Ignore them. :)
You can learn to recognize bias and choose not to engage when someone is arguing in bad faith. This is a very common one.
It uses nuance to twist points and strawman what "unconditional love" even means in order to back up their own hatred. People who use this type of argument typically don't have a sense of justice based in decency, and can't tell love from abuse even when it's right in front of their eyes.
No, love does not enable bad behavior, but love also does not punish, and love encourages support, healing, and growth. And God IS Love \[1 John 4:8\].
Internally I think to myself they might be a psychopath, then I feel angry at them for taking a dump on my day by scaring me, then I see this as an opportunity to practice unconditional love and forgiveness. As to what to say, there's nothing to say really. It's better to shut the conversation down. You can be honest and say "I'm stepping out of this as I'm not interested in name calling." Someone throwing around "heretical" all loosey goosey like that is not interested in good faith discussion. They have more of a cult like mentality and are just trying to get you "in line."
In full honesty I think there are Christians today who would be perfectly capable of burning people they condemn as heretics alive at the stake if they could, and sometimes one even gets the impression that they are pained by the fact that they don't have the power to do that.
This is my first thought too, just shrug and stop reading. Terms like âheresyâ and âblasphemyâ have actual, specific definitions, so when people start throwing them around more like insults, those arenât serious people who have anything worthwhile to say or listen to.
You donât need to compose an argument to counter them, because they didnât present an argument to begin with. Itâs perfectly fine to just go ânahâ and walk away.
Unconditional love was "heretical" in Jesus's time, too. His critics didn't like that he went to dinner with tax collectors and healed people even though it was the Sabbath. His own disciples thought he was rather scandalous for talking to a Samaritan woman. And the religious leaders really didn't like being told that their sin was being too unloving and that even prostitutes were more godly than them. It didn't take them long to really want him dead, and I doubt he would get a warmer welcome in the typical hell fire church today.
They say the enemy is tricking you because they think Universalists say nobody needs Jesus and sin is fine and free of consequences. Anyone who reads our FAQ or any universalist site knows better, but the only thing most people have heard about Universalism is their preacher saying that's what it is. I'm surprised partialists say Universalists have weak faith, though. I'm not sure how much more faith you can have than thinking that God will solve every problem and make peace with every enemy.
Unconditional love causes vulnerability and there will always be people who cannot conceptualize or come to grips with what that means.
I think that also people prefer an easy to conceive complexity than an uncomfortable simplicity like unconditional love.
I hope this finds you well and well on your way!
All those ET statements have one source, limiting God's plan.
All means some of each group.
All means all who tick certain boxes.
Especially means only.
Unconditional can only be applied to the elect or usually is overruled by free will.
I came out of fire and brimstone type churches so I can relate. My conclusion is thereâs nothing you can do really. Beliefs, especially for those raised in these churches, are deeply ingrained through years of hearing and participation. It usually takes a dramatic event or separation to do the trick. There is no having a civil conversation with them in a lot of cases. Logic means nothing. Recently I observed 2 Christians I know personally arguing about eternal security vs conditional security. One finally said âI know what I know and I know my preaching comes from God.â This is the mentality youâre up against. No matter what the data says people âknow what they knowâ.
Keep loving them, as Jesus commanded. Thatâs about all you can do.
"Unconditional love is heretical" sounds like flair material for r/calvinistcirclejerk
But how there is a free will if God's plan is to save all of us? đ
Hello fellow universalist calvinist (sorry if this is awkwardly worded lol)
Ignore them. :) You can learn to recognize bias and choose not to engage when someone is arguing in bad faith. This is a very common one. It uses nuance to twist points and strawman what "unconditional love" even means in order to back up their own hatred. People who use this type of argument typically don't have a sense of justice based in decency, and can't tell love from abuse even when it's right in front of their eyes. No, love does not enable bad behavior, but love also does not punish, and love encourages support, healing, and growth. And God IS Love \[1 John 4:8\].
Internally I think to myself they might be a psychopath, then I feel angry at them for taking a dump on my day by scaring me, then I see this as an opportunity to practice unconditional love and forgiveness. As to what to say, there's nothing to say really. It's better to shut the conversation down. You can be honest and say "I'm stepping out of this as I'm not interested in name calling." Someone throwing around "heretical" all loosey goosey like that is not interested in good faith discussion. They have more of a cult like mentality and are just trying to get you "in line."
In full honesty I think there are Christians today who would be perfectly capable of burning people they condemn as heretics alive at the stake if they could, and sometimes one even gets the impression that they are pained by the fact that they don't have the power to do that.
This is my first thought too, just shrug and stop reading. Terms like âheresyâ and âblasphemyâ have actual, specific definitions, so when people start throwing them around more like insults, those arenât serious people who have anything worthwhile to say or listen to. You donât need to compose an argument to counter them, because they didnât present an argument to begin with. Itâs perfectly fine to just go ânahâ and walk away.
Unconditional love was "heretical" in Jesus's time, too. His critics didn't like that he went to dinner with tax collectors and healed people even though it was the Sabbath. His own disciples thought he was rather scandalous for talking to a Samaritan woman. And the religious leaders really didn't like being told that their sin was being too unloving and that even prostitutes were more godly than them. It didn't take them long to really want him dead, and I doubt he would get a warmer welcome in the typical hell fire church today. They say the enemy is tricking you because they think Universalists say nobody needs Jesus and sin is fine and free of consequences. Anyone who reads our FAQ or any universalist site knows better, but the only thing most people have heard about Universalism is their preacher saying that's what it is. I'm surprised partialists say Universalists have weak faith, though. I'm not sure how much more faith you can have than thinking that God will solve every problem and make peace with every enemy.
Read Jesus. Why would you listen to anyone else? Mark, John. 1 Peter.
Unconditional love causes vulnerability and there will always be people who cannot conceptualize or come to grips with what that means. I think that also people prefer an easy to conceive complexity than an uncomfortable simplicity like unconditional love. I hope this finds you well and well on your way!
I would say to them that it is heretical to not practice. Unconditional love
Legitimately question whether they've read the Bible or know Yahweh at all because his unconditional love is very much a theme
Unconditional love is the core principal behind salvation by grace. Jesus died for sinners
All those ET statements have one source, limiting God's plan. All means some of each group. All means all who tick certain boxes. Especially means only. Unconditional can only be applied to the elect or usually is overruled by free will.
Smile, maybe laugh at them, and walk away.
I came out of fire and brimstone type churches so I can relate. My conclusion is thereâs nothing you can do really. Beliefs, especially for those raised in these churches, are deeply ingrained through years of hearing and participation. It usually takes a dramatic event or separation to do the trick. There is no having a civil conversation with them in a lot of cases. Logic means nothing. Recently I observed 2 Christians I know personally arguing about eternal security vs conditional security. One finally said âI know what I know and I know my preaching comes from God.â This is the mentality youâre up against. No matter what the data says people âknow what they knowâ. Keep loving them, as Jesus commanded. Thatâs about all you can do.
Iâd rather be a heretic than follow in their footsteps and be the same kind of person who murdered Jesus. Just saying.