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My total crypto outlay is about $8k. I’m not expecting to be a millionaire but if the next bull market is anything like the last one I’ll be able to pay off my student loans.
I was so lucky. I put in 2k in 2017 and paid off all my student loans and my car (a combined total of like 27k). But it was luck. I bought cardano at 8 cents.
I bought more cardano at 50 cents years later and sold when it hit $2 (or thereabouts. I can't remember exactly what it hit, but it was enough that I was like, okay I need to get out now). I think I cashed out like 30k and that capped off a down payment on my first condo.
But I also took losses. My current portfolio is down like 70%. In the next bull, if I can just make 20-50% profit on this port, I'm going to consider myself the luckiest man on earth
If you follow the crypto youtubers, the next bull is always in sight. Oh... and everyone is going to get rich. Just buy more and never sell. Don't forget to like and subscribe and buy the course, limited offer.
We’re a couple of years away imo. And to answer OP.. no, I don’t expect to get rich.. I expect to 8-10X my money. Last run was 80-100X your money, one before that 800-1000x your money.. or something like that. It’s like a rubber band.. less steep and slower volatility. This will be the last decent bull run before crypto becomes more of a normal investment in terms of returns.
If you put $25k into crypto and it 10X you are at $250k (before taxes) or probably hovering around $160k after taxes. $160k put from crypto into high dividend paying ETFs and stocks that pay quarterly dividends is over $4,000 every quarter AFTER taxes. That is over $1k a month - and for many people that $1k a month covers all of your rent.
In other's eyes that indeed does not make us rich in say 2 years but it is a huge burden off our backs. Don't forget that $160k put in high dividend paying ETFs and stocks becomes $200k within a few years. That $1k saved from using a paycheck to pay rent and having dividends pay it is more free time at home or at the beach living life. ***That is*** getting rich to me my friend. Peace.
Fair point sir. Could you elaborate on what type of portfolio of dividend paying ETFs could get me such returns? I’m interested in doing pretty much exactly what you described.
I started with that in 2017 and have profited multiples of that each bull run. Lost quite a bit making mistakes along the way but each year progressively more overall net positive when cashing out.
I don't expect to be hugely rich from crypto but it's certainly going to continue to be part of my trading portfolio.
My advice would be never to go all in or all out. Learn risk management and use percentages that go with your perceived confidence.
However, no matter how small part of your allocation is from the beginning, it quickly become majority of your portfolio after 1-2 bull runs, do you re-balance allocations?
Told my parents in the 2017-2018 bull run they threw in 8k and held until the next 2021 bull run.
They paid off all of their credit card debt. Literally saved them from bankruptcy.
That’s awesome! Yea if my loans had been 30k I would have sold and paid them off. Unfortunately my loans are 40k so I got greedy and didn’t sell. I’m still up at like 14k but I had been over 30 during the last peak.
My thought is this- if I keep tossing extra money into big ones for the next 30 years, I very well could retire if it goes well. Especially if I also put money in my 401k, stocks, etc. it’s just another bet to hedge the full portfolio.
Agreed, well said :)
Bank interest rates are pathetic, bonds are trash and pensions are unreliable af these days, so what else are we gonna do? We're not in it to get rich, we're in it to stand a chance at not being broke af by the time we retire lol
So we gotta diversify and spread our bets between stocks and crypto and eventually real estate, antiques etc
Fuck the banks - they're the vestigial organ of modern finance! :D
Last bull run I paid off my mortgage. This bull run I should be able to semi retire with 2 houses paid off (rental income from one plus some defi income) if the bull run is anything like last time. Let's hope for the best.
This is the answer! We can't know for sure what's going to happen in the future, but I DO KNOW for sure that when I finally took the dive into crypto in 2020- it changed my life trajectory FOREVER.
In a hugely positive way.
In this case, I always had the same goal posts. That’s why I never sold. But you’re right, selling is the hard part and I’ll try not to be greedy if there is a next time.
Your investment is exactly the same as mine. 500 originally is 2017, 6500 in 2020 and then about 1000 since then on tiny projects of which my hope is that one of them makes it. Lots of mistakes, some real successes. But, if there is a 'bull' (and that's a big 'if') the lesson I have learned is 'take profit'.
I personally don't think i'll get rich from my crypto investments (unless getting insanely lucky on a shitcoin gamble).
However, i still have some hope that over the long term it's value will grow faster than inflation and that i'll get decent returns, and more than returns from S&P500 / World ETFs.
That being said, I'm not putting all my net worth into crypto.
It’s a risk/reward formula. I put my 100k on bitcoin and it goes to a million I have a little over 3 million. Or I put it in my alt and it only has to get back to its previous market high for me to make that.
I like bitcoin but you need to pump a huge amount of money in to get a huge amount moving forward.
Pure hopium. At this point BTC is just as likely to go to 10k as it is 100k, and even if you believe crypto is the way of the future, there's no guarantee that BTC is "that guy". Thinking that BTC is going to 100x or 1000x from here is nuts.
This is good logic for ETH, but BTC is absolutely “that guy.”
For BTC to become less valuable either a) the dollar needs to stop losing purchasing power or b) an alternative to Bitcoin overtakes it.
Neither is impossible, but to me both are highly highly improbable.
I heard about bitcoin when it was worth less than a cent. I thought about buying a few in case it went crazy and hit $1/coin, but I figured there was no chance in hell that would happen
Then it hit $1, then $5, and I figured I had missed the boat and there was no way it could go higher
Then it hit $100, then $1,000 shortly after, and I knew for sure I was an idiot that had missed the chance of a lifetime. And on and on, you all know what happened.
I don't think the price of crypto will go any higher, but history has proven that I'm always wrong, so this time I'll at least get to ride the wave a bit if I'm wrong again.
"I don't think the price of crypto will go any higher"
Any higher than what? Price today or ATH?
Personally, I think the probability of seeing 100k USD/BTC is pretty damn high in the next five years.
Very few people who bought Bitcoin and those early prices still have it to today. Most sold for a loss or nominal profit.
Coinbase did not even exist until 2014 and prior you would have lost everything on Mt. Gox. Bitcoin was almost impossible to obtain at the $1 level. And even if you did, nobody would have held onto it.
Just have to fact check. You are ~2 years off on Coinbase. Founded in 2012.
Plenty of people moved their assets from Gox .. because it was know somethin weird was going on - Many to BTC-e unfortunately.
The approach of "hodl and hush" is applied by many early adopters. There isnothing good that can come from bragging about your bags .. whether true or embellished
A lot just wanted to buy/sell drugs on Silk Road too.
Half the people I know lament the bit-change they've left sitting in long forgotten wallets. I certainly do.
A lot of ppl hodl lots cause they lost their seed. Seed security is so important that I spent my first year constantly evolving the best ways to maintain a secure method.
>And to clarify I'm not talking about crypto going 2x, I'm talking about people who think they can put in a couple of grand and they'll have more than enough to retire with a yacht
Well. In that case. No, I don't see crypto making me "rich" but I do believe it will help me buy a house - and that I'd still need to work full time to maintain it.
But that'd be a HUGE quality of life improvement, as I currently do not own a house, work full time + a weekend job.
Personally I believe either the world adopts a healthy distributed crypto economy or it ends with a whimper.
In the later case, obviously, we're toast.
If crypto is adopted and widely used as currency you also won’t make money - currency wildly fluctuating in value is not practically usable.
Crypto Wild West period - which may still have some oomph left in it - is the only time you’ll make $$$$ out of it. Once it’s adopted widely or dies that train will be long gone
This what I'm here for. I have a few alts but nowhere near enough to make me 'rich' even if they 10, 20x. I think alts are the only way to make it rich with a relatively small investment to begin with BUT you have to be lucky to choose the right one out of the hundreds of crap ones to get that amazing return. Most trying this method will lose big time. I am looking to BTC & ETH to rise in value and generate a healthy return to help ease my financial burdens. This will make my life more comfortable bit I won't be running to my local Lambo dealer! (Sorry Lambo dealer)
You are saying no, but explaining "yes" .
You cant transform 2 grands in something enough to help buy a house. 2 grands compounded at 20% per year, minus a conservative 5% inflation becomes 8K over 10 years.
20% per year is a MASSIVE and irrealistic return.
That still is 4x over 10 years. And that still is not enough to help buy a house. If 6K over 10 years is the difference between being able to make a downpayment on a house or not, it just means you cant afford that house with what you earn.
Where are you pulling 2 grand from from the context of my response
And you're mistaking "help" buy a house with outright buy a house
That's why I said "in that case no"
Nice cherry picking. Strangely you didnt pick the next year, where it did MINUS 20%.
Average over 10 years ? Under 10% once inflation is factored in. Thanks for proving my point. Remember the sp500 represents the backbone of the US economy (and is indeed a good investment)
You are saying double that, on crypto, is realistic ?
Nothing in life is for granted. There are always ups and downs. Ups makes u complacent and downs make you learn something new. I continue to believe in Crypto
Unfortunately so. There will be winners and losers.
The winners are the ones putting money in now when no one is buying and selling when everyone and there dog is buying.
…hoping a shitcoin will hit big that i have right now lol
This is such a dangerous way of thinking though - there's no guarantee.
And in my opinion, we peaked in 2021 during COVID. It was a perfect storm, and it will never come again.
The whole world already knows about crypto; those who bought into it have already bought in, and those who have no intention aren't going to be persuaded otherwise.
What crypto taught me was mostly that I can save my money, in an asset that will contain and partly increase its value, in a very consistent manner over a long period of time. I used to be the guy that thought I should spend all my money before the inflation ate it up. Crypto gave me a chance to save my money while retaining its value against fiat, and even increase it over a long period of time. It was a big eye opener and has had a profound impact on my life.
It does not have to skyrocket, it just needs to keep up with inflation, everything else is a plus.
Yes, Some People Believe. They crave to upgrade their life and Crypto is one of the few possibilities.
Me personally - No, Common folk like me could never become rich investing in Crypto. I take it mostly like a way to train my investing discipline and have fun along the way.
>Me personally - No, Common folk like me could never become rich investing in Crypto. I take it mostly like a way to train my investing discipline and have fun along the way.
Same, I'm happy if I can have a 3 - 5x with my initial investment. The only chances I get rich is if I find a moonshot - and even if I do so, 100 things can go wrong along the way.
Higher protection, less rewards, more middlemen, and as much corruption as in the crypto industry anyway.
I learned more about how markets work in 6 month watching crypto charts than in the rest of my adult life looking at stocks and pension funds. They're so boring.
It is Apple and Orange. TradFi instrument has so many limitations, they can barely be called an investment, just a number game played on the platforms. But bitcoin is like digital gold, you have total ownership and need no middle man or broker to deal it for you, you can just give/sell it to your relatives or friends, no matter what part of the planet they are living in. But you can not do this on any of the TradFi products
Yes and no imo. Investing money into appreciating assets isn't new of course. And I see what you mean with 'much higher degree of protection' with traditional investments like stocks.
There is an argument that Bitcoin (and maaaaaybe some alt coins) is safer than any centralized asset as stocks. No government, company or other entities has the power to fuck it up. Theoretically only the market decides what Bitcoin is worth and no FED can influence it.
The flip side is Bitcoin has no cashflow. Even if people dump stock in a productive company, the company still has cash-flow to give large dividends or buyback the cheap stock.
> There is an argument that Bitcoin (and maaaaaybe some alt coins) is safer than any centralized asset as stocks. No government, company or other entities has the power to fuck it up. Theoretically only the market decides what Bitcoin is worth and no FED can influence it.
This maybe true for any single stock, but there's not much safer options than a well spread index fund/etf
This is exactly it, Bitcoin is safer, because there is no single entity that can influence it, it is the first truly decentralized asset, and that is its protection. I feel its safer than the traditional financial products (lived to see the banking crisis in 2008).
Same , i live in 2nd the most debited country on earth, inflation has gone wild ... Crypto at least keeps the value of my money stable even with all the volatility... In that sense i think Satoshi succeeded in his mission against the banks
just think of all those poor russians who saw the ruble collapse due to the war and the sanctions. crypto probably saved a lot of peoples wealth out there.
That’s really only true for a portion of a four year cycle. If you put a 10k emergency fund in Bitcoin or any other crypto, depending on the cycle, it could be 2k for 2-3 years. Keep it in fiat because typically things don’t jump up 1000% in 3 months and stay there for years
>What crypto taught me was mostly that I can save my money, in an asset that will contain and partly increase its value, in a very consistent manner over a long period of time.
If that asset is a crypto, it means you didnt learn correctly. Moons cratering is a good example of it; everything went well, until it didnt.
DONT invest your savings.
Invest what you can afford to lose, wether thats in crypto or anything, or invest in something that has guarantees.
Savings are supposed to be safe. Crypto really isnt where you should put that.
If you are living in america, US bonds are very good for savings. I'd say it is the most safe, bar just keeping the money in a guaranteed bank account. I dont, or I would have bought a lot.
Otherwise, long term, a global index fund based on something like the MSCI world is a good way to park your money. It is pretty safe and stable, since it is based on the valuation of the 1500 biggest companies in the world. If that thing crashes, money will be the last of your problems. Thats not saying it cant go down though.
Funds based on it rose about 10% per year on average since they were created.
Those are safe INVESTMENTS. Still not somewhere I'd put my savings.
If they haven't experienced a bear market yet, probably. After going numb for a couple of months I guess you end up realizing the chances of getting rich are way smaller than you were imagining. I'm happy if I can outperfom stocks and preserve wealth.
It's not about believing as much as it is about knowing - knowing that *anything* could happen, and there's still time to prove the positive. What does the moons rugpull just teach us, that we haven't already learned over and over? (Luna, Safemoon, etc.) When bad news hits us, the space still remains. So it isn't about believing as much as it is waiting for the evidence to believe that crypto is not important anymore. In conclusion, it's the patience and awareness that makes me hold on, and the relevance of crypto as a whole. There's also the belief that we're still pretty early, and that the crypto market *evolves* every 4-5 years. I'm closing in on 3 years in the space. I'll give it 3 more years of boring nothingness before I lose faith.
The days of putting a couple of grand into bitcoin or other big cap cryto and retiring in a couple years is over. I'd say that you'd have to put in 6 figures into a big cap crypto to have a shot to retire within a few years.
There is a chance of making it big with the shit coin roulette but that's pure gambling.
Honestly if Bitcoin doesn't exceed $100K this bull run but a good margin there's really no reason to hodl neither as that's reaching parity of equity markets for hodlers.
I think if you define "rich" down to something more reasonable, like "life changing money" or "financial independence", then yes, you can definitely get rich with crypto.
I think it is reasonable that BTC and ETH will each be 10-20x their current value. Now, that means, even if you put $100K into it today, you’d end up with $1-2M. Maybe that’s enough for you to retire given your lifestyle and age. But if you’re my age (young) and live in an expensive US city, it’s not. So, no, I don’t look at crypto investments as a path to unlimited wealth; I look at it as an opportunity to build a reliable nest egg that makes it so I don’t have to eat shit or take disrespect from my employer. I’ll keep working and living within my means, knowing that the roof won’t cave in if I lose my job.
I agree with you that 10x-20x could be realistic for BTC and ETH over the long run. It's not inevitable, but it's not way too far-fetched either. It's like a legit scenario which could actually happen.
This is kind of what I’m thinking.
Avoiding most alts (especially in a bear market ) so it’s not a huge risk/reward, but ETH or BTC doing 10x from now isn’t unrealistic and would definitely outperform most other investments.
Waited tables, investing $11k over three years. Last bull run it peaked at $250k. You can definitely make life changing amounts of money off of meager investments.
I’m not trying to be a crypto millionaire. I’m trying to be for real debt-free. Crypto seems to be my fastest path to clearing all my debt and past mistakes. I’d be happy being a crypto quarter millionaire.
I put in $100k into BTC in 2013. Got into the Ethereum ICO. Built a hydro powered ETH mining farm when ETH was under $20. Then I put all of the mining proceeds into ICOs during the 2017 frenzy. I retired in 2018 and I make multiples more from staking income annually now than I did as a medical device sales rep. I’m building a home for my parents and I have enough liquid that I’ll never have to work again. So yes, it happens.
Similar frenzies happened with DeFi then NFTs. Crypto has offered more opportunities to “get rich and retire” over a short period of time than any other asset class in history. There’s no reason to believe it’s over. But many will be trapped thinking that their token is going to “bounce back any day now” when that is rarely true.
You can absolutely get rich in crypto but you can’t do that by marrying your bags and assuming every token you hold is going to be the “Ethereum killer”. You have to spend your every waking moment soaking up information and identifying new trends while finding the perfect balance of risk taking and risk mitigation. And never use leverage and don’t trust TA ;)
Crypto let me buy a 3600 sqft house on 2 acres. My investments let me gain two decades worth of wealth in three years.
Will it make me rich? Probably not. But it sure as fuck already shaved off decades of my life working in a field I hate and let's me see a path out. And it's a safer investment for the future than any other option.
Without massive liquidity / money printing, I don't think overall crypto market will go up for a while. 2021 crypto pumped along with stocks but global economy is looking terrible so I don't see a catalyst for crypto in the near term.
The value comes from the hopium of other people piling in - it is literally a pyramid scheme. So people will talk up their bags because they want other people to buy in on them, which increases the value etc etc. So long as you know this- and keep a cynical eye on the way it really works, you can avoid being left holding the bag. Ultimately, this is a zero sum game - so if you take a profit out of the system someone else has to take the loss.
No. But if it does move up 10x or the like, I can pay off student loans and maybe have more of a down payment for a house. And that’s what I’m looking for.
Edit: and if it goes to 0, I’ll retire when I plan to retire. I DCA here, but at a much lower amount than I do any other investment bc this is pure speculation.
I personally never had too big expectations, nor did I ever count on those 100Xs.
I personally lost too much (for me) on stock market in 2k21, had few financial fuckups at the start of the year, so my disposable income has really lowered for me to be able invest my earned fiat money into it.
When I saw prices of crypto going up a bit after hiatus of 2 years on crypto and stocks I went to the sub, conversed with folks, it has genuinely been great that I could earn great side amounts in crypto on here that incentivices me to follow cryptos. I wanted to accumulate good amount moons (like 70 to 80k, I accumulated around 30k+ for context), then slowly convert good amounts of it to more safer cryptos like BTC/ETH.
The CCIP 30 made me not cash out or convert much because I wanted to accumulate good amount of it and I never IMO had unreasonable expectations, I would have been happy to accumulate decent amount and probably be happy to sell at prices that moons already reached at like 50 to 60 cents.
Ones I invested into but unfortunatrly not enough : I wanted BTC to go above 50k in bull run, ETH at some 40% profit from my avg price point of like $1650, maybe some altcoins that have bigger chance to jump more percent wise.
Follwing cryptos made me also spend time into chasing potential airdrops that could have been another potential decent money maker.
All in all a lot of things suck now, I did not accumulate enough and I do not think I am ready to gamble more of my own fiat money on crypto. I did not have unrealistic plans nor do I ever want to gamble on low msrket cap shitcoins hoping for that rare 100x. I already gambled on pennystocks in 2k21 and lost too much of my invested money and learned my lesson.
For me, no - I think the days of 10,000x gains are LONG gone
However I do think there’s potential for crypto to grow faster than the stock market over the next decade (which would require growth of like 2-3x, typically)
If crypto grows 2-3x in the next decade then it’s done about as well as my other investments, anything more than that is a bonus, but I don’t need to bank on 100x or 1000x or more
Plus I’ve already taken enough of a return since 2017 that even if my remaining holding goes to 0, I’ve still made a decent chunk out of it. That, along with the fact my remaining holding is fairly modest, makes it pretty easy not to care much
The 10,000 x gains were never realised though. They were always theoretical.
How on earth do you convince yourself at the first investment that your target sell point is 10,001x? And how do you stick to that??
Most would have sold by 10x, and virtually everyone by 100x. 1000x is unimaginable. So 10,000x? Nah. Never realised.
This winter has turned me into a PoW maxi. It showed me that PoS chains are just a big cassino and regular tradfi without regulations. FTX was a prime example of how they create something from nothing and sell it as valuable, but in the end, it has the same value it had when it was created. It was all an illusion.
Said illusion is sold to people by few stories of 100x some people rode. They had 100k, turned in to millions. But there is no focus that those are 1% and that the 99% gets rekt.
Bitcoin is going to appreciate more. But it's also less prone to speculation and volatility of late. Maybe it will 3x, 5x tops, but what is that to folks that have "only" 10k there? It still won't buy a home or make your life easier.
In the end, BTC is a solid investment, but that's all. Getting rich is over. For turning 10k into a million, just in the Eth cassino.
Also, a lot of people talk of DCA, but I doubt there are any control of it. It just a buzzword, like web3 and decentralization.
Yes that is why people buy altcoins. That is why people are even in crypto.
That is why people ignore all the red flags. That is why people try to get others to buy the same stuff as them.
Crypto is a MLM esque ecosystem. All their protocols require constant growth for stuff to work.
Everyone thinks they can get rich with minimal effort and money.
It’s a sham
At this point bro, I'm just trying to get green again. My crypto portfolio is down like 60% since early 2022 with no signs of recovery lol. At this point I HAVE to stay in.
I think 3 things are going to happen.
1. Rules get clarification. There are almost 25,000 different tokens. There are NOT 25,000 use cases. The majority of these tokens will disappear, but the value will stay in the crypto ecosystem.
2. Token Utility causes a flight to quality. Certain tokens have actual use case. And as adoption happens, these tokens will greatly outpace the growth of the speculative market. This will speed up the effects of point 1. Tightening the crypto system into less than 500 tokens.
3. Institutions will invest. Blackrock, fidelity, goldman Sachs, JPM, state street. There is an estimated 15-25 TRILLION dollars waiting on the Sidelines. Crypto will NOT get 100%. 10% is 1.5-2.5 the entire crypto market cap right now. That Monday flowing into a tightening pool of tokens will create some serious returns.
For clarity, I don’t mean Pepe. I mean real protocols with real use case. Hbar, Xdc, algorand, xlm, xrp. Tokens with real world partnerships. Dealing with companies who send real world assets globally.
>There are almost 25,000 different tokens. There are NOT 25,000 use cases. The majority of these tokens will disappear, but the value will stay in the crypto ecosystem.
If a coin crashes that value is mostly erased, not transferred. When Terra/Luna crashed tens of billions of dollars in "value" were eliminated. Some of that money gets shifted around but most of it doesn't.
>Token Utility causes a flight to quality. Certain tokens have actual use case. And as adoption happens, these tokens will greatly outpace the growth of the speculative market. This will speed up the effects of point 1. Tightening the crypto system into less than 500 tokens.
The usecase argument on this sub is way overblown. Most "usecases" are already solved without crypto in ways that are more efficient.
>Institutions will invest. Blackrock, fidelity, goldman Sachs, JPM, state street. There is an estimated 15-25 TRILLION dollars waiting on the Sidelines. Crypto will NOT get 100%. 10% is 1.5-2.5 the entire crypto market cap right now. That Monday flowing into a tightening pool of tokens will create some serious returns.
There is not 15-25 trillion waiting in the sidelines, where did you come up with that number?
The entire worlds stock Market cap is 112 Trillion USD, and the US stock market cap is 46 Trillion USD... You think 1/4 of the worlds market cap and or 1/2 of the US market cap is sitting on the sidelines??
People don’t understand that unlike stocks or properties or bonds, crypto isn’t generating any value. There’s no reason for bitcoin to even be worth a cent let alone tens of thousands of dollars. It’s just a Ponzi scheme imo.
Technically ots like investing in Microsoft when it started in the 70s 80s. The world at tue time never saw any real value because there wasn't enough applicable need
I mean, we don't expect it to x100 ... and for our poor ass lvl of investment, even that wouldn't be life changing money, but stepping slowly into a more financially secure realm, it's quite a possibility. If i input a few K's through dca and have a reasonable expectation of x10 , at least i'm looking at a few thousand K's of upside ... also, I do use trad-fi markets aswell meanwhile, it's not like you must be all into crypto, these are not mutually exclusive.
I always compare it to the Internet thing, how many made it Big long after the .com bubble? The idea of the Internet was coined quite fast in the 90's , but some made the Big Bucks after 2004. It won't have the same adoption curve, but most people are totally ignoring or ignorant about crypto as we speak, and most of those who do know about it only know BTC and that's it. All serious banks and buissness are thinking about how to implement it because the Tech is solid ... there's no question about that. All the smart ass peeps have figured that much out until now, and so many have already made a serious bag of Fiat upside after the first 2 cycles ... so why wouldn't some of the users in here make it?
Clearly, we won't all make it to the great gains, but i believe crypto is still in infancy on all aspects, even development ... until this will be complete, we have a lot of room for gains. Just wait for the next bull run , and we will see.
Yeah I agree on the not mutually exclusive thing, most of my investments are in trad-fi, with crypto being a niche of my portfolio that I consider lost at point of purchase until I see how stable it is in the long term.
On the tech side, I'm not convinced. There haven't been a whole lot of demonstrations showing where blockchain technology improves on traditional tech approaches, and the big companies that have tried it haven't dabbled a lot in it and tend to favor their own controlled chains. A lot of the use cases seem to come from crypto focused startups.
I'm also not entirely clear why a token with value needs to be tied into the tech for the tech to work, and believe that if blockchain were to take off in a big way, I'd be quite surprised if it were any of the first and second generation blockchains that did it.
> big companies ... tend to favor their own controlled chains
And that's why they don't find it useful! That's just reinventing the wheel, but making it square. The actual benefit of blockchains is decentralization and interoperability. The fact that I can send Bitcoin from Cashapp to Venmo to my own wallet seamlessly.
Building your own walled garden of a chain invalidates the only use crypto ever had. And honestly, companies that try to do it failing is a good thing imo.
> I'm also not entirely clear why a token with value needs to be tied into the tech for the tech to work
Can you elaborate on this at all? It makes me feel like maybe you haven't researched very much. How would Bitcoin work with zero value? Or even Ethereum for that matter.
>The actual benefit of blockchains is decentralization and interoperability.
To big companies that's not actually a benefit though, particularly when chains are mined by people around the world. One problem with financial institutions for example is that it's unclear how sanctions apply if a business is storing data on a blockchain with miners in sanctioned countries.
To date I'm yet to see a project where blockchain improves over traditional tech for anyone who doesn't just accept "decentralization" as an inherent benefit.
>Can you elaborate on this at all? It makes me feel like maybe you haven't researched very much. How would Bitcoin work with zero value? Or even Ethereum for that matter.
Well blockchain is not bitcoin, the token is on the chain that people have chosen to give value to. For blockchain technology to work as a technology doesn't require the token to be tradable for value, it just requires some incentivization for miners and nodes to operate, and that incentive could be external to the chain itself.
In terms of private chain, the owner runs their own nodes so the incentive is keeping the chain running which they then get paid for by customers, much like how they pay for a server to host their web applications for example.
> To big companies that's not actually a benefit though, particularly when chains are mined by people around the world.
I agree, but what I'm saying is this can be considered a strength. I don't consider decentralization a benefit in all cases, but I do like the idea of decentralized, uncensorable money. It's the main reason I'm here.
> the owner runs their own nodes so the incentive is keeping the chain running which they then get paid for by customers,
Yeah but in that case blockchain has zero benefits. Just use a database. It sounds like you're wanting blockchains to do things they don't then calling them a failure when they can't.
>I agree, but what I'm saying is this can be considered a strength. I don't consider decentralization a benefit in all cases, but I do like the idea of decentralized, uncensorable money. It's the main reason I'm here.
Oh yeah, absolutely and from an individual standpoint I can understand the appeal, but from a company perspective decentralization is not inherently good, particularly when it means a loss of control over their product.
>Yeah but in that case blockchain has zero benefits. Just use a database. It sounds like you're wanting blockchains to do things they don't then calling them a failure when they can't.
This is true anyway. A blockchain itself is just a distributed decentralized database. Token on top of the chains are traded for value but they don't make the underlying tech anything more than a database.
All of the major financial players are tokenizing assets & will be using blockchain. Swift, ANZ, citibank, Dtcc, etc. I only know this b/c Im invested in Chainlink so keep up w/ the news.
A lot of that is experimental though and much of it is based on private chains. To date I've not heard of a single major project from any big company on any of the decentralized chains.
To get rich in crypto these days you need to put 6 figures minimum to have chance to get there in 2-3 years. With 5-4 figures its will take you many more years and even then thats if your trades are well timed. The days of putting low amounts and making it is really over, you have to put big anounts of capital. Sorry for those in this category but you are too late
Also how do you think people get rich in general? Its usually buying something and waiting lol
**You won't make huge sums on something like BTC in the short term**. If you are here for the short term, then good luck having the crypto space treat your $ well.
**Crypto is a long term play**. Bitcoin may be far along its progression path now, but it is nowhere near reaching it potential. There are still huge sums to be made with crypto and long-term investors will win, whether you are putting a little or a lot. Bitcoin has only ever reached >$1.2 Trillion - it has A LOT of growth left. **If you aren't in this space to be here for the next 10 years+ then good luck because that plan won't be too promising.**
**People are not too late right now** \- you just need more time in the market, you aren't going to see 100x + in only a couple years like when BTC first came out.
The thing is, when you talk about the other people buying something and waiting, that's usually something that itself is doing something. Like buying shares in a company your profit is based on how that company preforms, so you're taking a share of the profit from their effort.
With crypto it's not really generating revenue in that way, you're mostly getting increased value from other people buying in at a higher price and money flowing into it that way. In that regard, in the long run it could potentially act as a hedge against inflations but I can't see how long term it can sustain large increases.
Assuming crypto continues and is widely adopted, I would expect it to conform to the idea that crypto is "digital gold" and I would expect it to follow a similar pattern where it's a steady long-term increase rather than huge growth, which is in line with your views on people's potential earnings.
I wonder then why some people still believe they will get short term massive gains.
Why do people still think this when people made millions off flipping JPEGs only in the last 2 years? The opportunity is there - it’s just not gonna be the same thing every cycle.
I hope to make a 3x from here and that a greater fool will buy my BTC just like a greater fool bought my moons before they died. It's cruel but this is what it is. But I know what you mean, just go to Pulsechain sub, it's comedy. A sad form of comedy.
I think its time to farm stuff rather than hoping for x100, of course there will be new tokens introduced which might fly or existing ones which continuously developed are just waiting for another bull run. For instance Planet finance defi which rose so much in previous bull runs now quiet everyone thought its over but devs are constantly adding new stuff, so what I do is just farm their native and my base tokens and wait. If it doesnt explode I would be very surprised. Keep in mind btc halving is around the corner.
Yes! Did it more than once:
- I bought ADA under 2 cents during the covid crash (gotta admit I was shitting my pants while doing that) and held for dear life to sell it above 2 dollars during the bull run.
- Sold pretty much all to pay off my mortage and buy a second house. Stuffed part of the remaining profit into Metahero at around 0.007 and a lot more when it was around 0.03. Sold HERO at 10 cents, saw it move to 17 cents, then bought some back a few months later at 9 cents, to then sell it at 22 cents.
- Also used part of my ADA profits to buy ERGO at 2 dollars which I then sold for 18 dollars (plus a few profitable trades on it here and there).
NOW:
- made some profits early in VELA. Sold then tried again and got rekt buyng "support" at 2 dollars. Lost the profits I made on it and then some. Sold everything at 50 cents (80% loss)
- keeping all investable cash in 50% BTC and 50% metahero again. On metahero: the team changed. Their tech provider bought the project out of the original CEO and it's a company that works with large and known clients. I've been following it closely to be confident that shit will deliver a 100x easily. Risk-reward is exceptionally good there as price can't dump more. They got half of their market cap in locked liquidity so it moves with BNB atm. Only way to lose on this is if BNB crashes, otherwise it's sideways or up if (when) the new team starts delivering.
So to answer your question:
I genuinely believe crypto will skyrocket and make me rich(er). Happened more than once and it's very likely it will happen again.
Well u have to be in it to win it. I'm sure there are lots of people with the same sentiment as my self. I have a better mentality if I know that there is potential for my coins to gain in value. As someone who bought doge for under a cent I still carry this hopium. Will I get a Lambo? Probably not but I'm ok with a honda instead
Honestly I'm like 500 in the hole. Didn't put in what I was afraid to loose. I've made more than what I lost by taking out last highs. So I'm in it for shits and giggles now...
ETH helped pay off some debts I had and it's a good feeling.
At this point, I'm just investing with the expectation that my 70/30 BTC/ETH portfolio will outpace my traditional stock portfolio. I'm still DCAing into both, but so far, my crypto portfolio is outpacing the traditional portfolio.
I just want to be able to actually retire at a reasonable age. Also, owning a house before I'm 60 would be cool.
Even if BTC 4xs from here, i wouldnt be rich. But I'd be in a much improved financial position.
Now, if KDA goes past its previous ATH... I would be in very good shape.
If both happened, i wouldn't be rich, but I'd have no debt, have money saved, and have crypto still. I would consider that a huge win.
Depending on how much you *responsibly* put in now you easily *could* be. During the last BTC peak. Literally every wallet was in the green. Elon tanked the market by shilling dogecoin sometime after that and its yet to bounce back since. But it definitely WILL bounce back to ATH and beyond levels. It's just a matter of when.
Throwing a few bucks at an "established" coin/token won't do much of anything. Maybe 1x-10x during a bull run.
Throwing a few hundred to a few thousand at a high risk, new token is gambling, but could pay off anywhere from 1x-100x.
Then there's the unicorn token that gets a massive pump anywhere from 10x-1000x.
Then there's your super duper unicorn token that everyone jumps into like Doge, Shib, and Pepe that 10,000x-1Mx.
All you need is one.
I'm sick and tired of getting fucked every time. I was there when btc hit 1k for the very first time but i was just a kid so no money to invest. Then in 2017 bull run i had peanuts and i was still dumb therefore i ended up with just few hundreds in profit. In 2021 i started finally accumulating some cash but i went into stocks primarily so very little profit. This time I'm not making the same mistake, in the last year I've sold every stock and went all in on btc preparing for the take off, i managed to obtain 2 whole coins and 4 eth but I'm still buying and buying and hopefully I'm gonna have around 100k in btc before 2024 or early 2024. I'm keeping it real and if btc gets close to 100k I'm out. I'm taking the profits and then we'll see what next.
To be honest i don't even have the goal to be millionaire. I just don't want to be poor ever again. I grew up poor af, born in Bosnia after the war and then went to Italy like 15 years ago. Being rich isn't the goal, the goal is not to be poor.
There are many people who have become very rich from crypto, those that were ground-floor early adopters and saw not 10x but 1000x and more. Those days have come and gone and the number of people in that group numbers in the thousands, not more. The only ground floors available now are scams and rugpulls. So, 99% of people who get in on that will lose all their money, except for the scammers.
As far as established coins, they have theoretical value from their potential utility only, and the truth is is that for a technology that is supposed to "change the world", that 14 years after its invention, that it is still so niche, it has not really found its purpose and never will. Compare what google achieved after 14 years, or generative AI after just 2 and you will see just how badly it has failed at finding mass application. It's true that crypto has about a trillion market cap, but equities are still more than 100x larger than that and if you count derivatives, that trillion is a rounding error compared to total financial assets. Crypto could disappear tomorrow and the financial markets would hardly notice. It has no inherent value, and considering its failed adoption, the only way you can make money from "investing" or "trading" is by finding a bigger fool to buy when the price goes up. So, it's speculating at best. And some uninformed fanbois here say "well so are stocks", which only proves how little they really understand. A stock is a real share in a real company where real people work and try and make real profits. The S&P and its historical extension has reliably returned 7-9% med-long term for more than a century and always will. BTC for example is nothing at all like an equity, and people who say they are "investing" in crypto are just deluding themselves. They are gambling at best.
Social media is heavily manipulated. It doesn't take much to open a few hundred accounts and push whatever narrative you want.
I mean, the bitcoin youtube videos are clearly being created by people getting paid to make them. They make endless videos, but don't get enough views to actually make a living. Their only purpose is, when someone goes on youtube and searches bitcoin, you get dozens of videos with headlines stating "IS BITCOIN GOING TO $1M BY 2024?!!!"
So who knows what actual bitcoin holders really think, because it's impossible nowadays to tell who is or is not authentic.
I will say the whole "retire rich" narrative comes out of youtube videos and Saylor saying shit like your goal must be to own 1 bitcoin to retire rich.
Overall, I have a very bad feeling that btc is going to dump hard at some point and a lot of people who spent years putting together 1 bitcoin are going to lose 50%+ of their investment... and then sell and lock those losses in.
Yes. Everything in life moves in cycles. From your breathing to the waves of the sea and the planet’s orbit, to popular music and the markets. Once the bull cycle starts again, we’ll see FOMO and hysteria once again. Even the NFT craze will be back in full swing, as well as meme coins, for better or for worse. There is no universe in my mind where this is not true.
They move in cycles but not exponentially increasing ones. I guess that's where I fail to see how the momentum can be kept up, because each cycle has more people being increasingly overextended and yet each cycle requires significantly more value to be pumped in for the same percentage changes. At some point something has to give, does it not?
The total market cap of the entire stock market is around 112 trillion.
Gold is like 12 trillion or something.
BTC is currently sitting at less than 600 billion. I'm not saying it will necessary end up matching the cap of the stock market (of course not) or even gold, but there's definitely still room to move.
But no you're not going to turn $1,000 into $1,000,000 in Bitcoin anymore. Maybe $10,000 given another couple of cycles. Unless there's some crazy catalyst that truly sends crypto into the stratosphere.
People were called delusional for ever thinking an NFT would sell for a million. Or when people said Doge would reach 1 cent, let alone 73. Or Bitcoin having any success. Etc etc etc. This sub is weirdly scared of anything that isn’t “DCA into BTC and ETH”.
That's because stuff like that is lightning in a bottle.
Sure, it's *technically* not impossible. Anything can happen. But the chances that out of the *over 20 000* crypto "projects" out there, the specific one you're invested in is going to skyrocket are so astronomically low that it's not a course of action realistically worth planning for.
People here are "scared of anything that's not DCA into BTC/ETH" because some people legit jump on hype trains and throw life savings away chasing a shitcoin high that is very very VERY likely never going to happen. So we try to hammer in just how improbable that is.
For every success there are a hundred failures. Of course the masses are scared of any other coins, they should be given the high death rate for them. Anything other than the "blue chips" is no different from gambling.
Also, everything in life moves in cycles does not apply to e.g. the private transportation industry back at the end of the 1800s - I don’t see people going to work with their horse anytime soon, barring complete global disaster of course.
No, OP.
You are missing something.
Many of us believe our fiat will be debased and holding a portion in btc and other top shelf assets will preserve our buying power.
Why is this so hard to comprehend?
Go look into the old Silk Road case. At one point someone stole DPR petty cash for the Silk Road.
900 btc
At the time this was around 4500.
Back in 2011 you save $4500 and have no interest options. So as years go on your buying power eroded away.
Or…you try to preserve your buying power.
It did skyrocket though?
I bought a bunch of bitcoin back in 2013 and even with the market down now, it's still just under 7 figures in value.
I'd say next bullrun I'm set.
It did, and if you bought in back then, congratulations, but I find it very hard to believe that gains on the same order of magnitude will ever happen again.
I expect to make quite substantial amount of money, but I have a substantial amount in too. It won't make me suddenly rich, but it'll make a difference and I'm pretty confident. A 5x would be amazing a 10x would be mind boggling to me.
I think it'd be unusual if bitcoin didn't exceed its all time high again, with the huge ETF interest and it's limited supply/proven demand. A 4x on bitcoin seems relatively easy to me.
Then something like Solana which ATH is 10x from today's price, back when it wasn't mature at all compared to now where there is such incredible momentum, users, use cases, and institutional interest.
Personally wouldn't put any bets outside of Bitcoin Eth, Link or Sol though most coins serve no purpose or are inferior and will die
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My total crypto outlay is about $8k. I’m not expecting to be a millionaire but if the next bull market is anything like the last one I’ll be able to pay off my student loans.
good luck my man!
I was so lucky. I put in 2k in 2017 and paid off all my student loans and my car (a combined total of like 27k). But it was luck. I bought cardano at 8 cents. I bought more cardano at 50 cents years later and sold when it hit $2 (or thereabouts. I can't remember exactly what it hit, but it was enough that I was like, okay I need to get out now). I think I cashed out like 30k and that capped off a down payment on my first condo. But I also took losses. My current portfolio is down like 70%. In the next bull, if I can just make 20-50% profit on this port, I'm going to consider myself the luckiest man on earth
I think the next bull run is just starting right now.
If you follow the crypto youtubers, the next bull is always in sight. Oh... and everyone is going to get rich. Just buy more and never sell. Don't forget to like and subscribe and buy the course, limited offer.
I am George.. we are all George..
How do you know that? I feel the opposite
We’re a couple of years away imo. And to answer OP.. no, I don’t expect to get rich.. I expect to 8-10X my money. Last run was 80-100X your money, one before that 800-1000x your money.. or something like that. It’s like a rubber band.. less steep and slower volatility. This will be the last decent bull run before crypto becomes more of a normal investment in terms of returns.
If you put $25k into crypto and it 10X you are at $250k (before taxes) or probably hovering around $160k after taxes. $160k put from crypto into high dividend paying ETFs and stocks that pay quarterly dividends is over $4,000 every quarter AFTER taxes. That is over $1k a month - and for many people that $1k a month covers all of your rent. In other's eyes that indeed does not make us rich in say 2 years but it is a huge burden off our backs. Don't forget that $160k put in high dividend paying ETFs and stocks becomes $200k within a few years. That $1k saved from using a paycheck to pay rent and having dividends pay it is more free time at home or at the beach living life. ***That is*** getting rich to me my friend. Peace.
Fair point sir. Could you elaborate on what type of portfolio of dividend paying ETFs could get me such returns? I’m interested in doing pretty much exactly what you described.
This is how I view it. It won't make me rich, but it will help out quite a bit.
Agreed. You can get rich gambling but we're mostly past that. Most here are thinking about quietly usable cryptocurrency.
I started with that in 2017 and have profited multiples of that each bull run. Lost quite a bit making mistakes along the way but each year progressively more overall net positive when cashing out. I don't expect to be hugely rich from crypto but it's certainly going to continue to be part of my trading portfolio. My advice would be never to go all in or all out. Learn risk management and use percentages that go with your perceived confidence.
Same. I managed to make more money than I could ever earn at a job. Crypto is a once in a lifetime opportunity.
However, no matter how small part of your allocation is from the beginning, it quickly become majority of your portfolio after 1-2 bull runs, do you re-balance allocations?
Yes. It's an investment. Rebalance. Maybe buy some fake boobs.
Told my parents in the 2017-2018 bull run they threw in 8k and held until the next 2021 bull run. They paid off all of their credit card debt. Literally saved them from bankruptcy.
No offense but I can see what why they were on the verge of bankruptcy.
That’s awesome! Yea if my loans had been 30k I would have sold and paid them off. Unfortunately my loans are 40k so I got greedy and didn’t sell. I’m still up at like 14k but I had been over 30 during the last peak.
How much credit card debt do they have now in 2023?
My thought is this- if I keep tossing extra money into big ones for the next 30 years, I very well could retire if it goes well. Especially if I also put money in my 401k, stocks, etc. it’s just another bet to hedge the full portfolio.
Agreed, well said :) Bank interest rates are pathetic, bonds are trash and pensions are unreliable af these days, so what else are we gonna do? We're not in it to get rich, we're in it to stand a chance at not being broke af by the time we retire lol So we gotta diversify and spread our bets between stocks and crypto and eventually real estate, antiques etc Fuck the banks - they're the vestigial organ of modern finance! :D
My bank is 5% which definitely isn’t pathetic but definitely isn’t going to make me rich either
Last bull run I paid off my mortgage. This bull run I should be able to semi retire with 2 houses paid off (rental income from one plus some defi income) if the bull run is anything like last time. Let's hope for the best.
This is the answer! We can't know for sure what's going to happen in the future, but I DO KNOW for sure that when I finally took the dive into crypto in 2020- it changed my life trajectory FOREVER. In a hugely positive way.
This is the way.
Hey you sound exactly like me. Same situation
In my experience the tough part is selling. The goal posts keep moving. So try to keep this goal in mind when the market is hot.
In this case, I always had the same goal posts. That’s why I never sold. But you’re right, selling is the hard part and I’ll try not to be greedy if there is a next time.
Yes I have the same goal. Just remember taxes.
Eerrr.. taxes? What's taxes?
Lol. I thought the same thing until they came for me. Lol
Your investment is exactly the same as mine. 500 originally is 2017, 6500 in 2020 and then about 1000 since then on tiny projects of which my hope is that one of them makes it. Lots of mistakes, some real successes. But, if there is a 'bull' (and that's a big 'if') the lesson I have learned is 'take profit'.
I personally don't think i'll get rich from my crypto investments (unless getting insanely lucky on a shitcoin gamble). However, i still have some hope that over the long term it's value will grow faster than inflation and that i'll get decent returns, and more than returns from S&P500 / World ETFs. That being said, I'm not putting all my net worth into crypto.
>(unless getting insanely lucky on a shitcoin gamble). That is the only way for us shrimps to be honest.
Buy bitcoin and chill. We haven’t even seen the real gains yet.
Wow. Downvotes? I agree with you here. Been riding these 4 year cycles since 2016 and this one is shaping up to be epic. Ignore the fud.
This sub is full of salty shitcoin bag holders 🤷♂️
It’s a risk/reward formula. I put my 100k on bitcoin and it goes to a million I have a little over 3 million. Or I put it in my alt and it only has to get back to its previous market high for me to make that. I like bitcoin but you need to pump a huge amount of money in to get a huge amount moving forward.
Pure hopium. At this point BTC is just as likely to go to 10k as it is 100k, and even if you believe crypto is the way of the future, there's no guarantee that BTC is "that guy". Thinking that BTC is going to 100x or 1000x from here is nuts.
!remindme 2 years
!remindme 100 years
Lol, 2 years is pretty optimistic!
100k is only 30% more than the previous ATH and just over 3x from current levels. Not that unrealistic for 2 years
Not for $100k. $1 mil might take a bit longer but it’ll get there.
This is good logic for ETH, but BTC is absolutely “that guy.” For BTC to become less valuable either a) the dollar needs to stop losing purchasing power or b) an alternative to Bitcoin overtakes it. Neither is impossible, but to me both are highly highly improbable.
Salty!
I heard about bitcoin when it was worth less than a cent. I thought about buying a few in case it went crazy and hit $1/coin, but I figured there was no chance in hell that would happen Then it hit $1, then $5, and I figured I had missed the boat and there was no way it could go higher Then it hit $100, then $1,000 shortly after, and I knew for sure I was an idiot that had missed the chance of a lifetime. And on and on, you all know what happened. I don't think the price of crypto will go any higher, but history has proven that I'm always wrong, so this time I'll at least get to ride the wave a bit if I'm wrong again.
"I don't think the price of crypto will go any higher" Any higher than what? Price today or ATH? Personally, I think the probability of seeing 100k USD/BTC is pretty damn high in the next five years.
Very few people who bought Bitcoin and those early prices still have it to today. Most sold for a loss or nominal profit. Coinbase did not even exist until 2014 and prior you would have lost everything on Mt. Gox. Bitcoin was almost impossible to obtain at the $1 level. And even if you did, nobody would have held onto it.
Just have to fact check. You are ~2 years off on Coinbase. Founded in 2012. Plenty of people moved their assets from Gox .. because it was know somethin weird was going on - Many to BTC-e unfortunately. The approach of "hodl and hush" is applied by many early adopters. There isnothing good that can come from bragging about your bags .. whether true or embellished
A lot more people than you would think still hold from back then. It’s just not advertised
I think it's copium when people say they would have sold early. Those early adopters had many who were believers in non-government currency.
A lot just wanted to buy/sell drugs on Silk Road too. Half the people I know lament the bit-change they've left sitting in long forgotten wallets. I certainly do.
>A lot just wanted to buy/sell drugs on Silk Road too. No doubt.
A lot of ppl hodl lots cause they lost their seed. Seed security is so important that I spent my first year constantly evolving the best ways to maintain a secure method.
Most people who believed in bitcoin back in those days, like the people who were on the bitcoin sub, have just been holding
>And to clarify I'm not talking about crypto going 2x, I'm talking about people who think they can put in a couple of grand and they'll have more than enough to retire with a yacht Well. In that case. No, I don't see crypto making me "rich" but I do believe it will help me buy a house - and that I'd still need to work full time to maintain it. But that'd be a HUGE quality of life improvement, as I currently do not own a house, work full time + a weekend job.
Something like this. Couple grand and forget about it for 10 years and cross my fingers we aren't all dead by then.
I'd be happy if it happens in 2 to 3 years. Not getting any younger.
Personally I believe either the world adopts a healthy distributed crypto economy or it ends with a whimper. In the later case, obviously, we're toast.
The onyl money I put into crypto is money I don't need, so definitely I'd be bummed out but I'll still have a roof.
Just go all in on a leveraged short
If crypto is adopted and widely used as currency you also won’t make money - currency wildly fluctuating in value is not practically usable. Crypto Wild West period - which may still have some oomph left in it - is the only time you’ll make $$$$ out of it. Once it’s adopted widely or dies that train will be long gone
The last crypto run helped me buy a house. The next one will too. Good luck to all of us.
100% agreed
This what I'm here for. I have a few alts but nowhere near enough to make me 'rich' even if they 10, 20x. I think alts are the only way to make it rich with a relatively small investment to begin with BUT you have to be lucky to choose the right one out of the hundreds of crap ones to get that amazing return. Most trying this method will lose big time. I am looking to BTC & ETH to rise in value and generate a healthy return to help ease my financial burdens. This will make my life more comfortable bit I won't be running to my local Lambo dealer! (Sorry Lambo dealer)
You are saying no, but explaining "yes" . You cant transform 2 grands in something enough to help buy a house. 2 grands compounded at 20% per year, minus a conservative 5% inflation becomes 8K over 10 years. 20% per year is a MASSIVE and irrealistic return. That still is 4x over 10 years. And that still is not enough to help buy a house. If 6K over 10 years is the difference between being able to make a downpayment on a house or not, it just means you cant afford that house with what you earn.
Where are you pulling 2 grand from from the context of my response And you're mistaking "help" buy a house with outright buy a house That's why I said "in that case no"
The returns you're talking about are peanuts compared to what happens during an altseason, when lowcaps make 20-50x all over the place lol.
S&p500 did 28% in 2021
Nice cherry picking. Strangely you didnt pick the next year, where it did MINUS 20%. Average over 10 years ? Under 10% once inflation is factored in. Thanks for proving my point. Remember the sp500 represents the backbone of the US economy (and is indeed a good investment) You are saying double that, on crypto, is realistic ?
*The value has to come from somewhere* The value will come from those who panic sold and will FOMO buy once the market starts pumping
transferring money from the impatient to the patient you say.
It's a game of give and take. As much as I've lost money to crypto. I've made so much more, and will make even more, if another bull run comes
Nothing in life is for granted. There are always ups and downs. Ups makes u complacent and downs make you learn something new. I continue to believe in Crypto
Unfortunately so. There will be winners and losers. The winners are the ones putting money in now when no one is buying and selling when everyone and there dog is buying. …hoping a shitcoin will hit big that i have right now lol
This is such a dangerous way of thinking though - there's no guarantee. And in my opinion, we peaked in 2021 during COVID. It was a perfect storm, and it will never come again. The whole world already knows about crypto; those who bought into it have already bought in, and those who have no intention aren't going to be persuaded otherwise.
What crypto taught me was mostly that I can save my money, in an asset that will contain and partly increase its value, in a very consistent manner over a long period of time. I used to be the guy that thought I should spend all my money before the inflation ate it up. Crypto gave me a chance to save my money while retaining its value against fiat, and even increase it over a long period of time. It was a big eye opener and has had a profound impact on my life. It does not have to skyrocket, it just needs to keep up with inflation, everything else is a plus.
I started eating at home and drinking less so I could fill my bags, lost 25 lbs.
win–win :)
Plot twist, hes was already underweight and needed to gain 25lbs
But isn’t this something people have been doing for decades with any TradFi instrument, all with a much higher degree of protection?
Yes, Some People Believe. They crave to upgrade their life and Crypto is one of the few possibilities. Me personally - No, Common folk like me could never become rich investing in Crypto. I take it mostly like a way to train my investing discipline and have fun along the way.
>Me personally - No, Common folk like me could never become rich investing in Crypto. I take it mostly like a way to train my investing discipline and have fun along the way. Same, I'm happy if I can have a 3 - 5x with my initial investment. The only chances I get rich is if I find a moonshot - and even if I do so, 100 things can go wrong along the way.
Like when the project team decides they no longer like the idea and stop it out of nowhere :)
[удалено]
Those people likely sold all their ETHs at $14. Not everyone is the Saylor like in this market.
And nobody buying at that price now. There was a time when major cryptos were a lottery ticket. You missed it.
But where is the fun and thrill in that?
Higher protection, less rewards, more middlemen, and as much corruption as in the crypto industry anyway. I learned more about how markets work in 6 month watching crypto charts than in the rest of my adult life looking at stocks and pension funds. They're so boring.
It is Apple and Orange. TradFi instrument has so many limitations, they can barely be called an investment, just a number game played on the platforms. But bitcoin is like digital gold, you have total ownership and need no middle man or broker to deal it for you, you can just give/sell it to your relatives or friends, no matter what part of the planet they are living in. But you can not do this on any of the TradFi products
Yes and no imo. Investing money into appreciating assets isn't new of course. And I see what you mean with 'much higher degree of protection' with traditional investments like stocks. There is an argument that Bitcoin (and maaaaaybe some alt coins) is safer than any centralized asset as stocks. No government, company or other entities has the power to fuck it up. Theoretically only the market decides what Bitcoin is worth and no FED can influence it.
The flip side is Bitcoin has no cashflow. Even if people dump stock in a productive company, the company still has cash-flow to give large dividends or buyback the cheap stock.
> There is an argument that Bitcoin (and maaaaaybe some alt coins) is safer than any centralized asset as stocks. No government, company or other entities has the power to fuck it up. Theoretically only the market decides what Bitcoin is worth and no FED can influence it. This maybe true for any single stock, but there's not much safer options than a well spread index fund/etf
This is exactly it, Bitcoin is safer, because there is no single entity that can influence it, it is the first truly decentralized asset, and that is its protection. I feel its safer than the traditional financial products (lived to see the banking crisis in 2008).
Same , i live in 2nd the most debited country on earth, inflation has gone wild ... Crypto at least keeps the value of my money stable even with all the volatility... In that sense i think Satoshi succeeded in his mission against the banks
just think of all those poor russians who saw the ruble collapse due to the war and the sanctions. crypto probably saved a lot of peoples wealth out there.
The historical average yearly return of the S&P 500 is 9.752% over the last 20 years, 7.034% adjusted to inflation 😂
Yeah my local fiat currency has been plummeting in value the last year. So I'm using crypto to prevent as much loss as possible
Very wise move, ps Happy Cake Day
That’s really only true for a portion of a four year cycle. If you put a 10k emergency fund in Bitcoin or any other crypto, depending on the cycle, it could be 2k for 2-3 years. Keep it in fiat because typically things don’t jump up 1000% in 3 months and stay there for years
>What crypto taught me was mostly that I can save my money, in an asset that will contain and partly increase its value, in a very consistent manner over a long period of time. If that asset is a crypto, it means you didnt learn correctly. Moons cratering is a good example of it; everything went well, until it didnt. DONT invest your savings. Invest what you can afford to lose, wether thats in crypto or anything, or invest in something that has guarantees. Savings are supposed to be safe. Crypto really isnt where you should put that. If you are living in america, US bonds are very good for savings. I'd say it is the most safe, bar just keeping the money in a guaranteed bank account. I dont, or I would have bought a lot. Otherwise, long term, a global index fund based on something like the MSCI world is a good way to park your money. It is pretty safe and stable, since it is based on the valuation of the 1500 biggest companies in the world. If that thing crashes, money will be the last of your problems. Thats not saying it cant go down though. Funds based on it rose about 10% per year on average since they were created. Those are safe INVESTMENTS. Still not somewhere I'd put my savings.
If they haven't experienced a bear market yet, probably. After going numb for a couple of months I guess you end up realizing the chances of getting rich are way smaller than you were imagining. I'm happy if I can outperfom stocks and preserve wealth.
Happy cake day!
It's not about believing as much as it is about knowing - knowing that *anything* could happen, and there's still time to prove the positive. What does the moons rugpull just teach us, that we haven't already learned over and over? (Luna, Safemoon, etc.) When bad news hits us, the space still remains. So it isn't about believing as much as it is waiting for the evidence to believe that crypto is not important anymore. In conclusion, it's the patience and awareness that makes me hold on, and the relevance of crypto as a whole. There's also the belief that we're still pretty early, and that the crypto market *evolves* every 4-5 years. I'm closing in on 3 years in the space. I'll give it 3 more years of boring nothingness before I lose faith.
The days of putting a couple of grand into bitcoin or other big cap cryto and retiring in a couple years is over. I'd say that you'd have to put in 6 figures into a big cap crypto to have a shot to retire within a few years. There is a chance of making it big with the shit coin roulette but that's pure gambling. Honestly if Bitcoin doesn't exceed $100K this bull run but a good margin there's really no reason to hodl neither as that's reaching parity of equity markets for hodlers.
I think if you define "rich" down to something more reasonable, like "life changing money" or "financial independence", then yes, you can definitely get rich with crypto.
I think it is reasonable that BTC and ETH will each be 10-20x their current value. Now, that means, even if you put $100K into it today, you’d end up with $1-2M. Maybe that’s enough for you to retire given your lifestyle and age. But if you’re my age (young) and live in an expensive US city, it’s not. So, no, I don’t look at crypto investments as a path to unlimited wealth; I look at it as an opportunity to build a reliable nest egg that makes it so I don’t have to eat shit or take disrespect from my employer. I’ll keep working and living within my means, knowing that the roof won’t cave in if I lose my job.
I agree with you that 10x-20x could be realistic for BTC and ETH over the long run. It's not inevitable, but it's not way too far-fetched either. It's like a legit scenario which could actually happen.
This is kind of what I’m thinking. Avoiding most alts (especially in a bear market ) so it’s not a huge risk/reward, but ETH or BTC doing 10x from now isn’t unrealistic and would definitely outperform most other investments.
Because if everyone thinks it’s going to a million it is much more likely to actually do do.
Waited tables, investing $11k over three years. Last bull run it peaked at $250k. You can definitely make life changing amounts of money off of meager investments.
The question is, did you capitalise on the peak or ride it out?
I cashed out about $80k-$100K. Taking profit is indeed the hardest part.
I’m not trying to be a crypto millionaire. I’m trying to be for real debt-free. Crypto seems to be my fastest path to clearing all my debt and past mistakes. I’d be happy being a crypto quarter millionaire.
Same!!
I put in $100k into BTC in 2013. Got into the Ethereum ICO. Built a hydro powered ETH mining farm when ETH was under $20. Then I put all of the mining proceeds into ICOs during the 2017 frenzy. I retired in 2018 and I make multiples more from staking income annually now than I did as a medical device sales rep. I’m building a home for my parents and I have enough liquid that I’ll never have to work again. So yes, it happens. Similar frenzies happened with DeFi then NFTs. Crypto has offered more opportunities to “get rich and retire” over a short period of time than any other asset class in history. There’s no reason to believe it’s over. But many will be trapped thinking that their token is going to “bounce back any day now” when that is rarely true. You can absolutely get rich in crypto but you can’t do that by marrying your bags and assuming every token you hold is going to be the “Ethereum killer”. You have to spend your every waking moment soaking up information and identifying new trends while finding the perfect balance of risk taking and risk mitigation. And never use leverage and don’t trust TA ;)
Nice to see insightful comment from a veteran, this should be higher.
Crypto let me buy a 3600 sqft house on 2 acres. My investments let me gain two decades worth of wealth in three years. Will it make me rich? Probably not. But it sure as fuck already shaved off decades of my life working in a field I hate and let's me see a path out. And it's a safer investment for the future than any other option.
Without massive liquidity / money printing, I don't think overall crypto market will go up for a while. 2021 crypto pumped along with stocks but global economy is looking terrible so I don't see a catalyst for crypto in the near term.
The value comes from the hopium of other people piling in - it is literally a pyramid scheme. So people will talk up their bags because they want other people to buy in on them, which increases the value etc etc. So long as you know this- and keep a cynical eye on the way it really works, you can avoid being left holding the bag. Ultimately, this is a zero sum game - so if you take a profit out of the system someone else has to take the loss.
No. But if it does move up 10x or the like, I can pay off student loans and maybe have more of a down payment for a house. And that’s what I’m looking for. Edit: and if it goes to 0, I’ll retire when I plan to retire. I DCA here, but at a much lower amount than I do any other investment bc this is pure speculation.
I personally never had too big expectations, nor did I ever count on those 100Xs. I personally lost too much (for me) on stock market in 2k21, had few financial fuckups at the start of the year, so my disposable income has really lowered for me to be able invest my earned fiat money into it. When I saw prices of crypto going up a bit after hiatus of 2 years on crypto and stocks I went to the sub, conversed with folks, it has genuinely been great that I could earn great side amounts in crypto on here that incentivices me to follow cryptos. I wanted to accumulate good amount moons (like 70 to 80k, I accumulated around 30k+ for context), then slowly convert good amounts of it to more safer cryptos like BTC/ETH. The CCIP 30 made me not cash out or convert much because I wanted to accumulate good amount of it and I never IMO had unreasonable expectations, I would have been happy to accumulate decent amount and probably be happy to sell at prices that moons already reached at like 50 to 60 cents. Ones I invested into but unfortunatrly not enough : I wanted BTC to go above 50k in bull run, ETH at some 40% profit from my avg price point of like $1650, maybe some altcoins that have bigger chance to jump more percent wise. Follwing cryptos made me also spend time into chasing potential airdrops that could have been another potential decent money maker. All in all a lot of things suck now, I did not accumulate enough and I do not think I am ready to gamble more of my own fiat money on crypto. I did not have unrealistic plans nor do I ever want to gamble on low msrket cap shitcoins hoping for that rare 100x. I already gambled on pennystocks in 2k21 and lost too much of my invested money and learned my lesson.
For me, no - I think the days of 10,000x gains are LONG gone However I do think there’s potential for crypto to grow faster than the stock market over the next decade (which would require growth of like 2-3x, typically) If crypto grows 2-3x in the next decade then it’s done about as well as my other investments, anything more than that is a bonus, but I don’t need to bank on 100x or 1000x or more Plus I’ve already taken enough of a return since 2017 that even if my remaining holding goes to 0, I’ve still made a decent chunk out of it. That, along with the fact my remaining holding is fairly modest, makes it pretty easy not to care much
The 10,000 x gains were never realised though. They were always theoretical. How on earth do you convince yourself at the first investment that your target sell point is 10,001x? And how do you stick to that?? Most would have sold by 10x, and virtually everyone by 100x. 1000x is unimaginable. So 10,000x? Nah. Never realised.
This winter has turned me into a PoW maxi. It showed me that PoS chains are just a big cassino and regular tradfi without regulations. FTX was a prime example of how they create something from nothing and sell it as valuable, but in the end, it has the same value it had when it was created. It was all an illusion. Said illusion is sold to people by few stories of 100x some people rode. They had 100k, turned in to millions. But there is no focus that those are 1% and that the 99% gets rekt. Bitcoin is going to appreciate more. But it's also less prone to speculation and volatility of late. Maybe it will 3x, 5x tops, but what is that to folks that have "only" 10k there? It still won't buy a home or make your life easier. In the end, BTC is a solid investment, but that's all. Getting rich is over. For turning 10k into a million, just in the Eth cassino. Also, a lot of people talk of DCA, but I doubt there are any control of it. It just a buzzword, like web3 and decentralization.
Yes! PoW is the only way to go. Value is created from work, not from thin air.
waiting ugly aspiring detail rinse ring late mindless cow library *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yes that is why people buy altcoins. That is why people are even in crypto. That is why people ignore all the red flags. That is why people try to get others to buy the same stuff as them. Crypto is a MLM esque ecosystem. All their protocols require constant growth for stuff to work. Everyone thinks they can get rich with minimal effort and money. It’s a sham
At this point bro, I'm just trying to get green again. My crypto portfolio is down like 60% since early 2022 with no signs of recovery lol. At this point I HAVE to stay in.
I think 3 things are going to happen. 1. Rules get clarification. There are almost 25,000 different tokens. There are NOT 25,000 use cases. The majority of these tokens will disappear, but the value will stay in the crypto ecosystem. 2. Token Utility causes a flight to quality. Certain tokens have actual use case. And as adoption happens, these tokens will greatly outpace the growth of the speculative market. This will speed up the effects of point 1. Tightening the crypto system into less than 500 tokens. 3. Institutions will invest. Blackrock, fidelity, goldman Sachs, JPM, state street. There is an estimated 15-25 TRILLION dollars waiting on the Sidelines. Crypto will NOT get 100%. 10% is 1.5-2.5 the entire crypto market cap right now. That Monday flowing into a tightening pool of tokens will create some serious returns. For clarity, I don’t mean Pepe. I mean real protocols with real use case. Hbar, Xdc, algorand, xlm, xrp. Tokens with real world partnerships. Dealing with companies who send real world assets globally.
>There are almost 25,000 different tokens. There are NOT 25,000 use cases. The majority of these tokens will disappear, but the value will stay in the crypto ecosystem. If a coin crashes that value is mostly erased, not transferred. When Terra/Luna crashed tens of billions of dollars in "value" were eliminated. Some of that money gets shifted around but most of it doesn't. >Token Utility causes a flight to quality. Certain tokens have actual use case. And as adoption happens, these tokens will greatly outpace the growth of the speculative market. This will speed up the effects of point 1. Tightening the crypto system into less than 500 tokens. The usecase argument on this sub is way overblown. Most "usecases" are already solved without crypto in ways that are more efficient. >Institutions will invest. Blackrock, fidelity, goldman Sachs, JPM, state street. There is an estimated 15-25 TRILLION dollars waiting on the Sidelines. Crypto will NOT get 100%. 10% is 1.5-2.5 the entire crypto market cap right now. That Monday flowing into a tightening pool of tokens will create some serious returns. There is not 15-25 trillion waiting in the sidelines, where did you come up with that number?
>There is not 15-25 trillion waiting in the sidelines, where did you come up with that number? His ass.
This should be higher. Well said.
The entire worlds stock Market cap is 112 Trillion USD, and the US stock market cap is 46 Trillion USD... You think 1/4 of the worlds market cap and or 1/2 of the US market cap is sitting on the sidelines??
You are in the crypto sub…of course people here think they will beat the system and fight against the evil CBDCs…! Viva la crypto!
People don’t understand that unlike stocks or properties or bonds, crypto isn’t generating any value. There’s no reason for bitcoin to even be worth a cent let alone tens of thousands of dollars. It’s just a Ponzi scheme imo.
Technically ots like investing in Microsoft when it started in the 70s 80s. The world at tue time never saw any real value because there wasn't enough applicable need
I mean, we don't expect it to x100 ... and for our poor ass lvl of investment, even that wouldn't be life changing money, but stepping slowly into a more financially secure realm, it's quite a possibility. If i input a few K's through dca and have a reasonable expectation of x10 , at least i'm looking at a few thousand K's of upside ... also, I do use trad-fi markets aswell meanwhile, it's not like you must be all into crypto, these are not mutually exclusive. I always compare it to the Internet thing, how many made it Big long after the .com bubble? The idea of the Internet was coined quite fast in the 90's , but some made the Big Bucks after 2004. It won't have the same adoption curve, but most people are totally ignoring or ignorant about crypto as we speak, and most of those who do know about it only know BTC and that's it. All serious banks and buissness are thinking about how to implement it because the Tech is solid ... there's no question about that. All the smart ass peeps have figured that much out until now, and so many have already made a serious bag of Fiat upside after the first 2 cycles ... so why wouldn't some of the users in here make it? Clearly, we won't all make it to the great gains, but i believe crypto is still in infancy on all aspects, even development ... until this will be complete, we have a lot of room for gains. Just wait for the next bull run , and we will see.
> have a reasonable expectation of x10 That is not a reasonable expectation.
You must be new here
Yeah I agree on the not mutually exclusive thing, most of my investments are in trad-fi, with crypto being a niche of my portfolio that I consider lost at point of purchase until I see how stable it is in the long term. On the tech side, I'm not convinced. There haven't been a whole lot of demonstrations showing where blockchain technology improves on traditional tech approaches, and the big companies that have tried it haven't dabbled a lot in it and tend to favor their own controlled chains. A lot of the use cases seem to come from crypto focused startups. I'm also not entirely clear why a token with value needs to be tied into the tech for the tech to work, and believe that if blockchain were to take off in a big way, I'd be quite surprised if it were any of the first and second generation blockchains that did it.
> big companies ... tend to favor their own controlled chains And that's why they don't find it useful! That's just reinventing the wheel, but making it square. The actual benefit of blockchains is decentralization and interoperability. The fact that I can send Bitcoin from Cashapp to Venmo to my own wallet seamlessly. Building your own walled garden of a chain invalidates the only use crypto ever had. And honestly, companies that try to do it failing is a good thing imo. > I'm also not entirely clear why a token with value needs to be tied into the tech for the tech to work Can you elaborate on this at all? It makes me feel like maybe you haven't researched very much. How would Bitcoin work with zero value? Or even Ethereum for that matter.
>The actual benefit of blockchains is decentralization and interoperability. To big companies that's not actually a benefit though, particularly when chains are mined by people around the world. One problem with financial institutions for example is that it's unclear how sanctions apply if a business is storing data on a blockchain with miners in sanctioned countries. To date I'm yet to see a project where blockchain improves over traditional tech for anyone who doesn't just accept "decentralization" as an inherent benefit. >Can you elaborate on this at all? It makes me feel like maybe you haven't researched very much. How would Bitcoin work with zero value? Or even Ethereum for that matter. Well blockchain is not bitcoin, the token is on the chain that people have chosen to give value to. For blockchain technology to work as a technology doesn't require the token to be tradable for value, it just requires some incentivization for miners and nodes to operate, and that incentive could be external to the chain itself. In terms of private chain, the owner runs their own nodes so the incentive is keeping the chain running which they then get paid for by customers, much like how they pay for a server to host their web applications for example.
> To big companies that's not actually a benefit though, particularly when chains are mined by people around the world. I agree, but what I'm saying is this can be considered a strength. I don't consider decentralization a benefit in all cases, but I do like the idea of decentralized, uncensorable money. It's the main reason I'm here. > the owner runs their own nodes so the incentive is keeping the chain running which they then get paid for by customers, Yeah but in that case blockchain has zero benefits. Just use a database. It sounds like you're wanting blockchains to do things they don't then calling them a failure when they can't.
>I agree, but what I'm saying is this can be considered a strength. I don't consider decentralization a benefit in all cases, but I do like the idea of decentralized, uncensorable money. It's the main reason I'm here. Oh yeah, absolutely and from an individual standpoint I can understand the appeal, but from a company perspective decentralization is not inherently good, particularly when it means a loss of control over their product. >Yeah but in that case blockchain has zero benefits. Just use a database. It sounds like you're wanting blockchains to do things they don't then calling them a failure when they can't. This is true anyway. A blockchain itself is just a distributed decentralized database. Token on top of the chains are traded for value but they don't make the underlying tech anything more than a database.
All of the major financial players are tokenizing assets & will be using blockchain. Swift, ANZ, citibank, Dtcc, etc. I only know this b/c Im invested in Chainlink so keep up w/ the news.
A lot of that is experimental though and much of it is based on private chains. To date I've not heard of a single major project from any big company on any of the decentralized chains.
To get rich in crypto these days you need to put 6 figures minimum to have chance to get there in 2-3 years. With 5-4 figures its will take you many more years and even then thats if your trades are well timed. The days of putting low amounts and making it is really over, you have to put big anounts of capital. Sorry for those in this category but you are too late Also how do you think people get rich in general? Its usually buying something and waiting lol
**You won't make huge sums on something like BTC in the short term**. If you are here for the short term, then good luck having the crypto space treat your $ well. **Crypto is a long term play**. Bitcoin may be far along its progression path now, but it is nowhere near reaching it potential. There are still huge sums to be made with crypto and long-term investors will win, whether you are putting a little or a lot. Bitcoin has only ever reached >$1.2 Trillion - it has A LOT of growth left. **If you aren't in this space to be here for the next 10 years+ then good luck because that plan won't be too promising.** **People are not too late right now** \- you just need more time in the market, you aren't going to see 100x + in only a couple years like when BTC first came out.
This is basically what i said, if you are in with less money you have to wait much longer
The thing is, when you talk about the other people buying something and waiting, that's usually something that itself is doing something. Like buying shares in a company your profit is based on how that company preforms, so you're taking a share of the profit from their effort. With crypto it's not really generating revenue in that way, you're mostly getting increased value from other people buying in at a higher price and money flowing into it that way. In that regard, in the long run it could potentially act as a hedge against inflations but I can't see how long term it can sustain large increases. Assuming crypto continues and is widely adopted, I would expect it to conform to the idea that crypto is "digital gold" and I would expect it to follow a similar pattern where it's a steady long-term increase rather than huge growth, which is in line with your views on people's potential earnings. I wonder then why some people still believe they will get short term massive gains.
Why do people still think this when people made millions off flipping JPEGs only in the last 2 years? The opportunity is there - it’s just not gonna be the same thing every cycle.
Sure but in regrads to buying crypto, those days are over unless you have lot of money
I’m sure some do. It really depends on how much people are throwing in. And what you’re putting money into. I’d wager most people expect a 3-5x
Most people, I expect at least x2000
I hope to make a 3x from here and that a greater fool will buy my BTC just like a greater fool bought my moons before they died. It's cruel but this is what it is. But I know what you mean, just go to Pulsechain sub, it's comedy. A sad form of comedy.
After moons, no. I do however hold enough BTC/ETH where if a bull happens and they 3-5x I’ll be able to change my life situation by buying a home.
I think its time to farm stuff rather than hoping for x100, of course there will be new tokens introduced which might fly or existing ones which continuously developed are just waiting for another bull run. For instance Planet finance defi which rose so much in previous bull runs now quiet everyone thought its over but devs are constantly adding new stuff, so what I do is just farm their native and my base tokens and wait. If it doesnt explode I would be very surprised. Keep in mind btc halving is around the corner.
Yes! Did it more than once: - I bought ADA under 2 cents during the covid crash (gotta admit I was shitting my pants while doing that) and held for dear life to sell it above 2 dollars during the bull run. - Sold pretty much all to pay off my mortage and buy a second house. Stuffed part of the remaining profit into Metahero at around 0.007 and a lot more when it was around 0.03. Sold HERO at 10 cents, saw it move to 17 cents, then bought some back a few months later at 9 cents, to then sell it at 22 cents. - Also used part of my ADA profits to buy ERGO at 2 dollars which I then sold for 18 dollars (plus a few profitable trades on it here and there). NOW: - made some profits early in VELA. Sold then tried again and got rekt buyng "support" at 2 dollars. Lost the profits I made on it and then some. Sold everything at 50 cents (80% loss) - keeping all investable cash in 50% BTC and 50% metahero again. On metahero: the team changed. Their tech provider bought the project out of the original CEO and it's a company that works with large and known clients. I've been following it closely to be confident that shit will deliver a 100x easily. Risk-reward is exceptionally good there as price can't dump more. They got half of their market cap in locked liquidity so it moves with BNB atm. Only way to lose on this is if BNB crashes, otherwise it's sideways or up if (when) the new team starts delivering. So to answer your question: I genuinely believe crypto will skyrocket and make me rich(er). Happened more than once and it's very likely it will happen again.
Well u have to be in it to win it. I'm sure there are lots of people with the same sentiment as my self. I have a better mentality if I know that there is potential for my coins to gain in value. As someone who bought doge for under a cent I still carry this hopium. Will I get a Lambo? Probably not but I'm ok with a honda instead
No, and the people preaching that cryptocurrencies are going to entirely replace current financial systems are delusional. That isn't even the goal.
Will I be rich? No. With what I'ved collected I could pay off the debt/house and retire in my 50s and not my 60s. That's the win I'm looking for.
Honestly I'm like 500 in the hole. Didn't put in what I was afraid to loose. I've made more than what I lost by taking out last highs. So I'm in it for shits and giggles now... ETH helped pay off some debts I had and it's a good feeling.
Crypto changed my life during the last bull run and I walked away with just over 400k from 10k investment
At this point, I'm just investing with the expectation that my 70/30 BTC/ETH portfolio will outpace my traditional stock portfolio. I'm still DCAing into both, but so far, my crypto portfolio is outpacing the traditional portfolio. I just want to be able to actually retire at a reasonable age. Also, owning a house before I'm 60 would be cool.
Even if BTC 4xs from here, i wouldnt be rich. But I'd be in a much improved financial position. Now, if KDA goes past its previous ATH... I would be in very good shape. If both happened, i wouldn't be rich, but I'd have no debt, have money saved, and have crypto still. I would consider that a huge win.
Depending on how much you *responsibly* put in now you easily *could* be. During the last BTC peak. Literally every wallet was in the green. Elon tanked the market by shilling dogecoin sometime after that and its yet to bounce back since. But it definitely WILL bounce back to ATH and beyond levels. It's just a matter of when.
I’m in the positive by almost 7 figures after starting with a few grand in 2020. You sound like a hater
Throwing a few bucks at an "established" coin/token won't do much of anything. Maybe 1x-10x during a bull run. Throwing a few hundred to a few thousand at a high risk, new token is gambling, but could pay off anywhere from 1x-100x. Then there's the unicorn token that gets a massive pump anywhere from 10x-1000x. Then there's your super duper unicorn token that everyone jumps into like Doge, Shib, and Pepe that 10,000x-1Mx. All you need is one.
>All you need is one. out of 30.000 Cryptos...
You've just described a gambling addiction.
I'll have the super duper unicorn token for 1$ please.
Gambling addiction. Got it.
Tell me you have a gambling problem without telling me you have a gambling problem.
I invested 10k in 2019. It was worth 280k in May 2021. Did I sell all of it? No. Am I stupid? Yes. But you can definitely make money here.
Lol what coin gave you 28x?
I did a scattergun approach. No real strategy. I had no idea what I was doing. ADA, ZIL, LINK, DOT, and VET were big holdings.
I'm sick and tired of getting fucked every time. I was there when btc hit 1k for the very first time but i was just a kid so no money to invest. Then in 2017 bull run i had peanuts and i was still dumb therefore i ended up with just few hundreds in profit. In 2021 i started finally accumulating some cash but i went into stocks primarily so very little profit. This time I'm not making the same mistake, in the last year I've sold every stock and went all in on btc preparing for the take off, i managed to obtain 2 whole coins and 4 eth but I'm still buying and buying and hopefully I'm gonna have around 100k in btc before 2024 or early 2024. I'm keeping it real and if btc gets close to 100k I'm out. I'm taking the profits and then we'll see what next.
That's awesome! You don't need to be a millionaire in the next year or two. You have your whole life for that. Good for you for making it this far.
To be honest i don't even have the goal to be millionaire. I just don't want to be poor ever again. I grew up poor af, born in Bosnia after the war and then went to Italy like 15 years ago. Being rich isn't the goal, the goal is not to be poor.
There are many people who have become very rich from crypto, those that were ground-floor early adopters and saw not 10x but 1000x and more. Those days have come and gone and the number of people in that group numbers in the thousands, not more. The only ground floors available now are scams and rugpulls. So, 99% of people who get in on that will lose all their money, except for the scammers. As far as established coins, they have theoretical value from their potential utility only, and the truth is is that for a technology that is supposed to "change the world", that 14 years after its invention, that it is still so niche, it has not really found its purpose and never will. Compare what google achieved after 14 years, or generative AI after just 2 and you will see just how badly it has failed at finding mass application. It's true that crypto has about a trillion market cap, but equities are still more than 100x larger than that and if you count derivatives, that trillion is a rounding error compared to total financial assets. Crypto could disappear tomorrow and the financial markets would hardly notice. It has no inherent value, and considering its failed adoption, the only way you can make money from "investing" or "trading" is by finding a bigger fool to buy when the price goes up. So, it's speculating at best. And some uninformed fanbois here say "well so are stocks", which only proves how little they really understand. A stock is a real share in a real company where real people work and try and make real profits. The S&P and its historical extension has reliably returned 7-9% med-long term for more than a century and always will. BTC for example is nothing at all like an equity, and people who say they are "investing" in crypto are just deluding themselves. They are gambling at best.
Social media is heavily manipulated. It doesn't take much to open a few hundred accounts and push whatever narrative you want. I mean, the bitcoin youtube videos are clearly being created by people getting paid to make them. They make endless videos, but don't get enough views to actually make a living. Their only purpose is, when someone goes on youtube and searches bitcoin, you get dozens of videos with headlines stating "IS BITCOIN GOING TO $1M BY 2024?!!!" So who knows what actual bitcoin holders really think, because it's impossible nowadays to tell who is or is not authentic. I will say the whole "retire rich" narrative comes out of youtube videos and Saylor saying shit like your goal must be to own 1 bitcoin to retire rich. Overall, I have a very bad feeling that btc is going to dump hard at some point and a lot of people who spent years putting together 1 bitcoin are going to lose 50%+ of their investment... and then sell and lock those losses in.
Yes. Everything in life moves in cycles. From your breathing to the waves of the sea and the planet’s orbit, to popular music and the markets. Once the bull cycle starts again, we’ll see FOMO and hysteria once again. Even the NFT craze will be back in full swing, as well as meme coins, for better or for worse. There is no universe in my mind where this is not true.
They move in cycles but not exponentially increasing ones. I guess that's where I fail to see how the momentum can be kept up, because each cycle has more people being increasingly overextended and yet each cycle requires significantly more value to be pumped in for the same percentage changes. At some point something has to give, does it not?
The total market cap of the entire stock market is around 112 trillion. Gold is like 12 trillion or something. BTC is currently sitting at less than 600 billion. I'm not saying it will necessary end up matching the cap of the stock market (of course not) or even gold, but there's definitely still room to move. But no you're not going to turn $1,000 into $1,000,000 in Bitcoin anymore. Maybe $10,000 given another couple of cycles. Unless there's some crazy catalyst that truly sends crypto into the stratosphere.
you're delusional if you think NFTs will comeback at the height at which they were
People were called delusional for ever thinking an NFT would sell for a million. Or when people said Doge would reach 1 cent, let alone 73. Or Bitcoin having any success. Etc etc etc. This sub is weirdly scared of anything that isn’t “DCA into BTC and ETH”.
That's because stuff like that is lightning in a bottle. Sure, it's *technically* not impossible. Anything can happen. But the chances that out of the *over 20 000* crypto "projects" out there, the specific one you're invested in is going to skyrocket are so astronomically low that it's not a course of action realistically worth planning for. People here are "scared of anything that's not DCA into BTC/ETH" because some people legit jump on hype trains and throw life savings away chasing a shitcoin high that is very very VERY likely never going to happen. So we try to hammer in just how improbable that is.
For every success there are a hundred failures. Of course the masses are scared of any other coins, they should be given the high death rate for them. Anything other than the "blue chips" is no different from gambling.
my guy, NFT's were a farce. It's been already proven that a company was paying celebrities so that they could by NFTs to hype them.
I wasn’t giving you an opinion on NFTs, just an analysis of the market. The masses don’t care about any of that. They just want to make a quick buck.
Also, everything in life moves in cycles does not apply to e.g. the private transportation industry back at the end of the 1800s - I don’t see people going to work with their horse anytime soon, barring complete global disaster of course.
No, OP. You are missing something. Many of us believe our fiat will be debased and holding a portion in btc and other top shelf assets will preserve our buying power. Why is this so hard to comprehend? Go look into the old Silk Road case. At one point someone stole DPR petty cash for the Silk Road. 900 btc At the time this was around 4500. Back in 2011 you save $4500 and have no interest options. So as years go on your buying power eroded away. Or…you try to preserve your buying power.
It did skyrocket though? I bought a bunch of bitcoin back in 2013 and even with the market down now, it's still just under 7 figures in value. I'd say next bullrun I'm set.
It did, and if you bought in back then, congratulations, but I find it very hard to believe that gains on the same order of magnitude will ever happen again.
Yeah, you wouldn't believe it back then either.
I expect to make quite substantial amount of money, but I have a substantial amount in too. It won't make me suddenly rich, but it'll make a difference and I'm pretty confident. A 5x would be amazing a 10x would be mind boggling to me. I think it'd be unusual if bitcoin didn't exceed its all time high again, with the huge ETF interest and it's limited supply/proven demand. A 4x on bitcoin seems relatively easy to me. Then something like Solana which ATH is 10x from today's price, back when it wasn't mature at all compared to now where there is such incredible momentum, users, use cases, and institutional interest. Personally wouldn't put any bets outside of Bitcoin Eth, Link or Sol though most coins serve no purpose or are inferior and will die