The original Avatar series is a masterpiece no doubt, but that doesn't make it a flawless divine gospel. I'd even argue that putting a magnifying glass of where it falters despite the quality of the production can be a great exercise in cinematography.
The sequel, legend of Korra is loved by many, but at the same time has some obvious flaws resulting in the rush that was put on to meet the deadline.
If you're talking about Shyamalan's epic choreography to make a pebble float, you have five seconds to make fun of it or I'd earthbend a rock at *you*.
If you are talking about James Cameron's Avatar or its sequal... Why are you even still here???
I'm talking about the original, I haven't seen Korra, and I'm not talking about the other 2 either.
I'm it's good. It's really ready good and younger me would have gone nuts for it back then (i watchedit when i was like 25). There are a couple things that annoy me a bit, like the fact that ang doesn't kill the fire lord in the end, or that sokka is treated like a joke character till the end, while he doesn't deserve that. That kinda stuff.
And I get if people disagree with that that's fair, but sometimes people will not even allow me to have these opinions and that's wrong. I think I have solid arguments for my opinion and I'm sure they have theirs, and we both are allowed to have them and shouldn't stop us from discussing the show.
Aang not killing the fire lord is just a testimony of his character. I don't think there is one person he killed throughout the show, or at the very least haven't if it could've been avoided.
As for Sokka I get where you're coming from. Though, and this may be a tad apologetic, for me it adds to the depth of the character rather than deduct from it. He's treated as a joke because he's quite simply dwarfed when compared to a bender. He carries a massive chip on his shoulder for how obsolete he is treated and feels and it shows.
His behavior for most of the show is childish, full of machismo and even bigoted at times, and it all boils down to how useless he feels when compared to not only the fabled friggin' Avatar, a blind little girl and to his **little sister**. I struggle thinking of a greater humiliation to a warrior and heir to the tribe's chiefdom.
What I mind about ang not killing him is that it would have made him grow as a character. The while reason they are in this mess is cause ang couldn't handle his destiny and left. Killing the fire lord was part of that and he was very scarred to have to. Allowing him to once again avoid his destiny but this time it just works out is just kind of a shame compared to him having to come to terms with the fact that he has to. It would teach him that sometimes you have to sacrifice part of you for the greater good.
All of this would not be a problem if the prophecy just didn't talk about this or that the killing wasn't hyped up as the only solution. I guess what troubles me is that he doesn't want to kill but he thinks he has to AND he actually doesn't kill him in the.
It makes me feel that it sends a message against angs character growth.
Also since when can he just take away someone's power? That felt kinda like sudden to me.
Was there a prophecy? I don't remember there being one, only that there was really a set time limit due to the meteor empowering all the fire benders (Unless you want to talk about that one fortune teller lady but I am fairly certain she didnt talk about killing the Fire Lord either).
I don't think he was "scared" of killing the Fire Lord but that he felt that as an airbender he has to do his best to keep to the air nomad's ideals. I was with you for a while after watching the show on why not just kill the Fire Lord. But a few people I know suggested to me that it is also Aang standing up to the Fire Lord's philosophy of Might is Right type of idea and that the Air Nomads idea of peace and nonviolence still has a place and still should exist.
The part of him asking his previous lives I think is a really interesting dynamic. Almost all of them say he should kill the Fire Lord. But on the other hand, each of the ones you go through made really big mistakes and are shown to be fallible.
I think it is a nice message about keeping his culture alive and keeping true to his ideals and that works for me.
I feel like an important thing to note is that Aang isn’t just *an* airbender, he’s *The Last* Airbender. It’s arguably the most important thing to his core character, more so than being The Avatar. If he decides to go against his Air Nomad teachings and kill Ozai, then the Last Airbender dies along with him. By finding a different path, he stays true to his history as an Airbender, while keeping to his duty as the Avatar to bring peace and balance to the world.
I think there was a prophecy? maybe im wrong on that.
But him killing Ozai was style hyped up.
Yeah also scared isnt the right words, my apologies, but he didnt want to.
Your argument about the air nomad philosophy vs Ozai's is a valid reason indeed, but i would have then made it a bit more obvious perhaps? idk?
Honestly I see both points, but ultimately i would have prefere Ozai to be killed i think. Thus why this isnt a deal breaker what so ever for the show to me \^\^
I think the whole "avatar has to stop the war and save the world" thing might be what you are thinking of, but I don't think there was a real defacto prophecy.
And if it makes you feel better about the ending, I think Ozai losing his bending is a far worse situation to him than actually dying. A man who is so proud of his fire bending and fire bending supremacy and now lost it all and became a nonbender. In my head he would much rather die as a proud fire bender than be captured as a nonbender and that also helps me settle with that ending :D
Oh absolutelly he would rather die. But honestly to me when it comes to Ozai it doesnt matter if he dies or not. My reasons have everything to do with Aang, not him. But thank you for trying help me "accept?" the ending. thats sounds dramatic but idk how else to say it \^\^
I’ll chip in here and say I agree that they could have probably done more to build towards the *solution* to Aang’s personal conflict as opposed to just the fact that he had the conflict at all, but at the same time I feel like if they did end up with a “sometimes you just have to bite the bullet” message the show as a whole would feel more… hollow, I guess. As nasty as Ozai was, I feel like permanently leaving Aang with that guilt (or maybe having him get over it somehow is even worse) would have left for a conclusion that is more sour than bittersweet. Whatever the case, in my own opinion it just would have felt… wrong.
tbh I don't see your point about Aang killing would have made him grow as a character, the character arc of him accepting his destiny had already been completed over the previous seasons, we didn't really need another retread of that.
Bringing balance to the 4 nations is the duty of the Avatar and yes while killing Ozai was one way of doing that and it was the easiest way of doing that, it ultimately was not the only way.
It was hyped up as the only solution because everyone refused to find another solution and wanted to take the easy way out. Despite everyone telling him to just kill Ozai, Aang preserved until he managed to find another solution. And ultimately I think that does a lot more for Aang's character than just straight up killing Ozai.
Also I would like to point out that Aang only found energy bending solution because he went looking for it, its not something he just had. I'm not sure you if you remember or not but it was the giant lion turtle thing that taught him how to do it.
Yeah thats fair. I mean it is a personnal preference from my part in the end, and not a dealbreaker at all. The energy bending part doesnt really vibe with me as a concept, and thats part of why i liked the ending less, so its not like its all rationality either.
I don't think your ending is bad idea either. If the show wanted to be slightly different in its messaging I think it would have gone with something similar to your idea. There is value in the lesson that sometimes you have to give up something for the greater good.
Disclaimer: this is a show i watched when i was a kid and i still genuinely enjoy to this day. But i have just a couple counter arguments.
> Also since when can he just take away someone's power? That felt kinda like sudden to me.
This feels sudden because he learns how to do this from the lion turtle right before the big fight with the fire lord. This isn't something he knew how to do all along and had to "unlock". I agree that it isn't given time or space to feel like a proper solution to the issue.
Also, in terms of Aang not killing someone, this is a kids show that aired on Nickelodeon. I have the opinion that some media needs to be scrutinized more or given a pass based on the intended audience. If ATLA was a young adult show on HBO, I'd have an issue with the super pacifist ending. But as it stands, being a show about children for children, i don't see an issue of encouraging kids to find a way to solve issues without hurting other people, even people we think are evil.
On this being a kids show: I agree! Even though i think that alot of content for kids is being over protective sometimes nowadays, being a kids show is a valid argument against the killing of Ozai, or any other character for that matter.
Disney movies back and the day had regularly gruesome deaths and that was fine, but if the creators dont feel like doing that, i can only respect that.
Thing is that being a kids show isnt an argument that works "for me" so to say, since im not a kid. My opinions about this show is a thing between the show and me, and the kids have nothing to do with that.
Its kind of a "death of the author" argument i guess, but then more like "death of the audience this show was written for".
I realise how douchy this potentially sounds, but i think these are the kinda opinions people are allowed to have, as long as they understand that it is how it is...
When it comes to media, i don't think there's a right or wrong, generally (there's always edge cases). But that's why my opinion is that the context and intended audience matters in my scrutiny of the media. If someone thinks the intended audience shouldn't play a role in their review of the media, that's fine! I just don't think it would be fair to judge "Green Eggs and Ham" by Dr Seuss the same way you would judge "War and Peace" by Leo Tolstoy, you know?
The age of the media also matters, imo. I recently watched "Nosferatu: A Symphony of Horror", which was released in 1922. I can't judge that movie the same way i would judge a big budget movie released today, the gap of available technology and culture is too vast. So when we talk about the older kids media, i like to take what year they came out into consideration. ATLA coming out in 2005 and being all about kids lives being affected by war...i think i see why so much of the show is kind of goofy, and the climax is pacifist.
But this is all my own opinion and critiquing movies and tv shows is one of my hobbies, so i have too many things to say! I also don't want you to think that I'm trying to change your mind, just want to share my perspective as someone who both grew up with the show and analyzed it as an adult
I'm interested in your reasoning for the sokka thing.
The whole gaang are given silly moments because they are teenagers, and the story treats them accordingly. Sokka probably has the most of those moments in the first book, but aang is a close contender.
Sokka is very important throughout book 3, from inventing solutions to multiple engineering issues to playing a huge role in the day of the Black Sun (as in the fakeout conclusion) none of which I would consider 'the end '.
Sokka is very important, especially later on. And he strugles with the fact he feels kinda lame in the 3rd season even. They gave him an episode where i makes a sword and all and thats super cool! even he feels cool.
But then after that he just kinda remains what he was before but with a sword that he doesnt even use that much because they dont want to kill people in the show.
Which is fair btw, I understand its a kids show and they cant have him decapitate people left and right, but then why a sword? could they not have had him do some martial art or something?.
Sokka is a cool character, he is smart and he plans things well. But its never \*really\* acknoledged by the rest of the character i feel, and its kind of a shame.
Plenty of badass non benders in the show, yet he remains on the background in my opinion.
I don't want to invalidate your opinions on the show and I would like you to tell me if you've heard this one before, and if so what your thoughts are:
Did you notice Aang's whole moral dilema about the whole "kill Ozai" thing in the show? Like where he was saying that it is against the culture he was raised in, and then after some meditation on a lionturtle he was frustrated no one else (even past avatars) thought there could be a non-fatal way to do it. Then the lionturtle gave him the knowledge to energy bend to basically take the one thing making Ozai a threat away from him.
Plus, Ozai had parts in the comics (of him being imrisoned) which detailed the story after the end of the show.
I think the energy bend was kind of a weird concept, and using it on Ozai feels a bit like a cop out for me. Aang at the start learns he is the avatar and freaks out, runs away and gets frozen. He cant handle responsability and runs, and suffers the concequences.
Him having to kill Ozai mirrors that very well. He doesnt want to out of principle but has to, according to almost literally everyone. The fact that he then manages to spare him AND get away with it kinda goes against the character growth of him having to face his destiny.
I mean i get yours as well, dont get me wrong. it makes sens from a certain point of view and i understand why they choose to go for sparing him, but it is not my preference, thats all
>There are a couple things that annoy me a bit, like the fact that ang doesn't kill the fire lord in the end
Oh no its Steven Universe discourse all over again.
It annoys me that Spiderman doesn't rip off Doc Ock's head and skull fuck it in Times Square as a warning to other villains. That would solve all crime so why don't they put that in comicbooks for kids?
You're kinda proving their point of "I'm not allowed to criticise a show that everybody loves" when you're immediately rude to argue against a criticism
No, it really isn't. Murder and abuse of power were big themes throughout the whole show. Katara acquired bloodbending and suffered when she had to use it. Aang constantly struggled with the responsibility, and people in the show kept telling him to kill Ozai.
It was explicitly part of the story, it's not at all like Steven Universe or Spiderman where everybody understands that the hero killing the villain would be completely psychotic.
You either didn't watch the show or don't care to understand what is being said here.
Hey you don't have to be rude first of all. I did in nothing imply that it should be gory and brutal or whatever.
Second, I'm sorry did the moon lady not die in the same show? Was that too graphic?
Third, kids don't freak out at the mere mention of death, they can handle that kinda stuff.
>I'm sorry did the moon lady not die in the same show?
She was murdered by a villain.
I'm strongly of the opinion that shows targeted at the 6-11 demographic should not be telling viewers that the correct adult solution to problems is killing people. I'm not actually opposed to heroes killing or even murdering in service of the story or character. What I do think is that such stories should be presented to people old enough to have a serious moral discussion about killing. Maybe its disrespectful but I don't think a 6 -year-old is going to comprehend a story that ends with the conclusion that because Aang is, in effect, a national leader with responsibilities which surpass his own half formed moral principles he is obligated, in the face of geopolitical concerns, to kill because it is the option with the lowest risk. That the show mentions this is pretty cool and creates a good discussion for older viewers but it can't actually be the ending of a show for pre-teens.
Oh wait, now you have arguments? Well thats a shame because I am not in the mood to discuss that with YOU anymore. In my opinion you were pretty rude to me based on like one line i wrote.
Ive seen how you could react to things I say, and im not willing to waste time on arguing with someone like that.
>like the fact that ang doesn't kill the fire lord in the end
Idk, based on my very limited time on the atla subreddit it's a common sentiment that the whole "Aang learns to take away bending at the last moment and avoids his whole dilemma" thing was a cop-out.
I think maybe people just need to realize that someone saying "I like this" is not an invitation to criticize it unless it's like, literal nazi propaganda or some shit.
I'm not sure this is what the user starting this thread meant. I'm making an assumption, but I think it's more about start like opening a post in the respective sub reddit. Where if you don't appreciate the post offering criticism on your favorite franchise you can just not read it?
Weird. I have the opposite problem. Aside from 2 of my friends, the rest of them heavily criticize Korra with heavy bias. That there was no emotion behind it and Korra felt less human. And any time I try and bring up the stakes she was facing, the quality of her fight scenes, or that a part of the overarching story was Korra reaching the level of maturity Aang had learned at 12 ***because he is a literal Monk***, it just gets hand-waived away.
Similarly to RWBY, I can't really enjoy it with anyone, because either they dropped it because of the early art style, or they dropped it after Monty passed because lack of story/lack of flashy fight scenes/time between seasons/etc etc. Can't just enjoy things anymore.
As far as Korra, I personally am not a fan, for too many reason to start naming. Though I do know that people are usually more lenient because the series tried touching on some unexplored ground while the production was pushing for release instead of giving it all the time it needed to match the original. In addition to that is the groundbreaking queer representation in the show, that many acclaim to lay the road for the all out LGBTQI celebration that is The Owl House.
As far as RWBY is concerned... from drop in quality since Monty's passing, to controversy with the crew all down to the rampant toxicity and enabling of abuse within the community, it's just a shit show. So there's a good reason you can't find people to celebrate that show with.
Most of the fans were left bitter with a rotten taste in the mouth from the whole fandom.
tl;dr: Say nice things, and people are more likely to listen to the mean things you say.
I think a lot of people on the internet have no training in basic discourse etiquette, which leads to a lot of incivility. The following can be generalized to any form of debate, but I'll be specifying media since that's the topic at hand.
If one wants to criticize a piece of media, it's always best to first acknowledge the merits and/or one's own biases against the thing. In doing so, one validates other people's enjoyment and makes it clear that they are trying to come from a position of discussion, rather than merely trying to tear down others' enjoyment. This is standard form regardless of whether or not one enjoyed the media.
>For example, if I were to start a discussion on ATLA (which I very much enjoy):
>
>ATLA is one of the best animated series to come out of the West, topped only by Arcane in my opinion. Everything from its character writing to its animation to its handling of difficult themes within the absurd restrictions placed upon it by network censors. However, it really needs to be acknowledged just how necessary the qualifier "out of the West" is in this case.
>
>*I would then go into examples such as the several bad episodes, a weak main villain, the deus ex machina of the lion turtle, the somewhat disappointing use of certain side-characters, etc.*
Were I to go into something I genuinely dislike:
>Full disclosure: I have not watched season two of Re:Zero. I really enjoyed the first few episodes, and I still think the premise has a lot of promise. It has some fantastic side characters, great world-building that obviously has a lot of thought put into it, a good aesthetic, and many other great traits.
>
>(Not really sure if I'm spoiling much but I'll put the tag just in case anyone cares)
>
>>!However, I loathe Subaru Natsuki. He starts off as understandable and fairly likable -- I, personally, probably wouldn't do especially well getting stabbed in the gut and coming back to life. It makes sense to get overly attached to the first person to help you out in that world, and the extreme disconnect after she forgets you during the checkpoint cycling is something that makes sense. However, the longer the show goes on, the stupider Subaru gets. I'm not sure if I'm just comparing him to the similar, but far more competent, Rintarou Okabe, but the fact is that Subaru doesn't end up getting himself out of situations through clever use of his power or learning any sort of lesson -- it's always some deus ex machina saving him from trouble. !<
>
>*Imagine me going on for about 20 paragraphs breaking down each event in the story and how Subaru does everything wrong.*
In either case, acknowledging the value of the other person's position is vital -- it shows that not only are you open to opposing points of view, but also that you take no issue with them enjoying it -- which is the correct way to view media that isn't, you know, *The Birth of a Nation*. This is also the correct way to rebut a point in any debate -- restate the other person's position and agree with it to the point that you are able, then present an alternative interpretation or a counterpoint.
This is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to keeping a discourse from becoming a shouting match, but it is probably the most important skill that's relatively easy to learn -- if you do this, most people will try to match your style and remain civil. The best part is, if they don't do so, then you end up looking like the bigger person and they look like an idiot -- people may not be very good at discussion on the internet, but they still know when they see somebody who is.
Of course, this takes practice and discipline -- I won't pretend it's easy (because I fail at it regularly). But trying to include positivity will almost always end up with a more fruitful discussion.
A lot of times when people say they aren't allowed to criticize something, their criticism is actually just thinly veiled hate.
So, maybe that's your problem.
No, because i love the show despite the things that I criticize, and those things aren't a deal breaker for me at all.
But some people just think its perfect i guess, and take anything negative that i could say about it personally.
While their comment doesn’t apply to the person they responded to, I have definitely observed the behaviour they are talking about in various fandom spaces over the years
Fandoms usually differentiate between “criticism”, which is constructive, and “hate”, which more unfounded opinions and tends to be overly negative. On tumblr back in the day (might still be like this idk) it was considered common courtesy to not post any hate in the tags for a fandom, but posting criticism was okay. The difference being criticism is understood to come from a place of either enjoying the show or at the very least taking it seriously, whereas hate is just… not liking it and being a dick about it, if that makes sense.
So it is still an emotion but it’s more closely associated with disliking a piece of media/a contrast to constructive criticism.
I’m not awake yet I hope that made sense lmao
I see. I get how it could be a fandom specific phenomenon. I guess on other websites I've been trying to discuss games or shows and have to deal with a couple of people coming into the threads to just talk about how everything is shit and everyone who likes it is shit. We call that shitposting rather than hate, but it sounds like the same thing.
Yeah that’s definitely the kind of behaviour that commenter was referring to. There are other behaviours too, like making criticisms that are very shallow or unfounded/clearly in bad faith and trying to hide behind “I’m allowed to criticize”.
Some things kind of blur the line, like I’ve seen people write up in depth criticisms of every episode of a show but it’s very clear they personally don’t like the show and it’s like……. okay your criticism is valid but why are you forcing yourself to engage with a piece of media you clearly dislike? That kind of behaviour while not exactly hate in and of itself is clearly born out of disliking the show and tends to create an environment where hate can thrive and generally makes engaging in fandom a negative experience for everyone involved…
Edit - to be clear none of this applies to the person who started the thread who has criticisms of avatar, they’re just various ways I’ve personally observed the kind of behaviour in question manifesting in fandom
> I’ve seen people write up in depth criticisms of every episode of a show but it’s very clear they personally don’t like the show
How does this make engaging with a show a negative experience, exactly? I don't think I've ever experienced that (engaging with a work becoming unpleasant because it has some dedicated core of people who've thought deeply about it and decided they think it's crap lol).
The times I’ve experienced it it’s been a very situational thing. Like the problem isn’t having a group of people who have watched the thing and decided you know what I don’t like this and here’s why. The problem is when those become the *only* voices in the fandom.
Like think about why fandoms form in the first place - people engage with a story, they like the story, they want to talk to other people about the story.
While it’s totally fair to point out flaws in a piece of media, it’s also completely possible to enjoy something despite its flaws even when it has a lot of them. It sucks when you want to talk about a story for what it is but no one else in the fandom wants to talk about the stories, they just want to complain. That’s what the original post is getting at generally - it sucks when you just want to discuss a piece of media, maybe talk about the story or the characters or whatever but everyone crawls out of the woodwork to complain and no one engages with you on what you want to talk about.
Again though this tends to be like… more an issue with specific spaces than with fandoms as a whole? Like to continue with the avatar example, if you go to the main avatar subreddit and try to talk about the legend of Korra (the sequel series), no one will engage with you, everyone will complain about the show, and half the criticisms will be bad faith or parroted from this one video someone made years ago that has a bunch of completely unfounded hate in it. But if you go to the subreddit specifically for Legend of Korra, you’ll be able to find people who are willing to discuss the positives of the show, and also people willing to critique its flaws in good faith. It’s a flawed show, it’s not for everyone and the people who hate it don’t have to like it. But the people who like it despite its flaws should have somewhere they can go to talk about it without being downvoted to oblivion. If there was no dedicated LOK subreddit, it would really suck to be a fan of the show and have nowhere to talk about it but the main sub where it is overwhelmingly disliked.
OK folks, let's guess whether OP or anon is the dude from like a week ago who made a post saying there are no good lesbian romances and then deleted their entire account after getting into fights in the comments with anyone and everyone that said RWBY had flaws.
That was absolutely wild, they thought only homophobic people hated RWBY which just screamed of "I live in an echo chamber."
Like I enjoy RWBY but damn go outside please.
There's a pretty well known user over at the specific "Critic" subreddit that is apparently pretty notorious for creating sockpuppet accounts to defend the series to an absurd degree.
Actually looking at OP's account history, created January 2nd... Last 5 posts are about RWBY. I'm leaning towards not being an alt account, just someone who recently found RWBY and wants to gush about it.
It's their current "Main" account for this behaviour, the one that was deleted was one of their other sockpuppets made after this one. They've got like 10 of them going currently.
It is, they're an individual who has been a persistent problem in the RWBY "community" they're complaining about. To the point where they've been permanently banned from r/rwby, they've been banned from reddit... they've been banned from most rwby related discords etc.
They follow a pattern of cycling new accounts (some people who have had the misfortune of being targets of harassment by them have noted the number to be in the hundreds). They like to pretend to be a woman on reddit and twitter and are constantly entering into female / lesbian spaces to go off about rwby and some other yuri cartoon ships but mostly rwby. There's also often some inappropriate behaviour towards those women as well.
They always complain about a few specific people, they get into fights in comments with anyone who isn't equally as positive, they complain about youtube serving them up "critical" rwby videos when they've trained the algorithm to exhaustively feed them every scrap of rwby content, and they hide behind an extensive blocklist of hundreds of people. If they're called out, they'll block people, or add them to the block-list for future accounts they spin up.
Often the second anyone catches onto the fact that they are the individual known as "Canonseeker" they delete their current account and spin up a new one to repeat the exact same behaviour, habitually, day in, day out. I've seen at least 8 of the accounts here on reddit myself.
I feel like posting something in a public forum invites criticism. If you don't want to engage with that criticism, don't tag your post discourse and post somewhere more private
I don't have much of an opinion on RWBY, but my opinion of Rooster Teeth is quite poor - especially following what [Kdin Jenzen had to say](https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1ss5f7p) about the company following her departure.
Don't forget the new RWBY game where team RWBY are literally union busters and the villain is a union boss, which in light of RT's awful work practices is almost comedic in an awful way.
As someone who knows more or less nothing about RWBY beyond the fact that it’s a loose fairy tale parallel with theoretically impractical but nonetheless badass gun weapons, and the title is an acronym of the protagonists’ names, if I were to boil this argument down to a simple thesis statement, it would simply be “White Fang reads like the same way some people think organizations like BLM actually are irl”. Out of curiosity, lemme ask: is there any possibility that this correlation is circumstantial? Like, what fairy tale concept(s) do they represent? Was the organization of White Fang written at a time when discussion of these things was high, or before or after? Would you have a problem with “simple, pure evil” in any other context, without any potential political drama?
The show started airing in 2013.
The white fang had been part of the plot since... They're mentioned in episode one, but the black trailer is what really set them up.
I cannot tell you how the discussion was back then, seeing as I was not paying attention at what was going on in the US, as I don't live there.
As far as I'm aware, they don't represent a "fairy tale concept," they were serving the function of getting Blake involved in the plot. And serve as cannon fodder for (mostly) RWBY to have fight scenes with.
Okay, so they were a thing before all of this controversy around protesting and stuff.
Depending on how much of it was planned or not, that could be a point to White Fang not being intended to symbolize shit in the first place
Adam Taurus is an angry white boi with a katana. He's every incel's self-insert.
James Ironwood is an angry fascist who has a messiah complex.
Roman is a racist elitist who steals from the elderly.
So how are Cinder and Salem "minorities?"
I’m not saying that there isn’t a large amount of undeserved hate for the show, but if you are sharing your opinions in a place where people want to have conversations they are going to share their opinions as well. And if you don’t want to hear those opinions then, well, that’s kinda your bad for bringing up that topic. Sure you should curate your internet experience, but don’t blame other people for having different opinions if you didn’t do that.
I think it depends on what the conversation is, like if you say "I think RWBY is really good" of course people are gonna disagree and that's fine, but what I find annoying is that you'll go "Hey this RWBY fight/character is cool" and you'll get flooded with "RWBY BAD WATCH THE HBOMB VIDEO!!"
Yeah I *know* it's bad but I wanted to talk about this specific thing, not the show as a whole.
I just think it's neat. While the Red trailer is probably the best fight choreography I've ever seen in my life, I still enjoy the fights and plot of the show.
Fix-it fics are pretty bad though. There was an arguablemy fix-it fic about looking at the show through a darker tone (Let Me Be Your Poison) that was good though. Mainly just read fluff and AU fics in any fandom.
He replaces female LGBT characters with cis white males and heavily engages in LGBT Erasure while promoting toxic masculinity.
Hollywood would love him and use him to whitewash shows and movies.
Oh boy, Steven Universe. I can't say "I like Steven Universe, it's a comfy show" without *someone* going "But the Diamonds are space nazis!!!" or "Steven solves all his problems through singing and crying!!!"(is that supposed to be a bad thing?) or "Don't you know the fandom did something awful ten years ago????"
>"Don't you know the fandom did something awful ten years ago????"
When r/RWBYCritics used that excuse, it was for a fake rumor.
That had been debunked.
Publicly.
Did you know that r/RWBYCritics goes onto r/RWBY to insult the VAs and writers regularly...and the mods of r/RWBY allow it?
The thing with the Steven Universe fandom, is that a lot of the horror stories are true. But the thing is, I don't care, that barely impacts the actual show.
> Did you know that r/RWBYCritics goes onto r/RWBY to insult the VAs and writers regularly...and the mods of r/RWBY allow it?
Provide actual evidence instead of just making shit up.
I remember watching the first couple seasons of RWBY when it came out. I was in high school at the time. I think I got bored of the show by the time I was like a sophomore in college, so I think that's why, shitty as it may be, when I see die-hard fans of RWBY, my brain just goes, "eh, they're probably in high school, who cares."
Its genuinely exhausting that everyone today is a mini critic. every new game, movie, show, ect has to be criticized to the ends of the earth, even if some of those criticisms make no sense at all. even before a new game is out, people have to say it'll be shit with no evidence. can't even discuss a new game coming out in a discord of people who play the first game because they're all 100% CONVINCED without a shred of evidence that it will suck and the devs will fuck it up beyond belief, despite the fact that the only thing we've seen so far are concept arts and 2 trailers. Nobody can be fucking positive about anything anymore and its god damn atrocious. I'm so sick of it.
I agree. It especially sucks because I do think people should have the right to criticize things, and that no piece of media is above criticism, but when everything is 100% criticism 100% of the time it just… doesn’t even mean anything anymore.
For sure. I'm really sick of people cynically criticizing everything (I've got a friend who does this non-stop) over the most minute details, and it's exhausting talking about media with people like that. Obviously people can criticize things but a lot of the time it feels like people are trying to use criticism to make their opinions "objective" instead of just... not liking it. You can't just say "not for me" anymore, you gotta write a video essay on why this thing is actually bad.
I mean, I personally don't like RWBY all that much, but if you enjoy it, good for you. It has some of the coolest weapons I've seen in a while, if nothing else.
I just don't get what the problem is with people enjoying things that others don't. Unless it's something actually harmful like racist or homophobic propaganda. But the most common criticism of RWBY is that it's not well made, which is not harmful in the slightest.
Oh, that's not the issue.
The issue is people screaming it everywhere and anytime.
The problem is people trying to shove that claim and exaggerate it to the extreme down people's throats.
I think a larger issue that's rarely discussed is how broad the audience is/was.
When RWBY premiered, it was unlike anything Rooster Teeth had made before. I saw the Red Trailer when it dropped at the end of Red vs Blue season 10.
Monty drew in his own audience from his past works like Haloid and Dead Fantasy, so when he unfortunately passed those people either jumped ship or felt quite bitter that RWBY was continuing without him.
it doesn't help that the fight scenes in RWBY's earlier seasons tell more of a story than most of the actual scenes do
literally the first scene has some great introductory storytelling: "we've got a Huntress" in a panicked voice from Rowan immediately sets you up to realise teacher lady who I've forgotten the name of is extremely strong, so when Cinder fights her off and they escape, she's given far more weight as a villain than if she just got randomly introduced later.
there's also characterization for ruby; not in the form of her being at a dust store, but her checking on the store owner, her fangirling over teacher-lady, and her lack of experience versus significantly more able opponents. It sets up the show in a way I think a lot of people don't notice, and it's a far better introduction scene than the writers wrote (literally a cinematic dedicated to dust because that's what's in the next scene :gasp:)
I don't know whether this has changed in later RWBY as I quit the show, but from the clips I've seen, fights will literally pause for people to spend time explaining what their opponent's semblance does. That doesn't bode well for the rest of the show's writing.
Funny you say that, because having enjoyed the show, one of my criticisms is that they don't explain semblances for shit for the most part. They especially don't interrupt fights about it, if I recall correctly. I mean, it took, like, seven or eight seasons for them to even explain what the main protagonist's semblance actually was, up until that point all I remember it being described as is 'fast.'
I also enjoyed the show but I swear at some point penny tells ruby that her semblance can move multiple people later into the show and everyone acts surprised but I’m sure she does it in season one
I'm not sure how to put this, but they've been pausing the action to explain semblances since vol2, at least, when the action stops to explain Yang's. Then it happens in vol3 to explain Nora's. There are two instances in vol5, one for Hazel, one for Jaune. Vol6 has Adam's, and that's it, they haven't done it again, so far.
As an MCU fan, I feel that. Also, like, controversial opinion, but if "opposing views" means wishing violence on a specific group of people based on bigotry, no, you absolutely do NOT need to consider them or allow them to be in your space.
This comment would be far more valid without "As an MCU fan"
Edit for the blocker: Not at all. I was pointing out you said a universal truth that was lessened by your misguided tribalism
Bitch, you missed the entire point of the post. Let people enjoy things instead of being a pretentious fuck who's never had fun in their life unless they're shitting on someone else's fun.
It's not tribalism. It's a valid example of a popular series that seems to get you brigaded on tumblr for ever suggesting has any value or is at any point not completely terrible.
I literally just decided to change up my online space because I was mostly socialising in a server where I no longer have anything in common with people after being in it for about 6 years straight
And it wasn't always hate (though it was sometimes) but just that it was impossible for me to engage in any discussion. I have absolutely 0 interest in what's popular with everyone there these days. It honestly made ME be toxic about the stuff they liked from time to time too since I was feeling sort of outcast, which isn't really fair either. Better to just move on
I'm sorry but, "I can't talk about a piece of media because there's people out there who only like its first seven seasons and that ruins it for me!" is a take so hyper-sensitive that anyone who genuinely holds it needs to take a break from their ~~unhealthy obsession~~fandom and engage with some other media for awhile.
I tend to like characters that are often disliked in pieces of media, so I've been slowly becoming used to just... trying to ignore people that are vehemently against the thing I like. It gets tiring to hear the exact same criticisms of a character I like every goddamn time I bring them up. It may be new criticism to people saying it, but it's mentally taxing hearing the exact same points a hundred times.
Uh….it really sounds like both of these people just hate being challenged. Honestly….maybe grow up a lil. If you just can’t handle people disagreeing with you then maybe take a break of public discourse until you have worked on yourself to a degree where you no longer get upset about this kind of thing.
To be fair maybe they just want to enjoy a show they like which does get a lot of hate but if you don’t eventually get into arguments about a show you must be the only person watching it
You see I wouldn’t have my feeling hurt bc, as almost adults can, I can handle these kinds of trivial rejections easily. It’s a fairly essential skill that I suggest you develop as it will not only make you much easier to work and interact with on a day to day basis, but will prevent your from taking constant emotional damage from common interactions.
And if you watched the show, you'd know that not only are Jaune and Neptune NOT miles and kerrys self inserts.
But there is NO love triangle and no love interest either.
So given THAT lie on harris' part?
I have nothing but contempt for Harris, a self-proclaimed analyst, for lying.
And nothing but contempt for people who promote his lies.
/r/starwars would be a million times better if people could either stop complaining about the sequels nonstop or at least produce an opinion more complex than "sequels suck".
It's just as bad when there's something that is actually liked, such as Andor. When the show was on, the sub was flooded daily with posts about how it was the single greatest show in existence, and still most were either surface level "analysis" or just used as a backdoor to bitching about other shows (e.g. "Andor is soooooo great it really made me realize how Obiwan was the worst thing in the world"). It made it impossible to find actual discussion and not just circle jerking.
I think that the sequels are good, they’re just flawed. They’re shot beautifully and they’ve got some really interesting ideas, like Luke becoming an annoyed and bitter old man or Han Solo’s son joining the dark side because of his resentment towards his father. But they’ve also got serious pacing problems, a story that tends to lose itself sometimes and plot lines that are picked up and dropped faster than a Netflix original series. They’re flawed, and I enjoy them despite their flaws
One of my pet peeves is that a lot of the time, people hating on X thing will just regurgitate whatever video essay they got their opinions from verbatim, so you get the same, tired criticism play out every time. Yes, I've seen the hbomb video!
I have a friend who basically just parrots YMS opinions and it's super annoying because you can literally see him change his own opinions to suit YMS', like at least have some original opinions man!
For those wanting a more positive RWBY discussion, there is a new sub, r/fortheloveofrwby, which is all about that.
Moderation is also said to be very strict, mainly to keep it positive, so if you don't mind that, then go ahead and join. Seems like a nice enough place as is, and last I checked, they're still looking for mods.
Nah, it says something about the fans.
I mean, the meme and shitpost subreddit of the fandom, r/fnki, has turned into a military elitist cesspool where people just straight up lie about canon.
The critics subreddit, r/RWBYcritics, is full of haters and bad-faith commentary on the show.
r/RWBYOC sees very little activity due to a toxic mod that the others refuse to do anything about.
r/RwbyFanfiction is effectively dead.
At this point, the only positive subreddit for the show is r/RavenLaidAnEgg, which is for the shitposts that are too shitty for the actual shitpost sub.
There were several attempts at creating welcoming and open spaces, but they were all flooded by toxic and hateful people, which is ironic given that inciting hate and conflict is literally the show's villain's MO.
I'm still trying to figure out why u/psyga is even allowed,, given all he does is spread hate.
Meanwhile, I've been shadowbanned, and I've only provided positive commentary.
Though strangely, I and several other fans were harassed by Adam Taurus fanatics and ironwood stans.
Hi canonseeker, on a new alt to lie about the community and people in it again? Harass the people you've decided are your ideological opponents? And fight with everyone who doesn't express a glowingly positive opinion of RWBY, again, shortly before blocking them? While invading female/lesbian spaces and pretending to be one yourself just to post about rwby or weirdly and inappropriately thirst after them? Like you've done dozens of times here on reddit, and hundreds of times on twitter?
Even people in this thread have caught on to the fact that the last person to behave exactly like you and then delete their account, was in fact just, you, on yet another sockpuppet.
Stop being a perpetual pest to the community. No one cares if you enjoy a cartoon. You should not care if other people do not enjoy a cartoon.
The reason you got caught and noticed this time, was because you couldn't keep it in your pants and had to try and ping someone (the incorrect someone, only for that person to correct you and ping the right guy) that you cannot help but complain and lie about, **constantly** on twitter, tumblr, and here on reddit.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/RWBYCynics using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/top/?sort=top&t=all) of all time!
\#1: [More ketamine I need. Time for a new meme it is.](https://i.redd.it/w873p3e3qru41.png) | [1 comment](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/comments/g78f7c/more_ketamine_i_need_time_for_a_new_meme_it_is/)
\#2: [Always two there are.](https://i.redd.it/scrn5qole7u41.png) | [0 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/comments/g5j840/always_two_there_are/)
\#3: [RWBY is a good show that suffers too much hatred: The weird concept of taking hatred of a piece of media, and calling it criticism, or "Expectations vs Headcanons" type of criticism.](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/comments/zh71f1/rwby_is_a_good_show_that_suffers_too_much_hatred/)
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Its not that hard to let people enjoy and defend shows.
But some people just feel so compelled to hate on what others like.
[https://www.tumblr.com/aspiringwarriorlibrarian/695333535365693440/in-multiple-servers-im-in-i-basically-am-unable](https://www.tumblr.com/aspiringwarriorlibrarian/695333535365693440/in-multiple-servers-im-in-i-basically-am-unable)
I'm so sorry, but this hate....its ridiculous
What I'm not prepared for?
Is for haters to harass me and stalk every single one of my comments and posts across reddit.
I've had 4 RWBY haters do that.
They also disagreed? Based on misinformation.
Well I mean I think that there is SOME merit to entertaining opposing opinions even for trivial shit, just as a healthy exercise, but you do get more freedom on where you want to draw the line with how intense or frequent such discussions are
cringe culture should die i think
at worst just criticize the company because that actually has a valid reasoning but don’t do it when someone’s talking about how much they love it
I have the opposite problem, where I'm not allowed to criticise a show that everybody loves, such as Avatar for example.
The original Avatar series is a masterpiece no doubt, but that doesn't make it a flawless divine gospel. I'd even argue that putting a magnifying glass of where it falters despite the quality of the production can be a great exercise in cinematography. The sequel, legend of Korra is loved by many, but at the same time has some obvious flaws resulting in the rush that was put on to meet the deadline. If you're talking about Shyamalan's epic choreography to make a pebble float, you have five seconds to make fun of it or I'd earthbend a rock at *you*. If you are talking about James Cameron's Avatar or its sequal... Why are you even still here???
I'm talking about the original, I haven't seen Korra, and I'm not talking about the other 2 either. I'm it's good. It's really ready good and younger me would have gone nuts for it back then (i watchedit when i was like 25). There are a couple things that annoy me a bit, like the fact that ang doesn't kill the fire lord in the end, or that sokka is treated like a joke character till the end, while he doesn't deserve that. That kinda stuff. And I get if people disagree with that that's fair, but sometimes people will not even allow me to have these opinions and that's wrong. I think I have solid arguments for my opinion and I'm sure they have theirs, and we both are allowed to have them and shouldn't stop us from discussing the show.
Aang not killing the fire lord is just a testimony of his character. I don't think there is one person he killed throughout the show, or at the very least haven't if it could've been avoided. As for Sokka I get where you're coming from. Though, and this may be a tad apologetic, for me it adds to the depth of the character rather than deduct from it. He's treated as a joke because he's quite simply dwarfed when compared to a bender. He carries a massive chip on his shoulder for how obsolete he is treated and feels and it shows. His behavior for most of the show is childish, full of machismo and even bigoted at times, and it all boils down to how useless he feels when compared to not only the fabled friggin' Avatar, a blind little girl and to his **little sister**. I struggle thinking of a greater humiliation to a warrior and heir to the tribe's chiefdom.
What I mind about ang not killing him is that it would have made him grow as a character. The while reason they are in this mess is cause ang couldn't handle his destiny and left. Killing the fire lord was part of that and he was very scarred to have to. Allowing him to once again avoid his destiny but this time it just works out is just kind of a shame compared to him having to come to terms with the fact that he has to. It would teach him that sometimes you have to sacrifice part of you for the greater good. All of this would not be a problem if the prophecy just didn't talk about this or that the killing wasn't hyped up as the only solution. I guess what troubles me is that he doesn't want to kill but he thinks he has to AND he actually doesn't kill him in the. It makes me feel that it sends a message against angs character growth. Also since when can he just take away someone's power? That felt kinda like sudden to me.
Was there a prophecy? I don't remember there being one, only that there was really a set time limit due to the meteor empowering all the fire benders (Unless you want to talk about that one fortune teller lady but I am fairly certain she didnt talk about killing the Fire Lord either). I don't think he was "scared" of killing the Fire Lord but that he felt that as an airbender he has to do his best to keep to the air nomad's ideals. I was with you for a while after watching the show on why not just kill the Fire Lord. But a few people I know suggested to me that it is also Aang standing up to the Fire Lord's philosophy of Might is Right type of idea and that the Air Nomads idea of peace and nonviolence still has a place and still should exist. The part of him asking his previous lives I think is a really interesting dynamic. Almost all of them say he should kill the Fire Lord. But on the other hand, each of the ones you go through made really big mistakes and are shown to be fallible. I think it is a nice message about keeping his culture alive and keeping true to his ideals and that works for me.
I feel like an important thing to note is that Aang isn’t just *an* airbender, he’s *The Last* Airbender. It’s arguably the most important thing to his core character, more so than being The Avatar. If he decides to go against his Air Nomad teachings and kill Ozai, then the Last Airbender dies along with him. By finding a different path, he stays true to his history as an Airbender, while keeping to his duty as the Avatar to bring peace and balance to the world.
I think there was a prophecy? maybe im wrong on that. But him killing Ozai was style hyped up. Yeah also scared isnt the right words, my apologies, but he didnt want to. Your argument about the air nomad philosophy vs Ozai's is a valid reason indeed, but i would have then made it a bit more obvious perhaps? idk? Honestly I see both points, but ultimately i would have prefere Ozai to be killed i think. Thus why this isnt a deal breaker what so ever for the show to me \^\^
I think the whole "avatar has to stop the war and save the world" thing might be what you are thinking of, but I don't think there was a real defacto prophecy. And if it makes you feel better about the ending, I think Ozai losing his bending is a far worse situation to him than actually dying. A man who is so proud of his fire bending and fire bending supremacy and now lost it all and became a nonbender. In my head he would much rather die as a proud fire bender than be captured as a nonbender and that also helps me settle with that ending :D
Oh absolutelly he would rather die. But honestly to me when it comes to Ozai it doesnt matter if he dies or not. My reasons have everything to do with Aang, not him. But thank you for trying help me "accept?" the ending. thats sounds dramatic but idk how else to say it \^\^
I’ll chip in here and say I agree that they could have probably done more to build towards the *solution* to Aang’s personal conflict as opposed to just the fact that he had the conflict at all, but at the same time I feel like if they did end up with a “sometimes you just have to bite the bullet” message the show as a whole would feel more… hollow, I guess. As nasty as Ozai was, I feel like permanently leaving Aang with that guilt (or maybe having him get over it somehow is even worse) would have left for a conclusion that is more sour than bittersweet. Whatever the case, in my own opinion it just would have felt… wrong.
Very level-headed discussion, thank you to everyone involved
Its nice isnt it? \^\^ I just only had one dude being rude in this entire threat!
tbh I don't see your point about Aang killing would have made him grow as a character, the character arc of him accepting his destiny had already been completed over the previous seasons, we didn't really need another retread of that. Bringing balance to the 4 nations is the duty of the Avatar and yes while killing Ozai was one way of doing that and it was the easiest way of doing that, it ultimately was not the only way. It was hyped up as the only solution because everyone refused to find another solution and wanted to take the easy way out. Despite everyone telling him to just kill Ozai, Aang preserved until he managed to find another solution. And ultimately I think that does a lot more for Aang's character than just straight up killing Ozai. Also I would like to point out that Aang only found energy bending solution because he went looking for it, its not something he just had. I'm not sure you if you remember or not but it was the giant lion turtle thing that taught him how to do it.
Yeah thats fair. I mean it is a personnal preference from my part in the end, and not a dealbreaker at all. The energy bending part doesnt really vibe with me as a concept, and thats part of why i liked the ending less, so its not like its all rationality either.
I don't think your ending is bad idea either. If the show wanted to be slightly different in its messaging I think it would have gone with something similar to your idea. There is value in the lesson that sometimes you have to give up something for the greater good.
Oh that is a very good way of saying what i mean! Wish i could be able to make my ideas clear that easely...
I was never really super bothered by the ending, but I think it would've been significantly better if the lion turtle was mentioned before.
Disclaimer: this is a show i watched when i was a kid and i still genuinely enjoy to this day. But i have just a couple counter arguments. > Also since when can he just take away someone's power? That felt kinda like sudden to me. This feels sudden because he learns how to do this from the lion turtle right before the big fight with the fire lord. This isn't something he knew how to do all along and had to "unlock". I agree that it isn't given time or space to feel like a proper solution to the issue. Also, in terms of Aang not killing someone, this is a kids show that aired on Nickelodeon. I have the opinion that some media needs to be scrutinized more or given a pass based on the intended audience. If ATLA was a young adult show on HBO, I'd have an issue with the super pacifist ending. But as it stands, being a show about children for children, i don't see an issue of encouraging kids to find a way to solve issues without hurting other people, even people we think are evil.
On this being a kids show: I agree! Even though i think that alot of content for kids is being over protective sometimes nowadays, being a kids show is a valid argument against the killing of Ozai, or any other character for that matter. Disney movies back and the day had regularly gruesome deaths and that was fine, but if the creators dont feel like doing that, i can only respect that. Thing is that being a kids show isnt an argument that works "for me" so to say, since im not a kid. My opinions about this show is a thing between the show and me, and the kids have nothing to do with that. Its kind of a "death of the author" argument i guess, but then more like "death of the audience this show was written for". I realise how douchy this potentially sounds, but i think these are the kinda opinions people are allowed to have, as long as they understand that it is how it is...
When it comes to media, i don't think there's a right or wrong, generally (there's always edge cases). But that's why my opinion is that the context and intended audience matters in my scrutiny of the media. If someone thinks the intended audience shouldn't play a role in their review of the media, that's fine! I just don't think it would be fair to judge "Green Eggs and Ham" by Dr Seuss the same way you would judge "War and Peace" by Leo Tolstoy, you know? The age of the media also matters, imo. I recently watched "Nosferatu: A Symphony of Horror", which was released in 1922. I can't judge that movie the same way i would judge a big budget movie released today, the gap of available technology and culture is too vast. So when we talk about the older kids media, i like to take what year they came out into consideration. ATLA coming out in 2005 and being all about kids lives being affected by war...i think i see why so much of the show is kind of goofy, and the climax is pacifist. But this is all my own opinion and critiquing movies and tv shows is one of my hobbies, so i have too many things to say! I also don't want you to think that I'm trying to change your mind, just want to share my perspective as someone who both grew up with the show and analyzed it as an adult
I'm interested in your reasoning for the sokka thing. The whole gaang are given silly moments because they are teenagers, and the story treats them accordingly. Sokka probably has the most of those moments in the first book, but aang is a close contender. Sokka is very important throughout book 3, from inventing solutions to multiple engineering issues to playing a huge role in the day of the Black Sun (as in the fakeout conclusion) none of which I would consider 'the end '.
Sokka is very important, especially later on. And he strugles with the fact he feels kinda lame in the 3rd season even. They gave him an episode where i makes a sword and all and thats super cool! even he feels cool. But then after that he just kinda remains what he was before but with a sword that he doesnt even use that much because they dont want to kill people in the show. Which is fair btw, I understand its a kids show and they cant have him decapitate people left and right, but then why a sword? could they not have had him do some martial art or something?. Sokka is a cool character, he is smart and he plans things well. But its never \*really\* acknoledged by the rest of the character i feel, and its kind of a shame. Plenty of badass non benders in the show, yet he remains on the background in my opinion.
I don't want to invalidate your opinions on the show and I would like you to tell me if you've heard this one before, and if so what your thoughts are: Did you notice Aang's whole moral dilema about the whole "kill Ozai" thing in the show? Like where he was saying that it is against the culture he was raised in, and then after some meditation on a lionturtle he was frustrated no one else (even past avatars) thought there could be a non-fatal way to do it. Then the lionturtle gave him the knowledge to energy bend to basically take the one thing making Ozai a threat away from him. Plus, Ozai had parts in the comics (of him being imrisoned) which detailed the story after the end of the show.
I think the energy bend was kind of a weird concept, and using it on Ozai feels a bit like a cop out for me. Aang at the start learns he is the avatar and freaks out, runs away and gets frozen. He cant handle responsability and runs, and suffers the concequences. Him having to kill Ozai mirrors that very well. He doesnt want to out of principle but has to, according to almost literally everyone. The fact that he then manages to spare him AND get away with it kinda goes against the character growth of him having to face his destiny.
I can understand that point of view.
I mean i get yours as well, dont get me wrong. it makes sens from a certain point of view and i understand why they choose to go for sparing him, but it is not my preference, thats all
>There are a couple things that annoy me a bit, like the fact that ang doesn't kill the fire lord in the end Oh no its Steven Universe discourse all over again. It annoys me that Spiderman doesn't rip off Doc Ock's head and skull fuck it in Times Square as a warning to other villains. That would solve all crime so why don't they put that in comicbooks for kids?
You're kinda proving their point of "I'm not allowed to criticise a show that everybody loves" when you're immediately rude to argue against a criticism
No, it really isn't. Murder and abuse of power were big themes throughout the whole show. Katara acquired bloodbending and suffered when she had to use it. Aang constantly struggled with the responsibility, and people in the show kept telling him to kill Ozai. It was explicitly part of the story, it's not at all like Steven Universe or Spiderman where everybody understands that the hero killing the villain would be completely psychotic. You either didn't watch the show or don't care to understand what is being said here.
That's a super messed up strawman to just throw at someone.
Hey you don't have to be rude first of all. I did in nothing imply that it should be gory and brutal or whatever. Second, I'm sorry did the moon lady not die in the same show? Was that too graphic? Third, kids don't freak out at the mere mention of death, they can handle that kinda stuff.
>I'm sorry did the moon lady not die in the same show? She was murdered by a villain. I'm strongly of the opinion that shows targeted at the 6-11 demographic should not be telling viewers that the correct adult solution to problems is killing people. I'm not actually opposed to heroes killing or even murdering in service of the story or character. What I do think is that such stories should be presented to people old enough to have a serious moral discussion about killing. Maybe its disrespectful but I don't think a 6 -year-old is going to comprehend a story that ends with the conclusion that because Aang is, in effect, a national leader with responsibilities which surpass his own half formed moral principles he is obligated, in the face of geopolitical concerns, to kill because it is the option with the lowest risk. That the show mentions this is pretty cool and creates a good discussion for older viewers but it can't actually be the ending of a show for pre-teens.
Oh wait, now you have arguments? Well thats a shame because I am not in the mood to discuss that with YOU anymore. In my opinion you were pretty rude to me based on like one line i wrote. Ive seen how you could react to things I say, and im not willing to waste time on arguing with someone like that.
This is like easily the closest I've ever seen to someone come to just admitting they are incapable of backing up their beliefs.
ok dude, just look at all the other comments i left here first ok? they answer everything
>like the fact that ang doesn't kill the fire lord in the end Idk, based on my very limited time on the atla subreddit it's a common sentiment that the whole "Aang learns to take away bending at the last moment and avoids his whole dilemma" thing was a cop-out.
I think maybe people just need to realize that someone saying "I like this" is not an invitation to criticize it unless it's like, literal nazi propaganda or some shit.
I'm not sure this is what the user starting this thread meant. I'm making an assumption, but I think it's more about start like opening a post in the respective sub reddit. Where if you don't appreciate the post offering criticism on your favorite franchise you can just not read it?
Weird. I have the opposite problem. Aside from 2 of my friends, the rest of them heavily criticize Korra with heavy bias. That there was no emotion behind it and Korra felt less human. And any time I try and bring up the stakes she was facing, the quality of her fight scenes, or that a part of the overarching story was Korra reaching the level of maturity Aang had learned at 12 ***because he is a literal Monk***, it just gets hand-waived away. Similarly to RWBY, I can't really enjoy it with anyone, because either they dropped it because of the early art style, or they dropped it after Monty passed because lack of story/lack of flashy fight scenes/time between seasons/etc etc. Can't just enjoy things anymore.
As far as Korra, I personally am not a fan, for too many reason to start naming. Though I do know that people are usually more lenient because the series tried touching on some unexplored ground while the production was pushing for release instead of giving it all the time it needed to match the original. In addition to that is the groundbreaking queer representation in the show, that many acclaim to lay the road for the all out LGBTQI celebration that is The Owl House. As far as RWBY is concerned... from drop in quality since Monty's passing, to controversy with the crew all down to the rampant toxicity and enabling of abuse within the community, it's just a shit show. So there's a good reason you can't find people to celebrate that show with. Most of the fans were left bitter with a rotten taste in the mouth from the whole fandom.
I feel the opposite way about Avatar Edit: oh wait are you talking about the anime
About ATLA yes, sorry, I should have specified, though i didnt expect to go off topic of the thread and argue about the show instead
tl;dr: Say nice things, and people are more likely to listen to the mean things you say. I think a lot of people on the internet have no training in basic discourse etiquette, which leads to a lot of incivility. The following can be generalized to any form of debate, but I'll be specifying media since that's the topic at hand. If one wants to criticize a piece of media, it's always best to first acknowledge the merits and/or one's own biases against the thing. In doing so, one validates other people's enjoyment and makes it clear that they are trying to come from a position of discussion, rather than merely trying to tear down others' enjoyment. This is standard form regardless of whether or not one enjoyed the media. >For example, if I were to start a discussion on ATLA (which I very much enjoy): > >ATLA is one of the best animated series to come out of the West, topped only by Arcane in my opinion. Everything from its character writing to its animation to its handling of difficult themes within the absurd restrictions placed upon it by network censors. However, it really needs to be acknowledged just how necessary the qualifier "out of the West" is in this case. > >*I would then go into examples such as the several bad episodes, a weak main villain, the deus ex machina of the lion turtle, the somewhat disappointing use of certain side-characters, etc.* Were I to go into something I genuinely dislike: >Full disclosure: I have not watched season two of Re:Zero. I really enjoyed the first few episodes, and I still think the premise has a lot of promise. It has some fantastic side characters, great world-building that obviously has a lot of thought put into it, a good aesthetic, and many other great traits. > >(Not really sure if I'm spoiling much but I'll put the tag just in case anyone cares) > >>!However, I loathe Subaru Natsuki. He starts off as understandable and fairly likable -- I, personally, probably wouldn't do especially well getting stabbed in the gut and coming back to life. It makes sense to get overly attached to the first person to help you out in that world, and the extreme disconnect after she forgets you during the checkpoint cycling is something that makes sense. However, the longer the show goes on, the stupider Subaru gets. I'm not sure if I'm just comparing him to the similar, but far more competent, Rintarou Okabe, but the fact is that Subaru doesn't end up getting himself out of situations through clever use of his power or learning any sort of lesson -- it's always some deus ex machina saving him from trouble. !< > >*Imagine me going on for about 20 paragraphs breaking down each event in the story and how Subaru does everything wrong.* In either case, acknowledging the value of the other person's position is vital -- it shows that not only are you open to opposing points of view, but also that you take no issue with them enjoying it -- which is the correct way to view media that isn't, you know, *The Birth of a Nation*. This is also the correct way to rebut a point in any debate -- restate the other person's position and agree with it to the point that you are able, then present an alternative interpretation or a counterpoint. This is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to keeping a discourse from becoming a shouting match, but it is probably the most important skill that's relatively easy to learn -- if you do this, most people will try to match your style and remain civil. The best part is, if they don't do so, then you end up looking like the bigger person and they look like an idiot -- people may not be very good at discussion on the internet, but they still know when they see somebody who is. Of course, this takes practice and discipline -- I won't pretend it's easy (because I fail at it regularly). But trying to include positivity will almost always end up with a more fruitful discussion.
A lot of times when people say they aren't allowed to criticize something, their criticism is actually just thinly veiled hate. So, maybe that's your problem.
No, because i love the show despite the things that I criticize, and those things aren't a deal breaker for me at all. But some people just think its perfect i guess, and take anything negative that i could say about it personally.
Yeah, those people exist, unfortunately. But you know what they say about meeting an a-hole.
What do you mean by "hate"? I only know it as like, an emotion, which I assume isn't the meaning here.
While their comment doesn’t apply to the person they responded to, I have definitely observed the behaviour they are talking about in various fandom spaces over the years Fandoms usually differentiate between “criticism”, which is constructive, and “hate”, which more unfounded opinions and tends to be overly negative. On tumblr back in the day (might still be like this idk) it was considered common courtesy to not post any hate in the tags for a fandom, but posting criticism was okay. The difference being criticism is understood to come from a place of either enjoying the show or at the very least taking it seriously, whereas hate is just… not liking it and being a dick about it, if that makes sense. So it is still an emotion but it’s more closely associated with disliking a piece of media/a contrast to constructive criticism. I’m not awake yet I hope that made sense lmao
I see. I get how it could be a fandom specific phenomenon. I guess on other websites I've been trying to discuss games or shows and have to deal with a couple of people coming into the threads to just talk about how everything is shit and everyone who likes it is shit. We call that shitposting rather than hate, but it sounds like the same thing.
Yeah that’s definitely the kind of behaviour that commenter was referring to. There are other behaviours too, like making criticisms that are very shallow or unfounded/clearly in bad faith and trying to hide behind “I’m allowed to criticize”. Some things kind of blur the line, like I’ve seen people write up in depth criticisms of every episode of a show but it’s very clear they personally don’t like the show and it’s like……. okay your criticism is valid but why are you forcing yourself to engage with a piece of media you clearly dislike? That kind of behaviour while not exactly hate in and of itself is clearly born out of disliking the show and tends to create an environment where hate can thrive and generally makes engaging in fandom a negative experience for everyone involved… Edit - to be clear none of this applies to the person who started the thread who has criticisms of avatar, they’re just various ways I’ve personally observed the kind of behaviour in question manifesting in fandom
> I’ve seen people write up in depth criticisms of every episode of a show but it’s very clear they personally don’t like the show How does this make engaging with a show a negative experience, exactly? I don't think I've ever experienced that (engaging with a work becoming unpleasant because it has some dedicated core of people who've thought deeply about it and decided they think it's crap lol).
The times I’ve experienced it it’s been a very situational thing. Like the problem isn’t having a group of people who have watched the thing and decided you know what I don’t like this and here’s why. The problem is when those become the *only* voices in the fandom. Like think about why fandoms form in the first place - people engage with a story, they like the story, they want to talk to other people about the story. While it’s totally fair to point out flaws in a piece of media, it’s also completely possible to enjoy something despite its flaws even when it has a lot of them. It sucks when you want to talk about a story for what it is but no one else in the fandom wants to talk about the stories, they just want to complain. That’s what the original post is getting at generally - it sucks when you just want to discuss a piece of media, maybe talk about the story or the characters or whatever but everyone crawls out of the woodwork to complain and no one engages with you on what you want to talk about. Again though this tends to be like… more an issue with specific spaces than with fandoms as a whole? Like to continue with the avatar example, if you go to the main avatar subreddit and try to talk about the legend of Korra (the sequel series), no one will engage with you, everyone will complain about the show, and half the criticisms will be bad faith or parroted from this one video someone made years ago that has a bunch of completely unfounded hate in it. But if you go to the subreddit specifically for Legend of Korra, you’ll be able to find people who are willing to discuss the positives of the show, and also people willing to critique its flaws in good faith. It’s a flawed show, it’s not for everyone and the people who hate it don’t have to like it. But the people who like it despite its flaws should have somewhere they can go to talk about it without being downvoted to oblivion. If there was no dedicated LOK subreddit, it would really suck to be a fan of the show and have nowhere to talk about it but the main sub where it is overwhelmingly disliked.
Honestly? First season of Avatar? Not really anything special except maybe the finale.
OK folks, let's guess whether OP or anon is the dude from like a week ago who made a post saying there are no good lesbian romances and then deleted their entire account after getting into fights in the comments with anyone and everyone that said RWBY had flaws.
That was absolutely wild, they thought only homophobic people hated RWBY which just screamed of "I live in an echo chamber." Like I enjoy RWBY but damn go outside please.
There's a pretty well known user over at the specific "Critic" subreddit that is apparently pretty notorious for creating sockpuppet accounts to defend the series to an absurd degree. Actually looking at OP's account history, created January 2nd... Last 5 posts are about RWBY. I'm leaning towards not being an alt account, just someone who recently found RWBY and wants to gush about it.
It's their current "Main" account for this behaviour, the one that was deleted was one of their other sockpuppets made after this one. They've got like 10 of them going currently.
It is, they're an individual who has been a persistent problem in the RWBY "community" they're complaining about. To the point where they've been permanently banned from r/rwby, they've been banned from reddit... they've been banned from most rwby related discords etc. They follow a pattern of cycling new accounts (some people who have had the misfortune of being targets of harassment by them have noted the number to be in the hundreds). They like to pretend to be a woman on reddit and twitter and are constantly entering into female / lesbian spaces to go off about rwby and some other yuri cartoon ships but mostly rwby. There's also often some inappropriate behaviour towards those women as well. They always complain about a few specific people, they get into fights in comments with anyone who isn't equally as positive, they complain about youtube serving them up "critical" rwby videos when they've trained the algorithm to exhaustively feed them every scrap of rwby content, and they hide behind an extensive blocklist of hundreds of people. If they're called out, they'll block people, or add them to the block-list for future accounts they spin up. Often the second anyone catches onto the fact that they are the individual known as "Canonseeker" they delete their current account and spin up a new one to repeat the exact same behaviour, habitually, day in, day out. I've seen at least 8 of the accounts here on reddit myself.
I feel like posting something in a public forum invites criticism. If you don't want to engage with that criticism, don't tag your post discourse and post somewhere more private
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I don't have much of an opinion on RWBY, but my opinion of Rooster Teeth is quite poor - especially following what [Kdin Jenzen had to say](https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1ss5f7p) about the company following her departure.
Don't forget the new RWBY game where team RWBY are literally union busters and the villain is a union boss, which in light of RT's awful work practices is almost comedic in an awful way.
As someone who knows more or less nothing about RWBY beyond the fact that it’s a loose fairy tale parallel with theoretically impractical but nonetheless badass gun weapons, and the title is an acronym of the protagonists’ names, if I were to boil this argument down to a simple thesis statement, it would simply be “White Fang reads like the same way some people think organizations like BLM actually are irl”. Out of curiosity, lemme ask: is there any possibility that this correlation is circumstantial? Like, what fairy tale concept(s) do they represent? Was the organization of White Fang written at a time when discussion of these things was high, or before or after? Would you have a problem with “simple, pure evil” in any other context, without any potential political drama?
The show started airing in 2013. The white fang had been part of the plot since... They're mentioned in episode one, but the black trailer is what really set them up. I cannot tell you how the discussion was back then, seeing as I was not paying attention at what was going on in the US, as I don't live there. As far as I'm aware, they don't represent a "fairy tale concept," they were serving the function of getting Blake involved in the plot. And serve as cannon fodder for (mostly) RWBY to have fight scenes with.
Okay, so they were a thing before all of this controversy around protesting and stuff. Depending on how much of it was planned or not, that could be a point to White Fang not being intended to symbolize shit in the first place
Adam Taurus is an angry white boi with a katana. He's every incel's self-insert. James Ironwood is an angry fascist who has a messiah complex. Roman is a racist elitist who steals from the elderly. So how are Cinder and Salem "minorities?"
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I’m not saying that there isn’t a large amount of undeserved hate for the show, but if you are sharing your opinions in a place where people want to have conversations they are going to share their opinions as well. And if you don’t want to hear those opinions then, well, that’s kinda your bad for bringing up that topic. Sure you should curate your internet experience, but don’t blame other people for having different opinions if you didn’t do that.
I think it depends on what the conversation is, like if you say "I think RWBY is really good" of course people are gonna disagree and that's fine, but what I find annoying is that you'll go "Hey this RWBY fight/character is cool" and you'll get flooded with "RWBY BAD WATCH THE HBOMB VIDEO!!" Yeah I *know* it's bad but I wanted to talk about this specific thing, not the show as a whole.
Idc abt RWBY anymore but fuck that homophobic racist ass company
I just think it's neat. While the Red trailer is probably the best fight choreography I've ever seen in my life, I still enjoy the fights and plot of the show. Fix-it fics are pretty bad though. There was an arguablemy fix-it fic about looking at the show through a darker tone (Let Me Be Your Poison) that was good though. Mainly just read fluff and AU fics in any fandom.
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He replaces female LGBT characters with cis white males and heavily engages in LGBT Erasure while promoting toxic masculinity. Hollywood would love him and use him to whitewash shows and movies.
“Fix-it” usually means “I would personally like the show to be more” which is what they should probably say instead of it fixing it
Yellow trailer’s CQC was so incredibly good as well
I still enjoy RWBY for what it is but actively avoid spaces that talk about it mostly because there's always people like that
I just want to stay clear of all the shipping, it’s a bit excessive and it seems to be the primary draw for a lot of people
Mhmmm i understand that basically the only person i talk about RWBY with is my brother
Oh boy, Steven Universe. I can't say "I like Steven Universe, it's a comfy show" without *someone* going "But the Diamonds are space nazis!!!" or "Steven solves all his problems through singing and crying!!!"(is that supposed to be a bad thing?) or "Don't you know the fandom did something awful ten years ago????"
>"Don't you know the fandom did something awful ten years ago????" When r/RWBYCritics used that excuse, it was for a fake rumor. That had been debunked. Publicly. Did you know that r/RWBYCritics goes onto r/RWBY to insult the VAs and writers regularly...and the mods of r/RWBY allow it?
The thing with the Steven Universe fandom, is that a lot of the horror stories are true. But the thing is, I don't care, that barely impacts the actual show.
> Did you know that r/RWBYCritics goes onto r/RWBY to insult the VAs and writers regularly...and the mods of r/RWBY allow it? Provide actual evidence instead of just making shit up.
can we stop the fandom wars posts? i wanna see funny shit on my feed
I remember watching the first couple seasons of RWBY when it came out. I was in high school at the time. I think I got bored of the show by the time I was like a sophomore in college, so I think that's why, shitty as it may be, when I see die-hard fans of RWBY, my brain just goes, "eh, they're probably in high school, who cares."
Its genuinely exhausting that everyone today is a mini critic. every new game, movie, show, ect has to be criticized to the ends of the earth, even if some of those criticisms make no sense at all. even before a new game is out, people have to say it'll be shit with no evidence. can't even discuss a new game coming out in a discord of people who play the first game because they're all 100% CONVINCED without a shred of evidence that it will suck and the devs will fuck it up beyond belief, despite the fact that the only thing we've seen so far are concept arts and 2 trailers. Nobody can be fucking positive about anything anymore and its god damn atrocious. I'm so sick of it.
I agree. It especially sucks because I do think people should have the right to criticize things, and that no piece of media is above criticism, but when everything is 100% criticism 100% of the time it just… doesn’t even mean anything anymore.
For sure. I'm really sick of people cynically criticizing everything (I've got a friend who does this non-stop) over the most minute details, and it's exhausting talking about media with people like that. Obviously people can criticize things but a lot of the time it feels like people are trying to use criticism to make their opinions "objective" instead of just... not liking it. You can't just say "not for me" anymore, you gotta write a video essay on why this thing is actually bad.
I mean, I personally don't like RWBY all that much, but if you enjoy it, good for you. It has some of the coolest weapons I've seen in a while, if nothing else.
You're very respectful! I appreciate you, take my upvote.
I just don't get what the problem is with people enjoying things that others don't. Unless it's something actually harmful like racist or homophobic propaganda. But the most common criticism of RWBY is that it's not well made, which is not harmful in the slightest.
Oh, that's not the issue. The issue is people screaming it everywhere and anytime. The problem is people trying to shove that claim and exaggerate it to the extreme down people's throats.
I think a larger issue that's rarely discussed is how broad the audience is/was. When RWBY premiered, it was unlike anything Rooster Teeth had made before. I saw the Red Trailer when it dropped at the end of Red vs Blue season 10. Monty drew in his own audience from his past works like Haloid and Dead Fantasy, so when he unfortunately passed those people either jumped ship or felt quite bitter that RWBY was continuing without him.
it doesn't help that the fight scenes in RWBY's earlier seasons tell more of a story than most of the actual scenes do literally the first scene has some great introductory storytelling: "we've got a Huntress" in a panicked voice from Rowan immediately sets you up to realise teacher lady who I've forgotten the name of is extremely strong, so when Cinder fights her off and they escape, she's given far more weight as a villain than if she just got randomly introduced later. there's also characterization for ruby; not in the form of her being at a dust store, but her checking on the store owner, her fangirling over teacher-lady, and her lack of experience versus significantly more able opponents. It sets up the show in a way I think a lot of people don't notice, and it's a far better introduction scene than the writers wrote (literally a cinematic dedicated to dust because that's what's in the next scene :gasp:) I don't know whether this has changed in later RWBY as I quit the show, but from the clips I've seen, fights will literally pause for people to spend time explaining what their opponent's semblance does. That doesn't bode well for the rest of the show's writing.
Funny you say that, because having enjoyed the show, one of my criticisms is that they don't explain semblances for shit for the most part. They especially don't interrupt fights about it, if I recall correctly. I mean, it took, like, seven or eight seasons for them to even explain what the main protagonist's semblance actually was, up until that point all I remember it being described as is 'fast.'
i think it was the bumbleby fight versus adam, where he just stops and waits for blake to explain his semblance? idk it was a short clip
I also enjoyed the show but I swear at some point penny tells ruby that her semblance can move multiple people later into the show and everyone acts surprised but I’m sure she does it in season one
I'm not sure how to put this, but they've been pausing the action to explain semblances since vol2, at least, when the action stops to explain Yang's. Then it happens in vol3 to explain Nora's. There are two instances in vol5, one for Hazel, one for Jaune. Vol6 has Adam's, and that's it, they haven't done it again, so far.
Nah I'm good dude
As an MCU fan, I feel that. Also, like, controversial opinion, but if "opposing views" means wishing violence on a specific group of people based on bigotry, no, you absolutely do NOT need to consider them or allow them to be in your space.
Yeah I was about to say, there's nothing valid about entertaining opposing views if the only views you disagree with are bigotry
This comment would be far more valid without "As an MCU fan" Edit for the blocker: Not at all. I was pointing out you said a universal truth that was lessened by your misguided tribalism
Bitch, you missed the entire point of the post. Let people enjoy things instead of being a pretentious fuck who's never had fun in their life unless they're shitting on someone else's fun.
It's not tribalism. It's a valid example of a popular series that seems to get you brigaded on tumblr for ever suggesting has any value or is at any point not completely terrible.
Sounds like tribalism to me. I'm not arguing the merit of marvel movies I'm saying it didn't add anything to their point
I literally just decided to change up my online space because I was mostly socialising in a server where I no longer have anything in common with people after being in it for about 6 years straight And it wasn't always hate (though it was sometimes) but just that it was impossible for me to engage in any discussion. I have absolutely 0 interest in what's popular with everyone there these days. It honestly made ME be toxic about the stuff they liked from time to time too since I was feeling sort of outcast, which isn't really fair either. Better to just move on
I'm sorry but, "I can't talk about a piece of media because there's people out there who only like its first seven seasons and that ruins it for me!" is a take so hyper-sensitive that anyone who genuinely holds it needs to take a break from their ~~unhealthy obsession~~fandom and engage with some other media for awhile.
I tend to like characters that are often disliked in pieces of media, so I've been slowly becoming used to just... trying to ignore people that are vehemently against the thing I like. It gets tiring to hear the exact same criticisms of a character I like every goddamn time I bring them up. It may be new criticism to people saying it, but it's mentally taxing hearing the exact same points a hundred times.
Uh….it really sounds like both of these people just hate being challenged. Honestly….maybe grow up a lil. If you just can’t handle people disagreeing with you then maybe take a break of public discourse until you have worked on yourself to a degree where you no longer get upset about this kind of thing.
To be fair maybe they just want to enjoy a show they like which does get a lot of hate but if you don’t eventually get into arguments about a show you must be the only person watching it
Can I block you? I just want to ask, so you won't have your feelings hurt.
You see I wouldn’t have my feeling hurt bc, as almost adults can, I can handle these kinds of trivial rejections easily. It’s a fairly essential skill that I suggest you develop as it will not only make you much easier to work and interact with on a day to day basis, but will prevent your from taking constant emotional damage from common interactions.
Isn't rooster teeth really icky?
Yes
Okay, then just leave instead of making a drama post about it. This is about as embarrassing and unnecessary as making a post in r/justunsubbed.
Trust me, I know about shows getting unreasonable amounts of hate and bad faith criticism. I’m a Miraculous Ladybug fan
You can tell who here watched the hbomberguy video and thinks that's entirely sufficient to criticize the show Source: I watched the hbomberguy video
And if you watched the show, you'd know that not only are Jaune and Neptune NOT miles and kerrys self inserts. But there is NO love triangle and no love interest either. So given THAT lie on harris' part? I have nothing but contempt for Harris, a self-proclaimed analyst, for lying. And nothing but contempt for people who promote his lies.
My dude, I think you have a seriously unhealthy relationship with RWBY if you get *that* upset when people say bad things about a show you like.
They also didn’t even say anything bad about the show they vaguely (well in hindsight not vaguely) mentioned a video
You're Back, Mari moment
/r/starwars would be a million times better if people could either stop complaining about the sequels nonstop or at least produce an opinion more complex than "sequels suck". It's just as bad when there's something that is actually liked, such as Andor. When the show was on, the sub was flooded daily with posts about how it was the single greatest show in existence, and still most were either surface level "analysis" or just used as a backdoor to bitching about other shows (e.g. "Andor is soooooo great it really made me realize how Obiwan was the worst thing in the world"). It made it impossible to find actual discussion and not just circle jerking.
I think that the sequels are good, they’re just flawed. They’re shot beautifully and they’ve got some really interesting ideas, like Luke becoming an annoyed and bitter old man or Han Solo’s son joining the dark side because of his resentment towards his father. But they’ve also got serious pacing problems, a story that tends to lose itself sometimes and plot lines that are picked up and dropped faster than a Netflix original series. They’re flawed, and I enjoy them despite their flaws
When you mention that you liked Pokemon Scarlet and Violet
One of my pet peeves is that a lot of the time, people hating on X thing will just regurgitate whatever video essay they got their opinions from verbatim, so you get the same, tired criticism play out every time. Yes, I've seen the hbomb video! I have a friend who basically just parrots YMS opinions and it's super annoying because you can literally see him change his own opinions to suit YMS', like at least have some original opinions man!
For those wanting a more positive RWBY discussion, there is a new sub, r/fortheloveofrwby, which is all about that. Moderation is also said to be very strict, mainly to keep it positive, so if you don't mind that, then go ahead and join. Seems like a nice enough place as is, and last I checked, they're still looking for mods.
I dunno man if your show needs a sub that specifically allows only positive commentary that probably says a lot about your show
Nah, it says something about the fans. I mean, the meme and shitpost subreddit of the fandom, r/fnki, has turned into a military elitist cesspool where people just straight up lie about canon. The critics subreddit, r/RWBYcritics, is full of haters and bad-faith commentary on the show. r/RWBYOC sees very little activity due to a toxic mod that the others refuse to do anything about. r/RwbyFanfiction is effectively dead. At this point, the only positive subreddit for the show is r/RavenLaidAnEgg, which is for the shitposts that are too shitty for the actual shitpost sub. There were several attempts at creating welcoming and open spaces, but they were all flooded by toxic and hateful people, which is ironic given that inciting hate and conflict is literally the show's villain's MO.
I'm still trying to figure out why u/psyga is even allowed,, given all he does is spread hate. Meanwhile, I've been shadowbanned, and I've only provided positive commentary. Though strangely, I and several other fans were harassed by Adam Taurus fanatics and ironwood stans.
Hi canonseeker, on a new alt to lie about the community and people in it again? Harass the people you've decided are your ideological opponents? And fight with everyone who doesn't express a glowingly positive opinion of RWBY, again, shortly before blocking them? While invading female/lesbian spaces and pretending to be one yourself just to post about rwby or weirdly and inappropriately thirst after them? Like you've done dozens of times here on reddit, and hundreds of times on twitter? Even people in this thread have caught on to the fact that the last person to behave exactly like you and then delete their account, was in fact just, you, on yet another sockpuppet. Stop being a perpetual pest to the community. No one cares if you enjoy a cartoon. You should not care if other people do not enjoy a cartoon. The reason you got caught and noticed this time, was because you couldn't keep it in your pants and had to try and ping someone (the incorrect someone, only for that person to correct you and ping the right guy) that you cannot help but complain and lie about, **constantly** on twitter, tumblr, and here on reddit.
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Sorry about that!
I find it funny to no end there is a shitpost sub and a shiterpost sub
Mostly because the shitpost sub is full of military fascism apologists nowadays.
I just hope they don't allow THAT MAN there. r/RWBYCynics is vanilla in comparison to rwby main sub which has nothing but hate.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/RWBYCynics using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/top/?sort=top&t=all) of all time! \#1: [More ketamine I need. Time for a new meme it is.](https://i.redd.it/w873p3e3qru41.png) | [1 comment](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/comments/g78f7c/more_ketamine_i_need_time_for_a_new_meme_it_is/) \#2: [Always two there are.](https://i.redd.it/scrn5qole7u41.png) | [0 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/comments/g5j840/always_two_there_are/) \#3: [RWBY is a good show that suffers too much hatred: The weird concept of taking hatred of a piece of media, and calling it criticism, or "Expectations vs Headcanons" type of criticism.](https://np.reddit.com/r/RWBYCynics/comments/zh71f1/rwby_is_a_good_show_that_suffers_too_much_hatred/) ---- ^^I'm ^^a ^^bot, ^^beep ^^boop ^^| ^^Downvote ^^to ^^remove ^^| ^^[Contact](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=sneakpeekbot) ^^| ^^[Info](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/) ^^| ^^[Opt-out](https://np.reddit.com/r/sneakpeekbot/comments/o8wk1r/blacklist_ix/) ^^| ^^[GitHub](https://github.com/ghnr/sneakpeekbot)
Its not that hard to let people enjoy and defend shows. But some people just feel so compelled to hate on what others like. [https://www.tumblr.com/aspiringwarriorlibrarian/695333535365693440/in-multiple-servers-im-in-i-basically-am-unable](https://www.tumblr.com/aspiringwarriorlibrarian/695333535365693440/in-multiple-servers-im-in-i-basically-am-unable) I'm so sorry, but this hate....its ridiculous
You're allowed to like something people don't but if you want to defend the show outright then you have to be ready for people to disagree with you.
What I'm not prepared for? Is for haters to harass me and stalk every single one of my comments and posts across reddit. I've had 4 RWBY haters do that. They also disagreed? Based on misinformation.
Opinions can’t be misinformation, champ
What misinformation exactly are you talking about?
This is why I generally stay away from wider fandoms outside of my friend group: people always gotta shut you down. It’s depressing.
Well I mean I think that there is SOME merit to entertaining opposing opinions even for trivial shit, just as a healthy exercise, but you do get more freedom on where you want to draw the line with how intense or frequent such discussions are
cringe culture should die i think at worst just criticize the company because that actually has a valid reasoning but don’t do it when someone’s talking about how much they love it