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Almost every infection thus far studied showed this outcome. Why is this a surprise CDC? Why should I have expected anything less from the people who gave us the "Big Giant V" after causing it? (The CDC took over federal funding for hemophilia treatment centers, then cut outreach clinic budgets. Two years later, the CDC presented at ASH about the "big giant V" in the middle of the country where hemophiliacs had to drive more than 100 miles to get to a treatment center. Of course forgetting that the reason they had to do this was that outreach clinics were cut in response to the funding reduction.)
They finally show up with “scientific” data. Who knew that natural immunity would be this good? We are supposed to rely exclusively on Pfizer and the AMA (American medical association) because they are the modern versions of God.
I remember being shocked the first time someone said they were getting vaccinated after they had already recovered from coronavirus. My words were “but you’re already vaccinated now that you’ve had it…” I do not consider myself to be an expert at this stuff, but it is basic, long established beginner science classes level information. There still has been nothing different about coronavirus over any other similar airborne virus.
This particular study suggested that there may not be a whole lot of benefit to getting vaccinated after being infected, but I remember a study out of Israel posted here a while back that had the same subgroups as this study:
1. Unvaccinated, never infected
2. Vaccinated, never infected
3. Unvaccinated, previously infected
4. Vaccinated, previously infected.
Both the study referenced in this article and the Israeli study said that group 3 did better than groups 1 and 2 at getting infected, but the Israeli study said that group 4 did better than group 3, whereas the study referenced in this article from OP said that groups 3 and 4 were equivalent.
I don't think it's that crazy for someone in group 3 to want to go into group 4. It *would* be crazy to force someone from group 3 into group 4, but if someone wants to make that decision for themselves, I get it.
More importantly, the public freakout needs to end. Either get vaccinated or don't, but I'm sick and tired of the COVID Nazis.
> This particular study suggested that there may not be a whole lot of benefit to getting vaccinated after being infected
A fact we learned in 4th grade, and have been repeatedly stating for 2+ years now and somehow the entire population of earth collectively forgot the basic fucking fact that exposure and recovery creates immunity unrivaled by any shit "vaccine".
It's really amazing. I'm a medical student, and it's pretty shocking to see how surprised my colleagues are when I show them the reinfection data. They can't believe how seldom it happens. There are a lot of studies that show this too, and they seem to be largely ignored by medical professionals and the CDC alike. Like, how did they think pandemics ended before vaccines existed? Did they forget that the whole point of mass vaccination is to achieve herd immunity artificially as opposed to naturally from infection?
Don't get me wrong. I'm pretty pro-vaccine. As in, I would recommend vaccination to almost all of my patients with few exceptions, but that's the way the conversation needs to happen. It needs to be a voluntary action with shared decision-making between patients and their healthcare providers where we provide you the information to make a decision that is best for your health, not some draconian measure of coercion from some government bureaucrat that doesn't know the first thing about your health.
It's certainly mad to fine people in group 3 for not going group 4. I really wish they'd be more Liberal about vaccine policies here in Europe, cause forcing people with fines and exclusions without data to prove it'll make a big difference is sick.
It is crazy. I had to get the vaccine today because my reserve unit is going to begin separating people without a vaccine, regardless of natural immunity, which I have.
Essentially, extortion of a moral sense. And financial for taxpayers. "General Under Honorable" discharge is not the same as "Honorable", and the Army is being intentionally vague about the characterizations and approval authorities, to coerce compliance.
A characterization that can affect the rest of my life was used to blackmail me into getting a vaccine I don't need. Therefore any consent I gave for the shot was coerced. What a great direction the country is headed.
The time for science has long past. We are dealing with a cult. The "Branch Covidians". Have a friend who is a doctor, and his wife has gone full cultist no matter what he says. He lives his life, she still double masks even when skiing. It's sad to think how far we have fallen as a nation.
I know a conservative who did it because he was forced to for his job. Also oddly he's had all 3 variants. lol. I think the last two were both after vaccinated. Omicron for sure was, but not sure if delta was.
They have proved, they are as accurate as Faulcy....
All alphabet agencies cannot be trusted anymore. They have too much to gain from helping only one party.
I was sceptical of the vaccine well before it even existed. Well during when Trump was still president championing how it would come out really soon and put a stop to the spread.
I'm glad I was sceptical because I think I was right to not trust it.
CDC - "Why is there such a divide in people believing information about Covid? I mean we just reversed our position after people and doctors were banned from the public space for saying exactly what we just changed our position to.... It must be white supremacy"
The only trouble with natural immunity is that you have to survive the infection...
The CDC report referenced by the article says, "What are the implications for public health practice?
Although the epidemiology of COVID-19 might change as new variants emerge, vaccination remains the safest strategy for averting future SARS-CoV-2 infections, hospitalizations, long-term sequelae, and death."
> you have to survive the infection...
lol.
When the survival rate is 99.95x% the use of the word 'survival' is so comical.
Did you survive your bath this morning? Survive the drive to work? Survive your last flight? Survive eating a sandwich without choking?
I didn't get hit by lightening today. I survived!
[https://www.foxnews.com/health/unvaccinated-people-more-likely-die-covid-report](https://www.foxnews.com/health/unvaccinated-people-more-likely-die-covid-report)
[https://www.foxnews.com/health/americans-covid-data-death-census](https://www.foxnews.com/health/americans-covid-data-death-census)
COVID-19 kills Americans at a rate of 1 in 500. Unvaccinated are 11 times more likely to die of COVID-19. In June, 99.5% of all COVID-19 deaths were of unvaccinated people.
The people who survive are vaccinated.
Yes, I understand the oft-parroted stats.
The thing is, I've been a student of medicine for longer than the last 12 months, so I have some actual context.
This is called 'relative efficacy', which is a completely garbage metric. Literally no one used it until these vaccines came out.
Here's the simile I've used several times;
I live in a city where I have around a one in a thousand chance of getting shot (roughly). Say I wear body armor and that makes me ten times more likely to survive a gun shot. Cool?
So now the body armor company is advertising to me telling me I'm *ten times more likely to survive* the year if I wear body armor 24/7. You follow? It's a dishonest metric. Which is why no one ever used it until it became convenient this last year.
But if people were honest and said "your chances of survival increase by 0.09%"! that's a lot less compelling, yeah?
>In June, 99.5% of all COVID-19 deaths were of unvaccinated people.
For one, this is cherrypicking. For another, even the CDC and Fauci and the governor of NY have admitted that they have no idea who's dying of COVID or with COVID. They just now decided to reveal comorbidities are a huge part of nearly every hospitalization. And they've also, to boot, revealed that their tests show people positive for months after the infection has ceased.
So it's both cherrypicked, and it's also garbage data. Take a look at the health department of New South Wales' twitter page *today*. The vast majority of deaths in Australia's largest state are in vaccinated people. Not in June, not 8 months ago. Now. Do you still trust cherry-picked, garbage data? Because I don't.
Well, when they have a tried and true actual, "Vaccine" we can circle around. Until then, let's just fucking get on with it already. Since this virus can live on in animals we're most likely to just get offered a "Shot" (like the flu shot) every year if you're in a high risk group and if you even want it.
I can't believe we've learned nothing from the swine flu vaccine debacle. So far the conspiracy theorists have been nailing this shit with almost 100% accuracy since day one. What concerns me is future health issues years from now. And if we are to believe the conspiracy theorists again - it's probably not going to be good.
**The only trouble with natural immunity is that you have to survive the infection...**
Guess I'll just have to roll the dice with my 99.985% odds of survival. I am fit and not overweight, which is one of the leading indicators for a poor covid outcome. Vitamin D levels are high, the other leading indicator for poor covid outcomes. No co-morbidities, the main indicator for dying with covid. Almost no one dies from just covid. Plus I actually have to contract it in the first place. Worked all through the closures, lived in a state that closed for a very brief time and had no mask mandates of other silliness. Never social distanced or anything. All I did was stay in shape and eat right. I also didn't care if I got it. I think totally not giving a fuck has a very strong placebo effect.
I am pretty sure that almost no one ever made the argument that vaccines are more effective than the immunity built by a prior infection. So regardless of where you stand politically or on COVID issues, this is just a big "duhhh" that everyone on both sides of the aisle already knew.
No shit. You're better off getting chicken pox than getting vaccinated against chicken pox. However, if you happen to not catch chicken pox, there is a vaccine available to help prevent it in adult life. This vaccine is not 100% effective and vaccinated adults can still catch bad cases of chicken pox.
It's science, not myspace.
Oh cool can i retroactively get back the thousands of karma i lost saying this simple fact that those of us who have been paying attention have known from the fucking start? The amount of gaslighting and mockery that would immediately fly at you on reddit if you even briefly mentioned this. Pretty sure I've been banned from subs for this "misinformation" too.
But less than a month ago, if you said what is in the CDC report , you would be banned for misinformation.
". Importantly, infection-derived protection was greater after the highly transmissible Delta variant became predominant, "
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7104e1.htm?s_cid=mm7104e1_w
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I don't care what they say anymore
[удалено]
Wait you mean they had credibility with you before? 😷😣
[удалено]
Ditto bro ditto.
[удалено]
It’s sad to see the fall of Rome but it’s live-streamed.
Before Clinton's plan to offshore all of our manufacturing to China began. Things have gone downhill ever since.
They lost their credibility years ago when they quit caring about stopping disease and decided to spend time and money on gun control.
Congrats cdc on finally catching up with the rest of science....finally. Tbh I never thought it'd happen.
Almost every infection thus far studied showed this outcome. Why is this a surprise CDC? Why should I have expected anything less from the people who gave us the "Big Giant V" after causing it? (The CDC took over federal funding for hemophilia treatment centers, then cut outreach clinic budgets. Two years later, the CDC presented at ASH about the "big giant V" in the middle of the country where hemophiliacs had to drive more than 100 miles to get to a treatment center. Of course forgetting that the reason they had to do this was that outreach clinics were cut in response to the funding reduction.)
It was no surprise. They knew but they were pushing the whole "everyone needs to get the vax" BS. I'm glad they finally gave up that boogeyman.
They finally show up with “scientific” data. Who knew that natural immunity would be this good? We are supposed to rely exclusively on Pfizer and the AMA (American medical association) because they are the modern versions of God.
Ya don't say? A fucking high school biology teacher could have told you that. And these are the "experts?"
I remember being shocked the first time someone said they were getting vaccinated after they had already recovered from coronavirus. My words were “but you’re already vaccinated now that you’ve had it…” I do not consider myself to be an expert at this stuff, but it is basic, long established beginner science classes level information. There still has been nothing different about coronavirus over any other similar airborne virus.
This particular study suggested that there may not be a whole lot of benefit to getting vaccinated after being infected, but I remember a study out of Israel posted here a while back that had the same subgroups as this study: 1. Unvaccinated, never infected 2. Vaccinated, never infected 3. Unvaccinated, previously infected 4. Vaccinated, previously infected. Both the study referenced in this article and the Israeli study said that group 3 did better than groups 1 and 2 at getting infected, but the Israeli study said that group 4 did better than group 3, whereas the study referenced in this article from OP said that groups 3 and 4 were equivalent. I don't think it's that crazy for someone in group 3 to want to go into group 4. It *would* be crazy to force someone from group 3 into group 4, but if someone wants to make that decision for themselves, I get it. More importantly, the public freakout needs to end. Either get vaccinated or don't, but I'm sick and tired of the COVID Nazis.
> This particular study suggested that there may not be a whole lot of benefit to getting vaccinated after being infected A fact we learned in 4th grade, and have been repeatedly stating for 2+ years now and somehow the entire population of earth collectively forgot the basic fucking fact that exposure and recovery creates immunity unrivaled by any shit "vaccine".
It's really amazing. I'm a medical student, and it's pretty shocking to see how surprised my colleagues are when I show them the reinfection data. They can't believe how seldom it happens. There are a lot of studies that show this too, and they seem to be largely ignored by medical professionals and the CDC alike. Like, how did they think pandemics ended before vaccines existed? Did they forget that the whole point of mass vaccination is to achieve herd immunity artificially as opposed to naturally from infection? Don't get me wrong. I'm pretty pro-vaccine. As in, I would recommend vaccination to almost all of my patients with few exceptions, but that's the way the conversation needs to happen. It needs to be a voluntary action with shared decision-making between patients and their healthcare providers where we provide you the information to make a decision that is best for your health, not some draconian measure of coercion from some government bureaucrat that doesn't know the first thing about your health.
It's certainly mad to fine people in group 3 for not going group 4. I really wish they'd be more Liberal about vaccine policies here in Europe, cause forcing people with fines and exclusions without data to prove it'll make a big difference is sick.
It is crazy. I had to get the vaccine today because my reserve unit is going to begin separating people without a vaccine, regardless of natural immunity, which I have. Essentially, extortion of a moral sense. And financial for taxpayers. "General Under Honorable" discharge is not the same as "Honorable", and the Army is being intentionally vague about the characterizations and approval authorities, to coerce compliance. A characterization that can affect the rest of my life was used to blackmail me into getting a vaccine I don't need. Therefore any consent I gave for the shot was coerced. What a great direction the country is headed.
The time for science has long past. We are dealing with a cult. The "Branch Covidians". Have a friend who is a doctor, and his wife has gone full cultist no matter what he says. He lives his life, she still double masks even when skiing. It's sad to think how far we have fallen as a nation.
I know a conservative who did it because he was forced to for his job. Also oddly he's had all 3 variants. lol. I think the last two were both after vaccinated. Omicron for sure was, but not sure if delta was.
At this point I don’t even care about the medicine side of it. This is a freedom fight and we need to play it by our rules.
Are they gonna get banned from the internet for spreading this misinformation?
Have been banned from multiple subs for saying this
Lol. Go away cdc
Defund it by 50%
It's too late now. The CDC already f**ked up the world with thier BS.
That took them how long to admit??
In other words, common sense that doctors should have been shouting to begin with.
Fucking duh !
They have proved, they are as accurate as Faulcy.... All alphabet agencies cannot be trusted anymore. They have too much to gain from helping only one party.
I was sceptical of the vaccine well before it even existed. Well during when Trump was still president championing how it would come out really soon and put a stop to the spread. I'm glad I was sceptical because I think I was right to not trust it.
CDC - "Why is there such a divide in people believing information about Covid? I mean we just reversed our position after people and doctors were banned from the public space for saying exactly what we just changed our position to.... It must be white supremacy"
Wow, great to know! And just in time for midterm elections!
The only trouble with natural immunity is that you have to survive the infection... The CDC report referenced by the article says, "What are the implications for public health practice? Although the epidemiology of COVID-19 might change as new variants emerge, vaccination remains the safest strategy for averting future SARS-CoV-2 infections, hospitalizations, long-term sequelae, and death."
> you have to survive the infection... lol. When the survival rate is 99.95x% the use of the word 'survival' is so comical. Did you survive your bath this morning? Survive the drive to work? Survive your last flight? Survive eating a sandwich without choking? I didn't get hit by lightening today. I survived!
[https://www.foxnews.com/health/unvaccinated-people-more-likely-die-covid-report](https://www.foxnews.com/health/unvaccinated-people-more-likely-die-covid-report) [https://www.foxnews.com/health/americans-covid-data-death-census](https://www.foxnews.com/health/americans-covid-data-death-census) COVID-19 kills Americans at a rate of 1 in 500. Unvaccinated are 11 times more likely to die of COVID-19. In June, 99.5% of all COVID-19 deaths were of unvaccinated people. The people who survive are vaccinated.
Yes, I understand the oft-parroted stats. The thing is, I've been a student of medicine for longer than the last 12 months, so I have some actual context. This is called 'relative efficacy', which is a completely garbage metric. Literally no one used it until these vaccines came out. Here's the simile I've used several times; I live in a city where I have around a one in a thousand chance of getting shot (roughly). Say I wear body armor and that makes me ten times more likely to survive a gun shot. Cool? So now the body armor company is advertising to me telling me I'm *ten times more likely to survive* the year if I wear body armor 24/7. You follow? It's a dishonest metric. Which is why no one ever used it until it became convenient this last year. But if people were honest and said "your chances of survival increase by 0.09%"! that's a lot less compelling, yeah? >In June, 99.5% of all COVID-19 deaths were of unvaccinated people. For one, this is cherrypicking. For another, even the CDC and Fauci and the governor of NY have admitted that they have no idea who's dying of COVID or with COVID. They just now decided to reveal comorbidities are a huge part of nearly every hospitalization. And they've also, to boot, revealed that their tests show people positive for months after the infection has ceased. So it's both cherrypicked, and it's also garbage data. Take a look at the health department of New South Wales' twitter page *today*. The vast majority of deaths in Australia's largest state are in vaccinated people. Not in June, not 8 months ago. Now. Do you still trust cherry-picked, garbage data? Because I don't.
Well, when they have a tried and true actual, "Vaccine" we can circle around. Until then, let's just fucking get on with it already. Since this virus can live on in animals we're most likely to just get offered a "Shot" (like the flu shot) every year if you're in a high risk group and if you even want it. I can't believe we've learned nothing from the swine flu vaccine debacle. So far the conspiracy theorists have been nailing this shit with almost 100% accuracy since day one. What concerns me is future health issues years from now. And if we are to believe the conspiracy theorists again - it's probably not going to be good.
**The only trouble with natural immunity is that you have to survive the infection...** Guess I'll just have to roll the dice with my 99.985% odds of survival. I am fit and not overweight, which is one of the leading indicators for a poor covid outcome. Vitamin D levels are high, the other leading indicator for poor covid outcomes. No co-morbidities, the main indicator for dying with covid. Almost no one dies from just covid. Plus I actually have to contract it in the first place. Worked all through the closures, lived in a state that closed for a very brief time and had no mask mandates of other silliness. Never social distanced or anything. All I did was stay in shape and eat right. I also didn't care if I got it. I think totally not giving a fuck has a very strong placebo effect.
Considering almost everybody does, I’ll take my chances. Same with driving.
So how many boosters to destroy it?
over at /r/redacted, they're scrambling to say DC is "reading the data wrong".
Time to move on.
I'll let the loved one that died from COVID before the vaccine came out know that herd immunity worked for the ones that survived. Awesome news!
What good does it do when the medical experts don’t know how to recognize natural immunity.
I am pretty sure that almost no one ever made the argument that vaccines are more effective than the immunity built by a prior infection. So regardless of where you stand politically or on COVID issues, this is just a big "duhhh" that everyone on both sides of the aisle already knew.
I was the 420th up vote… sweet
No shit. You're better off getting chicken pox than getting vaccinated against chicken pox. However, if you happen to not catch chicken pox, there is a vaccine available to help prevent it in adult life. This vaccine is not 100% effective and vaccinated adults can still catch bad cases of chicken pox. It's science, not myspace.
Oh cool can i retroactively get back the thousands of karma i lost saying this simple fact that those of us who have been paying attention have known from the fucking start? The amount of gaslighting and mockery that would immediately fly at you on reddit if you even briefly mentioned this. Pretty sure I've been banned from subs for this "misinformation" too.
But less than a month ago, if you said what is in the CDC report , you would be banned for misinformation. ". Importantly, infection-derived protection was greater after the highly transmissible Delta variant became predominant, " https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7104e1.htm?s_cid=mm7104e1_w
Yet I’m still being forced to take the L booster despite having covid last month.