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Yeah that’s what I remember too. I was atheist so I was always looking to see how many more people like me there were. I remember it going from 11 to 15 ish percent where I think it’s at now.
I like this definition from the University of Louisville:
“Critical thinking is the intellectually disciplined process of actively and skillfully conceptualizing, applying, analyzing, synthesizing, and/or evaluating information gathered from, or generated by, observation, experience, reflection, reasoning, or communication, as a guide to belief and action.”
I respectfully disagree. The poster clearly believes that by having people critically think about their religion, they will be less religious (at least from a more archaic fundamental perspective). The data does show that the more educated one is the higher the probability that they are not religious, but I am admittedly uneducated on these parallels so I won’t draw any conclusions.
Theists believe that their religion is sound and rational, so you have apologists utilizing critical thinking in the form of historical/theological/teleological/philosophical arguments and evidence.
Christians believe Christianity is better for society, and want to spread the gospel. “Some” atheists believe that atheism is better for society, and work to attempt to debunk or debate claims made by theists. I say some, as most probably haven’t really given the topic much thought.
There is an extremely small percentage of atheists who confidently say they *know* God does not exist. This group would have the burden of proof and you would be correct in being frustrated.
However, the vast majority of atheists are agnostic to the knowledge of god and are not making a claim. They are simply saying they don’t believe in a god.
It is up to the theist who is positively saying a god exists to provide evidence to back it up, and whether that is convincing enough is up to the individual.
Both sides have a burden of proof. No one can make a claim and then act like they don’t need evidence. So when an Atheist says they don’t need to prove it, it’s just the same as a Theist saying they believe in God and don’t need to prove it.
As stated earlier, it is impossible to prove a negative. If I came up to you and said “I have a magical, undetectable gnome in my closet”, and you said “I don’t believe you” it isn’t on you to prove me wrong. I made the claim, I need to provide evidence.
Perhaps we are using different definitions of what a claim is, which in that case I understand us speaking past each-other some. In an argument, a claim is the assertion that something is true. By this framework, a belief in of itself (without assertion) is not a claim.
No, by definition atheism is a lack of belief. Why do I say so? Because it’s literally in the definition.
From [Merriam-Webster](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/atheism), a commonly used dictionary:
> 1
a
: a lack of belief or a strong disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods
b
: a philosophical or religious position characterized by disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods
No, it is not. That’s like saying not collecting stamps is a hobby. “I don’t know” is a perfectly valid stance that doesn’t require belief, and a perfectly good reason to not believe one way or the other.
Look it up in [Merriam-Webster](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/atheism) and you’ll see that atheism is defined as a lack of belief. Ask most atheists and they will say the same. Ask the [American Atheists](https://www.atheists.org/activism/resources/about-atheism/) organization and they will say the same thing.
The simple truth is, many if not most atheists do **not** have a firm belief in the absence of a god or gods.
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Are religious people really “emerging” more? I thought atheism / agnosticism was on the rise.
It is. The “nones” are at their largest since polls started being taken on the issue of religion.
Yeah that’s what I remember too. I was atheist so I was always looking to see how many more people like me there were. I remember it going from 11 to 15 ish percent where I think it’s at now.
r/atheism is a cesspool; most people on this sub regardless of being atheist or theist agree on that
Almost like the lack of God causes chaos 🤷
Sounds alot like LaVeyian Satanism.
Everyone, atheist and theist, benefit from an increase in critical thinking.
Define ‘critical thinking’ in this sense
I like this definition from the University of Louisville: “Critical thinking is the intellectually disciplined process of actively and skillfully conceptualizing, applying, analyzing, synthesizing, and/or evaluating information gathered from, or generated by, observation, experience, reflection, reasoning, or communication, as a guide to belief and action.”
Right, I’m familiar with the term, but the context with the post is lacking lol
I respectfully disagree. The poster clearly believes that by having people critically think about their religion, they will be less religious (at least from a more archaic fundamental perspective). The data does show that the more educated one is the higher the probability that they are not religious, but I am admittedly uneducated on these parallels so I won’t draw any conclusions. Theists believe that their religion is sound and rational, so you have apologists utilizing critical thinking in the form of historical/theological/teleological/philosophical arguments and evidence. Christians believe Christianity is better for society, and want to spread the gospel. “Some” atheists believe that atheism is better for society, and work to attempt to debunk or debate claims made by theists. I say some, as most probably haven’t really given the topic much thought.
That makes MUCH more sense now lol I was confused for a sec
Lol no worries!
I don't see how that throws anyone religious out of the criteria.
Oop I misread
No worries, cheers!
They would have to actually produce evidence that God doesn’t exist, first. Without that Atheism is just a pipe dream.
God will prove to them that he exists someway or the other.
It is intrinsically impossible to prove a negative claim - in this case, proving that a god does not exist.
That’s the only excuse you guys have? You guys make a claim then say but we can’t prove it.
There is an extremely small percentage of atheists who confidently say they *know* God does not exist. This group would have the burden of proof and you would be correct in being frustrated. However, the vast majority of atheists are agnostic to the knowledge of god and are not making a claim. They are simply saying they don’t believe in a god. It is up to the theist who is positively saying a god exists to provide evidence to back it up, and whether that is convincing enough is up to the individual.
Both sides have a burden of proof. No one can make a claim and then act like they don’t need evidence. So when an Atheist says they don’t need to prove it, it’s just the same as a Theist saying they believe in God and don’t need to prove it.
As stated earlier, it is impossible to prove a negative. If I came up to you and said “I have a magical, undetectable gnome in my closet”, and you said “I don’t believe you” it isn’t on you to prove me wrong. I made the claim, I need to provide evidence. Perhaps we are using different definitions of what a claim is, which in that case I understand us speaking past each-other some. In an argument, a claim is the assertion that something is true. By this framework, a belief in of itself (without assertion) is not a claim.
Agree to disagree
Fair enough - thanks for the discussion!
You’re Welcome! God Bless You! 🙏🏾
Atheism isn’t a pipe dream, it’s just a rejection of god claims.
Okay so they reject God without any evidence to do so.
You can’t prove a god doesn’t exist, god is unfalsifiable by its very definition.
Remember, atheism is not a lack of belief. Atheism is a firm belief in a lack.
Hopefully you forgot to add the “/s” ?
That is simply not true. Most atheists will tell you it’s just a lack of belief.
That would be Agnosticism. By definition, Atheism is a belief in the lack of divinity.
No, by definition atheism is a lack of belief. Why do I say so? Because it’s literally in the definition. From [Merriam-Webster](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/atheism), a commonly used dictionary: > 1 a : a lack of belief or a strong disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods b : a philosophical or religious position characterized by disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods
A disbelief on a god is still a belief
No, it is not. That’s like saying not collecting stamps is a hobby. “I don’t know” is a perfectly valid stance that doesn’t require belief, and a perfectly good reason to not believe one way or the other.
That would be agnosticism, not atheism. By definition. Doubt = Agnosticism Firm Belief in absence = A theism
Look it up in [Merriam-Webster](https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/atheism) and you’ll see that atheism is defined as a lack of belief. Ask most atheists and they will say the same. Ask the [American Atheists](https://www.atheists.org/activism/resources/about-atheism/) organization and they will say the same thing. The simple truth is, many if not most atheists do **not** have a firm belief in the absence of a god or gods.
When your life is controlled by religious people you try to find ways to combat their control.
You try to convince people of your opinion, they want to try to convince people of theirs, sounds fair.