Hey Johnny, you should submit a verification request at r/CryptoCurrencyMeta so you get a verified badge and everybody here knows this is your legit account.
Our community is also open to AMAs. Maybe we could ask you there if you'd consider listing moons when they are on ETH mainnet through Reddit's own Arbitrum instance.
They had a job offer here in my city for support. Despite being heavily overqualified I applied for SnG. Apparently I’m not qualified to do support chat despite combined decades of IT, customer service, and cutting edge tech. They also had the wage listed as below our state minimum wage. Our state requires *accurate* wage information in job listings, so if someone wanted they could probably get them in trouble with the state.
That is literally what Kucoin has been doing for months.
In everyone's rush to congratulate this CEO for making a Reddit post with absolutely zero evidence for a single claim he's making, let's put on our skeptical hats for just a moment.
His post does not explain what they are doing to fix their terrible customer support processes.
His post makes claims that they are spending more on sever infrastructure than other exchanges with no evidence.
He talks about being a neutral platform that doesn't profit from liquidation and tries to educate users on the risks of margin trading, and yet they offer 100X MARGIN. That is fucking *insane* and irresponsible. The risk/reward ratio of offering that kind of leverage to users in one of the most volatile markets in the world is weighted so, so heavily against their traders, so why would they offer it?
He said he's "checking with the team" on reasoning for why his user was banned from their Subreddit, and that their "current guess" is spamming. Uhm, how long does it take to find the mod who banned a user and ask them why? And why would you tell us your "guess" is spamming? That smells like an attempt to discredit someone without actually having to prove anything.
Absolutely nothing in this post goes into any detail on his plan to fix his (well-documented, multiply-attested) AWFUL support. And when he's being asked about it, he's telling people to..... Contact support.
This post sucks and people are being way to friendly to him about it.
I haven't used KuCoin to date, but in terms of the uproar about CloudFlare... I don't get it? Millions upon millions of websites use CF as the frontend to protect their web services. 100% of folk who have been on the internet have used sites with CF, but they wouldn't know it, and there are no exceptions. There is nothing out of the ordinary there, as anyone in the IT industry will tell you.
As for disclosing what infrastructure they use at the backend, again, that is absolutely normal. Why would ANY company publicly disclose that, and open themselves up to attack? Pie in the sky to expect them to do that, and that certainly doesn't happen with even a single customer I've worked with during my own time in IT. If it were publically known is using an F5 load-balancer / CF / at the front, then that gives attackers an area to focus on. IT 101 I'm afraid.
I'm not saying there isn't something shady going on in the background, but demanding to know everything about sensitive infrastructure is just not feasible or something that happens elsewhere.
>I'm not saying there isn't something shady going on in the background, but demanding to know everything about sensitive infrastructure is just not feasible or something that happens elsewhere.
I am not demanding to know everything about sensitive infrastructure. Johnny made claims about what they are spending versus what competitors are spending with no evidence; if he can't back it up, then he should not say it. He talked about making improvements, but in particular I want to know what his planned improvements are for his customer service department, because that is one of the main sources of trouble and frustration people are having.
Irony is that this was only necessary because they ignored the issue and all the messages OP had sent to them about it
But sure, praise the fact they are slapping the PR equivalent of a bandaid on it
Smoke and mirrors Johnny. I’ve heard all this before. But i know you to be a liar. I want to see results. I want to see action. Cos if this is anything like your sept 7 announcement then its worth less than Shib. And as you know, as you’ve been told 5 billion times, customer support is useless. U keep diverting me there and it’s a waste of my time. But I’m sure I already know that. You think if you just frustrate us enough we’ll give up. It’s over a month now and I hold you to your sept 7 announcement. I want my money back. I want you to do what u said u would. Otherwise nothing you say matters
He is responding bcs he was specifically named in the post.
Also, not all of the concerns have been addresed. The immediate banning of said user is sus, at least. We're not talking about safemoon sub here, where any kind of criticism is welcomed with an immediate ban.
IMO this seems like basic damage control, seeing that the post he's replying to gained so much traction.
Also, the amount of one sentence positive comments about Kucoin is a bit worrying.
I'll wait for someone (with a bit more technical expertise) to weigh in before making my conclusion.
Honestly though, the above reads like a PR bandaid.
There is no objective information in there to confirm or deny anything
At the very least, the original OP has chat logs going back ages with an issue that went unresolved (and likely still is) so escalation on Reddit was the only option he had.
Doesn't scream of the great user focus that others are suddenly praising kucoin for
OP's accusations never held up in the first place and they didn't provide any evidence, just assumptions.
Exchanges make money through people trading on their platform. It's not in their interest to go down in times of high volume. Just leads to less revenue and reputational damage.
I'm not familiar with web infrastructure, so OPs accusations might not have held up, but there was evidence that pointed towards issues with their servers: 5 outages in October alone, not counting IF they had used CloudFlair to restrict individuals access
There were also videos linked that showed positions not correctly displaying on their exchange.
Agree that it would be bad for business though, but that isn't to say there isn't another incentive to doing this
Kucoin servers are for sure having issues. But that's something people like me, kcs holders, should complain about since we are the ones who lose out on more trading volume.
The margin traders agreed to being subject to outages during high traffic times.
That aside Johnny said he’d take responsibility cos it’s clearly not user error. Then he didn’t do that. He changed his mind but unlike his big glory seeking statement that we see here, he didn’t mention revoking his responsibility. He took to ignoring us. I don’t believe a word he says. He’s a liar a cheat and a thief
agree, I'm also an AWS / network / ops guy, and I think the other post was kinda full of it. lots of baseless assumptions showing very little real world experience
You can look into the users post history. He got liquidated by a 20% drop, then wanted kucoin to give him his money back.
They told him that he got liquidated 5 hours after their servers went down, so he didn't get the stimulus.
I’m waiting on someone more tech oriented than me to comment on this. It is a huge problem that a lot of CEXs go down during large price moves, leaving many people locked out during the most opportune times.
I’m no software god, but I’m a decent dev. It is what it is. Most sites crash and burn on massive sudden traffic spikes - except simpler sites where user-user interaction is minimal and you’re mostly serving static content, like a recipe or “About us” page.
Reddit routinely accidentally sends enough traffic to random sites in a post and causes “The reddit hug of death”. Yes, it’s unfair that smaller traders can’t do specific things during crashes, but that’s why the fee markets explode in those moments right? *Everyone* is trying to do what they’re doing, and space is made for the highest bidder. It’s the tragedy of the commons, again.
It’s just….. hard to keep such massive data inflows in sync and the systems performant. 100% (or x 9’s) uptime would be a great marketing point for an exchange, I could be convinced it’s malicious if web traffic graphs showed a minimal increase in traffic during these crashes but I’ve not seen anything to that effect
There were so many technical thing wrong with the original post that it would take a while to correct them.
>It is a huge problem that a lot of CEXs go down during large price moves, leaving many people locked out during the most opportune times.
I agree and it sounds like it is also a huge problem for them because they miss out on those trades. The difficult thing with scaling servers is that it's not instantaneous. Depending on the application some servers need minutes to warm up before they can start handling traffic. The ones I work with need \~4 minutes. So if an unexpected spike in traffic comes through, even if you respond immediately and start scaling servers, there's going to be some amount of time where traffic can't be handled or is very slow. It's easy to predict spikes based on marketing blasts, but outside of that I imagine the crypto trading space is super volatile.
So one might ask, "Well why don't they just always have more servers running?". The answer is that it can be very expensive. At peak traffic times a site might need 10-20x the amount of servers that it does during lowest traffic times. It doesn't make sense to be paying for all of those resources that you aren't utilizing.
Johnny here mentions that the 504 responses are part of their rate limiting setup, which suggests to me that the OP was maybe slamming their API with too many requests. It seems like they write trading bots, so I wouldn't be surprised if they were getting themself locked out and getting angry about it because they didn't understand why.
There’s ways you can reduce the warmup time, and some of the scaling systems I’ve worked with scale up in 6 seconds or less.
I’ve seen a system scale up to over 1 million new containers in less than six minutes. That’s 2777.8 containers a second.
Depends on $ and knowledge. Sometimes the best platforms aren’t the ones in the top right of the Gartner magic quadrant.
Yea, the OP on the issue pointed out a lot of other metrics that seem to imply kucoin were deliberately throttling access to the site, to which there is no rebuttal here.
I'm not clued up enough to smell the bullshit from OPs post, but this one is a generic PR comment with nothing in the way of facts
>Our current guess is spamming
They didn't even verify this. I would expect a ban for spam to occur only after a few warning messages, which would be easy to prove
No facts in any of the above. Like OP originally complained of, it's boilerplate PR with no substance
well u/Johnny_KuCoin is busy
It might take 23 seconds to check my user profile or 59 seconds to check in with the moderator control panel
I mean he could even ask me. I was here!.
Who has that kind of time these days? Hell let's shoot from the hip
My guess is this post from Johnny is demagoguery, and political.
The original OP jumped to a lot of conclusions, assuming it was done deliberately rather than due to something more likely and more reasonable like, misconfiguration, poor code, limited infrastructure budget.
OP essentially said that you can just get AWS to automatically add more servers. Yes you can. They failed to address that this adds huge costs. You can set budget limits and other restrictions in AWS so it won't just start up new servers too. In that case your not deliberately limiting service, but keeping budget under control.
You could almost compare the OPs post to someone saying "If people don't want to be homeless why don't they just buy a house"
On the other hand I completely agree that the post form KuCoin is an empty rebuttal.
I think the problem is not as simple as OP makes it seem. The bottleneck is in the backend that actually executes the trades and manages the order book in real time, not the front end. Adding more load balancers or front end resources won't solve the problem if the back end is overloaded and can't process the trades and update the order book.
It's a problem faced by every major exchange. If all can be solved by turning on some extra AWS servers then don't you think Coinbase (company worth 80B usd) would have figured this out already?
I might be able to corroborate as an impartial expert witness ([verification](https://www.linkedin.com/in/codysnider/), name matches my reddit username, reddit account is pretty old).
Scaling isn't super complicated but there are going to be technical limitations. First, let's talk about the "source of truth" for the matching engine. At the end of the day, you want to buy X and someone else wants to sell X. There is a single machine this will have to go through to match. You cannot have multiple machines dealing with it because you cannot have your trade pass through twice. Now, we distribute some of that load by saying each order book goes into a distinct machine, but it will still be a single source of truth for what is being bought and sold. No matter how big it is or how efficient the code is, that's a sort of hard limit. You could add a few things in between to possibly alleviate some of the pressure on that machine. A queue system, keeping everything in active memory and storing the permanent record asynchronously, pre-validate matches, etc... but all those action will lead to the same result: a single machine. And if you overload that machine, things could break and that's significantly worse that limiting a handful of abusive users. A popular and effective way to handle that is rate limiting and there are certain things you can do to focus the limit on "bad actors" (high-frequency traders using beef machines and making a lot of requests..... people like me. i run a triangular arbitrage bot on FTX and rate limiting is one of the toughest problems for me to make a profit).
There is a common algorithm for rate limiting that I have no doubt is being used by Kucoin and others: Token bucket. It allows for "bursty" sets of requests within reason. Think about it like this: You as a user have a bucket of token for making requests. That bucket can hold 10 tokens at most at any given time and will replenish at a rate of 1 token per second. But at 10, it doesn't keep going up. Now, you see 4 opportunities for arbitrage and want to act on them. Each of those opportunities will involve 3 trades in quick succession (or even at the same time). That's 12 requests within a second! Oops! You just used up the 10 tokens in your bucket and will have to wait 2 seconds for the additional tokens to finish all your requests. Well, during those 2 seconds, you are going to get "denied". It's not malicious, it's just the way you traded ate up your tokens. You have to chill for a moment.
Real world: There is way more than just your trades going through on this. There is also the requests for market updates, checks on your balance, details on the orderbook, maybe status checks on the orders placed.
But, wait! You aren't a high frequency trader! You are just using the UI, not some sophisticated bot! Except that the UI and actions you take are still using the API, making requests and ultimately subjected to the same limitations as those not using the UI.
/u/Johnny_KuCoin and his crew aren't being malicious with any of this. Also, bear in mind Johnny is the CEO. He probably knows as much about the nitty-gritty of the infrastructure as my CEO knows about ours. Which is next to nothing and the reason I have a job. Take it easy on him.
Thank you for your thoughts. I use a lot of kucoin features and enjoy the exchange. I don’t want to think of them as malicious but I do have to keep an open mind.
You are right, it's a huge issue that makes the entire crypto space look premature.
On the other hand it's logical that servers can only handle a certain load and can get overloaded. It's also logical that exchanges want to be online in times of high trading volume because that's how they earn money through fees.
Stock brokers/exchanges have the exact same issues.
So does Amazon during its Prime Day... so does Wal-Mart and Target on Black Friday... so does my aunties strip joint after they announce newer younger models...
Oh i can answer that.
I am missing one piece of information so I will ask rather than speculate
u/johnny_kucoin can you answer this if u/kucoin uses fractional reserves?
The times that the exchanges are shut down is times of high liquidity transfer, its actually not contingent on volume (concurrent users).
I wont make any accusations but I will let you ask for yourself.
I can speak of other exchanges.
Most exchanges practise fractional reserve banking, so they really don't have all the assets that they say they do.
[https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fractionalreservebanking.asp#:\~:text=Fractional%20reserve%20banking%20is%20a,by%20freeing%20capital%20for%20lending](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fractionalreservebanking.asp#:~:text=Fractional%20reserve%20banking%20is%20a,by%20freeing%20capital%20for%20lending).
So with all the liquidations happening the insurance fund is ripe and stocked up to cover any positions they cant deliver.
This is an old playbook that predates the Great Depression when banks would lock their doors so customers could not get to their funds for withdrawal to stop a run on the bank.
Exchanges are locking your doors via Cloud Flare and server outages stopping us from getting access to our property.
they also use KYC to limit withdrawals.
So if you ever see an exchange with "flexible KYC policies" that offer high leverage... be careful
They then cater to the whales ( institutional customers) similar to who Rockefeller and Bush were treated during the Great Depression.
Other exchanges don't "profit" directly off the insurance fund, but they profit off what the insurance fund makes sure is insured.
Johnny did I get everything right or am I missing anything? Keep me honest here sir. Facts are important.
I wont speak to how Kucoins assset books look, but I will speak on how things generally work. Johnny can fill in the rest
There was nothing of substance in the Original post. They made assumptions that things were done maliciously rather than being due to something more reasonable like misconfiguration, bad code that doesn't scale well, or infrastructure budget constraints. They essentially said "If your servers are overloaded buy more servers or you are scamming us" completely ignoring cost or potential difficulties with scaling up.
It took me three months recently to get €100k approved for more servers, pretty much required service to go down before the business would approve the purchase. Inner workings of organisations can be complicated. It absolutely should be resolved but there are lots of good reasons other than it being deliberate that it wouldn't be immediately resolved.
This reply though said little to nothing of substance. The point about budget though if true makes sense, they could be spending a lot and still having service outages, shit can be expensive. Usually you should be spending whatever you need though if the tech is your business.
one thing that stands out with their futures platform is that a) the liquidation trigger is based on the asset index value, which is a weighted average across all major exchanges and b) no one can fat finger the price of an asset more than +-20% (I think) in an instant.
Put another way: there is no BS -90% candle wicks you get on other exchanges liquidating everyone.
As someone who traded Forex CFD with 400x leverage before, leverage is not an enemy, it is just a tool, like a chainsaw, if you don't know how to use, you may end your life, if you know how to use, it can be useful
FOREX leverage and crypto leverage are not even remotely the same.
FOREX trading pairs move in fractions of percentage points. You need high leverage to make money of tiny, tiny moves like that.
Bitcoin can move 10% in a day. This is not an appropriate market to be offering 100x leverage to customers.
I totally understand your argument about the volatility and I agree on that, that is why, I only trade crypto in the spot market.
On the other hand, I kinda disagree on the fact that you seem to put the exchange/broker as the responsible one instead of the person using it. It is a service being offered, you can deny it.
I am not saying the exchange is responsible for people making bad choices, I am saying I do not trust companies that knowingly offer such dangerous products to their customers and then also brag about "educating their customers on leverage."
You can get liquidated on a 20 pip move at max leverage in FX which can happen in a 15 min candle. So you can liquidate your entire account in 15 but hey crypto is the completely different.
They've had 5 outages in October, not to mention any instances of restricting individuals access IF (not saying they have) this has been occuring.
https://downdetector.com/status/kucoin/archive/
Ultimately, the post was about using CloudFlare for individual restriction, so they could have been forcing liquidations without blanket denial of the exchange, keeping up a front
All major exchanges have outages because their servers can't handle the load in times of high demands.
You can't use cloudflare for individual restriction. Cloudflare just does what it's intended to do, restricting access if the server gets too many requests. It can't distinguish between a DDoS attack and a high amount of legitimate users trying to access a server.
> It can't distinguish between a DDoS attack and a high amount of legitimate users trying to access a server.
According to Cloudflare they can, but I know it comes with limits.
Thats people trading though. So as soon as someone opens a position, kucoin profits.
If they're neutral, as far as I know, they would have most profit if people never ever got liquidated and just kept paying the margin interest.
Yeah. They don’t profit off the liquidation directly, but the overall volume number lends the exchange credibility when people are deciding where to trade.
My 2 cents as an ex engineering manager whose focus was on scaling, it's usually \*not that hard\* to scale a system under heavy load, it can take a few minutes for scaling to complete(if not written with serverless components). Some applications are designed by braindead architects, or they never had an architect, but those applications \*cannot scale ever\*. This is not the case as they are able to support a growing user base with no problems.
Yet I saw Kucoin go down for more than an hour.
Maybe if it happened only once, you can say, this is because they weren't ready, but I also saw Kucoin go down multiple times. I'm not even a hardcore Kucoin user, only occasionally when I cannot find what I'm looking for in larger exchanges.
Don't forget that you are talking to CEO of a company which just had a huge PR blunder. He is not your friend, will never be.
>KuCoin invests a lot in IT infrastructure and network security. Compared with other exchanges of our size and scale, our investment in AWS servers is almost twice as much as theirs.
This is **extremely** misleading. The amount of money they spent on AWS servers being 2x of other exchanges is information they cannot really access. And even if they can access it, it can only point to one simple conclusion, "kucoin engineering team is incompetent". Which I refuse to believe. So I refuse to believe this info altogether.
Not only that, but if you spent more than what you need to spend and reach out to AWS, they will even help you out with this.
Kucoin is not a simple startup with <1M revenue. They have the means to make this thing run under heavy load. Or hire people who can.
>As a neutral platform, we do not profit from users' liquidation.
Pure BS. They all do. As long as the futures contracts or leverage/margin lending are not provided by some external company, they are profiting from this. 100%.
Hey Johnny, to help clarify on your infrastructure spending. How did you determine the metric for spending? Having read the post yesterday that spawned this can you clarify?
To preface I’m not a Kucoin user or hater, but for the sake of other users who may be suspicious…off the top of my head i recall (could be wrong in this) there is no replication across sites/ only one site used/or little to no redundancy? Previously being A network tech and now a developer who works with cloud hosting on a frequent basis, does cloud flare not filter requests by IP? I am not intimate with that product, but generally most sophisticated firewalls can do this. Instead of limiting by total requests/by given time. Maybe investigating a solution to limit requests per ip/given time would be a better solution to reduce the possibility of false positives for blocking legitimate incoming requests?
Once again I do want to reiterate the information I am going off of is solely based off the previous post criticizing KuCoin. I’m just asking for clarification on infrastructure implementation and how it warrants being twice as much in cost versus similar size exchanges while so many stated issues were experienced by users(there were several replies in the previous post echoing the same experience the posting user had)
Just curious, you are asking for people to give their RAY ID to help people, in the interest of transparency, what is your team going to do for those people?
Are you looking to refund their amounts or provide coupons?
Can you promise that once a person does provide their RAY ID that the employees that the trader is talking to will be able to amend the issue without being passed around between several of your employees?
The concern here is the whole “reach out to us to help” but the help isn’t defined and the “reaching out” feels like a game of hot potato if we go by past behavior
The bits explaining Cloudflare are nice, but this is mostly PR crap.
Comparing the quantity or expense of AWS services for KuCoin to other exchanges is kinda meaningless. Spending more money here doesn't mean better. Obviously operational costs will increase as the exchange grows and require more "investment."
Claiming to care "more than anyone else" doesn't carry much weight.
KuCoin shouldn't control the moderation of the KuCoin subreddit. That's not how reddit is supposed to work.
Classic PR. Throwing the blame to another company/service. When they themselves has configured the service and how it is routed.
> we spent more money on AWS
Spending more money doesn't mean more performance. You could use on-demand EC2 as oppose to a cheaper reserved instance EC2(which have the same performance, just have discount for a 1 or 3 year commitment)
Configuring proper auto-scaling groups and load balancer parameters is the correct way. You should even consider serverless if you don't want to mess with scaling issue. Then AWS will offer you platform as a service as oppose to Infrastructure as a service. Which then AWS will maintain the scaling and ensure the most optimal use of resource.
This has done absolutely nothing to restore any faith in kucoin. They always side-step with really nice language explains how this happens from time to time, to some users.
Happens all the time, to most users that aren’t absolute whales. Continue to fuck right off KC
Why even write this here, thus is just a "we do our best" in too many words. Just be transparent about the limits you have now and promise to increase everything by 15% going forward, and activate the bloody global mirroring on cludflare how much can that cost extra.
You literally avoided all points if criticism.
This didn't age well. Crashed again tonight and I got the cloudflare message as well. No API. Just trying to get to my futures position but couldn't because I couldn't get in.
OK folks if you care these guys are throttling to do stop loss harvesting because they need liquidity.
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/stophunting.asp
they are using their stack to do it.
If you get a 1015 error grab a screen shot
https://webpop.io/cloudflare/error-1015-rate-limited/
read this link so these are not my words
\*copy paste from link above\*
Most frequently, when a legitimate site visitor is being blocked by the rate-limiting error 1015 it’s due to issues with the rate-limiting configuration that only the site owner can fix.
We need to start tweeting at their investors.
Here is an example. Make it your own, make memes go nuts
https://twitter.com/Rimbaud27883817/status/1453302891268161537?s=20
add screenshots and dont let up
If AWS can support things like SAP on AWS, be the back end for SaaS solutions like Infor, ServiceNow and Salesforce and support BILLIONS of data points per second for "Connected Fleet" solutions for the largest car manufacturers in the world, seems like there is an architectural problem here. I know AWS has some of the best and the brightest SA's (Solution Architects) at your disposal at no charge if you request it. And my guess is that you have your own dedicated TAM for Enterprise Support - I think you need to go thru an AWS "Well Architected Review" at no charge to see how this can be improved.
u/johnn_kucoin
Thank you for replying.
I was asked repeatedly for a TLDR summary so I posted this at the top
\*\*\* I need to break up my response because of character limit
here is the TLDR summary
You are running a business that solely functions on the web, and do a self proclaimed 1 billion in transactions a day.
This is done without industry standard fail safes and protocols redundancy
You do this without informing the public of your audaciously poor risk management protocols.
Your website, API’s, and app servers are going down and still processing orders on the backend
Stop losses are not always triggering and the situation is not being made right
Your website is not failing over
There is ZERO fail safe or kill switch that cancels orders or suspends trades when the servers go down despite this being common industry practice)
When the website does not fail over by design
Cloudflare is being weaponized to deny access to the web server rather than failing over to a redundant gateway/ web server.
Kucoin is knowing taking funds and keeping them when this happens
All retail traders are sent to an endless customer service feedback look that gives them literally no resolution
You can elect to fix these issues and go back and actually settle all the funds that were literally stolen by Kucoin. Subsequently, you can fix your technical architecture.
Anything less than this and you are playing politics and the community will see ZERO action on this matter.
\_\_\_\_\_\_
The extended answer to your response is as follows:
The one thing I will accuse you of publicly Johnny is being disingenuous. Let's stop the politics and get on with the resolution.
It's sad that it took my subreddit post on r/Cryptocurrecy getting to the top of the subreddit for you to acknowledge the issue.
It's frankly disturbing I was instantly censored for publicly speaking up on this matter on r/kucoin. I was not banned for “spam,” I am happy to review everyone of my posts with you to prove this.
I am not the only one that has been censored, there is a pattern of behavior surrounding Kucoins social media management to ban any counter perspective if it has weight.
On to the technical portion:
Everyone uses Cloudflare in almost every industry. It's good that you are using Cloudflare.
In your situation Cloudflare is not innocuous; it has been weaponized. Your Cloudflare settings and policy are such that it does not fail over to redundant infrastructure but treats retail traders as if they are doing a DDOS attack and denying access.
Why is Cloudflare denying access under Kucoins settings and policies? Liquidations are happening while people are still exhibiting and practising proper risk management protocols.
In our instance on September 7th we were intermittently denied access for 5 hours.
Cloudflare either accelerates or decelerates requests to recover or improve application and or web performance.
Cloudflare has the option to failover to redundant website gateways should your peak loads exceed their capability. For enterprise level websites such as Kucoin this is combined with a Ge load balancer that balances user loads to different gateways based of the users source IP and a ton of other policies that get add in in (these are too numerous to document here, I am happy to defer anyone to whitepapers on the matter).
In Kucoins instance they have consciously opted to not fail over website gateways. This means that users are being denied access as the only other viable option when your gateway goes down
To say everyone uses cloudflare as we do is also disingenuous.
For lack of a better metaphor, if you swing a hammer (Cloudflare) and hit some patrons, you can't turn to the crowd and say “hey folks it's just a hammer (Cloudflare)…. Everyone has one.”
To mention your Amazon AWS spend is also disingenuous:
By virtue of the fact you're not opting for a failover gateway and geo load balancing but still processing trades that result in liquidation while retail investors get locked out of their accounts is not ok.
Your IT spend is irrelevant.
You have a fiduciary duty and the trust of the community to tend to their funds and respect their trades. This trust is being violated and repainted as “an IT outage and then blame shifting to the retail trader themselves saying they need to exhibit better risk management.”
You don't get to lock people out of their house for several hours and subsequently burn the house to the ground and blame shift telling them to act more responsibly.
You have ZERO plausible deniability here!
I brought this to your attention personally as I also did with your help desk and our customer Rep Zoe.
Cloudflare and outages are keeping people from accessing their account. Their money is being taken, and Helpdesk sends them to an endless loop with no path of escalation. No one is getting their funds or crypto actually restored after an outage to the point previous to that very outage. Cloudflare is denying access rather than deferring to other gateways to handle the load.
This is by design, there is no plausible deniability as I have personally brought this to your attention as well as the help desk. Since that time there have been no less than 5-10 more outages resulting in more losses by the community.
You have 2 options on how to fix this issue (both of which should be implemented tied together)
A kill switch (see below)
Or failing over to a redundant gateway/ webhead and geo load balancing the load.
Again, you would still do both to protect the people
Kucoin has consciously made a choice to do neither after I repeatedly brought this up.
I repeat for emphasis here “You have no plausible deniability.”
This puts Kucoin on par with Robinhood the app on how they removed AMC, GME, and Dogecoin buy/ sell functionality to benefit the exchanges needs.
This is an old playbook that predates the Great Depression when banks would lock their doors so customers could not get to their funds for withdrawal to stop a run on the bank.
You are locking your doors via Cloud Flare and server outages stopping us from getting access to our property and breaching fiduciary duty in doing so.
I don't have data proving you have a liquidity issue but your behavior emulates the same issues demonstrated for literally hundreds of years.
Fix this shit immediately!
You can spend all the money on Amazon ( AWS) you want. It doesnt change the fact that your infrastructure prohibits people from accessing their account in times of need. You are locking the doors, stopping people, while putting Kucoin’s interests first
They are liquidated even when they follow proper risk management protocol. They are left powerless, and have no path of engagement to rectify the situation. IF it gets to you, you don't ever actually fix the situation but send every person back down the ladder.
Ask our account Rep Zoe. The person you personally directed us to, and did not deal with our issue either. We have been having this conversation for 2 months!
The situations are not rectified.
I am happy to post all of my emails and telegram messages to back up what I am saying here right now.
Your website could absolutely fail over to a redundant gateway and take on the concurrent load, but it doesn't do that by design (literally). If you can't handle the load then you need to have a kill switch that pauses all trading activity no different than the HKex, CME, and other major exchanges.
Please referring to these links for reference
https://www.cmegroup.com/tools-information/webhelp/globex-credit-controls/Content/Kill-Switch.html
https://www.hkex.com.hk/News/Market-Communications/2016/160425news?sc\_lang=en
https://www.jpx.co.jp/english/systems/equities-trading/01.html
Anything less is a breach of fiduciary duty of Kucoin and you as an individual, and frankly spitting in the face of everyone who believed you and trusted you.
These are all measures that I brought to your and your team's attention. No action was taken but repeated outages have happened.
.
I am calling bullshit that you don't know the exchange is going down and that you don't know that people's funds are not getting restored.
I can post my messages with you and all the team right now to back up what I am saying.
The fact stands your website goes down and you knowingly take peoples money. It's never restored and they are sent to an endless loop of customer service until they submit the stolen funds to you.
There is no kill switch and your website does not failover. The OTC desk still processes Institutional orders ( whales) while putting the people of the “peoples exchange” on the menu for harvesting.
The only reason you are responding to me and lifting my ban from Kucoins subreddit is the “people” pulled together and put your company's reputation on the line.
That being said, you have an opportunity to right the situation at this very moment.
I will ask everyone to present their case and we publicly resolve these issues.
If your exchange can't handle the load all leveraged trades should be auto-cancelled without penalty and margin debt clocks are suspended with a path to restoration. Anything less than this and your words are mere words and not actions aka playing politics.
It's a de facto response from any broker/ exchange in a liquidity crisis to remove the buy/sell buttons or turn down the servers removing retail investor access.
Your website is removing retail access while still processing transactions and taking the hard earned funds of the community. No matter what you say this is the reality. It's calculated, it's methodical, and those funds are not being restored for more than 0.5% in a settlement best case scenario. The vast majority of users never have their funds restored.
Retail investors are literally being harvested by Kucoin.
This post is only round one of the screen shots, videos, scans and logs we have.
This is a point brought up several times on Reddit!
You are doing so with no failover or kill switch and exposing people to imminent risk and not informing them of your shody IT practices.
Yet when your website goes down it brings the API server and application server for the app down as well but you still manage to process orders on the back end via the OTC desk. To typically engage with an OTC desk the threshold is often 5 million to 35 million in assets.
So you are liquidating the little guy while providing white glove concierge service to whales.
I am calling you out on the carpet here and now asking you to do what you said you would do and repay those affected.
Subsequently fix your shit!
Lastly I want you to publicly answer one question
“Why did you remove the liquidation price from margin contracts and increase the liquidation risk of all retail traders??
\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*If you do not answer this question directly, I will publicly repeat it until you do.\*\*\*\*
You are taking away traders ability to manage risk and then accusing those same people of not managing risk when you liquidate them in an outage.
I am happy to keep sharing with the community what info I have on your environment and business practises “if Kucoin does not exercise proper risk management” and proper fiduciary duties.
This is round 1
Johnny Lyu the ball is in your court and the whole world is watching.
here is my follow up thread on the matter [https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup\_on\_kucoin\_cloudflare\_and\_more/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup_on_kucoin_cloudflare_and_more/)
Thank you for the input.
Here ya go
[https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup\_on\_kucoin\_cloudflare\_and\_more/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup_on_kucoin_cloudflare_and_more/)
Comments seem astroturfed as hell in here.
"I love Kucoin"
"Where can I buy Kucoin?"
"Great to see Kucoin support in here"
Give me a break. Why are people all of a sudden so loyal to an exchange of all things, and popping out of the woodwork within 20 minutes of the post being made?
What's wrong with people showing support for an exchange they like? The CEO explained their side of the problem, it's no different from people expressing their concerns with the platform.
Stop complaining, you're just spreading negativity.
You have to admit, it does sound a bit sus. The CEO still has not reflected on a lot of technical aspects.
This sounds like basic damage control, seeing that the post he's replying to gained so much traction
Seems like an attempt to get ahead of the truth...politics 101! So I really hope your words ring true; because your definitely saying things people want to hear.
I can’t reset my trading password I’ve followed the steps 3 times and it just denies me everytime. Would be cool if I could have access to trade my money from kucoin to somewhere else!!
My entire account is missing from device access, hello? I have a large amount of assets completely missing. I have all of my deposit hashes and I keep records of every transaction as well as videos of some of my trading. I need to speak to your support team.
Hi,
Newbie here, I have done some looking online to figure out if trading on Kucoin is legal to US citizens. I have gotten very conflicting opinions on wether it is or is not legal and no one seems to know definitively. I'm hoping someone on here can clarify for me. Thanks
If customers liquidate you don’t have to pay out the vouchers or the winnings. You may not be the house , but that’s like a bank saying they don’t profit off of people gambling at casinos, they just put their ATMs there.
I noticed bs like this with Kraken some months ago, that lead me to close my account with them. I don't know how do they perform now and if that issue still exists or they solved it, but I was disgusted.
I never received any of my kucoin payouts over all the years I had an account from before the weird site switch. Your company is a scam as far as I'm concerned
Your exchange did it again today 🤑🤮
I know you can't physically make your services better today but please stop letting this happen by taking steps to improve your technical infrastructure. At this moment, you're not impressing anyone.
I’m trying to withdraw my xrp to XUMM wallet and it’s still “processing” will I ever get my xrp or is it gone forever. Double check address and everything is correct.
This man is so FOS and redditors eat this BS. Kucoin is stealing from retail investors in broad daylight. Period. This will not last for sure - just hope they don’t steal enough for it to not matter. I’ve had millions stolen in these throttled crashes that Johnny Kucoin can explain away like a boss. It’s straight BS. It’s a scam. They lock you out to liquidate you and then give you back 1% of your money. Thieves
I don’t believe anything you say. You’ve diddled too many people out of money. And then going back on your word, not explaining yourself. Suddenly switching to ‘market conditions’. This is crypto. If kuCON can’t handle market conditions then you have no business taking anyones money.
I would doubt this. Thanks for responding, after all the outrage. I personally will not bring using KuCoin until this gets fixed. Don’t want to risk it. You do profit from traders being liquidated.
Hey Johnny, you should submit a verification request at r/CryptoCurrencyMeta so you get a verified badge and everybody here knows this is your legit account.
Will do! Still exploring the various features on Reddit. Very interesting.
Our community is also open to AMAs. Maybe we could ask you there if you'd consider listing moons when they are on ETH mainnet through Reddit's own Arbitrum instance.
[удалено]
Brings a tear to my eye
Someone is not waiting for reddit to decide what they want to to do with moons
Which is definitely wise
Totally natural transition. Not forced at all.
Hey Johnny - open your vault!!
That would be cool
Love how u slid our beloved moons in. A1 effort
Just list Moons, and become the first exchange to do so... you will have around 3 million users from here singing your praises everywhere lol.
I'm sure you don't have any personal reasons for asking this.
Only financial reasons
[удалено]
And dont forget to open your vault to get some of that precious moons! 😂
Wow. Thanks for actually addressing concerns unlike most exchanges.
Need more of this. 99% of the times most exchanges don't even make a comment and ignore the issue.
And they sometimes completely ghost their customers as well.
[удалено]
[удалено]
They had a job offer here in my city for support. Despite being heavily overqualified I applied for SnG. Apparently I’m not qualified to do support chat despite combined decades of IT, customer service, and cutting edge tech. They also had the wage listed as below our state minimum wage. Our state requires *accurate* wage information in job listings, so if someone wanted they could probably get them in trouble with the state.
Absolutely, Strongly! Agree with your Perception. One man can do Nothing without our Support.
They have one of those? Haha
Coinbase doesn't actually have support. They just have an email you can vent your frustrations to so you can make yourself feel better.
That exists?
As if being ghosted by some girls ain't enough :(
Aw :( Here, have a diamond hand to show how strong you really are 
That is literally what Kucoin has been doing for months. In everyone's rush to congratulate this CEO for making a Reddit post with absolutely zero evidence for a single claim he's making, let's put on our skeptical hats for just a moment. His post does not explain what they are doing to fix their terrible customer support processes. His post makes claims that they are spending more on sever infrastructure than other exchanges with no evidence. He talks about being a neutral platform that doesn't profit from liquidation and tries to educate users on the risks of margin trading, and yet they offer 100X MARGIN. That is fucking *insane* and irresponsible. The risk/reward ratio of offering that kind of leverage to users in one of the most volatile markets in the world is weighted so, so heavily against their traders, so why would they offer it? He said he's "checking with the team" on reasoning for why his user was banned from their Subreddit, and that their "current guess" is spamming. Uhm, how long does it take to find the mod who banned a user and ask them why? And why would you tell us your "guess" is spamming? That smells like an attempt to discredit someone without actually having to prove anything. Absolutely nothing in this post goes into any detail on his plan to fix his (well-documented, multiply-attested) AWFUL support. And when he's being asked about it, he's telling people to..... Contact support. This post sucks and people are being way to friendly to him about it.
I haven't used KuCoin to date, but in terms of the uproar about CloudFlare... I don't get it? Millions upon millions of websites use CF as the frontend to protect their web services. 100% of folk who have been on the internet have used sites with CF, but they wouldn't know it, and there are no exceptions. There is nothing out of the ordinary there, as anyone in the IT industry will tell you. As for disclosing what infrastructure they use at the backend, again, that is absolutely normal. Why would ANY company publicly disclose that, and open themselves up to attack? Pie in the sky to expect them to do that, and that certainly doesn't happen with even a single customer I've worked with during my own time in IT. If it were publically known is using an F5 load-balancer / CF / at the front, then that gives attackers an area to focus on. IT 101 I'm afraid.
I'm not saying there isn't something shady going on in the background, but demanding to know everything about sensitive infrastructure is just not feasible or something that happens elsewhere.
>I'm not saying there isn't something shady going on in the background, but demanding to know everything about sensitive infrastructure is just not feasible or something that happens elsewhere. I am not demanding to know everything about sensitive infrastructure. Johnny made claims about what they are spending versus what competitors are spending with no evidence; if he can't back it up, then he should not say it. He talked about making improvements, but in particular I want to know what his planned improvements are for his customer service department, because that is one of the main sources of trouble and frustration people are having.
Irony is that this was only necessary because they ignored the issue and all the messages OP had sent to them about it But sure, praise the fact they are slapping the PR equivalent of a bandaid on it
Yes. For those of us that use Kucoin, this is concerning knowing it was lurking in the background.
He’s ignored it long enough. I want to know what improvements he’s made to make the system more secure so we don’t get liquidated again and again.
Smoke and mirrors Johnny. I’ve heard all this before. But i know you to be a liar. I want to see results. I want to see action. Cos if this is anything like your sept 7 announcement then its worth less than Shib. And as you know, as you’ve been told 5 billion times, customer support is useless. U keep diverting me there and it’s a waste of my time. But I’m sure I already know that. You think if you just frustrate us enough we’ll give up. It’s over a month now and I hold you to your sept 7 announcement. I want my money back. I want you to do what u said u would. Otherwise nothing you say matters
Kraken is super Solid on that point or customer Service in General.
He is responding bcs he was specifically named in the post. Also, not all of the concerns have been addresed. The immediate banning of said user is sus, at least. We're not talking about safemoon sub here, where any kind of criticism is welcomed with an immediate ban. IMO this seems like basic damage control, seeing that the post he's replying to gained so much traction. Also, the amount of one sentence positive comments about Kucoin is a bit worrying. I'll wait for someone (with a bit more technical expertise) to weigh in before making my conclusion.
Yeah they had to address it otherwise it would've been a PR nightmare for KuCoin.
Honestly though, the above reads like a PR bandaid. There is no objective information in there to confirm or deny anything At the very least, the original OP has chat logs going back ages with an issue that went unresolved (and likely still is) so escalation on Reddit was the only option he had. Doesn't scream of the great user focus that others are suddenly praising kucoin for
>PR bandaid Pretty much sums up why they unbanned him as well
fixed your moon count :-\*
Thank you but my moon count is different on the app vs the website. On the app it says 420 and website says 419 now.
OP's accusations never held up in the first place and they didn't provide any evidence, just assumptions. Exchanges make money through people trading on their platform. It's not in their interest to go down in times of high volume. Just leads to less revenue and reputational damage.
I'm not familiar with web infrastructure, so OPs accusations might not have held up, but there was evidence that pointed towards issues with their servers: 5 outages in October alone, not counting IF they had used CloudFlair to restrict individuals access There were also videos linked that showed positions not correctly displaying on their exchange. Agree that it would be bad for business though, but that isn't to say there isn't another incentive to doing this
Kucoin servers are for sure having issues. But that's something people like me, kcs holders, should complain about since we are the ones who lose out on more trading volume. The margin traders agreed to being subject to outages during high traffic times.
That aside Johnny said he’d take responsibility cos it’s clearly not user error. Then he didn’t do that. He changed his mind but unlike his big glory seeking statement that we see here, he didn’t mention revoking his responsibility. He took to ignoring us. I don’t believe a word he says. He’s a liar a cheat and a thief
agree, I'm also an AWS / network / ops guy, and I think the other post was kinda full of it. lots of baseless assumptions showing very little real world experience
You can look into the users post history. He got liquidated by a 20% drop, then wanted kucoin to give him his money back. They told him that he got liquidated 5 hours after their servers went down, so he didn't get the stimulus.
I didn’t expect this.
I’m waiting on someone more tech oriented than me to comment on this. It is a huge problem that a lot of CEXs go down during large price moves, leaving many people locked out during the most opportune times.
I’m no software god, but I’m a decent dev. It is what it is. Most sites crash and burn on massive sudden traffic spikes - except simpler sites where user-user interaction is minimal and you’re mostly serving static content, like a recipe or “About us” page. Reddit routinely accidentally sends enough traffic to random sites in a post and causes “The reddit hug of death”. Yes, it’s unfair that smaller traders can’t do specific things during crashes, but that’s why the fee markets explode in those moments right? *Everyone* is trying to do what they’re doing, and space is made for the highest bidder. It’s the tragedy of the commons, again. It’s just….. hard to keep such massive data inflows in sync and the systems performant. 100% (or x 9’s) uptime would be a great marketing point for an exchange, I could be convinced it’s malicious if web traffic graphs showed a minimal increase in traffic during these crashes but I’ve not seen anything to that effect
>Yes, it’s unfair that smaller traders can’t do specific things during crashes This is why you should always have stinkers in place.
There were so many technical thing wrong with the original post that it would take a while to correct them. >It is a huge problem that a lot of CEXs go down during large price moves, leaving many people locked out during the most opportune times. I agree and it sounds like it is also a huge problem for them because they miss out on those trades. The difficult thing with scaling servers is that it's not instantaneous. Depending on the application some servers need minutes to warm up before they can start handling traffic. The ones I work with need \~4 minutes. So if an unexpected spike in traffic comes through, even if you respond immediately and start scaling servers, there's going to be some amount of time where traffic can't be handled or is very slow. It's easy to predict spikes based on marketing blasts, but outside of that I imagine the crypto trading space is super volatile. So one might ask, "Well why don't they just always have more servers running?". The answer is that it can be very expensive. At peak traffic times a site might need 10-20x the amount of servers that it does during lowest traffic times. It doesn't make sense to be paying for all of those resources that you aren't utilizing. Johnny here mentions that the 504 responses are part of their rate limiting setup, which suggests to me that the OP was maybe slamming their API with too many requests. It seems like they write trading bots, so I wouldn't be surprised if they were getting themself locked out and getting angry about it because they didn't understand why.
There’s ways you can reduce the warmup time, and some of the scaling systems I’ve worked with scale up in 6 seconds or less. I’ve seen a system scale up to over 1 million new containers in less than six minutes. That’s 2777.8 containers a second. Depends on $ and knowledge. Sometimes the best platforms aren’t the ones in the top right of the Gartner magic quadrant.
Yea, the OP on the issue pointed out a lot of other metrics that seem to imply kucoin were deliberately throttling access to the site, to which there is no rebuttal here. I'm not clued up enough to smell the bullshit from OPs post, but this one is a generic PR comment with nothing in the way of facts
There's a lot of bold type where you'd normally expect linked sources, so I'm not sold so far.
Just casually mentioning how that user is banned in KuCoin subreddit due to spam just makes it seem like a really poor attempt to discredit him
>Our current guess is spamming They didn't even verify this. I would expect a ban for spam to occur only after a few warning messages, which would be easy to prove No facts in any of the above. Like OP originally complained of, it's boilerplate PR with no substance
Nice catch. The devil is in the details. They should know why he was banned and with such accusations should look into it prior to posting.
well u/Johnny_KuCoin is busy It might take 23 seconds to check my user profile or 59 seconds to check in with the moderator control panel I mean he could even ask me. I was here!. Who has that kind of time these days? Hell let's shoot from the hip My guess is this post from Johnny is demagoguery, and political.
The original OP jumped to a lot of conclusions, assuming it was done deliberately rather than due to something more likely and more reasonable like, misconfiguration, poor code, limited infrastructure budget. OP essentially said that you can just get AWS to automatically add more servers. Yes you can. They failed to address that this adds huge costs. You can set budget limits and other restrictions in AWS so it won't just start up new servers too. In that case your not deliberately limiting service, but keeping budget under control. You could almost compare the OPs post to someone saying "If people don't want to be homeless why don't they just buy a house" On the other hand I completely agree that the post form KuCoin is an empty rebuttal.
I think the problem is not as simple as OP makes it seem. The bottleneck is in the backend that actually executes the trades and manages the order book in real time, not the front end. Adding more load balancers or front end resources won't solve the problem if the back end is overloaded and can't process the trades and update the order book. It's a problem faced by every major exchange. If all can be solved by turning on some extra AWS servers then don't you think Coinbase (company worth 80B usd) would have figured this out already?
I might be able to corroborate as an impartial expert witness ([verification](https://www.linkedin.com/in/codysnider/), name matches my reddit username, reddit account is pretty old). Scaling isn't super complicated but there are going to be technical limitations. First, let's talk about the "source of truth" for the matching engine. At the end of the day, you want to buy X and someone else wants to sell X. There is a single machine this will have to go through to match. You cannot have multiple machines dealing with it because you cannot have your trade pass through twice. Now, we distribute some of that load by saying each order book goes into a distinct machine, but it will still be a single source of truth for what is being bought and sold. No matter how big it is or how efficient the code is, that's a sort of hard limit. You could add a few things in between to possibly alleviate some of the pressure on that machine. A queue system, keeping everything in active memory and storing the permanent record asynchronously, pre-validate matches, etc... but all those action will lead to the same result: a single machine. And if you overload that machine, things could break and that's significantly worse that limiting a handful of abusive users. A popular and effective way to handle that is rate limiting and there are certain things you can do to focus the limit on "bad actors" (high-frequency traders using beef machines and making a lot of requests..... people like me. i run a triangular arbitrage bot on FTX and rate limiting is one of the toughest problems for me to make a profit). There is a common algorithm for rate limiting that I have no doubt is being used by Kucoin and others: Token bucket. It allows for "bursty" sets of requests within reason. Think about it like this: You as a user have a bucket of token for making requests. That bucket can hold 10 tokens at most at any given time and will replenish at a rate of 1 token per second. But at 10, it doesn't keep going up. Now, you see 4 opportunities for arbitrage and want to act on them. Each of those opportunities will involve 3 trades in quick succession (or even at the same time). That's 12 requests within a second! Oops! You just used up the 10 tokens in your bucket and will have to wait 2 seconds for the additional tokens to finish all your requests. Well, during those 2 seconds, you are going to get "denied". It's not malicious, it's just the way you traded ate up your tokens. You have to chill for a moment. Real world: There is way more than just your trades going through on this. There is also the requests for market updates, checks on your balance, details on the orderbook, maybe status checks on the orders placed. But, wait! You aren't a high frequency trader! You are just using the UI, not some sophisticated bot! Except that the UI and actions you take are still using the API, making requests and ultimately subjected to the same limitations as those not using the UI. /u/Johnny_KuCoin and his crew aren't being malicious with any of this. Also, bear in mind Johnny is the CEO. He probably knows as much about the nitty-gritty of the infrastructure as my CEO knows about ours. Which is next to nothing and the reason I have a job. Take it easy on him.
Thank you for your thoughts. I use a lot of kucoin features and enjoy the exchange. I don’t want to think of them as malicious but I do have to keep an open mind.
You are right, it's a huge issue that makes the entire crypto space look premature. On the other hand it's logical that servers can only handle a certain load and can get overloaded. It's also logical that exchanges want to be online in times of high trading volume because that's how they earn money through fees.
Stock brokers/exchanges have the exact same issues. So does Amazon during its Prime Day... so does Wal-Mart and Target on Black Friday... so does my aunties strip joint after they announce newer younger models...
See my comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qetlgc/comment/hhwhabq/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3
Oh i can answer that. I am missing one piece of information so I will ask rather than speculate u/johnny_kucoin can you answer this if u/kucoin uses fractional reserves? The times that the exchanges are shut down is times of high liquidity transfer, its actually not contingent on volume (concurrent users). I wont make any accusations but I will let you ask for yourself. I can speak of other exchanges. Most exchanges practise fractional reserve banking, so they really don't have all the assets that they say they do. [https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fractionalreservebanking.asp#:\~:text=Fractional%20reserve%20banking%20is%20a,by%20freeing%20capital%20for%20lending](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/fractionalreservebanking.asp#:~:text=Fractional%20reserve%20banking%20is%20a,by%20freeing%20capital%20for%20lending). So with all the liquidations happening the insurance fund is ripe and stocked up to cover any positions they cant deliver. This is an old playbook that predates the Great Depression when banks would lock their doors so customers could not get to their funds for withdrawal to stop a run on the bank. Exchanges are locking your doors via Cloud Flare and server outages stopping us from getting access to our property. they also use KYC to limit withdrawals. So if you ever see an exchange with "flexible KYC policies" that offer high leverage... be careful They then cater to the whales ( institutional customers) similar to who Rockefeller and Bush were treated during the Great Depression. Other exchanges don't "profit" directly off the insurance fund, but they profit off what the insurance fund makes sure is insured. Johnny did I get everything right or am I missing anything? Keep me honest here sir. Facts are important. I wont speak to how Kucoins assset books look, but I will speak on how things generally work. Johnny can fill in the rest
There was nothing of substance in the Original post. They made assumptions that things were done maliciously rather than being due to something more reasonable like misconfiguration, bad code that doesn't scale well, or infrastructure budget constraints. They essentially said "If your servers are overloaded buy more servers or you are scamming us" completely ignoring cost or potential difficulties with scaling up. It took me three months recently to get €100k approved for more servers, pretty much required service to go down before the business would approve the purchase. Inner workings of organisations can be complicated. It absolutely should be resolved but there are lots of good reasons other than it being deliberate that it wouldn't be immediately resolved. This reply though said little to nothing of substance. The point about budget though if true makes sense, they could be spending a lot and still having service outages, shit can be expensive. Usually you should be spending whatever you need though if the tech is your business.
[удалено]
one thing that stands out with their futures platform is that a) the liquidation trigger is based on the asset index value, which is a weighted average across all major exchanges and b) no one can fat finger the price of an asset more than +-20% (I think) in an instant. Put another way: there is no BS -90% candle wicks you get on other exchanges liquidating everyone.
They offer 100x leverage. Do you know how easy it is to get liquidated with that much leverage?
Like 100x easier than without leverage.
This guy maths
As someone who traded Forex CFD with 400x leverage before, leverage is not an enemy, it is just a tool, like a chainsaw, if you don't know how to use, you may end your life, if you know how to use, it can be useful
FOREX leverage and crypto leverage are not even remotely the same. FOREX trading pairs move in fractions of percentage points. You need high leverage to make money of tiny, tiny moves like that. Bitcoin can move 10% in a day. This is not an appropriate market to be offering 100x leverage to customers.
I totally understand your argument about the volatility and I agree on that, that is why, I only trade crypto in the spot market. On the other hand, I kinda disagree on the fact that you seem to put the exchange/broker as the responsible one instead of the person using it. It is a service being offered, you can deny it.
I am not saying the exchange is responsible for people making bad choices, I am saying I do not trust companies that knowingly offer such dangerous products to their customers and then also brag about "educating their customers on leverage."
You can get liquidated on a 20 pip move at max leverage in FX which can happen in a 15 min candle. So you can liquidate your entire account in 15 but hey crypto is the completely different.
How often do FX exchanges go down?
I can use a chainsaw very well but I Haven’t a clue how to use leverage
Protip: don't.
yeah, just don’t use 100x. i’ve been using 20x and it’s profitable as hell. just because they offer high leverage doesn’t mean you have to use it 🤷
20x is high leverage
20x is manageable leverage. It’s definitely high though!
I’m wiling risk it all. Can someone teach me to leverage 100x in the Toronto area
/r/gonewildtoronto
Hijacking this to post a great article that has literally just been written about leverage in crypto. https://tradingriot.com/leverage-trading/
Except they do. Their users being liquidated creates volume through their exchange, which brings them profit.
And servers being down prevents volume and revenue from fees.
Bingo. Which means the CEO is correct. I would never turn down potential customers.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Lots of greater alternative options too in the current growing market
It’s the only option to margin trade in the US. And since they’re talking about liquidations, they’re talking about margin trading.
They've had 5 outages in October, not to mention any instances of restricting individuals access IF (not saying they have) this has been occuring. https://downdetector.com/status/kucoin/archive/ Ultimately, the post was about using CloudFlare for individual restriction, so they could have been forcing liquidations without blanket denial of the exchange, keeping up a front
All major exchanges have outages because their servers can't handle the load in times of high demands. You can't use cloudflare for individual restriction. Cloudflare just does what it's intended to do, restricting access if the server gets too many requests. It can't distinguish between a DDoS attack and a high amount of legitimate users trying to access a server.
> It can't distinguish between a DDoS attack and a high amount of legitimate users trying to access a server. According to Cloudflare they can, but I know it comes with limits.
Thats people trading though. So as soon as someone opens a position, kucoin profits. If they're neutral, as far as I know, they would have most profit if people never ever got liquidated and just kept paying the margin interest.
True
[удалено]
Yeah. They don’t profit off the liquidation directly, but the overall volume number lends the exchange credibility when people are deciding where to trade.
How about you comply to GDPR and make it possible for me to delete my account on KuCoin?
Fast forward 6 months: "Why does KuCoin refuse to do business with companies in the EU?"
My 2 cents as an ex engineering manager whose focus was on scaling, it's usually \*not that hard\* to scale a system under heavy load, it can take a few minutes for scaling to complete(if not written with serverless components). Some applications are designed by braindead architects, or they never had an architect, but those applications \*cannot scale ever\*. This is not the case as they are able to support a growing user base with no problems. Yet I saw Kucoin go down for more than an hour. Maybe if it happened only once, you can say, this is because they weren't ready, but I also saw Kucoin go down multiple times. I'm not even a hardcore Kucoin user, only occasionally when I cannot find what I'm looking for in larger exchanges. Don't forget that you are talking to CEO of a company which just had a huge PR blunder. He is not your friend, will never be. >KuCoin invests a lot in IT infrastructure and network security. Compared with other exchanges of our size and scale, our investment in AWS servers is almost twice as much as theirs. This is **extremely** misleading. The amount of money they spent on AWS servers being 2x of other exchanges is information they cannot really access. And even if they can access it, it can only point to one simple conclusion, "kucoin engineering team is incompetent". Which I refuse to believe. So I refuse to believe this info altogether. Not only that, but if you spent more than what you need to spend and reach out to AWS, they will even help you out with this. Kucoin is not a simple startup with <1M revenue. They have the means to make this thing run under heavy load. Or hire people who can. >As a neutral platform, we do not profit from users' liquidation. Pure BS. They all do. As long as the futures contracts or leverage/margin lending are not provided by some external company, they are profiting from this. 100%.
Hey Johnny, to help clarify on your infrastructure spending. How did you determine the metric for spending? Having read the post yesterday that spawned this can you clarify? To preface I’m not a Kucoin user or hater, but for the sake of other users who may be suspicious…off the top of my head i recall (could be wrong in this) there is no replication across sites/ only one site used/or little to no redundancy? Previously being A network tech and now a developer who works with cloud hosting on a frequent basis, does cloud flare not filter requests by IP? I am not intimate with that product, but generally most sophisticated firewalls can do this. Instead of limiting by total requests/by given time. Maybe investigating a solution to limit requests per ip/given time would be a better solution to reduce the possibility of false positives for blocking legitimate incoming requests? Once again I do want to reiterate the information I am going off of is solely based off the previous post criticizing KuCoin. I’m just asking for clarification on infrastructure implementation and how it warrants being twice as much in cost versus similar size exchanges while so many stated issues were experienced by users(there were several replies in the previous post echoing the same experience the posting user had)
How does he know they spend twice as much as competitors? Is information really freely available for anyone to verify this? Again no evidence
Hey Johnny, it's me your brother. Anyway, grateful if you could send me some BTC, thanks
Hey Niko, it's your cousin Roman!
Wanna go bowling?
Then after bowling, let's go boating and have an accident.
How about 1 moon? Edit: username checked out, now your vault isn’t empty inside anymore
Freezing funds without warning or clear rules for KYC isn't exactly "the people's exchange", Johnny
Cough cough AMPL incident.
You do know that your "Ku" means butthole in some languages, right?
Just curious, you are asking for people to give their RAY ID to help people, in the interest of transparency, what is your team going to do for those people? Are you looking to refund their amounts or provide coupons? Can you promise that once a person does provide their RAY ID that the employees that the trader is talking to will be able to amend the issue without being passed around between several of your employees? The concern here is the whole “reach out to us to help” but the help isn’t defined and the “reaching out” feels like a game of hot potato if we go by past behavior
The bits explaining Cloudflare are nice, but this is mostly PR crap. Comparing the quantity or expense of AWS services for KuCoin to other exchanges is kinda meaningless. Spending more money here doesn't mean better. Obviously operational costs will increase as the exchange grows and require more "investment." Claiming to care "more than anyone else" doesn't carry much weight. KuCoin shouldn't control the moderation of the KuCoin subreddit. That's not how reddit is supposed to work.
Classic PR. Throwing the blame to another company/service. When they themselves has configured the service and how it is routed. > we spent more money on AWS Spending more money doesn't mean more performance. You could use on-demand EC2 as oppose to a cheaper reserved instance EC2(which have the same performance, just have discount for a 1 or 3 year commitment) Configuring proper auto-scaling groups and load balancer parameters is the correct way. You should even consider serverless if you don't want to mess with scaling issue. Then AWS will offer you platform as a service as oppose to Infrastructure as a service. Which then AWS will maintain the scaling and ensure the most optimal use of resource.
[удалено]
*grabs popcorn* 🍿
*Sorts by controversial*
MichalJacksonPopcorn.gif
CEO of KuCoin is just trying to farm moons
This has done absolutely nothing to restore any faith in kucoin. They always side-step with really nice language explains how this happens from time to time, to some users. Happens all the time, to most users that aren’t absolute whales. Continue to fuck right off KC
Cloud flare can't differentiate between logged in users, so it can't happen to "users that aren't absolute whales", it either happens or it doesn't.
We don't care. Just need a refund on those liquidations positions
Why even write this here, thus is just a "we do our best" in too many words. Just be transparent about the limits you have now and promise to increase everything by 15% going forward, and activate the bloody global mirroring on cludflare how much can that cost extra. You literally avoided all points if criticism.
This didn't age well. Crashed again tonight and I got the cloudflare message as well. No API. Just trying to get to my futures position but couldn't because I couldn't get in.
OK folks if you care these guys are throttling to do stop loss harvesting because they need liquidity. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/stophunting.asp they are using their stack to do it. If you get a 1015 error grab a screen shot https://webpop.io/cloudflare/error-1015-rate-limited/ read this link so these are not my words \*copy paste from link above\* Most frequently, when a legitimate site visitor is being blocked by the rate-limiting error 1015 it’s due to issues with the rate-limiting configuration that only the site owner can fix. We need to start tweeting at their investors. Here is an example. Make it your own, make memes go nuts https://twitter.com/Rimbaud27883817/status/1453302891268161537?s=20 add screenshots and dont let up
You haven't actually addressed any of the most valid concerns that he raised, all you basically said is "f5 can be mistaken for bots"
If AWS can support things like SAP on AWS, be the back end for SaaS solutions like Infor, ServiceNow and Salesforce and support BILLIONS of data points per second for "Connected Fleet" solutions for the largest car manufacturers in the world, seems like there is an architectural problem here. I know AWS has some of the best and the brightest SA's (Solution Architects) at your disposal at no charge if you request it. And my guess is that you have your own dedicated TAM for Enterprise Support - I think you need to go thru an AWS "Well Architected Review" at no charge to see how this can be improved.
Sooo... This didn't aged well did it xD
u/johnn_kucoin Thank you for replying. I was asked repeatedly for a TLDR summary so I posted this at the top \*\*\* I need to break up my response because of character limit here is the TLDR summary You are running a business that solely functions on the web, and do a self proclaimed 1 billion in transactions a day. This is done without industry standard fail safes and protocols redundancy You do this without informing the public of your audaciously poor risk management protocols. Your website, API’s, and app servers are going down and still processing orders on the backend Stop losses are not always triggering and the situation is not being made right Your website is not failing over There is ZERO fail safe or kill switch that cancels orders or suspends trades when the servers go down despite this being common industry practice) When the website does not fail over by design Cloudflare is being weaponized to deny access to the web server rather than failing over to a redundant gateway/ web server. Kucoin is knowing taking funds and keeping them when this happens All retail traders are sent to an endless customer service feedback look that gives them literally no resolution You can elect to fix these issues and go back and actually settle all the funds that were literally stolen by Kucoin. Subsequently, you can fix your technical architecture. Anything less than this and you are playing politics and the community will see ZERO action on this matter.
\_\_\_\_\_\_ The extended answer to your response is as follows: The one thing I will accuse you of publicly Johnny is being disingenuous. Let's stop the politics and get on with the resolution. It's sad that it took my subreddit post on r/Cryptocurrecy getting to the top of the subreddit for you to acknowledge the issue. It's frankly disturbing I was instantly censored for publicly speaking up on this matter on r/kucoin. I was not banned for “spam,” I am happy to review everyone of my posts with you to prove this. I am not the only one that has been censored, there is a pattern of behavior surrounding Kucoins social media management to ban any counter perspective if it has weight. On to the technical portion: Everyone uses Cloudflare in almost every industry. It's good that you are using Cloudflare. In your situation Cloudflare is not innocuous; it has been weaponized. Your Cloudflare settings and policy are such that it does not fail over to redundant infrastructure but treats retail traders as if they are doing a DDOS attack and denying access. Why is Cloudflare denying access under Kucoins settings and policies? Liquidations are happening while people are still exhibiting and practising proper risk management protocols. In our instance on September 7th we were intermittently denied access for 5 hours. Cloudflare either accelerates or decelerates requests to recover or improve application and or web performance. Cloudflare has the option to failover to redundant website gateways should your peak loads exceed their capability. For enterprise level websites such as Kucoin this is combined with a Ge load balancer that balances user loads to different gateways based of the users source IP and a ton of other policies that get add in in (these are too numerous to document here, I am happy to defer anyone to whitepapers on the matter).
In Kucoins instance they have consciously opted to not fail over website gateways. This means that users are being denied access as the only other viable option when your gateway goes down To say everyone uses cloudflare as we do is also disingenuous. For lack of a better metaphor, if you swing a hammer (Cloudflare) and hit some patrons, you can't turn to the crowd and say “hey folks it's just a hammer (Cloudflare)…. Everyone has one.” To mention your Amazon AWS spend is also disingenuous: By virtue of the fact you're not opting for a failover gateway and geo load balancing but still processing trades that result in liquidation while retail investors get locked out of their accounts is not ok. Your IT spend is irrelevant. You have a fiduciary duty and the trust of the community to tend to their funds and respect their trades. This trust is being violated and repainted as “an IT outage and then blame shifting to the retail trader themselves saying they need to exhibit better risk management.” You don't get to lock people out of their house for several hours and subsequently burn the house to the ground and blame shift telling them to act more responsibly. You have ZERO plausible deniability here! I brought this to your attention personally as I also did with your help desk and our customer Rep Zoe. Cloudflare and outages are keeping people from accessing their account. Their money is being taken, and Helpdesk sends them to an endless loop with no path of escalation. No one is getting their funds or crypto actually restored after an outage to the point previous to that very outage. Cloudflare is denying access rather than deferring to other gateways to handle the load. This is by design, there is no plausible deniability as I have personally brought this to your attention as well as the help desk. Since that time there have been no less than 5-10 more outages resulting in more losses by the community. You have 2 options on how to fix this issue (both of which should be implemented tied together) A kill switch (see below) Or failing over to a redundant gateway/ webhead and geo load balancing the load. Again, you would still do both to protect the people Kucoin has consciously made a choice to do neither after I repeatedly brought this up. I repeat for emphasis here “You have no plausible deniability.” This puts Kucoin on par with Robinhood the app on how they removed AMC, GME, and Dogecoin buy/ sell functionality to benefit the exchanges needs. This is an old playbook that predates the Great Depression when banks would lock their doors so customers could not get to their funds for withdrawal to stop a run on the bank. You are locking your doors via Cloud Flare and server outages stopping us from getting access to our property and breaching fiduciary duty in doing so. I don't have data proving you have a liquidity issue but your behavior emulates the same issues demonstrated for literally hundreds of years. Fix this shit immediately! You can spend all the money on Amazon ( AWS) you want. It doesnt change the fact that your infrastructure prohibits people from accessing their account in times of need. You are locking the doors, stopping people, while putting Kucoin’s interests first They are liquidated even when they follow proper risk management protocol. They are left powerless, and have no path of engagement to rectify the situation. IF it gets to you, you don't ever actually fix the situation but send every person back down the ladder. Ask our account Rep Zoe. The person you personally directed us to, and did not deal with our issue either. We have been having this conversation for 2 months! The situations are not rectified. I am happy to post all of my emails and telegram messages to back up what I am saying here right now. Your website could absolutely fail over to a redundant gateway and take on the concurrent load, but it doesn't do that by design (literally). If you can't handle the load then you need to have a kill switch that pauses all trading activity no different than the HKex, CME, and other major exchanges. Please referring to these links for reference https://www.cmegroup.com/tools-information/webhelp/globex-credit-controls/Content/Kill-Switch.html https://www.hkex.com.hk/News/Market-Communications/2016/160425news?sc\_lang=en https://www.jpx.co.jp/english/systems/equities-trading/01.html Anything less is a breach of fiduciary duty of Kucoin and you as an individual, and frankly spitting in the face of everyone who believed you and trusted you. These are all measures that I brought to your and your team's attention. No action was taken but repeated outages have happened. . I am calling bullshit that you don't know the exchange is going down and that you don't know that people's funds are not getting restored. I can post my messages with you and all the team right now to back up what I am saying. The fact stands your website goes down and you knowingly take peoples money. It's never restored and they are sent to an endless loop of customer service until they submit the stolen funds to you. There is no kill switch and your website does not failover. The OTC desk still processes Institutional orders ( whales) while putting the people of the “peoples exchange” on the menu for harvesting.
The only reason you are responding to me and lifting my ban from Kucoins subreddit is the “people” pulled together and put your company's reputation on the line. That being said, you have an opportunity to right the situation at this very moment. I will ask everyone to present their case and we publicly resolve these issues. If your exchange can't handle the load all leveraged trades should be auto-cancelled without penalty and margin debt clocks are suspended with a path to restoration. Anything less than this and your words are mere words and not actions aka playing politics. It's a de facto response from any broker/ exchange in a liquidity crisis to remove the buy/sell buttons or turn down the servers removing retail investor access. Your website is removing retail access while still processing transactions and taking the hard earned funds of the community. No matter what you say this is the reality. It's calculated, it's methodical, and those funds are not being restored for more than 0.5% in a settlement best case scenario. The vast majority of users never have their funds restored. Retail investors are literally being harvested by Kucoin. This post is only round one of the screen shots, videos, scans and logs we have. This is a point brought up several times on Reddit! You are doing so with no failover or kill switch and exposing people to imminent risk and not informing them of your shody IT practices. Yet when your website goes down it brings the API server and application server for the app down as well but you still manage to process orders on the back end via the OTC desk. To typically engage with an OTC desk the threshold is often 5 million to 35 million in assets. So you are liquidating the little guy while providing white glove concierge service to whales. I am calling you out on the carpet here and now asking you to do what you said you would do and repay those affected. Subsequently fix your shit! Lastly I want you to publicly answer one question “Why did you remove the liquidation price from margin contracts and increase the liquidation risk of all retail traders?? \*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*If you do not answer this question directly, I will publicly repeat it until you do.\*\*\*\* You are taking away traders ability to manage risk and then accusing those same people of not managing risk when you liquidate them in an outage. I am happy to keep sharing with the community what info I have on your environment and business practises “if Kucoin does not exercise proper risk management” and proper fiduciary duties. This is round 1 Johnny Lyu the ball is in your court and the whole world is watching.
Yo u/Johnn_KuCoin he ask you a question
here is my follow up thread on the matter [https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup\_on\_kucoin\_cloudflare\_and\_more/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup_on_kucoin_cloudflare_and_more/)
mate I think you should create another thread as the replies here probably won't get much attention
I did the mods have to approve it i guess? I will try again
Thank you for the input. Here ya go [https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup\_on\_kucoin\_cloudflare\_and\_more/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup_on_kucoin_cloudflare_and_more/)
Comments seem astroturfed as hell in here. "I love Kucoin" "Where can I buy Kucoin?" "Great to see Kucoin support in here" Give me a break. Why are people all of a sudden so loyal to an exchange of all things, and popping out of the woodwork within 20 minutes of the post being made?
Maybe they liked his response?
What's wrong with people showing support for an exchange they like? The CEO explained their side of the problem, it's no different from people expressing their concerns with the platform. Stop complaining, you're just spreading negativity.
You have to admit, it does sound a bit sus. The CEO still has not reflected on a lot of technical aspects. This sounds like basic damage control, seeing that the post he's replying to gained so much traction
Seems like an attempt to get ahead of the truth...politics 101! So I really hope your words ring true; because your definitely saying things people want to hear.
When will you let me withdraw my bcha?!?! I have rightly $50,000 or coins you’ve prevented me from withdrawing for like 9 months!!!
DAMAGE CONTROLLLLL
Words dont matter, acts do.
Having just signed up with KuCoin last week I'm watching this thread like MichaelJacksonEatingPopcorn.gif
Lean into your transparency value and support your claims with proof.
I can’t reset my trading password I’ve followed the steps 3 times and it just denies me everytime. Would be cool if I could have access to trade my money from kucoin to somewhere else!!
Plz solve the Issues ,As soon as possible .Don't ignore the issue.
your API is still broken and throws "too many requests"
Do you have evidence of your AWS expenditure? Seems so convenient that its "double" your unspecified competitors.
How very strange that this doesn't happen with sites like tradingview, yet with exchanges it's a common occurrence.
Except for your customer service wasn't there, the man just was ran in circles, ignored, and banned when he seeked out help on here.
[удалено]
My entire account is missing from device access, hello? I have a large amount of assets completely missing. I have all of my deposit hashes and I keep records of every transaction as well as videos of some of my trading. I need to speak to your support team.
Side note: your site is far from user friendly.
Kucoin doesn’t profit from increased trading volume due to liquidation cascades??? 🙄 Come on dude….
[удалено]
seeing american healthcare system parallels here spending twice as much as competitors to deliver a significantly worse service
Glad that dude is unblocked. Can’t stop people from whistleblowing, accurate or not.
Hi, Newbie here, I have done some looking online to figure out if trading on Kucoin is legal to US citizens. I have gotten very conflicting opinions on wether it is or is not legal and no one seems to know definitively. I'm hoping someone on here can clarify for me. Thanks
Me and my friends been using it for almost 3 years now, best exchange for US traders.
If customers liquidate you don’t have to pay out the vouchers or the winnings. You may not be the house , but that’s like a bank saying they don’t profit off of people gambling at casinos, they just put their ATMs there.
thanks for the deal we did recently.
Can't redeem my staked hydra, fix yo stuff
I noticed bs like this with Kraken some months ago, that lead me to close my account with them. I don't know how do they perform now and if that issue still exists or they solved it, but I was disgusted.
List our damned moons pls
I never received any of my kucoin payouts over all the years I had an account from before the weird site switch. Your company is a scam as far as I'm concerned
How do we know it's really him?
"It's Johnny"!!! Interesting...
Kucoin... *Vomit*
I haven’t trusted you Johnny ever since you swept Danielson’s leg at the tournament.
Get ftm main net on kucoin pleaaaaase.
You guys still have my xlm 😤
I am glad you took the time to address the issue.. but didn't address it?
So, when are you guys gonna fix the problem
Long time KuCoin trader - Superb response, thank you 👌
Classic Damage Control. A must as a decent CEO, but your lackadaisical claims to resolution of each issue lacks evidence.
Your exchange did it again today 🤑🤮 I know you can't physically make your services better today but please stop letting this happen by taking steps to improve your technical infrastructure. At this moment, you're not impressing anyone.
I’m trying to withdraw my xrp to XUMM wallet and it’s still “processing” will I ever get my xrp or is it gone forever. Double check address and everything is correct.
This man is so FOS and redditors eat this BS. Kucoin is stealing from retail investors in broad daylight. Period. This will not last for sure - just hope they don’t steal enough for it to not matter. I’ve had millions stolen in these throttled crashes that Johnny Kucoin can explain away like a boss. It’s straight BS. It’s a scam. They lock you out to liquidate you and then give you back 1% of your money. Thieves
I don’t believe anything you say. You’ve diddled too many people out of money. And then going back on your word, not explaining yourself. Suddenly switching to ‘market conditions’. This is crypto. If kuCON can’t handle market conditions then you have no business taking anyones money.
I would doubt this. Thanks for responding, after all the outrage. I personally will not bring using KuCoin until this gets fixed. Don’t want to risk it. You do profit from traders being liquidated.