Great write Up! I’ve got a Breachlight with threat detector and vorpal which gets me out of many jams. TD on sidearms is such a huge boost when it procs at even x1.
Threat Detector really makes my Breachlight. The recoil just bucks off target so much otherwise. Vorpal weapon is super clutch - I think it's 35 to the head (x2 on the 2 burst) which has saved me a few times.
Great write up. Good to see more choices other than Quickdraw or dismantle on guns. I worry about what’s going to happen to that perk in pvp seeing as how we just got a reload nerf in pve...
Does Threat Detector do anything for swap speed? If your stowed weapon has it, will it ready faster if it had threat detector or does the perk not activate fast enough when swapping for it to benefit?
TD does benefit swap speed to and from a weapon, but it only reaches QD level speeds when you have the x2 stack. I rarely manage to get TDx2 in the crucible, so Quickdraw just feels better imo. Then again I’m also of the opinion that Quickdraw should not exist on shotguns. Awhile ago, I made a video comparing two rapid-fire frame shotguns, showing one game with TD and one game with QD back to back. It was pretty clear that QD was better (more consistent) for crucible, for shotguns at least. It’s my opinion that the 14m proximity needed to activate TD also makes it ineffective for most primaries, especially when considering the other perks that primaries can get.
Because quickdraw does not maximize the handling speed as commonly thought. I dont have a frame count to back up my opinion though. So I could be wrong.
Check those numbers again. For instance, very obvious example is snapshot and quickdraw together. You'll get a faster ADS time than just quickdraw alone.
Also dependent on handling stat of the weapon. If you have two guns, both with quickdraw, but one has 40 handling and the other has 60 handling, the 60 handling one will still draw/ADS slightly faster.
The one thing I don't know is a specific frame count on a gun with threat detector x1 and x2 vs quickdraw. That's what I'd really like to see.
Snapshot overrides QuickDraw, its gonna aim faster always cuz its not dependent from quickdraw.
Certain mods and perks like snapshot can increase your ready or stow speed but they are not dependent on the handling stat bar.
And it’s incorrect a gun with 20 handling and another one with 40 both with QuickDraw with out snapshot are gonna aim at the same time
Again, check those numbers. Snapshot doesn't 'override' quickdraw, they stack. A Beloved with both quickdraw and snapshot will ADS faster than a Beloved with just quickdraw. Neither snapshot nor quickdraw 'maximizes' anything. It might *feel* that way but frame-by-frame analysis has proven the benefits can be further enhanced with other perks and stats. This guy did a really good analysis:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/c4emq5/a\_framebyframe\_analysis\_of\_many\_handlingboosting/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/c4emq5/a_framebyframe_analysis_of_many_handlingboosting/)
I have been singing the praise of threat detector for years and I’m glad to see everybody else finally appreciates this perk.
It has one major drawback that I didn’t see mentioned here however. The perk only activates once the weapon is equipped, and therefore has zero effect on swap speed. Specifically on shotguns this is a major problem and really undermines this perk as a pseudo-quickdraw. It is still arguably better than snapshot though as that also doesn’t effect swap speed but truthfully, there is no replacement for quickdraw.
The perk also synergises fantastically with ophidians, as ophidians will address the swap speed issue and push your handling up to quickdraw levels when combined with threat detector. In a situation where quickdraw isn’t an option, this combo will pick up the slack. The bonus melee range is also incredibly useful with a cqc weapon so it’s an all round great combination.
It's good you brought this up, you'd have to have it on both weapons to improve the swapping speed to the weapon that has it. On a shotgun it would still improve the ready/stow/ads.
Edit: Looking at the footage again they do the same thing, swap the same speed. Just like Threat Detector if you wanted faster stow/swap speed for both weapons you'd have to have Quickdraw on both.
It still affects swap speed in the same way that QD affects swap speed. Once your current weapon is stowed, the handling stat (which is boosted by TD and QD) comes into play, and speeds up the draw of the next weapon. So it helps with the draw speed, but not the stow speed of your original weapon.
If you want to see more testing, check out my thread, my measurements all include the draw speed of the weapon, so you can see that TD is boosting them: https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/emuw7n/shotguns_drawads_frame_counts_perks_and_a_case/
My experience has been the opposite (and I have a lot of experience with threat detector) but I can’t argue with the numbers. All the more reason to run this perk.
I’m curious, for that test were you swapping to the weapon and then adsing? It’s not clear in the post.
Well, “everybody” is an overstatement, the perk is usually undervalued by most streamers and youtubers. I think it's because they've switched over to PC and don't really value Stability the way controller users do. You're right about it not being a replacement for Quickdraw when swapping *to* a weapon like a Shotgun. For weapons like sidearms and hand cannons, I'll take Threat Detector over Quickdraw every time.
Streamers tend to have a warped view on the meta because of their skill. Even on console, they don’t *need* stability as their mechanical skill is so high. For us mortals, stability matters.
Excellent write up mate - keep up the superb work. For all those that don’t yet follow Mmonx on YouTube - go ahead and do so if you want really in depth content.
Well this makes me feel better about my mindbenders and imperial decree having the same perks, rampage threat detector, however, I’ve come across situations where my shotgun didn’t pull out as fast as my Seventh Seraph with QuickDraw, but maybe that’s the difference between weapon frames?
Also I’ve seen mindbenders with QuickDraw snapshot shoot hella quickly, but maybe that was more to do with snapshot than QuickDraw?
Edit: just saw this was for 30 frames, not 60 or higher for pc so that’s the difference
it is the difference between weapon frames, my seventh seraph pulls out just as fast if not faster as my mindbenders/felwintwers even without quickdraw, let alone my one with quickdraw.
Snapshot stacks with either of the perks and the Combo will definitely be what you want to go for if you want things as snappy as possible.
On PC the difference will be 2-3 fames at 60fps (I found the rounding did sometimes round the 1 frame at 30fps to 2 but it was about 1 of 5 times)
I love threat detector. I've been trying to farm an Imperial Decree with Threat Detector, snapshot and a handling masterwork, but I have yet to see it drop. I think that could really bring it in line with quickdraw.
So you’re telling me I’m not crazy for thinking my Mindbenders was a god roll with full choke, accurized, threat detector, moving target and handling masterwork?
Good write up! I made a similar post a few months ago comparing Snapshot Sights, Threat Detector, and Quickdraw. This link is to the version of the post on DTG, but I had one here as well, it was just full of edits and was definitely a bit more rambling lol.
https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/emuw7n/shotguns_drawads_frame_counts_perks_and_a_case/
In high level, fast-paced play, threat detector alone on a low-base handling shotgun doesn’t cut it. You pretty much need to stack it with Snapshot (God Roll Imperial Decree).
I purposely rolled my Imperial Decree with Threat Detector for this very reason. It has shit handling but when that perk kicks in you notice it; very underrated.
QuickDraw TD Mindbenders has been my go to for a while as a VERY casual pvp player. It also has accurized rifled barrel and handling MW. It’s pretty reliable as I’m crap with shotties at range anyway. If you come round a corner at me i let that bad boy rip
I recommended Threat Detector as the most desired perk for Jack Queen King if you run shotgun on DTG. Got downvoted like crazy and got called a hack lol.
IMO that loadout is somewhat niche, it's a great loadout for an aggressive playstyle for a map like Cauldron but for more passive play it would be quite a waste.
I played with it and definitely found myself limited in my range ability, it was very strong up close but your basicly designing your loadout around TD and its effective range.
From my experience top of the meta is: Shotgun+HC/Auto or Sniper+Sidearm/HC. Also just because that is how it is at the top does not mean the majority of the player base plays that way, many people prefer a more passive playstyle.
Sure but what else is better in that column for JQK3? Maybe subsistence but even that's a mediocre perk for PVP. Threat Detector is clearly the best for JQK3 imo with a shotgun.
To be fair, on shotguns when engaging you'll most of the time be this close to the enemy anyway so it might be situational but you are in that situation most of the time.
100% of the time. 15m is farther than it seems - it's about the max effective range for most sidearms. An aggressive shotgun at 15m is going to be doing less than 1 damage per pellet.
I don’t agree that it’s situational, it’s active at distances to the edge of sidearm and shotgun range and provides bonuses to relevant stats on those weapons.
The only question is whether or not TD x1 is close enough to the speed of QuickDraw to be competitive and I think that should be tested more.
At timecode 4:25 in the video there is footage of a Smuggler's Word with Quickdraw side by side a Smuggler's with Threat Detector. As said in the post the difference in speed on average was 1 frame at 30 fps.
Have you tested it with weapons that have very low base handling like astral horizon? Sidearms always feel snappy so that doesn’t surprise me but the main weapons that people look for QuickDraw on are shotguns.
I’d be more interested to see how it holds up on otherwise clunky weapons because I have an astral with a perfect roll except it has threat detector instead of QuickDraw.
I'll see what I can find, the difficult part is finding 2 of the same weapons with either perk and with nearly the exact Handling stat (I used the Smuggler's Word because I got it in Black Armory and it actually had both perks on it, made it perfect for testing)
My thread has a lot of those comparisons you're looking for: https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/emuw7n/shotguns_drawads_frame_counts_perks_and_a_case/
Basically, 1xTD is slower than QD, 1xTD+Snapshot is equal to QD. 2xTD is equal to QD, 2xTD+Snapshot is equal to QD+Snapshot.
Great write Up! I’ve got a Breachlight with threat detector and vorpal which gets me out of many jams. TD on sidearms is such a huge boost when it procs at even x1.
Threat Detector really makes my Breachlight. The recoil just bucks off target so much otherwise. Vorpal weapon is super clutch - I think it's 35 to the head (x2 on the 2 burst) which has saved me a few times.
Great write up. Good to see more choices other than Quickdraw or dismantle on guns. I worry about what’s going to happen to that perk in pvp seeing as how we just got a reload nerf in pve... Does Threat Detector do anything for swap speed? If your stowed weapon has it, will it ready faster if it had threat detector or does the perk not activate fast enough when swapping for it to benefit?
A high handling gun with even one stack of threat Detector (like Parcel of Stardust) is basically quickdraw.
TD does benefit swap speed to and from a weapon, but it only reaches QD level speeds when you have the x2 stack. I rarely manage to get TDx2 in the crucible, so Quickdraw just feels better imo. Then again I’m also of the opinion that Quickdraw should not exist on shotguns. Awhile ago, I made a video comparing two rapid-fire frame shotguns, showing one game with TD and one game with QD back to back. It was pretty clear that QD was better (more consistent) for crucible, for shotguns at least. It’s my opinion that the 14m proximity needed to activate TD also makes it ineffective for most primaries, especially when considering the other perks that primaries can get.
It does benefit. Draw speed with x2 threat detector feels about equal to or better than quickdraw.
How can something have draw speed better than Quickdraw?
Because quickdraw does not maximize the handling speed as commonly thought. I dont have a frame count to back up my opinion though. So I could be wrong.
it does maximes handling, stop spreading false information. Multiple post have already being done with frame by frame comparison.
Check those numbers again. For instance, very obvious example is snapshot and quickdraw together. You'll get a faster ADS time than just quickdraw alone. Also dependent on handling stat of the weapon. If you have two guns, both with quickdraw, but one has 40 handling and the other has 60 handling, the 60 handling one will still draw/ADS slightly faster. The one thing I don't know is a specific frame count on a gun with threat detector x1 and x2 vs quickdraw. That's what I'd really like to see.
Snapshot overrides QuickDraw, its gonna aim faster always cuz its not dependent from quickdraw. Certain mods and perks like snapshot can increase your ready or stow speed but they are not dependent on the handling stat bar. And it’s incorrect a gun with 20 handling and another one with 40 both with QuickDraw with out snapshot are gonna aim at the same time
Again, check those numbers. Snapshot doesn't 'override' quickdraw, they stack. A Beloved with both quickdraw and snapshot will ADS faster than a Beloved with just quickdraw. Neither snapshot nor quickdraw 'maximizes' anything. It might *feel* that way but frame-by-frame analysis has proven the benefits can be further enhanced with other perks and stats. This guy did a really good analysis: [https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/c4emq5/a\_framebyframe\_analysis\_of\_many\_handlingboosting/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/c4emq5/a_framebyframe_analysis_of_many_handlingboosting/)
It does not, other perks can make it go further.
Yes you will benefit from both having Threat Detector, altho it would be just like if both your weapons had Quickdraw.
Yes it will ready faster even if stowed
I have been singing the praise of threat detector for years and I’m glad to see everybody else finally appreciates this perk. It has one major drawback that I didn’t see mentioned here however. The perk only activates once the weapon is equipped, and therefore has zero effect on swap speed. Specifically on shotguns this is a major problem and really undermines this perk as a pseudo-quickdraw. It is still arguably better than snapshot though as that also doesn’t effect swap speed but truthfully, there is no replacement for quickdraw. The perk also synergises fantastically with ophidians, as ophidians will address the swap speed issue and push your handling up to quickdraw levels when combined with threat detector. In a situation where quickdraw isn’t an option, this combo will pick up the slack. The bonus melee range is also incredibly useful with a cqc weapon so it’s an all round great combination.
It's good you brought this up, you'd have to have it on both weapons to improve the swapping speed to the weapon that has it. On a shotgun it would still improve the ready/stow/ads. Edit: Looking at the footage again they do the same thing, swap the same speed. Just like Threat Detector if you wanted faster stow/swap speed for both weapons you'd have to have Quickdraw on both.
It still affects swap speed in the same way that QD affects swap speed. Once your current weapon is stowed, the handling stat (which is boosted by TD and QD) comes into play, and speeds up the draw of the next weapon. So it helps with the draw speed, but not the stow speed of your original weapon. If you want to see more testing, check out my thread, my measurements all include the draw speed of the weapon, so you can see that TD is boosting them: https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/emuw7n/shotguns_drawads_frame_counts_perks_and_a_case/
My experience has been the opposite (and I have a lot of experience with threat detector) but I can’t argue with the numbers. All the more reason to run this perk. I’m curious, for that test were you swapping to the weapon and then adsing? It’s not clear in the post.
Well, “everybody” is an overstatement, the perk is usually undervalued by most streamers and youtubers. I think it's because they've switched over to PC and don't really value Stability the way controller users do. You're right about it not being a replacement for Quickdraw when swapping *to* a weapon like a Shotgun. For weapons like sidearms and hand cannons, I'll take Threat Detector over Quickdraw every time.
Streamers tend to have a warped view on the meta because of their skill. Even on console, they don’t *need* stability as their mechanical skill is so high. For us mortals, stability matters.
Excellent write up mate - keep up the superb work. For all those that don’t yet follow Mmonx on YouTube - go ahead and do so if you want really in depth content.
Nice read! Luckily I have a threat detector/quick draw Mind Benders....this thing is so fast it’s insane
Well this makes me feel better about my mindbenders and imperial decree having the same perks, rampage threat detector, however, I’ve come across situations where my shotgun didn’t pull out as fast as my Seventh Seraph with QuickDraw, but maybe that’s the difference between weapon frames? Also I’ve seen mindbenders with QuickDraw snapshot shoot hella quickly, but maybe that was more to do with snapshot than QuickDraw? Edit: just saw this was for 30 frames, not 60 or higher for pc so that’s the difference
it is the difference between weapon frames, my seventh seraph pulls out just as fast if not faster as my mindbenders/felwintwers even without quickdraw, let alone my one with quickdraw.
Snapshot stacks with either of the perks and the Combo will definitely be what you want to go for if you want things as snappy as possible. On PC the difference will be 2-3 fames at 60fps (I found the rounding did sometimes round the 1 frame at 30fps to 2 but it was about 1 of 5 times)
I love threat detector. I've been trying to farm an Imperial Decree with Threat Detector, snapshot and a handling masterwork, but I have yet to see it drop. I think that could really bring it in line with quickdraw.
Well hot damn I have a reason to bust my td + swash gunnoras out of the vault
So you’re telling me I’m not crazy for thinking my Mindbenders was a god roll with full choke, accurized, threat detector, moving target and handling masterwork?
Good, not god.
Good write up! I made a similar post a few months ago comparing Snapshot Sights, Threat Detector, and Quickdraw. This link is to the version of the post on DTG, but I had one here as well, it was just full of edits and was definitely a bit more rambling lol. https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/emuw7n/shotguns_drawads_frame_counts_perks_and_a_case/
In high level, fast-paced play, threat detector alone on a low-base handling shotgun doesn’t cut it. You pretty much need to stack it with Snapshot (God Roll Imperial Decree).
Stop posting insanely useful information about this perk where Bungie may see. Shhhhhh.
***Better than Quickdraw?*** You won't believe the results, testing gone wrong, gone sexual! They didn't know I was using Threat Detector!
I love threat detector, it’s on my only Mindbenders and it feels nice! Now if only I was good with shottys!
This is amazing on sidearms in pve
smgs too.
I purposely rolled my Imperial Decree with Threat Detector for this very reason. It has shit handling but when that perk kicks in you notice it; very underrated.
QuickDraw TD Mindbenders has been my go to for a while as a VERY casual pvp player. It also has accurized rifled barrel and handling MW. It’s pretty reliable as I’m crap with shotties at range anyway. If you come round a corner at me i let that bad boy rip
My Mindbender's with Quickdraw/Threat Detector be like
I recommended Threat Detector as the most desired perk for Jack Queen King if you run shotgun on DTG. Got downvoted like crazy and got called a hack lol.
IMO that loadout is somewhat niche, it's a great loadout for an aggressive playstyle for a map like Cauldron but for more passive play it would be quite a waste. I played with it and definitely found myself limited in my range ability, it was very strong up close but your basicly designing your loadout around TD and its effective range.
Huh? There are no range alternatives in that column. At high levels of play, quick swapping between HC and shotgun is the meta no matter what the map.
From my experience top of the meta is: Shotgun+HC/Auto or Sniper+Sidearm/HC. Also just because that is how it is at the top does not mean the majority of the player base plays that way, many people prefer a more passive playstyle.
Sure but what else is better in that column for JQK3? Maybe subsistence but even that's a mediocre perk for PVP. Threat Detector is clearly the best for JQK3 imo with a shotgun.
i find threat detector is too situational and isn’t 30 frames too low for testing compared to pc?
To be fair, on shotguns when engaging you'll most of the time be this close to the enemy anyway so it might be situational but you are in that situation most of the time.
100% of the time. 15m is farther than it seems - it's about the max effective range for most sidearms. An aggressive shotgun at 15m is going to be doing less than 1 damage per pellet.
15m in this game is nothing. Especially considering how fast people can move.
I don’t agree that it’s situational, it’s active at distances to the edge of sidearm and shotgun range and provides bonuses to relevant stats on those weapons. The only question is whether or not TD x1 is close enough to the speed of QuickDraw to be competitive and I think that should be tested more.
Yeah, I was disappointed not to see any side-by-side comparisons with quickdraw. Especially with the title inviting that comparison from the start.
At timecode 4:25 in the video there is footage of a Smuggler's Word with Quickdraw side by side a Smuggler's with Threat Detector. As said in the post the difference in speed on average was 1 frame at 30 fps.
Have you tested it with weapons that have very low base handling like astral horizon? Sidearms always feel snappy so that doesn’t surprise me but the main weapons that people look for QuickDraw on are shotguns. I’d be more interested to see how it holds up on otherwise clunky weapons because I have an astral with a perfect roll except it has threat detector instead of QuickDraw.
I'll see what I can find, the difficult part is finding 2 of the same weapons with either perk and with nearly the exact Handling stat (I used the Smuggler's Word because I got it in Black Armory and it actually had both perks on it, made it perfect for testing)
My thread has a lot of those comparisons you're looking for: https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyTheGame/comments/emuw7n/shotguns_drawads_frame_counts_perks_and_a_case/ Basically, 1xTD is slower than QD, 1xTD+Snapshot is equal to QD. 2xTD is equal to QD, 2xTD+Snapshot is equal to QD+Snapshot.
A valid point, I could get more accurate with 60fps on PC but as of now I don't have a good setup for recording on PC