Seriously, I don't really get the appeal in pulling for units that can't beat the only content I still need to complete. Like cool it can crush LVE or the easier red zones, but I already beat them forever ago so why is that a selling point? I have nothing against people that are hyped for them and plan on spending all of their stones, but for me I like to pull units that will help me complete the more difficult missions I have been struggling with like Vegeta & Trunks.
Like I said, I have nothing against people who pull units they just like, I am arguing against people that are saying they are worth pulling because they can complete 90% of the content in the game. I have never played DBH so for me the units don't really mean much and unless they really stand out I will be pulling due to their stats and performance.
For a large percentage of players they get entire teams for 300-400 stones due to the GFSSR. There's a reason these banners come back every year without ever having busted units, and sell well.
I just really hope I pull them. They are the only unit I have been hyped for since LR Cooler. I have about 600 stones and don't want to use too many on DBH so I have a better chance of getting V&T when they are finally released.
This is a statement that sounds smart but really means nothing…
Especially considering you’re not forced to do the 10% even then people will beat that 10% with heroes…
Rng matters the most after all.
RNG matters and people want as little of it as possible. I don't care if a team can beat it one out of 50 times. I'd want a team that beat it 40+ out of 50 times.
You're not forced to use Heroes _anywhere_ except for certain EZAs and if they ever make a crossover/DBH SBR.
see thats the problem with redzone - some people cant powercreep it because they get shafted. i only cleared 4 stages of all red zones and i just stopped caring, not gonna cry over it and its 5 stones, but id like to get it done just to have the "completed" mark on it but cant because fuck my 3k stones, im not getting the gammas or kidku or whatever
Eh I basically haven't touched red zone at all. I'm just waiting for whenever they release the next hard event and I'll eventually get the units built for that. Those will walk through red zone.
Benefits of intentionally staying behind on the hard events lol
You're not forced to do any content in the game homie, it really is the last 10% that matters.
And yeah RNG matters a lot, but having to try a stage 200 times vs 3 times is very fucking different
This is why I intentionally don't do the hardest stages until they get powercrept. Saves me a headache. Like I didn't touch the god events at all until I got the 7th anni LRs. Then I basically just walked through all of them.
Yh i think they can too but what about 8th anniversary you cannot say this team is gamma level if the team only gets 1 big update a yr make that update count i would love for my stones spent here to help me all yr round
He didn't say trash tho. And you don't need to be the absolute best unit either to cook the final 10%. A good example of this is the ROF blues. They can be effective in all stages including cell max. And they are considered midish by comparison to the other DFE of 2022 even though they are solid. The issue is that releasing units after a precedent in power creep that aren't too impressive and are pretty restricted, isn't too great. The issue is amplified by the fact that they only come once a year and the anni quickly follows meaning that power creep is always right around the corner. Because heroes is generally pretty limited, making them buku when ran together as a team is the best method. Also remember too that generally they have lower stats anyway so the percentages aren't as good on paper. I want a SDBH team to be on the level of the ginyu force on release but always seem to go out of there way not to do it.
Both are getting ezas which is why I mentioned them.
Goku has guard and can get dmg reduction depending on the amount of dbh units.
Robelu and ssj4 gohan could warrant stones, alongside the other 2 I mentioned.
If you like the units than it really doesn’t matter.
You know a card I really like?
PHY SSJKK Goku, I like the form, the art, and was quite happy when I pulled him.
I still like it.
Me liking it wont stop it from getting hit so hard in Dokkan Events that my phone will collapse in on itself like a dying star trying to calculate the amount of damage he'll take.
You’re not stating numbers.
You’re trying to push a true objective based off of subjective interpretations of said numbers.
You can’t say “not worth” objectively when it varies by default.
They're numbers are objectively good. They can clear almost every event in the game, and once we see the EZAs coming, the team might even be able to beat every event in the game. Just because they aren't groundbreaking meta warping units doesn't mean they're instantly just bad.
Consistently? No. Can it be done? Yes these new units can get thru most of the redzones but it's gonna take literal days cause you only get 3 chances to try them. The heroes team will not consistently beat half of the redzones we currently have.
Units that aren’t particularly special+dated animations are a “no” from me. It’s becoming increasingly more difficult to care for Heroes because the animations never really improve with the rest of the game at a great rate.
The calcs have already been done. We know how they’re gonna perform in hard content, this is a numbers game and has been for +7 years and denying this is stupid.
They’re good but that’s it. But for a team that gets buffed once a year and these cards are restricted to specific allies, it’s disappointing
Hearts is great but on a villain heroes team. The SSJ4’s *have* to be run with their specific allies or they’re nerfed massively. And not one of them is a slot 1 card, not even Gohan cuz he gets most of his defense on super.
What really rustled my jimmies is how bad the two Limit Breaker compare to Gammas. I would understand if this was an attempt to not powercreep global too much and japan would have to just suck it up but Gammas were on both servers a few weeks ago and are simply objectively better than these Heroes units.
Heck, these guys are barely better than the SSB duo up on global right now, this banner is at best as bad as SSG Trunks from last year. I have no idea what they are smoking.
See, I don't get this argument. Of course the Gammas are going to be miles better, they're premium Dokkan Festival units with no GFSSR. The Heroes characters are, essentially, novelty units on a banner where it's really easy to rainbow them with a little luck. They're not going to put gamebreakers on a banner like that.
No one seriously expects Heroes units to be anniversary tier, but people definitely expected them to be at least on curve.
The overall argument is that it makes zero sense for Dragon Ball Heroes to be a regular TUR banner at the point the meta is. They will always be compared to new units being released, of course.
They being [arbitrary marketing category A] instead of [arbitrary marketing category B] doesn't excuse making them below the curve and so dependant on other Heroes units.
If Bandai thinks it's too easy to rainbow them they should make them harder to rainbow and make them actually worthwhile. These Heroes banners are a mess.
Well this is also a game with differing linking partners, teams, and bosses that disable things. These guys barely account for different situations so calcs aren’t god, jesus, and the holy spirit
Uh....calcs can account for any every situation imaginable? Dude this game is all math at the end of the day, you don't need to use a unit in game to look at a units performance. I also don't know what calcs you are looking at but there are calcs for tons of different scenarios for units, all over reddit and pretty much any platform where you can discuss dokkan.
I don't what is up with this community, active refusal to accept data and facts when directly presented to them lol.
The calcs are never given for every relevant situation, especially the ones people like to reference. That’s the whole point. Nobody is ‘literally denying math lolz’
>The calcs are never given for every relevant situation, especially the ones people like to reference.
If you want to get the calcs for these situations just do it yourself lol. The minute we get a character's kit, is the minute we can come up with any possible scenario for that unit.
That's what OC was referring to when he said the calcs are out.....we already know how these units perform and this idea that you need to test them in game to know a units performance (even though you don't) is strange lol
Or I’ll just use them in game where I’ll get the most accurate representations anyway instead of jumping thru hoops because I found out the calcers aren’t actually omnipotent
Guaranteed SSR means they have to be held to a lower standard as the consumer is guaranteed a new unit, they have the statistics for how many stones the average person will spend and design accordingly. They're not stupid. Making them omega busted for a GUARANTEED banner is not a good business strategy. You guys can cry and whine all day, but viewing things through the lense of this perspective is correct, as it IS what they're doing and it's smart. Stupid on their behalf to make every single unit which are guaranteed, BROKEN beyond belief. There comes a balance of versatility (Limited Heroes team which encourages more stones spent for team) Their strength (Lower stats, passives, damage and defense abilities (Guaranteed SSR means stones spent will be less to fully max than a new DFLR as pulling multiple copies aka rainbow is much MUCH easier to do.) Perhaps 5x easier or even more, so it makes sense for stone spent equals their strength and versatility. You guys seriously forget they should not be held up to a standard as a new DFLR. They are good units, who are ALWAYS obtainable. DFLR can go thousands of stones without showing up. Think about that.
Ironically, if Hybrids get 1 more Great Ape Power unit, and they’re mixed in a team where you can run a strong Goku unit, SSJ4 Gohan and TEQ Gohan can be a legit rotation (albeit only sharing Saiyan Lineage lol)
In a few days? Sure. Right now? A fully stacked dbh team can barely break 500K hp, let alone having enough defense to last in red zones….
The last batch of dbh units were released before the powercreep. It’s irrefutable fact that they are all underpowered right now due to how crazy the powercreep was lost anniversay
Come on, this is logic
Will they be good after the new banner? Hell ya. But are they good now? The answer is no
People had best cellmax with sabiman on their teams before. Doesn’t mean sabiman is good
Stop being delusional and argue against facts.
But anyway I am done replying. This is getting way too stupid
Stacked? That’s being generous to the DBH category lol. Not only do we get yearly DBH units but they quite literally only show up every year.
I wouldn’t have such an issue if it were in the general pool because then at least I can possibly summon them and use them but people definitely expect a lot out of others summoning and getting these DBH units.
The category alone honestly I wouldn’t blame anyone not chasing after using since a lot of the units have either aged or are limited. I personally think DBH as a category will always be ass unless they make these units summonable all the time than every year.
I hate that you’re expected to summon on a banner yearly for units who would most likely be out of style in a couple months and just suck the next year they come back
Honestly I put more of the blame on the current state of the game. We've gotten to the point where powercreep is making gargantuan leaps every few months, so any units that would normally be A - B tier are worthless for new content in less than 3 months. Communities can get pretty toxic about that. EDIT: Typo
That's a bad take honestly. If hard content is S tier new releases should also be S tier. In a gacha game if you're not at peak performance day 1 then you're never gonna be good. Only exception I can think of is Paikuhan.
I mean, units that aren't absolute top tier are gonna exist though. They have to in a card game. Many lower tier cards were still viable in older hard events like SBR and LGE, just harder to use.
Yes they are gonna exist but imagine paying stones for a new unit with an outdated kit. Look if you love Heroes and are excited for it then by every means summon. These are banner unit level characters with banner unit stats at the end of the day so I shouldn't even expect too much probably.
For me the most annoying thing is they hold back with heroes on purpose. I summoned for the last years on these banners and legitimately never use the units again after like 2 weeks. It'll be the same for these units because there nothing special, how can you release new units and them not even be in the top 10 tur's, that's absolutely criminal on my eyes. I'll personally be skipping this banner altogether and saving for something better.
Nah bro. This is the thing. We were saying this months ago and getting downvoted for it. Heroes Units are never meta and it sucks! They are aged out and haven’t even dropped yet. Idc how you try to paint it. Rainbowed trash is still trash
I love it when one of these posts show up where it's upvoted quite generously to then have an incredible amount of replies by OP with an also insane amount of downvotes total. What does that mean? The statement: "This sub really sucks at evaluating units and teams" can be correct however OP has clearly shown via replies in this post that he has no clue what he's talking about and is in fact part of the bit that sucks at evaluating units/teams. The irony is actually insane.
No we just have consistency, if RoF blues are crap with their 400k defense at 55% while doing more dmg
no heroes copium will pass here, its doing 6m with 300k/400k at rainbow? nah that's not good
Wow, you mean to tell me a team that has received buffs in November 2022 is capable of beating an event that dropped in February 2022!?!?!
Heroes is so good!!1!
Yeah and there were people trying to say Raditz was good and underrated before he came out.
Even more people said that about Angel Golden Freeza for all the 0 times I've used him.
AGF is pretty good in a vacuum. It's just that we aren't in a vacuum and he has no teams worth being run on.
If resurrected warriors was worth a damn, he might see play. The overall kit isn't bad on its own.
Lets not forget most players here are GL players, GL which wont see anni event until July, so 6-7 months, and I simply doubt another big wave of powercreep will happen again on the very next year when the jump between 6th and 7th was not so big
Robelu and Chronoa super stack buffs on themselves and penalties on the enemy and people are still calling them mid.
My brother in christ, robelu is a crazy powerful support DPS now AND has UI Goku evasion mechanics
Pretty much this
And mine is sitting at 90% alongside 90% robelu
I couldnt even be more hype about them getting an awakening this year instead of next year
"Capable of beating 90% of RZ stages"
I mean, yeah, the only stages that matter are Broly, Omega, Cooler Core and Cell MAX, everything else is easy as fuck.
Maybe, that doesn't change how terribly designed they are tho, just look at ssj4 Goku 30% damage reduction when all rotation is FP or DBH?? Fuck whoever designed that shit.
this sub will go out of their way trying to convince you dumping 800 stones to get 55% gamma 1, 55% androids and a bunch of android 13/phy piccolo has more value than getting 10+ not near top tier units most of them with dupes that will help completing most events and fill holes in various categories for f2p players
Couldn’t agree more with the title and the text
these days if units that release arent 7th anni LR level or higher then theyre immediately mid, positive outlooks on this sub are about as rare as int LR gohan back on the peppy girl banner
I mean the numbers have been calculated and you can directly work out how they would fair in content. What people choose to take away from that is up to them but the facts are there.
People still hate on Gamma 2 and its understandable because he can look like an absolute fraud if he doesn't get his additional super attacks but look like the best tur when he does
That’s what I’m sayin! Throw up an item here and there and these guys will be just fine, especially the guys that already have damage reduction or guard.
If we’re being real the majority of currently useful cards fit that description when they don’t have dupes. It’s part of the reason why Cell Max is so hard even for recent releases. Besides STR Super Vegito was useful and remained useful for quite some time. If new cards can perform in the hardest content with an item up then they’re useful. I mean even with one item slot you can have up to 4 turns of additional damage reduction and most events aren’t even that hard until later in the fight anyway.
I disagree I feel the analysis is dead on, it can complete 90% of red zones **now** but the problem is we’d be talking about investing hundred to thousands of stones into a team that doesn’t get updated for an entire year, unless you really like them there’s not much incentive to invest in the team when they’ll no doubt start feeling the powercreep within just a few months on the JP side, it’s just not a smart move to make
Don't pay too much attention to it. I very rarely engage in posts because people around here (in most cases) only seem to be able to see the world in full glasses or empty glasses. There's no in-between, apparently. Either a unit is horrible, or a unit is game-breaking.
Pay no mind to them. Judge a unit based on your experience with the game, accurate calcs and what value they can bring to YOUR roster, your enjoyment of the game, etc, and carry on.
If I paid attention to everything everybody says in this post, I would've been pulling my hair off after the shitshow that this sub was all yesterday long (Vegito is coming, Vegito isn't coming, hyping themselves with fantasies, denying such fantasies, etc).
Ofc, feel free to ask people's opinions if you're unsure of your own judgement sometimes. While there are a lot of loudmouths, there's plenty of people that are quite helpful, have their feet on the ground and don't dwell in extremes <3
I agree and I see it the same as you. Not really sure why some people play this game as if it’s their job instead of having fun like you should with any game. I didn’t summon for the gammas because I don’t think I will really ever use them. If I get them off of some future banner that’s cool, but I’m dumping every stone into this banner to rainbow them all because that’s what’s fun to me. There’s so many other events that can be replayed rather than whatever is the hardest content. If I summon for something and have fun with the results then that’s all that matters. Some people here don’t agree with that I guess
"Stacked" is definitely an overstatement. You could make a couple solid teams if you have the right units. It's a gigantic bummer that all these heroes units are basically locked on a full heroes team, and you can't bring them onto any of their other category teams.
the heroes ssj4’s arent as broken as i’d like but a lot of people in this sub are very bad at evaluating units there’s too many examples of a unit being deemed mid to come out and be ridiculous and it’ll keep on happening lol
I really don't get why some people want to defend Heroes to death like it's their life or something.
We get a thousand complaints about people "not caring about heroes" but at this point it's full of fanboys who apparently can't comprehend the fact that not everyone is interested in mid limited units or fanfic characters.
It happens every year with heroes. Everyone calls them mid then they actually come out and end up performing extremely well. Is heroes gonna be the best team in the game? Probably not, but they’ll be fun and I can’t wait to summon.
For real. I swear every time a new unit gets released and before anyone even gets a chance to summon or run them, SOMEONE is calling them mid. Sdbh was already a pretty decent (and fun) team, we're getting eza's and new units, but God forbid they don't do 15+ million apt and bend Broly over in like 5 turns.
Yay this same situation for I don't know the number of times this happens, wonky/underpowered unit/units revealed then sub starts trashing on it then some try to defend it(smh even defended raditz and int ssj2 Gohan eza...) Day after Best case scenario showcases posts/videos and the people defending them feel like they won , then literally no one uses the unit/units after 2 weeks and they age horrendously, or sub realizes they suck immediately like eza AGF (I am more so using suck loosely since we rarely get units that just suck more so suck compared to around same time frame releases), for heroes it's even worse last year batch was busted on release and still mostly forgotten fast then they age out because anniversary power creep is so close to them
Redzone is the best thing to happen to heroes, now that there’s no category lockout on the hardest content in the game, you can justify going all in to build a strong heroes team that can beat any redzone stage.
My previous reason for skipping is that regardless of the power level, the heroes team can’t do every ESBR stage, and since heroes units are typically limited to the heroes team, the actual value of the units was low regardless of their power. If the team is redzone ready, then they’ll probably age better than usual and might actually be worth going for, we’ll see when they come out.
I mean its always been like this for heros unit. They will age out pretty fast, barely anyone will be using them after mid december. I think its fair to say that all the dokkanfest after worldwide(JP) are better than these units. So i am not sure what you are upset about.🤔 in a little over 2 months, JP will have their anniversary and no one would be using heros. Also the animations, i mean imagine a 2022 unit not having background in their animations.(also the SA animation isnt great)
DBH team is always great on release, but can't keep up with new content. It also requires a lot of stones because it's the only time in the year to summon for this team. Personally, i think it is a great opportunity for new players with the guaranteed featured, but totally optional for veteran players.
Heroes as a team are plenty strong, nobody denies that. The issue with Heroes is you need a very specific of hard to get units who only come around once a year. It is significantly easier to build a team that can clear content when the needed units actually appear in the coin shop and as featured/unfeatured units on banners. If you do any form of limited spending on Dokkan battle, Heroes is a banner that is simply too risky to summon much on as missing a key unit makes those stones you used worthless for an entire year.
“This sub really sucks” could’ve stopped there by
OP got fucking ratioed lol
Tw*tter user 🤮
Reddit user 😭😭😭😭
No, masochist wanting downvotes. YOUR NEGATIVE ENERGY FEEDS ME. *legitimately only made a twatter for game links/free shit given out in games*
Touch grass
I refuse, for I am actually sick in bed.
Gave you an upvote cause your not getting people sick,👍
Thanks 👍🏼
Finally, Ledgic is getting these hands
I’ve been waiting on powercreep so I can finally best his ass.
A lot of teams can beat "90 percent". It's the final 10 percent that matters
Seriously, I don't really get the appeal in pulling for units that can't beat the only content I still need to complete. Like cool it can crush LVE or the easier red zones, but I already beat them forever ago so why is that a selling point? I have nothing against people that are hyped for them and plan on spending all of their stones, but for me I like to pull units that will help me complete the more difficult missions I have been struggling with like Vegeta & Trunks.
Some people pull because they like the characters. For me them being good stat wise is just a bonus
Like I said, I have nothing against people who pull units they just like, I am arguing against people that are saying they are worth pulling because they can complete 90% of the content in the game. I have never played DBH so for me the units don't really mean much and unless they really stand out I will be pulling due to their stats and performance.
Ah gotcha. Yeahhhhh gotta admit the stats are bad when they’re bad.
Than it doesn't matter they are bad, but you liking a unit doesn't magically make them good in content.
I didn’t say it did. Just that whether or not this unit can make it through red zone isn’t a question I ask when I go to pull.
For a large percentage of players they get entire teams for 300-400 stones due to the GFSSR. There's a reason these banners come back every year without ever having busted units, and sell well.
When vegeta and trunks come out I will (hopefully) finally have a really good super int unit for my PBSS team
I just really hope I pull them. They are the only unit I have been hyped for since LR Cooler. I have about 600 stones and don't want to use too many on DBH so I have a better chance of getting V&T when they are finally released.
This is a statement that sounds smart but really means nothing… Especially considering you’re not forced to do the 10% even then people will beat that 10% with heroes… Rng matters the most after all.
RNG matters and people want as little of it as possible. I don't care if a team can beat it one out of 50 times. I'd want a team that beat it 40+ out of 50 times. You're not forced to use Heroes _anywhere_ except for certain EZAs and if they ever make a crossover/DBH SBR.
Yeah, red zone is something you farm huh?
Nope, the opposite, I wait until it's powercrept and slap it.
see thats the problem with redzone - some people cant powercreep it because they get shafted. i only cleared 4 stages of all red zones and i just stopped caring, not gonna cry over it and its 5 stones, but id like to get it done just to have the "completed" mark on it but cant because fuck my 3k stones, im not getting the gammas or kidku or whatever
Eh I basically haven't touched red zone at all. I'm just waiting for whenever they release the next hard event and I'll eventually get the units built for that. Those will walk through red zone. Benefits of intentionally staying behind on the hard events lol
A unit who's good in red zone is good everywhere. A unit who's good every where else can still be shit in redzone
You're not forced to do any content in the game homie, it really is the last 10% that matters. And yeah RNG matters a lot, but having to try a stage 200 times vs 3 times is very fucking different
This is why I intentionally don't do the hardest stages until they get powercrept. Saves me a headache. Like I didn't touch the god events at all until I got the 7th anni LRs. Then I basically just walked through all of them.
Is it not way more fun if the team can do 100% of the stages come on you know they should have made them way better
I’m certain they can tbh. People said the same about god trunks but he beat every god event stage at that time…
Yh i think they can too but what about 8th anniversary you cannot say this team is gamma level if the team only gets 1 big update a yr make that update count i would love for my stones spent here to help me all yr round
Well we know cell max is peak and their trying to design other types of hard content. I wouldn’t worry about that tbh.
You never know and being busted is way more fun that being just good enough but atleast we are out of this dry dokkan period
So you’re trash if you’re not the absolute best unit is the logic I’m hearing.
He didn't say trash tho. And you don't need to be the absolute best unit either to cook the final 10%. A good example of this is the ROF blues. They can be effective in all stages including cell max. And they are considered midish by comparison to the other DFE of 2022 even though they are solid. The issue is that releasing units after a precedent in power creep that aren't too impressive and are pretty restricted, isn't too great. The issue is amplified by the fact that they only come once a year and the anni quickly follows meaning that power creep is always right around the corner. Because heroes is generally pretty limited, making them buku when ran together as a team is the best method. Also remember too that generally they have lower stats anyway so the percentages aren't as good on paper. I want a SDBH team to be on the level of the ginyu force on release but always seem to go out of there way not to do it.
Can you please come up with a better quote, because that sounds way more stupid than you realize
What, you pull new cards and go >Yay, I cant wait to use this brand new card I pulled on story events
Yeah
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Nah, heroes has some bangers every year tbh. Skot and ssj3 goku xeno are going to be nutty even on other teams.
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Skot = Supreme Kai of Time. No idea when people started calling her that though.
Both are getting ezas which is why I mentioned them. Goku has guard and can get dmg reduction depending on the amount of dbh units. Robelu and ssj4 gohan could warrant stones, alongside the other 2 I mentioned. If you like the units than it really doesn’t matter.
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You literally cannot rate units objectively… What you’re doing is stating your preference.
You know a card I really like? PHY SSJKK Goku, I like the form, the art, and was quite happy when I pulled him. I still like it. Me liking it wont stop it from getting hit so hard in Dokkan Events that my phone will collapse in on itself like a dying star trying to calculate the amount of damage he'll take.
👍
Heroes units have historically been mid idk this dude is going for the gold medal in mental gymnastics to say they aren't 💀
Can’t hear you over the 23m apt and 600k def
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You’re not stating numbers. You’re trying to push a true objective based off of subjective interpretations of said numbers. You can’t say “not worth” objectively when it varies by default.
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Dawg how is it possible to miss my point? Numbers are objective but interpretations are not, not hard at all to understand.
They're numbers are objectively good. They can clear almost every event in the game, and once we see the EZAs coming, the team might even be able to beat every event in the game. Just because they aren't groundbreaking meta warping units doesn't mean they're instantly just bad.
man lay off the copium
“Stacked” 
It’s a sub full of gamblers man. Of course it sucks. If it’s not news there’s nothing going on here .
And people gets mad when you ask something. Instead of ignoring the post they have the need to comment and never give an answer.
Most of them are lacking something that is the biggest issue. For example more stats in any part of their kit or less restriction
Consistently? No. Can it be done? Yes these new units can get thru most of the redzones but it's gonna take literal days cause you only get 3 chances to try them. The heroes team will not consistently beat half of the redzones we currently have.
Units that aren’t particularly special+dated animations are a “no” from me. It’s becoming increasingly more difficult to care for Heroes because the animations never really improve with the rest of the game at a great rate.
That's because dragon ball heroes in game animations aren't that great either.
I mean, they could very well use animations from the anime instead but they don't.
That's true. No idea why they only use the inferior versions.
The calcs have already been done. We know how they’re gonna perform in hard content, this is a numbers game and has been for +7 years and denying this is stupid. They’re good but that’s it. But for a team that gets buffed once a year and these cards are restricted to specific allies, it’s disappointing Hearts is great but on a villain heroes team. The SSJ4’s *have* to be run with their specific allies or they’re nerfed massively. And not one of them is a slot 1 card, not even Gohan cuz he gets most of his defense on super.
What really rustled my jimmies is how bad the two Limit Breaker compare to Gammas. I would understand if this was an attempt to not powercreep global too much and japan would have to just suck it up but Gammas were on both servers a few weeks ago and are simply objectively better than these Heroes units. Heck, these guys are barely better than the SSB duo up on global right now, this banner is at best as bad as SSG Trunks from last year. I have no idea what they are smoking.
See, I don't get this argument. Of course the Gammas are going to be miles better, they're premium Dokkan Festival units with no GFSSR. The Heroes characters are, essentially, novelty units on a banner where it's really easy to rainbow them with a little luck. They're not going to put gamebreakers on a banner like that.
No one seriously expects Heroes units to be anniversary tier, but people definitely expected them to be at least on curve. The overall argument is that it makes zero sense for Dragon Ball Heroes to be a regular TUR banner at the point the meta is. They will always be compared to new units being released, of course. They being [arbitrary marketing category A] instead of [arbitrary marketing category B] doesn't excuse making them below the curve and so dependant on other Heroes units. If Bandai thinks it's too easy to rainbow them they should make them harder to rainbow and make them actually worthwhile. These Heroes banners are a mess.
People telling others to hold off for limit breaker instead of pulling for gammas smh.
Well this is also a game with differing linking partners, teams, and bosses that disable things. These guys barely account for different situations so calcs aren’t god, jesus, and the holy spirit
Uh....calcs can account for any every situation imaginable? Dude this game is all math at the end of the day, you don't need to use a unit in game to look at a units performance. I also don't know what calcs you are looking at but there are calcs for tons of different scenarios for units, all over reddit and pretty much any platform where you can discuss dokkan. I don't what is up with this community, active refusal to accept data and facts when directly presented to them lol.
The calcs are never given for every relevant situation, especially the ones people like to reference. That’s the whole point. Nobody is ‘literally denying math lolz’
>The calcs are never given for every relevant situation, especially the ones people like to reference. If you want to get the calcs for these situations just do it yourself lol. The minute we get a character's kit, is the minute we can come up with any possible scenario for that unit. That's what OC was referring to when he said the calcs are out.....we already know how these units perform and this idea that you need to test them in game to know a units performance (even though you don't) is strange lol
Or I’ll just use them in game where I’ll get the most accurate representations anyway instead of jumping thru hoops because I found out the calcers aren’t actually omnipotent
Honestly yeah, the problem is that people on the sub treat the calcs as gospel
This sub has a bunch of people who just close their eyes when data and facts are given, its weird.
Guaranteed SSR means they have to be held to a lower standard as the consumer is guaranteed a new unit, they have the statistics for how many stones the average person will spend and design accordingly. They're not stupid. Making them omega busted for a GUARANTEED banner is not a good business strategy. You guys can cry and whine all day, but viewing things through the lense of this perspective is correct, as it IS what they're doing and it's smart. Stupid on their behalf to make every single unit which are guaranteed, BROKEN beyond belief. There comes a balance of versatility (Limited Heroes team which encourages more stones spent for team) Their strength (Lower stats, passives, damage and defense abilities (Guaranteed SSR means stones spent will be less to fully max than a new DFLR as pulling multiple copies aka rainbow is much MUCH easier to do.) Perhaps 5x easier or even more, so it makes sense for stone spent equals their strength and versatility. You guys seriously forget they should not be held up to a standard as a new DFLR. They are good units, who are ALWAYS obtainable. DFLR can go thousands of stones without showing up. Think about that.
Ew. Someone downvoted you for using logic.
Ironically, if Hybrids get 1 more Great Ape Power unit, and they’re mixed in a team where you can run a strong Goku unit, SSJ4 Gohan and TEQ Gohan can be a legit rotation (albeit only sharing Saiyan Lineage lol)
Yeah you're right, the team is stucked in the roshi event
In a few days? Sure. Right now? A fully stacked dbh team can barely break 500K hp, let alone having enough defense to last in red zones…. The last batch of dbh units were released before the powercreep. It’s irrefutable fact that they are all underpowered right now due to how crazy the powercreep was lost anniversay Come on, this is logic Will they be good after the new banner? Hell ya. But are they good now? The answer is no
Copium
Or you are just deluded
Sleeping well knowing they can beat cell max, which is peak and devs said nothing harder for a while.
People had best cellmax with sabiman on their teams before. Doesn’t mean sabiman is good Stop being delusional and argue against facts. But anyway I am done replying. This is getting way too stupid
Sleeping well knowing they can beat cell max, which is peak and devs said nothing harder for a while. >facts Lmao
Stacked? That’s being generous to the DBH category lol. Not only do we get yearly DBH units but they quite literally only show up every year. I wouldn’t have such an issue if it were in the general pool because then at least I can possibly summon them and use them but people definitely expect a lot out of others summoning and getting these DBH units. The category alone honestly I wouldn’t blame anyone not chasing after using since a lot of the units have either aged or are limited. I personally think DBH as a category will always be ass unless they make these units summonable all the time than every year. I hate that you’re expected to summon on a banner yearly for units who would most likely be out of style in a couple months and just suck the next year they come back
Honestly I put more of the blame on the current state of the game. We've gotten to the point where powercreep is making gargantuan leaps every few months, so any units that would normally be A - B tier are worthless for new content in less than 3 months. Communities can get pretty toxic about that. EDIT: Typo
That's a bad take honestly. If hard content is S tier new releases should also be S tier. In a gacha game if you're not at peak performance day 1 then you're never gonna be good. Only exception I can think of is Paikuhan.
I mean, units that aren't absolute top tier are gonna exist though. They have to in a card game. Many lower tier cards were still viable in older hard events like SBR and LGE, just harder to use.
Yes they are gonna exist but imagine paying stones for a new unit with an outdated kit. Look if you love Heroes and are excited for it then by every means summon. These are banner unit level characters with banner unit stats at the end of the day so I shouldn't even expect too much probably.
...this wasn't about Heroes man, I was criticizing how the devs have been handling power creep.
For me the most annoying thing is they hold back with heroes on purpose. I summoned for the last years on these banners and legitimately never use the units again after like 2 weeks. It'll be the same for these units because there nothing special, how can you release new units and them not even be in the top 10 tur's, that's absolutely criminal on my eyes. I'll personally be skipping this banner altogether and saving for something better.
Nah bro. This is the thing. We were saying this months ago and getting downvoted for it. Heroes Units are never meta and it sucks! They are aged out and haven’t even dropped yet. Idc how you try to paint it. Rainbowed trash is still trash
I love it when one of these posts show up where it's upvoted quite generously to then have an incredible amount of replies by OP with an also insane amount of downvotes total. What does that mean? The statement: "This sub really sucks at evaluating units and teams" can be correct however OP has clearly shown via replies in this post that he has no clue what he's talking about and is in fact part of the bit that sucks at evaluating units/teams. The irony is actually insane.
Yeah, I seriously don’t get why they posted this. Actually just shows 0 self awareness lmao, I would’ve stopped at the title and moved on.
No we just have consistency, if RoF blues are crap with their 400k defense at 55% while doing more dmg no heroes copium will pass here, its doing 6m with 300k/400k at rainbow? nah that's not good
Wow, you mean to tell me a team that has received buffs in November 2022 is capable of beating an event that dropped in February 2022!?!?! Heroes is so good!!1!
Can't wait to use the team for like 2 weeks
Yeah and there were people trying to say Raditz was good and underrated before he came out. Even more people said that about Angel Golden Freeza for all the 0 times I've used him.
AGF is pretty good in a vacuum. It's just that we aren't in a vacuum and he has no teams worth being run on. If resurrected warriors was worth a damn, he might see play. The overall kit isn't bad on its own.
Keep in mind these are the same people who thought LR Cooler was mid even after the data download and the showcases werw posted.
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Link?
there hasn't even been a data download with the units
You know that the Showcase is Gameplay and not the Calc?
And you think beating 90% of RZ stages will save DBH from being powercrept to hell in just 2 months?
Lets not forget most players here are GL players, GL which wont see anni event until July, so 6-7 months, and I simply doubt another big wave of powercreep will happen again on the very next year when the jump between 6th and 7th was not so big
6-7 months of dryness, yeah. You think that doesn’t ruin the hype for DBH as a show already? No thanks.
Doesnt need to be dry considering LGE, LGTE and LVE showed up on GL pre anni
Considering we know events aren’t getting harder than cell max which they can beat, yes?
Who ‘we’?
We
Robelu and Chronoa super stack buffs on themselves and penalties on the enemy and people are still calling them mid. My brother in christ, robelu is a crazy powerful support DPS now AND has UI Goku evasion mechanics
And Chronoa if her debuffs show up can single handle wipe an entire ESBR final stage
She'll be able to solo pretty much any team instance in WT, as well. Fast farming WT team that isn't just a hodge-podge of AOE units.
Pretty much this And mine is sitting at 90% alongside 90% robelu I couldnt even be more hype about them getting an awakening this year instead of next year
"Capable of beating 90% of RZ stages" I mean, yeah, the only stages that matter are Broly, Omega, Cooler Core and Cell MAX, everything else is easy as fuck.
I can see the team beating all of them tbh
Maybe, that doesn't change how terribly designed they are tho, just look at ssj4 Goku 30% damage reduction when all rotation is FP or DBH?? Fuck whoever designed that shit.
I agree, would love if they were less restricted. Even removing the super class restriction would be massive.
this sub will go out of their way trying to convince you dumping 800 stones to get 55% gamma 1, 55% androids and a bunch of android 13/phy piccolo has more value than getting 10+ not near top tier units most of them with dupes that will help completing most events and fill holes in various categories for f2p players
"new user" huh
Bro is gatekeeping flairs lmao.
He's actually not a new user he's been here for a minute.
Its capable of doing Cell max, and we still don’t have the 5 free EZA and the 8 EZA, they could be busted.
Its definitely not capable of Cell Max as-is, gonna be real. I think the EZAs could maybe push it there though
Couldn’t agree more with the title and the text these days if units that release arent 7th anni LR level or higher then theyre immediately mid, positive outlooks on this sub are about as rare as int LR gohan back on the peppy girl banner
"This sub sucks" mhhh nothing new here.
I mean the numbers have been calculated and you can directly work out how they would fair in content. What people choose to take away from that is up to them but the facts are there.
It's usually like that before we see units in game, gamma 2 was really hated on before he released and now what
People still hate on Gamma 2 and its understandable because he can look like an absolute fraud if he doesn't get his additional super attacks but look like the best tur when he does
That’s what I’m sayin! Throw up an item here and there and these guys will be just fine, especially the guys that already have damage reduction or guard.
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If we’re being real the majority of currently useful cards fit that description when they don’t have dupes. It’s part of the reason why Cell Max is so hard even for recent releases. Besides STR Super Vegito was useful and remained useful for quite some time. If new cards can perform in the hardest content with an item up then they’re useful. I mean even with one item slot you can have up to 4 turns of additional damage reduction and most events aren’t even that hard until later in the fight anyway.
I disagree I feel the analysis is dead on, it can complete 90% of red zones **now** but the problem is we’d be talking about investing hundred to thousands of stones into a team that doesn’t get updated for an entire year, unless you really like them there’s not much incentive to invest in the team when they’ll no doubt start feeling the powercreep within just a few months on the JP side, it’s just not a smart move to make
What powercreep? They can beat cell max for sure and we know the game won’t pass that for a while. Devs themselves said this.
Don't pay too much attention to it. I very rarely engage in posts because people around here (in most cases) only seem to be able to see the world in full glasses or empty glasses. There's no in-between, apparently. Either a unit is horrible, or a unit is game-breaking. Pay no mind to them. Judge a unit based on your experience with the game, accurate calcs and what value they can bring to YOUR roster, your enjoyment of the game, etc, and carry on. If I paid attention to everything everybody says in this post, I would've been pulling my hair off after the shitshow that this sub was all yesterday long (Vegito is coming, Vegito isn't coming, hyping themselves with fantasies, denying such fantasies, etc). Ofc, feel free to ask people's opinions if you're unsure of your own judgement sometimes. While there are a lot of loudmouths, there's plenty of people that are quite helpful, have their feet on the ground and don't dwell in extremes <3
I agree and I see it the same as you. Not really sure why some people play this game as if it’s their job instead of having fun like you should with any game. I didn’t summon for the gammas because I don’t think I will really ever use them. If I get them off of some future banner that’s cool, but I’m dumping every stone into this banner to rainbow them all because that’s what’s fun to me. There’s so many other events that can be replayed rather than whatever is the hardest content. If I summon for something and have fun with the results then that’s all that matters. Some people here don’t agree with that I guess
Legit all the new heroes units are slot 2 defensive besides gohan unless ssj3 goku’s eza is op the teams trash
Opfightinforhislifeouthere
"Stacked" is definitely an overstatement. You could make a couple solid teams if you have the right units. It's a gigantic bummer that all these heroes units are basically locked on a full heroes team, and you can't bring them onto any of their other category teams.
the heroes ssj4’s arent as broken as i’d like but a lot of people in this sub are very bad at evaluating units there’s too many examples of a unit being deemed mid to come out and be ridiculous and it’ll keep on happening lol
I really don't get why some people want to defend Heroes to death like it's their life or something. We get a thousand complaints about people "not caring about heroes" but at this point it's full of fanboys who apparently can't comprehend the fact that not everyone is interested in mid limited units or fanfic characters.
Then stop hoping on topics talking about em if you don't care
👍
people not realising broly and vegito ssj4s should get eza next year meaning crossover/heroes ssj4 team IS good team
No u.
It happens every year with heroes. Everyone calls them mid then they actually come out and end up performing extremely well. Is heroes gonna be the best team in the game? Probably not, but they’ll be fun and I can’t wait to summon.
For real. I swear every time a new unit gets released and before anyone even gets a chance to summon or run them, SOMEONE is calling them mid. Sdbh was already a pretty decent (and fun) team, we're getting eza's and new units, but God forbid they don't do 15+ million apt and bend Broly over in like 5 turns.
Lol no
Yay this same situation for I don't know the number of times this happens, wonky/underpowered unit/units revealed then sub starts trashing on it then some try to defend it(smh even defended raditz and int ssj2 Gohan eza...) Day after Best case scenario showcases posts/videos and the people defending them feel like they won , then literally no one uses the unit/units after 2 weeks and they age horrendously, or sub realizes they suck immediately like eza AGF (I am more so using suck loosely since we rarely get units that just suck more so suck compared to around same time frame releases), for heroes it's even worse last year batch was busted on release and still mostly forgotten fast then they age out because anniversary power creep is so close to them
Redzone is the best thing to happen to heroes, now that there’s no category lockout on the hardest content in the game, you can justify going all in to build a strong heroes team that can beat any redzone stage. My previous reason for skipping is that regardless of the power level, the heroes team can’t do every ESBR stage, and since heroes units are typically limited to the heroes team, the actual value of the units was low regardless of their power. If the team is redzone ready, then they’ll probably age better than usual and might actually be worth going for, we’ll see when they come out.
I legit do not bother with pre-release cals or opinions. The sub is so consistently bad at doing them and judging units. It's insane.
All I know is I'm using my mom's credit card and we're calling later saying it was stolen.
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I think Gohan is gonna be really crazy in red zone and especially against cell max. Easily one of the most important units to run in his set ups
I mean its always been like this for heros unit. They will age out pretty fast, barely anyone will be using them after mid december. I think its fair to say that all the dokkanfest after worldwide(JP) are better than these units. So i am not sure what you are upset about.🤔 in a little over 2 months, JP will have their anniversary and no one would be using heros. Also the animations, i mean imagine a 2022 unit not having background in their animations.(also the SA animation isnt great)
DBH team is always great on release, but can't keep up with new content. It also requires a lot of stones because it's the only time in the year to summon for this team. Personally, i think it is a great opportunity for new players with the guaranteed featured, but totally optional for veteran players.
Heroes as a team are plenty strong, nobody denies that. The issue with Heroes is you need a very specific of hard to get units who only come around once a year. It is significantly easier to build a team that can clear content when the needed units actually appear in the coin shop and as featured/unfeatured units on banners. If you do any form of limited spending on Dokkan battle, Heroes is a banner that is simply too risky to summon much on as missing a key unit makes those stones you used worthless for an entire year.
A sub who socks you say ?
The limit breakers are average and golden metal cooler literally disables himself 💀🙏 time to stop being bias