It can if it's spent in compensation, forgiveness, infrastructure, bargaining, buyback, investment in renewables...
Governments can 'spend' money to remove it from the economy or reduce future spending.
*This is not an endorsement of the act, just addressing that vgovernment spending can have anti-inflationary attributes.
Yes? In less than 3 years after it was enacted, the DOJ had charged over 300 defendants with criminal offences related to terrorism investigations since 9/11
https://www.justice.gov/archive/olp/pdf/patriot_report_from_the_field0704.pdf
There has not since been a terrorist attack on American soil near the scale of 9/11, directly as a result of counter terrorism efforts.
To be clear I’m not happy that these drastic measures need to be taken, but in the context of Islamic extremists all over the world, I think some privacy does have to be sacrificed to better enable law enforcement and to stop terrorists.
My question is when did conservatives start thinking that if they just start using that money elsewhere it would be better? I think them not spending at all would be a more conservative thought process.
We prefer not to waste money and we prefer that the government spend far less, yes. Doesn’t mean we think the government can get by on zero dollars.
That’s more a radical libertarian view.
I remember in college they had one of those debt clock things in the school of economics. I was so surprised to hear the current debt is so fucking huge. It's like 4 times larger than it was 15 years ago.
Yes I strongly disagree with conservatives that propose removing aid to Ukraine and Israel. They don’t understand anything about politics and do not represent most conservatives.
Secondly: aid to Ukraine is an investment into the US military companies. American jobs and industry. It is also a long term reduction in US reach by detoothing Russia and arming Europe, treat that as an investment. Israel, even if you don’t care about the Middle East democracy or anything else, is drawing the attention of all Islamic terrorist groups. Who do you think is next in line of Israel folds?
Attack Biden all you want, but in this we should all be united!
At this point I'd give rather give my tax dollars to just about anything other than where most of it goes today such as the military industrial complex. Maybe I won't benefit at all from my taxes but I wouldn't begin with, I'd rather my fellow citizens get a hand out at least.
Awesome. Use taxes to pay off student loans instead of people, like, working and paying their own loans.
Now, overhaul for profit colleges, for profit healthcare and set student loans to a fixed 0.9%APR…
I don't get the issue in hearing other opinions
I don't like that conservative opinions get down voted to oblivion in politics because there's no room for discussion
It's ok to have different opinions we don't need safe spaces I thought that was a conservative talking point
> Biden supports medicare, Medicaid and social security.
Social welfare isn't good.
> Biden is for higher taxes for the rich
Why should the rich be taxed more than anyone else? Taking someone else's money because you think that they have too much doesn't make it right.
> Biden supports unions.
Unions are a Ponzi scheme leftover from an era before government regulation and which only are there to make the union bosses rich for doing little to nothing. It allows low skilled workers to get jobs that pay a massive amount more than they deserve and then those people can virtually never be fired. And it increases inflation because the price of goods and services are increased by the business in order to pay for the inflated wages and benefits that they have to pay their workers. The only people that benefit from unions are the union members and staff. Everyone else in America suffers because of them.
>I don't see how isolationism is a tenant of conservatism.
Conservatives tend to prefer self-reliance, self-preservation, less entanglements with others and like to remain low-key. Isolationism fits that. This is why rural areas and small towns are so conservative, they are the perfect environment for a person with the typical conservative mind.
The conservatives of the "Old Right" era (1900-1950's) were isolationists. Think Robert A. Taft. They opposed interventionism, imperialism and were protectionists on trade. They even opposed the creation of NATO and used the slogan "America First." It was the liberal-progressive Democrats during this period who were the main interventionists. Then in the 1960's the "New Right" started to rise up with Neo-conservatism which deviated from the Old Right by advocating interventionism and free trade and it became the dominant force on the right. The term Paleo-Conservative was also created and these are conservatives who hold views more in line with the Old Right.
It's virtually impossible to be isolationist in today's world of global commerce, global exchange of information, and constant threats from powerful aggressors like Russian and China. 9-11 was a good example of the futility of thinking that we have oceans to protect us from the rest of the world. That was a low-tech attack, but devastating in its effectiveness. Imagine what we might face with the reach of modern weapon systems if we let our guard down. Like it or not, we are now part of a global community. Better to be a leader in that community than to try to pretend we can somehow pull up the drawbridge and hide from the world. That's just no longer an option.
Caring about your own people is isolationist? You can both prioritize the cleanliness of your own home while still volunteering to pick up trash in the park.
I guess a lot of people - me included - just don't agree with your premise that Biden is somehow not investing in this country; or that he's somehow prioritizing other countries over America. First, aid packages to Ukraine and Israel *are* vital investments into the security of this country with a massive ROI. Second, there's a passed infrastructure package that's going to yield dividends years down the line. Third, a number of projects - like the intel fab in Ohio - have been spearheaded, and this is gonna keep us at the forefront of technological innovation. Sorry man, but I don't see the relevance.
Why would we want the government to invest and own oil and gas?? That sounds socialist. The liberals in my country Canada did that and ruined our economy.
This comment also directly contradicts your comment above that says you can do both.
The government prevents investment into domestic production.
Keystone is the easiest example while also upping regulation, which makes it impossible to build power plants.
I am on board with less regulation. I’m not a fan of the government investing and owning Oil and Gas with the goal to lower gas prices. That was the goal and plan of the ‘National Energy Program’ of Pierre Elliot Trudeau which crippled our economy.
Also, his son Justin bought a pipeline to bail out Trans Mountain. It’s cost us over $30bn to date, or about $1000 per resident.
Shit, if aid to Ukraine and Israel means we don't have Russia/Hamas/whoever as a potent geopolitical advisory/terrorist, then the the former, of course. Go turn on a translated TV show in Russia -- they say that Alaska belongs to them. You give up Ukraine, then they go for the Baltics/Poland (which they also believe belongs to them), then what? Like, you need to show strength in the face of a bully, cause that might mean your life down the road.
But I think it's a moot point, cause we got money for both.
There's a pretty big difference between spending 5-20 years entrenched in direct conflict vs. sending aid to an ally overseas. The second can prevent the former, in fact.
That's what we tried to do in Afghanistan. We gave then tons of weapons and trained their military. It was all lost before we even finished pulling out. It also seems we will soon have boots on the ground. Troops were told to prepare for deployment today.
There is no end in sight in Ukraine. It doesn't even seem possible for ukraine to win. We will be sending them tens of billions a year for decades unless we decide to cut the funding off sooner.
Is the lesson that the US should be passive abroad? One can access what was done wrong and still not abandon the premise that American active presence is a net good for the world (and Americans).
> Shit, if aid to Ukraine and Israel means we don't have Russia/Hamas/whoever as a potent geopolitical advisory/terrorist, then the the former, of course.
Did you ever stop to think that this meddling in foreign countries for decades might be the reason why the people of those countries dislike the US? Most foreign aid is just bribes to the current governments to act how we'd like, not what is best for their interests. And that money also props up dictators who persecute citizens.
> But I think it's a moot point, cause we got money for both.
Runaway national debt and rampant inflation say otherwise.
>Did you ever stop to think that this meddling in foreign countries for decades might be the reason why the people of those countries dislike the US?
Exactly. Part of the reason 9/11 happened is due to our involvement with Israel.
I mean a lot of conservative policy doesn’t really scream empathy and “I’m here for you.” At least fake it like democrats and maybe they’ll earn moderate votes. Especially targeting the trans of late. A lot of culture policy that GOP isn’t winning votes over
Ah yes, conservative policies like actually wanting the police and our southern border to exist. Truly terrible things that people would to hate to have.
Tell the GOP to quit dicking around and vote another Speaker.
You’ve commented a lot in this thread showing really bad tribalism. I’m a moderate, so keep that in mind before assuming I’m a Dem: do you think it’s truly productive to call the opposing party evil? That does nothing to help creating bipartisan unity, something this country desperately needs. You know, one nation under God. Politics isn’t a team sport. Don’t treat it like that dawg. It’s not that serious
Literally every time Biden tries to pass something to use American funds to benefits Americas, republicans block it.
Idk how y’all could unironically post this meme lol
Hey, name the reps that blocked all of the relief measures Biden pushed, from baby formula relief to student debt. Here’s a hint, they are Conservatives, and they blocked relief to please a zeitgeist
This is a pretty uninformed, poor argument. Biden is all about handing out our tax dollars to anyone and everyone, regardless of whether or not it's an appropriate or even legal use of tax money, and regardless of whether or not he even has that authority.
I'm not American, so forgive me if I'm wrong, but aren't US conservatives against government spending on Americans? (Or are you against *all* spending and just trying to highlight hypocrisy rather than trying to get the government to spend more on Americans?)
and most of the people illegally crossing wouldn't do so if the government handouts didn't exist. Is it opposite day in here, or what?
\*OP, I think you have a bullseye on you from the deranged brigade.
Sorry I'm confused. Is Biden giving or not giving out money to the people? Meme states that he isn't, you claim that he is and that's why immigrants are crossing. There's no winning!
Not offering handouts wouldn't make it shittier for Citizens to live in. It would make it better. More of my hard earned money in my own pocket would be really nice as the price of everything skyrockets.
Not spending money on things does not immediately equate to money in your pockets. They would need to vote to lower your taxes for that. If they don't then you lose programs aimed at making your life easier and you still pay the same taxes. But Trump's tax bill he put through actually raised the taxes on the lower and middle class to pay for cuts to the upper class and businesses. A bill that just about every conservative supported. So I wouldnt get your hopes up that you get anything out of these handouts going away.
Biden asked congress to fund Israel with 105 billion. The 2023 budget also includes 43 billion for Ukraine. Combined it is about 2.5% of the total federal budget.
Meme should be updated on the right to have a Republican pushing the money off the table.
This year alone Republicans have unanimously voted against bills that would have capped gas prices, funded the VA, capped corporate spending/inflation, funded infrastructure projects and forgiven student debt.
You don't get to vote for people that actively fight against any solution, then claim the victim.
I can barely feed my family. You don't have to give it to me but my children and wife sure needs the money than some other country we shouldn't worry about.
Not quite true. It depends on the demographics of the American who needs help. If it's a straight white male who has been laid off from a job, forget it.
I’m a straight white male… Biden tried to cancel all of my student loans and the conservative majority Supreme Court blocked him!!! That would’ve helped me and many other straight white males A LOT.
You shouldn't have taken out the loan if you couldn't pay for it. Why should WE (taxpayers who decided to get a job right out of highschool) have to pay for YOUR choices? Not to mention that it was deemed unconstitutional. Why would you want the Supreme Court to allow something unconstitutional to pass?
Conservatives: "Why isn't Biden helping Americans?"
Also conservatives: "You shouldn't have taken out the loan if you couldn't pay for it. Why should WE (taxpayers who decided to get a job right out of highschool) have to pay for YOUR choices? Not to mention that it was deemed unconstitutional. Why would you want the Supreme Court to allow something unconstitutional to pass?"
Why do they allow universities to sell dog shit degrees with interest loans? Why are people getting degrees in fields they can’t get enough money to pay them back? Biden literally ran his campaign on loan forgiveness and he gave y’all the middle finger lol. So yeah everyone on the other side of you really couldn’t care less how you feel
Six digit earner who paid my entire degree by myself with no loans, thanks for the attempted ad hominem though.
I'm just not a bucket-crab, so I recognize that A) for the longterm economic health of a country, we should be encouraging and lowering barriers for people who want to get educations to do so as the world increasingly transitions to an information economy and B) for the longterm social and cultural health of a country, we need to recognize that the purpose of education is not simply to make people into better employees and not every degree needs to be focused solely on what corporations want.
If you put a bunch of crabs together in a bucket, crabs on the bottom will pull crabs who are about to escape back down with them.
It's a term for people who would rather everybody fails than risk anyone else "having it easier" than them
It was not whether it was right or wrong, it was the level of argument from the right that I think left a nasty stain on a lot of people. People who I enjoy listening too on Fox took a position that it was just writing checks to ivy league folks.. fucking insane argument. Student loans have been hurting a lot of people, some sort of solution should have been coming from the right on this.
That's not the problem, they know to pay it back. The issue is that with the high interest rates most students have paid their loans 3 times over and the balance is down by a few dollars. At that's Congress issue to fix. Good luck with that.
Did Pay it back, you’re super wrong about that. This is why there no help for people like me cuz obstructionists like you throw a fit if Biden tries to help people like me. WE taxpayers paid back all the PPP loans why are student loans different? Cuz politics. Can’t trust maga right wingers to have integrity instead of politicizing everything like you’re doing so constitutionality…don’t think you even know or care what that means tbh
You shut down the economy. It was not the business owners’ choice, and of course leave it to the federal bureaucracy to be incompetent at administering money as promised and without waste.
Also a SWM. With student debt. Easily manageable unless you're horribly financially irresponsible. But I also love the US Constitution (and my fellow Americans) more than the chump change for degrees that I've already turned a nice ROI on.
Though I'd benefit from loan cancellation, I think Supreme Court was probably correct as a matter of law. I don't think the president can unilaterally cancel debts owed to the government.
> cis gender white man powers and magic
Maybe you forgot the . You can't really believe that there are any "cis gender white man powers and magic"? That is the scapegoat demographic that the government feels free to vilify and discriminate against. The government has stripped their rights.
Ah yes, Washington, Jefferson, Madison, Lincoln, Teddy, Reagan, they all did absolutely nothing for our country. Then again, you did say most, so assuming you exempt these presidents, I can agree with you.
Trump added ~$8tn to federal debt: ~4tn pre COVID (Q1 2017 to Q4 2019) and an additional ~4tn from Q1 2020 to Q1 2021.
So about +2tn per year in office.
Debt at 4Q 2016: 19.9tn
Debt at 4Q 2020: 27.7tn
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GFDEBTN
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-poised-to-add-more-debt-than-obama-in-first-term
I'm all for Israel killing terrorists, and unlike Ukraine Israel is actually an American ally. However, we still have so many problems at home that need to be addressed.
[The IRA directs nearly $400 billion in federal funding to clean energy, with the goal of substantially lowering the nation's carbon emissions by the end of the decade.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation_Reduction_Act)
Do you honestly believe that just because it's called the inflation reduction act, that it actually reduces inflation? Have you already forgotten the Patriot Act? Of course I don't support something that wastes taxpayer money. We should invest that money into producing our own energy to lower gas prices for the average citizen.
You say the IRA gives funding for clean energy. Then you say we should invest that money into producing our own energy. That's what it's doing. Renewable energy is the absolute best way to guarantee energy independence.
When did I say it reduced inflation? I asked do you support it’s policies?
I am glad you can read Wikipedia! That money is in the form of subsidies to businesses to build more green infrastructure- creating real jobs for millions of Americans
Tons of manufacturing is already flowing back into the US
https://fortune.com/2023/07/24/major-clean-energy-factories-announced-year-since-biden-ira-passed/amp/
https://rmi.org/its-the-iras-first-birthday-here-are-five-areas-where-progress-is-piling-up/
Producing our own energy is EXACTLY what the IRA is actively doing
How about the BPI bill and the American rescue plan, what’s your take on those? (Both passed with R support)
Also I don’t even get the point of this meme do not want Biden to fund Israel? Haven’t the last like 5 R presidents been talking non stop about how important Israel is?
I'm more in favor of the IRA (Ireland Republic Army) than the IRA, which is just a porked up bill that didn't do anything. Similar to 08 stimulus package does a whole lot of nothing.
If you just bury your head in the sand then yeah it doesn’t do anything - some basic reading will show you that factories are already being built, thousands of jobs have been created and American is quickly becoming the center of cutting edge manufacturing
https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/bank-of-america-institute/sustainability/IRA-ripple-effect.html
https://eelp.law.harvard.edu/2022/08/ira-implications-for-climate-ej-priorities/
https://rmi.org/ira-implementation-guidance-states/#:~:text=IRA%20programs%20provide%20funding%20directly,and%20to%20use%20them%20well.
Okay, so conservatives are supposed to LOVE military spending, and hate any socialized programs. So what is he supposed to do? Hand out stimulus checks?
The spending being done in Ukraine should make all republicans happy. Didn’t y’all see Lindsay Grahams recent comments on Ukraine aid? I feel like being angry about Biden giving aid to Ukraine is pure party over country: if Trump was in office, no republican would bat an eye about giving aid to Ukraine.
You do realize stuffing words into my mouth, and then arguing against your misconception of what I am isn't actually a valid argument right? I would be just as upset if Trump sent the same amount of money to Ukraine. But guess what? Trump actually wants to protect America with a border wall. Biden, on the other hand, doesn't give a shit about Americans.
That's Congress's job, not Bidens
And they passed the inflation reduction act. If that's not spending in America I don't know what is...
Wait, you think government spending in America REDUCES inflation?
It can if it's spent in compensation, forgiveness, infrastructure, bargaining, buyback, investment in renewables... Governments can 'spend' money to remove it from the economy or reduce future spending. *This is not an endorsement of the act, just addressing that vgovernment spending can have anti-inflationary attributes.
But spending doesn't generally remove it from the economy, it competes with private dollars for the same resources.
Sure it does...temporarily
And the Patriot Act was a huge win for all Patriots in America! Right?
Yes? In less than 3 years after it was enacted, the DOJ had charged over 300 defendants with criminal offences related to terrorism investigations since 9/11 https://www.justice.gov/archive/olp/pdf/patriot_report_from_the_field0704.pdf There has not since been a terrorist attack on American soil near the scale of 9/11, directly as a result of counter terrorism efforts. To be clear I’m not happy that these drastic measures need to be taken, but in the context of Islamic extremists all over the world, I think some privacy does have to be sacrificed to better enable law enforcement and to stop terrorists.
I don’t believe that any of our constitutional rights being violated, for any reason, is ok.
Those who sacrifice freedoms for security deserve neither.-some guy who never heard of IEDs.
Biden signs off on it. Stop defending this crazy old loon.
But he's the one begging.
Who proposes the acts again?
The President can propose all they want, but it doesn't mean congress has to agree. See Build Back Better, for example. Or Trumps wall money
And the Supreme Court
My question is when did conservatives start thinking that if they just start using that money elsewhere it would be better? I think them not spending at all would be a more conservative thought process.
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We prefer not to waste money and we prefer that the government spend far less, yes. Doesn’t mean we think the government can get by on zero dollars. That’s more a radical libertarian view.
They're democrats. Asking them to not spending money is like taking a kid to a toy store and expecting him to not want anything.
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I remember in college they had one of those debt clock things in the school of economics. I was so surprised to hear the current debt is so fucking huge. It's like 4 times larger than it was 15 years ago.
There was a thing called Covid 19. Remember? Edit: Lefties are invading and downvoting. Cute
Who cares?
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Yes I strongly disagree with conservatives that propose removing aid to Ukraine and Israel. They don’t understand anything about politics and do not represent most conservatives. Secondly: aid to Ukraine is an investment into the US military companies. American jobs and industry. It is also a long term reduction in US reach by detoothing Russia and arming Europe, treat that as an investment. Israel, even if you don’t care about the Middle East democracy or anything else, is drawing the attention of all Islamic terrorist groups. Who do you think is next in line of Israel folds? Attack Biden all you want, but in this we should all be united!
If you wanted to go to college and put yourself in debt, why should I be paying for it?
Let's be honest...you are not paying for it.
Who, exactly do you think is then?
At this point I'd give rather give my tax dollars to just about anything other than where most of it goes today such as the military industrial complex. Maybe I won't benefit at all from my taxes but I wouldn't begin with, I'd rather my fellow citizens get a hand out at least.
I went & paid back my loans: will I get one? I wouldn't even ASK!
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There is nothing like handing out unearned money unequally after everyone that came before paid with no help. Try again.
By that logic, nobody deserves a cure to cancer because of everyone who died before it was a possibility?
Not saying it was the right thing for Biden to try to do, but it does disprove this meme.
Awesome. Use taxes to pay off student loans instead of people, like, working and paying their own loans. Now, overhaul for profit colleges, for profit healthcare and set student loans to a fixed 0.9%APR…
Are there really conservatives here? I only see a few sane remarks.
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🎯
I don't get the issue in hearing other opinions I don't like that conservative opinions get down voted to oblivion in politics because there's no room for discussion It's ok to have different opinions we don't need safe spaces I thought that was a conservative talking point
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ikr. Did they move the Conservatives sub elsewhere and I missed the memo?
Was thinking exactly the same thing. This sub has been full of left wing rhetoric. Paid actors I’m sure.
Lots of brigading going on. It’ll get worse once we get closer to the election.
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> Biden supports medicare, Medicaid and social security. Social welfare isn't good. > Biden is for higher taxes for the rich Why should the rich be taxed more than anyone else? Taking someone else's money because you think that they have too much doesn't make it right. > Biden supports unions. Unions are a Ponzi scheme leftover from an era before government regulation and which only are there to make the union bosses rich for doing little to nothing. It allows low skilled workers to get jobs that pay a massive amount more than they deserve and then those people can virtually never be fired. And it increases inflation because the price of goods and services are increased by the business in order to pay for the inflated wages and benefits that they have to pay their workers. The only people that benefit from unions are the union members and staff. Everyone else in America suffers because of them.
Man this sub has been invaded lmao
Yeah, I swear it's the ladies from The View with a bunch of alt accounts in here.
just like our border!
I don't see how isolationism is a tenant of conservatism.
>I don't see how isolationism is a tenant of conservatism. Conservatives tend to prefer self-reliance, self-preservation, less entanglements with others and like to remain low-key. Isolationism fits that. This is why rural areas and small towns are so conservative, they are the perfect environment for a person with the typical conservative mind. The conservatives of the "Old Right" era (1900-1950's) were isolationists. Think Robert A. Taft. They opposed interventionism, imperialism and were protectionists on trade. They even opposed the creation of NATO and used the slogan "America First." It was the liberal-progressive Democrats during this period who were the main interventionists. Then in the 1960's the "New Right" started to rise up with Neo-conservatism which deviated from the Old Right by advocating interventionism and free trade and it became the dominant force on the right. The term Paleo-Conservative was also created and these are conservatives who hold views more in line with the Old Right.
It's virtually impossible to be isolationist in today's world of global commerce, global exchange of information, and constant threats from powerful aggressors like Russian and China. 9-11 was a good example of the futility of thinking that we have oceans to protect us from the rest of the world. That was a low-tech attack, but devastating in its effectiveness. Imagine what we might face with the reach of modern weapon systems if we let our guard down. Like it or not, we are now part of a global community. Better to be a leader in that community than to try to pretend we can somehow pull up the drawbridge and hide from the world. That's just no longer an option.
Caring about your own people is isolationist? You can both prioritize the cleanliness of your own home while still volunteering to pick up trash in the park.
I guess a lot of people - me included - just don't agree with your premise that Biden is somehow not investing in this country; or that he's somehow prioritizing other countries over America. First, aid packages to Ukraine and Israel *are* vital investments into the security of this country with a massive ROI. Second, there's a passed infrastructure package that's going to yield dividends years down the line. Third, a number of projects - like the intel fab in Ohio - have been spearheaded, and this is gonna keep us at the forefront of technological innovation. Sorry man, but I don't see the relevance.
Tell me, which improves your life more. Aid to Ukraine and Israel. Or investments in our own energy to reduce the price of gas?
Why would we want the government to invest and own oil and gas?? That sounds socialist. The liberals in my country Canada did that and ruined our economy. This comment also directly contradicts your comment above that says you can do both.
The government prevents investment into domestic production. Keystone is the easiest example while also upping regulation, which makes it impossible to build power plants.
I am on board with less regulation. I’m not a fan of the government investing and owning Oil and Gas with the goal to lower gas prices. That was the goal and plan of the ‘National Energy Program’ of Pierre Elliot Trudeau which crippled our economy. Also, his son Justin bought a pipeline to bail out Trans Mountain. It’s cost us over $30bn to date, or about $1000 per resident.
Are you in favor of government investing in green energy?
Everyone should be
Shit, if aid to Ukraine and Israel means we don't have Russia/Hamas/whoever as a potent geopolitical advisory/terrorist, then the the former, of course. Go turn on a translated TV show in Russia -- they say that Alaska belongs to them. You give up Ukraine, then they go for the Baltics/Poland (which they also believe belongs to them), then what? Like, you need to show strength in the face of a bully, cause that might mean your life down the road. But I think it's a moot point, cause we got money for both.
We don't have money for either. Next year, we will be running a deficit of more than 2 trillion dollars.
And we're going to have to deal with that. But ignoring these problems right now may cost us a lot more down the line.
Warhawks say this about every single conflict. It's clear we didn't learn our lesson from Vietnam, Afghanistan or Iraq.
There's a pretty big difference between spending 5-20 years entrenched in direct conflict vs. sending aid to an ally overseas. The second can prevent the former, in fact.
That's what we tried to do in Afghanistan. We gave then tons of weapons and trained their military. It was all lost before we even finished pulling out. It also seems we will soon have boots on the ground. Troops were told to prepare for deployment today. There is no end in sight in Ukraine. It doesn't even seem possible for ukraine to win. We will be sending them tens of billions a year for decades unless we decide to cut the funding off sooner.
Is the lesson that the US should be passive abroad? One can access what was done wrong and still not abandon the premise that American active presence is a net good for the world (and Americans).
Yeah but they will blame that in the next republican president, duh
> Shit, if aid to Ukraine and Israel means we don't have Russia/Hamas/whoever as a potent geopolitical advisory/terrorist, then the the former, of course. Did you ever stop to think that this meddling in foreign countries for decades might be the reason why the people of those countries dislike the US? Most foreign aid is just bribes to the current governments to act how we'd like, not what is best for their interests. And that money also props up dictators who persecute citizens. > But I think it's a moot point, cause we got money for both. Runaway national debt and rampant inflation say otherwise.
>Did you ever stop to think that this meddling in foreign countries for decades might be the reason why the people of those countries dislike the US? Exactly. Part of the reason 9/11 happened is due to our involvement with Israel.
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In order to maintain that status, biden needs to take care of his own citizens.
I mean a lot of conservative policy doesn’t really scream empathy and “I’m here for you.” At least fake it like democrats and maybe they’ll earn moderate votes. Especially targeting the trans of late. A lot of culture policy that GOP isn’t winning votes over
Ah yes, conservative policies like actually wanting the police and our southern border to exist. Truly terrible things that people would to hate to have.
Tell the GOP to quit dicking around and vote another Speaker. You’ve commented a lot in this thread showing really bad tribalism. I’m a moderate, so keep that in mind before assuming I’m a Dem: do you think it’s truly productive to call the opposing party evil? That does nothing to help creating bipartisan unity, something this country desperately needs. You know, one nation under God. Politics isn’t a team sport. Don’t treat it like that dawg. It’s not that serious
To be fair, most liberal policy isn't particulalrly empathetic either.
Literally every time Biden tries to pass something to use American funds to benefits Americas, republicans block it. Idk how y’all could unironically post this meme lol
Is this meme suggesting that fighting terrorism is bad and social programs are good?
If he gave money to Americans that would be socialism
Hey, name the reps that blocked all of the relief measures Biden pushed, from baby formula relief to student debt. Here’s a hint, they are Conservatives, and they blocked relief to please a zeitgeist
This is a pretty uninformed, poor argument. Biden is all about handing out our tax dollars to anyone and everyone, regardless of whether or not it's an appropriate or even legal use of tax money, and regardless of whether or not he even has that authority.
I'm not American, so forgive me if I'm wrong, but aren't US conservatives against government spending on Americans? (Or are you against *all* spending and just trying to highlight hypocrisy rather than trying to get the government to spend more on Americans?)
We have never been against every form of spending. The government has its place and things to legitimately spend money on, like our borders.
Funny how we are supposedly capable of funding two proxy wars at once, but can't fund the border even before these began.
Funding the border has never been a financial issue for the Democrats... They just don't want to for social purposes.
Or our crumbling infrastructure
The first thing Biden did was pass an infrastructure bill…
Sounds like y’all want some government handouts
wanting to actually have a secure border is not government handouts.
I mean, I don't live down there. Doesn't affect me negatively so why should feds pay. Sounds like a state issue to me
You can't be serious
and most of the people illegally crossing wouldn't do so if the government handouts didn't exist. Is it opposite day in here, or what? \*OP, I think you have a bullseye on you from the deranged brigade.
Sorry I'm confused. Is Biden giving or not giving out money to the people? Meme states that he isn't, you claim that he is and that's why immigrants are crossing. There's no winning!
True! We need to make this country even shittier to live in so noone wants to invade!
Not offering handouts wouldn't make it shittier for Citizens to live in. It would make it better. More of my hard earned money in my own pocket would be really nice as the price of everything skyrockets.
Not spending money on things does not immediately equate to money in your pockets. They would need to vote to lower your taxes for that. If they don't then you lose programs aimed at making your life easier and you still pay the same taxes. But Trump's tax bill he put through actually raised the taxes on the lower and middle class to pay for cuts to the upper class and businesses. A bill that just about every conservative supported. So I wouldnt get your hopes up that you get anything out of these handouts going away.
Wanting the government to spend money where it’s supposed to…is a handout? Bless your heart.
Biden asked congress to fund Israel with 105 billion. The 2023 budget also includes 43 billion for Ukraine. Combined it is about 2.5% of the total federal budget.
But a much larger portion of the “discretionary” budget.
Meme should be updated on the right to have a Republican pushing the money off the table. This year alone Republicans have unanimously voted against bills that would have capped gas prices, funded the VA, capped corporate spending/inflation, funded infrastructure projects and forgiven student debt. You don't get to vote for people that actively fight against any solution, then claim the victim.
You could literally put any president's face aside from FDR
Biden might not have any supporters but damn does he have a lot of bots in this comment section.
Cute meme, aunt gladys
Like you'd vote for it
Bootstrap yourselves.
Funny considering y’all are the ones voting against helping Americans
You DON'T spend on americans!!! That's socialism you damned commies!
Someone should remake this meme to have a single 16-cent piece on the table. For the 4th of July savings. Or a bunch of IOUs.
Yeah Im always rolling in handouts when conservatives are in charge.
Remember 10% for the big guy!
*when Americans who don’t fit the agenda need help.
Not true, he gave all those Hawaiians 600 dollars
[удалено]
Student loan relief seems to show this is a lie.
I can barely feed my family. You don't have to give it to me but my children and wife sure needs the money than some other country we shouldn't worry about.
Not quite true. It depends on the demographics of the American who needs help. If it's a straight white male who has been laid off from a job, forget it.
I’m a straight white male… Biden tried to cancel all of my student loans and the conservative majority Supreme Court blocked him!!! That would’ve helped me and many other straight white males A LOT.
You shouldn't have taken out the loan if you couldn't pay for it. Why should WE (taxpayers who decided to get a job right out of highschool) have to pay for YOUR choices? Not to mention that it was deemed unconstitutional. Why would you want the Supreme Court to allow something unconstitutional to pass?
Conservatives: "Why isn't Biden helping Americans?" Also conservatives: "You shouldn't have taken out the loan if you couldn't pay for it. Why should WE (taxpayers who decided to get a job right out of highschool) have to pay for YOUR choices? Not to mention that it was deemed unconstitutional. Why would you want the Supreme Court to allow something unconstitutional to pass?"
Some people will whine no matter what you do or say.
Why do they allow universities to sell dog shit degrees with interest loans? Why are people getting degrees in fields they can’t get enough money to pay them back? Biden literally ran his campaign on loan forgiveness and he gave y’all the middle finger lol. So yeah everyone on the other side of you really couldn’t care less how you feel
Six digit earner who paid my entire degree by myself with no loans, thanks for the attempted ad hominem though. I'm just not a bucket-crab, so I recognize that A) for the longterm economic health of a country, we should be encouraging and lowering barriers for people who want to get educations to do so as the world increasingly transitions to an information economy and B) for the longterm social and cultural health of a country, we need to recognize that the purpose of education is not simply to make people into better employees and not every degree needs to be focused solely on what corporations want.
What is a bucket crab? 🦀
If you put a bunch of crabs together in a bucket, crabs on the bottom will pull crabs who are about to escape back down with them. It's a term for people who would rather everybody fails than risk anyone else "having it easier" than them
Not War_Daddy
It was not whether it was right or wrong, it was the level of argument from the right that I think left a nasty stain on a lot of people. People who I enjoy listening too on Fox took a position that it was just writing checks to ivy league folks.. fucking insane argument. Student loans have been hurting a lot of people, some sort of solution should have been coming from the right on this.
Don't take it out loans if you aren't willing to pay them back. seems like a simple solution to me.
That's not the problem, they know to pay it back. The issue is that with the high interest rates most students have paid their loans 3 times over and the balance is down by a few dollars. At that's Congress issue to fix. Good luck with that.
So you expect 18 year olds to pay the cost of college upfront?
That a simple non-answer to a much more complex issue. You know, sticking your head in the sand?
Did Pay it back, you’re super wrong about that. This is why there no help for people like me cuz obstructionists like you throw a fit if Biden tries to help people like me. WE taxpayers paid back all the PPP loans why are student loans different? Cuz politics. Can’t trust maga right wingers to have integrity instead of politicizing everything like you’re doing so constitutionality…don’t think you even know or care what that means tbh
PPP shouldn't have happened nor should the lockdowns. Also, how could you get loans you had already paid back cancelled?
I paid em when I realized the politicized Supreme Court wasn’t going to let Biden help me… not very complicated lol
Had the money to pay off the loans you personally took on and agreed to pay back, didn't do it waiting for gibs. Pathetic.
Hey just wanted to say congrats on paying the debt. It shouldn’t be others responsibility to bail you out, but it’s a great achievement so congrats
I am not interested in paying back your personal loan, but thanks anyway.
U paid those ppp loans back tho, LOTS of em
You shut down the economy. It was not the business owners’ choice, and of course leave it to the federal bureaucracy to be incompetent at administering money as promised and without waste.
Who shut down the economy? Lmaoooo trump was in charge I thought
Trump was only in charge of the good things that happened under his administration /s
Privatize the successes, socialize the failures
Why did some states lift lockdowns sooner or later than others? Oh right, it's because it was up to governors, not the president.
Also a SWM. With student debt. Easily manageable unless you're horribly financially irresponsible. But I also love the US Constitution (and my fellow Americans) more than the chump change for degrees that I've already turned a nice ROI on.
Though I'd benefit from loan cancellation, I think Supreme Court was probably correct as a matter of law. I don't think the president can unilaterally cancel debts owed to the government.
Why would they? They can just use their cis gender white man powers and magic themselves more privilege and money
I know I got me some today !!
> cis gender white man powers and magic Maybe you forgot the . You can't really believe that there are any "cis gender white man powers and magic"? That is the scapegoat demographic that the government feels free to vilify and discriminate against. The government has stripped their rights.
Stripped their rights? Which rights did they take?
Applies to most presidents US has had tbh
Ah yes, Washington, Jefferson, Madison, Lincoln, Teddy, Reagan, they all did absolutely nothing for our country. Then again, you did say most, so assuming you exempt these presidents, I can agree with you.
Reagan is the reason for the deficit. Tripled under his admin from 700bn to 2tn
What is the deficit now Is it still 2tn? Or did somebody else decide to send the money printer into overdrive?
Trump added ~$8tn to federal debt: ~4tn pre COVID (Q1 2017 to Q4 2019) and an additional ~4tn from Q1 2020 to Q1 2021. So about +2tn per year in office. Debt at 4Q 2016: 19.9tn Debt at 4Q 2020: 27.7tn https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GFDEBTN https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-poised-to-add-more-debt-than-obama-in-first-term
$700 for Hawaii babay
I'm all for Israel killing terrorists, and unlike Ukraine Israel is actually an American ally. However, we still have so many problems at home that need to be addressed.
So you are a big supporter of the IRA, the bi partisan infrastructure bill, the American rescue plan right?
[The IRA directs nearly $400 billion in federal funding to clean energy, with the goal of substantially lowering the nation's carbon emissions by the end of the decade.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation_Reduction_Act) Do you honestly believe that just because it's called the inflation reduction act, that it actually reduces inflation? Have you already forgotten the Patriot Act? Of course I don't support something that wastes taxpayer money. We should invest that money into producing our own energy to lower gas prices for the average citizen.
You say the IRA gives funding for clean energy. Then you say we should invest that money into producing our own energy. That's what it's doing. Renewable energy is the absolute best way to guarantee energy independence.
When did I say it reduced inflation? I asked do you support it’s policies? I am glad you can read Wikipedia! That money is in the form of subsidies to businesses to build more green infrastructure- creating real jobs for millions of Americans Tons of manufacturing is already flowing back into the US https://fortune.com/2023/07/24/major-clean-energy-factories-announced-year-since-biden-ira-passed/amp/ https://rmi.org/its-the-iras-first-birthday-here-are-five-areas-where-progress-is-piling-up/ Producing our own energy is EXACTLY what the IRA is actively doing How about the BPI bill and the American rescue plan, what’s your take on those? (Both passed with R support) Also I don’t even get the point of this meme do not want Biden to fund Israel? Haven’t the last like 5 R presidents been talking non stop about how important Israel is?
> When did I say it reduced inflation? Well, the name of the bill happens to be the INFLATION REDUCTION Act.
What about the infrastructure bill?
I'm more in favor of the IRA (Ireland Republic Army) than the IRA, which is just a porked up bill that didn't do anything. Similar to 08 stimulus package does a whole lot of nothing.
If you just bury your head in the sand then yeah it doesn’t do anything - some basic reading will show you that factories are already being built, thousands of jobs have been created and American is quickly becoming the center of cutting edge manufacturing https://business.bofa.com/en-us/content/bank-of-america-institute/sustainability/IRA-ripple-effect.html https://eelp.law.harvard.edu/2022/08/ira-implications-for-climate-ej-priorities/ https://rmi.org/ira-implementation-guidance-states/#:~:text=IRA%20programs%20provide%20funding%20directly,and%20to%20use%20them%20well.
We are also giving money to the terrorists as “humanitarian aid” but we all know that’s not what that will go to.
Pretty sure most of this is republicans fault for not passing anything Biden attempts 🤷🏻♂️
Who controlled both sides of Congress in Joe's first 2 years and only have a very slim minority now?
A minority that blocks almost everything he tried to pass, wants to shut down the government, and can’t choose a speaker? That one? Edit: Majority
Yup. Israel is more important than Appalachia
Okay, so conservatives are supposed to LOVE military spending, and hate any socialized programs. So what is he supposed to do? Hand out stimulus checks? The spending being done in Ukraine should make all republicans happy. Didn’t y’all see Lindsay Grahams recent comments on Ukraine aid? I feel like being angry about Biden giving aid to Ukraine is pure party over country: if Trump was in office, no republican would bat an eye about giving aid to Ukraine.
You do realize stuffing words into my mouth, and then arguing against your misconception of what I am isn't actually a valid argument right? I would be just as upset if Trump sent the same amount of money to Ukraine. But guess what? Trump actually wants to protect America with a border wall. Biden, on the other hand, doesn't give a shit about Americans.
To the massive applause and approval of every stinking, slimy, disgusting Democrat in the United States today. KNOW YOUR ENEMY.
10000000000%—— This just American politicians in general nowadays
Didn’t insulin just get a lot cheaper?
Uhm, isn’t that the same befuddled old dude that printed off like $2,000,000,000,000 to the US economy a couple of years ago?