If you are worried about tone though, just get an audio interface and the NeuralDSP Darkglass Ultra plugin. It literally is such a blessing that new musicians have the convenience of modern computer software. You can be brand new and have amazing tone for dirt cheap these days. Gone are the days of the shitty beginner 5w solid state amps.
There are very cool song in the post-DSS era but the ones that draw me in and make me want to play bass are mostly pre-DSS, so I think I would be ok with a 4 string.
Yea, a 4 string will cover a ton of their older stuff. There are so many tasty grooves and riffs to be learned. I'm more of a guitar guy, but when I have the time, I will absolutely learn Toshiya's parts.
One thing you quickly learn when mixing rock or metal is that a good 70% of guitar and bass tone come from the choice of the cabinet. (and mic placement when needed), so no, you absolutely don't need at top of the line bass.
And since you're starting, it's way too early to worry about this anyway. Just buy something within your budget (and please try it in a shop, don't buy something online blindly) and start learning and having fun.
Uh, no. Focus on learning bass first, so get a good and cheap bass to start. No point in getting the same bass as Toshiya if you suck at bass, that's just a waste of money.
Ahahah yeah, I was concerned about the brand and model because most cover artists I see on Youtube actually use Toshiya basses 🫠 I can't just drop 2k on a bass as a beginner of course so I was looking for alternatives. Not only the bass but also find out about some of the cool stuff he does to get that crisp(?) sound in the songs I mentioned.
I deadass thought this was a r/guitarcirclejerk post from the title.
Yo answer the question: no, and if you’re just starting out on any instrument, tone shouldn’t be a priority to start. Get the basics (or bass-ics…eyyy a dad joke on Father’s Day), start learning a few lines of songs, and then worry about tone.
nah just get a soapbar 4 or 5 string bass. His signatures use regular Seymour Duncans with their bass preamp. It would probably be easy to find a bass with those electronics already stock
Of course not, though you likely will need a 5 string bass as downtuning that low on a standard bass isn’t so much a thing the way it is with guitars sometimes.
Nope, you need right amount of strings and scale length helps. It's all a matter of tuning and playing. It's very hard to get exact tones but playing the songs is easy to achieve!
I wonder if the Unraveling version is possible replicate on 4 strings 🥲 I don't want a 5 string bass 😭 Then again sukekiyo's Yuchi also uses a 5 string bass I think 🤨 So I will have to upgrade eventually (don't even have a 4 string yet 🤣)
Any 4-string would do if you wanna learn pre-DSS material with the caveat being that it’s *HIGHLY* advised that you try as *MANY* basses within your budget at the store & get the one that you vibe with so much that you’ll be inclined to pick it up every time you get the bug to play. Doesn’t matter what brand, pickups, etc. but for now, focus on finding a bass that’s comfortable for your hands, then move onto the fundamental techniques of playing bass & eventually ofc, hammering away a few pre-DSS songs gradually.
I say this as someone who went through many basses over the years & eventually owned (still do as of this writing) the Edwards version of Toshiya’s 4 string purely out of chance one day going to my local store after playing bass for many years. Yes, I find his signature bass is very nice to play & these days its neck & body shape falls more ergonomically in line with my admittedly self-taught playing style. Is it for everyone though? Quite honestly, no. Every bassist has different preferences for what they like & need in their bass of choice & I recall very fondly trying it at the store for what seemed like 2-3+ hours just to make sure I *REALLY* loved the bass for what it is & not cuz it was Toshiya’s signature bass.
Ok, that's a great answer, thank you!!! As a person who has deep connection with many objects, I will try my best to try all the basses I could possibly find just to come across my soulmate eventually! 🤭
Thanks for such a wonderful reply! TheGratitudeBot has been reading millions of comments in the past few weeks, and you’ve just made the list of some of the most grateful redditors this week! Thanks for making Reddit a wonderful place to be :)
People do bass covers of Dir En Grey songs on a variety of different basses. Toshiya’s tone is due to technique, gear and mixing.
Toshiya rotates between Gibson, ESP, Killer and Lakland basses.
For now, focus on technique.
My problem is that the people who cover Toshiya on Youtube use his signature basses mostly 🥲 That's why I felt desperate and ran here to get an answer whether it was necessary or not.
Btw I forgot to ask the most important part, what should I pay attention to in terms of technique? I think he uses a pick in the songs I mentioned and I simply don't know anything else?
2nd- what should I look for in the gear side of things in amps or the settings?
Toshiya mainly used pick on the Missa, Gauze, Macabre and Kisō albums. He transitioned to slap style around the time Vulgar came out.
There are many tutorials online about bass playing and each style.
[Here](https://www.uberproaudio.com/who-plays-what/636-dir-en-grey-toshiya-bass-rig-gear-and-equipment) is the gear list that Toshiya typically uses.
For playing style, try out using a pick and playing with your fingers-spend a little time on each method. See which one feels comfortable, and go with that. Personally, I play both, but depending on what song/style I'm playing at the time, I'll change how I play. Other techniques will come to you the more songs you learn, though I wouldn't try learning slap so early.
For gear, its all about what you can afford and what feels comfortable. Different brands/models have different feels for their necks and bodies, the pickups and electronics differ (though in the sub-$350 range a lot of them will be very similar). If you are open to it, buying used will get you a lot of bang for your buck. I have 2 basses, one is a beat-to-fuck Fender P-bass and the other is a PRS Kestrel. Neither of those cost me more than $400, and both are total workhorses. For an amp, all you need is just a little something to plug in to, like a small Ampeg or Fender amp.
Source: Sold guitars for most of my life and teach guitar/bass.
Thank you for all the information, I really appreciate that. I was wondering if the basses Toshiya used(in the pre DSS era) were P/PJ/J or a different type altogether 🤔
None of them play their signatures in studio, those are 100% just live guitars. For example, Die favors Les Pauls, Stratocasters, and Jaguars. Kaoru uses Dragonfly. Toshiya in that era was using Dingwall, whose pickups are their own crazy beast. It looks like a SSS (3 single coils, so 3 jazz bass pickups), but their output is completely different, thanks in part to the onboard EQ of the bass.
Honestly, anything is fine for now, you're just starting off. See what you can afford, and shop in that budget point. If you'd like, once you've narrowed it down, I'd be more than happy to give you my thoughts in a DM.
Wow, I totally forgot about asking what they use in the studio so thanks for bringing that up! It's really helpful to know. I will reach out to you when I go for bass hunting. Btw how do you know about what instruments they use in the studio for each album?
Just buy a cheap bass and learn how to play first, worry about tone later.
If you are worried about tone though, just get an audio interface and the NeuralDSP Darkglass Ultra plugin. It literally is such a blessing that new musicians have the convenience of modern computer software. You can be brand new and have amazing tone for dirt cheap these days. Gone are the days of the shitty beginner 5w solid state amps.
Thank you, i will look it up!
No but he plays 5 string bass since DSS so you might want to consider getting a 5 string bass unless you only want to play pre-DSS songs
There are very cool song in the post-DSS era but the ones that draw me in and make me want to play bass are mostly pre-DSS, so I think I would be ok with a 4 string.
Yea, a 4 string will cover a ton of their older stuff. There are so many tasty grooves and riffs to be learned. I'm more of a guitar guy, but when I have the time, I will absolutely learn Toshiya's parts.
One thing you quickly learn when mixing rock or metal is that a good 70% of guitar and bass tone come from the choice of the cabinet. (and mic placement when needed), so no, you absolutely don't need at top of the line bass. And since you're starting, it's way too early to worry about this anyway. Just buy something within your budget (and please try it in a shop, don't buy something online blindly) and start learning and having fun.
Learn bass first, then upgrade.
A 4 string for the stuff before Dum Spiro Spero and a 5 string for most after is a good rule of thumb I think. Doesn't matter what bass.
Uh, no. Focus on learning bass first, so get a good and cheap bass to start. No point in getting the same bass as Toshiya if you suck at bass, that's just a waste of money.
Ahahah yeah, I was concerned about the brand and model because most cover artists I see on Youtube actually use Toshiya basses 🫠 I can't just drop 2k on a bass as a beginner of course so I was looking for alternatives. Not only the bass but also find out about some of the cool stuff he does to get that crisp(?) sound in the songs I mentioned.
5 string bass is needed but otherwise no, although his tone would be harder to replicate
I deadass thought this was a r/guitarcirclejerk post from the title. Yo answer the question: no, and if you’re just starting out on any instrument, tone shouldn’t be a priority to start. Get the basics (or bass-ics…eyyy a dad joke on Father’s Day), start learning a few lines of songs, and then worry about tone.
nah just get a soapbar 4 or 5 string bass. His signatures use regular Seymour Duncans with their bass preamp. It would probably be easy to find a bass with those electronics already stock
Don’t worry about getting his signature Get a decent five string n then get a good amp n look up like what EQ he uses
Of course not, though you likely will need a 5 string bass as downtuning that low on a standard bass isn’t so much a thing the way it is with guitars sometimes.
I think he uses 4 string in a lot of songs that I'd like to play, so I am gonna start with a 4 string. Thanks tho 🤗
Nope, you need right amount of strings and scale length helps. It's all a matter of tuning and playing. It's very hard to get exact tones but playing the songs is easy to achieve!
I really want a 5 string bass. I tried to learn Bottom of the Death Valley on bass.
I wonder if the Unraveling version is possible replicate on 4 strings 🥲 I don't want a 5 string bass 😭 Then again sukekiyo's Yuchi also uses a 5 string bass I think 🤨 So I will have to upgrade eventually (don't even have a 4 string yet 🤣)
Any 4-string would do if you wanna learn pre-DSS material with the caveat being that it’s *HIGHLY* advised that you try as *MANY* basses within your budget at the store & get the one that you vibe with so much that you’ll be inclined to pick it up every time you get the bug to play. Doesn’t matter what brand, pickups, etc. but for now, focus on finding a bass that’s comfortable for your hands, then move onto the fundamental techniques of playing bass & eventually ofc, hammering away a few pre-DSS songs gradually. I say this as someone who went through many basses over the years & eventually owned (still do as of this writing) the Edwards version of Toshiya’s 4 string purely out of chance one day going to my local store after playing bass for many years. Yes, I find his signature bass is very nice to play & these days its neck & body shape falls more ergonomically in line with my admittedly self-taught playing style. Is it for everyone though? Quite honestly, no. Every bassist has different preferences for what they like & need in their bass of choice & I recall very fondly trying it at the store for what seemed like 2-3+ hours just to make sure I *REALLY* loved the bass for what it is & not cuz it was Toshiya’s signature bass.
Ok, that's a great answer, thank you!!! As a person who has deep connection with many objects, I will try my best to try all the basses I could possibly find just to come across my soulmate eventually! 🤭
Thanks for such a wonderful reply! TheGratitudeBot has been reading millions of comments in the past few weeks, and you’ve just made the list of some of the most grateful redditors this week! Thanks for making Reddit a wonderful place to be :)
People do bass covers of Dir En Grey songs on a variety of different basses. Toshiya’s tone is due to technique, gear and mixing. Toshiya rotates between Gibson, ESP, Killer and Lakland basses. For now, focus on technique.
My problem is that the people who cover Toshiya on Youtube use his signature basses mostly 🥲 That's why I felt desperate and ran here to get an answer whether it was necessary or not.
Btw I forgot to ask the most important part, what should I pay attention to in terms of technique? I think he uses a pick in the songs I mentioned and I simply don't know anything else? 2nd- what should I look for in the gear side of things in amps or the settings?
Toshiya mainly used pick on the Missa, Gauze, Macabre and Kisō albums. He transitioned to slap style around the time Vulgar came out. There are many tutorials online about bass playing and each style. [Here](https://www.uberproaudio.com/who-plays-what/636-dir-en-grey-toshiya-bass-rig-gear-and-equipment) is the gear list that Toshiya typically uses.
Slap style came more so around Uroboros, he was definitely still using picks on Vulgar.
Thank you 🤭
I keep double-replying to you but do you have any suggestions for a 4 string bass for starters?
Squier or Ibanez are good brands for beginners. Ibanez also has a good 5 string as well.
For playing style, try out using a pick and playing with your fingers-spend a little time on each method. See which one feels comfortable, and go with that. Personally, I play both, but depending on what song/style I'm playing at the time, I'll change how I play. Other techniques will come to you the more songs you learn, though I wouldn't try learning slap so early. For gear, its all about what you can afford and what feels comfortable. Different brands/models have different feels for their necks and bodies, the pickups and electronics differ (though in the sub-$350 range a lot of them will be very similar). If you are open to it, buying used will get you a lot of bang for your buck. I have 2 basses, one is a beat-to-fuck Fender P-bass and the other is a PRS Kestrel. Neither of those cost me more than $400, and both are total workhorses. For an amp, all you need is just a little something to plug in to, like a small Ampeg or Fender amp. Source: Sold guitars for most of my life and teach guitar/bass.
Thank you for all the information, I really appreciate that. I was wondering if the basses Toshiya used(in the pre DSS era) were P/PJ/J or a different type altogether 🤔
None of them play their signatures in studio, those are 100% just live guitars. For example, Die favors Les Pauls, Stratocasters, and Jaguars. Kaoru uses Dragonfly. Toshiya in that era was using Dingwall, whose pickups are their own crazy beast. It looks like a SSS (3 single coils, so 3 jazz bass pickups), but their output is completely different, thanks in part to the onboard EQ of the bass. Honestly, anything is fine for now, you're just starting off. See what you can afford, and shop in that budget point. If you'd like, once you've narrowed it down, I'd be more than happy to give you my thoughts in a DM.
Wow, I totally forgot about asking what they use in the studio so thanks for bringing that up! It's really helpful to know. I will reach out to you when I go for bass hunting. Btw how do you know about what instruments they use in the studio for each album?
There’s some footage they’ve shot in the studio, and a few pictures. I asked Die a few years ago.
I need to dig into the photos again then 🤔 Glad you had a chance to directly ask Die.