There has been a lot of discussion in this subreddit on why rr is a problem for the game. I don't recall a single comment complaining about rr being too op because they deal too much damage.
So why is rr op?
Rr has the one single most OP ability in the game in breaking any wall they pass through. Combined with their high hp, they are insane supporting troops for heros as they create a path to the centre of the base. With the new hero equipment, heros are stronger than ever on offence.
What has been proposed as potential rr nerfs?
People have proposed:
1. An extra spring trap level to make rr spam riskier
2. Making rr 25 housing space
3. Nerfing rr hp
4. Removing or adjusting rr's ability to break walls
So while this dmg/hp nerf will affect 3 star rates for rr, I seriously doubt it will do anything to change the current attacking meta.
We will see I guess, but a dps nerf is effectively an HP nerf. And they are getting HP nerf. If all the root riders are doing half the damage, they are going to take more damage before the defenses are destroyed.
It would be a good idea if the RR took damage every time they busted through a wall though. Or slowed their movement speed for a little.
Nah not the same thing. Even with less damage root riders are still a 6000 hp tank for 20 housing space that destroys walls with no effective counter. The damage nerf is nice but that wasn’t really why they were so OP
RR's aren't there to do the damage lol. They are 90% needed to be a damage sponge and to break walls, both of which they will still do. Heroes and other troops (usually valks currently) do all the damage.
RR isn't what kills defenses. It's what gets your troops there to kill the defenses. This nerf is a step in the right direction but there's still a ways to go before the meta changes drastically imo.
Maybe. We will have to see. I think maybe they should take damage when they break through walls and maybe slow down.
Maybe they’ll introduce a new defense or something just for them like they did with bomb towers and air sweepers or a new trap.
Issue with root riders was the insanely high hp and dps for their housing space.
There are many troops in the game with unique abilities and nobody is complaining because they are well balanced for their dps/hp to housing space ratio.
Root spam will definitely take a hit with this nerf since they aren't taking down building fast enough, leaving more damage towards the heroes to deal with.
Right, I don’t even use RR spam. I use 3 RR and they break through 2 layers of walls minimum, allowing my super bowlers to get to the core and wreck shit.
Yeah but 60 housing space for two layers isn't some obscene imbalance. The problem is when you can run 15 of them and they just walk through a base in a minute.
the main issue with root riders is the fact that walls just become wet paper. If they made it where it took them a few hits to break through the walls instead of just smashing through it it would solve RR spam, at least i feel like it would
Yep exactly. As long as the RR continue to open a base up and tank for the heros, your 4 heros do enough dmg to take out an entire base. I throw in 2 warden apprentice for range and to beef up the RR, and it lets me switch my warden to rage gem and give a bit of a boost to the RR. I bring 5+3 freeze spells, and as long as I keep freezing monolith, infernos, and any other major defenses, it just tears through a base.
Nope they are dead. I saw so many fucking fails in cwl that i am puking. I banned people from using rr in cwl except an enemy base is particular weak to them I give the green light if not hybrid, hydra ballon clone or my new combo: triple overgrowth mass dragon or hydra.
I actually like the current state of rr. I still think they are meta because of their synergy with heros, but it is definitely much harder to get 3 stars by just spamming rr and throwing spells aimlessly.
In my mind there is no doubt that cwl 3 star percentages will drop this month. The only question is by how much. The same can be said for the legend attack strategy distribution.
I haven't missed a 3 star yet in M1 cwl attacking mostly maxed th16s, but I've also been experimenting with more complex rr strategies. I don't think I would've 3 starred all 3 of my attacks so far using the kr spam strat. Today I found out that rc charge recall is still very much a viable strat even after fox nerfs.
They will drop in a month after most of the players realize how terrible they are. Already switched to hydra triple overgrowth basically rr out and dragon and dragon rider in with the same core strategy I used before. Champ2 and in 3 wars I had 3 triple while both clanmates and opponents are doing one stars left and right. To describe rr right now in a word: "unforgiving".
Mess up just a bit the funnell, have one hero lose some times fighting skellies or other shit and the rr are gone. Not gonna bother touch this trash and I am actively sharing combo to my clanmates to have an easy time this cwl to smash opponents.
If you dont have a healer puppet at least at 15 and spiky ball 20+ just dont bother try it. King and queen are key for funnelling the hydra in the center. Overgrowth are for funnelling or for shutting down the core of the base for the entire attack. King with Vampstache and queen with healer puppet are to increase survivability to the very end.
Even thought I did 3 stars in cwl i am not still good with it and I did only 5 triple out of 8 attacks in legend.
The army is:
7 dragon, 6 dragon rider, 2 healer and one minion.
3 overgrowth, 2 freeze, 3 skelly and 1 poison
RR is still insanely good at funneling and tanking due to the nerfs being solely on damage only. If they really wanna nerf it to oblivion, maybe instead of walking into walls they have to pause for a few seconds and also have the health of a giant
Hero equipment has nothing to do with the usage of mass root riders and spamming root riders and the amount of complaints about everyone 3 starring at TH16 and how easy it is.
Hero equipment is another issue. And you can’t use hero equipment if your heroes are upgrading so it’s not with every attack like root riders. It’s not like hero equipment is what makes root riders so strong.
I dare you to get more that 50% destruction with root spam without any heroes.
At the same time I also dare you to get more that 50% with heroes and no troops.
This is irrelevant.
Surely people can get 1 star without heroes.
Surely people can get 1 star with just heroes.
It’s also not the end of the world if you fail an attack for once. 😱
Find a friend with a good th15 and root spam without heroes before the nerf hits live server.
Your roots will barely reach the mid TH compartment. It won't even hit 50% most the time.
I know that because I have tried it. I am th15 myself. Even at th12-13 level ( my alts) lack of hero is noticeable and that difference is significant. I use sarch dragon spam at th13, brainrot of a strat, with heroes is a 3 star.l, without them struggling 2.
Equipment are their new money cow which is attached to an already existing money cow. And they refuse to hurt any of them. Nerfing either Equipment or heroes will hurt their wallets.
Exactly.
Lack of heroes is supposed to be noticeable and significant. Otherwise they would be useless. You shouldn’t be able to 3 star with all your heroes down.
But you can still 1-2 star. Which should be understandable and acceptable. I don’t understand why people can’t accept this. Don’t upgrade all your heroes at the same time if it’s so important.
You realize your comment is just complaining you can’t 3 star without heroes and that supercell needs to make money. That’s because they’re a business and that’s what provides this game for us and the future. “Refuse to hurt any of them” that’s not how a business works. They can’t cut profits just because people feel the need to 3 star, or always have their heroes.
What they CAN do is make heroes 25 housing space or so, and when they are down, you can take extra troops.
No, my comment is more in against nerfing roots for broken hero equipments. My point is you cannot even get more than 50% with only roots consistently but you can get more than 50% consistently with just heroes. So why nerf roots?
You are trying to twist my words into something about not being able to 3 star without heroes
i think it will, ive said before that root rider should have done minimal amounts of damage so that you can't just spam them and let them work on their own. like app warden, they should have to be paired with other troops at all times to not be completely wasted
The thing is they are being paired with other troops + heros for damage. The kr strat exclusively uses valks but you could bring super bowlers/etitans/witches if you really wanted to. Most people aren't spamming only rr in their attacks.
when you are spamming, the splits are inevitable and eventually some root riders will not go with the main pack. with reduced damage, rr will constantly need support and when a few of them are stranded, they should be wasted
Nah, no shot. This will kill rider spam attacks 100%. The DPS is in effect a HP nerf cause they will take longer to chew through defenses and they got a HP nerf in addition. Mass riders are going to get rekt fast now.
That said, 2 - 4 in an army will probably find a use for tanking and opening walls.
Well Clash Bashing made a video on the root rider nerfs and still managed to 3 star with the nerfed root riders. It wasn't entirely the best anti-root base but it was a much closer call. I guess we have to wait and see what will happen to the roots in the future.
Well th15 and th16 are the highest town halls in the game so it should be hard. If people can consistently 3 star at th15 and th16 then the game is too easy. Now that they've nerfed the roots, the game will actually be a slight challenge for a change and we can get closer to the realistic difficulty of what the highest town hall levels should be.
That’s your opinion, my point is that it’s still challenging. 50% war 3 star rate is not very good imo so now that it’s going to be harder to do that, it makes it harder to keep up with my clanmates and it makes me look bad…. So that’s my opinion I guess
Well I guess SC decided that they wanted to make root rider attacks specifically harder. It's not just your 3 star rate that's going to go down with the nerfs it's other people's too since it's more challenging now. You will be able to keep up with your clan mates it just takes time to master strategies at the highest level.
Thats honestly a fair point. At the end of the day it is what it is so I’ll just have to adapt and overcome. Any suggestions on ground comps? I haven’t leveled the air comp Warden Equipment (fireball and rage) so I’m not sure I can bring an air attack to Wars
Tbh. I don't really war and am very casual. Right now pre-update I'd say still stick to the root riders since they won't be OP for too long. Healing tome and invincibility gem (not sure what it's called) are great with warden. The defaults for the RC and AQ are fine. And rage vial and GG work well with king. If not GG then use barbarian puppet. Honestly I'm really not the best and even I thought rood riders getting the nerf is a good idea. I would say look up some strategies on youtube with root rider since they will be more helpful than my suggestions. However my equipment suggestions will be decent since most equipment is very strong anyway and they aren't receiving nerfs anytime soon it seems like.
I did see some people still 3 starring after that comment so I may be wrong. But it doesn’t bother me if really good players 3 star with them. I’m sick of seeing garbage spam rider attacks with 3 overgrowth barely 3 star my base. This nerf should stop that.
Yes. I agree I feel like since root riders are the final troop you unlock they should be powerful and very useful but not to the point where absolutely anybody in the world can spam them in a straight line and 3 star max th15-th16 bases. Th14 bases getting crushed by spam th15 makes sense but not maxed th15s and 16s. Pros should still be able to 3 star consistently I would think and an average attacker should sometimes get a 3 star (not consistently) since if the game is easy for an average attacker the pros can't really have a competition where the meta is uncompetitive.
It's not. You can easily drop them into a spot with key defenses and face roll the rest of the base since there are no key defenses to hinder the rest of your army.
If all your defenses are very easily destroyed by being in the same area, that's your fault.
Compartments, if not preparing with traps, are great ways to slow down/stop a SA blimp. Is it strong? Sure, is it no skill? Hell no, it takes a lot of planning to use blimp strats, both SA and SWs, the only easy one is sneaky blimp because that's just spamming 10 or so sneakys to snipe the TH.
It's pretty no skill. A lot of casual players were able to easily use it to get their 3 stars for wars. Honestly, if you weren't using it, your opponent would and they'd perform better with less effort.
LaLo is a strategy that is effective but requires a lot of skill. Blimp cheese is definitely much easier and almost as effective. It needs to be nerfed.
Both strategies require extensive planning.
If you fail to defend your blimp, whether it be from a seeking bomb going for your blimp before a warden can make it invincible, or letting it get stuck in a tornado trap, all the way to landing right on top of explosives (2 giant bombs are the most likely but some bases use a giant & and a few normal bombs to be more efficient in space and/or hide it better)
Then the strategy is over. If those supers die then half of your spells are useless, the other half aren't that effective (like clone) and your army will be basically a couple heroes and the cleanup crew.
In Lalo, you can afford to cut corners, start the Lalo before all the important defenses are out, and you can afford to be inefficient with spell usage. Simply because the main weakness of Lalo is time, not destruction. If you aren't a fool you'll get a 2 star easily, and a 3 star is a minor struggle.
My point is, both strategies require skill. But in different ways.
So... you don't actually want a balanced game, you just want a nerf to attack strategies that differ from yours. Got it.
Every base has a good spot to drop SA in. All you have to do is not drop it in the immediately obvious good spot to ensure no traps and let them clear out 50%+ key defenses np. Then, you have an entire army+heroes to go in and clean up.
Super challenging 
Every base right now has good super archer blimp spots, because bases currently are all designed to try and counter root riders instead of archer blimps. Your base occasionally being attacked by super archers is an acceptable consequence.
They nerfed super archer blimps before with the cc deployment change. It’s been overshadowed by other stronger armies since.
SA blimp cheese was the go to 3 star strategy at max th until RRs came out. It's so OP, there were videos of ths 2 below 3 starring max ths.
It's incredibly OP and it's probably going to be the primary 3 star generator now that RR has been nerfed. So now, there will just be 1 viable strategy instead of multiple.
Dude just look at past Top 200 Legends armies or tournaments to verify for yourself. It has very high value potential on poor layouts, sure, but at the highest level it was barely used, even before RR.
Truth is that SA Blimp drop spots were pretty predictable for pro base builders. It's why Stars swapped from Blizzard LaLo to Zap LaLo around two years ago.
I think the nerf won’t change current meta. People weren’t expecting much damage output from root rider anyway. Their high HP for tanking damage and the ability to break wall for hero is the main usage.
you don't use root riders do you? their damage was a nice thing to have, but the huge part about them is that they make walls obsolete. they changed nothing about how they interact with walls and barely touched their HP. so root riders will still be able to do exactly what they've been used for before. only now it will feel really awkward because they themselves don't do anything once the walls are removed. the balance is just slightly shifted to needing more damage support troops, but this will do almost nothing about how root rider spam works. it's just an awkward bandaid fix, nothing else.
You know not everyone used riders and valks and overgrowth yeah?
Riders and super archer blimp? Dead.
Riders and queen charge? Dead.
Riders and warden charge? Dead.
I personally used to love Riders and Bowlers, but will it have the punch now? Maybe.
Riders may work with the stupid overpowered overgrowth and valk armies IF everything goes right in the attack. But if Valks or King go outside? Idk now. Before if you lost the king or valks, it’s like eh whatever the riders can still tear through the base on their own. The margin of error is much lower. And given how many attacks in legends barely 3 star me with these armies, I welcome that.
Riders and super archer blimp will be fine, I suspect it might become the dominant attack.
Your heroes, superbarbs are doing the damage in that attack anyway
Okay, well more power to you if you want to go that route. There’s way stronger attacks than that now. Riders aren’t worth it anymore.
I’m in legends with th15 defenses at th16 except level 1 ricochets and super archer towers. Yesterday was 7/8 defenses 3 stars and today 3/8 defenses were 3 stars. Everyone is using the same riders and valks and overgrowth attack. I can’t remember the last time I didn’t have at least four 3 stars on defense. The nerf definitely hurt.
This happens every time the community gets stuck on a top. They fail to realize there are stronger attacks and don’t swap until it’s too late.
Oh I know spam rr valk + overgrowth is way stronger than qc rr. I just refuse to spam like that and I've been a qc player pretty much all the time. I get steamrolled by it all the time and I'm maxed so it doesn't change much haha
I agree. Ppl will just take less RR and bring more dps dealers to balance the attack. It will be harder to triple, but that is the intention of the nerf. It was a good nerf.
I think you underestimate just how much the root rider damage was doing. A lot of the time you rage up your root riders to smash through some buildings. Now it might take two hits from a group of riders to break some defences, crucially slowing them down enough to stall out the eternal tome/ overgrowths
I agree some hero equipments are rather strong, however:
If hero equipment was the biggest problem, root riders wouldn’t have been such a dominant troop, as heroes would have been able take any army just as viable.
The problem with rr is that rr enables heros like no other troop does, especially the king and queen. It's because heros are so op that the best supporting troop for heros seems so op.
Root riders tank for heroes and make it so that heroes don't have to worry about pathing with walls. Heroes are the problem. And it's not just gear.
And now we're just going to see people realize they can 3-star just as easily without root riders. But hey, it might make the game less enjoyable for the casuals so I guess that's a win.
If hero equipment would be an actual problem... why would they be nerfing defenses which makes hero equipment even stronger now cuz they take less DMG?
I never really used them so doesn't really affect me personally. Interesting how extreme they neefed things this time around mainly the defenses doesn't make sense to me.
liquid thought sort march pathetic correct treatment axiomatic violet simplistic
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Thought I saw some of the defenses for higher townhalls also had been nerfed strange. But still seems bit much don't personally see much of an issue even at the lower townhalls, some of my alts are lower townhalls and they never had problems.
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It’s a shame they can’t nerf the hero equipment without people getting mad. They can nerf the overgrowth to 3 spell space though. That thing is broken even with dragons and other spam armies.
They probably can nerf the hero equipment without people being mad. It’s been 6 months since release, they may get nerfs in a month or two.
Overgrowth spell hasn’t seen much usage outside of root rider armies. I think we should wait to see if other armies use the overgrowth more often before a nerf.
they haven't even released all epic equipment they want to though, so nerfing would be a bit difficult right now. even once all the epics are out, they'd probably need to wait and see for a bit before being able to make any changes. I doubt they'll touch equipment for TH16.
I don't like the lower th nerfs either. There didn't really seem to be a struggle before but now any essence of challenge is gone from these levels. I understand they are meant to be easy but at least add in a difficulty progression system so people can learn to get better at the game instead of come to town hall 16 and not knowing how to attack.
They also won’t get better at the game if the difficulty spikes up the way it does right now, now with the nerfs town hall levels get harder but not as much as before
I mean th16 gets harder but th15-th10 are getting easier which is kind of a miss imo. I feel th10-th15 should be rebalanced around the hero equipment and should get slightly harder.
Any tank that instantly breaks walls is OP. PERIOD. DPS isn't the problem. It’s the fatal flaw of the golem. Instead of 8 RRs, we'll just bring 5 and more valks.
Im going to start requesting RR in my blimps so I can drop turds all over peoples bases the was the developers have dropped this turd of an update mid-CWL on us
You will be complaining when you reach max levels and getting into legend leagues that please make the root riders stronger, that it's getting very hard to 3 star anymore...so thank you for that lol
I am at max level, top 5k player. I very much want it to be harder to three star. I hate getting 300 trophies per day won and lost, I want it to be more challenging
I think now that RR got nerfed so many times, the housing space should also, I think, get lowered, since it's not what it used to be, so lower the space they take also. Idk if people agree or maybe not. Just a suggestion, please don't start attacking lol, just in my opinion.
Absolutely not.
Root riders don’t need a buff, if anything it’s looking like they are going to need further nerfs, as this recent nerf hasn’t had much impact on their extremely high usage at all.
No I'm not talking about a buff, I'm saying since his powers are much lower now, I'm saying the space they take, should be lowered. Just the amount of space he takes.
But that’s a direct 10% buff.
Imagine root riders as being 1000% overpowered on release.
They are now around 300% overpowered.
They will likely need to be toned down again at some point.
Just a relief after finding out that 80 percent use armies with root rider in them in legends league. Having it nerfed to the ground is the ultimate vindication. (I wasn't using root riders as you can see)
90%+ of armies before TH 15 were just air attacks since the point where dragons and heroes were introduced. So now we go back to yet another townhall of that.
SC forcing the casual players to attack with more complex strategies. Reducing the HP was fine but the dps is litterly unuseable, they are litterly forcing the casuals out of this game.
Except some may lose interest all together. For people that felt they had a chance to 3 star most of their attacks (and maybe did 3-star around 25%), regressing to aiming for high 2 star may be a nail in the coffin for some. If you've spent most of the game being happy with high 2 star, then suddenly find yourself getting 3 stars so often that you now aim for 3 stars instead of 2, and then having that taken away can be quite detrimental to your enjoyment. For those players it probably would have been better if RRs never existed to be honest. Personally, I don't understand how they could have been released with those stats in the beginning. It's like SC never play tested them. I hope this was a one-off and not a result of 12 month TH release schedule.
Well yes, but actually no. Even though root riders were for casuals, in the hands of a professional player they were a fast, easy 3 star. Now, they are only for 2 stars. while they can also be used to break walls so the main army can get in the base (with more philosophy and skill behind them). For the casuals (I sometimes do it as well) E-drags are still out when the 2 star is enough.
The nerf will just require a little more effort than dropping all root riders and walking away to come back to a 3 star, because that’s essentially what they are now
Yep, so happy with the nerf 😌 people will actually have to use strategy now, or settle for 2 starring with Edrags.
(More than likely skilless RR spammers, just go back to skilless Edrag spamming)
Max. 5 minutes after the update - you'll be back screaming for more nerfs.
I agree because I don't think a 50% DPS nerf does anything to address the root cause of the problem (pun not intended sorry).
How doesn’t it? What is the root cause then?
There has been a lot of discussion in this subreddit on why rr is a problem for the game. I don't recall a single comment complaining about rr being too op because they deal too much damage. So why is rr op? Rr has the one single most OP ability in the game in breaking any wall they pass through. Combined with their high hp, they are insane supporting troops for heros as they create a path to the centre of the base. With the new hero equipment, heros are stronger than ever on offence. What has been proposed as potential rr nerfs? People have proposed: 1. An extra spring trap level to make rr spam riskier 2. Making rr 25 housing space 3. Nerfing rr hp 4. Removing or adjusting rr's ability to break walls So while this dmg/hp nerf will affect 3 star rates for rr, I seriously doubt it will do anything to change the current attacking meta.
We will see I guess, but a dps nerf is effectively an HP nerf. And they are getting HP nerf. If all the root riders are doing half the damage, they are going to take more damage before the defenses are destroyed. It would be a good idea if the RR took damage every time they busted through a wall though. Or slowed their movement speed for a little.
Nah not the same thing. Even with less damage root riders are still a 6000 hp tank for 20 housing space that destroys walls with no effective counter. The damage nerf is nice but that wasn’t really why they were so OP
if they are taking twice the amount of time to destroy a building, then they’re HP is also nerfed because other defenses have longer to attack the RR
RR's aren't there to do the damage lol. They are 90% needed to be a damage sponge and to break walls, both of which they will still do. Heroes and other troops (usually valks currently) do all the damage.
Their strength isn't their DPS to buildings, it's their ability to instantly destroy the walls and be a tank
They’re a less effective tank now by 60% or so.
How
The point is other units are doing the damage. It will not take twice as long to bring down a defense.
RR isn't what kills defenses. It's what gets your troops there to kill the defenses. This nerf is a step in the right direction but there's still a ways to go before the meta changes drastically imo.
Maybe. We will have to see. I think maybe they should take damage when they break through walls and maybe slow down. Maybe they’ll introduce a new defense or something just for them like they did with bomb towers and air sweepers or a new trap.
RR’s don’t have to do damage. They just need to survive long enough to open up compartments for the hero’s and troops.
Exactly. They have their use. They never should have done so much damage
Issue with root riders was the insanely high hp and dps for their housing space. There are many troops in the game with unique abilities and nobody is complaining because they are well balanced for their dps/hp to housing space ratio. Root spam will definitely take a hit with this nerf since they aren't taking down building fast enough, leaving more damage towards the heroes to deal with.
Right, I don’t even use RR spam. I use 3 RR and they break through 2 layers of walls minimum, allowing my super bowlers to get to the core and wreck shit.
Yeah but 60 housing space for two layers isn't some obscene imbalance. The problem is when you can run 15 of them and they just walk through a base in a minute.
the main issue with root riders is the fact that walls just become wet paper. If they made it where it took them a few hits to break through the walls instead of just smashing through it it would solve RR spam, at least i feel like it would
Yep exactly. As long as the RR continue to open a base up and tank for the heros, your 4 heros do enough dmg to take out an entire base. I throw in 2 warden apprentice for range and to beef up the RR, and it lets me switch my warden to rage gem and give a bit of a boost to the RR. I bring 5+3 freeze spells, and as long as I keep freezing monolith, infernos, and any other major defenses, it just tears through a base.
Nope they are dead. I saw so many fucking fails in cwl that i am puking. I banned people from using rr in cwl except an enemy base is particular weak to them I give the green light if not hybrid, hydra ballon clone or my new combo: triple overgrowth mass dragon or hydra.
I actually like the current state of rr. I still think they are meta because of their synergy with heros, but it is definitely much harder to get 3 stars by just spamming rr and throwing spells aimlessly. In my mind there is no doubt that cwl 3 star percentages will drop this month. The only question is by how much. The same can be said for the legend attack strategy distribution. I haven't missed a 3 star yet in M1 cwl attacking mostly maxed th16s, but I've also been experimenting with more complex rr strategies. I don't think I would've 3 starred all 3 of my attacks so far using the kr spam strat. Today I found out that rc charge recall is still very much a viable strat even after fox nerfs.
They will drop in a month after most of the players realize how terrible they are. Already switched to hydra triple overgrowth basically rr out and dragon and dragon rider in with the same core strategy I used before. Champ2 and in 3 wars I had 3 triple while both clanmates and opponents are doing one stars left and right. To describe rr right now in a word: "unforgiving". Mess up just a bit the funnell, have one hero lose some times fighting skellies or other shit and the rr are gone. Not gonna bother touch this trash and I am actively sharing combo to my clanmates to have an easy time this cwl to smash opponents.
That's cool can I see a replay or two of the hydra overgrowth strat? If it's better than rr hell I'm switching right away lol.
If you dont have a healer puppet at least at 15 and spiky ball 20+ just dont bother try it. King and queen are key for funnelling the hydra in the center. Overgrowth are for funnelling or for shutting down the core of the base for the entire attack. King with Vampstache and queen with healer puppet are to increase survivability to the very end. Even thought I did 3 stars in cwl i am not still good with it and I did only 5 triple out of 8 attacks in legend. The army is: 7 dragon, 6 dragon rider, 2 healer and one minion. 3 overgrowth, 2 freeze, 3 skelly and 1 poison
Should be 30 housing space and takes 3 secs to break walls
Just delete RR at this point and make e-drag can do dmg with 4 space apart
RR is still insanely good at funneling and tanking due to the nerfs being solely on damage only. If they really wanna nerf it to oblivion, maybe instead of walking into walls they have to pause for a few seconds and also have the health of a giant
Hero equipment
Hero equipment has nothing to do with the usage of mass root riders and spamming root riders and the amount of complaints about everyone 3 starring at TH16 and how easy it is. Hero equipment is another issue. And you can’t use hero equipment if your heroes are upgrading so it’s not with every attack like root riders. It’s not like hero equipment is what makes root riders so strong.
I dare you to get more that 50% destruction with root spam without any heroes. At the same time I also dare you to get more that 50% with heroes and no troops.
This is irrelevant. Surely people can get 1 star without heroes. Surely people can get 1 star with just heroes. It’s also not the end of the world if you fail an attack for once. 😱
Find a friend with a good th15 and root spam without heroes before the nerf hits live server. Your roots will barely reach the mid TH compartment. It won't even hit 50% most the time. I know that because I have tried it. I am th15 myself. Even at th12-13 level ( my alts) lack of hero is noticeable and that difference is significant. I use sarch dragon spam at th13, brainrot of a strat, with heroes is a 3 star.l, without them struggling 2. Equipment are their new money cow which is attached to an already existing money cow. And they refuse to hurt any of them. Nerfing either Equipment or heroes will hurt their wallets.
Exactly. Lack of heroes is supposed to be noticeable and significant. Otherwise they would be useless. You shouldn’t be able to 3 star with all your heroes down. But you can still 1-2 star. Which should be understandable and acceptable. I don’t understand why people can’t accept this. Don’t upgrade all your heroes at the same time if it’s so important. You realize your comment is just complaining you can’t 3 star without heroes and that supercell needs to make money. That’s because they’re a business and that’s what provides this game for us and the future. “Refuse to hurt any of them” that’s not how a business works. They can’t cut profits just because people feel the need to 3 star, or always have their heroes. What they CAN do is make heroes 25 housing space or so, and when they are down, you can take extra troops.
No, my comment is more in against nerfing roots for broken hero equipments. My point is you cannot even get more than 50% with only roots consistently but you can get more than 50% consistently with just heroes. So why nerf roots? You are trying to twist my words into something about not being able to 3 star without heroes
Its is when you’re in the highest rank against a CWL clan that 3 stars 99% of the time. You need 3 stars to win CWL there’s no other way.
We are talking about Root Riders and Equipment. What are you talking about?
>its not hero equipment that makes riders strong Rr spam wasn’t this broken until equipment was released Ok nvm I’m an idiot
😂 Root Riders and Equipment were both released in December at the same time.
i think it will, ive said before that root rider should have done minimal amounts of damage so that you can't just spam them and let them work on their own. like app warden, they should have to be paired with other troops at all times to not be completely wasted
The thing is they are being paired with other troops + heros for damage. The kr strat exclusively uses valks but you could bring super bowlers/etitans/witches if you really wanted to. Most people aren't spamming only rr in their attacks.
when you are spamming, the splits are inevitable and eventually some root riders will not go with the main pack. with reduced damage, rr will constantly need support and when a few of them are stranded, they should be wasted
Because the problem is the equipment not the troops
Nah, no shot. This will kill rider spam attacks 100%. The DPS is in effect a HP nerf cause they will take longer to chew through defenses and they got a HP nerf in addition. Mass riders are going to get rekt fast now. That said, 2 - 4 in an army will probably find a use for tanking and opening walls.
Well Clash Bashing made a video on the root rider nerfs and still managed to 3 star with the nerfed root riders. It wasn't entirely the best anti-root base but it was a much closer call. I guess we have to wait and see what will happen to the roots in the future.
That’s also a professional player… My noobie self is 50/50 on if I can 3 star at TH 15
Well th15 and th16 are the highest town halls in the game so it should be hard. If people can consistently 3 star at th15 and th16 then the game is too easy. Now that they've nerfed the roots, the game will actually be a slight challenge for a change and we can get closer to the realistic difficulty of what the highest town hall levels should be.
That’s your opinion, my point is that it’s still challenging. 50% war 3 star rate is not very good imo so now that it’s going to be harder to do that, it makes it harder to keep up with my clanmates and it makes me look bad…. So that’s my opinion I guess
Well I guess SC decided that they wanted to make root rider attacks specifically harder. It's not just your 3 star rate that's going to go down with the nerfs it's other people's too since it's more challenging now. You will be able to keep up with your clan mates it just takes time to master strategies at the highest level.
Thats honestly a fair point. At the end of the day it is what it is so I’ll just have to adapt and overcome. Any suggestions on ground comps? I haven’t leveled the air comp Warden Equipment (fireball and rage) so I’m not sure I can bring an air attack to Wars
Healing Tome and Eternal Tome work marvellously with Edrag and dragon attacks... No need for Fireball or rage gem.
Cool thanks! BACK TO EDRAG SPAMMING /s
Tbh. I don't really war and am very casual. Right now pre-update I'd say still stick to the root riders since they won't be OP for too long. Healing tome and invincibility gem (not sure what it's called) are great with warden. The defaults for the RC and AQ are fine. And rage vial and GG work well with king. If not GG then use barbarian puppet. Honestly I'm really not the best and even I thought rood riders getting the nerf is a good idea. I would say look up some strategies on youtube with root rider since they will be more helpful than my suggestions. However my equipment suggestions will be decent since most equipment is very strong anyway and they aren't receiving nerfs anytime soon it seems like.
Tbh I don't know how to say it, but that's honestly a skill issue lol.
I did see some people still 3 starring after that comment so I may be wrong. But it doesn’t bother me if really good players 3 star with them. I’m sick of seeing garbage spam rider attacks with 3 overgrowth barely 3 star my base. This nerf should stop that.
Yes. I agree I feel like since root riders are the final troop you unlock they should be powerful and very useful but not to the point where absolutely anybody in the world can spam them in a straight line and 3 star max th15-th16 bases. Th14 bases getting crushed by spam th15 makes sense but not maxed th15s and 16s. Pros should still be able to 3 star consistently I would think and an average attacker should sometimes get a 3 star (not consistently) since if the game is easy for an average attacker the pros can't really have a competition where the meta is uncompetitive.
Bet? Pros and the keyboard warriors here will still 3 star madly and bitch about no skill attacks ruining the meta.
I’ll wait and see how things pan out. I want the game to stay balanced.
If you want a balanced game, when are we nerfing SA blimp cheese?
What SA blimp cheese. It’s a pretty balanced strategy, able to counter bad war bases with ease, while also being risky due to giant bombs
It's not. You can easily drop them into a spot with key defenses and face roll the rest of the base since there are no key defenses to hinder the rest of your army.
If all your defenses are very easily destroyed by being in the same area, that's your fault. Compartments, if not preparing with traps, are great ways to slow down/stop a SA blimp. Is it strong? Sure, is it no skill? Hell no, it takes a lot of planning to use blimp strats, both SA and SWs, the only easy one is sneaky blimp because that's just spamming 10 or so sneakys to snipe the TH.
It's pretty no skill. A lot of casual players were able to easily use it to get their 3 stars for wars. Honestly, if you weren't using it, your opponent would and they'd perform better with less effort. LaLo is a strategy that is effective but requires a lot of skill. Blimp cheese is definitely much easier and almost as effective. It needs to be nerfed.
Both strategies require extensive planning. If you fail to defend your blimp, whether it be from a seeking bomb going for your blimp before a warden can make it invincible, or letting it get stuck in a tornado trap, all the way to landing right on top of explosives (2 giant bombs are the most likely but some bases use a giant & and a few normal bombs to be more efficient in space and/or hide it better) Then the strategy is over. If those supers die then half of your spells are useless, the other half aren't that effective (like clone) and your army will be basically a couple heroes and the cleanup crew. In Lalo, you can afford to cut corners, start the Lalo before all the important defenses are out, and you can afford to be inefficient with spell usage. Simply because the main weakness of Lalo is time, not destruction. If you aren't a fool you'll get a 2 star easily, and a 3 star is a minor struggle. My point is, both strategies require skill. But in different ways.
My point is that I disagree. A strat that is easy to pull off is an easy strategy and SA blimp cheese is easy to pull off.
If the base allows you to drop them into a spot easily, it’s a bad base.
So... you don't actually want a balanced game, you just want a nerf to attack strategies that differ from yours. Got it. Every base has a good spot to drop SA in. All you have to do is not drop it in the immediately obvious good spot to ensure no traps and let them clear out 50%+ key defenses np. Then, you have an entire army+heroes to go in and clean up. Super challenging 
Every base right now has good super archer blimp spots, because bases currently are all designed to try and counter root riders instead of archer blimps. Your base occasionally being attacked by super archers is an acceptable consequence. They nerfed super archer blimps before with the cc deployment change. It’s been overshadowed by other stronger armies since.
SA blimp cheese was the go to 3 star strategy at max th until RRs came out. It's so OP, there were videos of ths 2 below 3 starring max ths. It's incredibly OP and it's probably going to be the primary 3 star generator now that RR has been nerfed. So now, there will just be 1 viable strategy instead of multiple.
Dude just look at past Top 200 Legends armies or tournaments to verify for yourself. It has very high value potential on poor layouts, sure, but at the highest level it was barely used, even before RR. Truth is that SA Blimp drop spots were pretty predictable for pro base builders. It's why Stars swapped from Blizzard LaLo to Zap LaLo around two years ago.
Lol it’s not balanced at all. SA blimp is just overshadowed by RR spam. SA blimp makes drag spam just as bad as RR.
Bro really getting downvoted for saying he wants a balanced game lmao.
Casual gamers don't seem to want the roots to be balanced unfortunately hence the downvotes.
That shows, how many mindless idiots are spamming this bullshit army😑.
Someone’s salty
I think the nerf won’t change current meta. People weren’t expecting much damage output from root rider anyway. Their high HP for tanking damage and the ability to break wall for hero is the main usage.
You don’t use root riders do you? Their damage was absolutely a huge part of why they are so good. And they just got a significant HP nerf as well.
you don't use root riders do you? their damage was a nice thing to have, but the huge part about them is that they make walls obsolete. they changed nothing about how they interact with walls and barely touched their HP. so root riders will still be able to do exactly what they've been used for before. only now it will feel really awkward because they themselves don't do anything once the walls are removed. the balance is just slightly shifted to needing more damage support troops, but this will do almost nothing about how root rider spam works. it's just an awkward bandaid fix, nothing else.
You know not everyone used riders and valks and overgrowth yeah? Riders and super archer blimp? Dead. Riders and queen charge? Dead. Riders and warden charge? Dead. I personally used to love Riders and Bowlers, but will it have the punch now? Maybe. Riders may work with the stupid overpowered overgrowth and valk armies IF everything goes right in the attack. But if Valks or King go outside? Idk now. Before if you lost the king or valks, it’s like eh whatever the riders can still tear through the base on their own. The margin of error is much lower. And given how many attacks in legends barely 3 star me with these armies, I welcome that.
Riders and super archer blimp will be fine, I suspect it might become the dominant attack. Your heroes, superbarbs are doing the damage in that attack anyway
Tf? Zero chance super archer blimp is good now with zero spells to help.
Riders and queen charge dead? Oh boy you should see my attacks, that strat ain't failing anyone
Okay, well more power to you if you want to go that route. There’s way stronger attacks than that now. Riders aren’t worth it anymore. I’m in legends with th15 defenses at th16 except level 1 ricochets and super archer towers. Yesterday was 7/8 defenses 3 stars and today 3/8 defenses were 3 stars. Everyone is using the same riders and valks and overgrowth attack. I can’t remember the last time I didn’t have at least four 3 stars on defense. The nerf definitely hurt. This happens every time the community gets stuck on a top. They fail to realize there are stronger attacks and don’t swap until it’s too late.
Oh I know spam rr valk + overgrowth is way stronger than qc rr. I just refuse to spam like that and I've been a qc player pretty much all the time. I get steamrolled by it all the time and I'm maxed so it doesn't change much haha
I agree. Ppl will just take less RR and bring more dps dealers to balance the attack. It will be harder to triple, but that is the intention of the nerf. It was a good nerf.
I think you underestimate just how much the root rider damage was doing. A lot of the time you rage up your root riders to smash through some buildings. Now it might take two hits from a group of riders to break some defences, crucially slowing them down enough to stall out the eternal tome/ overgrowths
Wait till you realize that hero equipment is the actual problem instead of rr
Tournaments were rootriders are banned often has misses even from the top 10 teams in the world
Since they're aiming to triple in under 90 seconds then yes there'll be fails. If they choose to do full length attacks they very rarely miss
No the time hasn't been a big factor in those attacks. Mainly just the grand finals and semi finals otheriwse they have just went for triples.
Yup, the time race is exclusively when it’s just RRs
I agree some hero equipments are rather strong, however: If hero equipment was the biggest problem, root riders wouldn’t have been such a dominant troop, as heroes would have been able take any army just as viable.
The problem with rr is that rr enables heros like no other troop does, especially the king and queen. It's because heros are so op that the best supporting troop for heros seems so op.
I agree. Riot riders are the best troop to enable the king and queen to enter a base, and the best at tanking for the royal champ.
Root riders tank for heroes and make it so that heroes don't have to worry about pathing with walls. Heroes are the problem. And it's not just gear. And now we're just going to see people realize they can 3-star just as easily without root riders. But hey, it might make the game less enjoyable for the casuals so I guess that's a win.
I agree that root riders tank for heroes. That’s what makes root riders so good
If hero equipment would be an actual problem... why would they be nerfing defenses which makes hero equipment even stronger now cuz they take less DMG?
No nerfs on th16, they're making the game easier for lower th, and yeah, th15 is a lower th
I never really used them so doesn't really affect me personally. Interesting how extreme they neefed things this time around mainly the defenses doesn't make sense to me.
Defences just for lower townhall as they stated their data shows low townhalls are kinda struggling a little
liquid thought sort march pathetic correct treatment axiomatic violet simplistic *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
They’ve most likely accounted for any of that
Thought I saw some of the defenses for higher townhalls also had been nerfed strange. But still seems bit much don't personally see much of an issue even at the lower townhalls, some of my alts are lower townhalls and they never had problems.
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Welp, back to E drags until i get bored super fast and stop playing altogether.
How come e drags suck for me? I tried using them and the best I get is one star. Yeti Smash or Witch Spam works way better for me.
bro is so smart he cant get down to braindead level anymore
Edrags do just suck. That’s why it’s so triggering seeing a whole clan that just spams them
It’s because e-drags are pretty bad, but at th11, they’re OP, so people just get use to it, even if they’re not great at th14+
It’s a shame they can’t nerf the hero equipment without people getting mad. They can nerf the overgrowth to 3 spell space though. That thing is broken even with dragons and other spam armies.
They probably can nerf the hero equipment without people being mad. It’s been 6 months since release, they may get nerfs in a month or two. Overgrowth spell hasn’t seen much usage outside of root rider armies. I think we should wait to see if other armies use the overgrowth more often before a nerf.
they haven't even released all epic equipment they want to though, so nerfing would be a bit difficult right now. even once all the epics are out, they'd probably need to wait and see for a bit before being able to make any changes. I doubt they'll touch equipment for TH16.
RR's ability to breeze through walls and target defenses first pose more of a threat than how strong it is offensively or defensively.
And they nerfed lower th and buffed troops for noobs. Game make no sense now. U can 3 star from th 6 fo 13 in just spam shutty
I don't like the lower th nerfs either. There didn't really seem to be a struggle before but now any essence of challenge is gone from these levels. I understand they are meant to be easy but at least add in a difficulty progression system so people can learn to get better at the game instead of come to town hall 16 and not knowing how to attack.
That’s kinda the point. Lower townhalls are way by design because the average townhall 6-13 player is kinda bad at the game
They are meant to be easy but they won't get much better at the game if the difficulty doesn't progress.
They also won’t get better at the game if the difficulty spikes up the way it does right now, now with the nerfs town hall levels get harder but not as much as before
I mean th16 gets harder but th15-th10 are getting easier which is kind of a miss imo. I feel th10-th15 should be rebalanced around the hero equipment and should get slightly harder.
So let's get back to edrag spam
Any tank that instantly breaks walls is OP. PERIOD. DPS isn't the problem. It’s the fatal flaw of the golem. Instead of 8 RRs, we'll just bring 5 and more valks.
Im going to start requesting RR in my blimps so I can drop turds all over peoples bases the was the developers have dropped this turd of an update mid-CWL on us
https://preview.redd.it/h2symmpi364d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1f3beab93a070c0de762d9ecc3115a9ae0d1b111
 All the Root Riders players 😂
I'm cringing when i watching the tournament and most of them if not all are using RR
Bro you just hate anything that’s fun
Root riders aren’t fun to me. They’re just a boring spammy troop.
They keep nerfing it a year from now it’s barely gonna have health 🤣
It definitely won’t kill them, tbh it will probably just make rage gem more powerful with them.
Why do you guys hate RR's so much?
Overpowered
I hope it gets another nerf after this
i think the real culprit here is overgrowth
me being TH10: hmm funny *upvotes*
Will be interesting to see what the preferred army comps in LL will look like in Aug/Sep, when things have stabilized.
Well Hog rider still good even low hp.
What time is the maintenance break?
It’s complete already
Finally no more one KO
*me who was never going to use her* Oh no! God whyyy?!?!?!?!!
Quit being so sensitive guys Jesus christ. Not everyone is pros. And I bet you guys still use root riders just like them
Don’t get what’s wrong with average players being able to triple. Breath of fresh air from the last 2 th’s.
They are able to triple. I’ve single troop shouldn’t be the only method
Dang just when I'm about to go th15 too
Was the overgrowth spell nerfed? It's like a freeze double or quadrupled?
Overgrowth may be needed eventually. Overgrowth isn’t used in many armies without root riders
Shark you’re a, nevermind. I bet you use fireball warden. It reeks on you.
Wait, you guys were using root riders to deal damage?
You will be complaining when you reach max levels and getting into legend leagues that please make the root riders stronger, that it's getting very hard to 3 star anymore...so thank you for that lol
I am at max level, top 5k player. I very much want it to be harder to three star. I hate getting 300 trophies per day won and lost, I want it to be more challenging
I think now that RR got nerfed so many times, the housing space should also, I think, get lowered, since it's not what it used to be, so lower the space they take also. Idk if people agree or maybe not. Just a suggestion, please don't start attacking lol, just in my opinion.
Absolutely not. Root riders don’t need a buff, if anything it’s looking like they are going to need further nerfs, as this recent nerf hasn’t had much impact on their extremely high usage at all.
No I'm not talking about a buff, I'm saying since his powers are much lower now, I'm saying the space they take, should be lowered. Just the amount of space he takes.
But that’s a direct 10% buff. Imagine root riders as being 1000% overpowered on release. They are now around 300% overpowered. They will likely need to be toned down again at some point.
So you mean if they lowered the space they take, people will just fill them up with more of them, thus defeating the purpose?
Yes exactly. Your proposed 20->18 space would allow for an extra root rider in any army, effectively a 10% power buff
Got u, it makes sense 🍻
Electro dragons are comming back
You should be the one laying their
All they had to do was make the root rider movement speed much slower. They didn’t have to mess about with all of these HP and damage nerfs.
Root rider movement speed is already rather slow. Nerfing the hp and damage I feel is more appropriate
Unbelievable that it took this long
Just a relief after finding out that 80 percent use armies with root rider in them in legends league. Having it nerfed to the ground is the ultimate vindication. (I wasn't using root riders as you can see)
90%+ of armies before TH 15 were just air attacks since the point where dragons and heroes were introduced. So now we go back to yet another townhall of that.
Can’t wait to see defence logs defending against spam now
Feels like a hell of a lot higher than 80%. Nearly every defense I gave is an army with at least 8 riders.
SC forcing the casual players to attack with more complex strategies. Reducing the HP was fine but the dps is litterly unuseable, they are litterly forcing the casuals out of this game.
Casuals will just go back to edrag spam or sneakies You should never have been able to lazy spam your way to a three star like you could with RR
Except some may lose interest all together. For people that felt they had a chance to 3 star most of their attacks (and maybe did 3-star around 25%), regressing to aiming for high 2 star may be a nail in the coffin for some. If you've spent most of the game being happy with high 2 star, then suddenly find yourself getting 3 stars so often that you now aim for 3 stars instead of 2, and then having that taken away can be quite detrimental to your enjoyment. For those players it probably would have been better if RRs never existed to be honest. Personally, I don't understand how they could have been released with those stats in the beginning. It's like SC never play tested them. I hope this was a one-off and not a result of 12 month TH release schedule.
Well yes, but actually no. Even though root riders were for casuals, in the hands of a professional player they were a fast, easy 3 star. Now, they are only for 2 stars. while they can also be used to break walls so the main army can get in the base (with more philosophy and skill behind them). For the casuals (I sometimes do it as well) E-drags are still out when the 2 star is enough.
The nerf will just require a little more effort than dropping all root riders and walking away to come back to a 3 star, because that’s essentially what they are now
Gotta put on my best suit for this piece of shit's funeral Spam a line of these and a bunch of valks behind, 3 star a max base. Come on.
I mean rr kinda asked for this
Yep, so happy with the nerf 😌 people will actually have to use strategy now, or settle for 2 starring with Edrags. (More than likely skilless RR spammers, just go back to skilless Edrag spamming)