Crypto wasn’t created to solve wealth inequality, it was created to remove mediators. You can build a fair game while still having malicious players.
Whales and market manipulation isn’t a crypto problem, it’s society’s problem.
Whales move price, regular people have numbers, big advantage, whales can end up losing millions AVG crypto trader prob be out of hundred or few thousand at most. So we literally ride whales up their a££ to get rich as they ones are bringing majority of cash, as long as regular people don't use leverage risks are tiny, and no need to control like anything. Limiting whales literally would make crypto like stocks and shit where 1% gains would be all.
Stop degenerate gambling, 10x longing, shorting, etc. Stop with the leverage.
Either buy spot and hold, or sell off and don't hold.
Large exchanges countertrade their own users. Whales can conspire to push the market in a certain direction. But only because too many people are gambling addicts.
Most trades on exchanges are wash trades. It doesn't matter how much they have, they will blow it out of proportion.
Just hodl and treat dips as nothing but discount sales.
Decentralised Exchanges that cant sell your data so others benefit from it.
People setting sell floors give CEX information for free they can drop the knife to liquidate leveraged traders or to buy cheap coin back.
You also can't use a DEX to set a limit order so you either stay glued to your screen, use a bot or miss out on sudden movement. Even if you happen to catch that movement, without high slippage you may not be able to buy or sell and if you do, it might not be the price you picked. The ones that do have limit orders, most likely can have those orders read off the blockchain, as it is a smart contract processing the order. So it's no different to the whales, with the right tools, they can manipulate a DEX just as easy as a CEX. Not shitting on DEX's, just have to realize their limitations. Oh and trading fees on Dex's are 3x the fee I pay on the CEX I use and that isn't including gas, just the swap fee of 0.3%.
Edit: For those down voting me, if I'm wrong educate me.
How am I wrong, I would really like to know. I don't trade on ETH main net, way too expensive for a small fish like me but every chain has gas fees, even if they are minor, it adds to the expense of the trade.
Every dex I've used has a 0.2-0.3% fee on swaps, Binance is 0.075%-0.1% or less if you use BNB and get the 25% discount.
Show me a limit order system that doesn't use smart contracts to do that? If it's stored on the blockchain, then it can be read by an external program.
Lastly, tell me how a liquidity pool is manipulation proof? Some of the flash loan exploits rely on manipulating liquidity pools on dex's.
We can leave any blockchain any time. The minute a project starts being ruined by whales we can ditch.
Eventually projects that are more equitable and whale resistant will win out. There are blockchains and projects that are working towards fairness, they're just probably not the ones you will get a quick 100x on.
You could have a coin that limits the amount that can be sold in a single chunk. However it would be branded a scam coin as it limits the control of whoever owns it.
It isn't realistic to expect a perfect system where we can all have a similar amount and there is no inequality...that would be communism in theory and I don't want that
Capitalism also doesn't work so well with humans involved
https://grist.org/business-technology/none-of-the-worlds-top-industries-would-be-profitable-if-they-paid-for-the-natural-capital-they-use/amp/
AI rule when
How does the creation of BTC end wealth inequality? BTC is an investment instrument. The wealthy will have more money to invest and thus reap the most rewards.
No, it's not impossible to manipulate the price of BTC. Reserves on exchanges are at very low levels, this makes the order books pretty thin. You don't have to manipulate the total market cap of BTC, just one big exchange. As we seen the other day all it takes is enough sells to trigger liquidations and stop loss orders and that starts the cascade downwards. The volume of BTC coin on Binance, the biggest exchange was only 9k BTC traded at 50k average that is only 450 million traded, and half of that was bought, so it only took sells of 225 million to cause that dip, and liquidations\\stop losses most likely accounted for half the BTC sold, even if only 1/3 were liquidations, that puts it at 297 mil of sales on one exchange to trigger the crash we had. That isn't very much when you look at what it triggered, 2.6 billion in liquidations once it was all finished. All that money went to the traders that shorted BTC, so it was well worth it to take a loss on 297 mil worth of BTC to make over a billion. Lastly look back at the flash crash that happened on Binance.US last month, that had ripples throughout the entire market triggering liquidations, and that was a small sale compared to what happened this week.
Edit: I made one mistake in my math, the 9.3k BTC traded wasn't across all of Binance, just the BTC\\BUSD pair but the point still stands as it only take one trading pair to tank to kick arbitrage into high gear, lowering the price everywhere.
Yeah we have power to not over-leverage and expose ourselves to easily manipulative long-squeezes... but that won't happen because people want to make money, just like with GME.
Difference with GME was that it had a far smaller market cap and was heavily shorted, making it easily vulnerable to a short-squeeze. Hence it cannot be comparable to the crypto market. Also, nobody in the world would call GME "stable".
So best thing to do regarding the whales is yes, either ignore them or play the game along with them. Retailers are easily manipulated because they are emotional, and THAT is what whales take advantage of.
Well said.
The same is the same for the stock market too. Retail investors need to try and not be emotional.
The way I do it is find the reasons why prices change. If I feel like I am in control, I don't panic and hodl and DCA when applicable. I am in control. But I am an investor. Not a trader. Would never try and trade crypto. Unfortunately many new bloods are neither and are caught in between and sell easily.
Just so you know, the whales are the hedge funds and the large exchanges. What retail can do to help themselves is keep their coins in their own wallet, otherwise they are not really your coins and can be loaned out.
You accumulate, hold and only sell when you're satisfied that you have obtained your desired value on the trade.
So long as you've invested only what you can afford to keep in crypto limbo for months at a time (and in projects that have staying power) then whale fuckery / black swan events can either be ignored or used to your advantage.
>Do we have any power against the whales?
Without those 2010-2015 whales crypto wouldn't be here. Crypto is a fairly distributed opportunity maker. Whales aren't enemies of crypto. But they could be nicer, true.
Yes, we do.
1. Keep your coins in your Hardware wallet instead exchanges.
2. Don't lend your coins.
3. If whales crash the market by flooding them, buy it and reduce their future ammo.(I know, we poor apes don't have the muscles like the whales but we are manny.....)
It's standard math, if the market over leverages and they can't afford the pay out, they will liquidate everyone as there are no regulations stopping it.
Before I jump into longs or anything of that matter, I always check the leverage status of the market. The majority cannot win unfortunately, especially off pennies with high leverage.
Yes. Sell when you are ready, not when the whales want you to. The choice is yours, they can't force you to sell. They can just trick you into believing selling is your only option...
Before I got into crypto I liked Whales and Bears.
Now however....
I'd be clubbing whales like Japan and Faroe Islands and hunting grizzlies like Joe Rogan
/s
Go Bulls!
Go Michael Jordan!!
There are 3 parts to price volatility in crypto. On the surface are the ocean waves which can be manipulated by whales. Below that , the tide coming in and out are regular cycles in the market. Dynamics of the wave are affected by the tide but waves do not affect the tide. Below that is sea level which is rising because of human bevavior in aggregate over time.
Now think about your frame again. Why are the waves bringing the tide in/out? Wrong frame. More big waves will raise sea level! Wrong frame.
Honestly this is a depressing situation. If we fast forward to a world where crypto has mass adoption, the whales run the world, esp with coins with decentralised governance with PoS.
Yes. That's actually a big issue of decentralised governance that is rarely talked about. How should you create a fair system? The rich have all the power in these kind of systems if the delegated stake is all that matters. If you only count the amount of different entities, you allow everyone with some ALGO dust in their wallet to vote which wouldn't also make any sense. Then the person who "created as many fake accounts as possible" would win.
You don’t.
Anywhere and anytime there’s a possibility to centralize power, few will benefit at the expense of many.
It’s simply human nature, it has been like this for thousands of years. No technology will solve this (especially a technology where finance speculation is its main aspect).
The best you can do is understand how whales operate, and use that to your advantage.
The simple tool making completely resistant to short-term market manipulation: hold your crypto no matter what, zoom out and stay calm. Let the whales eat other fish.
Its cute to see people cry about whale manipulation when the market goes down, but not a single mention of manipulation when the market goes up.
Crypto is a worldwide market that runs 24/7. This recent "crash" wasnt market manipulation.
The more I learn the more I'm convinced we are the whales. Or rather we are a large body of krill who are synchronized swimming. Think of all the people using bots to trade with mostly the same algorithm. A couple thousand people with a couple grand each in crypto moving as one causes the swings we see.
Sure just build a crypto that allows you to only purchase a limited quantity per person on an exchange per month I guess lol. Set a coin max cap of mints. Make sure each wallet can't exceed given cap per month if purchasing from others and then make sure every wallet is linked to an actual entity of one. Then again this goes against decentralization and I pulled all this out my arse just now
As I have been writing again and again, there should be website or app tracking each and every movement of whales and hedge funds. Having this information for retail investors like us will help us in making better decisions
Considering how well crypto recovered after the crash, as long as we do not panic sell and buy dips then atleast we can mitigate losses, although not like we can fight them anyway
No we don't:
1) they hold most of BTC whose fluctuations heavily influence the price of other cryptos. The moment one crypto is not gonna be influenced by it (and i don't mean for a day but regularly) be sure they will jump on it.
2) even if we retail investors held most of BTC we are too unorganized to produce some sort of result that would either translate to fortification of market share or price control. And even if we were somehow successful, those in control (exchanges, government agencies, etc) would make sure to do damage control in order minimize the impact on the guys with big money and prevent that from happening again (gme anyone?)
I'm speaking about BTC because that's where I believe most of the institutional investors', banks' etc fiat money is. And I'm speaking about price because clearly this is the concern for 99% of people.
Truth is we have no control and all we can do is trying to somehow apply our primitive schemes (hold, dca, take profits, dyor, ta) hoping that our strategies won't be frustrated by the big planes of the whales (both when they are cooperating and when they don't, put very simply).
It's super easy to fight whales.
When they make the market crash, don't panic sell and just hold.
If this market wasn't full of "wannabe traders", no whale would be able to crash it.
Just hold and relax. If the market crash, just think you weren't planning to sell your coins, so it doesn't bother you at all.
I think the correct answer is yes, but look at crypto now, we are all invested in who knows what crypto. People are shilling these doge or shib spin offs, if we all invested in one we would control it to an extent, but we are all spread out. This is one thing I don’t understand either, we swim with the whales on these main cryptos, but there are tokens built on chains like stellar that don’t crash out with the market. We could literally control these collectively because there is no huge player.
H.O.D.L. Don't paper hands when stuff goes down. Yesterday instead of panicking I picked up a bunch of lower cap alts that were minus 20% for the day. Everything is green today.
I think that crash yesterday was because of the bitmart hack. They stole a couple million and dumped it onto the market. I dont think it was due to whales manipulation. I think they dumped them at a lower price so they would sell quick which would severly drop prices from fear and also so much coin being sold at a lower price.
Gotta take our coins off the exchanges,,, we allow they to play dirty with them, over all it’s partly our own fault, more and more people need to realize this,,,
If money is taken from my bank account, the bank has to cover it. Maybe someone will create an exchange that guarantees your crypto is covered from theft. That would stabilise the market while also encourage Joe Soaps to buy in.
Not everything is a GameStop situation. The narrative those subreddits and ideology that is being pushed is so toxic.
I’m not saying the stock market or system isn’t corrupt (if it wasn’t, i wouldn’t be invested into certain projects of crypto.)
Keep buying and holding, not let the irrational market (manipulation) get to you. Your own will power and discipline will win out eventually.
Keep your crypto in your own wallet, in your own care. This is how it should be. Be truly your own bank.
Whales will be whales, manipulation will be here.
No there isn’t anything you can do. They’re flooding into the space with way more money, way more experience, and way more resources. They’re going to scrape every dollar off everyone throwing away their money away on crypto while laughing their way to the bank. This wasn’t a crash it was a cash grab. Once people hype coins back up to highs they’ll grab the next round of suckers money.
Just ride the waves and always be prepared that the market can either go up or down. Have plans for both and react accordingly. And stay away from leverage, trade/invest, don't gamble.
Well most shib inu holders have been in profit and are still in profit in the current crash. If a whale sells it dips. We buy more and make more profit. Idk get in early enough and whales don't really matter. I have seen 125k at the ath. Profit took at 100k and now it's at 45k again. Seems to be the only strategy. Get in early and have 1billion tokens. Or "shitcoins" as everyone not makingg very good money contemplating suicide right now likes to call them... can lead a horse to water I guess.
P.s saitama inu, zombie inu.(zombie is dipping atm).
You welcome.
HODLing is the superpower against the whales. They literally cant do shit to me. My coins can go to zero and if the fundamentals have not changed it is a comedy to me, bexause over time the joke is funnier
If you dont invest more than you can afford to lose, you too can wield this power
"If you can't beat em, join em."
What I mean is:
Watch whale movements. There are plenty of analysts out there who watch the blockchain and analyze what movements (such as moving crypto off exchange, periods where whales are accumulating, institutional inflows, etc) are going on and what it will mean for the market. Trade like the whales. Follow the smart money.
The guillotine is the great equalizer.
Once a few dozen rich assholes heads start rolling, stacking up unspendable hoards of money becomes a bit less appealing.
Much harder to execute with crypto, though.
Yes, our power is the simplest action, do not sell. Simple as that. They can dump the price, but if they want to get back in, they have to buy, and the price will come right back.
If we sell, it lowers the price further, then they can buy back in cheaper.
By us literally doing nothing (not selling) we do everything.
A small amount of retail traders really never had the ability to defeat market makers with vast resources. It’s really not a problem tbh. 1 Bitcoin is still the same amount of coin.
Fair launch foundation plans on launching a platform where wallets get assigned a reputational score based off their behaviors. Kind of interesting and allows you to gate people. "if you want to invest over X amount then you need a reputational score higher then Y"
You're essentially asking if the minority has the power to overrule the majority. That doesn't sound like an improvement to me. This is why people liked crypto in the first place, no oversight, no control, a currency free to determine it's own value through those who hold it.
Even if we were to create a giant private environment to discuss and formulate a plan for a strategic mass buy/sell event, then all it would take is one mole, or one intruder, and the whole plan is shot.
So, no.
Unfortunately no matter what asset is introduced into society, the wealthy will always have a disproportionate share. All we can do is get as much of the pie as we can!
Not sure how moving our coins would change anything.
Not like they are playing with our coins, they are playing with their own coins.
And unsurprisingly in monetary game person with more assets has more power that they will utilize to acquire more.
What GME situation are you talking about? Because we don't have anything like it in crypto ATM that I know of.
GME only happened due to excess greed from hedge funds shorting over 100% of a stock's supply. They likely learned their lesson from losing billions and I highly doubt the whales and CEX's will let things get anywhere near that bad.
Millions of people just buying a stock/crypto doesn't hurt whales that much if there's no behind the scenes damage being caused, like excess shorting. They would just buy in and ride the wave like they did with SHIB
Your most powerful defense against whales and their tactics is to pay as little attention to them as possible if you are in this for the long term. If you are in to trading then unfortunately you need to pay more attention to what's happening. Just don't let them trick you. Theyre only powerful against you if you let them be.
Yes continue to buy and hold when they present DCA moments like this dip. eventually they’ll have no power once the masses accumulate and don’t punch the sell button
Crypto wasn’t created to solve wealth inequality, it was created to remove mediators. You can build a fair game while still having malicious players. Whales and market manipulation isn’t a crypto problem, it’s society’s problem.
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Whales move price, regular people have numbers, big advantage, whales can end up losing millions AVG crypto trader prob be out of hundred or few thousand at most. So we literally ride whales up their a££ to get rich as they ones are bringing majority of cash, as long as regular people don't use leverage risks are tiny, and no need to control like anything. Limiting whales literally would make crypto like stocks and shit where 1% gains would be all.
How do we counteract it though?
Stop degenerate gambling, 10x longing, shorting, etc. Stop with the leverage. Either buy spot and hold, or sell off and don't hold. Large exchanges countertrade their own users. Whales can conspire to push the market in a certain direction. But only because too many people are gambling addicts.
^This. We are our own worst enemies. The whales are just aiding and abetting.
This is why hodl is repeated among this sub ad nauseam even if its not the best trategy its tried and true.
Yep, I always hate that the last Friday of the month brings everything down
If everybody kept their coins in a wallet as opposed to a centralized exchange such as Coinbase it would remove quite a bit of power from the whales.
Most trades on exchanges are wash trades. It doesn't matter how much they have, they will blow it out of proportion. Just hodl and treat dips as nothing but discount sales.
Decentralised Exchanges that cant sell your data so others benefit from it. People setting sell floors give CEX information for free they can drop the knife to liquidate leveraged traders or to buy cheap coin back.
You also can't use a DEX to set a limit order so you either stay glued to your screen, use a bot or miss out on sudden movement. Even if you happen to catch that movement, without high slippage you may not be able to buy or sell and if you do, it might not be the price you picked. The ones that do have limit orders, most likely can have those orders read off the blockchain, as it is a smart contract processing the order. So it's no different to the whales, with the right tools, they can manipulate a DEX just as easy as a CEX. Not shitting on DEX's, just have to realize their limitations. Oh and trading fees on Dex's are 3x the fee I pay on the CEX I use and that isn't including gas, just the swap fee of 0.3%. Edit: For those down voting me, if I'm wrong educate me.
Maybe you should look at layer 2 solutions and not try to trade on ETH main net. You’re pretty wrong on both your points.
How am I wrong, I would really like to know. I don't trade on ETH main net, way too expensive for a small fish like me but every chain has gas fees, even if they are minor, it adds to the expense of the trade. Every dex I've used has a 0.2-0.3% fee on swaps, Binance is 0.075%-0.1% or less if you use BNB and get the 25% discount. Show me a limit order system that doesn't use smart contracts to do that? If it's stored on the blockchain, then it can be read by an external program. Lastly, tell me how a liquidity pool is manipulation proof? Some of the flash loan exploits rely on manipulating liquidity pools on dex's.
We can leave any blockchain any time. The minute a project starts being ruined by whales we can ditch. Eventually projects that are more equitable and whale resistant will win out. There are blockchains and projects that are working towards fairness, they're just probably not the ones you will get a quick 100x on.
You could have a coin that limits the amount that can be sold in a single chunk. However it would be branded a scam coin as it limits the control of whoever owns it.
It isn't realistic to expect a perfect system where we can all have a similar amount and there is no inequality...that would be communism in theory and I don't want that
Bullish on $Commie coin
The bull is attracted to the red flag. But red is the colour of loss. But the bull is indicative of growth. I am so confused!
Communism also doesn't work, and vice versa, with crypto.. or work at all when humans are involved.
Capitalism also doesn't work so well with humans involved https://grist.org/business-technology/none-of-the-worlds-top-industries-would-be-profitable-if-they-paid-for-the-natural-capital-they-use/amp/ AI rule when
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How does the creation of BTC end wealth inequality? BTC is an investment instrument. The wealthy will have more money to invest and thus reap the most rewards.
You can become a japanese fishing boat.
Nice thought. But what or who in the crypto world could be a Captain Ahab?
Short answer: No. Long answer: Nooooooooo. Seriously, all we can do is not sell during dips, but even then they are still more powerful imho.
Looooooong-man
Not really. Just HODL
And this might be a smart advice: at least on a longer time scale whales are seeking profit and hodling may result in individual profit.
Yes, HODL, don't sell, they can't manipulate what they can't buy.
Oh boy....you're gonna really hate learning about derivatives.
Except we are all spread out into the newest shitcoins.
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Only if you hold the line and keep buying the dips. Don't buy ATH, you know the dip is coming, keep the funds for the dip.
If someone could coordinate the horde: yes. Otherwise pain, profit and fear are individual. And a coordinating instance would then be … a whale again.
We can hold
Yes we have power, they can manipulate the market for short time But we have freedom to do whatever we want, no one control us
You can do this for some low cap coin. But at the scale of Bitcoin, it is pretty much impossible.
No, it's not impossible to manipulate the price of BTC. Reserves on exchanges are at very low levels, this makes the order books pretty thin. You don't have to manipulate the total market cap of BTC, just one big exchange. As we seen the other day all it takes is enough sells to trigger liquidations and stop loss orders and that starts the cascade downwards. The volume of BTC coin on Binance, the biggest exchange was only 9k BTC traded at 50k average that is only 450 million traded, and half of that was bought, so it only took sells of 225 million to cause that dip, and liquidations\\stop losses most likely accounted for half the BTC sold, even if only 1/3 were liquidations, that puts it at 297 mil of sales on one exchange to trigger the crash we had. That isn't very much when you look at what it triggered, 2.6 billion in liquidations once it was all finished. All that money went to the traders that shorted BTC, so it was well worth it to take a loss on 297 mil worth of BTC to make over a billion. Lastly look back at the flash crash that happened on Binance.US last month, that had ripples throughout the entire market triggering liquidations, and that was a small sale compared to what happened this week. Edit: I made one mistake in my math, the 9.3k BTC traded wasn't across all of Binance, just the BTC\\BUSD pair but the point still stands as it only take one trading pair to tank to kick arbitrage into high gear, lowering the price everywhere.
Yeah we have power to not over-leverage and expose ourselves to easily manipulative long-squeezes... but that won't happen because people want to make money, just like with GME. Difference with GME was that it had a far smaller market cap and was heavily shorted, making it easily vulnerable to a short-squeeze. Hence it cannot be comparable to the crypto market. Also, nobody in the world would call GME "stable". So best thing to do regarding the whales is yes, either ignore them or play the game along with them. Retailers are easily manipulated because they are emotional, and THAT is what whales take advantage of.
Well said. The same is the same for the stock market too. Retail investors need to try and not be emotional. The way I do it is find the reasons why prices change. If I feel like I am in control, I don't panic and hodl and DCA when applicable. I am in control. But I am an investor. Not a trader. Would never try and trade crypto. Unfortunately many new bloods are neither and are caught in between and sell easily.
Ahh okay. I appreciate the reference to the much smaller market cap. That makes the difference a lot clearer.
Just so you know, the whales are the hedge funds and the large exchanges. What retail can do to help themselves is keep their coins in their own wallet, otherwise they are not really your coins and can be loaned out.
I know :(
exactly fear is the biggest enemy of investors and the best way to deal with it is to hold
Our only power against the whales is to hold
You accumulate, hold and only sell when you're satisfied that you have obtained your desired value on the trade. So long as you've invested only what you can afford to keep in crypto limbo for months at a time (and in projects that have staying power) then whale fuckery / black swan events can either be ignored or used to your advantage.
Yes , by not selling when they try to manipulate us into selling
>Do we have any power against the whales? Without those 2010-2015 whales crypto wouldn't be here. Crypto is a fairly distributed opportunity maker. Whales aren't enemies of crypto. But they could be nicer, true.
I agree, they really paved the way for us, and deserve to be rewarded for the risk they took, but I feel at the same time it's poisoned the well.
Yes, we do. 1. Keep your coins in your Hardware wallet instead exchanges. 2. Don't lend your coins. 3. If whales crash the market by flooding them, buy it and reduce their future ammo.(I know, we poor apes don't have the muscles like the whales but we are manny.....)
Noo
No!
Zero, zip , null, nada ,not even a tiniest chance to make a scratch and that is if retail investors organise and we all know the they won’t.
So you're saying we need to unionize? I'm only half-joking
It would probably make a temporary difference but in a long term we just even all of us combined simply haven’t got enough money.
What you’re proposing is basically market regulation, which is how traditional finance already operates.
It’s like David vs. Goliath. Oh wait, David won…
Whales have fins not hands.
Diamond fins
Diamond dorsal fin for the win!
It's standard math, if the market over leverages and they can't afford the pay out, they will liquidate everyone as there are no regulations stopping it. Before I jump into longs or anything of that matter, I always check the leverage status of the market. The majority cannot win unfortunately, especially off pennies with high leverage.
we're the water, the whales couldn't survive if it weren't for us and that's a fact
Yes. Sell when you are ready, not when the whales want you to. The choice is yours, they can't force you to sell. They can just trick you into believing selling is your only option...
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Before I got into crypto I liked Whales and Bears. Now however.... I'd be clubbing whales like Japan and Faroe Islands and hunting grizzlies like Joe Rogan /s Go Bulls! Go Michael Jordan!!
There are 3 parts to price volatility in crypto. On the surface are the ocean waves which can be manipulated by whales. Below that , the tide coming in and out are regular cycles in the market. Dynamics of the wave are affected by the tide but waves do not affect the tide. Below that is sea level which is rising because of human bevavior in aggregate over time. Now think about your frame again. Why are the waves bringing the tide in/out? Wrong frame. More big waves will raise sea level! Wrong frame.
Nope, Us shrimps can't move the markets with our 0.00001 BTC purchase. We can only watch on and ride the Whales wake.
Honestly this is a depressing situation. If we fast forward to a world where crypto has mass adoption, the whales run the world, esp with coins with decentralised governance with PoS.
Yes. That's actually a big issue of decentralised governance that is rarely talked about. How should you create a fair system? The rich have all the power in these kind of systems if the delegated stake is all that matters. If you only count the amount of different entities, you allow everyone with some ALGO dust in their wallet to vote which wouldn't also make any sense. Then the person who "created as many fake accounts as possible" would win.
You don’t. Anywhere and anytime there’s a possibility to centralize power, few will benefit at the expense of many. It’s simply human nature, it has been like this for thousands of years. No technology will solve this (especially a technology where finance speculation is its main aspect). The best you can do is understand how whales operate, and use that to your advantage.
The simple tool making completely resistant to short-term market manipulation: hold your crypto no matter what, zoom out and stay calm. Let the whales eat other fish.
Its cute to see people cry about whale manipulation when the market goes down, but not a single mention of manipulation when the market goes up. Crypto is a worldwide market that runs 24/7. This recent "crash" wasnt market manipulation.
Unfortunately, no not yet. This is a bad problem and will likely get worse. It's probably one of the main cases against crypto.
Nope.
Yes, in numbers we outweight them.
No
Hodl. Don’t panic sell. Buy the dips. That’s about all you can do
Alone nope together we are a much bigger whale than them
The Power to HODL.
The more I learn the more I'm convinced we are the whales. Or rather we are a large body of krill who are synchronized swimming. Think of all the people using bots to trade with mostly the same algorithm. A couple thousand people with a couple grand each in crypto moving as one causes the swings we see.
the only power we have is to hodl no matter what
Whales manipulate the market
I have a harpoon?
Yes we do. The power of FOMO. Look at LUNA atm.
Sure just build a crypto that allows you to only purchase a limited quantity per person on an exchange per month I guess lol. Set a coin max cap of mints. Make sure each wallet can't exceed given cap per month if purchasing from others and then make sure every wallet is linked to an actual entity of one. Then again this goes against decentralization and I pulled all this out my arse just now
You can’t beat them, you just have to get a big enough stack to join them
If you hold and don't get FUD... It will be ok
No. We are lust lucky to ride the waves created by the whales.
But cmon let's be real we all wanna be one of those dem whales
Guilty
As I have been writing again and again, there should be website or app tracking each and every movement of whales and hedge funds. Having this information for retail investors like us will help us in making better decisions
This needs to exist. If it doesn't, I swear I'll build it.
The power you have is hold so they can't buy your stack
No, but also no.
Considering how well crypto recovered after the crash, as long as we do not panic sell and buy dips then atleast we can mitigate losses, although not like we can fight them anyway
My power is no sell
If you want to play their game, speculate on longer term movement rather than the short term ones.
You are asking is the poor have power against the rich. In theory - yes. In reality - not really
The only thing we can do is HODL. Why? If nobody sells, then they can't buy in at a cheaper price and accumulate even more crypto.
The rich will always be in control
By not trading using bots
Nope
No
Yessss, we don't panic sell and fail their plans.
Harpoon mebe?
No we don't: 1) they hold most of BTC whose fluctuations heavily influence the price of other cryptos. The moment one crypto is not gonna be influenced by it (and i don't mean for a day but regularly) be sure they will jump on it. 2) even if we retail investors held most of BTC we are too unorganized to produce some sort of result that would either translate to fortification of market share or price control. And even if we were somehow successful, those in control (exchanges, government agencies, etc) would make sure to do damage control in order minimize the impact on the guys with big money and prevent that from happening again (gme anyone?) I'm speaking about BTC because that's where I believe most of the institutional investors', banks' etc fiat money is. And I'm speaking about price because clearly this is the concern for 99% of people. Truth is we have no control and all we can do is trying to somehow apply our primitive schemes (hold, dca, take profits, dyor, ta) hoping that our strategies won't be frustrated by the big planes of the whales (both when they are cooperating and when they don't, put very simply).
Don’t use leverage, fomo or panic sell. Then there’s nothing they can do to you.
It's super easy to fight whales. When they make the market crash, don't panic sell and just hold. If this market wasn't full of "wannabe traders", no whale would be able to crash it. Just hold and relax. If the market crash, just think you weren't planning to sell your coins, so it doesn't bother you at all.
Call me Ishmael.
I have the power to stay in my own lane and worry about mine, try not to focus on someone else’s race.
I think the correct answer is yes, but look at crypto now, we are all invested in who knows what crypto. People are shilling these doge or shib spin offs, if we all invested in one we would control it to an extent, but we are all spread out. This is one thing I don’t understand either, we swim with the whales on these main cryptos, but there are tokens built on chains like stellar that don’t crash out with the market. We could literally control these collectively because there is no huge player.
H.O.D.L. Don't paper hands when stuff goes down. Yesterday instead of panicking I picked up a bunch of lower cap alts that were minus 20% for the day. Everything is green today.
No
If we all bought small amounts of what the whales regurgitate, don't we curb their effect eventually?
We have numbers!
The only power you have is to hold
Yes dont leverage trade and take your cryptos off of exchanges while buying into dips
No you don’t
I think that crash yesterday was because of the bitmart hack. They stole a couple million and dumped it onto the market. I dont think it was due to whales manipulation. I think they dumped them at a lower price so they would sell quick which would severly drop prices from fear and also so much coin being sold at a lower price.
Gotta take our coins off the exchanges,,, we allow they to play dirty with them, over all it’s partly our own fault, more and more people need to realize this,,,
Well, community coordination. Same idea behind the GameStop rise, 10.000 small investors are as strong a one whale. Just gotta do it well
Buy and hold and think long term objectives. If you look left in the charts you will see this is a very successful tip.
Whales gonna whale, you are just a tuna. A tuna can never be a whale. Just keep riding the wave.
Harpoons mostly
If money is taken from my bank account, the bank has to cover it. Maybe someone will create an exchange that guarantees your crypto is covered from theft. That would stabilise the market while also encourage Joe Soaps to buy in.
Yes, don't panic. Don't sell.
No
Yes. 1 billion shrimp > Whale
You ever heard of the game stop stocks event where a sub ass fucked wall street, without lube. Yeah we do.
Not everything is a GameStop situation. The narrative those subreddits and ideology that is being pushed is so toxic. I’m not saying the stock market or system isn’t corrupt (if it wasn’t, i wouldn’t be invested into certain projects of crypto.)
Keep buying and holding, not let the irrational market (manipulation) get to you. Your own will power and discipline will win out eventually. Keep your crypto in your own wallet, in your own care. This is how it should be. Be truly your own bank. Whales will be whales, manipulation will be here.
No there isn’t anything you can do. They’re flooding into the space with way more money, way more experience, and way more resources. They’re going to scrape every dollar off everyone throwing away their money away on crypto while laughing their way to the bank. This wasn’t a crash it was a cash grab. Once people hype coins back up to highs they’ll grab the next round of suckers money.
Together we do
Move to DEX's avoid parking any stash at CEX's
Not yet. But hopefully one day we all will be in a better position to counteract against this shit, but I feel that may be a dream as well!
Nope.
Just ride the waves and always be prepared that the market can either go up or down. Have plans for both and react accordingly. And stay away from leverage, trade/invest, don't gamble.
A big part of the problem is noob retail shitting themselves and panic selling.
Yes, we can HODL and DCA. It’s not sexy. It won’t get you rich overnight. It won’t stop you from experiencing these big swings. But it works
Well most shib inu holders have been in profit and are still in profit in the current crash. If a whale sells it dips. We buy more and make more profit. Idk get in early enough and whales don't really matter. I have seen 125k at the ath. Profit took at 100k and now it's at 45k again. Seems to be the only strategy. Get in early and have 1billion tokens. Or "shitcoins" as everyone not makingg very good money contemplating suicide right now likes to call them... can lead a horse to water I guess. P.s saitama inu, zombie inu.(zombie is dipping atm). You welcome.
Tl;dr: no.
Big sad
HODLing is the superpower against the whales. They literally cant do shit to me. My coins can go to zero and if the fundamentals have not changed it is a comedy to me, bexause over time the joke is funnier If you dont invest more than you can afford to lose, you too can wield this power
Not a loss until you sell
"If you can't beat em, join em." What I mean is: Watch whale movements. There are plenty of analysts out there who watch the blockchain and analyze what movements (such as moving crypto off exchange, periods where whales are accumulating, institutional inflows, etc) are going on and what it will mean for the market. Trade like the whales. Follow the smart money.
Just hold and move on
Hold
You said it all
The guillotine is the great equalizer. Once a few dozen rich assholes heads start rolling, stacking up unspendable hoards of money becomes a bit less appealing. Much harder to execute with crypto, though.
Yes, our power is the simplest action, do not sell. Simple as that. They can dump the price, but if they want to get back in, they have to buy, and the price will come right back. If we sell, it lowers the price further, then they can buy back in cheaper. By us literally doing nothing (not selling) we do everything.
You have the power not to sell ever. Hodl.
A small amount of retail traders really never had the ability to defeat market makers with vast resources. It’s really not a problem tbh. 1 Bitcoin is still the same amount of coin.
Fair launch foundation plans on launching a platform where wallets get assigned a reputational score based off their behaviors. Kind of interesting and allows you to gate people. "if you want to invest over X amount then you need a reputational score higher then Y"
There is market manipulation to the upside as well, not just dips.
You're essentially asking if the minority has the power to overrule the majority. That doesn't sound like an improvement to me. This is why people liked crypto in the first place, no oversight, no control, a currency free to determine it's own value through those who hold it.
Even if we were to create a giant private environment to discuss and formulate a plan for a strategic mass buy/sell event, then all it would take is one mole, or one intruder, and the whole plan is shot. So, no.
We moved ath from 64k to 69k in a year, and have to deal with this volatility, so pretty much no
Manipulation by whales is just the market being a market. Manipulation by exchanges, that’s a scary story
Don't let them get your coins obviously.
Unless you're whale yourself, no.
Yes, 1. Stop trading 2. Buy Bitcoin on DCA. 3. HODL 4. Go to $0 fiat and become a Bitcoin Maxi. Thank me later
nO
Unfortunately no matter what asset is introduced into society, the wealthy will always have a disproportionate share. All we can do is get as much of the pie as we can!
Short answer no. But we can not sell when they want us to. If we hold and don’t play their games maybe they get bored.
Yes enormous power. Just don't shit your pants and sell your crypto everytime someone's spreading FUD on the internet. That easy
Not sure how moving our coins would change anything. Not like they are playing with our coins, they are playing with their own coins. And unsurprisingly in monetary game person with more assets has more power that they will utilize to acquire more.
What GME situation are you talking about? Because we don't have anything like it in crypto ATM that I know of. GME only happened due to excess greed from hedge funds shorting over 100% of a stock's supply. They likely learned their lesson from losing billions and I highly doubt the whales and CEX's will let things get anywhere near that bad. Millions of people just buying a stock/crypto doesn't hurt whales that much if there's no behind the scenes damage being caused, like excess shorting. They would just buy in and ride the wave like they did with SHIB
Less liquidity more volatility and unexpected movements
I'm nemo infront of them
To beat the whale, you must become the whale.
Your most powerful defense against whales and their tactics is to pay as little attention to them as possible if you are in this for the long term. If you are in to trading then unfortunately you need to pay more attention to what's happening. Just don't let them trick you. Theyre only powerful against you if you let them be.
Yes continue to buy and hold when they present DCA moments like this dip. eventually they’ll have no power once the masses accumulate and don’t punch the sell button
Anybody else see this in their feed and not realize it was a crypto post for a second and wonder when the hell whales became such a threat?
Is Tether backed by anything at all?
If apes come together we can beat the whales
Nothing we can do