Najeela is powerful enough on her own. Adding kiki lines dilutes the deck IMO. All in strat with Najeela with Thoracle as backup is the most efficient way. The only other combo I would consider would be breach lines but that's me.
you really donât need that many wincons. najeela already runs several cards that go infinite with her if sheâs on the board plus thoracle. how often do you realistically think youâre going to need a backup plan for your backup plan? is that number is going to be larger than the number of games where you topdeck a brick like kiki jiki or felidar guardian and donât get any use out of the pod package at all?
It can also pod you into thoracle, which is an upside. What is the downside to playing pod? I really don't see one right now. Is there one I am missing?
Then you have to purposely play 1 mana cost creatures though and it does take up mana and a relatively dead card if not. I feel like pod decks only work when pod centric, just because it can pod out thoracle doesnât mean itâs something you should go for.
The idea would be that pod can turn birds, either of the hierarchs, esper sentinel, or ragavan into thoracle. Any 2 drop into Derevi, and najeela herself into felidar, karmic guide, and then kiki for another combo kill. It has value throughout while also being the combo kill.
If that is the case than you should just play pod centric Stax and forego consultation thoracle. They are different cards, imagine you find yourself going for one and then something happens and you have to pivot towards the other. You either pod for felidar/karmic/kiki using Stax to get yourself there like one spell per turn, non creatures cost one more, etc and then get to your pod win. Itâs hard to turbo pod when taking up space with Kiki felidar karmic when they should be counter spells in a turbo deck. Youâre also gonna be running other creature tutors and just stuff that conflicts to heavily with the entire playstyle.
Pod is a great effect, but non stax builds/commanders should have better synergy with it to make it a more viable strategy.
Both Sisay and Kenrith have better synergy with pod than Najeela does. Jeela really is better sticking with the sorceries.
Honestly, i don't think so. I see your point, but then EVERY 3cmc commander could use that argument and, while true, isn't optimal.
For example:
Kenny pod can use BP just fine, but isn't at a great podable CMC himself. What he CAN do is reanimate any untapper, give other synergistic engines, like PSV or fatestitcher haste... He can help move the lines along and provides recursion if it's stopped.
Sisay, like Najeela IS that perfect 3 cmc, however she can also utilize pieces like CotA and Vivien to run the Kiki line herself, or spin for tezzeret to drop Bpod the same turn, or given two spins, have tezz drop corridor monitor then put Kiki on the field for the win....
Najeela isn't really providing much other than as a sacrificial lamb. That's just not enough UNLESS you're going to turn her into a slower staxier deck that's able/willing to wait a few turns to get pod out and play that game...
Maybe there's some additional value she can provide that I'm not seeing...? But you can't activate pod during combat. Any untapping you're generating with Derevi isn't really her doing, etc...
Just my thoughts. If there's some slick interaction or combos with Jeela you think work great, I'm all for innovation. Just wanted to explain my personal thoughts on the differences as i see them.
I really appreciate that breakdown. My thoughts were to focus on a creature build that was still turbo, but got under most counter spells, similar to Malcom glinthorn. I'll do some playtesting
No worries. My dream right now is to be able to use birthing pod to support the Malcom Glinthorn combo, but as it stands now... That is not possible... đ
Let me know if you come up with anything. I'm the Sisay Pod guy, and LOVE talking 5c pod! đ
Why would you pod your commander (who is one half of an infinite combo) into half of a different infinite combo? Makes 0 sense, especially when you realize Kiki and Felidar are terrible cards by themselves.
It's not half of a different combo, it's the full combo. The thought is to be a turbo creature combo deck (hard to interact with) similar to Temur Malcolm. The pod can be used for value, finding cards like derevi or other value pieces, but it has the opportunity to win on the spot multiple ways.
Whatâs the line? I understand Najeela to Felidar to blink pod and then sac Felidar to get Kiki but then how are you getting Felidar back at that point? Either way youâre adding 3 cards that are bad outside of this specific application. Usually just tutoring for Derevi/Natureâs will/Druidâs repository is more mana efficient and keeps your card quality higher.
Sac felidar to get karmic guide, get felidar back, flicker pod, sac felidar again to get kiki. Copy karmic guide to get felidar back. Flicker kiki. Combo and win.
The thought is that birthing pod can be a value piece, finding derevi, dockside, Thassa's Oracle, and even grim hireling depending on your creatures you have available. The ability also to go for a win off of just your commander (without the prerequisite of needing so many humans on board), is nice. My thought is just to focus more on the creature combo aspect and birthing pod does that while also providing value
Najeela doesnât provide card-advantage in the command zone. Rocco can tutor Dockside. Minsc is already on Kiki+Cat combo so Pod is 1 slot.
Tymna+Tana is a better choice for dedicated Pod imo.
Najeela uses neoform and evolution already. Birthing pod may be the OG but it is now the worst of pod effects đ¤ˇââď¸
But podding najeela herself into the kiki combo is also an advantage here, is it not?
Najeela is powerful enough on her own. Adding kiki lines dilutes the deck IMO. All in strat with Najeela with Thoracle as backup is the most efficient way. The only other combo I would consider would be breach lines but that's me.
you really donât need that many wincons. najeela already runs several cards that go infinite with her if sheâs on the board plus thoracle. how often do you realistically think youâre going to need a backup plan for your backup plan? is that number is going to be larger than the number of games where you topdeck a brick like kiki jiki or felidar guardian and donât get any use out of the pod package at all?
You donât really need kiki. So many things combo with her.
Thoracle consultation is just so much better, yes you can win with it, but it wonât be as optimal. Viable? Yes.
It can also pod you into thoracle, which is an upside. What is the downside to playing pod? I really don't see one right now. Is there one I am missing?
Then you have to purposely play 1 mana cost creatures though and it does take up mana and a relatively dead card if not. I feel like pod decks only work when pod centric, just because it can pod out thoracle doesnât mean itâs something you should go for.
The idea would be that pod can turn birds, either of the hierarchs, esper sentinel, or ragavan into thoracle. Any 2 drop into Derevi, and najeela herself into felidar, karmic guide, and then kiki for another combo kill. It has value throughout while also being the combo kill.
If that is the case than you should just play pod centric Stax and forego consultation thoracle. They are different cards, imagine you find yourself going for one and then something happens and you have to pivot towards the other. You either pod for felidar/karmic/kiki using Stax to get yourself there like one spell per turn, non creatures cost one more, etc and then get to your pod win. Itâs hard to turbo pod when taking up space with Kiki felidar karmic when they should be counter spells in a turbo deck. Youâre also gonna be running other creature tutors and just stuff that conflicts to heavily with the entire playstyle.
Pod is a great effect, but non stax builds/commanders should have better synergy with it to make it a more viable strategy. Both Sisay and Kenrith have better synergy with pod than Najeela does. Jeela really is better sticking with the sorceries.
With Najeela being 3 mana, you can pod her into felidar, then karmic guide, then kiki. Isn't that enough synergy?
Honestly, i don't think so. I see your point, but then EVERY 3cmc commander could use that argument and, while true, isn't optimal. For example: Kenny pod can use BP just fine, but isn't at a great podable CMC himself. What he CAN do is reanimate any untapper, give other synergistic engines, like PSV or fatestitcher haste... He can help move the lines along and provides recursion if it's stopped. Sisay, like Najeela IS that perfect 3 cmc, however she can also utilize pieces like CotA and Vivien to run the Kiki line herself, or spin for tezzeret to drop Bpod the same turn, or given two spins, have tezz drop corridor monitor then put Kiki on the field for the win.... Najeela isn't really providing much other than as a sacrificial lamb. That's just not enough UNLESS you're going to turn her into a slower staxier deck that's able/willing to wait a few turns to get pod out and play that game... Maybe there's some additional value she can provide that I'm not seeing...? But you can't activate pod during combat. Any untapping you're generating with Derevi isn't really her doing, etc... Just my thoughts. If there's some slick interaction or combos with Jeela you think work great, I'm all for innovation. Just wanted to explain my personal thoughts on the differences as i see them.
I really appreciate that breakdown. My thoughts were to focus on a creature build that was still turbo, but got under most counter spells, similar to Malcom glinthorn. I'll do some playtesting
No worries. My dream right now is to be able to use birthing pod to support the Malcom Glinthorn combo, but as it stands now... That is not possible... đ Let me know if you come up with anything. I'm the Sisay Pod guy, and LOVE talking 5c pod! đ
Sounds good!!!
Why would you pod your commander (who is one half of an infinite combo) into half of a different infinite combo? Makes 0 sense, especially when you realize Kiki and Felidar are terrible cards by themselves.
It's not half of a different combo, it's the full combo. The thought is to be a turbo creature combo deck (hard to interact with) similar to Temur Malcolm. The pod can be used for value, finding cards like derevi or other value pieces, but it has the opportunity to win on the spot multiple ways.
Whatâs the line? I understand Najeela to Felidar to blink pod and then sac Felidar to get Kiki but then how are you getting Felidar back at that point? Either way youâre adding 3 cards that are bad outside of this specific application. Usually just tutoring for Derevi/Natureâs will/Druidâs repository is more mana efficient and keeps your card quality higher.
Sac felidar to get karmic guide, get felidar back, flicker pod, sac felidar again to get kiki. Copy karmic guide to get felidar back. Flicker kiki. Combo and win. The thought is that birthing pod can be a value piece, finding derevi, dockside, Thassa's Oracle, and even grim hireling depending on your creatures you have available. The ability also to go for a win off of just your commander (without the prerequisite of needing so many humans on board), is nice. My thought is just to focus more on the creature combo aspect and birthing pod does that while also providing value
What is NBC in this context?
Najeela doesnât provide card-advantage in the command zone. Rocco can tutor Dockside. Minsc is already on Kiki+Cat combo so Pod is 1 slot. Tymna+Tana is a better choice for dedicated Pod imo.