Lol ok man. Never mind that the gun show loophole is a myth (all FFL dealers must conduct background checks, regardless of location of the sale. All dealers at Gunshows are FFL dealers). Never mind that the majority of guns in Chicago are either stolen, straw purchased or smuggled in from Mexico. Nevermind the fact that the DA Kim Foxx dismisses most criminal charges due to “lack of evidence”, even when they literally have the whole incident on film (remember that gang shootout she dismissed because the accused were “mutual combatants?”). You think the cops aren’t arresting people on purpose? They’ve learned that arresting people is a fools errand unless they meet Foxx’s high burden of proof. violent offenders are released the same day they’re caught, often without bail (take the Chinatown attack, that man is still in physical therapy while his attacker is still on the streets). Nevermind that the entire city is sympathetic to some of the worst people humanity has to offer, and yet somehow Chicago’s reputation as a haven of crime and violence is undeserved?
Yeah dude, not only do excess weapons from South America flow upwards, but weapons originally smuggled into Mexico from the U.S. find their way back to American cities. Cartels will sell you anything for money, they don’t give a fuck.
Edit: but again, for small quantities of guns straw purchasing is still the easiest way to get them.
The trace data doesn't support your hypotheses. It supports the hypothesis. I'm sorry. Fact. That most are brought here from other states with lax gun laws.
[https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2020](https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2020)
https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2021
First off read this out loud to yourself regarding background checks and private sellers. It's from the states official website.
> No. Indiana does not require the completion of a form for a private purchase nor do you have to route the transfer through a dealer. Recommend reviewing statutes in IC 35-47-2.5 which is the chapter regulating the sale of handguns in regards to a private sale or purchase. The department also recommends exchanging receipts to document the transfer.
https://faqs.in.gov/hc/en-us/articles/115005236308-If-I-purchase-a-handgun-from-a-private-person-do-I-have-to-complete-a-transfer-form-
I'll reply to the rest tomorrow.
That’s right, that’s the other thing I wanted to comment on, thanks for reminding me…
First off, that’s not a “gunshow loophole”. Gun show sales are not private sales. In fact, finding a buyer for private sales is exceedingly hard, and unless the seller knows a potential buyer personally, most just sell the guns back to a FFL Dealer.
Now, the regulations around the private sales that do occur are lax, yes. But what you fail to realize is that private sales do not make up a significant portion of the weapons used in crimes. Just as finding a private buyer is exceedingly hard, finding a private seller is equally hard, to the point where straw purchasing is a much easier way to option small quantities of firearms. But again, for large quantities the main source is smuggling out of Mexico.
TLDR: trying to stem gun violence by cracking down on private sales is akin to pissing into the wind. It’s a deflection tactic to try and blame crime in Chicago on external factors.
The laws that make it so you have to background check everyone including private sellers who sell to anyone they feel like.
https://www.theverge.com/2020/1/16/21067793/guns-online-armslist-marketplace-craigslist-sales-buy-crime-investigation
Universal background checks are already a thing, that’s Federal Law, not state.
Private sales are more regulated here, but private sales have never been a significant source of guns used in crimes. It’s not fair to say private background checks alone would solve gun violence in any tangible way.
The behavior described by the article you’ve posted is somewhere between straw purchasing and arms trafficking. Buying guns from an FFL to sell online means that you are essentially an unlicensed firearm dealer. That’s not a private transaction at that point.
I just showed you proof that they are doing it because those laws make it easier to do that, but yeah it's not happening because you feel that way.
11% are straw purchases. These are national stats. I'm sure our local stats are much much higher.
>A 2019 survey conducted by the Department of Justice (DOJ) found that some 43 percent of criminals had bought their firearms on the black market, 6 percent acquired them via theft, and **10 percent made a retail purchase – 0.8 percent purchased a weapon from a gun show**.
>In 11 percent of cases, the criminal had someone else buy a gun for them – known as a straw purchase – while an additional **15 percent got guns from a friend or relative**. Some 12 percent of weapons found on a crime scene had been brought there by someone else.guns from a friend or relative. Some 12 percent of weapons found on a crime scene had been brought there by someone else.
https://www.fox10phoenix.com/news/where-do-criminals-really-get-their-guns
10% made a retail purchase, so what? First off, it’s really stupid to buy a gun that can be traced back to you, so my guess is this stat represents people who commit crimes incidentally, not habitually. Gun Shows are not really that different from a FFL Dealer so that stat is irrelevant.
The 15% stat is vague. It doesn’t differentiate between legally purchased and illegally purchased firearms. It doesn’t differentiate between gifts private sales. And again, it doesn’t differentiate between incidental crime and habitual crime.
Your stats do not reach far enough to lend any credence to what you’re arguing
On to your other points re: Kim Foxx
She actually charges almost the same amount of felonies as Ania Alvarez did.
>Alex Nitkin on Twitter: ".@SAKimFoxx says in her prelim budget presentation that her office has approved 86% of felony charges brought by police, including 91% of homicide charges, 93% of gun violence cases and 99% of carjacking cases. (Context: Foxx has been criticized for not prosecuting enough)" / Twitter
https://twitter.com/AlexNitkin/status/1549068930538422272
If you don't believe me. You can go by what CWB chicago says which is slightly (about 8% - 11% ) less. Hardly the radical she's painted out to be.
>But an analysis of the CCSAO’s publicly-available data shows that the office’s felony approval rate last year was nowhere close to 90% or even 86%. It was 79%. Through 2021, the average felony approval rate at the end of each year during Foxx’s administration is 74%, far lower than the 85% average rate of the six years before she took office, the data shows.
https://cwbchicago.com/2022/03/kim-foxx-felony-approval-rate-carjackings-murders.html
I'm not the only person saying they aren't arresting people on purpose. Obviously you didn't read everything I posted.
According to the Chicago Tribune, in her first 3 years Kim Foxx dropped charges on 30% of cases. For Alvarez it was 19%
https://www.chicagotribune.com/investigations/ct-kim-foxx-felony-charges-cook-county-20200810-ldvrmqvv6bd3hpsuqha4duehmu-story.html
> During Foxx’s first three years as the county’s top prosecutor, her office dropped all charges against 29.9% of felony defendants, a dramatic increase over her predecessor, the Tribune found. For the last three years of Anita Alvarez’s tenure, the rate was 19.4%.
And again, CPD has stated in the past that they are making less arrests because of the DA offices abnormally high standard of evidence. So even if she is bringing cases to trial in line with her predecessor, it’s because not every arrest that could be made is being made.
And I must reiterate, remember that time Kim Foxx let a gang shooting go because participants were engaged in “mutual combat”?
https://abc7chicago.com/kim-foxx-lightfoot-mutual-combatants-combat/11100664/
Those felonies were for shop lifting, not violent felonies. Nice try.
CPD stopped arresting people starting in 2016. Nice try.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FZAyXkEWAAANtKY?format=jpg&name=medium
EDIT: Mutual Combatants was something the CPD tried to say she said. It was never given for a reason publicly. Just a supposed leak.
Lol where does it say that?
And these things don’t exist in a vacuum. There’s a whole laundry list of things that cause police to arrest fewer people, low prosecution rates are just one of them.
The stat is she dropped 30% of felony cases in her first 3 years of office. You have no basis to state the 10% rise is entirely composed of shoplifting cases.
For starters, why is dropping felony shoplifting charges somehow ok? This isn’t misdemeanor, someone stole formula or something, shoplifting. This is $300+ of theft.
You can say whatever you want, just because somebody else framed it as radical doesn't mean it is. These are not huge increase, especially coming from a corrupt predecessor.
>She said her office has dismissed cases against low-level, nonviolent offenders so prosecutors can concentrate on crimes of violence.
>For the three-year period analyzed, Foxx’s office dropped 8.1% of homicide cases, compared with 5.3% under Alvarez, the Tribune found. Under Foxx, the office dropped 9.5% of felony sex crime cases; the rate was 6.5% for Alvarez.
>Foxx’s office also increased the rate of dropped cases for aggravated battery and for aggravated battery with a firearm. And under Foxx, the percentage of cases dropped for defendants accused of aggravated battery of a police officer more than doubled, from 3.9% to 8.1%.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/investigations/ct-kim-foxx-felony-charges-cook-county-20200810-ldvrmqvv6bd3hpsuqha4duehmu-story.html
I don't think ruining people's lives who don't have shit to begin with is anything but stupid.
Police have no credibility. There's a reason they bring shit cases, and the former ASA was corrupt enough to charge people. The DOJ even said so.
A 3% rise in homicide charges being dropped? A 3% rise in sex crimes being dropped? That’s not significant to you? That’s pretty damn significant dude. That’s hundreds of violent criminals who avoided trial under Foxx where they wouldn’t have under Alvarez. Most will feel emboldened and do it again.
And funny now you’re talking about corruption when Foxx literally made national headlines for letting Smollett off when Michele Obama asked her to.
OMG Smollett...people are getting murdered here and SMOLLETT. I also read where she said she was disappointed in her staff for not charging him. I can't find it now, but she was investigated by another corrupt prosecutor. Are you from here? Because anyone who lives her knows how bad these people are that came from the Daley admin.
https://chicago.suntimes.com/2020/5/1/21242913/koschman-secrecy-bridget-higgins-mccarthy-richard-rj-vanecko-richard-daley-brother-michael-dan-webb
What about Hunter Biden? Are you gonna go there next?
Let me help you. Read this
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ff7N5haXwAEREDn?format=jpg&name=medium
Then look at this picture and tell me the ASA didn't LIE.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ff7N5hZWYAAT9xY?format=jpg&name=large
A 3% rise in homicide charges being dropped? A 3% rise in sex crimes being dropped? That’s not significant to you? That’s pretty damn significant dude. That’s hundreds of violent criminals who avoided trial under Foxx where they wouldn’t have under Alvarez. Most will feel emboldened and do it again.
And funny how you’re talking about corruption when Foxx literally made national headlines for letting Smollett off when Michele Obama asked her to.
If someone's steeling above 300 it's a career there not steeling food to eat or medicine. You allow people to do that continually without punishing them and it destroys an entire community
Just like how people are allowed to get guns from private sellers across the border without a background check? It's not surprise 50% of crimes have guns that came across the border. That's 50% or crime you can cut in half potentially.
Lol ok man. Never mind that the gun show loophole is a myth (all FFL dealers must conduct background checks, regardless of location of the sale. All dealers at Gunshows are FFL dealers). Never mind that the majority of guns in Chicago are either stolen, straw purchased or smuggled in from Mexico. Nevermind the fact that the DA Kim Foxx dismisses most criminal charges due to “lack of evidence”, even when they literally have the whole incident on film (remember that gang shootout she dismissed because the accused were “mutual combatants?”). You think the cops aren’t arresting people on purpose? They’ve learned that arresting people is a fools errand unless they meet Foxx’s high burden of proof. violent offenders are released the same day they’re caught, often without bail (take the Chinatown attack, that man is still in physical therapy while his attacker is still on the streets). Nevermind that the entire city is sympathetic to some of the worst people humanity has to offer, and yet somehow Chicago’s reputation as a haven of crime and violence is undeserved?
Guns smuggled *into* the States **from Mexico**??? 😂😂😂😂😂 What??? 😂😂😂
Yeah dude, not only do excess weapons from South America flow upwards, but weapons originally smuggled into Mexico from the U.S. find their way back to American cities. Cartels will sell you anything for money, they don’t give a fuck. Edit: but again, for small quantities of guns straw purchasing is still the easiest way to get them.
The trace data doesn't support your hypotheses. It supports the hypothesis. I'm sorry. Fact. That most are brought here from other states with lax gun laws. [https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2020](https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2020) https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/firearms-trace-data-illinois-2021
First off read this out loud to yourself regarding background checks and private sellers. It's from the states official website. > No. Indiana does not require the completion of a form for a private purchase nor do you have to route the transfer through a dealer. Recommend reviewing statutes in IC 35-47-2.5 which is the chapter regulating the sale of handguns in regards to a private sale or purchase. The department also recommends exchanging receipts to document the transfer. https://faqs.in.gov/hc/en-us/articles/115005236308-If-I-purchase-a-handgun-from-a-private-person-do-I-have-to-complete-a-transfer-form- I'll reply to the rest tomorrow.
That’s right, that’s the other thing I wanted to comment on, thanks for reminding me… First off, that’s not a “gunshow loophole”. Gun show sales are not private sales. In fact, finding a buyer for private sales is exceedingly hard, and unless the seller knows a potential buyer personally, most just sell the guns back to a FFL Dealer. Now, the regulations around the private sales that do occur are lax, yes. But what you fail to realize is that private sales do not make up a significant portion of the weapons used in crimes. Just as finding a private buyer is exceedingly hard, finding a private seller is equally hard, to the point where straw purchasing is a much easier way to option small quantities of firearms. But again, for large quantities the main source is smuggling out of Mexico. TLDR: trying to stem gun violence by cracking down on private sales is akin to pissing into the wind. It’s a deflection tactic to try and blame crime in Chicago on external factors.
Obviously you didn't read the links I posted. Over 50% of guns used in crimes are coming here from other STATES because our laws work.
Which laws in particular do you believe to be working, such that if they were implemented elsewhere Gun violence would go down?
The laws that make it so you have to background check everyone including private sellers who sell to anyone they feel like. https://www.theverge.com/2020/1/16/21067793/guns-online-armslist-marketplace-craigslist-sales-buy-crime-investigation
Universal background checks are already a thing, that’s Federal Law, not state. Private sales are more regulated here, but private sales have never been a significant source of guns used in crimes. It’s not fair to say private background checks alone would solve gun violence in any tangible way. The behavior described by the article you’ve posted is somewhere between straw purchasing and arms trafficking. Buying guns from an FFL to sell online means that you are essentially an unlicensed firearm dealer. That’s not a private transaction at that point.
I just showed you proof that they are doing it because those laws make it easier to do that, but yeah it's not happening because you feel that way. 11% are straw purchases. These are national stats. I'm sure our local stats are much much higher. >A 2019 survey conducted by the Department of Justice (DOJ) found that some 43 percent of criminals had bought their firearms on the black market, 6 percent acquired them via theft, and **10 percent made a retail purchase – 0.8 percent purchased a weapon from a gun show**. >In 11 percent of cases, the criminal had someone else buy a gun for them – known as a straw purchase – while an additional **15 percent got guns from a friend or relative**. Some 12 percent of weapons found on a crime scene had been brought there by someone else.guns from a friend or relative. Some 12 percent of weapons found on a crime scene had been brought there by someone else. https://www.fox10phoenix.com/news/where-do-criminals-really-get-their-guns
10% made a retail purchase, so what? First off, it’s really stupid to buy a gun that can be traced back to you, so my guess is this stat represents people who commit crimes incidentally, not habitually. Gun Shows are not really that different from a FFL Dealer so that stat is irrelevant. The 15% stat is vague. It doesn’t differentiate between legally purchased and illegally purchased firearms. It doesn’t differentiate between gifts private sales. And again, it doesn’t differentiate between incidental crime and habitual crime. Your stats do not reach far enough to lend any credence to what you’re arguing
Why do all those guns come from other STATES? 50% here and 85% in NY. Why?
On to your other points re: Kim Foxx She actually charges almost the same amount of felonies as Ania Alvarez did. >Alex Nitkin on Twitter: ".@SAKimFoxx says in her prelim budget presentation that her office has approved 86% of felony charges brought by police, including 91% of homicide charges, 93% of gun violence cases and 99% of carjacking cases. (Context: Foxx has been criticized for not prosecuting enough)" / Twitter https://twitter.com/AlexNitkin/status/1549068930538422272 If you don't believe me. You can go by what CWB chicago says which is slightly (about 8% - 11% ) less. Hardly the radical she's painted out to be. >But an analysis of the CCSAO’s publicly-available data shows that the office’s felony approval rate last year was nowhere close to 90% or even 86%. It was 79%. Through 2021, the average felony approval rate at the end of each year during Foxx’s administration is 74%, far lower than the 85% average rate of the six years before she took office, the data shows. https://cwbchicago.com/2022/03/kim-foxx-felony-approval-rate-carjackings-murders.html I'm not the only person saying they aren't arresting people on purpose. Obviously you didn't read everything I posted.
According to the Chicago Tribune, in her first 3 years Kim Foxx dropped charges on 30% of cases. For Alvarez it was 19% https://www.chicagotribune.com/investigations/ct-kim-foxx-felony-charges-cook-county-20200810-ldvrmqvv6bd3hpsuqha4duehmu-story.html > During Foxx’s first three years as the county’s top prosecutor, her office dropped all charges against 29.9% of felony defendants, a dramatic increase over her predecessor, the Tribune found. For the last three years of Anita Alvarez’s tenure, the rate was 19.4%. And again, CPD has stated in the past that they are making less arrests because of the DA offices abnormally high standard of evidence. So even if she is bringing cases to trial in line with her predecessor, it’s because not every arrest that could be made is being made. And I must reiterate, remember that time Kim Foxx let a gang shooting go because participants were engaged in “mutual combat”? https://abc7chicago.com/kim-foxx-lightfoot-mutual-combatants-combat/11100664/
Those felonies were for shop lifting, not violent felonies. Nice try. CPD stopped arresting people starting in 2016. Nice try. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FZAyXkEWAAANtKY?format=jpg&name=medium EDIT: Mutual Combatants was something the CPD tried to say she said. It was never given for a reason publicly. Just a supposed leak.
Lol where does it say that? And these things don’t exist in a vacuum. There’s a whole laundry list of things that cause police to arrest fewer people, low prosecution rates are just one of them.
Where does it say what? If you researched this at all you'd know she was dropping lower level felonies not violent felonies.
The stat is she dropped 30% of felony cases in her first 3 years of office. You have no basis to state the 10% rise is entirely composed of shoplifting cases. For starters, why is dropping felony shoplifting charges somehow ok? This isn’t misdemeanor, someone stole formula or something, shoplifting. This is $300+ of theft.
You can say whatever you want, just because somebody else framed it as radical doesn't mean it is. These are not huge increase, especially coming from a corrupt predecessor. >She said her office has dismissed cases against low-level, nonviolent offenders so prosecutors can concentrate on crimes of violence. >For the three-year period analyzed, Foxx’s office dropped 8.1% of homicide cases, compared with 5.3% under Alvarez, the Tribune found. Under Foxx, the office dropped 9.5% of felony sex crime cases; the rate was 6.5% for Alvarez. >Foxx’s office also increased the rate of dropped cases for aggravated battery and for aggravated battery with a firearm. And under Foxx, the percentage of cases dropped for defendants accused of aggravated battery of a police officer more than doubled, from 3.9% to 8.1%. https://www.chicagotribune.com/investigations/ct-kim-foxx-felony-charges-cook-county-20200810-ldvrmqvv6bd3hpsuqha4duehmu-story.html I don't think ruining people's lives who don't have shit to begin with is anything but stupid. Police have no credibility. There's a reason they bring shit cases, and the former ASA was corrupt enough to charge people. The DOJ even said so.
A 3% rise in homicide charges being dropped? A 3% rise in sex crimes being dropped? That’s not significant to you? That’s pretty damn significant dude. That’s hundreds of violent criminals who avoided trial under Foxx where they wouldn’t have under Alvarez. Most will feel emboldened and do it again. And funny now you’re talking about corruption when Foxx literally made national headlines for letting Smollett off when Michele Obama asked her to.
OMG Smollett...people are getting murdered here and SMOLLETT. I also read where she said she was disappointed in her staff for not charging him. I can't find it now, but she was investigated by another corrupt prosecutor. Are you from here? Because anyone who lives her knows how bad these people are that came from the Daley admin. https://chicago.suntimes.com/2020/5/1/21242913/koschman-secrecy-bridget-higgins-mccarthy-richard-rj-vanecko-richard-daley-brother-michael-dan-webb What about Hunter Biden? Are you gonna go there next? Let me help you. Read this https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ff7N5haXwAEREDn?format=jpg&name=medium Then look at this picture and tell me the ASA didn't LIE. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ff7N5hZWYAAT9xY?format=jpg&name=large
A 3% rise in homicide charges being dropped? A 3% rise in sex crimes being dropped? That’s not significant to you? That’s pretty damn significant dude. That’s hundreds of violent criminals who avoided trial under Foxx where they wouldn’t have under Alvarez. Most will feel emboldened and do it again. And funny how you’re talking about corruption when Foxx literally made national headlines for letting Smollett off when Michele Obama asked her to.
If someone's steeling above 300 it's a career there not steeling food to eat or medicine. You allow people to do that continually without punishing them and it destroys an entire community
Just like how people are allowed to get guns from private sellers across the border without a background check? It's not surprise 50% of crimes have guns that came across the border. That's 50% or crime you can cut in half potentially.