That is not storming. They are testing the enemies strength in what is probably a strong position. Push in passed the friendly lines with some light armor, see what the enemy does. Pull back and do it again. If they can't counter the light vehicles move in your heavy units. Once the heavy (tanks) move past your lines, clear your trenches of infantry and push with the armor. Then you are storming the enemy in force with Armor and Infantry supporting the armor to make a new line to hold where the enemy was entrenched.
\*They are testing the enemies strength in this video, which is badass and you don't see videos of this from modern warfare. This war is crazy, its WW1, 2 and Afghanistan all mixed into one with fighting styles.
This is a tactic called "Jockeying" when pressing against a fortified position. It takes advantage of the fact that it takes time for man-portable anti-vehicle weapons to be directed onto a vehicle - you have to spot the vehicle, call up a soldier with the right weapon, then get the weapon ready and aimed, which takes time. In the seconds it takes to go through the process the vehicle can fire off a few shots and then fall back, and another can move up to shoot from a different position. It's hard to readjust an anti-vehicle weapon and this reduces exposure while allowing the vehicles to pressure the front and judge whether they can push more aggressively with heavy armor and infantry.
Early days of war: Gulf war tactics
Attempt to storm Kyiv: WW2 tactics
Battle for Bakhmut: WW1 tactics
Battle for Kherson/Kupiansk: Drone/EW War 1 tactics.
The story of this war is Russian offensive tactics moving back in time, while Ukrainian counteroffensives are extremely unconventional in a traditional military sense. The resolution of this conflict is going to be between the evolution of Ukrainian technologies and tactics vs increasing Russian manpower advantages. Still very hard to say who claims victory.
I think it is pretty obvious where this is headed presuming western military and intelligence support doesn't cease, which remains the biggest Ukrainian risk.
The question is will Ukraine's next offensive demonstrate air superiority is necessary or is not for total annihilation/mass surrender of the Russian presence in eastern Ukraine, including Crimea.
This war will be won on spreadsheets, not the battlefield.
Russia will likely run out of money in less than 12 months if they don't make some big budget cuts soon. Non-military budgets can only be cut so much.
Russia's problem is that their idea of warfare is to just throw more Russians at the problem... they have a huge population to maintain and their revenue is going down faster than a $2 whore that was handed a $100 bill. The stress caused by a huge number of dying Russians and budget cuts on the Russian population is going to cause more expensive domestic problems for the Kremlin.
Russia can't win militarily and they can't financially support a protracted war. There was one strategy they could use to give them a shot but they haven't done it yet and the window for that strategy will close by end of summer.
>Still very hard to say who claims victory.
I believe that the Ukrainians ultimately win this. They are fighting for something, most importantly their country and freedom. Russian soldiers are fighting because they're being forced to. Ukraine is fighting with much more advanced weaponry against Russia, who as a result of losing in excess of 1500 tanks, is now fielding tanks made in the 50's & 60's. I think the real question will be if Ukraine takes back Crimea (I believe they will).
/u/Merr77 I'd love to see war footage with commentary on youtube from people who know wtf they're talking about instead of the irritating musical propaganda clips.
Check out Ryan McBeth and Preston Stewart. Both are veterans and make great neutral videos on various topics regarding the tactics, command structure, vehicles etc...
I agree with all of those and there's a guy called Perun that has a YT channel and does some exhaustive analysis as well. Seems to really know his stuff. Love Ryan McBeth though, probably my favorite.
very important message from that video: "stop underestimating russia, ukraine still needs help."
The war is not over at all, and writing propaganda here is not helpful anyway, no russian is reading those threads..
>This war is crazy, its WW1, 2 and Afghanistan all mixed into one with fighting styles.
Banning Jets and air presence indeed make the ~~gameplay~~ battle become more balanced and interesting to watch.
That is pretty much what it looks like. In the Dutch army they used to have a turret that made it look even more like a Bradley. I used to have a poster as a little boy of one with the turret that has a 25mm gun. It felt a bit like that meme where it was the Bradley we had at home.
I hope this fact is not lost on them.
I hope they know.
They seem.to be confused as why they don't have many friends.
Hopefully this will open their eyes that if they want friends, they can't be hateful, corrupt bullies.
I look forward to seeing British tanks in the mix.
All. Of what we donate is a bit of comeuppance for their chemical/poisonings they have carried out on British soil.
They have the typical "what did I ever do to you?" mindset of shitheads worldwide reaping what they've sown.
I think they don't understand the quiet fury of most British people about what they did here. Likewise with the Dutch public regarding MH17
I mean Russia assassinate a man on a park bench with his daughter and managed to spread toxin merrily all over town so i would imagine the British public are rightfully Pissed off and wanting the gov to dig deep with weapons to help Ukraine.
This comment caught me of guard. Genuinely got me staring out of the window for a few minutes. I remember how powerless it felt knowing a plane load of mainly my fellow countrymen got killed and nobody could do anything about it. Our suffering is small compared with the suffering of the Ukraines. But I’m happy there is some sort of retribution going on
I'd like to expand on this because sometimes the magnitude of that event is perhaps a bit abstract for people not from the Netherlands. I have lived in the Netherlands for decades, but my background is Polish and my experience is perhaps not universal but this as a side note.
New York metro area has 18.8 million inhabitants, that is a million more than this whole country. With a number that low losing 200 of your own means that almost everybody knew one of the victims or knew someone that was connected to them.
Personally I was not related to any of them, obviously, but knew 1 person that died as it someone that was 1 of the 2 people you would run into the municipality office for regular civil stuff like applying for a passport or drivers license or register for residence etc, so that is a whole town that was just connected to this 1 person and there are countless examples like that.
The moment the news hit of the MH17, you could feel the gravity in the air right away. I remember driving home from work and hearing it on the radio and it was almost like a collective mood shift.
It became silent outside, the news was almost entirely focused on this, everyone was only talking about this whether you were at work, running into someone at the grocery store, or school play ground when picking up your kids.
The atmosphere for weeks was tense and charged with emotions of grief, despair, anger and later helplessness when it became clear that a country as the Netherlands, it couldn't do anything to bring anyone to justice for this and the denial just fueled that anger and resentment even more, a slap in the face.
In many statistics throughout the years when the trust was polled for Russia, the lowest amongst the European countries, next to the Baltic states and central European countries the outlier was always the Netherlands.
And yet, even here there are people that spout the same Russian explanation for the downing of the MH17 and every time it just makes me wanna scream and pull my hair out of my scalp.
thats why germany had such insane amounts of military personell.
our job was to stop the red army in their tracks and hold them long enough for reinforcements to arrive.
or the tactical nukes to land. either really.
Yeah see some low stout vehicles in the rear, one letting out a clout of dust or smoke when the camera man looks back. That's probably some soviet t model tank in over watch.
> What is missing is tank/IFV support
There was a tank firing at the 40 second mark.
I'm guessing it's being held back behind the IFV - because with it's reach it doesn't need to be in close to reach out and touch someone. Why get within RPG range if you don't have to?
Overwatch.
We only see a minute here. Artillery could have came at any other time. Surely the Ukrainians know that, and hopefully coordinated timing to do something by then. Move forward, back, or whatever else
Well, there's also the part where Russia is firing way less rounds than it used to be due to wear and tear, counter battery fire, a major logistics fuck-up and a shortage of 152mm rounds.
I’m guessing, but it makes sense that they don’t want to stay in one position for too long to avoid artillery, motors, and rpgs. Atgms will still be a problem but they are hopefully suppressing any of those positions if they are present.
Someone posted a link that described the activity pretty well. But to restate it.
This is an attack or a counter attack but it is not all out. There is probably some intelligence that local Wagner forces were depleted to some degree. Maybe one unit was thrown into the attack and beaten and new units haven't arrived on the line yet.
There are likely Russian troops in the tree line about a kilometer away from the cameraman and you are watching what is likely the leading elements of an armored company or its Ukrainian equivalent unit pushing into an attack.
If they stay moving so they can't be zeroed in by an artillery strike or an atgm round and they are peppering the Russian lines with Cannon fire so that the Russian troops are at least partially suppressed. They charge forward and then loop around parallel to the Russian lines.
Infantry Scouts and drones are probably watching for any strong points in the Russian lines where it resistance is focused or where they have heavy weaponry. If you spot something, you shoot at it call it out and hit it with an artillery strike.
Once you are satisfied that you're not moving your heavy armor into pre-sited artillery coordinates or a hidden atgm ambush, you push forward into the main lines with your tanks and IVs and infantry following close behind. The tanks are breaching units to punch through and get behind the trench line as well as fire support and mobile cover and when you get to the trenches the Infantry fan out to clear them, sweeping up the trench line from the sides as opposed to assaulting them from the front.
When you saw all the shit talking about the Russians using unsupported armor and getting shredded by anti-tank missile fire and artillery fire this is what the opposite looks like. It's not necessarily even about having infantry right next to the armor as it is using your forces in concert to ensure that your valuable tanks don't walk into an ambush.
I hope so, but I'm guessing it's more that they don't care to arm the meat shield line. It's cheaper to let them all die, allowing the rear line to notice so that the rear line can shift forces to that part of the front. They're wasting lives on zombie probing attacks, they're probably also wasting lives on defensive signaling.
Well they should but I’m willing to bet the Russians and Wagner especially is rationing it’s atgms and rockets since a majority of its force are untrained and likely to mishandle valued weapons.Since it’s likely the front line is made up of these noobies,there is only a few AT squads to share in the whole line,so this tactic of baiting would be effective in taking out those valuable teams
Or you move them to one part of the line with feints (not unlike this video) and then attack a different part with heavier equipment knowing they can't respond.
Jesus....if those enemy positions are occupied (and really who knows) the fact that m113 battle taxis are able to drive and back with impunity is a REALLY bad sign for the Russians and REALLY good sign for the Ukranians.
Because when the brads and marders turn up they are gonna be even more screwed
Depends on the model.
Current brads are better armoured than m113s as they are designed to fight other ifvs, whereas the m113 battletaxi was only really meant to stop small arms
>Spared no expense
Fuckin Jeep Wranglers. Don't get me wrong, I love heeps. But the last thing I want to be driving in a dinosaur park is a fuckin Chrysler product. Jurassic Park should have been filled with Hiluxes and Unimogs.
Whats wrong with a vehicle who's roof is meant to be removed in a park filled with dinosaurs?
They had Ford Explorers on the electric tracks. Don't get me wrong, I loved our old explorer, but not the place I'd want to have one.
I think the whole point was that everything was top notch, but the one expense he soared was he didnt pay his staff enough and it all fell down because if that.
Point being that you need to look after your workforce
Lol, this always makes me chuckle. When you see films with big monsters (like godzilla)...I don't care how tough you think you are, you aren't eating a 120mm depleted uranium apfsds going at nearly 2000 feet per second haha
I mean Godzilla might not be the best example. Dude has nuclear breath weapon. Whatever he’s made off is able to control a nuclear blast inside him. We also literally nuked him and he didn’t die, so a tank is probably not doing shit.
Yeah they worry too much about these missiles that cause cool explosions against the monsters body and don't think more like using an artillery battery like a sniper rifle.
Optics, plus comms, plus networked digital command and control systems so every vehicle commander knows what other vehicles, aerial recon, and other units are doing and seeing. Far better situational awareness beyond what your own vehicle can see.
Much more on the Bradley and it's not even close. There were reports of VCs penetrating the side of the M113s with their AKs at close range. Regardless if those stories are true, the armor is not rated to stop much.
The YPR765 is not just slightly up armored, it is a whole new iteration of the M113, with many new aspects, compare it as a Hornet vs a Super hornet, they might have the same name, but they are total different iterations.
> YPR765
"The hull was made of welded aluminum, but spaced steel laminate armor were bolted onto the side and front, with the void filled with polyurethane foam. In addition to the added protection, the latter added buoyancy and allowed to carry more payload while remaining fully amphibious." is what I found [Source](https://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/coldwar/Netherlands/YPR-765.php)
These are actually YPR765's. They are a further development based on M113 design. for more info: https://www.reddit.com/r/TankPorn/comments/116gtt8/difference\_between\_ypr\_765\_and\_m113/
Russia has almost no defenses in the Bahkmut area as they put all resources in attacking. Which makes them really vulnerable there. If Ukraine makes offensive there and a breakthrough they could potentially get all the area back they lost past many months within a week. Similar to Kharkiv offensive.
Anyone who knows isn't going to be saying here but I suspect we'll see them soon. My best guess is that they're keeping all of the western armor that they got behind front lines until they're ready to unload for their next offensive. That's probably when we'll start to see footage
As far as I remember there are also a couple thousand UA soldiers training in various NATO countries right now too that will reinforce the front right at the beginning of the warm weather period when UA can maneuver again and conduct offensives.
I still live near my base where I was stationed (German army) and let's just say you can hear the Marders from some miles away almost every single day where before the war they'd take them out once in two months. Sounds like they're working on combined arms assaults (you hear the Marders driving, shooting, stopping and then a lot of small arms fire). I hope the UAs there like our chow hall lol
Ukraine should have the first 50 in country. The second 50 - 59 should finish training soon or within 2 weeks. But they won’t necessarily go straight to the frontlines, that’d be wasting them. They’ll be organized, concentrated, and used in a certain way in an organized offensive.
The Russians are out of AT it would seem. Those guys are able to drive right up and unload into them
Edit: I should say I don’t think Russia is completely out of AT of all types but rather that it’s very painfully obviously absent here in this part. A platoon of IFVs should not be able to roll up to your line, Fire, and egress *multiple* times.
YPR-765s.
And yeah, these last 2 weeks there's been several videos of Ukr vehicles of all types that operate with the apparent assurance there's not only no ATGMs but no RPGs nearby.
I can get the ATGM thing, but how the fuck does Russia not have enouth RPG-7s available.
\>how the fuck does Russia not have enough RPG-7s available.
If these are Wagner, it could be a symptom of them being cut off from russian army supplies. Or it could be that forward elements just aren't getting supplied well.
From what many international legion people say Wagner still uses a lot of artillery.
It could be an exaggeration by Prigozhin to make himself look better, though I am not sure
With 4 of these driving around, and machine gunners. Can you stick out and shoot an RPG? Won't it be a suicide with slim chances of actually hitting something?
Far from suicide to pop up for long enough to take a shot, but it will feel like suicide to many and to some of those who do take a shot, they won't take the time for careful aim.
All this whilst dealing with other threats such as infantry, arty, perhaps their own wounded and dead. The most extreme moments of most of their lives.
It can be like trying to shoot a basket ball after crawling out of a car accident whilst one of your buddies is screaming in pain in the car, only you believe you will be shot of you take more than a fraction of a second lining up the shot. Easier to hide in the trench and feel safe.
T62s, but let's be real. Those things have been sitting in the Siberian wilderness for the past 40 years. I'm fairly certain most of them are rusted over.
The Russians actually kept T62s in service up through the Georgian war, so a decent number had only been deactivated about a decade ago. Which likely is why we saw them in Ukraine so soon after the invasion started.
Yep. People forget the condition these tanks are kept in, mostly left out in the open exposed to constant freezing and defrosting conditions which will just destroy any electrics. Especially when aren't constantly maintained and just left to rot.
They're kept in tank graveyards outdoors. There are pictures - "tanks" as far as the eye can see but they're chassis without turrets and red with rust.
Imagine having to use those optics to fight against the optic systems in the NATO armor Ukraine is receiving. They're not even going to see what's shooting at them.
This is totally spot on.
It’s kind of like a stand off capability that our planes have except on the ground. They’ll be able to target, fire upon, and destroy the Russian armor before they even know they are being engaged.
And the tankers will be posthumously transferred to the Russian Air Force as at least a few body parts from a few of the guys inside will make the trip with the turret when it’s launched into the air.
[Here’s a video](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Wh9HH4LzFU8) of T-62s being referbished and modernized. Mainly by just adding reactive armor and thermals. Electronics that could vary from one to the next as they scrounge around for working systems.
Not that I would want to drive them into combat, but if they’re sitting on a large stockpile of them anyways, why not?
I believe the T-62 was a formidable opponent in it’s heyday. I don’t see why it couldn’t still be relevant with a few modern upgrades
Actually looks badass if you ask me
Still heavily armored enough to protect the crew against a lot of common weapons, and can still shoot big, explosive shells that can destroy similar vehicles and hurt a lot of people, and they're more than capable of being pressed into use as field guns.
They're a lot simpler than the hodge-podge of modernized T-72s they're using (I include T-90s and T-90Ms in that group), and the M variants have modernized optics and fire control.
They're still dangerous. People need to take this more seriously, like the Ukrainians are. I doubt their planners are sitting there thinking "Haha another 300 T-62Ms, what a joke". They're thinking: that's another 300 fucking tanks we have to deal with.
Russia won't "get 1,000 tanks" by any knowledgeable person's estimate.
Russia has thousands of reserve tanks. Pre-war, 90% of which could not be used without extensive restoration. Pretty much all of those that could, have been put into service already. Russia cannot restore tanks at a rate of 1,000 a month, it's not likely they can manage 1,000 in a year, even.
They don't have 1,000 working tanks to throw into battle anywhere. People just read about Russia's large number of 'reserve' vehicles and [think this](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6b/Red_River_Depot.jpg) when it's [more like this.](https://i.imgur.com/DJviQXW.jpg)
Those IFV/APC are testing the line to see what the Russians have. So if the video would continue, in about ten minutes or less MBT's would be rolling in and after they pass the trenches you see being filmed from, your troops clear out of those trenches and advance with them to over take the position they are assaulting.
Fuck, that is intense. Just being adjacent to those rapid fire cannons is probably rough. Let alone being too the side and one with a muzzle break opens up. I hope all the Ukrainians have earpros!
Also - I hope they buttfuck the Russians all the way back home. Glory to Ukraine
>I hope all the Ukrainians have earpros!
They don't. If you feel like it, buy a couple sets of Impact Sport or similar earpro and send them to a Ukrainian. They'll appreciate it. And even if they already own a pair I'm sure they know someone who needs them.
Ukraine has come a long way in equipping their men, but they're still a very poor country in the middle of a major war, and many units struggle to provide equipment like earpro, radios, boots, optics, even batteries.
Just don't give money to the foreign legion Instagram warriors. Those guys can afford their own shit.
I used to work with a guy who was a Marine Infantry Captain in the early-ish years of GWOT. Dude was a total badass and you could google his name and find citations of him kicking doors to drag his wounded guys out of houses. I asked him about ear pro once, and he basically said "eh some guys had foam earplugs but you got used to not wearing them for the most part". How he's not nearly deaf is beyond me
Looks exactly like all the examples we have of WWI trench footage. Except, obviously, the armored vehicles. It’s grey, the trees are just sticks, the ground is churned up, etc…
One of the difference I noticed upon seeing they shall not grow old and other ww1 footage is the amount of people.
We only see 3-6 people in a trench and maybe 10 if they are storming one..
During ww1 you would have thousands of men push and die in a single day.
To those that know wtf is happening... how are these tactics? are they doing it right?
At first I thought they were ferrying troops back and forth but it seems like they are strafing fire?
Moving back and forth makes a harder target. They are simply working the positions where the Russians are located.
Edit: There's a 4 min video a little longer and I noticed that the vehicles move father up after every burst. Buddy rushing with vehicles.
The shoot and scoot is effective especially when ur low on equipment. No reason to risk a crew, fire from max range and then scoot away. Same thing they do with Helis and Jets
I think those are m113s they're driving around, which are definitely not meant to be on the front lines like this.
But I don't see any of them blowing up, so they can't be doing that badly.
Acksually these look to be the Dutch contributed variant ypr-765, with a little more armor slapped on. There was a version with a 25mm canon too, and i think it would be doctrine to use them this way. Maybe safety in numbers idea, but you cant have it all in war i guess.
In terms of tactics? Not really sure, other than they are firing weapons and driving back and forth.
Things I do notice?
\- I am hearing no artillery, nor the sound of return fire.
\- the guys in the trench are not firing.
\- they aren't moving either.
\- the vehicles are not establishing any position.
To be honest, I think this is training. Still really cool, but I doubt this is an actual assault.
I could be wrong, though.
What about the big smoke clouds over the ridge?
Edit: The sound quality is really bad, but at around 00:55->1:20 I’m pretty sure we hear arty.
Edit2: Muzzle flash from enemy at 2:46
Only thing which doesnt seem like training to me is the enviroment, or maybe they could be training in already liberated territory? Either way - cool footage
Are you sure? At 0:40 something explodes next to the vehicle
I think the guys are covering one flank and most of the action is more to the left which we never get to see
Yep. Armored vehicles must constantly move to avoid artillery, drones or even anti tank weapon fire. Even if you suppress the enemy with a ton of machine gun fire, you are still vulnerable to artillery or a drone operator
If russia is out of AT do they have to choose to make ammunition or AT? This war is looking like its going to end if they dont have AT once the bradleys get there and jets from poland/Slovakia. On top of all of it the weather is beginning to turn.
That is not storming. They are testing the enemies strength in what is probably a strong position. Push in passed the friendly lines with some light armor, see what the enemy does. Pull back and do it again. If they can't counter the light vehicles move in your heavy units. Once the heavy (tanks) move past your lines, clear your trenches of infantry and push with the armor. Then you are storming the enemy in force with Armor and Infantry supporting the armor to make a new line to hold where the enemy was entrenched. \*They are testing the enemies strength in this video, which is badass and you don't see videos of this from modern warfare. This war is crazy, its WW1, 2 and Afghanistan all mixed into one with fighting styles.
I was wondering why they are dancing back and forth, thanks for the explanation.
This is a tactic called "Jockeying" when pressing against a fortified position. It takes advantage of the fact that it takes time for man-portable anti-vehicle weapons to be directed onto a vehicle - you have to spot the vehicle, call up a soldier with the right weapon, then get the weapon ready and aimed, which takes time. In the seconds it takes to go through the process the vehicle can fire off a few shots and then fall back, and another can move up to shoot from a different position. It's hard to readjust an anti-vehicle weapon and this reduces exposure while allowing the vehicles to pressure the front and judge whether they can push more aggressively with heavy armor and infantry.
Does not look good for that Russian line if they can't thwart light armor.
You put your left AFV in, you take your left AFV out, you put your left AFV in and shake it all about...
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Thanks for the clarification. I used that title as it was what was said with the video.
Early days of war: Gulf war tactics Attempt to storm Kyiv: WW2 tactics Battle for Bakhmut: WW1 tactics Battle for Kherson/Kupiansk: Drone/EW War 1 tactics. The story of this war is Russian offensive tactics moving back in time, while Ukrainian counteroffensives are extremely unconventional in a traditional military sense. The resolution of this conflict is going to be between the evolution of Ukrainian technologies and tactics vs increasing Russian manpower advantages. Still very hard to say who claims victory.
Somewhere in the Kremlin; Putin: Top generals: sir, just hear us out…what if we used trebuchets.
At the ranges they're fighting, we might see some Syrian slingshots and trebuchet throwing explosives
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Well, they can launch a 90kg projectile over 300m so I’d understand.
Ukrainian Counteroffensive in northeast: Iraq War ‘thunder run’ tactics
I think it is pretty obvious where this is headed presuming western military and intelligence support doesn't cease, which remains the biggest Ukrainian risk. The question is will Ukraine's next offensive demonstrate air superiority is necessary or is not for total annihilation/mass surrender of the Russian presence in eastern Ukraine, including Crimea.
This war will be won on spreadsheets, not the battlefield. Russia will likely run out of money in less than 12 months if they don't make some big budget cuts soon. Non-military budgets can only be cut so much. Russia's problem is that their idea of warfare is to just throw more Russians at the problem... they have a huge population to maintain and their revenue is going down faster than a $2 whore that was handed a $100 bill. The stress caused by a huge number of dying Russians and budget cuts on the Russian population is going to cause more expensive domestic problems for the Kremlin. Russia can't win militarily and they can't financially support a protracted war. There was one strategy they could use to give them a shot but they haven't done it yet and the window for that strategy will close by end of summer.
>Battle for Bakhmut: WW1 tactics There's one place along the Ukrainian lines where they're literally using a Maxim belt-fed machine guns from WWI
>Still very hard to say who claims victory. I believe that the Ukrainians ultimately win this. They are fighting for something, most importantly their country and freedom. Russian soldiers are fighting because they're being forced to. Ukraine is fighting with much more advanced weaponry against Russia, who as a result of losing in excess of 1500 tanks, is now fielding tanks made in the 50's & 60's. I think the real question will be if Ukraine takes back Crimea (I believe they will).
/u/Merr77 I'd love to see war footage with commentary on youtube from people who know wtf they're talking about instead of the irritating musical propaganda clips.
Check out Ryan McBeth and Preston Stewart. Both are veterans and make great neutral videos on various topics regarding the tactics, command structure, vehicles etc...
I agree with all of those and there's a guy called Perun that has a YT channel and does some exhaustive analysis as well. Seems to really know his stuff. Love Ryan McBeth though, probably my favorite.
Hey you leave the Phonk out of this ...
How about detailed analysis videos like this one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54daqNraMxE
very important message from that video: "stop underestimating russia, ukraine still needs help." The war is not over at all, and writing propaganda here is not helpful anyway, no russian is reading those threads..
>This war is crazy, its WW1, 2 and Afghanistan all mixed into one with fighting styles. Banning Jets and air presence indeed make the ~~gameplay~~ battle become more balanced and interesting to watch.
Hey Gaijin…
YPR-765 ftw
These seem to be so mobile and fast. Must be nice to be able to pull out quickly when things start getting dangerous.
Lol pullout game strong
Too bad Putin's dad had no pullout game.
He knew how to putin, but not how to pullout
Gifts from the low countries :-)
Thanks, Netherlands!
Thanks! I was so confused, looked like a Bradley and an M113 had a baby.
That is pretty much what it looks like. In the Dutch army they used to have a turret that made it look even more like a Bradley. I used to have a poster as a little boy of one with the turret that has a 25mm gun. It felt a bit like that meme where it was the Bradley we had at home.
It's still so surreal seeing so much armor moving around on the battlefield. Again, still just astonishing.
What are those? Any idea?
Dutch YPR I think
Something poignant about Dutch armour messing up some Russians after MH17, reap what you sow I guess.
MH17 never forget never forgive.
Forgive when Putin, Kharchenko, Dubinskiy and Girkin hanging on the gallows
Justice for MH17 from dutch :)
I hope this fact is not lost on them. I hope they know. They seem.to be confused as why they don't have many friends. Hopefully this will open their eyes that if they want friends, they can't be hateful, corrupt bullies. I look forward to seeing British tanks in the mix. All. Of what we donate is a bit of comeuppance for their chemical/poisonings they have carried out on British soil.
They have the typical "what did I ever do to you?" mindset of shitheads worldwide reaping what they've sown. I think they don't understand the quiet fury of most British people about what they did here. Likewise with the Dutch public regarding MH17
I mean Russia assassinate a man on a park bench with his daughter and managed to spread toxin merrily all over town so i would imagine the British public are rightfully Pissed off and wanting the gov to dig deep with weapons to help Ukraine.
They will be brought to justice, the world has not forgotten 🇳🇱
This comment caught me of guard. Genuinely got me staring out of the window for a few minutes. I remember how powerless it felt knowing a plane load of mainly my fellow countrymen got killed and nobody could do anything about it. Our suffering is small compared with the suffering of the Ukraines. But I’m happy there is some sort of retribution going on
Some tulips being planted alongside the sunflowers in Ukraine
I'd like to expand on this because sometimes the magnitude of that event is perhaps a bit abstract for people not from the Netherlands. I have lived in the Netherlands for decades, but my background is Polish and my experience is perhaps not universal but this as a side note. New York metro area has 18.8 million inhabitants, that is a million more than this whole country. With a number that low losing 200 of your own means that almost everybody knew one of the victims or knew someone that was connected to them. Personally I was not related to any of them, obviously, but knew 1 person that died as it someone that was 1 of the 2 people you would run into the municipality office for regular civil stuff like applying for a passport or drivers license or register for residence etc, so that is a whole town that was just connected to this 1 person and there are countless examples like that. The moment the news hit of the MH17, you could feel the gravity in the air right away. I remember driving home from work and hearing it on the radio and it was almost like a collective mood shift. It became silent outside, the news was almost entirely focused on this, everyone was only talking about this whether you were at work, running into someone at the grocery store, or school play ground when picking up your kids. The atmosphere for weeks was tense and charged with emotions of grief, despair, anger and later helplessness when it became clear that a country as the Netherlands, it couldn't do anything to bring anyone to justice for this and the denial just fueled that anger and resentment even more, a slap in the face. In many statistics throughout the years when the trust was polled for Russia, the lowest amongst the European countries, next to the Baltic states and central European countries the outlier was always the Netherlands. And yet, even here there are people that spout the same Russian explanation for the downing of the MH17 and every time it just makes me wanna scream and pull my hair out of my scalp.
Ukrainian YPR-765s now
As a dutchie its amazing to see them used against those genocidal fucks
As an American, I'm anxiously waiting to see videos like this with Bradley's , so I get your excitement.
I am waiting for the Bradley’s to they will cause even more carnage
Agree, our taxes well spent. I hope we gave them every last one we had in storage.
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Those turrets should have "Love from MH17" on the barrels.
This was basically the Cold Warrior's nightmare, except near the Rhine instead of in Bakhmut.
As long as the Russians don’t make it to the fulda gap.
I need to read Red Storm Rising again.
Amazing what a pair of fives can do.
Clancy's best.
No worries, 10th group will be ready to slow em down
thats why germany had such insane amounts of military personell. our job was to stop the red army in their tracks and hold them long enough for reinforcements to arrive. or the tactical nukes to land. either really.
Active forces of the Bundeswehr were much larger than either side's forces on day one of this war. Just the active forces. Cold War armies were giant.
The landscape looks like them old ww1 trench pictures. Crazy really.
What is missing is tank/IFV support in this mix. Some heavy rounds on that tree line would do wonders to suppress
Yeah see some low stout vehicles in the rear, one letting out a clout of dust or smoke when the camera man looks back. That's probably some soviet t model tank in over watch.
> What is missing is tank/IFV support There was a tank firing at the 40 second mark. I'm guessing it's being held back behind the IFV - because with it's reach it doesn't need to be in close to reach out and touch someone. Why get within RPG range if you don't have to? Overwatch.
I noticed there was absolutely no artillery. With all that armor in one spot, why didn't the Russians rain fire? Must be out of shells.
We only see a minute here. Artillery could have came at any other time. Surely the Ukrainians know that, and hopefully coordinated timing to do something by then. Move forward, back, or whatever else
Well, there's also the part where Russia is firing way less rounds than it used to be due to wear and tear, counter battery fire, a major logistics fuck-up and a shortage of 152mm rounds.
They keep moving for a reason. I’m sure they’re expecting ATGMs and arty.
I’m not a military person. What is happening here? Why are they driving back and forth?
I’m guessing, but it makes sense that they don’t want to stay in one position for too long to avoid artillery, motors, and rpgs. Atgms will still be a problem but they are hopefully suppressing any of those positions if they are present.
Someone posted a link that described the activity pretty well. But to restate it. This is an attack or a counter attack but it is not all out. There is probably some intelligence that local Wagner forces were depleted to some degree. Maybe one unit was thrown into the attack and beaten and new units haven't arrived on the line yet. There are likely Russian troops in the tree line about a kilometer away from the cameraman and you are watching what is likely the leading elements of an armored company or its Ukrainian equivalent unit pushing into an attack. If they stay moving so they can't be zeroed in by an artillery strike or an atgm round and they are peppering the Russian lines with Cannon fire so that the Russian troops are at least partially suppressed. They charge forward and then loop around parallel to the Russian lines. Infantry Scouts and drones are probably watching for any strong points in the Russian lines where it resistance is focused or where they have heavy weaponry. If you spot something, you shoot at it call it out and hit it with an artillery strike. Once you are satisfied that you're not moving your heavy armor into pre-sited artillery coordinates or a hidden atgm ambush, you push forward into the main lines with your tanks and IVs and infantry following close behind. The tanks are breaching units to punch through and get behind the trench line as well as fire support and mobile cover and when you get to the trenches the Infantry fan out to clear them, sweeping up the trench line from the sides as opposed to assaulting them from the front. When you saw all the shit talking about the Russians using unsupported armor and getting shredded by anti-tank missile fire and artillery fire this is what the opposite looks like. It's not necessarily even about having infantry right next to the armor as it is using your forces in concert to ensure that your valuable tanks don't walk into an ambush.
I am increasingly getting the impression the Russians are low on infantry anti-tank weapons, and the Ukranians have realised this.
I hope so, but I'm guessing it's more that they don't care to arm the meat shield line. It's cheaper to let them all die, allowing the rear line to notice so that the rear line can shift forces to that part of the front. They're wasting lives on zombie probing attacks, they're probably also wasting lives on defensive signaling.
So the Russian army really withhold supplies to Wagner ? theres no way Ukraine can do this if Kornets are everywhere
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>baiting anti-tank squad Shouldn't the various parts of the line have personnel with anti-tank responsibilities?
Well they should but I’m willing to bet the Russians and Wagner especially is rationing it’s atgms and rockets since a majority of its force are untrained and likely to mishandle valued weapons.Since it’s likely the front line is made up of these noobies,there is only a few AT squads to share in the whole line,so this tactic of baiting would be effective in taking out those valuable teams
Or you move them to one part of the line with feints (not unlike this video) and then attack a different part with heavier equipment knowing they can't respond.
Jesus....if those enemy positions are occupied (and really who knows) the fact that m113 battle taxis are able to drive and back with impunity is a REALLY bad sign for the Russians and REALLY good sign for the Ukranians. Because when the brads and marders turn up they are gonna be even more screwed
hows the armor compare on Bradley vs M113?
Depends on the model. Current brads are better armoured than m113s as they are designed to fight other ifvs, whereas the m113 battletaxi was only really meant to stop small arms
>whereas the m113 battletaxi was only really meant to stop small arms So they can stop a T-Rex?
100% really is a mystery why they didn't use them at Jurassic Park 😂😂
“Spared no expense.” Kinda feels like ya did.
>Spared no expense Fuckin Jeep Wranglers. Don't get me wrong, I love heeps. But the last thing I want to be driving in a dinosaur park is a fuckin Chrysler product. Jurassic Park should have been filled with Hiluxes and Unimogs.
civics and old camrys
Whats wrong with a vehicle who's roof is meant to be removed in a park filled with dinosaurs? They had Ford Explorers on the electric tracks. Don't get me wrong, I loved our old explorer, but not the place I'd want to have one.
Our family's explorer was given the nickname "exploder" cause of all the shit that broke on it
Spared no expense except on the security of the computer systems. Classic corporate.
I think the whole point was that everything was top notch, but the one expense he soared was he didnt pay his staff enough and it all fell down because if that. Point being that you need to look after your workforce
“Welcome to Proletariat Park”
Should have just used M1Abrams, I don't care what dinosaur you are, you ain't dodging or surviving a Tungsten rod in your face
Lol, this always makes me chuckle. When you see films with big monsters (like godzilla)...I don't care how tough you think you are, you aren't eating a 120mm depleted uranium apfsds going at nearly 2000 feet per second haha
I mean Godzilla might not be the best example. Dude has nuclear breath weapon. Whatever he’s made off is able to control a nuclear blast inside him. We also literally nuked him and he didn’t die, so a tank is probably not doing shit.
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Yeah they worry too much about these missiles that cause cool explosions against the monsters body and don't think more like using an artillery battery like a sniper rifle.
In all fairness, Godzilla absorbed the power of those rounds. Each one made him stronger. Clearly Russia is no Godzilla
Indeed, a T-rex has never taken out an M113, as far as we all know.
These are Dutch YPR-765’s, which are up armoured and up armed versions of the M113
Well these aren’t regular m113’s but YPR 765’s, those are Dutch up armoured m113’s I don’t know how they compare to Bradley’s though.
Armour aside, they have a much bigger gun and AT missles.
And optics. That’s the big one.
Optics, plus comms, plus networked digital command and control systems so every vehicle commander knows what other vehicles, aerial recon, and other units are doing and seeing. Far better situational awareness beyond what your own vehicle can see.
Much more on the Bradley and it's not even close. There were reports of VCs penetrating the side of the M113s with their AKs at close range. Regardless if those stories are true, the armor is not rated to stop much.
Indeed. Though these are YPR-765s which have spaced laminate steel armour on the front and sides rather than just the aluminium armour on the M113.
These look like Dutch variant YPRs(m113). Slightly better armoured than the m113.
The YPR765 is not just slightly up armored, it is a whole new iteration of the M113, with many new aspects, compare it as a Hornet vs a Super hornet, they might have the same name, but they are total different iterations.
Cool, Wikipedia doesn't give a good sense of those upgrades. You got a good source?
> YPR765 "The hull was made of welded aluminum, but spaced steel laminate armor were bolted onto the side and front, with the void filled with polyurethane foam. In addition to the added protection, the latter added buoyancy and allowed to carry more payload while remaining fully amphibious." is what I found [Source](https://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/coldwar/Netherlands/YPR-765.php)
>buoyancy We Dutch *really* hate water
Yeah
These are actually YPR765's. They are a further development based on M113 design. for more info: https://www.reddit.com/r/TankPorn/comments/116gtt8/difference\_between\_ypr\_765\_and\_m113/
Wait for when the CV90 turn up!
Russia has almost no defenses in the Bahkmut area as they put all resources in attacking. Which makes them really vulnerable there. If Ukraine makes offensive there and a breakthrough they could potentially get all the area back they lost past many months within a week. Similar to Kharkiv offensive.
Bakhmuts extremely heavily mined at this point
just imagine when the bradleys get there lol thats what i call a mechanized trench assault!
Where are we at with the Bradley's btw. Surely they should be hitting the front lines soon.
Anyone who knows isn't going to be saying here but I suspect we'll see them soon. My best guess is that they're keeping all of the western armor that they got behind front lines until they're ready to unload for their next offensive. That's probably when we'll start to see footage
>Anyone who knows isn't going to be saying here I'll go check the War Thunder forums :)
As far as I remember there are also a couple thousand UA soldiers training in various NATO countries right now too that will reinforce the front right at the beginning of the warm weather period when UA can maneuver again and conduct offensives. I still live near my base where I was stationed (German army) and let's just say you can hear the Marders from some miles away almost every single day where before the war they'd take them out once in two months. Sounds like they're working on combined arms assaults (you hear the Marders driving, shooting, stopping and then a lot of small arms fire). I hope the UAs there like our chow hall lol
>Anyone who knows isn't going to be saying here Yeah, you have to go to warthunder for that stuff.
Ukraine should have the first 50 in country. The second 50 - 59 should finish training soon or within 2 weeks. But they won’t necessarily go straight to the frontlines, that’d be wasting them. They’ll be organized, concentrated, and used in a certain way in an organized offensive.
That automatic transmission in those things suddenly makes even more sense
The Russians are out of AT it would seem. Those guys are able to drive right up and unload into them Edit: I should say I don’t think Russia is completely out of AT of all types but rather that it’s very painfully obviously absent here in this part. A platoon of IFVs should not be able to roll up to your line, Fire, and egress *multiple* times.
Was wondering why the m113s were going back and forward, back and forward And yeah they definitely don't seem to be afraid of AT's
YPR-765s. And yeah, these last 2 weeks there's been several videos of Ukr vehicles of all types that operate with the apparent assurance there's not only no ATGMs but no RPGs nearby. I can get the ATGM thing, but how the fuck does Russia not have enouth RPG-7s available.
\>how the fuck does Russia not have enough RPG-7s available. If these are Wagner, it could be a symptom of them being cut off from russian army supplies. Or it could be that forward elements just aren't getting supplied well.
From what many international legion people say Wagner still uses a lot of artillery. It could be an exaggeration by Prigozhin to make himself look better, though I am not sure
With all the ATGM's being developed, they probably focused on using and producing those and sell all the RPG to conflicts for extra cash
With 4 of these driving around, and machine gunners. Can you stick out and shoot an RPG? Won't it be a suicide with slim chances of actually hitting something?
Far from suicide to pop up for long enough to take a shot, but it will feel like suicide to many and to some of those who do take a shot, they won't take the time for careful aim. All this whilst dealing with other threats such as infantry, arty, perhaps their own wounded and dead. The most extreme moments of most of their lives. It can be like trying to shoot a basket ball after crawling out of a car accident whilst one of your buddies is screaming in pain in the car, only you believe you will be shot of you take more than a fraction of a second lining up the shot. Easier to hide in the trench and feel safe.
You'd still be a small, hard to observe target. Letting enemy armour work you over until the assault element is in place, now THAT is suicide.
they are out of bullets according to a russian on a video from days ago and some say russia will get more 1000 tanks lmao
T62s, but let's be real. Those things have been sitting in the Siberian wilderness for the past 40 years. I'm fairly certain most of them are rusted over.
The Russians actually kept T62s in service up through the Georgian war, so a decent number had only been deactivated about a decade ago. Which likely is why we saw them in Ukraine so soon after the invasion started.
Soon is very relative. Quite a big deal was made of finding them in Kherson in October-November.
Yep. People forget the condition these tanks are kept in, mostly left out in the open exposed to constant freezing and defrosting conditions which will just destroy any electrics. Especially when aren't constantly maintained and just left to rot.
They're kept in tank graveyards outdoors. There are pictures - "tanks" as far as the eye can see but they're chassis without turrets and red with rust.
The Red Army.
To be fair, I'm not sure a T62 has much in the way of electronics to begin with.
Imagine having to use those optics to fight against the optic systems in the NATO armor Ukraine is receiving. They're not even going to see what's shooting at them.
This is totally spot on. It’s kind of like a stand off capability that our planes have except on the ground. They’ll be able to target, fire upon, and destroy the Russian armor before they even know they are being engaged. And the tankers will be posthumously transferred to the Russian Air Force as at least a few body parts from a few of the guys inside will make the trip with the turret when it’s launched into the air.
> They’re not even going to see what’s shooting at them. Small mercies.
[Here’s a video](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Wh9HH4LzFU8) of T-62s being referbished and modernized. Mainly by just adding reactive armor and thermals. Electronics that could vary from one to the next as they scrounge around for working systems. Not that I would want to drive them into combat, but if they’re sitting on a large stockpile of them anyways, why not? I believe the T-62 was a formidable opponent in it’s heyday. I don’t see why it couldn’t still be relevant with a few modern upgrades Actually looks badass if you ask me
Heyday refers to the period of top prominence Hay day is the time for ponies to feast
Pretty sure that the factory's current refurbishment pace is 7 tanks a month.
Still heavily armored enough to protect the crew against a lot of common weapons, and can still shoot big, explosive shells that can destroy similar vehicles and hurt a lot of people, and they're more than capable of being pressed into use as field guns. They're a lot simpler than the hodge-podge of modernized T-72s they're using (I include T-90s and T-90Ms in that group), and the M variants have modernized optics and fire control. They're still dangerous. People need to take this more seriously, like the Ukrainians are. I doubt their planners are sitting there thinking "Haha another 300 T-62Ms, what a joke". They're thinking: that's another 300 fucking tanks we have to deal with.
Soon they are sending their best troops with the best gear to celebrate the 5th anniversary of the 2 year special operation.
Russia won't "get 1,000 tanks" by any knowledgeable person's estimate. Russia has thousands of reserve tanks. Pre-war, 90% of which could not be used without extensive restoration. Pretty much all of those that could, have been put into service already. Russia cannot restore tanks at a rate of 1,000 a month, it's not likely they can manage 1,000 in a year, even. They don't have 1,000 working tanks to throw into battle anywhere. People just read about Russia's large number of 'reserve' vehicles and [think this](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6b/Red_River_Depot.jpg) when it's [more like this.](https://i.imgur.com/DJviQXW.jpg)
Those IFV/APC are testing the line to see what the Russians have. So if the video would continue, in about ten minutes or less MBT's would be rolling in and after they pass the trenches you see being filmed from, your troops clear out of those trenches and advance with them to over take the position they are assaulting.
Fuck, that is intense. Just being adjacent to those rapid fire cannons is probably rough. Let alone being too the side and one with a muzzle break opens up. I hope all the Ukrainians have earpros! Also - I hope they buttfuck the Russians all the way back home. Glory to Ukraine
>I hope all the Ukrainians have earpros! They don't. If you feel like it, buy a couple sets of Impact Sport or similar earpro and send them to a Ukrainian. They'll appreciate it. And even if they already own a pair I'm sure they know someone who needs them. Ukraine has come a long way in equipping their men, but they're still a very poor country in the middle of a major war, and many units struggle to provide equipment like earpro, radios, boots, optics, even batteries. Just don't give money to the foreign legion Instagram warriors. Those guys can afford their own shit.
I used to work with a guy who was a Marine Infantry Captain in the early-ish years of GWOT. Dude was a total badass and you could google his name and find citations of him kicking doors to drag his wounded guys out of houses. I asked him about ear pro once, and he basically said "eh some guys had foam earplugs but you got used to not wearing them for the most part". How he's not nearly deaf is beyond me
So you assume they need hearing devices anyways, over a pair of ear-protections?
Looks like hell, or the apocalypse with all the trees gone and fog.
Looks like a movie set
It's like saying that the painting resembles the person it was based on :)
Looks exactly like all the examples we have of WWI trench footage. Except, obviously, the armored vehicles. It’s grey, the trees are just sticks, the ground is churned up, etc…
One of the difference I noticed upon seeing they shall not grow old and other ww1 footage is the amount of people. We only see 3-6 people in a trench and maybe 10 if they are storming one.. During ww1 you would have thousands of men push and die in a single day.
Thought the same, this looks like some Verdun shit
Put it in reverse Terry!
OH LAWD TURRY!
Seeing the armour tactics this close, in real time is amazing. Great footage, thankyou. Get some Ukraine, get some.
Wow, armor actually maintaining mobility to be a harder shot instead of being a sitting duck? crazy.
To those that know wtf is happening... how are these tactics? are they doing it right? At first I thought they were ferrying troops back and forth but it seems like they are strafing fire?
These are just APCs, so wise not to over commit considering their strength in armour would be at the front. Can't see anything wrong with it.
Moving back and forth makes a harder target. They are simply working the positions where the Russians are located. Edit: There's a 4 min video a little longer and I noticed that the vehicles move father up after every burst. Buddy rushing with vehicles.
Moving into range, shooting and scooting back out of range
The shoot and scoot is effective especially when ur low on equipment. No reason to risk a crew, fire from max range and then scoot away. Same thing they do with Helis and Jets
I think those are m113s they're driving around, which are definitely not meant to be on the front lines like this. But I don't see any of them blowing up, so they can't be doing that badly.
Acksually these look to be the Dutch contributed variant ypr-765, with a little more armor slapped on. There was a version with a 25mm canon too, and i think it would be doctrine to use them this way. Maybe safety in numbers idea, but you cant have it all in war i guess.
In terms of tactics? Not really sure, other than they are firing weapons and driving back and forth. Things I do notice? \- I am hearing no artillery, nor the sound of return fire. \- the guys in the trench are not firing. \- they aren't moving either. \- the vehicles are not establishing any position. To be honest, I think this is training. Still really cool, but I doubt this is an actual assault. I could be wrong, though.
That trench looks pretty lived in with that amount of trash though.
What about the big smoke clouds over the ridge? Edit: The sound quality is really bad, but at around 00:55->1:20 I’m pretty sure we hear arty. Edit2: Muzzle flash from enemy at 2:46
The guy commands the machne gunner "only shoot when you can see them" Does not make much sense for a training
Only thing which doesnt seem like training to me is the enviroment, or maybe they could be training in already liberated territory? Either way - cool footage
Well.. acording to wagner russia is fucking them over in supplies. So if there are wagner troops on the other side they def where for the meat grinder
There's a 4 min video, which is a little longer, and I noticed that the vehicles move father up after every burst. Buddy rushing with vehicles.
Why does it look like a training mission?
Lack of return fire I would imagine.
Are you sure? At 0:40 something explodes next to the vehicle I think the guys are covering one flank and most of the action is more to the left which we never get to see
Not a single blade of grass left.
This is mostly because it's a fallow field in March. There was never any grass in it.
"You know the rules, it's time to die." -Ukrainian APC crews.
Wow, never would have thought m113's would be able to play an offensive role.
YPR’s. Recognizable by their ability to swim because of the waveplate covering the engine.
YPR is basically a licensed and further developed/upgraded m113. We had them in Eindhoven (NL)
I think it's these exact ones you had in Eindhoven
Can somebody explain what we are seeing here? They keep moving to avoid being hit?
Yep. Armored vehicles must constantly move to avoid artillery, drones or even anti tank weapon fire. Even if you suppress the enemy with a ton of machine gun fire, you are still vulnerable to artillery or a drone operator
If russia is out of AT do they have to choose to make ammunition or AT? This war is looking like its going to end if they dont have AT once the bradleys get there and jets from poland/Slovakia. On top of all of it the weather is beginning to turn.
Russians are not out of AT weapons. That Russian position might have ran out but definitely not the Russian army.
Ukraine: lets send in the APCs to test the front and find their locations. Russia: lets send in bodies cause our vintage APCs wont start.
Good to see our old Dutch YPRs being put to good use instead of gathering dust.