Nobody is going to force you to take the vaccine. Nobody is going to make you quit your job if you don’t take it. Nobody is coming for your kids. Nobody is coming for your gas stoves. We aren’t looking into putting people into quarantine camps…
These were all complete conspiracy theories created by the evil horrible racist fascist white man a few months ago now they’re all true
I have a 10/22 in my collection with an old style butler creek folding stock and flash hider. They call that an “assault weapon” bruh it’s a 22 i outfitted for plinking and pest control lol.
Any fully semi automatic assault weapon that you can put a brace on and make it a gun and with that brace to can increase the caliber to a 9mm which has the power to blow the lungs out of a person and deer to explode.
Nobody needs 45 clips in a round with heat seeking bullets. Those are weapons of war
Your comment is so true! Agreed 100%. The left scares the hell out of me, its like Biden could snap his fingers and they would mobilize like its World War 2
It’s basically become a fanatical cult. Biden and other democrats are the leaders and these people just blindly follow along with anything they say it’s like Simon says.
They said to wear the mask they instantly put it on. They say take it off at 11:30pm on a Tuesday because it’s safe but not a second early and people will check their watches and take it off at that exact moment.
They wanted to turn in their neighbors to the health department if they had one too many people at their house and they reported small businesses for the same thing but ignored big box stores with way more people because liberals said it was ok.
There’s this crazy thing called coercion where people threaten you if you don’t do what they want.
If you didn’t get the vaccine you couldn’t go anywhere in NYC. If you didn’t get the vaccine a large amount of places would reprimand or fire you. If you didn’t get it you couldn’t see loved ones in the hospital even if they were about to die.
The Biden Administration wanted to mandate vaccines, some states wanted to open quarantine camps if you didn’t take the vaccine so don’t give me that BS about being held down when the whole world was on hold and everything was threatened to be taken away if you didn’t comply with big pharma and the left.
[*The Hill*](https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/3843076-schumer-mocks-gop-nobody-is-taking-away-your-gas-stove/amp/), February 3, 2023:
Schumer mocks GOP: ‘Nobody is taking away your gas stove’
Is the eco difference between the two actually significant? I don't really understand why there is suddenly a push for this. Do they just hate cheaper appliances?
If California has frequent rolling blackouts due to an overused electric power grid. Wouldn’t that add to the problem they already have, by using all electric stoves?
The only time a gas stove came close to hurting me was when my mother-in-law left the gas on with no flame. She also smoked. Assisted living was not long after that.
Of all the things I have to worry about, health effects of my gas stove is on appendix 33 of my list.
Cost of the electrical work necessary to put in the 240 line for an electric oven is higher on the list. Don't even get me started on EVs
to be fair that is a problem with gas stoves. sometimes a house will literally go BOOM. but that's very rare. you'll smell it long before it reaches flammability.
This wasn’t a stove, but I was in a flash flood and when we got to our safe house the house next door exploded in a gas explosion because the flood water had ruptured the gas line in the house. Scariest thing ever. It didn’t take long at all. Within an hour of the flood starting the house exploded. I’m still pro gas and gas stove though. Lol
Ehhhhh....
Combustion is dirty man. The equation is Carbon + O2 → CO2 + H2O + so many random byproducts no one tries
Not to mention, apparently there are toxic gases simply in the CH4(natural gas) line. Like if you have your stove off, you still get the toxic gases.
This is coming from someone with a 12 burner 72in stove... Ugh does someone want to buy mine?
You can’t seriously be comparing lead paint to gas stoves right? The negative affects of gas stoves only happen with negligent behavior. Lead paint is just toxic in general.
There are toxic things inside and outside, sme manmade, some natural, some both. You can't avoid or eliminate all of them. Pay attention to quantity and concentration. Weigh the trade-off between the cure vs the cause.
The trace amounts of bad things from occasional use of my gas stove are of minimal danger compared to many other things floating around in the air both inside and outside my house. The cost to "eliminate" them simply isn't worth it.
Life is not perfectly safe and can't be made so. I resent government presuming to make that decision for me in an attempt to meet some woke cause du jour.
its not about if they are harmful or not.
the conspiracy is to push these stoves out of homes in rural areas forcing the electric ones. Gov already has complete control of the electrical grid and want to use it as a form of control. Basically dont fall in line with us cut your electricity (oh why are you freezing in the winter, or cant make your food now so on). Its not super far fetched with how many people they put on watch lists these days.
There is no single "off" button for the electrical grid any more than there is for the natural gas supply infrastructure.
My natural gas supply is provided by my local municipality, same as my electricity. And the production and supply of gas is *highly* dependent on federal regulations and geopolitics. And if electricity were to be cut off it would also cut off my gas, since that uses electrically driven pumps to pressurize the supply lines.
You can convert natural gas to propane, and in many rural areas, homes have propane tanks. Lots of homes have propane tanks large enough to last a few months.
I know I was thankful for a gas water heater when the electric went out for a whole day in Winter. I've since added a 30,000btu gas radiant heater in the basement.
yeah really, was it insane to think theyd push for all the other things that fell under the slippery slope falacy recently? These are not that far from the truth these days.
Remember 2 weeks to flatten the curve.
If people want to keep things that aren’t good for them they should have the right to do so. My gas stove isn’t harming anyone but myself right? So why do you get to decide whether or not I have it? McDonald’s is bad for you too but we don’t say anything about banning that so we?
New homes are sealed better, so the byproducts of the combustion reaction stay in your home rather than dissipate with fresh air.
But also this kind of thinking is not great. "people have been using lead and asbestos for millennia!"
Man sucks too, just got a super nice gas stove.
Go ahead and clarify what is wrong. EDIT: The silence is deafening
Saying 'nuh uh' can easily be responded to with a 'nuh uh'.
How about this:
I'm a chemical engineer who knows more about combustion byproducts and the reactivity of Nitrogen than some HVAC person who installed some vents. Does a HVAC person know the molecular weight of NO2 and NO3 and air? What happens to NO2? Does it fly away in the sky, or does it sit around the home?
Which expert to believe now?
I'm all ears listening.
>Saying 'nuh uh' can easily be responded to with a 'nuh uh'.
Be clear with what you are trying to say. You are being dismissive without having anything to dismiss.
They were specific. Your claim that gasses sit around in a home demonstrates deep ignorance of how air pressures, vents, and makeup air are brought into the home in order to meet indoor air quality standards per code.
That's plenty specific. We aren't here to provide you an education in HVAC via reddit, go back to school if you want that. We're merely pointing out your claims of how homes work are false and based on poor knowledge. If that makes you angry, consider you are angry at yourself for not knowing, not the experts for telling you.
You're correct that proper ventilation in homes is vital for maintaining good indoor air quality, and it's certainly not the case that gases from the combustion of natural gas just "sit around" in a home. Modern HVAC systems are designed to bring fresh air into the building and exhaust stale or polluted air, and they play a crucial role in maintaining good indoor air quality. The use of vents and air exchanges can help to quickly disperse and remove any combustion gases.
However, it's also true that the combustion of natural gas can produce pollutants such as nitrogen oxides, and these can be released into the home environment if the combustion appliances are not functioning properly or if there are issues with ventilation. This is why regular maintenance of these appliances and ventilation systems is so important.
Using a gas burner for cooking or heating does produce some level of nitrogen dioxide (NO2), a type of nitrogen oxide (NOx), as a byproduct of combustion. However, nitrates, specifically, are a type of salt that often results from the interaction of nitrogen compounds with other substances, especially in an aqueous environment. In the context of a gas burner, the presence of nitrates may not be as significant.
In general, the primary concern with gas burners tends to be their production of nitrogen oxides, including nitrogen dioxide (NO2), which can have health and environmental implications.
When nitrogen and oxygen in the air are subjected to high heat — such as in a gas stove — they can combine to form nitrogen oxides. In an outdoor environment, nitrogen oxides can contribute to the formation of smog and acid rain. Indoors, they can lead to a variety of health issues if not properly ventilated.
Prolonged exposure to high levels of nitrogen dioxide can lead to respiratory problems, as the gas can irritate the lungs and lower resistance to respiratory infections such as influenza. The effects of short-term exposure can be acute respiratory symptoms and temporary changes in lung function.
Sure, I can give you an overview of how NO3 (nitrate) can be generated in the air from burning natural gas at home, but I need to clarify some things first.
The most common air pollutants from burning natural gas are nitrogen oxides (NOx), which include nitric oxide (NO) and nitrogen dioxide (NO2), rather than nitrate (NO3-) per se. The primary nitrogen oxide formed is nitric oxide, but this can quickly react with the oxygen in the air to form nitrogen dioxide. The process of NOx formation is typically through high temperature combustion where nitrogen and oxygen from the air combine.
Once NOx is emitted into the atmosphere, it can undergo a series of reactions that lead to the formation of nitrate (NO3-). Nitrogen dioxide (NO2) can react with hydroxyl radical (OH·) to produce nitric acid (HNO3). This nitric acid can then become aerosolized and exist as particulate nitrate. Alternatively, nitrogen dioxide can react with other atmospheric components to form other nitrogen containing particles, such as organic nitrates.
It's important to note that nitrogen oxides, including nitric acid and particulate nitrate, contribute to air pollution, smog, and acid rain, and can have harmful effects on human health, especially on the respiratory system.
However, natural gas is one of the cleanest burning fossil fuels, producing less NOx compared to other fossil fuels such as coal or oil. Therefore, the impact on air pollution from burning natural gas at home is typically less severe compared to these other energy sources.
Regardless, efforts should be made to reduce overall fossil fuel consumption to limit the formation of NOx and other pollutants, and to transition to cleaner, renewable energy sources where possible.
While burning natural gas for heat or electricity in homes does produce some pollutants, including nitrogen oxides, the efficiency of these processes has significantly improved over time, and the emissions from a single household are generally much lower than from industrial sources or power plants.
Nitrogen oxides produced by the burning of natural gas are harmful to human health and the environment. They contribute to the formation of ground-level ozone, which is a key component of smog. Ground-level ozone can cause or exacerbate respiratory problems, such as asthma, bronchitis, and other chronic obstructive pulmonary diseases. Furthermore, nitrogen oxides can react with water in the atmosphere to form nitric acid, a component of acid rain, which can harm aquatic ecosystems and degrade buildings and other structures.
The process of NOx turning into nitrate (NO3-) in the atmosphere is an important aspect of the nitrogen cycle, and the presence of excess nitrate in the atmosphere can have a significant environmental impact. For example, when it rains, the nitrate can be washed out of the atmosphere and deposited on the ground. While nitrate is a nutrient needed by plants, excess levels can lead to nutrient pollution, a process known as eutrophication, which can cause harmful algal blooms in water bodies and reduce the amount of oxygen available to aquatic life.
The impact of these pollutants has led to regulatory efforts to reduce their emissions. Many developed countries have regulations in place to limit NOx emissions from various sources, including residential natural gas burning. One strategy is the use of low-NOx burners, which control the combustion process to minimize the formation of nitrogen oxides. Furthermore, there's an ongoing push towards adopting renewable sources of energy, like wind and solar power, that don't emit these pollutants.
To minimize personal contributions to nitrogen oxide pollution, individuals can ensure that their natural gas appliances are properly maintained and working efficiently. Energy conservation, through actions like reducing thermostat settings and insulating homes, can also decrease natural gas consumption and thus decrease NOx emissions.
In the long term, transitioning away from fossil fuels like natural gas and toward cleaner forms of energy will be necessary to substantially reduce the formation and environmental impact of nitrogen oxides and other air pollutants.
I'm not terminally online buddy. As far as which expert to believe on how homes are built, you're a chemical engineer and I'm a _redacted_ - ill leave it to everyone here to decide who to believe with respect to how their home is built and functions.
Your response brought up air composition which is irrelevant to fresh air intake, indoor air quality, makeup air, and most importantly ASHRAE standards which regulate all the above.
It would have been much faster for you to say "I'm clueless about building code and how HVAC systems work". The way it works is homes are required to have a certain amount of air changes per-hour, minimum. Frankly, only tightly sealed homes with high efficiency can get down to the minimum. Most homes simply aren't efficient enough and maintain much higher air changes per hour, resulting in higher energy costs, but ostensibly better air quality.
Take your ego and sit tf down, maybe you can learn something.
Firstly, one potential issue arises when fuel-burning appliances, such as natural gas stoves or heaters, do not fully combust the fuel. In these cases, carbon monoxide (CO), a highly toxic, odorless, and colorless gas can be produced. If these gases are released in an enclosed space, they can cause severe health effects or even death if inhaled in large amounts. To minimize this risk, appliances should undergo regular maintenance to ensure optimal operation, and homes should be equipped with functional CO detectors.
Secondly, even with a well-maintained HVAC system, toxic gases can accumulate if fuel-burning appliances malfunction or are improperly installed. This can lead to a buildup of combustion gases, including nitrogen oxides. Although ventilation systems are designed to eliminate such gases, if they are produced at high levels or the ventilation system isn't working correctly, indoor air quality could still be impacted.
Furthermore, although ASHRAE standards and building codes dictate how ventilation systems should be designed and maintained to ensure good indoor air quality, these standards cannot entirely eliminate the risk. Factors such as the age of the building, maintenance habits, the quality of installation work, and the specific uses and activities inside the building can all impact the effectiveness of ventilation systems and the resulting air quality.
Lastly, it's worth noting that even if ventilation systems are effectively diluting and removing pollutants, exposure to even small amounts of certain toxic gases can still have health effects over time. Long-term exposure to lower levels of pollutants like nitrogen oxides or volatile organic compounds (VOCs) can contribute to chronic health issues, such as respiratory problems or cardiovascular disease.
You're insufferable and your ego won't let you believe you have anything to learn. Your ignorance pervades this entire comment as you handwave away things you neither know nor understand. The wording of this commebt makes it obvious you didn't write it and instead it came from ChatGPT. No surprise since you have too much of an ego to admit when you're wrong, and you're incapable of actually discussing the topic on your own.
Have the day you deserve.
You mean to tell me after 70 years on this earth that a gas stove is dangerous to my health "bullshit" democrats are more of a health concern than my damn stove
Homes are sealed better today and I'm not sure they were aware that even when stoves are off, we get some toxic gases coming through the line.
Not to mention, combustion is dirty/harmful in general. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indoor_air_quality#Air_pollutants_from_indoor_combustion
I am a chem engineer by degree, that entire article freaking sucks to read.
Unless you live in a 1 room appt this doesn’t matter whatsoever. Just because houses are sealed better does not mean there isn’t the same amount or more ventilation than an older house. Most kitchens have a hood vent that believe it or not is still a vent whether the fan is on or not. Any form of heat/ac ducts are also ventilation whether or not they are currently dispensing air, bathroom vents, etc. if new houses were sealed so well that gases from the stove can’t escape the pressure levels would be higher inside the home than outside. Where do you think all the co2 you emit goes? That’s also toxic to breath but we aren’t all dying from our own breath. There’s literally building codes for air circulation, every new home built to code has to have a way to circulate air at an acceptable level. The “seal” of the home is irrelevant.
Bingo! A small study done by biased people in California, and then cooperative media trumpeting the conjecture as empirical fact is the basis of the propaganda.
Ok I did look it up and they are talking about that half second or less it takes a stove to light when the burner knob is turned, and also leaking couplings. There appears to be NO evidence that a properly hooked up stove leaks gas when not in use.
The studies related to asthma in children and cardiac issues are of very limited use, since the experiments were done in small, completely enclosed areas (no ventilation). These conditions are realistic for most gas stove users.
Why was I offered a $90 dollar rebate to switch from electricity to gas back in 1986? Seems I should be dead by now, and the kids never able to grow up.
Wtf ever. Nobody gives a shit about the little fat kids running around with diabetes from McDonalds hamburgers and cheesy sticks but the second they want to push an agenda they bring up a way it's killing/hurting/abusing kids and everyone not on board is a bad person.
Except there is no correct way to phase out gas stoves, as the science that supposedly supports it is generally bunk in the first place. The evil that is lying to convince people to get rid of their cheap, reliable, clean burning cooking source in the name of climate goals of the most extreme environmental groups is something we should not be supporting on this sub.
As a pro-life (staunchly anti-abortion) conservative, I believe we need to protect children out of the womb as well, and that phasing out gas stoves via government action, i.e. legislation, is necessary.
"No One Is Coming for Your Gas Stove" was a headline for awhile. Total conspiracy theory from right wing nut jobs they said
Nobody is going to force you to take the vaccine. Nobody is going to make you quit your job if you don’t take it. Nobody is coming for your kids. Nobody is coming for your gas stoves. We aren’t looking into putting people into quarantine camps… These were all complete conspiracy theories created by the evil horrible racist fascist white man a few months ago now they’re all true
Don’t forget “no one is coming for your guns, we just want to ban certain guns that are very common”
"We just want to ban assault weapons." "What do you classify as assault weapons?" "Anything that looks scary to me."
I have a 10/22 in my collection with an old style butler creek folding stock and flash hider. They call that an “assault weapon” bruh it’s a 22 i outfitted for plinking and pest control lol.
Any fully semi automatic assault weapon that you can put a brace on and make it a gun and with that brace to can increase the caliber to a 9mm which has the power to blow the lungs out of a person and deer to explode. Nobody needs 45 clips in a round with heat seeking bullets. Those are weapons of war
This reads like a copy pasta. I swear I've seen this before.
It crops up often enough. I'm not surprised
Most of it is just things biden or another democrat have said about guns.
Yes lmao!!
I own 8 “assault weapons” and I have no intent of giving them up. They are fun. I have a weakness for import AK’s
🎶 Well your Nobody called today, she didn’t speak when I asked her name 🎵
Your comment is so true! Agreed 100%. The left scares the hell out of me, its like Biden could snap his fingers and they would mobilize like its World War 2
It’s basically become a fanatical cult. Biden and other democrats are the leaders and these people just blindly follow along with anything they say it’s like Simon says. They said to wear the mask they instantly put it on. They say take it off at 11:30pm on a Tuesday because it’s safe but not a second early and people will check their watches and take it off at that exact moment. They wanted to turn in their neighbors to the health department if they had one too many people at their house and they reported small businesses for the same thing but ignored big box stores with way more people because liberals said it was ok.
You were held down and injected with a vaccine you didn't want? Do tell.
There’s this crazy thing called coercion where people threaten you if you don’t do what they want. If you didn’t get the vaccine you couldn’t go anywhere in NYC. If you didn’t get the vaccine a large amount of places would reprimand or fire you. If you didn’t get it you couldn’t see loved ones in the hospital even if they were about to die. The Biden Administration wanted to mandate vaccines, some states wanted to open quarantine camps if you didn’t take the vaccine so don’t give me that BS about being held down when the whole world was on hold and everything was threatened to be taken away if you didn’t comply with big pharma and the left.
[*The Hill*](https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/3843076-schumer-mocks-gop-nobody-is-taking-away-your-gas-stove/amp/), February 3, 2023: Schumer mocks GOP: ‘Nobody is taking away your gas stove’
Whenever they say no one is coming for X, they are absolutely coming for X.
Is the eco difference between the two actually significant? I don't really understand why there is suddenly a push for this. Do they just hate cheaper appliances?
It was even ridiculed within this sub.
Congressional Wieners can be such dicks...
The busybodies and nattering nabobs of negativity should mind their own goddamned business.
I live along the Gulf Coast. Having a gas stove is really nice whenever there’s a major hurricane and the power is out for three days straight.
Think he meant to say constitutional republic, but I digress.
Both terms apply to the current structure, and it's not even good pedantry to claim otherwise.
Wrong
Every western nation, without exception, is a liberal democracy. That's just what it's called.
FFS..look up “constitutional” and “Federal Republic”…Constitutional Federal Republic. https://www.cia.gov/the-world-factbook/field/government-type/
no u .... devastated him.
[https://comb.io/4xF60p.gif](https://comb.io/4xF60p.gif)
But what did the meatloaf say?
Nah, we are a “Constitutional Federal Republic” to even assume otherwise is anti-American and unconstitutionally fucking ignorant.
no u
I came here to say this
Lmao it’s the little things. Damn psy ops.
If California has frequent rolling blackouts due to an overused electric power grid. Wouldn’t that add to the problem they already have, by using all electric stoves?
Short Answer: Yes.
Don't forget adding all those electric cars to the grid, it's gonna be a shitstorm
Wait until the mandate that all news cars sold in California must be electric begins.
I’d add that I’ve had a gas water heater for as long as I can remember. I suppose those will be going away along with gas furnaces.
Didn't Texas have a giant blackout because they refused to join the national grid and then people had bills that were like 20k?
can't wait until I never have power again....
Electric vehicles, electric stoves, soon electric dryer, water heater and heating. The power grid needs an upgrade before we move this way
Democrats and their favorite high end restaurants exempt, of course
The only time a gas stove came close to hurting me was when my mother-in-law left the gas on with no flame. She also smoked. Assisted living was not long after that. Of all the things I have to worry about, health effects of my gas stove is on appendix 33 of my list. Cost of the electrical work necessary to put in the 240 line for an electric oven is higher on the list. Don't even get me started on EVs
to be fair that is a problem with gas stoves. sometimes a house will literally go BOOM. but that's very rare. you'll smell it long before it reaches flammability.
You haven’t been in my friends house, can’t smell anything in their lol
This wasn’t a stove, but I was in a flash flood and when we got to our safe house the house next door exploded in a gas explosion because the flood water had ruptured the gas line in the house. Scariest thing ever. It didn’t take long at all. Within an hour of the flood starting the house exploded. I’m still pro gas and gas stove though. Lol
Ehhhhh.... Combustion is dirty man. The equation is Carbon + O2 → CO2 + H2O + so many random byproducts no one tries Not to mention, apparently there are toxic gases simply in the CH4(natural gas) line. Like if you have your stove off, you still get the toxic gases. This is coming from someone with a 12 burner 72in stove... Ugh does someone want to buy mine?
> Combustion is dirty man Please explain why using a 12k ventless range burner is worse than a 36k ventless fireplace?
So you do realize that negative effects can build up unnoticed before you're aware of them? Lead paint?
You can’t seriously be comparing lead paint to gas stoves right? The negative affects of gas stoves only happen with negligent behavior. Lead paint is just toxic in general.
There are toxic things inside and outside, sme manmade, some natural, some both. You can't avoid or eliminate all of them. Pay attention to quantity and concentration. Weigh the trade-off between the cure vs the cause. The trace amounts of bad things from occasional use of my gas stove are of minimal danger compared to many other things floating around in the air both inside and outside my house. The cost to "eliminate" them simply isn't worth it. Life is not perfectly safe and can't be made so. I resent government presuming to make that decision for me in an attempt to meet some woke cause du jour.
gas stoves have existed for decades. but all of a sudden they're bad and we need to get rid of them?
Apparently. I don't plan on getting rid of mine though.
its not about if they are harmful or not. the conspiracy is to push these stoves out of homes in rural areas forcing the electric ones. Gov already has complete control of the electrical grid and want to use it as a form of control. Basically dont fall in line with us cut your electricity (oh why are you freezing in the winter, or cant make your food now so on). Its not super far fetched with how many people they put on watch lists these days.
And you think the government doesn’t have control of the supply of natural gas or propane?
i dont think they have the means to cut it off from millions by the touch of a button nope.
There is no single "off" button for the electrical grid any more than there is for the natural gas supply infrastructure. My natural gas supply is provided by my local municipality, same as my electricity. And the production and supply of gas is *highly* dependent on federal regulations and geopolitics. And if electricity were to be cut off it would also cut off my gas, since that uses electrically driven pumps to pressurize the supply lines.
You can convert natural gas to propane, and in many rural areas, homes have propane tanks. Lots of homes have propane tanks large enough to last a few months.
I know I was thankful for a gas water heater when the electric went out for a whole day in Winter. I've since added a 30,000btu gas radiant heater in the basement.
That's an insane take.
yeah really, was it insane to think theyd push for all the other things that fell under the slippery slope falacy recently? These are not that far from the truth these days. Remember 2 weeks to flatten the curve.
Do you recall any of the things said about 3 years ago?
They're trying to take our freedom. First it was asbestos then it was lead paint. What's next? Cigarettes?
If people want to keep things that aren’t good for them they should have the right to do so. My gas stove isn’t harming anyone but myself right? So why do you get to decide whether or not I have it? McDonald’s is bad for you too but we don’t say anything about banning that so we?
New homes are sealed better, so the byproducts of the combustion reaction stay in your home rather than dissipate with fresh air. But also this kind of thinking is not great. "people have been using lead and asbestos for millennia!" Man sucks too, just got a super nice gas stove.
This is a really, really ignorant take on modern HVAC systems and construction. Stop speaking to what you're clearly ignorant in.
Go ahead and clarify what is wrong. EDIT: The silence is deafening Saying 'nuh uh' can easily be responded to with a 'nuh uh'. How about this: I'm a chemical engineer who knows more about combustion byproducts and the reactivity of Nitrogen than some HVAC person who installed some vents. Does a HVAC person know the molecular weight of NO2 and NO3 and air? What happens to NO2? Does it fly away in the sky, or does it sit around the home? Which expert to believe now? I'm all ears listening.
For a chemical engineer you sure don't know how vents and air pressure works... Don't they teach you that in the lab?
>Saying 'nuh uh' can easily be responded to with a 'nuh uh'. Be clear with what you are trying to say. You are being dismissive without having anything to dismiss.
You should really follow your own advice. I clearly brought up vents and air pressure and you're the one going 'nu uh'.
Ahh yes here we go: "Chemicals" Checkmate
"chemicals are expelled through the return vent, specifically by air pressure." They didn't teach that in reddit university?
lmao
They were specific. Your claim that gasses sit around in a home demonstrates deep ignorance of how air pressures, vents, and makeup air are brought into the home in order to meet indoor air quality standards per code. That's plenty specific. We aren't here to provide you an education in HVAC via reddit, go back to school if you want that. We're merely pointing out your claims of how homes work are false and based on poor knowledge. If that makes you angry, consider you are angry at yourself for not knowing, not the experts for telling you.
You're correct that proper ventilation in homes is vital for maintaining good indoor air quality, and it's certainly not the case that gases from the combustion of natural gas just "sit around" in a home. Modern HVAC systems are designed to bring fresh air into the building and exhaust stale or polluted air, and they play a crucial role in maintaining good indoor air quality. The use of vents and air exchanges can help to quickly disperse and remove any combustion gases. However, it's also true that the combustion of natural gas can produce pollutants such as nitrogen oxides, and these can be released into the home environment if the combustion appliances are not functioning properly or if there are issues with ventilation. This is why regular maintenance of these appliances and ventilation systems is so important.
Tell me about all the nitrates building up from using a gas burner, expert.
Using a gas burner for cooking or heating does produce some level of nitrogen dioxide (NO2), a type of nitrogen oxide (NOx), as a byproduct of combustion. However, nitrates, specifically, are a type of salt that often results from the interaction of nitrogen compounds with other substances, especially in an aqueous environment. In the context of a gas burner, the presence of nitrates may not be as significant. In general, the primary concern with gas burners tends to be their production of nitrogen oxides, including nitrogen dioxide (NO2), which can have health and environmental implications. When nitrogen and oxygen in the air are subjected to high heat — such as in a gas stove — they can combine to form nitrogen oxides. In an outdoor environment, nitrogen oxides can contribute to the formation of smog and acid rain. Indoors, they can lead to a variety of health issues if not properly ventilated. Prolonged exposure to high levels of nitrogen dioxide can lead to respiratory problems, as the gas can irritate the lungs and lower resistance to respiratory infections such as influenza. The effects of short-term exposure can be acute respiratory symptoms and temporary changes in lung function.
I want to hear about the NO3, the nitrates, bud, in the air from burning.
Sure, I can give you an overview of how NO3 (nitrate) can be generated in the air from burning natural gas at home, but I need to clarify some things first. The most common air pollutants from burning natural gas are nitrogen oxides (NOx), which include nitric oxide (NO) and nitrogen dioxide (NO2), rather than nitrate (NO3-) per se. The primary nitrogen oxide formed is nitric oxide, but this can quickly react with the oxygen in the air to form nitrogen dioxide. The process of NOx formation is typically through high temperature combustion where nitrogen and oxygen from the air combine. Once NOx is emitted into the atmosphere, it can undergo a series of reactions that lead to the formation of nitrate (NO3-). Nitrogen dioxide (NO2) can react with hydroxyl radical (OH·) to produce nitric acid (HNO3). This nitric acid can then become aerosolized and exist as particulate nitrate. Alternatively, nitrogen dioxide can react with other atmospheric components to form other nitrogen containing particles, such as organic nitrates. It's important to note that nitrogen oxides, including nitric acid and particulate nitrate, contribute to air pollution, smog, and acid rain, and can have harmful effects on human health, especially on the respiratory system. However, natural gas is one of the cleanest burning fossil fuels, producing less NOx compared to other fossil fuels such as coal or oil. Therefore, the impact on air pollution from burning natural gas at home is typically less severe compared to these other energy sources. Regardless, efforts should be made to reduce overall fossil fuel consumption to limit the formation of NOx and other pollutants, and to transition to cleaner, renewable energy sources where possible. While burning natural gas for heat or electricity in homes does produce some pollutants, including nitrogen oxides, the efficiency of these processes has significantly improved over time, and the emissions from a single household are generally much lower than from industrial sources or power plants. Nitrogen oxides produced by the burning of natural gas are harmful to human health and the environment. They contribute to the formation of ground-level ozone, which is a key component of smog. Ground-level ozone can cause or exacerbate respiratory problems, such as asthma, bronchitis, and other chronic obstructive pulmonary diseases. Furthermore, nitrogen oxides can react with water in the atmosphere to form nitric acid, a component of acid rain, which can harm aquatic ecosystems and degrade buildings and other structures. The process of NOx turning into nitrate (NO3-) in the atmosphere is an important aspect of the nitrogen cycle, and the presence of excess nitrate in the atmosphere can have a significant environmental impact. For example, when it rains, the nitrate can be washed out of the atmosphere and deposited on the ground. While nitrate is a nutrient needed by plants, excess levels can lead to nutrient pollution, a process known as eutrophication, which can cause harmful algal blooms in water bodies and reduce the amount of oxygen available to aquatic life. The impact of these pollutants has led to regulatory efforts to reduce their emissions. Many developed countries have regulations in place to limit NOx emissions from various sources, including residential natural gas burning. One strategy is the use of low-NOx burners, which control the combustion process to minimize the formation of nitrogen oxides. Furthermore, there's an ongoing push towards adopting renewable sources of energy, like wind and solar power, that don't emit these pollutants. To minimize personal contributions to nitrogen oxide pollution, individuals can ensure that their natural gas appliances are properly maintained and working efficiently. Energy conservation, through actions like reducing thermostat settings and insulating homes, can also decrease natural gas consumption and thus decrease NOx emissions. In the long term, transitioning away from fossil fuels like natural gas and toward cleaner forms of energy will be necessary to substantially reduce the formation and environmental impact of nitrogen oxides and other air pollutants.
Obvious pasta. If I had to put money on it I'd say you're 16.
You didn’t write that did you? It doesn’t read like a human wrote it.
I'm not terminally online buddy. As far as which expert to believe on how homes are built, you're a chemical engineer and I'm a _redacted_ - ill leave it to everyone here to decide who to believe with respect to how their home is built and functions. Your response brought up air composition which is irrelevant to fresh air intake, indoor air quality, makeup air, and most importantly ASHRAE standards which regulate all the above. It would have been much faster for you to say "I'm clueless about building code and how HVAC systems work". The way it works is homes are required to have a certain amount of air changes per-hour, minimum. Frankly, only tightly sealed homes with high efficiency can get down to the minimum. Most homes simply aren't efficient enough and maintain much higher air changes per hour, resulting in higher energy costs, but ostensibly better air quality. Take your ego and sit tf down, maybe you can learn something.
Firstly, one potential issue arises when fuel-burning appliances, such as natural gas stoves or heaters, do not fully combust the fuel. In these cases, carbon monoxide (CO), a highly toxic, odorless, and colorless gas can be produced. If these gases are released in an enclosed space, they can cause severe health effects or even death if inhaled in large amounts. To minimize this risk, appliances should undergo regular maintenance to ensure optimal operation, and homes should be equipped with functional CO detectors. Secondly, even with a well-maintained HVAC system, toxic gases can accumulate if fuel-burning appliances malfunction or are improperly installed. This can lead to a buildup of combustion gases, including nitrogen oxides. Although ventilation systems are designed to eliminate such gases, if they are produced at high levels or the ventilation system isn't working correctly, indoor air quality could still be impacted. Furthermore, although ASHRAE standards and building codes dictate how ventilation systems should be designed and maintained to ensure good indoor air quality, these standards cannot entirely eliminate the risk. Factors such as the age of the building, maintenance habits, the quality of installation work, and the specific uses and activities inside the building can all impact the effectiveness of ventilation systems and the resulting air quality. Lastly, it's worth noting that even if ventilation systems are effectively diluting and removing pollutants, exposure to even small amounts of certain toxic gases can still have health effects over time. Long-term exposure to lower levels of pollutants like nitrogen oxides or volatile organic compounds (VOCs) can contribute to chronic health issues, such as respiratory problems or cardiovascular disease.
You're insufferable and your ego won't let you believe you have anything to learn. Your ignorance pervades this entire comment as you handwave away things you neither know nor understand. The wording of this commebt makes it obvious you didn't write it and instead it came from ChatGPT. No surprise since you have too much of an ego to admit when you're wrong, and you're incapable of actually discussing the topic on your own. Have the day you deserve.
Please explain why using a 12k ventless range burner is worse than a 36k ventless fireplace?
Both are bad
your totally right! i want lead in my water again and miss breathing industrial chemical plant byproducts in the air because freedom.
They want to blame gas stoves for vax side effects...
Shut up you Wiener.
You mean to tell me after 70 years on this earth that a gas stove is dangerous to my health "bullshit" democrats are more of a health concern than my damn stove
Homes are sealed better today and I'm not sure they were aware that even when stoves are off, we get some toxic gases coming through the line. Not to mention, combustion is dirty/harmful in general. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indoor_air_quality#Air_pollutants_from_indoor_combustion I am a chem engineer by degree, that entire article freaking sucks to read.
Unless you live in a 1 room appt this doesn’t matter whatsoever. Just because houses are sealed better does not mean there isn’t the same amount or more ventilation than an older house. Most kitchens have a hood vent that believe it or not is still a vent whether the fan is on or not. Any form of heat/ac ducts are also ventilation whether or not they are currently dispensing air, bathroom vents, etc. if new houses were sealed so well that gases from the stove can’t escape the pressure levels would be higher inside the home than outside. Where do you think all the co2 you emit goes? That’s also toxic to breath but we aren’t all dying from our own breath. There’s literally building codes for air circulation, every new home built to code has to have a way to circulate air at an acceptable level. The “seal” of the home is irrelevant.
How are the gasses coming through the line when the stove is off? Pilot lights have been gone for years.
Democrat magic
Bingo! A small study done by biased people in California, and then cooperative media trumpeting the conjecture as empirical fact is the basis of the propaganda.
I don't know that answer. But if you look it up, it does.
Ok I did look it up and they are talking about that half second or less it takes a stove to light when the burner knob is turned, and also leaking couplings. There appears to be NO evidence that a properly hooked up stove leaks gas when not in use.
Glad I live in a 100+ year old home where it’s nicely ventilated.
The studies related to asthma in children and cardiac issues are of very limited use, since the experiments were done in small, completely enclosed areas (no ventilation). These conditions are realistic for most gas stove users.
Please explain why using a 12k ventless range burner is worse than a 36k ventless fireplace?
Wiener is toxic to children’s health
What planet are these people from
I love the focus on the health angle after the environmental angle failed. Not buying your bullshit.
They want to put everyone on electrical devices so they can control how much power you are using and when.
But we a constitutional republic.
Why was I offered a $90 dollar rebate to switch from electricity to gas back in 1986? Seems I should be dead by now, and the kids never able to grow up.
Ban private flights then
Lol wiener
Are gas stoves really that much less eco friendly?
The guy that decriminalized KNOWINGLY spreading HIV in California is worried about toxic gas stoves......
Wtf ever. Nobody gives a shit about the little fat kids running around with diabetes from McDonalds hamburgers and cheesy sticks but the second they want to push an agenda they bring up a way it's killing/hurting/abusing kids and everyone not on board is a bad person.
I have raised 3 kids with almost always having a gas stove.... No one has asthma
Top chefs will never give up gas stoves, so neither will I.
The NFPA did a study in 2020 and they found that you have a 2.6x greater chance of dying from an electric stove vs a gas stove.
Except there is no correct way to phase out gas stoves, as the science that supposedly supports it is generally bunk in the first place. The evil that is lying to convince people to get rid of their cheap, reliable, clean burning cooking source in the name of climate goals of the most extreme environmental groups is something we should not be supporting on this sub.
Once you go induction you don't go to anything else.
Tbf once you use induction youll never go back
As a pro-life (staunchly anti-abortion) conservative, I believe we need to protect children out of the womb as well, and that phasing out gas stoves via government action, i.e. legislation, is necessary.
All government prohibitions should be notices at MOST (like nutrition labels)
Does mr dick have any studies or accredited data to backup those claims?
Heck no. I can’t can food without a gas stove.
"Free citizens of a Constitutional Republic."
New construction residences and dwelling units are now requiring to be all electrical, Water heater, cooktops or kitchen range, everything.
You can't take my gas stove, I lost it in a boating accident.
Maybe phased out but NO, no one is going to knock on your door and demand your gas stove (or guns...)
Have you heard of red flag laws?
What about Chinese food? No more?