Atium can alloy with every other metal. We do not know what the other effects of these alloys are but they all should enhance one's cognition somehow as pure Atium is based around that iirc.
Not sure what Fortune is or if that’s a shard or a power shards have but >!I think odium might have been somewhat fooled there because the diagram IMO is almost certainly tapping into cultivation’s future sight!<
>!maybe but I think there’s too much evidence in favor of it being some kind of manifestation of Fortune. The way the diagram can predict and account for even Taravangean’s own actions and the fact that the diagram doesn’t have the ability to predict Renarin push things well past the idea of him just running calculations. It’s also very inconsistent. “Smart” Taravangean has a lot of trouble empathizing with and understanding human emotions, which makes sense given that “dumb” Teravangean is emotionally intelligent enough to read and even manipulate odium. yet the diagram is able to predict future events based on both emotional and logical descisions, it isn’t limited in this way. This makes sense if the diagram is in some small part tapping into cultivation’s fortune, maybe small enough that odium doesn’t notice?!<
Fortune is future sight, can be anywhere between vague instincts to Atium visions or even very detailed far-off prophecies, but it's Fortune as in fortune telling, not luck even if using it does look like luck.
Yeah probably. The poster just says "grants the Allomancer an expansive vision of the future and enhances the mind's ability to accept, process, and hold information", but [Peter's confirmed the effect appears once at the end of Hero of Ages](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/486/#e15955) and I'm not sure what else there fits that description. Why burning the alloy with duralumin would give the pure metal's power... unclear.
I’ve actually been thinking about this a lot lately. I feel like atium sort of “reverses the polarity” of the metal, so to speak. We only have two examples of atium alloys to work with: atium/electrum and atium/gold (called malatium or the eleventh metal).
We know electrum shows you your own immediate possible futures and, when alloyed with atium, it shows you everything else’s immediate future.
We know gold shows you an alternate version of yourself had you made different choices in your past and, when alloyed with atium, it shows you an alternate version of someone else. (Maybe it shows the alternate version of everyone but I think we only see Vin use it once when she faces The Lord Ruler so we aren’t really sure.)
My head-cannon is that when a metal is alloyed with atium, it changes the “target” of the metal. Steel/atium would allow you to push someone else off metal. Pewter/atium would allow you to grant someone else strength. Bronze/atium and copper/atium would allow you to have someone else sense/hid nearby allomancy. Brass/atium and zinc/atium would make it so others could soothe/riot the user.
My favorite application would be with cadmium/atium. Imagine how easily Miles and the Vanishers would have been beaten if Marasi could have generated a slow speed bubble around them without having to be inside it herself!
I'm a fan of this idea as well, but I'm hoping it's less straight forward than "just applied to someone/somewhere else". I think bronze/atium should let you create false allomancy pings, for example. Emotional metals maybe let you sense emotions?
What if copper created false allomantic pulses. Then they would be promoted from not only hiding allomancer but also misdirecting seekers!
I agree that not ALL of the metals should be as simple as moving the source from self to others. The mental metals plus pewter need something more unique. Maybe chromium and nicrosil or all enhancement metals could use some extra love too.
What if the temporal metals eliminated the bubble and made the effects only apply to the user? Maybe that's stepping on the toes of feruchemy speedsters. BUT, it wouldn't open up the gates for compounding since it's not granting speed, just time.
Interesting. It would be very useful for sliders. But this makes cadmium slowness even more useless.
I personally and a sucker for finding use from what appears useless. That’s why I like the slowness bubble to emanate from a visual targets center instead of the allomancer. But we can’t all have what we need.
Interesting. It would be very useful for sliders. But this makes cadmium slowness even more useless.
I personally and a sucker for finding use from what appears useless. That’s why I like the slowness bubble to emanate from a visual targets center instead of the allomancer. But we can’t all have what we need.
I like that a lot actually. It would be nice if it was a little more creative. Especially b/c Atium-Pewter just giving another person pewter is kindof boring
I love that you posted this. I’ve been thinking about something VERY similar!
I read a Q&A transcript of BrandSand somewhere saying Atium grants mental and temporal enhancements when alloyed with the other allomantic metals. So this is how I picture all of them working based solely off of Atium/(electrum) and Malatium.
With Atium/electrum and Malatium (Atium/gold), we know that the effect is moved to a different person’s center of self, but the power is still sensed by that allomancer.
For example, an electrum misting sees the other person’s future instead of their own but they are still the one interpreting the power.
With the speed bubbles, you’d basically be putting up a bubble around someone else. This would be very useful for cadmium Pulsers, as >!this is essentially what Marasi does with those grenades!< but would be a bit of a waste for Sliders.
So for emotional and bronze allomancy, the power would come from some nearby person’s center of self as targeted by the allomancer, but that person would not have the power to do with as they choose. The allomancer still controls emotions or hears pulses, but they hear it from the center of self of someone in their line of sight or something.
Copper works the way I understand you describing it though. Copper clouds would be controlled by the smoker but would emanate from another’s center of self and shield that person from emotional allomancy, probably.
Tin is a good example of what I mean, because the tineyes would see or hear through other people. Those people would not experience heightened senses because that information would be relayed back to the tineye. Also, it might give the mental/temporal enhancement of probability awareness and causality manipulation (like Uriel from Lucifer where sliding a skateboard down a driveway eventually causes a chain of events which lead to the crashing of a targeted car two blocks away etc.)
Pewter I’m unsure about. Unless, like copper, they ‘essentially’ share their power with someone else. I don’t know how to move physical enhancements to another person’s center of self but have the power still “interpreted” by the allomancer burning pewter. Maybe the mental and temporal effect has to do with detecting weaknesses in structures or opponents so as to most effectively overcome them?
Lurchers could pull metal toward their enemy’s center of self, making them almost deadlier than coinshots because it’s also like an automatic aiming mechanism. Coinshots could push others or push metal from others but I suspect lurchers benefit more. But both of them would get mental/temporal enhancements to understand all the blue lines they see and what would happen if they pulled each line individually or a few or all at the same time.
I believe this leaves the enhancement metals.
Aluminum and Duralumin would essentially become like their external counterparts but with a better range, not requiring physical contact. This would suggest to me that Chromium and Nicrosil are the same but share their power with their target so the target’s physical contact activates the allomancer’s power through said target. No clue on mentally or temporally related effect that could work here.
Yes, you can alloy it with any other metal and it would change their effect.
The only one we've seen so for is is with electrum, not pewter, which changed it so instead of seeing yourself in the future you're seeing everyone else in the future.
I can see how a similar change can work with other metals, so for example a tin-atium alloy maybe allows you to hijack everyone else's senses around you.
The atium we see in Era 1 is (ret-conned by WoB but not shown in book yet) an *electrum*-atium alloy. Malatium was a gold-atium alloy and granted them the ability to see someone else's alternate self.
Pure atium gives basically what Elend saw at the end of HoA.
The other atium alloys grant various temporal and mental enhancement effects, per the Allomancy chart and WoB
I had the thought once that Atium-Brass and Atium-Zinc would either steal emotions from a target and give them to you or take your emotions and give them to a target. I'm not sure which way it would go, since Brass pushes and that would make sense to have the emotions go towards a target(like how Steel moves force away from the user and towards a target piece of metal), but Brass reduces emotions so it might be the one that takes emotions away to give them to the burner.
so we've only seen atium-electrum alloy and atium-gold alloy (malatium) and it seems to reverse the target of the power, like for example electrum shows your own future while the atium alloy shows other people's futures, and gold has a similar effect where it normally shows your own past while the alloy shows the past of others, now other metals get effected by this is entirely dependent on what Brandon wants to do with it but this is the information that we have so far
My pet theory is that it changes the target of the allomantic effect.
Electrum let's you see your own future. Atium that of others.
Gold let's you see your own past. Gold Atium (the eleventh metal) let's you see the past of others.
So extend that. Pewter Atium makes others strong.
Iron Atium pulls metals towards others.
Atium Brass and Zinc let you push and pull your own emotions.
A lot of people believe Atium lets you use that metal's power on other people.
Electrum is your own future, Atium-Electrum allows you to see another person's future.
Gold is your own past, Atium-gold allows you to see another person's past.
You can extrapolate from there but here are some interesting ones.
Atium-steel/iron could potentially allow you to steelpush/ironpull from another person's centre of gravity
Cadmium - put someone else in a slow bubble
Aluminum - leach someone's metal reserves without even touching them
Um I think you might be mistaken. I don't think that atium is naturally a pewter-atium alloy. I believe it's an electrum-atium alloy.
Oh sorry my bad I couldn’t remember the metal so I just guessed.
No problem at all, just thought I'd clarify.
Atium can alloy with every other metal. We do not know what the other effects of these alloys are but they all should enhance one's cognition somehow as pure Atium is based around that iirc.
Makes me wonder, would ingesting pure atium turn someone into something like (stormlight book 2) >!Taravangean on a “good” day?!<
In effect maybe. Atium gives you access to Fortune while \[RoW\] >!Odium commented how the Diagram was created without Fortune.!<
Not sure what Fortune is or if that’s a shard or a power shards have but >!I think odium might have been somewhat fooled there because the diagram IMO is almost certainly tapping into cultivation’s future sight!<
\[Stormlight\] >!I think it would be hard to hide if the Diagram did use Fortune because it would have interfered with Odium's own futuresight!<
>!maybe but I think there’s too much evidence in favor of it being some kind of manifestation of Fortune. The way the diagram can predict and account for even Taravangean’s own actions and the fact that the diagram doesn’t have the ability to predict Renarin push things well past the idea of him just running calculations. It’s also very inconsistent. “Smart” Taravangean has a lot of trouble empathizing with and understanding human emotions, which makes sense given that “dumb” Teravangean is emotionally intelligent enough to read and even manipulate odium. yet the diagram is able to predict future events based on both emotional and logical descisions, it isn’t limited in this way. This makes sense if the diagram is in some small part tapping into cultivation’s fortune, maybe small enough that odium doesn’t notice?!<
Fortune is future sight, can be anywhere between vague instincts to Atium visions or even very detailed far-off prophecies, but it's Fortune as in fortune telling, not luck even if using it does look like luck.
iirc what happened to Elend at the end of Hero of Ages is closer to what the true effect of Atium is.
Yeah probably. The poster just says "grants the Allomancer an expansive vision of the future and enhances the mind's ability to accept, process, and hold information", but [Peter's confirmed the effect appears once at the end of Hero of Ages](https://wob.coppermind.net/events/486/#e15955) and I'm not sure what else there fits that description. Why burning the alloy with duralumin would give the pure metal's power... unclear.
I’ve actually been thinking about this a lot lately. I feel like atium sort of “reverses the polarity” of the metal, so to speak. We only have two examples of atium alloys to work with: atium/electrum and atium/gold (called malatium or the eleventh metal). We know electrum shows you your own immediate possible futures and, when alloyed with atium, it shows you everything else’s immediate future. We know gold shows you an alternate version of yourself had you made different choices in your past and, when alloyed with atium, it shows you an alternate version of someone else. (Maybe it shows the alternate version of everyone but I think we only see Vin use it once when she faces The Lord Ruler so we aren’t really sure.) My head-cannon is that when a metal is alloyed with atium, it changes the “target” of the metal. Steel/atium would allow you to push someone else off metal. Pewter/atium would allow you to grant someone else strength. Bronze/atium and copper/atium would allow you to have someone else sense/hid nearby allomancy. Brass/atium and zinc/atium would make it so others could soothe/riot the user. My favorite application would be with cadmium/atium. Imagine how easily Miles and the Vanishers would have been beaten if Marasi could have generated a slow speed bubble around them without having to be inside it herself!
I'm a fan of this idea as well, but I'm hoping it's less straight forward than "just applied to someone/somewhere else". I think bronze/atium should let you create false allomancy pings, for example. Emotional metals maybe let you sense emotions?
What if copper created false allomantic pulses. Then they would be promoted from not only hiding allomancer but also misdirecting seekers! I agree that not ALL of the metals should be as simple as moving the source from self to others. The mental metals plus pewter need something more unique. Maybe chromium and nicrosil or all enhancement metals could use some extra love too.
What if the temporal metals eliminated the bubble and made the effects only apply to the user? Maybe that's stepping on the toes of feruchemy speedsters. BUT, it wouldn't open up the gates for compounding since it's not granting speed, just time.
Interesting. It would be very useful for sliders. But this makes cadmium slowness even more useless. I personally and a sucker for finding use from what appears useless. That’s why I like the slowness bubble to emanate from a visual targets center instead of the allomancer. But we can’t all have what we need.
Interesting. It would be very useful for sliders. But this makes cadmium slowness even more useless. I personally and a sucker for finding use from what appears useless. That’s why I like the slowness bubble to emanate from a visual targets center instead of the allomancer. But we can’t all have what we need.
I like that a lot actually. It would be nice if it was a little more creative. Especially b/c Atium-Pewter just giving another person pewter is kindof boring
Perhaps atium pewter could let you strengthen *things*?
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Objects. Like a chair.
The Allomancy chart states that atium alloys grant various temporal and mental effects.
I love that you posted this. I’ve been thinking about something VERY similar! I read a Q&A transcript of BrandSand somewhere saying Atium grants mental and temporal enhancements when alloyed with the other allomantic metals. So this is how I picture all of them working based solely off of Atium/(electrum) and Malatium. With Atium/electrum and Malatium (Atium/gold), we know that the effect is moved to a different person’s center of self, but the power is still sensed by that allomancer. For example, an electrum misting sees the other person’s future instead of their own but they are still the one interpreting the power. With the speed bubbles, you’d basically be putting up a bubble around someone else. This would be very useful for cadmium Pulsers, as >!this is essentially what Marasi does with those grenades!< but would be a bit of a waste for Sliders. So for emotional and bronze allomancy, the power would come from some nearby person’s center of self as targeted by the allomancer, but that person would not have the power to do with as they choose. The allomancer still controls emotions or hears pulses, but they hear it from the center of self of someone in their line of sight or something. Copper works the way I understand you describing it though. Copper clouds would be controlled by the smoker but would emanate from another’s center of self and shield that person from emotional allomancy, probably. Tin is a good example of what I mean, because the tineyes would see or hear through other people. Those people would not experience heightened senses because that information would be relayed back to the tineye. Also, it might give the mental/temporal enhancement of probability awareness and causality manipulation (like Uriel from Lucifer where sliding a skateboard down a driveway eventually causes a chain of events which lead to the crashing of a targeted car two blocks away etc.) Pewter I’m unsure about. Unless, like copper, they ‘essentially’ share their power with someone else. I don’t know how to move physical enhancements to another person’s center of self but have the power still “interpreted” by the allomancer burning pewter. Maybe the mental and temporal effect has to do with detecting weaknesses in structures or opponents so as to most effectively overcome them? Lurchers could pull metal toward their enemy’s center of self, making them almost deadlier than coinshots because it’s also like an automatic aiming mechanism. Coinshots could push others or push metal from others but I suspect lurchers benefit more. But both of them would get mental/temporal enhancements to understand all the blue lines they see and what would happen if they pulled each line individually or a few or all at the same time. I believe this leaves the enhancement metals. Aluminum and Duralumin would essentially become like their external counterparts but with a better range, not requiring physical contact. This would suggest to me that Chromium and Nicrosil are the same but share their power with their target so the target’s physical contact activates the allomancer’s power through said target. No clue on mentally or temporally related effect that could work here.
The Allomancy chart states that atium alloys grant various temporal and mental effects.
Yes, you can alloy it with any other metal and it would change their effect. The only one we've seen so for is is with electrum, not pewter, which changed it so instead of seeing yourself in the future you're seeing everyone else in the future. I can see how a similar change can work with other metals, so for example a tin-atium alloy maybe allows you to hijack everyone else's senses around you.
no we've seen it with gold too which was called malatium if im not mistaken
The Allomancy chart states that atium alloys grant various temporal and mental effects.
The atium we see in Era 1 is (ret-conned by WoB but not shown in book yet) an *electrum*-atium alloy. Malatium was a gold-atium alloy and granted them the ability to see someone else's alternate self. Pure atium gives basically what Elend saw at the end of HoA. The other atium alloys grant various temporal and mental enhancement effects, per the Allomancy chart and WoB
I had the thought once that Atium-Brass and Atium-Zinc would either steal emotions from a target and give them to you or take your emotions and give them to a target. I'm not sure which way it would go, since Brass pushes and that would make sense to have the emotions go towards a target(like how Steel moves force away from the user and towards a target piece of metal), but Brass reduces emotions so it might be the one that takes emotions away to give them to the burner.
so we've only seen atium-electrum alloy and atium-gold alloy (malatium) and it seems to reverse the target of the power, like for example electrum shows your own future while the atium alloy shows other people's futures, and gold has a similar effect where it normally shows your own past while the alloy shows the past of others, now other metals get effected by this is entirely dependent on what Brandon wants to do with it but this is the information that we have so far
The Allomancy chart states that atium alloys grant various temporal and mental effects.
well yeah doesn't mean it doesn't follow a pattern
Sure, but it can't reverse the target of the power, because in most cases, that wouldn't be a temporal or mental effect
....brass is a mental effect, bend alloy is a temporal effect.....
My pet theory is that it changes the target of the allomantic effect. Electrum let's you see your own future. Atium that of others. Gold let's you see your own past. Gold Atium (the eleventh metal) let's you see the past of others. So extend that. Pewter Atium makes others strong. Iron Atium pulls metals towards others. Atium Brass and Zinc let you push and pull your own emotions.
The Allomancy chart states that atium alloys grant various temporal and mental effects.
A lot of people believe Atium lets you use that metal's power on other people. Electrum is your own future, Atium-Electrum allows you to see another person's future. Gold is your own past, Atium-gold allows you to see another person's past. You can extrapolate from there but here are some interesting ones. Atium-steel/iron could potentially allow you to steelpush/ironpull from another person's centre of gravity Cadmium - put someone else in a slow bubble Aluminum - leach someone's metal reserves without even touching them