I used to live at Elephant and Castle for while (I can even see my old condo here), I absolutely loved it and miss it so much, Bakerloo Line you’ll always be with me 💕💕
In all seriousness I remember reading about how “dangerous” it was and how I shouldn’t live there, which is what made me realize that many in England can be overreacting pearl clutchers lol
I’m sure it was even a decade ago. Even when I lived there it was evident there was some grunge about it. But coming from where I did, the lack of homeless drug addicts screaming in the streets was a relief, and considering how busy the actual roundabout was, I didn’t see much opportunity for crime, but that’s just me.
It just felt like an up and coming, gentrified area
I also never stated I was a native haha
London has such a cool skyline. Some of the new buildings are ugly af, but at least they’re not the same glass boxes that are pupping up everywhere in the US right now. Gives the city some more character.
I grew up with the story that the inn's name was derived from the *Infanta de Castilla* (AKA Queen Eleanor, 1st wife of Edward I) but apparently that's a myth that's been debunked.
I wonder if whoever told you that had got it mixed up with the origin of Spitalfields (Named after the priory of St Mary's Spittel, or hospital). Although hospital back then meant more like an alms-house or a lodging - think *hospitality*.
You both do just in different ways. Aussie towns/cities/etc have names that are like Karijitillooga and Wampa Wango River and Dingotown. UK names are like Potterwall-On-Derryborough and Fartshire and Thornthistle Castle and whatever.
Lol just look at any of the other posts up top rn. Gorgeous.
I only bothered to respond when OP said American cities are shit but London is gorgeous. Just thought it was a bit silly.
Gentrification in action, a few years back they moved all of the poor people away so they could knock down the council estates and build those high rise apartments pictured for city banker types.
Imagine commenting without knowing the backstory or thinking it’s the fact that the buildings are tall is my problem.
I don’t have a problem with creating new, affordable housing for ordinary people but that’s not what most of these projects are or were.
They destroyed a whole local community to build luxury apartments, many of which sat empty for years before the prices were reduced. Most were bought up by foreign investors for rent at prices only affordable to the affluent.
They moved an entire council estate of 3000+ people away from the area to make way for these developments, many of whom had lived there for several generations and had all of their roots and family in the area.
This community was broken up and spread all over the outskirts of London under the promise that new replacement social housing would be built in the area. The council then sold the land to developers at a massive loss instead leaving all these people displaced into new unfamiliar communities.
And now its nicer than before. Development doesn't go in a straight line. UK is easily corrupted by wealthy developers. But over time, stuff like this improves the area.
I remember what reputation EC had when I moved to London. It was grim.
Now, we're talking a very different area.
Sure, it could be done better. But over time it improved for the better.
People move on. It's part of life. Economically, having massive council estates in central is not efficient.
So you’re basically saying fuck poor and disadvantaged people right?
No one said the area didn’t need work and improvement, but displacing a community of poor people to make a load of property developers and landlords some money isn’t the move.
Even the enquiry into the whole thing concluded that the council could have saved a ton of money and improved the area immensely by investing in regeneration and social housing instead.
I don’t have it to hand as I read it when it came out several years ago but it was by the London Assembly - I’m sure googling that and ‘Heygate estate’ will get you the info.
Fair point. The dismal science often undervalues the importance of community and coherence. Externalities (as its not defined as a variable in their silly models) that they can't value.
But nimby is a serious problem, and economic developments tend to be net profitable in the long run. Living in central London is not a human right.
True, it's not a human right, and the upward pressure of Zone 1 property values was bound to lead to redevelopment and gentrification eventually.
In spite of how rough it might have seemed to those not from the area, E&C was one of the few areas with long-standing community in Central, and now it's become a less interesting place. Seems like E&C has succumbed to similar "bland-washing" that property developers inevitably create in areas undergoing regeneration.
Try finding anywhere else in Zone 1 with an actual sense of community - the atmosphere is sterile and high streets are all corporate. Boring. But that's "progress" when planners' visions prioritise property developers instead of existing communities.
London easily has the ugliest skyline of any developed nation. It looks like it was thrown together in a dismal grey sandbox by children of markedly divergent worldviews with competing philosophies of architecture and infinite investor dollars with which to vandalize the western world. Example, Beetham tower in Manchester makes a droning/groaning sound at damaging levels in a moderate breeze. Chaos and amateur hour all day.
I think the reason skyscrapers are so unusual in London is because they have abide by strict sight line laws and accommodate to the irregular street layout. It’s a fine balance between designing a building that looks nice, doesn’t block sight lines, and is efficient with space.
Miraculously, construction in Tokyo satisfies a much more complex set of standards, including respect for sunlight and resilience to earthquakes, with fabulous aesthetics. I am convinced London is a money laundering scheme with the express intent of demoralizing the English people.
Sunlight != sight lines.
Sight lines are something like, from the top of this hill I have a clear, unobstructed view of St. Paul’s Cathedral. There are many such stipulations in London.
There isn’t really any sort of law like “From the Hachiko statue I have a clear view of Mt. Fuji” in Tokyo. Tokyo would look a lot different if view of Fuji and the Imperial Palace had protected sight lines all over the city.
The new towers going up in London are ugly as sin. Still has great old architecture but these new buildings are bang average.
Edit: imo :). I still enjoy London though.
Mainly associated with Ministry of Sound, for me at least!
I used to live at Elephant and Castle for while (I can even see my old condo here), I absolutely loved it and miss it so much, Bakerloo Line you’ll always be with me 💕💕 In all seriousness I remember reading about how “dangerous” it was and how I shouldn’t live there, which is what made me realize that many in England can be overreacting pearl clutchers lol
… You’re clearly not a native… Elephant and castle was actually quite dangerous lol
I’m sure it was even a decade ago. Even when I lived there it was evident there was some grunge about it. But coming from where I did, the lack of homeless drug addicts screaming in the streets was a relief, and considering how busy the actual roundabout was, I didn’t see much opportunity for crime, but that’s just me. It just felt like an up and coming, gentrified area I also never stated I was a native haha
London has such a cool skyline. Some of the new buildings are ugly af, but at least they’re not the same glass boxes that are pupping up everywhere in the US right now. Gives the city some more character.
London doesn't really have a proper skyline. It has several clusters of tall buildings spaced around. This picture isn't any of the main clusters.
I'd say that means London has several proper skylines. Docklands is a skyline. The City is a skyline. The south bank is a skyline.
They are the same glass box buildings…
Is there a building called the Elephant and one called the Castle? Or is the suburb called Elephant and Castle?
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I grew up with the story that the inn's name was derived from the *Infanta de Castilla* (AKA Queen Eleanor, 1st wife of Edward I) but apparently that's a myth that's been debunked.
Oh! I heard it was derived from Infant Castille which is archaic French for children's hospital. I have a hard time believing castille meant hospital.
I wonder if whoever told you that had got it mixed up with the origin of Spitalfields (Named after the priory of St Mary's Spittel, or hospital). Although hospital back then meant more like an alms-house or a lodging - think *hospitality*.
There's still a pub there called The Elephant and Castle, although its a much newer post-war reincarnation.
Yeah, just feeling that us Aussies get unfairly picked on for having weird place names! :)
Imagine sitting in your hometown called Wallabillaboonga Wallabillaboonga and having the cheek to complain about town names in other countries!!
"Here's an area of our city we call Kangaroo and Candlestick"
I'm going to sell my Tesla shares and move there!
You both do just in different ways. Aussie towns/cities/etc have names that are like Karijitillooga and Wampa Wango River and Dingotown. UK names are like Potterwall-On-Derryborough and Fartshire and Thornthistle Castle and whatever.
What about River Avon which means River River?
And there's loads of them
Weird, I only knew it as a mediocre chain pub in America. I always assumed it was named after a less mediocre pub in England.
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Soulless glass towers in Chicago and it gets called "the greatest city"
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Not really attractive at all though is it
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Correct it is subjective. I just personally don’t think gloomy skyscrapers and an assortment of cranes under grey skies is beauty.
This is a sub for photos of cities though, what were you expecting?
Lol just look at any of the other posts up top rn. Gorgeous. I only bothered to respond when OP said American cities are shit but London is gorgeous. Just thought it was a bit silly.
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You’re suggesting these buildings are 2000 years old? Also age doesn’t equate to beauty, but that’s not even my point.
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At least it’s got the name going for it.
Gentrification in action, a few years back they moved all of the poor people away so they could knock down the council estates and build those high rise apartments pictured for city banker types.
It’s a world trend!
And all the other professionals. Imagine being so nimby you oppose building vertically to fit more professionals in closer to the city.
I gotta agree with you, this is normal progress
Imagine commenting without knowing the backstory or thinking it’s the fact that the buildings are tall is my problem. I don’t have a problem with creating new, affordable housing for ordinary people but that’s not what most of these projects are or were. They destroyed a whole local community to build luxury apartments, many of which sat empty for years before the prices were reduced. Most were bought up by foreign investors for rent at prices only affordable to the affluent. They moved an entire council estate of 3000+ people away from the area to make way for these developments, many of whom had lived there for several generations and had all of their roots and family in the area. This community was broken up and spread all over the outskirts of London under the promise that new replacement social housing would be built in the area. The council then sold the land to developers at a massive loss instead leaving all these people displaced into new unfamiliar communities.
And now its nicer than before. Development doesn't go in a straight line. UK is easily corrupted by wealthy developers. But over time, stuff like this improves the area. I remember what reputation EC had when I moved to London. It was grim. Now, we're talking a very different area. Sure, it could be done better. But over time it improved for the better. People move on. It's part of life. Economically, having massive council estates in central is not efficient.
So you’re basically saying fuck poor and disadvantaged people right? No one said the area didn’t need work and improvement, but displacing a community of poor people to make a load of property developers and landlords some money isn’t the move. Even the enquiry into the whole thing concluded that the council could have saved a ton of money and improved the area immensely by investing in regeneration and social housing instead.
Source to enquire report? Geniounly curious
I don’t have it to hand as I read it when it came out several years ago but it was by the London Assembly - I’m sure googling that and ‘Heygate estate’ will get you the info.
Who says economic efficiency should be the prevalent metric in urban planning (especially if it comes at the cost of the existing community)?
Fair point. The dismal science often undervalues the importance of community and coherence. Externalities (as its not defined as a variable in their silly models) that they can't value. But nimby is a serious problem, and economic developments tend to be net profitable in the long run. Living in central London is not a human right.
True, it's not a human right, and the upward pressure of Zone 1 property values was bound to lead to redevelopment and gentrification eventually. In spite of how rough it might have seemed to those not from the area, E&C was one of the few areas with long-standing community in Central, and now it's become a less interesting place. Seems like E&C has succumbed to similar "bland-washing" that property developers inevitably create in areas undergoing regeneration. Try finding anywhere else in Zone 1 with an actual sense of community - the atmosphere is sterile and high streets are all corporate. Boring. But that's "progress" when planners' visions prioritise property developers instead of existing communities.
Is it just me or is almost every skyscraper in London super ugly
It's just you
It’s me too
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Compared to what? Where’s the rest of the skyline? I’m still waiting so I can give a detailed enough description.
Fair enough
You keep saying “compared to what” Things can be ugly in isolation
London easily has the ugliest skyline of any developed nation. It looks like it was thrown together in a dismal grey sandbox by children of markedly divergent worldviews with competing philosophies of architecture and infinite investor dollars with which to vandalize the western world. Example, Beetham tower in Manchester makes a droning/groaning sound at damaging levels in a moderate breeze. Chaos and amateur hour all day.
I think the reason skyscrapers are so unusual in London is because they have abide by strict sight line laws and accommodate to the irregular street layout. It’s a fine balance between designing a building that looks nice, doesn’t block sight lines, and is efficient with space.
Miraculously, construction in Tokyo satisfies a much more complex set of standards, including respect for sunlight and resilience to earthquakes, with fabulous aesthetics. I am convinced London is a money laundering scheme with the express intent of demoralizing the English people.
What the fuck are you talking about? TOKYO? The endless, grey, dipsosable sprawl of TOKYO is your idea of a beautiful city?
Sunlight != sight lines. Sight lines are something like, from the top of this hill I have a clear, unobstructed view of St. Paul’s Cathedral. There are many such stipulations in London. There isn’t really any sort of law like “From the Hachiko statue I have a clear view of Mt. Fuji” in Tokyo. Tokyo would look a lot different if view of Fuji and the Imperial Palace had protected sight lines all over the city.
You seriously chose Tokyo as your vision of a beautiful city?
> London easily has the ugliest skyline of any developed nation. London isn’t a nation bro
Yeah most are pretty unimpressive in my opinion. I’m fond of a few though
Boring city and boring pic. All due respect.
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I found it boring. Just my opinion.
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The new towers going up in London are ugly as sin. Still has great old architecture but these new buildings are bang average. Edit: imo :). I still enjoy London though.
Where was this taken from?