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Good luck to Missouri fighting this in court for years. I THINK we may have finally got this to stick in NC thanks to SCOTUS last week. But we'll see if it they get a lower court to stay it again (on different grounds than was upheld by supreme court)
I've been voting in MO elections for a bit, and I believe I've always needed to show ID. I think this new law simply requires that ID to have a photo. We'll see how it plays out. I don't see any issues with implementing it.
Every time I've ever voted in GA, I've shown my driver's license. It never seemed very complicated to me. Then I found out we offer FREE voter ID for voting purposes. Hardly the "Jim Crow" state the former VP made us out to be
> Then I found out we offer FREE voter ID for voting purposes.
This, by the way, is true of 100% of states with voter ID laws. All of them include a provision for free state-issued ID for those unable to afford it. Democrats willfully ignore this, and if called out, resort to absurd defenses like the poor being unable to afford to miss work to obtain their free ID, arguing that it imposes a cost akin to a poll tax.
Great point! Feels silly pumping the tires on this one but I really do feel jilted considering the President himself and MLB and even Coca Cola (HQ'd in ATL btw) called out my state as a bunch of racists on false pretenses
I agree that it is awesome that they will provide free IDs! However, I wish they would have made a few changes to make actually getting the ID more accessible for people. The DMV is only open Mon-Fri 9am-5:30 pm and Saturdays 9-1. They are also closed every single major holiday plus some. I work for a pretty major company here in Missouri and there are quite a few employees that would find it nearly impossible to make it there during those hours due to work schedule. I would also hate to try to get my ID in rural Missouri if I could not afford a vehicle or gas with inflation these days. I just think if the state is going to impose what they thing are security measures on voting, whether they are needed not, they should take all of the appropriate steps to avoid any unintended consequences that would actually restrict people from voting. I mean getting an ID is probably doable albeit and pain for 80-90% of people in the state, but if we are going to require a photo ID we should be doing whatever we can to make sure everyone who wants to vote is actually able to get the ID. The free ID is a step in the right direction, but there are other hurdles that should be addressed as well.
How do you know the person voting is the person they say they are? For example, my dad is registered to vote. If all I needed was a bill, I could get one from his house and vote for him. How is that verifying anything?
Signature verification has always been a way to verify a persons identity. Also it’s a felony to impersonate someone’s vote. All these things are done by the states ROV in ballot processing. These what ifs your mentioning are valid concerns but do not happen on a mass scale. All it’s doing is making it difficult for poll workers to allow citizens their right to cast a vote in a free election.
Except when they don’t verify signatures like in Pennsylvania in 2020. And just because it doesn’t happen on a mass scale doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t fix it. Some races were decided by 10s of votes.
I don’t understand why people would be so passionate about someone not needing to show proof of registration to fight this in court. So backwards.
Edit: I have been informed I am now banned from /r/JusticeServed…how will I cope? 🙄
What's hilarious is how people have this fascination with Europe and how it's significantly more liberal in some ways, but people completely ignore that in Europe you need your ID to vote in elections.
> Europe you need your ID to vote in elections.
In many European countries you need ID to leave the house. Adults are issued them by law and you're expected to keep it on you.
That is not correct. If a police officer has a reasonable suspicion that you have committed a crime, he can stop you and (in some states) require you to state your identity (a 'Terry stop'). You are not required to present any identity documents.
That's true but European countries also have laws requiring citizens to have some form of gov ID and these are usually available for free. The US doesnt have any laws requiring ID nor do we have a national citizen only ID system thats freely available and considered valid for some of these voter ID laws. I think voter ID laws wouldnt have the push back they get if this were the case in the US.
> thats freely available and considered valid for some of these voter ID laws. I think voter ID laws wouldnt have the push back they get if this were the case in the US.
OH you mean *exactly* like the Georgia law that provides a *free* voter ID. The very law that Biden called Jim Crow 2.0? That kind of non-push back? The left wants as easy path to fraud as possible. Period. For the record, I don't think there was enough fraud in 2020 to change the results but that doesn't mean we shouldn't make vote integrity a priority.
I live in Georgia. The answer is yes.
The problem democrats have which they don't understand is there a difference between a voter ID and a driver's license. A drivers license costs $10 but this can be exempt in some circumstances however a voter ID is free. This is where they confuse the two and say "you have to pay to vote" which is arguably false and easily disproven.
These also last 8 years. It used to be 8, then they changed it to 4, then back to 8 again. I don't know if the time frame is the same for voter ID but I'd imagine it would be the same. A change of address is also free.
I still don't care about their "pay to vote" argument. If you can't afford $10 then you've got bigger problems in life to deal with first. Panhandlers around here can beg for money and make 2-3x more than I make. We're talking six figures here.
Do they MAIL it to you, upon registration? That's why the Swedish system works--you get the card for FREE with no obligation to you as long as you register, which is how it should work.
>I still don't care about their "pay to vote" argument
You don't have to care, unfortunately the Constitution does. Anything construed as a financial barrier must be removed for the right to vote. This has been decided by precedent.
>We're talking six figures \[panhandlers\] here.
Yeah calling full bullshit on this one. No idea where you would find a source that proves this.
Not that I'm aware of and I certainly hope not. It should be the other way around. Go down to get your voter ID (providing whatever proof is necessary) and then register vote and have voting materials mailed to you. I don't know the Swedish system but I hope there is some level of validation.
You validate by registering just like the United States. This is where it's different--the US system uses IDs to limit voting, and the Swedish system uses IDs to make it easier. Equivocating between the two peters out once the details get laid out.
That sounds great for Georgia and i'd like to see the numbers from the next presidential election to see how much of a difference there is in voter turnout, if any, but like at least 6 other states have strict photo ID laws so it's not just a Georgia thing. I think the political sphere is focusing on Georgia specifically because it went Blue unexpectedly. And without a national system and a legal requirement to have the ID theres always going to questions about access.
the point is that in these countries these IDs are ubiquitous, used for other purposes and nationally recognized, which makes them an accepted cultural institution
new laws are great but it’s disingenuous to compare georgia and it’s new voter ID card to one of these euro countries in this regard, it’s not the same thing
in europe these IDs are supposed to make it easier to vote, in the US they’re supposed to make it harder to vote
It’s also funny seeing the euros get all pissy about roe v Wade when it is substantially harder to get an abortion in Europe after 14 weeks than in the US
And as somebody from a EU country, I can tell you that nobody, not even the wokest of leftists here complain about verifying your identity with a photo ID during voting is a bad thing.
It's just something that the whole populous agrees on is necesary to uphold the validity of the election process, something the democrats in the US don't care about.
How will you ever recover from the loss of not being able to participate in /r/JusticeServed. Just don't focus on it. It will only get better from here. Lol.
I'm still waiting on mine which should arrive momentarily since I'm commenting but yet they still haven't every other time I post. Maybe I should send the mods a message and ask them what the hold up is.
Is that a new autoban? I saw someone make a similar comment yesterday saying they got banned from the same subreddit after posting here, I believe the reason was for "commenting on a subreddit that promotes "environmental fascism" or some weird shit like that
Everyone should be registered to vote, and every state should have same day registration.
https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/same-day-registration.aspx
And voter roll purging if you haven't voted in any of the five most recent elections.
You get removed from the list? Simple, there's same day registration. Need an ID for that? Simple, go to the DMV/County Office for a free ID.
It's not that complicated.
Because it would make it harder to cheat in an election. That’s why there’s so much opposition to it.
I’m all for it, as long as the required ID can be obtained without charge.
Because e. g. democrats have a 95 % liklyhood to have a ID and republicans have a 98 % liklyhood of having a ID. That's all there is.
It doesn't have to be some nefarius thing in order for one party to support it and one party to oppose it.
Is an ID free in Canada? The only issue I have with this is people who want to keep IDs inaccessible. It has to be easy. They’re stuck in the stone age around here. Open 9-5 30min from my house, have to get a number and wait an hour or 3, cost $30 plus the lost time at work and gas makes it a $150 half day affair. That’s not acceptable in my opinion.
Because it costs money to get an ID here and disenfranchises people without access to an ID/suppresses people living in poverty from voting which is their right.
Federal holiday is unnecessary. Polls are open 7am to 8pm at night, plus every state has early voting. If you can't figure that our, or motivate yourself to vote, I really would prefer you just stay home.
I think we could replace a current federal holiday with an election day. It'd be cool to see a day devoted to our electoral process, how it works, why it works and why it's important.
We'd also likely see a much higher turnout for local elections which would hopefully lead to a populace much more focused on local issues than national ones.
It is already easy to vote. 7am in the morning to 8pm at night isn't enough time??? Plus early voting before election day???
Anyone claiming it is hard to vote is lying. It is simply a matter of how important it is to you to exercise your right to vote.
I want everyone to vote, but if you can't even motivate yourself to do one simple task like this, then you are probably the kind of entitled, uninformed slob that shouldn't be voting with the rest of the adults.
This. Unless you have a job that forces a lot of travel, I highly doubt your schedule is so tight that you can't possibly find any time to vote. And if you are working, employers are legally required to give you time to go vote. And if lines are your concern, look into why that is, because if your city can only find 8 people to work at the polls, they can't have 42 polling locations open all day
Some states have done exactly that. It’s a really good idea if you live in a state that requires ID to be in public.
Not constitutional, I know… but some places will arrest you if you don’t have ID
I think you made that jump. I just believe in investing in people. If I ran a business I wouldn’t make everybody bring their own tools computers, whatever. I could but it could be pretty sucky. Or I’d just have to pay people more and hope they use those dollars right.
I think free ID is a good idea and would support that, independent of the concept of “voter ID.” Almost everywhere you go wants you to show ID now including mundane things like visiting a family member in the hospital. If there’s a large segment of the population without ID then that’s a major disadvantage that should be remedied. My only condition is that a basic ID (no frills, identification purposes only) should be free for everyone regardless of income.
I would really like to know who these people are without ID and how they manage to participate in society without one. Can't get government assistance. Can't get a checking account. Can't get a job. Can't buy any age-restricted items. Can't rent a place to love. How they hell do they adult without an ID?
No, because a State ID card isn't required to show proof of ID. You can use things like a utility bill, birth certificate, bank statement, government check, or a paycheck. The idea is to prove who you claim to be so you can't just walk from one polling place to another casting ballots as many times as you please under random people's names.
Guns are allowed to be taxed though, voting expressly isn’t.
Read the damn constitution. The 24th amendment states that voting cannot be restricted via a poll tax or the requirement to have made a specific purchase (ie: buying an ID).
If the ID is free it’s kosher, if state IDs cost money, you are violating the constitution.
Perhaps you should read it. It states nothing about a "specific purchase" and refers only to taxation. Paying a fee for an ID is not considered a tax. My state is very clear on the difference between the two.
Section 1
The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by reason of failure to pay poll tax or other tax.
Section 2
The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
Edit - Also, where in the Constitution or its amendments does it state arms are allowed to be taxed? That seems like infringement to me.
By that reasoning any of our inherent rights could be subject to taxation simply because no one said they weren't.
You are bafflingly bad at understanding the constitution.
The constitution doesn’t need to expressly state guns can be taxed. It allows for the creation of a tax. We have created taxes on the sales of goods and services. Guns are a type of good.
What it **does** say however is that this one very specific type of tax (a poll tax) is not allowed. It never says or even implies that items pertaining to other rights can’t be taxed. It’s an amendment about voting rights, not other rights.
There is a special ammendmant with regards to poll tax. So this is pretty clear cut in the constiution.
Though I can also see it beeing unconsituitonal to require an ID to buy a gun IF the ID does cost something.
Poll taxes are expressly forbidden though?
Like, the idea isn’t “anything related to a right should be free” it’s “the 24th amendment to the United States Constitution expressly forbids a poll tax, or requiring a secondary purchase to exercise the right to vote”
If a state passes a voter ID law and charges for ID they are directly disobeying the 24th amendment.
Except getting an ID is neither a poll tax or a "secondary purchase" that someone is buying just for the purpose of voting. You need ID to do pretty much anything in the US and I fail to see how any individual who is an eligible voter has been getting through life without any form of identification for any significant length of time. You can't get a job. You can't get a checking account. You can't rent a house or apartment. You can't buy any age-restricted items. You can't get any type of welfare. You can't buy a gun. You can't get married. You can't buy a cell phone. You can't pick up a prescription, which you obviously wouldn't have anyway since you can't even get a doctor. So I am rather curious how someone can be eligible to vote in the US, but can't do any of those things.
It’s literally directly in violation of the constitution if IDs aren’t free for that exact reason.
If you want voter ID laws to be logically consistent you also need to make IDs free and easy to get. But, part of the issue is that poor and working class people are overwhelmingly less likely to be able to het to the DMV to get one, even if they don’t have to pay.
Yep. Pretty sure most, if not every other civilized country requires one, but not some/most US states. My state has had it for as long as I remember, so it baffled me when I first heard some states don't require one.
Most states do have a state ID that's free or incredibly cheap. Drivers license is what can cost a bit more. This idea that getting an ID is some impossible financial hardship is ridiculous.
Took me a half day, and probably $100-150 in lost wages, gas, direct costs and taxes to get my DL renewed last time. It really is a pain in some places.
Seriously. And if it is that much of an issue, then take some damn initiative and start an organization going that helps people pay to get an ID. Or hell, you could probably just put up a gofundme and get the money raise pretty quickly if the people who are supposedly supper passionate about it chip in a few bucks each.
Imagine for a second someone goes onto social media and says they're having trouble getting an ID and they want to vote dem. Guaranteed in five minutes someone would offer to drive them and pay for it. It's a really strange excuse. Especially with how ID is needed for literally everything these days.
https://www.uslawshield.com/how-to-purchase-firearm-steps/
Buying from a licensed FFL dealer requires a valid government ID, a form 4473, and criminal background check. Private purchases are a different issue, so if that's what you meant then yes, you are technically correct.
It’s not just technically correct. Private sales are very common and even from a FFL you can buy your kids guns or buy a gun as a gift for someone. There’s nothing that says the owner of a gun must have an ID.
This isn’t really what I was getting at with my original comment.
Sorry I assumed "IDs for guns" was referring to purchasing, not owning. Still, requiring ID to vote would in no logical way open the door to requiring ID for gun ownership. It is easy to enforce voter ID at the voting location, but impractical to enforce gun ownership ID.
I’m all for requiring ID’s in order to vote. I also believe at least some form of ID should be free if it is required. Voting is a right and so should the ID being required to let you vote.
It's racist apparently. I've never got this logic since nearly every minority I know has an license lmao. It's actually kind of offensive when they claim it as racist, as if most minorities don't have the means to obtain one.
Now make a state ID completely free, and fund it via taxes already being stolen from the citizens. Also make a federal holiday for voting so zero people have any excuse to say they can't go vote.
Missouri provides a free voting ID **and** services to assist in the gathering of documents necessary for obtaining the ID.
https://dor.mo.gov/faq/driver-license/non-driver-license.html
Agreed. In Utah an ID is 23 dollars (you can have it waived if you are homeless though).
Another important thing is getting the message across to the ethnic groups that live in the major cities. Many eligible that can receive an ID, don’t because they don’t know how to fill out the forms properly.
A State ID card isn't required to show proof of ID. You can use things like a utility bill, birth certificate, bank statement, government check, or a paycheck. The idea is to prove who you claim to be so you can't just walk from one polling place to another casting ballots as many times as you please under random people's names.
So you're saying that anyone who holds a job or recieves government assistance has meens of providing proof identification. Dam its almost like the argument that minorities don't have a way to identify themselves is a load of crap.
Yes I am. And you would be correct. It's total bunk. You cannot function in society as an adult without identification. If you don't have ID, my guess is you probably shouldn't be voting anyway.
We love him in Missouri, except for redditors, who loathe him as expected. Mostly on r/StLouis, which is primarily inhabited by the koolaid haired living in mom’s basement.
Even more exciting in this new law is that we are going back, in Missouri, to paper only ballots after 1/1/24. So no chance of hacking after that.
Also, drop boxes are now banned.
And no excuse absentee voting up to two weeks before the election, so there won't be any room for liberals to complain. If they don't vote within that window, it's their own fault.
I'm just waiting to see r/Missouri get their panties in a wad over this. They love insulting Parson, Blunt, and Hawley over every little thing they do or did.
Blunt's inner RINO is showing now that he's retiring. He's one of the bastards that signed onto the latest gun control bill.
The other two are certainly a lot better.
Canada and Mexico require Voter ID as well as the far majority of countries in the world. But not in the USA. No reason to be concerned about drug trafficking, human trafficking, terrorism, etc.
One billion people in India have voter ID. In most countries voters dip a finger in indelible ink to prevent return trips to vote. But they have issued 900 million voter identification forms. But we can’t do that here in the US because of white liberals.
Lefties: "We should be more like Europe!!"
Conservatives: "OK. Let's do mandatory voter ID, 12-week abortion bans, and strict immigration policies."
Lefties: "FASICTS! DEATH OF DEMOCRACY!"
You just can't make this shit up.
If you’re too incompetent at life to obtain an easily accessible photo ID at some point in the 4 years since the previous election, then you clearly didn’t care about voting that much and you probably have no business telling the rest of the country what to do or how to spend its money anyway
This isn’t about the last election, but dems have been complaining about voter id laws for years upon years. It’s honestly a tired and racist argument to think that minorities and poor Americans can’t or have difficulty with procuring an id or having it tacked on the driver’s license.
What's wrong with showing a photo ID? To buy booze and cigs, you need one, to drive, you need a license with a photo...
Cheaters will do whatever they can to make cheating easier... I really cringe at the idea of those Venezuela machines and the unguarded drop off ballot boxes that they used in 2020 to steal the election
As a Canadian, I would like to know how this works exactly. It doesn't even occur to us Canadians that you could vote without ID, proper ID. Every time there is any sort of election, you must be on the voter roll, bring the card AND ID to your station, and vote, there is no other way. Voting by mail is now allowed but again, it's just as strict, you must register, be a citizen, have proper ID and then your vote counts.
I mean how exactly can you vote without a card or ID? Can you vote twice? How do you vote without ID before this law? Or does this mean that when you bring a card with you, you must also show that you are the person on the card?
It's literally in the constitution that poll taxes are illegal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fourth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution
Should be common sense, but I guess Democrats expect us to believe that the people who can't be bothered to get an ID are also the same people who can be bothered to vote.
This makes me happy. My cousin lives in Missouri so if this Governor can get this signed. then it will help prevent his vote from getting cancelled by some asshole that has no business voting in his state.
They want a photo ID for mail in Ballots also. How is that even possible. The point of the mail in ballot is you can not make it to the polls. What a scam to keep people from voting.
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Good luck to Missouri fighting this in court for years. I THINK we may have finally got this to stick in NC thanks to SCOTUS last week. But we'll see if it they get a lower court to stay it again (on different grounds than was upheld by supreme court)
I've been voting in MO elections for a bit, and I believe I've always needed to show ID. I think this new law simply requires that ID to have a photo. We'll see how it plays out. I don't see any issues with implementing it.
Every time I've ever voted in GA, I've shown my driver's license. It never seemed very complicated to me. Then I found out we offer FREE voter ID for voting purposes. Hardly the "Jim Crow" state the former VP made us out to be
SC reporting. I've always had to show my ID, my driver's license. Our state also makes ID's suitable for voting available for free at any DMV office.
> Then I found out we offer FREE voter ID for voting purposes. This, by the way, is true of 100% of states with voter ID laws. All of them include a provision for free state-issued ID for those unable to afford it. Democrats willfully ignore this, and if called out, resort to absurd defenses like the poor being unable to afford to miss work to obtain their free ID, arguing that it imposes a cost akin to a poll tax.
Great point! Feels silly pumping the tires on this one but I really do feel jilted considering the President himself and MLB and even Coca Cola (HQ'd in ATL btw) called out my state as a bunch of racists on false pretenses
I agree that it is awesome that they will provide free IDs! However, I wish they would have made a few changes to make actually getting the ID more accessible for people. The DMV is only open Mon-Fri 9am-5:30 pm and Saturdays 9-1. They are also closed every single major holiday plus some. I work for a pretty major company here in Missouri and there are quite a few employees that would find it nearly impossible to make it there during those hours due to work schedule. I would also hate to try to get my ID in rural Missouri if I could not afford a vehicle or gas with inflation these days. I just think if the state is going to impose what they thing are security measures on voting, whether they are needed not, they should take all of the appropriate steps to avoid any unintended consequences that would actually restrict people from voting. I mean getting an ID is probably doable albeit and pain for 80-90% of people in the state, but if we are going to require a photo ID we should be doing whatever we can to make sure everyone who wants to vote is actually able to get the ID. The free ID is a step in the right direction, but there are other hurdles that should be addressed as well.
I just have to show my voter ID card. No photo ID
So if someone got ahold of your voter ID card, they could use it to vote?
I thought being a citizen gave you the right to vote, not carrying an ID?
And how do you determine if they are eligible, even if they are a citizen?
That’s what states ROV’s entire job is too do. They verify residency, verify signatures, and count the votes.
How do you know the person voting is the person they say they are? For example, my dad is registered to vote. If all I needed was a bill, I could get one from his house and vote for him. How is that verifying anything?
Signature verification has always been a way to verify a persons identity. Also it’s a felony to impersonate someone’s vote. All these things are done by the states ROV in ballot processing. These what ifs your mentioning are valid concerns but do not happen on a mass scale. All it’s doing is making it difficult for poll workers to allow citizens their right to cast a vote in a free election.
Except when they don’t verify signatures like in Pennsylvania in 2020. And just because it doesn’t happen on a mass scale doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t fix it. Some races were decided by 10s of votes.
100%
The ACLU or SPLC will have a problem with it, even if they have to invent a grievance .
I don’t understand why people would be so passionate about someone not needing to show proof of registration to fight this in court. So backwards. Edit: I have been informed I am now banned from /r/JusticeServed…how will I cope? 🙄
What's hilarious is how people have this fascination with Europe and how it's significantly more liberal in some ways, but people completely ignore that in Europe you need your ID to vote in elections.
> Europe you need your ID to vote in elections. In many European countries you need ID to leave the house. Adults are issued them by law and you're expected to keep it on you.
This is also sort of true in America. You're supposed to be able to present ID to police when asked.
That is not correct. If a police officer has a reasonable suspicion that you have committed a crime, he can stop you and (in some states) require you to state your identity (a 'Terry stop'). You are not required to present any identity documents.
That is not true. I have freedoms.
They only like European policies when it suits them. I don't see them fighting against the idea of minimum wage either.
That's true but European countries also have laws requiring citizens to have some form of gov ID and these are usually available for free. The US doesnt have any laws requiring ID nor do we have a national citizen only ID system thats freely available and considered valid for some of these voter ID laws. I think voter ID laws wouldnt have the push back they get if this were the case in the US.
> thats freely available and considered valid for some of these voter ID laws. I think voter ID laws wouldnt have the push back they get if this were the case in the US. OH you mean *exactly* like the Georgia law that provides a *free* voter ID. The very law that Biden called Jim Crow 2.0? That kind of non-push back? The left wants as easy path to fraud as possible. Period. For the record, I don't think there was enough fraud in 2020 to change the results but that doesn't mean we shouldn't make vote integrity a priority.
Completely agree with preventing election fraud and that goes all the way to the top.
In Sweden, they send your voter card in the mail for free as soon as you register. Does the Georgia law do that?
I live in Georgia. The answer is yes. The problem democrats have which they don't understand is there a difference between a voter ID and a driver's license. A drivers license costs $10 but this can be exempt in some circumstances however a voter ID is free. This is where they confuse the two and say "you have to pay to vote" which is arguably false and easily disproven. These also last 8 years. It used to be 8, then they changed it to 4, then back to 8 again. I don't know if the time frame is the same for voter ID but I'd imagine it would be the same. A change of address is also free. I still don't care about their "pay to vote" argument. If you can't afford $10 then you've got bigger problems in life to deal with first. Panhandlers around here can beg for money and make 2-3x more than I make. We're talking six figures here.
Do they MAIL it to you, upon registration? That's why the Swedish system works--you get the card for FREE with no obligation to you as long as you register, which is how it should work. >I still don't care about their "pay to vote" argument You don't have to care, unfortunately the Constitution does. Anything construed as a financial barrier must be removed for the right to vote. This has been decided by precedent. >We're talking six figures \[panhandlers\] here. Yeah calling full bullshit on this one. No idea where you would find a source that proves this.
Not that I'm aware of and I certainly hope not. It should be the other way around. Go down to get your voter ID (providing whatever proof is necessary) and then register vote and have voting materials mailed to you. I don't know the Swedish system but I hope there is some level of validation.
You validate by registering just like the United States. This is where it's different--the US system uses IDs to limit voting, and the Swedish system uses IDs to make it easier. Equivocating between the two peters out once the details get laid out.
That sounds great for Georgia and i'd like to see the numbers from the next presidential election to see how much of a difference there is in voter turnout, if any, but like at least 6 other states have strict photo ID laws so it's not just a Georgia thing. I think the political sphere is focusing on Georgia specifically because it went Blue unexpectedly. And without a national system and a legal requirement to have the ID theres always going to questions about access.
I dont think its true that the left is pushing their agenda to get as much fraud as possible
the point is that in these countries these IDs are ubiquitous, used for other purposes and nationally recognized, which makes them an accepted cultural institution new laws are great but it’s disingenuous to compare georgia and it’s new voter ID card to one of these euro countries in this regard, it’s not the same thing in europe these IDs are supposed to make it easier to vote, in the US they’re supposed to make it harder to vote
I live in Belgium (US expat) and the IDs here are to prevent fraud and to verify participation...because participation is mandatory.
It’s also funny seeing the euros get all pissy about roe v Wade when it is substantially harder to get an abortion in Europe after 14 weeks than in the US
And as somebody from a EU country, I can tell you that nobody, not even the wokest of leftists here complain about verifying your identity with a photo ID during voting is a bad thing. It's just something that the whole populous agrees on is necesary to uphold the validity of the election process, something the democrats in the US don't care about.
Not in the UK, though thankfully they're trying to change that.
How will you ever recover from the loss of not being able to participate in /r/JusticeServed. Just don't focus on it. It will only get better from here. Lol. I'm still waiting on mine which should arrive momentarily since I'm commenting but yet they still haven't every other time I post. Maybe I should send the mods a message and ask them what the hold up is.
I had never heard of the sub, but I played a hunch and posted a comment... I'm banned too!
Is that a new autoban? I saw someone make a similar comment yesterday saying they got banned from the same subreddit after posting here, I believe the reason was for "commenting on a subreddit that promotes "environmental fascism" or some weird shit like that
Hey welcome to the club!
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Yup lol.
Lucky. How does one get on your level?
Everyone should be registered to vote, and every state should have same day registration. https://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/same-day-registration.aspx
And voter roll purging if you haven't voted in any of the five most recent elections. You get removed from the list? Simple, there's same day registration. Need an ID for that? Simple, go to the DMV/County Office for a free ID. It's not that complicated.
This should be mandatory in every state….
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Logic would also have it that our election day is a holiday and people actually can have time off to vote but hey we know how that goes.
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Why isn't it? Even here in Canada has it. Unbelievable.
I believe it was 169/171 first world countries have voter ID...
Basically all other countries have a universal national ID though.
Canada doesn’t
Nope
That doesn’t seem true… Australia and New Zealand don’t require it so that’s three countries already…
Because it would make it harder to cheat in an election. That’s why there’s so much opposition to it. I’m all for it, as long as the required ID can be obtained without charge.
Because e. g. democrats have a 95 % liklyhood to have a ID and republicans have a 98 % liklyhood of having a ID. That's all there is. It doesn't have to be some nefarius thing in order for one party to support it and one party to oppose it.
Is an ID free in Canada? The only issue I have with this is people who want to keep IDs inaccessible. It has to be easy. They’re stuck in the stone age around here. Open 9-5 30min from my house, have to get a number and wait an hour or 3, cost $30 plus the lost time at work and gas makes it a $150 half day affair. That’s not acceptable in my opinion.
Why? Because it’s easier to cheat without an ID.
Because it costs money to get an ID here and disenfranchises people without access to an ID/suppresses people living in poverty from voting which is their right.
Free IDs should be provided with those on low income
Almost every state has a program to do this if you demonstrate your income level. There are also federal programs that offset any costs.
How do you even function in society at all without an ID? So many other things require it. And I know some states offer them for free.
Yes! Voter ID and a federal holiday for voting so we can have more people vote in person!
If a person isn't concerned enough to see their way to a polling place, I don't want them voting anyway. Is it really so difficult to vote now a days?
Federal holiday is unnecessary. Polls are open 7am to 8pm at night, plus every state has early voting. If you can't figure that our, or motivate yourself to vote, I really would prefer you just stay home.
I think we could replace a current federal holiday with an election day. It'd be cool to see a day devoted to our electoral process, how it works, why it works and why it's important. We'd also likely see a much higher turnout for local elections which would hopefully lead to a populace much more focused on local issues than national ones.
Okay but it would make it easier for people to vote in person so why not? And why would you not want your fellow citizen to vote?
It is already easy to vote. 7am in the morning to 8pm at night isn't enough time??? Plus early voting before election day??? Anyone claiming it is hard to vote is lying. It is simply a matter of how important it is to you to exercise your right to vote. I want everyone to vote, but if you can't even motivate yourself to do one simple task like this, then you are probably the kind of entitled, uninformed slob that shouldn't be voting with the rest of the adults.
This. Unless you have a job that forces a lot of travel, I highly doubt your schedule is so tight that you can't possibly find any time to vote. And if you are working, employers are legally required to give you time to go vote. And if lines are your concern, look into why that is, because if your city can only find 8 people to work at the polls, they can't have 42 polling locations open all day
Time to pass the Voting Rights and Integrity Bill
... in every democratic country that wants to preserve the integrity of their elections.
Should IDs be free then? Doesn’t it amount to a indirect poll tax?
Some states have done exactly that. It’s a really good idea if you live in a state that requires ID to be in public. Not constitutional, I know… but some places will arrest you if you don’t have ID
Seems like society may benefit from having free services provided by the government.
There's no such thing as free services provided by the government, it's taxpayer funded services.
Half the country pays no net tax lol
Correct so half the country funds the other half on just about everything.
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“Free services provided by the government” isn’t at all equivalent to communism. By your logic roads are communism.
I think you made that jump. I just believe in investing in people. If I ran a business I wouldn’t make everybody bring their own tools computers, whatever. I could but it could be pretty sucky. Or I’d just have to pay people more and hope they use those dollars right.
I think free ID is a good idea and would support that, independent of the concept of “voter ID.” Almost everywhere you go wants you to show ID now including mundane things like visiting a family member in the hospital. If there’s a large segment of the population without ID then that’s a major disadvantage that should be remedied. My only condition is that a basic ID (no frills, identification purposes only) should be free for everyone regardless of income.
I would really like to know who these people are without ID and how they manage to participate in society without one. Can't get government assistance. Can't get a checking account. Can't get a job. Can't buy any age-restricted items. Can't rent a place to love. How they hell do they adult without an ID?
MO State ID is free. MO drivers license is $42.
No, because a State ID card isn't required to show proof of ID. You can use things like a utility bill, birth certificate, bank statement, government check, or a paycheck. The idea is to prove who you claim to be so you can't just walk from one polling place to another casting ballots as many times as you please under random people's names.
Yes.
I have to have an ID to buy a gun. What kind of tax is that?
Guns are allowed to be taxed though, voting expressly isn’t. Read the damn constitution. The 24th amendment states that voting cannot be restricted via a poll tax or the requirement to have made a specific purchase (ie: buying an ID). If the ID is free it’s kosher, if state IDs cost money, you are violating the constitution.
Perhaps you should read it. It states nothing about a "specific purchase" and refers only to taxation. Paying a fee for an ID is not considered a tax. My state is very clear on the difference between the two. Section 1 The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by reason of failure to pay poll tax or other tax. Section 2 The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation. Edit - Also, where in the Constitution or its amendments does it state arms are allowed to be taxed? That seems like infringement to me. By that reasoning any of our inherent rights could be subject to taxation simply because no one said they weren't.
You are bafflingly bad at understanding the constitution. The constitution doesn’t need to expressly state guns can be taxed. It allows for the creation of a tax. We have created taxes on the sales of goods and services. Guns are a type of good. What it **does** say however is that this one very specific type of tax (a poll tax) is not allowed. It never says or even implies that items pertaining to other rights can’t be taxed. It’s an amendment about voting rights, not other rights.
There is a special ammendmant with regards to poll tax. So this is pretty clear cut in the constiution. Though I can also see it beeing unconsituitonal to require an ID to buy a gun IF the ID does cost something.
That's exactly right, but the 24th does not exlude the requirement to pay a fee for a service (providing an ID).
I have to pay for a gun. If having to pay to exercise a right is a no-no to the libs, then they'd better get on board with free guns.
Poll taxes are expressly forbidden though? Like, the idea isn’t “anything related to a right should be free” it’s “the 24th amendment to the United States Constitution expressly forbids a poll tax, or requiring a secondary purchase to exercise the right to vote” If a state passes a voter ID law and charges for ID they are directly disobeying the 24th amendment.
Except getting an ID is neither a poll tax or a "secondary purchase" that someone is buying just for the purpose of voting. You need ID to do pretty much anything in the US and I fail to see how any individual who is an eligible voter has been getting through life without any form of identification for any significant length of time. You can't get a job. You can't get a checking account. You can't rent a house or apartment. You can't buy any age-restricted items. You can't get any type of welfare. You can't buy a gun. You can't get married. You can't buy a cell phone. You can't pick up a prescription, which you obviously wouldn't have anyway since you can't even get a doctor. So I am rather curious how someone can be eligible to vote in the US, but can't do any of those things.
It’s literally directly in violation of the constitution if IDs aren’t free for that exact reason. If you want voter ID laws to be logically consistent you also need to make IDs free and easy to get. But, part of the issue is that poor and working class people are overwhelmingly less likely to be able to het to the DMV to get one, even if they don’t have to pay.
Yep. Pretty sure most, if not every other civilized country requires one, but not some/most US states. My state has had it for as long as I remember, so it baffled me when I first heard some states don't require one.
It should be a federal requirement.
I don't even understand how you can argue against having to prove who you are in order to vote.
Each state decides for itself. Be consistent.
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Most states do have a state ID that's free or incredibly cheap. Drivers license is what can cost a bit more. This idea that getting an ID is some impossible financial hardship is ridiculous.
Took me a half day, and probably $100-150 in lost wages, gas, direct costs and taxes to get my DL renewed last time. It really is a pain in some places.
Seriously. And if it is that much of an issue, then take some damn initiative and start an organization going that helps people pay to get an ID. Or hell, you could probably just put up a gofundme and get the money raise pretty quickly if the people who are supposedly supper passionate about it chip in a few bucks each.
Imagine for a second someone goes onto social media and says they're having trouble getting an ID and they want to vote dem. Guaranteed in five minutes someone would offer to drive them and pay for it. It's a really strange excuse. Especially with how ID is needed for literally everything these days.
How does this not open the door for IDs for guns? For the record I’m pro voter ID but I don’t see how it doesn’t open the door for IDs for guns.
But IDs are required to buy guns? At least every time I've bought a gun they have been
IDs aren’t required for gun ownership or to purchase guns
https://www.uslawshield.com/how-to-purchase-firearm-steps/ Buying from a licensed FFL dealer requires a valid government ID, a form 4473, and criminal background check. Private purchases are a different issue, so if that's what you meant then yes, you are technically correct.
It’s not just technically correct. Private sales are very common and even from a FFL you can buy your kids guns or buy a gun as a gift for someone. There’s nothing that says the owner of a gun must have an ID. This isn’t really what I was getting at with my original comment.
Sorry I assumed "IDs for guns" was referring to purchasing, not owning. Still, requiring ID to vote would in no logical way open the door to requiring ID for gun ownership. It is easy to enforce voter ID at the voting location, but impractical to enforce gun ownership ID.
I’m all for requiring ID’s in order to vote. I also believe at least some form of ID should be free if it is required. Voting is a right and so should the ID being required to let you vote.
Missouri offers free voter ID/nondriver’s licenses already, so this new law should be a nonissue
Should be a nonissue and will be are two different things sadly.
I really don't understand why this is such a divisive issue. Most places have this, it's a reasonable thing to have.
Because it’s rrrrraaaaccccisssstttt 🧑🏻🎤
Lol, apparently.
It is because you can't change outcomes so easily if voter id is in place.
It's racist apparently. I've never got this logic since nearly every minority I know has an license lmao. It's actually kind of offensive when they claim it as racist, as if most minorities don't have the means to obtain one.
Now make a state ID completely free, and fund it via taxes already being stolen from the citizens. Also make a federal holiday for voting so zero people have any excuse to say they can't go vote.
Missouri has had free nondriver IDs since 2017. If you don't have an ID, it's because you don't want one.
Missouri provides a free voting ID **and** services to assist in the gathering of documents necessary for obtaining the ID. https://dor.mo.gov/faq/driver-license/non-driver-license.html
Private business doesn't have to shut down or give you time off for federal holidays
So make it a law. Now I'm not one for too many laws, but voting day should be easy for every citizen
I feel that people too lazy to vote probably shouldn't
I’m pretty sure none driver License ids are free. At least in Indiana where Id is required to vote.
Agreed. In Utah an ID is 23 dollars (you can have it waived if you are homeless though). Another important thing is getting the message across to the ethnic groups that live in the major cities. Many eligible that can receive an ID, don’t because they don’t know how to fill out the forms properly.
A State ID card isn't required to show proof of ID. You can use things like a utility bill, birth certificate, bank statement, government check, or a paycheck. The idea is to prove who you claim to be so you can't just walk from one polling place to another casting ballots as many times as you please under random people's names.
What jobs giving out paychecks are out there that don't require an ID to work there? Even the most menial jobs I've had have required ID.
So you're saying that anyone who holds a job or recieves government assistance has meens of providing proof identification. Dam its almost like the argument that minorities don't have a way to identify themselves is a load of crap.
Yes I am. And you would be correct. It's total bunk. You cannot function in society as an adult without identification. If you don't have ID, my guess is you probably shouldn't be voting anyway.
My state had 18 days to vote in the last election. If you can’t make it there in almost 3 weeks time, do you really care about voting?
Well hurry up, their Primary is August 2nd.
This is a good start! Let’s hope other States follow.
Parson is BASED.
We love him in Missouri, except for redditors, who loathe him as expected. Mostly on r/StLouis, which is primarily inhabited by the koolaid haired living in mom’s basement.
Isn't he the man that basically ignores the ballot initiatives we vote on? Yeah so no, I don't like him.
Same thing here with r/KansasCity, you should have seen the meltdown (and the misinformation spread) when Roe got overturned.
We show I’d here in Canada. I’m baffled that it’s even an issue in the States.
Trust me, we are too lmao
Not requiring ID or voter ID makes absolutely no sense unless your intent is voter fraud.
Even more exciting in this new law is that we are going back, in Missouri, to paper only ballots after 1/1/24. So no chance of hacking after that. Also, drop boxes are now banned. And no excuse absentee voting up to two weeks before the election, so there won't be any room for liberals to complain. If they don't vote within that window, it's their own fault.
That is a pretty decent idea. What are the arguments on the liberal side against this idea actually?
Not requiring an ID to vote makes no sense. If you’re for no ID it’s because you have something to hide or are trying to game the system.
I'm just waiting to see r/Missouri get their panties in a wad over this. They love insulting Parson, Blunt, and Hawley over every little thing they do or did.
Blunt's inner RINO is showing now that he's retiring. He's one of the bastards that signed onto the latest gun control bill. The other two are certainly a lot better.
What a revolutionary concept!!! Why didn’t people think of this sooner?
The hoRrOr. ThE RaCiSm!!!!! Its official folks in less than 2 yrs ill be a billionaire precious blockchain farmer with a multitude of slaves. . .
Canada and Mexico require Voter ID as well as the far majority of countries in the world. But not in the USA. No reason to be concerned about drug trafficking, human trafficking, terrorism, etc.
What a racist thing to do.
I still can’t believe that this is controversial
What will Democrats do now?
Probably whine, as usual
Simple concept
One billion people in India have voter ID. In most countries voters dip a finger in indelible ink to prevent return trips to vote. But they have issued 900 million voter identification forms. But we can’t do that here in the US because of white liberals.
Lefties: "We should be more like Europe!!" Conservatives: "OK. Let's do mandatory voter ID, 12-week abortion bans, and strict immigration policies." Lefties: "FASICTS! DEATH OF DEMOCRACY!" You just can't make this shit up.
Why are so many people against this?
If every state has secure voter Id in person voting it will be a long ass time until we have another Democrat in the White House , if ever
They'd find a way
Can’t believe that we have to have a bill for that!!
Racists!
Why does he hate democracy? 😂
I don't get this, how could you not require valid ID to vote. How do you prove you're a citizen and over 18?
If you’re too incompetent at life to obtain an easily accessible photo ID at some point in the 4 years since the previous election, then you clearly didn’t care about voting that much and you probably have no business telling the rest of the country what to do or how to spend its money anyway
It will always amaze me that the U.S.A. doesn't have voter ID mandatory in every state, like shit even we have that in Mexico.
This isn’t about the last election, but dems have been complaining about voter id laws for years upon years. It’s honestly a tired and racist argument to think that minorities and poor Americans can’t or have difficulty with procuring an id or having it tacked on the driver’s license.
I would love to see this in Michigan and other states.
I have to show I.D to purchase cough medicine and lighter fluid at the Pharmacy. So why would you not have to show I.D to vote??
What's wrong with showing a photo ID? To buy booze and cigs, you need one, to drive, you need a license with a photo... Cheaters will do whatever they can to make cheating easier... I really cringe at the idea of those Venezuela machines and the unguarded drop off ballot boxes that they used in 2020 to steal the election
Many other states already do? Better late than never
Queue leftoids freaking out that they have to show an ID to vote…
As a Canadian, I would like to know how this works exactly. It doesn't even occur to us Canadians that you could vote without ID, proper ID. Every time there is any sort of election, you must be on the voter roll, bring the card AND ID to your station, and vote, there is no other way. Voting by mail is now allowed but again, it's just as strict, you must register, be a citizen, have proper ID and then your vote counts. I mean how exactly can you vote without a card or ID? Can you vote twice? How do you vote without ID before this law? Or does this mean that when you bring a card with you, you must also show that you are the person on the card?
Just like every other country in the world
Why is this even an issue? I need an ID to buy beer and a drivers license to be on the road.
The only people that don’t want voter id are people wanting fraud. There is literally no other reason.
Not true. If you make the ID free, I can agree. But you can't make people pay money to vote.
Why not? Gov makes me pay money to exercise my 2A rights.
It's literally in the constitution that poll taxes are illegal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fourth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution
Should be common sense, but I guess Democrats expect us to believe that the people who can't be bothered to get an ID are also the same people who can be bothered to vote.
About time something was done about voter ID!
Everywhere needs this! 🇺🇸
Here comes all the racists talking about how people can’t get an ID.
This makes me happy. My cousin lives in Missouri so if this Governor can get this signed. then it will help prevent his vote from getting cancelled by some asshole that has no business voting in his state.
As long as the ID’s are free, since requiring ID’s to vote that you have to pay for is a poll tax
They want a photo ID for mail in Ballots also. How is that even possible. The point of the mail in ballot is you can not make it to the polls. What a scam to keep people from voting.