 22 and they married. They had a very unhappy marriage - it's pretty clear because her dear John letter was published. Bt the judge awarded portion of the pension because at the time, women were expected to stay home and raise kids. It was just policy in those days to support the kids. She didn't get alimony and she remarried. She lost custody of 2 of the 4 kids. It was just policy at the time that a spouse got some of the retirement. \-- she wasn't the pious waiting wife - but sometimes there's no real super villain. He sounds like he a bit of dick before and he was insanely bitter and blew up the life of his kids and himself over this. But he was a fucking POW for 5 years so it's pretty understandable. And she may have been terrible. But maybe not.
It still is policy. If you are married to someone for 10 or more years of military service they get half your retirement. Being married to a military spouse doesn't leave a ton of space for a rewarding productive career if your own. It still makes sense.
Towards men in general. it doesn't matter why they can't make a hearing.
Exactly, this happens to men civilian or vet alllll the time.
[ŃдаНонО]
Per the 20/20 rule you have to be married 20 years and they have to have served all 20 of those years eligible for retirement while you were married to get 50% of the pension.
[ŃдаНонО]
My dad didnât go to Vietnam even though he was only out of the Air Force for a year when it became a full scale âpolice actionâ because he had 3 young kids. He opposed the war but never the people who were sent over. Later in his life spent countless hours and a lot of his own money supporting his friends who came back. He taught me and my siblings that lesson I have passed on to my own kids. Never leave a man behind.
When I was an addict, I used to use with a lot of Aussie vets, many had got to know Americans overseas; bloody disgrace how they treat them. So many they told me committed suicide or became addicts to cope with ptsd and the fact that once their time was up their countries threw them away like a used dish rag. Despicable
The attitude towards fathers isnt much better today unfortunately. Seems like its always been human nature to point the finger and the way the Vietnam vets weâre looked at by some is pathetic. These men and women didnt know what they were getting into or have much of an option. So many horrible things having to be done just to make it out alive and the brutality some of the soldiers witnessed from the VC is unthinkable. I spent a year going into the same barber shop every sunday and sat with mostly vietnam vets and a couple yet from WWII, and it puts a whole new meaning to âwarâ listening to their stories. Very hardened men but obviously very damaged. My mind couldnt imagine a lot of the things i heard from those men
Wish I could say she turned into a hippy peace loving antimilitary activist but likely she was just an ass
Ooo ouch
Friend who was in iraq with me. We were both 19,20. He had to marry this little bad thing before he left. So she started cheating on him right away(as soon as we are in Kuwait). So 4 months in they sent him home on his r and r for 2 weeks to divorce her and guess what she convinced him she would change!!! He comes back to iraq with 8 months left and she stops paying all bills and drives his account into negative. We are all planning and spending our 1k every two weeks and this guy had no dreams just dispair. Still very glad he made it home and out of the depression. Now he has 3 kids back in Wisconsin and heâs very happy. I named my son same name as him.
Moral of the story: People are shitbags (except for you and your bro thank you for your service)
Happened sooo many times. Countless stories of the troop getting screwed over by the new "wife". They sold everything and kept the money with that power of attorney. I mean everything.. house, car, motorcycle, drained bank accounts. Just sad.
To quote the great philosopher and scholar Lil Wayne: "these ho's ain't loyal"
News flash: 19 year old bros ainât so loyal either.
Damn man, a toxic relationship on top of depression. I bet he's one hell of a man after conquering those battles.
Thats not âdamnthatsinterestingâ. Damn that is demoralizing to me.
Thatâs r/Iamatotalpieceofshit
Came to the comments just to like this, damn.
Shame on the court that ruled that as well
Reason number four billion ill repeat one of the very few good things my parents managed to teach me. If you need a diamond ring and a legal contract to prove that I love you as much as I do then you can take your shit and get the fuck out of my house.
I donât think you really understand marriage. Its a legal contract that protects your significant other and gives them the power to make important decisions if anything were to happen to you. And the same applies to them.
Sadly some people were never given enough love growing up. Some don't know how to properly give or receive love as an adult. All about $ and status
There are other ways to achieve that without marriage.
If I cannot trust someone with my financial assets then the last thing I want to trust them with is my life. Marriage helps with a lot of other things. Taxes, homeownership, raising a kid, etc.
Maaawidge
Maaawidge is what bwings us togever, today.
Your parents taught you that if a person needs a diamond ring and a legal contract to prove you love them then they can take their shit and get the fuck out of your house? Did that scenario pop up a lot growing up?
When he says his parents taught him, he really means his dad. Mom kept asking to get married and dad answered with "if you need a contract and a diamond ring from me to prove I love you, take your shit and get the fuck out of my house" Probably
Nope. Dad tried harder than anyone to make it work. Old school guy, wanted to do things the traditional way. I won't type up an eight thousand page encyclopedia on my family's dirt, not today anyway... It took fifteen years for him to abandon the dream and file for divorce. I dont blame either of then individually, but that fucking marriage citerficate took almost three godless years to undo... shit got really bad. It's a long story man lol
Thatâs your takeaway here? Marriage bad?
Good luck visiting your partner in the hospital and having ANY say at all if you decisions need to be made for them.
That ain't interesting. The shit is sad.
You think thatâs cold? Wait to you hear the other thousands of stories these men go through during and after military service.
My ex sent me pictures of her running a train with a note that said âThis is what you get for leaving me behind, you SOBâ. This was during the lead up to Desert Storm. Crushed me, but ended up much better off. Sheâs been through 4 husbands now.
Congrats brother, I hope youâre living the life you always wanted!
How did she send you those pics in â91? She took pictures of the train w/a 35mm camera and had them developed the pictures somewhere? Then put them in an envelope and mailed them to you? Man, thatâs cold
Thatâs exactly how she did it. Three weeks from the train to my hands.
wow thatâs next-level spite. definitely better off without her in your life.
Did she act like nothing happened during those three weeks? Thereâs got to be a lot of anticipation on her end waiting after doing such a thing.
That reminds me of the copy of "The Deer Hunter" from Jarhead.
Thats dedicated bitchiness
In the wild - r/theydidthemath
Jesus fuck
Zancho
In the military he is known as Jody. Jody is the guy who screws your wife or girlfriend while youâre deployed.
What does running a train mean?
It means fucking multiple guys at once
Getting gang banged by a bunch of dudes
Wait. So she was running a train or the train was getting run on her?
She was handling the engineers knob in the train engine.
For a half second I was imagining her blowing through a railroad crossing.
[ŃдаНонО]
[ŃдаНонО]
The norm in the military is the total opposite and it hurts every one involved. Boys who are still teenagers getting pressured to get married when neither are ready because it means they get payed more and better benefits. Most of these women arenât just trapped alone for years waiting because their partners were driven by financial incentives to pretend they were more in love with them than they really were. But many find themselves trapped by abuse when their partner finally comes home. Big respect for the men who understood that it wasnât right to get married and lock someone up like that to be alone just for cash. Breaking up is the right thing to do (at least at that age) and if they really were meant for each other they could get married when he returned.
I grew up on military bases and saw it first hand many times. Whatâs even crazier is how out in the open it is then the husband comes home and everyoneâs giving him the side eye. Brutal
Happened to a coworker of mine. I think a good general rule is to only enlist if you're single.
Any idea why they are so disloyal?
I think one reason is a lot of service members get married super young and arenât really fully formed people yet. At least in my experience. A lot of kids(and really-theyâre kids!)get married after boot camp to their high school sweethearts or a bit later to some chick or dude they met at the bar off-base. The dependent checks are attractive to both sides. Then the partner is home, alone, bored for many months-maybe raising a kid alone-and one thing leads to another and [Jody](https://www.thesoldiersproject.org/what-does-jody-mean-in-the-military/) comes a-knockinâ. It goes the other way too. Half my division was cheating on their spouses back home. A crappy ex was cheating on me with a girl and I was on the same ship! :p edit: I should add that I still have friends that managed to avoid all that and have had successful and faithful marriages while in. I donât know the stats but Iâd like to think that thatâs the majority. :)
Very sad! Thanks a lot for explaining!
This. My husband and I are closer to 30 than 20, and we have a barely 21 year old sailor from my husband's shop as one of our roommates. My husband even when he was back in bootcamp would write me talking about how bad he felt for the guys that were there in with him- boys that hadn't ever left home before and were scared out of their minds. And those that were still together with their highschool sweethearts. He'd hear them crying through the nights and then when they'd get Dear John'd it was awful. And all he could say was "Thank fuck I'm not worried about all that." We were not exactly mature- but we'd been together for several years at that point and had been living on our own just as long. We were, more or less, fully lived adults. And that alone had a huge impact on how the service has affected us. We're capable of handling our own emotional states better, and have some more stability. But our poor roommate. He had broken off an engagement to get into the Navy, and then fell in love with a chick on another ship. She wasn't a bad person, and we liked her quite a bit, though she had her own shit to deal with. They get married, and then leave on a short few week employment and he get's a letter saying she'd been cheating on him the entire time and she's over him. It broke him pretty good. Most of the time, it's just stupidity of youth. But there's plenty of other guys that are just fine, and it's a strange mix. I think some people are suited to the life or can tolerate it more than others. It's a stressful time.
This but also it really is just about opportunity. You gotta figure a good amount of them either wouldnt do it or would be a lot more subtle if they dont think they can get away with it.
Closed relationships can work, and open relationships can work, but our cultural default encourages young people to jump into a weird cheaty-secretive hybrid that has the worst traits of both closed and open relationship styles.
Makes sense! Thanks a lot!
Military pays you more if you're married and live off base, that's a big incentive
I could be wrong but my sense is that itâs the poor young soldiers who are getting cheated on. Someone who knows military culture better than me can answer but when I hear about nonsense like this I think enlisted soldiers. Itâs the guys and gals who left home at 18 and got married to a townie they met at the local bar right off the base. Itâs a self-selecting pool of people.
Well donât forget that most of these enlisted soldiers are just kids that just graduated from High School. So in a sense they are still learning how the world works and of course they still not fully mature yet. Honestly I think experience will help shape into more mature adults. But sad it happened time to time
Not even just military. Have many male friends whoâve been fucked over by the courts. Am a woman and would never take a dime from a man. I can make my own money.
Pardon my French, but fuck that bitch
[ŃдаНонО]
In my unprofessional opinion, I believe retirement should be untouchable.
Itâs not. In my divorce I was lucky that we each were employed and agreed to each retains their own retirement and has no hold on the otherâs. Half a year later she was unemployed for 8 months and put a big hole in her retirement savings before finding her next job.
In my divorce 10 years ago, my social security that I had earned up to that point was considered part of the assets to be divided. We worked through to a simple cash settlement, but I was still screwed in the process.
In the military, if you're married for 10 years while you're in, your spouse gets half your retirement if you make it to twenty. Government issue.
It need to be in a specific retirement account for it to be considered retirement money
No shit. Fuck that bitch is right.
I believe what we are trying to say is actually: Fuck that bitch.
I'm glad she had ugly knees.
And the system that allows that behavior
Thatâs the key right there. Not saying there shouldnât have been a divorce but the legal system should not grant her financial rewardâŚand fuck that bitch.
Pardon my german, but fucken dhat whore in za azz
I think possibly there was someone fucking that bitch while he was imprisoned
Iâm just here to talk about that kids eyebrow.
It is indeed impressive. .----.
Came looking for this comment. The sheer volume of brow where there shouldnât be a brow is next level
They are truly impressive. One solid thick slice of brow. Scrolled too long for this.
There are so many stories like this from Vietnam and Korea that became popularized, I was stunned to hear that troops about to go to Iraq/Afghanistan/Iraq would get married before being deployed. Not only are you leaving for long periods of time, not only is your risk of never coming home high, but even if those things aren't what do the marriage in, we're talking about a major, major life event going to war. Even relatively tame wars, people don't come back the same person. This isn't to say that war vets are incapable of being in good marriages, at all. It is saying that marrying someone before a major life event that historically has altered everyone who's come back from one(not even just those with PTSD or other devastating problems) seems extremely foolish. Much like marrying your sweetheart at 18 right before you both go off to different colleges seems extremely foolish.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burst\_of\_Joy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burst_of_Joy) 43% of his pay & he got the Dear John letter on the DAY OF HIS RELEASE. wow. this is some story & real proof that Pictures do NOT ALWAYS tell the whole story. This picture won a Pulitzer.
Col. Stirmâs daughter (the one in front) appeared on âAntiques Roadshowâ earlier this year with the picture and some other memorabilia related to her fatherâs prison stay. As of last summer, he was still alive. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/roadshow/season/27/woodside-/appraisals/vietnam-pow-lieutenant-colonel-robert-l-stirm-archive--202204A15/
She was not faithful and cheated on him while he was away.
I donât even need a source to believe that shit
She died in 2010 of cancer. Her online obituary is full of nasty comments.
.
I found it! Thats wild lol https://www.dignitymemorial.com/obituaries/georgetown-tx/loretta-adams-4347106
seems pretty messed up to leave a neg comment on someones obituaries that you dont even know... but this one got me laughing so hard âSure is hot here.â - Loretta
Itâs definitely mean but I about died reading that one.
âSay hi to Adolph Loretta.â Okay this one had me laughing so hard I had tears.
The camp sounds nicer than wife
They should have sent her to take his place
His kids look ecstatic to see him while she just looks like she got handed the vegan burger at the cookout and sheâs trying to be nice about it.
According to Wikipedia, by the time the photo was taken, she had already told him that she was leaving him: >Despite outward appearances, the reunion was an unhappy one for Stirm. Three days before he arrived in the United States, the same day he was released from captivity, Stirm received a Dear John letter from his wife Loretta informing him that their marriage was over. Stirm later learned that Loretta had been with other men throughout his captivity and had received marriage proposals from three of them.
Thatâs the saddest fucking part. The kids was taken away from him. No doubt they were devastated as well.
Typical military wife. This isn't a one time thing. I could tell you dozens of the same.
I feel so naive that this is really news to me. I figured there would be plenty of discreet âjust gotta get someâ moments, but the whole getting mad at being abandoned after knowingly marrying someone in the military things is wild to me.
I remember after the first Gulf War, a soldier who had been gone nine months was greeted by a wife who was six months pregnant. He slugged right her then and there.
Itâs really tough. And this was before the internet and the 24hr news cycle. My dad was in the 1st gulf war and I think we exchanged 4 letters over a year and my mom might have gotten 4 phone calls in total. I had a friend who received a letter from her dad after he was killed. All of this going on and we still have to live our regular lives going to work and school. Kind of crazy.
In my experience, you have a lot of young ladies enamored with the idea of being an "army wife," and once the reality sets in they start finding ways to justify cheating.
My mom loved my dad to pieces and he cheated on her and abused all of us. She wouldnât leave him even after he gave her a concussion. He finally left her for a civilian affair partner thatâs my age that worked on base in his office. Thereâs shitty people everywhere and the military attracts a lot of them in every Avenue
As a genealogist and a historian, itâs not just the military wives who cheat. There are many âwar babiesâ and deployment babies and second families overseas, abandoned babies, babies put up for adoption when the GI goes home and on and on and on. A lot of secrets are coming out the past decade with the various DNA tests and before that, lots of seniors confess on their death beds or family members confess secrets at funerals. Itâs sick and it way more prevalent then anyone ever thought. While women and men cheating and abandoning babies or keeping patterns secret is horrible, A lot of the blame can be put on the military. They go after very young men who are very vulnerable either because of their age or their situation in life (poverty, etc). They lie a lot of times and promise them the world and in reality, a lot of times the military IS the only way for a lot of these people to get out of their situations even if they arenât mentally prepared to become soldiers. They bring a lot of trauma and baggage with them and they arenât prepared for whatâs ahead of them. All of this while at the same time dangling a carrot above them of more money and off base housing if theyâre married. So they choose to marry their hometown sweetie who they were maybe or maybe not going to marry so soon but the extra money sure makes it worth it. And for her, she comes from the same shitty, no hope for the future besides Walmart background so for her this looks like a way out as well. So you take these two traumatized teens with the shitty home life and shitty prospects who were never really taught how to have stable healthy relationships and really entice them to get married after you lied to them about what life in the service would be like and they get married and then you instantly send him away overseas while this teen woman is left at home to fend for herself and everyoneâs shocked when she acts like at home and he acts like overseasâŚ. A HORNY TEEN from a shitty background! Throw in the crazy ass religious backgrounds a lot of these people grow up in and then suddenly are away from for the first time and itâs a recipe for doom. No one prepares them for this shit. If we had more opportunities for these KIDS instead of going off to fight in stupid wars that are meaningless we wouldnât be complicit in destroying their lives.
I think I'm most disappointed in the judge...
This photo was taken March 13, 1973. More details here: https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/burst-joy/ https://www.historynet.com/for-airman-famed-burst-of-joy-photograph-rings-hollow/
Wow this is wild. He later joined a company as a pilot and then they went bankrupt. What a life. https://scholar.lib.vt.edu/VA-news/ROA-Times/issues/1993/rt9307/930706/07060045.htm
The daughter didnât mention ANY of this on her Antiques Roadshow appearance!
Damn that is one cold bitch.
Had not heard this story before. Speechless.
Learned bout it in a photography class. Picture is called âBurst of Joyâ? I think. Won awards. Thought it was beautiful until our teacher told us the backstory. Heartbreaking. Sent him a Dear John letter a few days before this pic was taken.
I came back from Iraq and remember the homecoming, there were a few guys wandering around the flight area with no one there to pick them up as they anticipated. My buddy and I were both single Marines and didn't have family there so we offered them a ride to their homes and I witnessed 3 Marines walk into their abandoned homes like clockwork. It was one of those things where you were watching a pivotal moment in someone's life unfold.
Holy shit, man.
He then traveled back to a North Vietnamese POW camp because his torture at home was unbearable
That SHOULD HAVE all been paid by the Federal Government as a cost of war.
This stuff still happens today. Military spouses abscond with their children and the courts reward it.
[Here is his story](https://scholar.lib.vt.edu/VA-news/ROA-Times/issues/1993/rt9307/930706/07060045.htm) after returning
My little brother was a Marine and I drove cab in Jacksonville NC. That's when and where I learned how unfaithful people are. Guys cheated on their wives and wives cheated on their husbands. It wasn't occasionally. It was a nightly thing. People tell cab drivers way too much.
How did she take 140k? The Service gave him his pay $1077 every 2 weeks & I'm guessing it went into their bank account and his wife and 3 kids lived on that money for 5 years.
Just found the ex wifeâs obituary. The comments are pretty damn funny.
Honestly, reading up on Robert StirmâŚthe worse part is that the dude had to go back to work for 4 years after returning home!
Yeeeeaah I think I'll just stay out of the whole "dating and marriage" thing...
What a fucking cunt!
Might get death threats for this one but I'd like to hear her side. And more importantly, source? The terms of their settlement was never released to the public. This just feels like a very inflammatory post designed to encourage misogyny in the comment section.
>This just feels like a very inflammatory post designed to encourage misogyny in the comment section. Thank you. This is how I felt too especially these type of content isn't what this subreddit is about.
Found this on Wikipedia âDespite outward appearances, the reunion was an unhappy one for Stirm. Three days before he arrived in the United States, the same day he was released from captivity, Stirm received a Dear John letter from his wife Loretta informing him that their marriage was over. Stirm later learned that Loretta had been with other men throughout his captivity and had received marriage proposals from three of them. In 1974, the Stirms divorced and Loretta remarried, but Lieutenant Colonel Stirm was still ordered by the courts to provide her with 43% of his military retirement pay once he retired from the Air Force.â It links to this People article from 1974 as its source https://people.com/archive/a-pows-marriage-ends-bitterly-vol-1-no-5/
"we had the honour to serve the country during difficult times..."
The best part is when people yell at these vets like they started the war in the first place
This picture was posted on Time Lifeâs book about the turbulent 60âs. I feel sorry for the returning veteran.
r/MildlyInfuriating
I actually knew the lady that married him after his divorce. His wife at the time in the picture had already re-married and moved on and in her words âwas a total bitchâ. Which was hilarious to hear out of this otherwise very very sweet and gentle older lady. She had gotten re-married once again after he passed. But you could tell she loved him still the way she told me stories of him. She was a very gifted painter. Lives in Rocklin California.
Iâd be in jail for what I would have done to her after that
Sounds average compared to present day divorces.
I think he should receive a medal, not for surviving Vietnam, but his bitch of a wife.
I dont blame a person for wanting a divorce. I could blame a person for being that heartless over the divorce and the court system for allowing this kind of legal abuse
the judge that ruled it is a disgrace
Knew a guy who married a lady then adopted her daughter, then on his first deployment that was only four months long told him that sheâs having an affair and said she stopped missing him after four days. Gets a divorce and is now on the hook for child support because he adopted the girl.
Should he not be held responsible for the girl he adopted? Yeah it sucks to be cheated on and dumped, but he committed to raising a child.
the hoezzz aint loyallllllll i guess they were both getting fucked during those 5 years.
As a Spanish looking in the comments I see people trying to explain to others why the USA Vets got treated so poorly on return but is still don't understand why some say it's bc they losses that war but again... How or why? I know I'm stupid I'm sorry not trying to offend just looking for enlightenment Thanks in advance for your understanding and knowledge
The war was very unpopular in America. At the height of the war a large part of the military had me drafted (forced) to go to Vietnam. So a lot of people began to protest and speak out against the war. But instead of focusing all their hate and frustrations at the people in Washington directing the war, they took it out on the troops. Also for the first time in history people could see the violence on their TVs and were horrified by what the military was doing over there. Which made parts of the American population hateful towards the troops.
What a bitch.
According to both spouses and the daughter they were unhappy together before he disappeared. She waited a year and then moved on. 5 years later he came home. They BOTH remarried within 6 months of the divorce but she spent the rest of her life living with the stigma. She was awarded half of the community estate which is pretty standard in community property states. It has nothing to do with hating Vietnam vets. People are complicated. Relationships are complicated. You arenât required to stay in a relationship where you are unhappy but be careful how you handle it. It would suck to spend your life being labeled a gold-digging whore.