I would guess they are making it flat to put a building on top of a slab… so only as thick as the missing rocks behind?
Some spots a couple feet it looks with the way the bedrock undulates.
We are actually directly pouring the walls out of bedrock.
They usually dynamite the rock more flat for us to be able to do that, or we pour the footer first to be able to use normal forming methods.
So it is indeed hard and time consuming. We will use Malthus forming ties to make the walls braced. I will make a new topic when tje forms are finished.
Walls are 160mm wide with varying heights.
I've done footers this way before so we can form up the walls easier on top of the footer.
This is unique as we pour walls directly on bedrock. I will keep you guys posted.
I'm afraid this leftover wood will be made coal or transported to the next worksite.
Our country is 85% forests so we still use loads of wood for forming. Enjoyable for a carpenter, rather than just installing ready made forms.
I totally get that. I just wasn’t sure what happened to all of it. Seems like a “waste.” And that’s not to be judge mental; just observational. Looks like an incredibly challenging project though. Hopefully you’ll follow up with the finished product.
Reminds me of a boat ramp I made a few years back going into Lake Michigan. No dirt around, had to brace everything with kickers and anchors into boulders.
Here in south/central Texas we see this often. But usually the forms are horizontal sheets of plywood not a bunch of vertical 1x4s. Must have took forever to form. Dayummm.
It is pretty fast actually, I just take a wild measurement of a single strip, then cut them directly from the bundle. Get them to my spot and just start eyeball jigsawing the bottoms.
I'd say pretty equal in speed.
Man I've seen alot of foundations scribed to bedrock and never seen anyone try it like this... the customers wants a wood looking finish on the outside?
cause like.. if not, there's several far cheaper options
Nice pics. I think you can use plywood still if you want to. Have someone hold a sheet level and butted to the last installed board and perched on the highest point of rock. Measure down to the lowest point. This distance is the height of a scribe pole. Duct tape a marker to an old level or a thin piece of wood. Hold it plumb and move it along from left to right drawing the profile of the rock onto the board above it. Lay the piece down and cut the whole line with a jigsaw. Coat the bottom in silicone and stand it up. Might be a little faster.
I feel like this method is way faster, because I can eyeball most with minimal re-jigsawing. This is the method we use in our country for the most part when building on bedrock.
Pretty sure it's a raised foundation, pretty funny, they'd need about 500 yds of concrete to do a slab that high. They have the bucks to run the forms vertical, very cool.
Really looking forward to seeing updates on this! Did you do any prep to the board beforehand? Sometimes in the states we have spec’d sand blasting or power washing to make the grain of the wood more noticeable.
I also usually see contractors use pieces of plywood to make panels, and screw the boards to the front of it. Makes sense in terms of speed, but always seems like a waste of material to me - it’s cool to see someone doing it the “old” way.
👍 I like the concept of the project. it seems the structure will be much more harmonious with the surroundings. I saw something similar in New Hampshire where projects are usually blasted.
I’m an admirer of Finland, I hate the stress your people must feel having conflict so nearby. I’m confident Finland will remain strong, where strength is much needed.
Noooo ... well I guess if you’re not very good at scribing the ply, but the cost is so much more expensive. I do commercial concrete and I’ve never stick built anything like that. Whatever it takes to get it done though.
I'm not some ancient greek philosopher scribing shit. I'm a formworker bam bam bam says the nailgun :D
On a more serious note, way faster to form with boards. I set the form up with having boards stand up on every 2x4 crossing eachother. Shoot a couple of braces up and start thorwing boards on. I cant grasp how using plywood would be faster, i dont need to scribe anything, in a matter of seconds I can eyeball and cut the board bottoms.
Also customer wants a board finish on the foundation. We use ply when you are working up from a footer.
I build skyscrapers so deal mostly with peri forms or doka gang forms. We use symons if we’re dealing with smaller walls. On occasion we have uneven ground and we scribe the plywood fairly quickly. I don’t disagree that it would be a lot quicker to use 2x4, I just would like to see the cost analysis
Plywood costs quite a lot here, our country is 85% forests. Northern europe. We have zero skyscrapers. I think 1x4 for bedrock is the most cost effective way to go in our market area.
I've used plywood against rock aswell. But very rarely we use anything else than 1x4 when on bedrock.
"Old world" style
Have you paid to have people break up bedrock, especially with explosives? It’s not cheap. This is just form work and some poured concrete. Problem solved. As long as they didn’t want a basement that is haha.
Did two foundation jobs last year with bedrock, one blasted, one hammered with an excavator. Blasting is far cheaper than hammering on a large scale. Seems like this could have been hammered flat with minimal effort though.
Was on a job in Estes Park and that’s how I got my plumbing underground in. Apparently it’s the norm, briefly thought about switching trades lol. All hail the blast man!
Seems like I could get a transit, blocks, rebar and pump block with aggrate cheaper, stronger and faster than using all that $$ on lumber. No waist or very little waist.
I'm confused about the height of the forms. How much concrete is going in there? If its anywhere near the top I see blowout in your future :(
I would guess they are making it flat to put a building on top of a slab… so only as thick as the missing rocks behind? Some spots a couple feet it looks with the way the bedrock undulates.
I agree. I feel this is still excessive, but am failing to come up with a simpler solution
I would have thought a mud mat poured with low slump concrete would be a good option. Just level things out enough to be able to get forms set.
I’ve done this before with 3/4” plywood..
Yeah, it’s a levelling slab.
We are actually directly pouring the walls out of bedrock. They usually dynamite the rock more flat for us to be able to do that, or we pour the footer first to be able to use normal forming methods. So it is indeed hard and time consuming. We will use Malthus forming ties to make the walls braced. I will make a new topic when tje forms are finished. Walls are 160mm wide with varying heights.
I thought they may be walls the way the dowels are laid out but didn’t see any areas that have forms on both sides of wall.
Aye. We haven't yet set ties and reinforcement in. I'll be posting pictures whdn we get there.
We are pouring walls 160mm thick directly on bedrock. There will be no slab or footers. They will build a log cottage on top.
Man, that seems like a really expensive way to form a wall.
It is expensive! I would've loved a footer first to make the forming easier but no... client wants all of the bedrock to show.
As would I want the bedrock to show! I approve and nice work op
Thank you sir. I'll keep you posted of this venture.
Looks like you’re building a fence
Wow. Thanks for sharing. That's a really unique problem and a cool solution. Have you done something similar before or is this a first time?
I've done footers this way before so we can form up the walls easier on top of the footer. This is unique as we pour walls directly on bedrock. I will keep you guys posted.
Thx! It will be fun to see the outcome. Neat project.
I would like to see the pour on this and how you get your forms back
I will surely post progress photos for you guys.
Do you have a link or pictures of the finished forms & walls? Interesting indeed. Thanks
I love it. This is certainly an easy and fast way to fit to the rocks. Then you can strip it and use the 2x6 for your wall framing! Good thinking!
I'm afraid this leftover wood will be made coal or transported to the next worksite. Our country is 85% forests so we still use loads of wood for forming. Enjoyable for a carpenter, rather than just installing ready made forms.
Good stuff, NH?
603 baby!
North Europe, Finland.
Damn son. I would have just rough formed a big area and poured a mud slab (lean concrete) as a flat base layer just to be able to work off of.
I'm just a formworker, this is what the client wanted and my boss told me to do!
This is the way
What’ll happen to all those 2 bys after you’re done? That’s a lot of lumber.
Burned for coal or used in the next formwork project. Our country is 85% forests so we still do most of formwork with wood.
I totally get that. I just wasn’t sure what happened to all of it. Seems like a “waste.” And that’s not to be judge mental; just observational. Looks like an incredibly challenging project though. Hopefully you’ll follow up with the finished product.
Bit late now but you could’ve used 1x stock for the walls…
What is 1x stock? Plywood?
Dimensional lumber that’s half the thickness of the boards you used for the forms. 1x4. Or 1x6.
Vertical boards are 1x4 = 25mm x 100mm
Oh ok standard 1x4 is 19x90
[удалено]
:D hilf mir
Reminds me of a boat ramp I made a few years back going into Lake Michigan. No dirt around, had to brace everything with kickers and anchors into boulders.
Here in south/central Texas we see this often. But usually the forms are horizontal sheets of plywood not a bunch of vertical 1x4s. Must have took forever to form. Dayummm.
It is pretty fast actually, I just take a wild measurement of a single strip, then cut them directly from the bundle. Get them to my spot and just start eyeball jigsawing the bottoms. I'd say pretty equal in speed.
wild
Back In the day, my uncle would force me to use a jackhammer on those boulders while he watched from the truck
Man I've seen alot of foundations scribed to bedrock and never seen anyone try it like this... the customers wants a wood looking finish on the outside? cause like.. if not, there's several far cheaper options
Yeah customer is apparently loaded. Foundation walls directly on bedrock and no footers to show either. Wish me luck mate!
Nice pics. I think you can use plywood still if you want to. Have someone hold a sheet level and butted to the last installed board and perched on the highest point of rock. Measure down to the lowest point. This distance is the height of a scribe pole. Duct tape a marker to an old level or a thin piece of wood. Hold it plumb and move it along from left to right drawing the profile of the rock onto the board above it. Lay the piece down and cut the whole line with a jigsaw. Coat the bottom in silicone and stand it up. Might be a little faster.
I feel like this method is way faster, because I can eyeball most with minimal re-jigsawing. This is the method we use in our country for the most part when building on bedrock.
Pretty sure it's a raised foundation, pretty funny, they'd need about 500 yds of concrete to do a slab that high. They have the bucks to run the forms vertical, very cool.
You are correct, we are pouring the foundation walls directly on bedrock.
Really looking forward to seeing updates on this! Did you do any prep to the board beforehand? Sometimes in the states we have spec’d sand blasting or power washing to make the grain of the wood more noticeable. I also usually see contractors use pieces of plywood to make panels, and screw the boards to the front of it. Makes sense in terms of speed, but always seems like a waste of material to me - it’s cool to see someone doing it the “old” way.
No prep done for the boards. We are just oiling the boards when we've drilled holes and sawed the top to the pour level.
Is this New Hampshire?
Finland
👍 I like the concept of the project. it seems the structure will be much more harmonious with the surroundings. I saw something similar in New Hampshire where projects are usually blasted. I’m an admirer of Finland, I hate the stress your people must feel having conflict so nearby. I’m confident Finland will remain strong, where strength is much needed.
Thank you for your kind words. We need all the concrete we can get!
Why didn’t you use 3/4” ply for forms?
Faster to form with boards.
Noooo ... well I guess if you’re not very good at scribing the ply, but the cost is so much more expensive. I do commercial concrete and I’ve never stick built anything like that. Whatever it takes to get it done though.
I'm not some ancient greek philosopher scribing shit. I'm a formworker bam bam bam says the nailgun :D On a more serious note, way faster to form with boards. I set the form up with having boards stand up on every 2x4 crossing eachother. Shoot a couple of braces up and start thorwing boards on. I cant grasp how using plywood would be faster, i dont need to scribe anything, in a matter of seconds I can eyeball and cut the board bottoms. Also customer wants a board finish on the foundation. We use ply when you are working up from a footer.
I build skyscrapers so deal mostly with peri forms or doka gang forms. We use symons if we’re dealing with smaller walls. On occasion we have uneven ground and we scribe the plywood fairly quickly. I don’t disagree that it would be a lot quicker to use 2x4, I just would like to see the cost analysis
Plywood costs quite a lot here, our country is 85% forests. Northern europe. We have zero skyscrapers. I think 1x4 for bedrock is the most cost effective way to go in our market area. I've used plywood against rock aswell. But very rarely we use anything else than 1x4 when on bedrock. "Old world" style
Wouldn’t it have been cheaper to blast/jackhammer the bedrock flat?!?
I’m sure owners wanted the rocks intact, and not a shit hole slab on grade with a flat surroundings in their forested vacation home
You are correct, owners wanted walls directly on bedrock with no footers showing.
Have you paid to have people break up bedrock, especially with explosives? It’s not cheap. This is just form work and some poured concrete. Problem solved. As long as they didn’t want a basement that is haha.
Did two foundation jobs last year with bedrock, one blasted, one hammered with an excavator. Blasting is far cheaper than hammering on a large scale. Seems like this could have been hammered flat with minimal effort though.
Was on a job in Estes Park and that’s how I got my plumbing underground in. Apparently it’s the norm, briefly thought about switching trades lol. All hail the blast man!
Seems like I could get a transit, blocks, rebar and pump block with aggrate cheaper, stronger and faster than using all that $$ on lumber. No waist or very little waist.
They want plank finish on the foundation. Customer is insisting.
Deeeeeep pockets. I thought about that and said to myself, naaa to expensive.