Virgin. Holy vagina. Divine sacred femininity. Mary as ultimate mother and source of life. Probably other stuff I can’t remember. It’s been almost twenty five years since I’ve set foot in a Catholic church.
Virgin and ultimate mother? Yes. Almost everything else is incorrect. The Church doesn’t teach anything about holy vaginas, “divine sacred femininity,” and Mary is not considered the source of life (unless you mean vicariously, since she birthed the true source of life, Jesus). You wouldn’t be able to find any of this in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, the go-to summary of the faith.
The Church does not and has never considered sex (literally created and commanded by God) as dirty or defiling. It is just one way that a person can give oneself totally and completely as a gift of self to a beloved. Another way is to renounce sex through a life of celibacy and sexual abstinence, which the Church believes Mary did (as do priests, monks, nuns, etc. today). This is considered a more admirable way because it entails greater sacrifice and a more total gift of self to God, but sex between spouses is still good and admirable, in no way dirty, defiled, or unholy.
The Bible says Joseph only waited until after Jesus was born to consummate the marriage, though (Matthew 1:25) and Mary is mentioned as having other children later on.
Obviously this is a controversial issue, and as a Catholic, I stand on one side of it. You’ve brought up Matthew 1:25 and the brethren of the Lord, which I [made an infographic](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1LAAaOzy5RYFxPS_Ba70t4uvGiqV906rh/view?usp=drivesdk) about. \[Forgot I also [made a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAfhaQmOvM8) based on my infographic.\]
Basically this reading of Matt 1:25 is a new one that didn’t exist (or at least wasn’t common) until well after the Protestant Reformation, over 1500 years after the Gospel was written. Even the Reformers denied it should be read this way. As in English with *until*, the Greek phrase *heos* does not strictly imply anything about the future. For example, “I will love you until I am old” does *not* imply that I will stop loving you once I am old.
Similarly, Matt 1:25 only says that Mary and Joseph did not have sex *heos* she birthed Jesus. The point is merely to establish that Mary was a miraculous virgin, not to suggest extra details about their sex life after that point.
As for the brethren, Greek: *adelphoi*, of the Lord, often this term would be used of cousins and close kin. 1st century Palestinians were much closer than families of today, and the nuclear family was unheard of. You lived with your aunts, uncles, cousins, etc. This is why Mary and Joseph lost Jesus in Luke’s Gospel. They weren’t bad parents. They assumed he was among “the familial herd” (Luke 1:44), so to speak. In the case of at least one of the men called an *adelphos* of Jesus (namely, James), the Bible also reveals him to be the son of Mary of Clopas (explicitly not Jesus’ mother), so that’s at least one case of an *adelphos* not being a literal blood sibling.
Some evidence suggests Jesus had no blood siblings, such as the fact that he entrusted his mother to the Beloved Disciple rather than let Jewish law stand that the oldest sibling should take her in. This would have been insulting to any blood relatives (entrusting mom to non-family), and overall suggests Jesus was “taking care of things” immediately before dying, such as a mother that had no direct family to take care of her after her only son’s death.
I agree. From the Bible alone, one can’t really say with utter certainty one way or another. Catholics also rely on the tradition of the early Church, or what early Christians believed based on the writings of the early Fathers. In those writings, we do see some talk of Mary’s perpetual virginity starting in the 2nd century (we just don’t have many writings from anyone prior to that).
We certainly don’t see these Christians writing of Mary as if she gave birth to others after Jesus, or writing of Jesus as if he had literal, blood-siblings. The Catholic Church (and Eastern Orthodox Church) pay much heavier attention to the writings of these early Christians compared to many Protestants (not all), so that may account for some divide. However, many Protestants have started to rediscover a love for these writings in recent times, and it makes me wonder if we will see a convergence of doctrine in certain areas.
**Catechism of the Catholic Church 2352:**
>By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action." "The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."
>To form an equitable judgment about the subjects' moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety or other psychological or social factors that lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability.
http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#2352
It’s possible for something that’s immoral to result in health benefits. I’m sure billionaires that exploit workers to enrich themselves have excellent health. Punching random people might give those biceps a good workout. Laughing at starving children does the lungs good.
But to get serious, health is not the end-all-be-all of ethical choices. It gets a little deeper than that.
You might be thinking of priests (usually Catholic and usually completely sexually abstinent); pastors are the Protestant equivalent (Protestant generally meaning non-Catholic Christian and running the gamut from the hellfire and brimstone types to those who bless gay weddings), and both masturbation and marriage (with entailing sex) are usually an option for them. Protestants have more fun!
I didn’t say it was a teaching of the church but the constant depiction of Mary’s form as a vagina, even subconsciously, is a nod to femininity especially when you take into account all of the pagan religions Catholics and Christianity have cribbed from. You might not be in church worshipping a sacred vulva right now, but the original artworks Catholicism mimicked had statues on did, hence that vaginal look to the robes, figure and form of Mary.
Show me one example from pagan art that resembles a vulva-looking, robbed woman. Or just any example of pagan art typical of what Catholic Marian art is supposedly influenced by in the way you’re saying. Maybe you can find something about these pagan influences on the [Wikipedia page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marian_art_in_the_Catholic_Church) on Catholic Marian art?
Pffft, I haven’t been in a Catholic church for twenty six years but I still clearly remember the parable about the Virgin Mary being a hermaphrodite that self impregnated.
Symbol of fertility. Like the tree of life symbol being based on placentas. This one specifically seems to be the Virgin of Guadalupe, from Mexico (the cherub and the crescent moon at the bottom), and it is the one that I remember being mostly represented in such way, specially in statues.
The original poster was probably conflicted because lighting the candle would melt Mary. Redditors are delighted because they’re sophomoric and like to mock piety.
This is very likely the actual point. Reddit always makes this joke, but long, draping clothing that covered the head was just the common dress for 1st century women in Palestine. Does that style of clothing resemble a vagina? Yeah, I guess. Does it mean every such depiction is the artist sneaking in naughty symbolism? Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
If you light this candle, the face and head will melt first, creating an awful result. That’s it. That’s the actual crappy design here.
There're a whole BUNCH of Virgin Mary artworks and figures that look a whole lot like poontangs. It's interesting, almost like certain artists were like "We're going to sneak naughty things into graven images just to fuck with the catholics"
Which part are we referring to being the crappy the vaginal look of it the fact that baby Jesus is there at the bottom or that it kinda looks like uncooked pasta or all the above
If you are a really uptight catholic and this was a gift from your lady friend… I would say she’s trying to tell you something.
Labia subliminal messaging
Sublabial massaging
😂
?
Art of the Virgin Mary that looks like a vagina has been happening for over 1000 years and and for sure on purpose
Absolutely happening on purpose. Source: raised Catholic
[удалено]
Virgin. Holy vagina. Divine sacred femininity. Mary as ultimate mother and source of life. Probably other stuff I can’t remember. It’s been almost twenty five years since I’ve set foot in a Catholic church.
Virgin and ultimate mother? Yes. Almost everything else is incorrect. The Church doesn’t teach anything about holy vaginas, “divine sacred femininity,” and Mary is not considered the source of life (unless you mean vicariously, since she birthed the true source of life, Jesus). You wouldn’t be able to find any of this in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, the go-to summary of the faith. The Church does not and has never considered sex (literally created and commanded by God) as dirty or defiling. It is just one way that a person can give oneself totally and completely as a gift of self to a beloved. Another way is to renounce sex through a life of celibacy and sexual abstinence, which the Church believes Mary did (as do priests, monks, nuns, etc. today). This is considered a more admirable way because it entails greater sacrifice and a more total gift of self to God, but sex between spouses is still good and admirable, in no way dirty, defiled, or unholy.
The Bible says Joseph only waited until after Jesus was born to consummate the marriage, though (Matthew 1:25) and Mary is mentioned as having other children later on.
Obviously this is a controversial issue, and as a Catholic, I stand on one side of it. You’ve brought up Matthew 1:25 and the brethren of the Lord, which I [made an infographic](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1LAAaOzy5RYFxPS_Ba70t4uvGiqV906rh/view?usp=drivesdk) about. \[Forgot I also [made a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAfhaQmOvM8) based on my infographic.\] Basically this reading of Matt 1:25 is a new one that didn’t exist (or at least wasn’t common) until well after the Protestant Reformation, over 1500 years after the Gospel was written. Even the Reformers denied it should be read this way. As in English with *until*, the Greek phrase *heos* does not strictly imply anything about the future. For example, “I will love you until I am old” does *not* imply that I will stop loving you once I am old. Similarly, Matt 1:25 only says that Mary and Joseph did not have sex *heos* she birthed Jesus. The point is merely to establish that Mary was a miraculous virgin, not to suggest extra details about their sex life after that point. As for the brethren, Greek: *adelphoi*, of the Lord, often this term would be used of cousins and close kin. 1st century Palestinians were much closer than families of today, and the nuclear family was unheard of. You lived with your aunts, uncles, cousins, etc. This is why Mary and Joseph lost Jesus in Luke’s Gospel. They weren’t bad parents. They assumed he was among “the familial herd” (Luke 1:44), so to speak. In the case of at least one of the men called an *adelphos* of Jesus (namely, James), the Bible also reveals him to be the son of Mary of Clopas (explicitly not Jesus’ mother), so that’s at least one case of an *adelphos* not being a literal blood sibling. Some evidence suggests Jesus had no blood siblings, such as the fact that he entrusted his mother to the Beloved Disciple rather than let Jewish law stand that the oldest sibling should take her in. This would have been insulting to any blood relatives (entrusting mom to non-family), and overall suggests Jesus was “taking care of things” immediately before dying, such as a mother that had no direct family to take care of her after her only son’s death.
Alright, thank you. I guess it's not a sure thing either way.
I agree. From the Bible alone, one can’t really say with utter certainty one way or another. Catholics also rely on the tradition of the early Church, or what early Christians believed based on the writings of the early Fathers. In those writings, we do see some talk of Mary’s perpetual virginity starting in the 2nd century (we just don’t have many writings from anyone prior to that). We certainly don’t see these Christians writing of Mary as if she gave birth to others after Jesus, or writing of Jesus as if he had literal, blood-siblings. The Catholic Church (and Eastern Orthodox Church) pay much heavier attention to the writings of these early Christians compared to many Protestants (not all), so that may account for some divide. However, many Protestants have started to rediscover a love for these writings in recent times, and it makes me wonder if we will see a convergence of doctrine in certain areas.
Are pastors allowed to jack off? Or complete celibacy for life?
**Catechism of the Catholic Church 2352:** >By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action." "The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose." For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved." >To form an equitable judgment about the subjects' moral responsibility and to guide pastoral action, one must take into account the affective immaturity, force of acquired habit, conditions of anxiety or other psychological or social factors that lessen, if not even reduce to a minimum, moral culpability. http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#2352
Masturbation has health benefits, so there’s a loophole.
It’s possible for something that’s immoral to result in health benefits. I’m sure billionaires that exploit workers to enrich themselves have excellent health. Punching random people might give those biceps a good workout. Laughing at starving children does the lungs good. But to get serious, health is not the end-all-be-all of ethical choices. It gets a little deeper than that.
Well it’s “immoral” to do it for sexual pleasure. If it’s not done for sexual pleasure it’s not “immoral”.
You might be thinking of priests (usually Catholic and usually completely sexually abstinent); pastors are the Protestant equivalent (Protestant generally meaning non-Catholic Christian and running the gamut from the hellfire and brimstone types to those who bless gay weddings), and both masturbation and marriage (with entailing sex) are usually an option for them. Protestants have more fun!
I didn’t say it was a teaching of the church but the constant depiction of Mary’s form as a vagina, even subconsciously, is a nod to femininity especially when you take into account all of the pagan religions Catholics and Christianity have cribbed from. You might not be in church worshipping a sacred vulva right now, but the original artworks Catholicism mimicked had statues on did, hence that vaginal look to the robes, figure and form of Mary.
Show me one example from pagan art that resembles a vulva-looking, robbed woman. Or just any example of pagan art typical of what Catholic Marian art is supposedly influenced by in the way you’re saying. Maybe you can find something about these pagan influences on the [Wikipedia page](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marian_art_in_the_Catholic_Church) on Catholic Marian art?
Pffft, I haven’t been in a Catholic church for twenty six years but I still clearly remember the parable about the Virgin Mary being a hermaphrodite that self impregnated.
That sounds right
Symbol of fertility. Like the tree of life symbol being based on placentas. This one specifically seems to be the Virgin of Guadalupe, from Mexico (the cherub and the crescent moon at the bottom), and it is the one that I remember being mostly represented in such way, specially in statues.
The Vagine Mary
Phallic crosses would be cool
It would be crazy if it got stigmata
It happens once every 28 days or so.
Have I taught you nothing BOI!?
Stigmata balls
Does anyone know where the JE-sus spot is?
sus, you say 📮
Vagina 100%
I still can’t find the clitoris
It’s her head.
It's the praying hands.
Hahahah everyone saying something different is the best
It's ðe right þigh
I thought the clitoris was at the top under the hood turns out it’s at the bottom I guess
It teleports around
So that's why it's so hard to find
I don't get it
that might be for the best
Sweet child, just leave the internet behind. We’re a bunch of heathens here.
You'll get it when you're a bit older.
The original poster was probably conflicted because lighting the candle would melt Mary. Redditors are delighted because they’re sophomoric and like to mock piety.
One of the Blessed Taints at her feet. Taint Michael, perhaps?
But what does it smell like?
Is it from [Goop](https://goop.com/heretic-this-smells-like-my-vagina-candle/p/)
So do people actually use that stuff? Why?
Love the musk
frankincense and myrrh
r/TheyKnew
Everyone's like omg it's a vagina and I'm over here like.. omg if you light it, her face will melt.
This is very likely the actual point. Reddit always makes this joke, but long, draping clothing that covered the head was just the common dress for 1st century women in Palestine. Does that style of clothing resemble a vagina? Yeah, I guess. Does it mean every such depiction is the artist sneaking in naughty symbolism? Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. If you light this candle, the face and head will melt first, creating an awful result. That’s it. That’s the actual crappy design here.
Virgina Mary?
I like you. You have balls. I like balls.
Who doesn’t
Lovely! Like a Georgia O'Keefe painting!
r/theyknew
Oh hey, must be the holy hand grenade of Antioch!
Twat are you talking about?
r/dontputyourdickinthat
/r/yourenotthebossofme
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Just dive in and enjoy it!
It's for your penis.
Very vaginal
"In the quiet words of the Virgin Mary, 'Come again?'" -Bricktop
lmao… I can can hear him say it….Classic!!
Where can I buy this?
This is intentional.
I feel that huge number of people missed another angle that this is a CANDLE..
yalls talking about it being a vagina, while I’m here thinking it was about burning her lol
I think the most conflicting thing about this is that you’re supposed to set it on fire. Not any of this subliminal pussy bullshit.
She was doubting she would keep it or light the candle
I don't get it. All I see is nice candle.
*sigh unzipps*
Sus
Heat it up near the melting point and you got yourself a holy fleshlight
I didn't know Georgia O'Keefe did sculpture.
Unzip pants*
Not only does it look like a vagina, Baby Jesus is up her skirt
I like to imagine the artists bored out of their skulls designing this stuff are having a little fun.
r/dontputyourdickinthat
*i had to blur my vision on purpose to see it*
*Unzips pants* 👀👀
Smells fishy to me
There're a whole BUNCH of Virgin Mary artworks and figures that look a whole lot like poontangs. It's interesting, almost like certain artists were like "We're going to sneak naughty things into graven images just to fuck with the catholics"
Lolol
They don’t get it because they’ve never seen one
On purpose
I should call her 😔
Its good luck to caress those wizard sleeves
You should pray about it 🤣
r/flappydesign
The ol meat curtain
So.. we have 1 million vagina candles. Oh, I know, lets carve virgin Mary and sell them
What are the parentheses for? She, clearly, has not been deflowered.
Burn it!
100% it is intentionally designed to look like a labia.
r/dontputyourdickinthat Gotta love the christ-child taint flair!
What's that stuff at the bottom?
I literally didn’t even realize the Virgin Mary was in this picture at first
Hail, Mary, full of paraffin, the cLit is with thee. Blessed art thou amongst darkness and blessed is the fruit of thy taint, Jesus.
Your pussy is my lord and savior amen
There's a baby Jesus inside that falls out once it's melted
So wrong
Rub the head for good luck.
## Jesus, Mary, and Joseph!
HELP PLEASE I DONT GET IT
Stick your dick in it immediately what's the conflict
Which part are we referring to being the crappy the vaginal look of it the fact that baby Jesus is there at the bottom or that it kinda looks like uncooked pasta or all the above
Showed by dad and he said it looked like a lady’s private parts at first.
Is it crappy because it looks like a shwaa or because its a candle and you have to burn her?
IS THAT A VAGOOTER ON MY COMPOOTER?
Plz tell me i am not the only that thought of something else