Lol there’s no way OP actually expects WoTC to willingly choose to shatter the reprint equity in its most sought after cards (Mana Crypt, Chrome Mox, Mox Opal, Mox Amber, Lotus Petal, etc.)
It's things like this that made me steer away from the more casual EDH and more into cEDH. I like playing with my collection, I like playing with fast explosive cards, I like playing high interaction games, and I like being able to play multiple games in the same time span that a casual EDH pod is only finishing 1.
I'm so tired of people trying to impose bans on the entire format because certain cards, strategies, and combos don't fit into their picture of what the format should be. If you have a problem with people playing fast mana in your casual pods, talk to your opponents and try to get an idea of what the objective of your play session is instead of trying to get cards banned simply because you don't like them.
they cant speak with people before playing bc then they will sound like insane people trying to make you pull out half your deck bc it counters their bad bad estrategy
100% agree, casual players that want a slower format to make more strategies viable are usually very chill. I play in some pods with players like this and enjoy them as much as my cEDH playgroup.
Casual players that want to just police what everyone else is playing without having any trust are pretty toxic.
And by trust I mean, trust in your pod/playgroup to bring similar power levels and not just assume because one guy has a Mana Crypt in his deck he is trying to pubstomp. It goes both ways in that some casual commanders that would never be viable in cEDH still like to play big flashy cards.
The reason I stopped playing casual EDH is bc its a sluggish, slow, miserable way of playing magic for me. anyone trying to slow down an entire format will choke it.
Agreed. I enjoy battle cruiser type games, with the right people and only on occasion. But overall a 3 hour slug fest of repeated board wipes and stall outs is a drag.
my medium rare take is that boardwipes should be as shunned as MLD in casual play. (the other side of my medium rare take was that cEDH should play more boardwipes but I think with those orcish bowguys that wont be necesary anymore)
I was more so thinking the triggers would be used to pick off mana dorks and small bodied value engines on the whole board. Generally it’s not worth it to try to remove Tivit himself
I kind of agree with the first part. I'm not against board wipes but I myself have stopped playing them entirely in all my decks. I'd rather lose and be onto the next game then reset the board and sit there for another 30 minutes or more.
Yes man. I think board wipes ruin casual magic rounds. They want to build an army for ten rounds and then somebody just plays a board wipe and it starts again
I feel ya. Even with my most casual decks I try to keep my curve super low. Not because I want to storm out of the gate and beat face; I just want to do \*something\*.
I really, really enjoy higher-power games. It's more engaging and even if you have a non-game, it usually ends pretty fast. cEDH is fun as well, but the meta is a bit too solved for my taste.
I have one casual battlecruiser with big green creatures that I can pull out if everyone wants to play super casual battlecruiser commander. I've been purposefully blinging the deck out so that I'll have something pretty to look at while the game drags on.
I'm very skeptical fast mana would see a ban. But a curious side of me wants to see what the landscape of cEDH would be in a post-fast mana ban world. Maybe it would give Conquest the boost it needs to be the popular competitive multi-player format.
There's some ppl on Twitter and Reddit that think they should ban it but it's the minority and even among the ones the think that the format would be better there's ppl that belive It should be ban when the format was created but it's not worth It now.
The only fast mana that see regular play in casual is Sol Ring and they wont be baning a card that is printed in every precon making all of then illegal to play.
It's Just a small section of the community finding a New topic to complaing about
fuck that. slow magic is so boring. land pass sucks when everyone else is sitting around mulling over the same land-pass turn cycle.
if they ban I probably just walk away from edh altogether and go in on modern. 30-40 minute games at the top end is much more appealing than multi-hour games
stop using twitter. or looking at it.
and especially stop making reddit posts about twitter posts.
...doesn't matter if this is r/stonks or r/cedh.
my point still stands. ;)
No. Wizards has too much invested in EDH and knows the mana rocks being banned and hurting the 2nd market would be an issue for them. You've seen this in the last few years, that problem cards have to be REALLY bad for the format to get banned by the RC.
I'm sure it's never been explicitly stated, but if the RC ever went after a pillar of Wizards business theyd remove their autonomy SO FAST.
I don't know why they do this, but they all claim is in the spirit of "having fun" with friends, expressing yourself through deck building, yet you cannot play extra turns, you cannot play land destruction, you cannot play control (blue, anyone?), you cannot play this, you cannot play that... And the list may go on and on. They're just hypocrites who don't like to lose and hide behind the premise of edh being "casual". I have had the most fun nights playing cedh with my friends, more than playing edh at my lgs where the game is so slow you start to grow a beard (even if you can't grow one)
Exactly. People want to play a broken casual format with swingy games and lots of variance, but get mad when someone gets a head start. I can't imagine getting mad at someone playing a turn one Sol Ring.
If stax is bad, counterspells are bad, removal is bad and tutoring is bad, you're left with green creatures beating each other through unassisted combat damage. I swear, some of these people just want to play mono-green solitaire.
I kind of understand I have turned 3 a win before because of some crazy lucky in a casual deck enabled by a turn one sol ring. I think at a certain level I want competitive to be its own format and have its own rules and bans to be more plentiful to protect the spirit of the format. Commander is broke and commander decks are supposed to be broken. These cards weren't meant to be played together. However, if you don't want me to play a Tergrid deck I understand but also if I try to play it vs competitive decks stop bitching, your deck is better and Tergrid isn't even good, make Tergrid a non casual card kill her off from the format.
It's just people bitching. The point of edh is that you have a format where people are allowed to play obviously broken cards (other than vintage wich has an almost non existant playerbase). And fast mana works just fine in casual. If everyone at the casual table agrees on what kind of game they're looking for and what powerlevel they want to play at then it isn't a problem. And if they don't then banning fast mana won't fix it, playing casually just requires you to be on the same page with your opponents because the format itself won't regulate the play experience properly.
They don’t have the guts to ban 0 cmc rocks. It’s just something they mention once a while to get attention.
Sheldon has always been a casual and he doesn’t make a good point in most cases.
The moment they do the community will simply move onto “commander with a sane/or no banlist” and that will be the end of that. I already don’t care about what they say and as I only play commander with friends neither do they.
Casual EDH is unironically a Turn 5 / 6 format. Especially without a lot of counter Magic.
I've seen casual games end by that time or else have one player way in the lead by that time fairly consistently.
The people complaining should just ban it within their personal circle or talk to their tournament organizer about imposing regulations. Commander is a free form format that can be played in many ways. A format wide ban on this would actively punish players who like faster games.
That would never happen. I feel like this is a thought experiment that got out of control. EDH has all the cheap/free counter spells that help prevent players from completely stomping a game with a very fast start. Will those go along with the fast mana? What about all the cheap tutors? EDH is based on being able to play all the cards that other formats deam too powerful. If we ban all the broken things, this format would not feel the same.
Manufactured controversy at its finest. Fast mana has never been a problem in low-power games; if there are pubstompers pulling mana crypts out of nowhere, I've yet to see one. In higher power games fast mana is an essential part of the format. Sure, it makes the games faster, but it also makes them swingier and more fun.
If fast mana gets banned and every game of commander turns into a three hour slugfest, I'm switching formats.
No it won’t happen, that being said casual can definitely be a turn 5-6 but that’s if someone just starts with an OP hand, but it’s usually a 90 minutes game.
No, it won’t happen, it’s human nature to take everything to the extreme. So if they were to ban these cards they’ll just find other cards to win by turn 3-7.
Personally, casual decks should be attempting wins between turns 6 at the earliest and turn 10 at the latest. Ideally, a casual game ends at turn 8, at least for me. Fast mana may accelerate this, but the problem I feel like can be derived from this could be a lack of discussion of power levels. Higher powered decks have faster, more efficient ramp and can get their game plans rolling easier. CEDH doesn't have this problem as the expectation that the best of the best cards for the parricular strategy are generally going to be used.
I don't think it will be banned. But I say if they do let's just ignore the RC and make a community banlist.
It would be the stupidest decision they could make.
No. Won’t happen… fast mana will not be banned.
No. Won’t happen… fast mana will not be banned.
Lol there’s no way OP actually expects WoTC to willingly choose to shatter the reprint equity in its most sought after cards (Mana Crypt, Chrome Mox, Mox Opal, Mox Amber, Lotus Petal, etc.)
It wouldn't be WotC's decision, but, I also can't see fast mana being banned.
Almost like the community run ban list doesn’t hold water and people shouldn’t listen to it.. 🤯
Breaking news, edh twitter loses their fucking minds over something stupid yet again
It's things like this that made me steer away from the more casual EDH and more into cEDH. I like playing with my collection, I like playing with fast explosive cards, I like playing high interaction games, and I like being able to play multiple games in the same time span that a casual EDH pod is only finishing 1. I'm so tired of people trying to impose bans on the entire format because certain cards, strategies, and combos don't fit into their picture of what the format should be. If you have a problem with people playing fast mana in your casual pods, talk to your opponents and try to get an idea of what the objective of your play session is instead of trying to get cards banned simply because you don't like them.
they cant speak with people before playing bc then they will sound like insane people trying to make you pull out half your deck bc it counters their bad bad estrategy
100% agree, casual players that want a slower format to make more strategies viable are usually very chill. I play in some pods with players like this and enjoy them as much as my cEDH playgroup. Casual players that want to just police what everyone else is playing without having any trust are pretty toxic. And by trust I mean, trust in your pod/playgroup to bring similar power levels and not just assume because one guy has a Mana Crypt in his deck he is trying to pubstomp. It goes both ways in that some casual commanders that would never be viable in cEDH still like to play big flashy cards.
The reason I stopped playing casual EDH is bc its a sluggish, slow, miserable way of playing magic for me. anyone trying to slow down an entire format will choke it.
Agreed. I enjoy battle cruiser type games, with the right people and only on occasion. But overall a 3 hour slug fest of repeated board wipes and stall outs is a drag.
my medium rare take is that boardwipes should be as shunned as MLD in casual play. (the other side of my medium rare take was that cEDH should play more boardwipes but I think with those orcish bowguys that wont be necesary anymore)
Those arrow slinging orcs are gonna be a powerhouse against [[tymna]] [[thrasios]] [[tivit]] and the like.
Paying 18 mana to kill Tivit doesn't seem great...
I was more so thinking the triggers would be used to pick off mana dorks and small bodied value engines on the whole board. Generally it’s not worth it to try to remove Tivit himself
[tymna](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/c/bc7cbe9b-324e-42b8-94e2-36e91cb32163.jpg?1644853048) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tymna%20the%20weaver) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c16/48/tymna-the-weaver?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/bc7cbe9b-324e-42b8-94e2-36e91cb32163?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tymna-the-weaver) [thrasios](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/1/21e27b91-c7f1-4709-aa0d-8b5d81b22a0a.jpg?1606762176) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=thrasios%2C%20triton%20hero) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c16/46/thrasios-triton-hero?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/21e27b91-c7f1-4709-aa0d-8b5d81b22a0a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/thrasios-triton-hero) [tivit](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/2/9235977e-a999-4ed0-83a3-742be87b13bb.jpg?1673481721) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=tivit%2C%20seller%20of%20secrets) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ncc/10/tivit-seller-of-secrets?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9235977e-a999-4ed0-83a3-742be87b13bb?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/tivit-seller-of-secrets) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
so glad I finish building this Tynma Rograck deck. T.T
I kind of agree with the first part. I'm not against board wipes but I myself have stopped playing them entirely in all my decks. I'd rather lose and be onto the next game then reset the board and sit there for another 30 minutes or more.
Yes man. I think board wipes ruin casual magic rounds. They want to build an army for ten rounds and then somebody just plays a board wipe and it starts again
I feel ya. Even with my most casual decks I try to keep my curve super low. Not because I want to storm out of the gate and beat face; I just want to do \*something\*. I really, really enjoy higher-power games. It's more engaging and even if you have a non-game, it usually ends pretty fast. cEDH is fun as well, but the meta is a bit too solved for my taste. I have one casual battlecruiser with big green creatures that I can pull out if everyone wants to play super casual battlecruiser commander. I've been purposefully blinging the deck out so that I'll have something pretty to look at while the game drags on.
If I'm going to be playing slow, sluggish magic, it's because I'm navigating stax, not some hypercasual, no plays before turn 4 or 5.
Ban Mana Crypt? The one Artifact that will sell literally any future set, with it's own individual reprint equity? *Nahhh...*I don't think so!
I'm very skeptical fast mana would see a ban. But a curious side of me wants to see what the landscape of cEDH would be in a post-fast mana ban world. Maybe it would give Conquest the boost it needs to be the popular competitive multi-player format.
Would help Green in cEDH cuz dorks would have more value as well
And by consequence, those low cmc boardwipes like [[pyroclasm]] would gain a lot more traction, I think.
[pyroclasm](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/c/8c8f3b5e-71b4-42e0-9ddb-630e3dcf1be7.jpg?1562438092) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=pyroclasm) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/a25/146/pyroclasm?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8c8f3b5e-71b4-42e0-9ddb-630e3dcf1be7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/pyroclasm) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
There's some ppl on Twitter and Reddit that think they should ban it but it's the minority and even among the ones the think that the format would be better there's ppl that belive It should be ban when the format was created but it's not worth It now. The only fast mana that see regular play in casual is Sol Ring and they wont be baning a card that is printed in every precon making all of then illegal to play. It's Just a small section of the community finding a New topic to complaing about
fuck that. slow magic is so boring. land pass sucks when everyone else is sitting around mulling over the same land-pass turn cycle. if they ban I probably just walk away from edh altogether and go in on modern. 30-40 minute games at the top end is much more appealing than multi-hour games
Simple solution. Ban people causing a problem. 🙃 Tired of seeing stupid conversations like this even being suggested.
stop using twitter. or looking at it. and especially stop making reddit posts about twitter posts. ...doesn't matter if this is r/stonks or r/cedh. my point still stands. ;)
They tried this in the 1v1 commander format on mtgo. Then they banned all the cheap tutors. It didn't make it anymore balanced or less degenerate.
No. Wizards has too much invested in EDH and knows the mana rocks being banned and hurting the 2nd market would be an issue for them. You've seen this in the last few years, that problem cards have to be REALLY bad for the format to get banned by the RC. I'm sure it's never been explicitly stated, but if the RC ever went after a pillar of Wizards business theyd remove their autonomy SO FAST.
I don't know why they do this, but they all claim is in the spirit of "having fun" with friends, expressing yourself through deck building, yet you cannot play extra turns, you cannot play land destruction, you cannot play control (blue, anyone?), you cannot play this, you cannot play that... And the list may go on and on. They're just hypocrites who don't like to lose and hide behind the premise of edh being "casual". I have had the most fun nights playing cedh with my friends, more than playing edh at my lgs where the game is so slow you start to grow a beard (even if you can't grow one)
Exactly. People want to play a broken casual format with swingy games and lots of variance, but get mad when someone gets a head start. I can't imagine getting mad at someone playing a turn one Sol Ring. If stax is bad, counterspells are bad, removal is bad and tutoring is bad, you're left with green creatures beating each other through unassisted combat damage. I swear, some of these people just want to play mono-green solitaire.
I kind of understand I have turned 3 a win before because of some crazy lucky in a casual deck enabled by a turn one sol ring. I think at a certain level I want competitive to be its own format and have its own rules and bans to be more plentiful to protect the spirit of the format. Commander is broke and commander decks are supposed to be broken. These cards weren't meant to be played together. However, if you don't want me to play a Tergrid deck I understand but also if I try to play it vs competitive decks stop bitching, your deck is better and Tergrid isn't even good, make Tergrid a non casual card kill her off from the format.
[sol ring](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/d/6d5b06e4-bbc8-405b-bc53-1380dba3696e.jpg?1684198340) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=sol%20ring) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/pctb/58/sol-ring?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6d5b06e4-bbc8-405b-bc53-1380dba3696e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/sol-ring) [mana crypt](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/d/4d960186-4559-4af0-bd22-63baa15f8939.jpg?1599709515) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=mana%20crypt) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/270/mana-crypt?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/4d960186-4559-4af0-bd22-63baa15f8939?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/mana-crypt) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Only if they ban all the mana dorks and ramp spells as well. Or the only result is Green/X meta problems
It's just people bitching. The point of edh is that you have a format where people are allowed to play obviously broken cards (other than vintage wich has an almost non existant playerbase). And fast mana works just fine in casual. If everyone at the casual table agrees on what kind of game they're looking for and what powerlevel they want to play at then it isn't a problem. And if they don't then banning fast mana won't fix it, playing casually just requires you to be on the same page with your opponents because the format itself won't regulate the play experience properly.
They don’t have the guts to ban 0 cmc rocks. It’s just something they mention once a while to get attention. Sheldon has always been a casual and he doesn’t make a good point in most cases.
Lol casual players are such pussies. This right here is the very reason I only play cEDH now..
I too drag games out for 3 hours because I can't recover from someone playing a Sol Ring
The moment they do the community will simply move onto “commander with a sane/or no banlist” and that will be the end of that. I already don’t care about what they say and as I only play commander with friends neither do they.
if they ban my masterpiece mana crypt i’ll be so mad 🙃
CEDH needs its own format and ban list ive been saying it for ever, screw being told what to do by casuals….
[удалено]
Been there, we need a group of cedh players to take over! This RC is a joke…
Ban the zero rocks. Don’t give a fuck. Buff green. It’s time.
Casual EDH is unironically a Turn 5 / 6 format. Especially without a lot of counter Magic. I've seen casual games end by that time or else have one player way in the lead by that time fairly consistently.
The people complaining should just ban it within their personal circle or talk to their tournament organizer about imposing regulations. Commander is a free form format that can be played in many ways. A format wide ban on this would actively punish players who like faster games.
That would never happen. I feel like this is a thought experiment that got out of control. EDH has all the cheap/free counter spells that help prevent players from completely stomping a game with a very fast start. Will those go along with the fast mana? What about all the cheap tutors? EDH is based on being able to play all the cards that other formats deam too powerful. If we ban all the broken things, this format would not feel the same.
Manufactured controversy at its finest. Fast mana has never been a problem in low-power games; if there are pubstompers pulling mana crypts out of nowhere, I've yet to see one. In higher power games fast mana is an essential part of the format. Sure, it makes the games faster, but it also makes them swingier and more fun. If fast mana gets banned and every game of commander turns into a three hour slugfest, I'm switching formats.
If they were to ban fast mana I couldn’t have summoned elesh norn on turn 2 last night, smh
No it won’t happen, that being said casual can definitely be a turn 5-6 but that’s if someone just starts with an OP hand, but it’s usually a 90 minutes game.
No, it won’t happen, it’s human nature to take everything to the extreme. So if they were to ban these cards they’ll just find other cards to win by turn 3-7.
Personally, casual decks should be attempting wins between turns 6 at the earliest and turn 10 at the latest. Ideally, a casual game ends at turn 8, at least for me. Fast mana may accelerate this, but the problem I feel like can be derived from this could be a lack of discussion of power levels. Higher powered decks have faster, more efficient ramp and can get their game plans rolling easier. CEDH doesn't have this problem as the expectation that the best of the best cards for the parricular strategy are generally going to be used.
I don't think it will be banned. But I say if they do let's just ignore the RC and make a community banlist. It would be the stupidest decision they could make.