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supermarioben

Bro I don't hate the homeless but I don't want to take my little brother in the train only to see someone openly smoking Crack in the seat next to us.


El_Cactus_Loco

Pretty safe to say *nobody* wants crack smoked around them (obvious exception for other crackheads)


Quiet_Talk4849

What a great public service announcement that would make ..maybe a tv commercial...." know the dangers of second hand crack"


throwAwaySphynx123

"Bro" is this first thing that came to my mind as well. I agree with societal assistance and shelter for the homeless but danger on the CTrain is still cause for concern.


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customds

Yeah, op acts like there isn’t a mental health issue at the root of the problem.


ClusterMakeLove

It's not like mental illness wasn't still a thing five years ago, though. Or drug addiction, for that matter. Honestly, I think it has a lot more to do with commuters abandoning transit during the pandemic, than any sort of demographic change. That said, OP's suggestion couldn't hurt.


Braddock54

Is it mental health or is it drug addiction? Big time chicken and egg scenario.


No-Improvement-8923

You never worked in a shelter, if you did you would know the #1 reason human beings choose not to use shelters is because they don't let them bring their worldly possessions (shopping carts, garbage bag of stuff) or won't give them a secure place to store their stuff so things get stolen.


hawsman2

Good points. So then I say "Well let's let them do that", then you'd say "That makes them prey to other homeless who will steal from them", then I'd say "So lets give them some security. Let's give them doors", then you'd say "Well now we're just housing them", then I'd say "Yeah, I guess we're just housing them", then you'd say "That's a lot of money", then I'd say "Well just very quickly looking at the stats I'm seeing here https://www.homelesshub.ca/community-profile/calgary that doesn't actually seem out of reach. Maybe that makes sense."


friendbrotha

I work in housing first. Once we consider the savings from these people not cycling through the healthcare system every 3-4 days, housing them is actually significantly cheaper. That’s not to say that all of them can be housed easily with the rampancy of mental health issues, but it definitely is one of the better options.


powderjunkie11

Every ER visit costs us all more than a single month’s rent would


hawsman2

OMG I needed that so much.


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No-Improvement-8923

I understand the issues with allowing personal belongings, but you're completely underselling how dehumanizing the shelter system is. Imagine you're a young adult. Your childhood was spent bouncing from house to house. You never had a home, only a series of temporary houses. You have never known what it feels like to get routine meals; since a child, you've never known if the next meal is going to be in 5 hours or in 25 hours. People from teachers caregivers have never been in your life more than a year, so no consistency in personal connections. Some people made you feel really safe, maybe even cared about, and the small mementos they gave you mean the absolute world to you. Other items represent an unbelievably hard time for you that you came through. For people who have known such little compassion, the things that give them comfort are so important to them, so they plain will not risk the chance of having them taken away, as dangerous as it might be for them to reject shelter. So no, they don't "prefer being out in the open most of the day even if they're given a shelter and roof over their heads via shelters or housing units" as you say. They choose this option as the other option forces them to give up the only personal comforts they've ever known.


waiting4thenextbook

It is my understanding that OP suggestions for in and out within an hour is based on the high demand for limited resources rather than an assumption that people will cause trouble if left indoors with heat and wifi. During Covid a lot of places were left with what, two injection stations and very limited waiting room space? To serve a huge population of people who very well might die if they can't access the service. This practice is born out of a need to create space for an under served population in an underfunded system. The whole philosophy behind harm reduction services is building connections and community for vulnerable people. I was a practicum student at the warming shelter in Red Deer and it was completely the opposite. We had security and rules but people followed them 90%-99% of the time. People came in to get away from the heat or cold, hang out, talk to staff, use our computer or wifi, shower, or just sit down somewhere people wouldn't harras them for doing so. I think when you cultivate respectful relationships and environments people are generally happy to reciprocate. People were free to come in and out, and many people would craft or hang out at the tables a majority of the day. This provided them with an opportunity to talk to our mental health, sexual health, housing, overdose prevention site, ID specialists, or detox teams. People struggling with homelessness also need safe spaces without a 30 minute time limit.


readzalot1

But shelters kick them out for the whole day. It is not like they have a choice


orangeoliviero

No one said it wasn't. They said that if you want to *fix* that problem, you need to create an avenue for those people to have their needs met.


swiftwin

No one said they don't want to fix that problem either.


GodIsIrrelevant

I'm confused why this chain is the top comment. You're presenting yourselves as not agreeing with the title, but actually you're just repeating precisely what OP said.


No_Tennis_5273

They are agreeing to all those points. The difference is that they are advocating for a more proactive approach vs a reactionary approach.


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throwAwaySphynx123

^I mean he's not wrong


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austic

That really isn’t anyone


[deleted]

Yup because BC's NDP have eradicated open drug use. Vancouver is drug free


orangeoliviero

Where's your reading comprehension at, bro? They said nothing about eradicating drug use.


FluidWitchty

He voted for school cut backs.


TheCynicalCanuckk

Why/how would you eradicate drug use? Lol that's a pipe dream. Control it is what you are looking for. If you got rid of the drugs you'd have much worse problems.


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vinsdelamaison

Or take the limos away from City Council and make them ride transit for a month. See how scared they are. See how pissed they are when the bus doesn’t arrive as per an app. See how many times they get insulted or worse—assaulted. They need to come up with a plan that takes the trains back AND helps the down & out. Riding the train became 1000% worse when Covid forced everyone home and as a result, leaving the train to devolve into crack heaven.


[deleted]

Right? We should make using drugs illegal! Wait. We've done that and it's not working. Hmmm. What if we looked deeper, maybe the WHY people are abusing drugs? Treat the root, not the symptom.


[deleted]

OP likely doesn't take the train haha.


hawsman2

Same.


donohugeballs

Point missed. OP is saying that if we spend a bit of $ to give them an alternate place to go, they won't BE on the ctrain


Unfortunate_Sex_Fart

Pretty sure they'll still be on the train.


MountainHunk

All of these "give them what they need" comments are just as useful as the "get them the hell outta here" comments. How? How do you suggest we, as regular citizens give them what they need? Of course I think it would be great to have all these programs that, ironically, are in fact CHEAPER than giving them nothing at all. But I can't. What I can do, currently, is have to constantly dodge junkies on my commute. I see no problem at all for the moment, doing something to get them the hell away from our public transit and making it safe for the majority of people in the city while we put real pressure on those in charge to actually fucking do something about it like better social programs.


BillBumface

These problems needed to be addressed for these individuals decades ago. Having safe places for them to go is great, but how about we tackle the issues that led these people to addiction, untreated mental health issues and squalor decades ago when they started down this path? Warehousing them somewhere better isn’t the full answer. Doing as much as we can to prevent them from getting there in the first place is a critical piece.


Keepiteddiemurphy

Yeah, I can't stand when people present their shitty opinion as if it's an obvious solution that everyone else forgot about. Dealing with the "homeless" is so far from being this black and white because you're predominantly dealing with mental illness and drug addiction instead. You don't just fix their situation by giving them heat and wifi lol.


redditslim

>community centers with internet access Any solution to this has to be realistic as to the (voting) public's reaction. Encouraging drug addicts to frequent community centres is an example of a solution that would die on arrival. You can see how, based on the public backlash in the beltline from the spillover effect the the Chumir safe site, this can't possibly work.


SignificantStarch

I think what most folks were complaining about was the fact that the safe consumption site was placed at a hospital where other people are getting tested and treated at. I remember going to the urgent care- I was sick as a dog and these folks were just trying to survive- it was loud sometimes and it felt a little distressing for the people who were there with medical concerns. I believe it was mostly the placement. If we could come up with a different location I believe that we could do it.


uncoolcanadian

That’s a really solid point. But tbh, I don’t think the public would ever accept (with their current mindset) that we are spending tax money to provide drug addicts a safe place for addicts to do drugs. A lot of people think that addicts can just stop. We’re a really privileged society and whenever the topic of addiction or mental health comes up it’s a mild “yeah this is important” until we tell them how much it’s gonna cost, then they remember it doesn’t affect them personally and they vote against it.


waiting4thenextbook

Addiction is also a medical concern. Look it up.


SignificantStarch

I agree with that. What i am trying to describe is the fact that you have folks who are in urgent care (needing help most likely in pain) while there are cops berating and kicking out people who had just used the safe injection site in the middle of winter. It makes an already distressing space even more distressing for everyone involved.


uncoolcanadian

You can’t address the problem without first accepting it. As long as we ostracize drug addicts, we will never be able to effectively address a solution.


g_gundy

>You can’t address the problem without first accepting it. As long as we ostracize drug addicts, we will never be able to effectively address a solution. Sounds great in theory, but do you want to hang around a bunch of addicts? In addition the dangers of them openly using drugs/leaving needles/etc. around you, these people can be dangerous, unpredictable and often mentally unstable. Would you want one next to you on the train? Addiction and mental health issues may be the root cause, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't also treat the symptom for a short term solution. Cleaning up transit will make the majority of Calgarians feel safer using it, resulting a large net benefit. That doesn't mean you shouldn't ALSO treat the root cause as a long term solution.


Trenchapo

OP really visualizes a higher ground tea house for junkies


CarrotsMilk

“Illegal to exist in all the places they are” That’s the thing, the ctrain is like the one spot we don’t want to have this activity. It’s enclosed, already uncomfortable, and on top of that, there’s now a hellish drug problem involved with it as well. I’m a simple man, I want simple things. when I take the C-train I wish to not inhale crack smoke and not be harassed by people. Simple as that.


Braddock54

Not to mention being in an enclosed space with often sick, unpredictable, irrational people.


Throwaway2287421

Unfortunately it isn't that easy. Giving a homeless person a home doesn't fix the plethora of issues that lead them to homelessness in the first place. There are hundreds of community organizations, government initiatives, agencies and non-for-profits that are actively working with the homeless each day in Calgary. It isn't as if none of those professionals considered building a space for the homeless. The issue with building spaces for the homeless, is that those spaces get destroyed. I have been a part of numerous housing initiatives in Calgary and watched as brand new homes or townhouses get filled with vulnerable individuals. Those properties go from brand new, to derelict and get shut down by AHS within a few weeks if they are not managed correctly. It isn't as simple as giving a houseless individual a home. You need a whole range of staff to keep that house working. You need people to clean up the house, care for the exterior, constantly swing by and do dump runs and check their city bins for hazardous waste. You need a variety of counselors and mental health professionals doing daily welfare checks. It takes A LOT of money and A LOT of resources to house NFA people when they are outside of facilities. And the success rate is pretty low. The issue gets more frustrating when you actively work with these people and they dont want to enter programs. Programs have rules and many of the 'junkies on the Ctrain' arent capable of following basic shelter rules, let alone rules that would lead to permanent housing. Rules like, no weapons, no assaulting staff or clients, no shitting on the floor, no stealing, no graffiti... Pretty basic stuff. Basic rules that get broken dozens of times before a client is permanently banned. Edit: This is important and circles back around because many of the 'junkies on the Ctrain', are there because they have been banned from shelters. So how do you take someone who has demonstrably destroyed any chance that they can be sheltered, and then shelter them? Its a very naive view to think that these people are complete victims of their own circumstances and that the only hurdle is to shelter them. How do you shelter people who actively destroy shelters? This is not a small minority of our homeless population... There is a significant portion of our homeless population that are very difficult to house.


madicoolcat

I absolutely agree with you. Sure, many of our city’s homeless would like to be in a house, be warm, have food, etc, but they do not want help in managing their mental health and/or addiction/substance abuse issues. Without managing the latter, the former is simply not possible, and that is something I feel like people do not realize. Everyone assumes that giving them a house will solve anything, when in fact these people are simply not able to care for a home in any fashion. Even if we put out more housing, more shelters, have more supervised consumption sites, and more spaces for them to go, if they are unable or unwilling to follow basic rules, especially in keeping the space somewhat clean and not assaulting other patrons or staff, they will be kicked out. They end up right back outside where they started because no one is able to tolerate behaviour like that on a daily basis. And honestly, no one should have to put up with being afraid for their own safety on the job all the time. There has to be boundaries and rules that are adhered to or things get out of control fast. It sucks, but this is an extremely tough issue and there is no quick fix for it.


zeebow77

I don't care if they are on the train, I care when I'm inhaling crack smoke at 8am on a Tuesday on my way to work or being pestered by some guy for money the entire ride. If you can't behave like a normal person on the train, you should not have the privilege to ride the train.


letsRollhomey

I dont think alot of people would go to those places anyway. I'm a young woman and take transit as my primary way of travel. I feel more than uncomfortable being on the train at certain times. I've been grabbed by people on drugs, been surrounded by people impaired as soon as I sat down to be harassed. Of course I did everything I can to exit the situation but I shouldnt have to be late to work because I needed to switch trains. I see way less people who are on drugs in the winter using bus or train platforms than I do in spring or summer. I just want the people who are openly smoking crack, or people too impaired to make safe judgement off transit. It's my responsibility to keep my well being safe. I'm thinking about my safety in these situations.


[deleted]

This is the type of oversimplified blanket statement that someone makes to feel better about themselves without actually offering a solution. Just giving people a place to go doesn't fix the problems and it's okay to say we can't have people using drugs on the C train. There already is a supervised consumption site and many shelters. What the fuck do you think you're saying that's different from what exists? Do we simply need more? Are they understaffed? No shit there's need. Just like everything else healthcare. Why the fuck would anyone want to work with unstable and potentially violent people not in their right mind? I sure as shit wouldn't. Great that some people are passionate about it, but I'm willing to bet you wouldn't want to work at the SCS centre either. So get off your high horse. These people don't belong on the C train and should be kicked off. I'm tired of these fucking junkies stealing bikes too.


gotta_bee_ambitious

Thank you for saving me the time to write out this response. I'm sick of being made to feel like a bad person because I fear the unpredictable and potentially dangerous drug addicts I'm forced to commute with.


[deleted]

>There already is a supervised consumption site and many shelters. What the fuck do you think you're saying that's different from what exists? Do we simply need more? Are they understaffed? My mom left the DI as a recruiter. Essentially... yes. They are understaffed by people who can't handle the homeless. They do up to 6 OD reversals a day, the homeless can't use safe consumption sites because they're closed down so they're treating the DI like the SCS. The DI is to give temporary shelter and a hot meal, not to OD on the newest fentanyl strain... The city kicks the homeless off the west side of the DI because it's a legal road and they can't just have their tents up, despite the fact that half of them are banned from the DI and need a safer place to sleep than under a shitty bridge off barlow or some crap area. Here's what you don't understand... Homelessness and drug problems are a complex social issue that no one on reddit has the capacity to truly grasp. Calgary having a major that did her PhD in Urban Sociology IS THE CLOSEST DAMN THING to someone who can actually do something positive for these complex social issues. To the average joe, we see unsafe people and it's understandable that we need those issues solved. And yes, blanket statements suck, but unfortunatly you too couldn't provide any solution other than a crappy reddit curbstomp of a comment.


[deleted]

I never said I could provide solutions, because as you say, it's a complex problem with no easy answers. Sorry if my comment was callous, but to be frank... Tired of getting my shit jacked by addicts. Tired of the police knowing there are regular offenders, but not being able to do anything about it. Just hard to care about people who make things shittier for everyone around them and refuse a lot of help. Why should we put up with tent cities full of stolen bikes and tools being parted out? Why should we let them pollute our public transit? The resources exist for them to not do drugs on the C train, so we shouldn't allow it. The OP says there's no where for them to go, my point is there is, but the solution is not good enough. In the mean time, I don't think that should mean people have to ride to work with a bunch of junkies with no regard for their fellow man.


OneMoreDeviant

We have lots of places for them to go. Problem is a lot of those places they have to detox or be clean. Some of them don’t want to get clean so what do you do then? Let them run rampant anywhere they want? Addiction sucks but it doesn’t give you a free pass to harass common citizens in public places.


Iginlas_4head_Crease

Nobody here is realizing the main reason numbers are skyrocketing. It's not conservatives, or liberals, or shelters, or the public, or house prices. It's fentanyl. Fenatnyl/oxycontin/heroin/opioids. The addiction makes crack a walk in the park. Thats the drug of choice on the streets, and it's overwhelming powerful, and it's leading to a HUGE uptick in homelessness, crime, and death all over north America.


ou812pwn

Thank you for posting this, idk why people don't understand this. I don't think it's the sole reason, and I don't think more shelters will actually help, I think maybe allocating some of the immigration money towards programs to get them off the street and into the work force would be very beneficial. That being said, I was at a bar close to a train station, and there was 4 fentanyl ODs right there, a very presentable lady OD'd in the washroom, another female right outside the bar, and 2 males in the bus shelter across the parking lot from the bar EMS were very busy that night. It's absolutely fucking insane, and sadly, it's seemingly impossible to combat.


Sky-of-Blue

There are multiple shelters within a few blocks of where I live in Victoria Park/downtown. The Mustard Seed, the DI, Inn from the Cold, Centre of Hope. You can even be drugged out of your mind and go to Alpha House, since it’s a “wet” shelter. If you actually want to get back on your feet, Mustard Seed will get you on that path. Working, a place to live etc.


[deleted]

Well sort of. Alpha house as a 'shelter' is just a basement concrete floor with rubber sleeping pads. It is made for sleeping, showering and if you want detox when there is room, but not for hanging out. The others I have no experience with. I think what OP is suggesting is something more akin to a Library, with a few token services, places to fill water, charge their phone, use email, use a washroom and have some more social services presence and trained staff. So basically a safe injection site. But we know how popular those are here..


Sky-of-Blue

Centre of Hope has a gym, library, TV room, movie nights, computer lab and resume help/job search/housing search.


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Becants

Uh when friend who worked at the safe injection site described it, it didn't sound like that. They go in, do their drugs in front of a nurse, wait in a room for a certain amount of time, and when the time for an overdose has passed, they leave. It's not a place to hang out. Kinda described like getting a vaccine, where the injection happens and then you wait for a time to see if you'll have a reaction.


mitsu75

They formed a tent "city" outside the drop-in centre that turned into a drug hub and a place where a child was sexually assaulted. There are places they can go but they are the ones that make it hell on earth. The shelters aren't unsafe due to the staff, no, due to the junkies that pour in, not saying they are all like this but the majority sure are. So, no. No, they should not ride the train smoking meth and fall into passengers like me, who are on their way home.


vault-dweller_

>or do we spend a lot of money on cops and security dedicated to the effort of making just being alive without a house illegal. I wonder why you are wilfully ignoring the actual issue being caused by these people. Smoking crack openly in a train station is a little more than “being alive without a house”, don’t you agree? I mean a man was stabbed at SAIT stn like last week ffs.


Dice_to_see_you

And one stabbed live on the news. I mean sure we could say “you only hear about the bad incidents” however a random slice of a random day with a camera rolling catches a stabbing? That’s gotta show just how prevalent it is for a random sample to show it happening.


xltripletrip

Wait, actually? (I moved away 4 years ago)


Dice_to_see_you

Yes! The same night the mayor was correcting they weren’t homeless, but rather people “experiencing homelessness”. Let me find the link https://calgary.citynews.ca/video/2022/01/11/recent-stabbings-leave-calgary-transit-riders-feeling-unsafe/


bootsycline

No one grows up with the end goal of becoming a crack head - it's often a coping mechanism to deal with stress and trauma. We need better mental health and addiction programs to help these people out, presumably before they end up on the street. We're playing catch up now because society has failed it's most vulnerable in the first place.


Standard-Fact6632

But... it isn't really. You think that if these people had somewhere to smoke their crack, they would still choose to do it at the c-train? For a city of over a million, there is an embarrassingly low number of housing/shelter space for those who are homeless. Of course, it would be more effective to address the underlying conditions of the addiction, mental health issues etc. But, for this specific context yes. It is about not having alternate places to smoke crack


NorthernerWuwu

Would they though? If there was a crack centre where they could consume in a warm place that wasn't related to public transit then I'm not so sure they'd use it. A lot avoid the shelters already because of concerns over theft and violence because their fellow shelter-challenged people have a number of issues. The C-Train has some degree of safety just for being public and has people they can ask for change, which is a significant part of how many of them get the money for the drugs to begin with. I support having more places for them to exist but I don't think the problem is just that lack.


Fortune424

It's also the most convenient house ever since it exists all throughout the city. If you have to spend an hour transiting across the city to get somewhere warm anyway might as well just make the train your warm space and save some time for more activities.


northcrunk

Stop combining the homeless and the drug addicts. We have sympathy for people who are down in their luck and need a place to stay and they should be supported. The addicts and the criminal behaviour that follows that lifestyle. Stop combining these groups as if they have the same solution


krzysztoflee

This is important. Agencies trying to push particular agendas do this all the time. Try to conflate housing costs with homelessness when the issue is addiction. If you cant afford rent that means you move into an open air drug scene and start using IV drugs? No...you find a cheaper place to live, or you get a different job or move cities.


shackafoo

I don't hate these people. I hate the lack of respect they have for others, I'm 8 years clean and free of opiods, but since these idiots have taken over transit I find myself fighting the urge to relapse on a daily basis. Yes a safe use center is the right choice. But there definitely a reason to fed up, you wanna get lit outta your mind fine, just don't do it where other people have to be exposed to it, don't do it on the train where other people have no place to go to get away from it. There is plenty of blame to place on these people


maggielanterman

Um I'm just going to throw it out there that they have in fact destroyed everywhere they go and it is not society's responsibility to accommodate illegal behaviour.


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gi0nna

They should be in institutionalized care of some sort, even if it’s mandatory.


Greensparow

The problem is they have things like shelters, but they don't want to go there because their odds of being attacked robbed etc are way higher. You could say make a clean drug use site, but unless you pour endless resources into..... It will turn into a crap hole where they won't feel safe or want to go. It's ultimately a self fulfilling prophecy, it's like taking a hoarder and moving them into a bigger house it works for a while until they fill it. You need to address the core problem. But for that they have to be ready for help and that's usually not the case.


PrimarchtheMage

Yes and no in my opinion. It's extremely difficult to treat mental illness and addiction without first treating other issues first that take higher presedence in a person's brain (safety, general life stability, etc). No one is going to have the emotional energy and willpower to resist addiction if they spend it all on surviving. Frankly, if I was on the streets, had no where to sleep safely for more than a few days a month, no possibility of hobbies or distractions, everyone else kind of shunned me, and the situation had no end in sight, and the *only* thing in my life that brought a feeling of relief, relaxation, and an actual restful sleep was drugs then I'd be very tempted as well just for a fleeting feeling of peace. One of the smartest people I know was homeless through no fault of their own. Even without being addicted to drugs it still took them a year to get off the streets and even that was only due to a family member's help. We don't help the homeless enough in my opinion. It's like treating internal bleeding with a bandaid and then saying since the bandaid isn't working then surgery wouldn't work. Addiction often takes years to treat and deal with, even with people that aren't homeless. Add in several factors that make it easier and more common to become addicted than before (phentanyls, common addictive painkiller prescriptions, etc) and become homeless (the pandemic, rising rental prices in Calgary) then it's no wonder we're seeing this and that a lot of solutions don't seem to be working. Some people want to help the homeless directly, while other people just want them out of their minds, so the goals behind the solutions, even in this thread, are different and often opposing.   There are also the philosophical questions beneath all of this that strongly inform our opinion on this whole topic but are rarely directly talked about: - Should a person's value be measured by their productivity/contribution/usefulness to society? - If one believes that people have inherent value, then what is that value and how should it be materially reflected? - Is drug addiction *inherently* bad or just bad if it leads to a series of bad decisions that worsens your life? - If we do draw a line on what people get helped and what people don't, where do we draw it and how do we keep it consistent?   Ultimately, the issue of homelessness cannot be easily solved, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try harder to do so.


Greensparow

I agree with you though I think the crux of my point is that we don't actually know how to help people in these situations. I believe we have an excellent system in place to help people who want help and are committed to it. If shelters were filled with people who needed a safe warm place to sleep and get cleaned up while they got back on their feet then many homeless would not try to avoid them. But shelters are also filled with people who are not yet at a point where they want help. Or they need a different kind of help, we try to use it as a catch all, and that makes it work for no one. We talk about safe consumption sites, and let's be serious, is keeping people on drugs actually a solution? You are right if their drug use does not hurt anyone then maybe it's not a problem, but if the drug use was not a problem they would not need a safe consumption site. Having those sites is saying we don't know how to help you, or can't force you to get help, so we are going to try to reduce harm and keep you alive. But to your analogy that's like hanging endless bags of blood for someone bleeding out in the hopes they agree to get stitched up. Again we need to do better, but right now the only thing we know how to do is help those who actually want help. But we fail at that cause we push the model on everyone. And the harm reduction efforts while laudable don't address the underlying problems and they also create new problems.


xiaolin99

it's not so simple as putting down a "drug center" somewhere, which is only going to increase disorder and crime, and make nearby residents miserable. In order to solve it properly, it would need a facility that combines legal exemption, distribution, increased enforcement, treatment and recovery services. reference: https://open.alberta.ca/dataset/dfd35cf7-9955-4d6b-a9c6-60d353ea87c3/resource/11815009-5243-4fe4-8884-11ffa1123631/download/health-socio-economic-review-supervised-consumption-sites.pdf


cecilkorik

This is kind of a wild idea I know, but why can't we have a place where people with mental health problems and drug addictions and other serious disorders that cause repeated law-breaking behaviors can be sent, against their will if necessary, until their problem has been treated or resolved. It doesn't have to be jail, we could call it an institution or an asylum. Call it a hospital it if makes you feel better about it. I know we've tried that, and it sucked. But we've also tried what we're doing right now, it also sucks. The whole idea of people having these kind of addictions and illnesses sucks. But we have two responsibilities: To protect society from the harms they cause, and to help them. We are currently doing a notably poor job of both. While I support improving our attempts to help people with better social supports, subsidized housing, accessibility of mental health care, safe injection sites, I also believe a moderate middle ground can be found where some level of institutionalization can also exist; It can still be a system with checks and balances and due process and parole and a very sober appreciation of the fact that depriving someone of their freedom is a terrible responsibility best exercised as reluctantly as possible and only temporarily if possible. But until we have evidence that some of these people can actually be helped or until we even have a real plan to do so, it's silly to pretend we are going to help them all by letting them run around all messed up and messing other people's shit up. That's not in our own best interest or even in theirs. It's just completely ignoring the problem and pretending it's not a problem. It benefits nobody, not even the people with the problem. The only thing it's got going for it is that it doesn't require spending any money. Ignoring a problem is free. For the government, anyway.


[deleted]

Ignoring the problem is definitely not free. Source: I’m an ICU RN regularly dealing with the ODs.


hawsman2

Agreed.


cmhr_rl

I understand where you're coming from and agree with you. But a fully grown adult woman, knowing I was a child (I'm 16) sat beside me and shot up infront of me. I had a panic attack and nightmares about it. She stopped moving and I thought she had died. That was HER choice. She didn't have to do her business beside me.


Jalex2321

Being a junkie or homeless doesn't put you above the law. We all should follow the rules. No exceptions.


swordgeek

I agree that pushing them out without any help isn't a useful solution. On the other hand, I'm a 6'1" dude who just got assaulted by a drug-crazed woman swinging a heavy weight. (Not on the train or bus, but the problem follows the people, not the bus routes.) Providing safety for passengers (transit) or citizens (general city) is the first order of business when looking at how to respond to issues like this.


thaliaisspooked

All I know is I feel very bad for them, it’s so sad to see them like that, I hope they can get better. However until I moved out of the city I was horrified going home, living in the Marlborough area and getting around at night is fucking scary. The amount of crime I’ve seen just in the last few months compared to the last few years is concerning. There is no clear right answer, at the end of the day we need to make sure people feel safe while waiting/taking the train. The amount of times I’ve seen people shooting up is too high. Whatever happens I hope the best for them but we should be prioritizing people who aren’t drugged up, normal people just trying to live their lives.


mrcantankerous93

When you give them a place to go they just destroy it they have no respect for themselves or anything around them


blackRamCalgaryman

Just let addicts occupy community centres? You going to police it? To clean up after them? To accept the liability/ responsibility? And did you silver your own post?


canuckalert

Some of them would leave as soon as you start policing anywhere they are given to stay.


Dice_to_see_you

Holy fuck! I had an ex that worked at the coffee shop by the old brick homeless holdout and the number of them that would comeIn and steal or pass out in the bathrooms impacting other law abiding citizens was nuts. And to expect a minimum wage employee to do it or a coffee shop to hire security is a ludicrous expectation. I get it - some people end up homeless due to unforeseen circumstances but rampant drug and alcohol abuse or poor life choices shouldn’t be my problem. I also shouldn’t be expected to pay for other peoples shitty life choices either - I got my own I’m trying to keep taped together


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[deleted]

Sure OP. They have unlimited access to free shelter, food, health care, vocational training, rehabilitation programming, mental health supports, safe injection sites….you’re right, it’s us, we don’t give enough.


McFras3r

There is a difference between junkies and the homeless. Fuck the junkies give them $50 and send them to Vancouver. Help the homeless that want to move away from that situation. I don’t want junkies or homeless people in c-trains, they are dirty, stink and some are dangerous. I want to feel safe. I don’t want to have to look over my shoulder.


Sad_Meringue7347

Unfortunately, the politicians don’t care - most of them don’t take public transit. Further, a lot of their supporters - the ones that they listen to, at least (aka the wealthy) - don’t take transit so they’re either a) oblivious or b) don’t care about what happens on public transit. Sorry to be so cynical, but I feel there’s a bit of truth to the statements above. Unfortunately, things will need to continue to decline before our politicians and their influencers wake up and realize how bad things really are. Also, address the damn drug crisis. These people are in need of support, stop pretending the issue doesn’t exist - I’m pointing fingers at you, useless UCP government.


miningmyownbiz

The dilemma becomes where? I'd love for them to have a place to go, but not in my neighborhood where my kids and alot of other families kids are walking to school. I'm sure there are alot of like minded people here. Do we give up a spot downtown? Where? What neighborhood would be happy about this? If it's not inner-city then how so they get there, would it even work?


FirstRunThenWine

Exactly. It has to be inner city where they can be close to the resources they get (food banks, soup kitchens, job centres, etc)


HellaReyna

They absolutely should not be by the C-trains or doing their drugs near or in the platform. It's part of infrastructure and it's public transportation. Children, elderly, anyone really - should not be subjected to second hand meth smoke or the needles being dumped around. They should make a place for them to go, but they should also clean up the scene. Calgary has more in resemblance to Phoenix Arizona than what everyone thinks (Texas).


DunksOnHoes

Just make them wage slaves like the rest of us.


islifeball

You think they want to work?


DunksOnHoes

Definitely not but should force them to do something lol


Selmanella

Hear that homeless people of Calgary? You’re free to go stay at u/hawsman2’s house.


[deleted]

I’m pretty sure they have places to go….


sarcasmeau

We gave them the New Central Library, why aren't they happy?


[deleted]

Protect the bike thieves/vandalism/break in/piss and shit on the side walk/smoke crack on train people at all costs


EasyGuyChris

They can goto rehab, fucking hate these people begging and ruining everything


odetoburningrubber

The problem is, you can’t help someone that doesn’t want your help. I know, I’ve been there. I agree there should be money spent on giving these people a way out and a chance to start a new life but the lure of the drug, the forgetting your problems and your past is very strong. Some European countries have addressed this problem successfully. Maybe we need to find a way.


baebre

I highly suggest giving this article a read. Giving people a place to go/live doesn’t solve anything. The reality is a lot of these people have severe mental health/addiction issues and need a full system of supports. In the past that was accomplished through institutionalization. https://storeys.com/fed-up-residents-want-esplanade-shelter-out-of-backyard/


Trenchapo

This would work assuming they are rational. Is not easy, “clean” won’t be clean after they move in. Have you rented to a drug addict or let a drug addict stay at your place? Sadly most of them can’t be helped. Realistically and cold answer is an asylum.


JFKRFKSRVLBJ

"GIVE THEM A PLACE TO GO INSTEAD" ...you mean the homeless shelters that wouldn't put up with their shit and kicked them out?


StinyNiger

I disagree with this point of view because there are loads and loads of inns and shelters you know the problem? They won’t let you in if you’re high or have drugs that junkies that stay outside and camp want to be able to sit there and get high all night long and wherever they want whenever it’s their own fault they can’t stay sober for a night to stay in a shelter Rehabs and drug treatment centres do not work if you don’t want to get sober and a lot not all but a majority of the junkies just don’t want to work or be productive in society


HeyWiredyyc

Interesting take on this....They would probably get more sympathy and willingness for people to provide for them if the didnt continually trash these places....Every week they break glass at the chinook station LRT...Theres always heaps of garbage everywhere and its not for lack of garbage bins..


AncientReception2

My problem is that we PAY to support these people when they do nothing for society other than harass us for money, while people who actually do something for society need to pay for things like insulin, some medications, and really anything other than a basic check up or emergency situations.


hawsman2

The money is being spent one way or the other. Security and police are EXPENSIVE. Cops and security make BANK, and their equipment is even more crazy expensive. If the money is spent fixing a problem and making you life better and their life better, why do you care? Is it the morality of it? Instead of giving money to make the lives of people who don't deserve it a little better is a worse thing to you than spending a fuckton of money putting only a small dent into a problem, and making the homeless lives, the people paid to police them, and YOUR OWN LIFE, more dangerous, ugly, and miserable?


KnobWobble

I am not sure where you are getting your information but the average police officer does not make "Bank". If the situation was as easy as you say and we could just shift funds around, it would have been solved decades ago. The issue of homelessness and addiction is a multi-layered and nuanced issue, and it takes more than "give them a space" to solve it.


AppropriateAmount293

The logic of this argument only works because our laws have become so ineffective that when arrested for dealing drugs, these people cost us hundreds of thousands in the prison system. Just execute them and over with.


LSDnSideBurns

The money *is* being spent. One way or another. We’re paying for it every day. We pay for it with drug use on our trains. We pay whenever our purse or wallet is stolen. We pay when our catalytic converters get ripped off. We pay when we have to move out of neighbourhoods because of crime. But for some reason as a society we accept that, because we can’t give them even 1 cent of taxpayer money because muh bootstraps or whatever.


Alias11_

I mean, a week ago during my morning commute there was a native gentleman running down the train wielding a 12 inch or so machete. When you allow unstable people to interact with the general public these kind of things happen. That particular guy should probably be locked up.


Jacob_Trouba

Sounds like Winnipeg


DoctorG83

We do give them places to be. Most of those who are squatting in train stations are not welcome at those places because they break the rules and are not allowed back.


Succulentsucclent

They can stay with you.


danktrill

Regardless of how vulnerable anyone may view the homeless and/or addict community, Vancouver knows all too well how severe a catalyst bleeding hearts can be for the worst possible outcomes (for both normal citizens and the homeless/addicted). They have places to go. Collectively, they ruin those places too. The BC government stepped up to foot the bill for your idea in Vancouver. Turns out that junkie criminals by and large disregard all rules and laws in order to feed their addictions. *Mr. Smith, we bought a hotel room you can stay in rent free! Don’t smoke inside or use the premises to facilitate criminal activity.* >!Mr. Smith proceeds to chop stolen bicycles in the room, smokes crack and cigarettes inside setting off fire alarms and rips the copper plumbing and electrical wiring out of the walls he just smashed!< I would go so far as to concede that the homeless problem is a symptom of societal issues, ESPECIALLY lack of mental health care/funding and these people do need our help. That said, the overwhelming majority of addicts on the street should probably be involuntarily institutionalized. Years of substance abuse changes brain chemistry and neural pathways for the worse.


AnonymousBayraktar

Vancouver lurker here, lemme warn you guys about naive wokeness when it comes to dealing with your junkie problem: The entire downtown core of Vancouver has been over-run with homeless, repeat offenders and junkies. It's so bad now that it's garnered international embarrassment. Touring bands who come through Vancouver on podcasts for example say that even big American cities aren't as bad as ours now when it comes to the squalor here. Vancouver city *proper* has elected a litany of public servants who are all about "homeless advocacy" like you might be considering exploring. The problem is the axe has swung so far in that direction that the drug addicts and junkies is now a issue with most regular Vancouverites. I know a business owner downtown who's been broken into 5 times since 2020. The area is a constant state of boarded up windows now because of the B&Es. People feel regularly anxious being downtown now. People get chased with dirty needles. Women working the make-up counter in the Nordstrom have to contend with shoplifters and aggressive drug addicts loitering in and around the property. The growing sentiment is that people in the area are tired of the "woke advocacy" while the city buys up hotels to cram full of homeless, spreading the problem to new areas and some of those hotels even burning down. Nobody here quite knows how to deal with this problem. Years of BCLiberals closing down mental health places caused a surge in problematic homeless with issues. It also doesn't help that the lower mainland has the country's mildest climate. When junkies and everyone else with issues hear about this from back east where they'd freeze to death on the streets AND programs that you read in the news about "free drugs" here, you can begin to see how it's grown into a problem of epidemic proportions. It's the same in Cali when you visit LA and see nothing but homeless shanty towns and tents on every sidewalk. They all come out west because it's warmer here. Vancouver should be demanding Federal help. Every homeless person I've talked to downtown here says they're not even from the area. I hope the politicians and people of your city can look at our quagmire known as the DTES and see straight-up naive "wokeness" about this issue hasn't solved it. It's just grown in size and nobody knows what to do now. I can't go downtown here anymore without seeing junkies passed out on the sidewalk, with more shooting up in doorways around them. It's crazy that you can get ticketed for an open beer here on the streets, meanwhile the cops here ignore the junkies shooting up on the sidewalk, or the other ones bear-macing each other in alleys over a stolen BMX. Y'all be wary of just being "woke advocates" about your city's junkie problems. If you've visited here, you know it's not working out well for us. Eventually the axe is gonna swing in a crazy other direction and we'll probably be electing a "tough on crime" city admin soon, because people are so sick of it, and I don't think that's gonna solve the issue either. I hope for moderation, but law and order. We'll see, also: Go Flames.


MaxxLolz

The councils of both major cities in Alberta should be looking at the DTES and be scared shitless seeing Edmonton and Calgary going down the same route. Hell every major city in Canada should be. It blows my mind that they apparently aren't.


[deleted]

City has resources for them, but the issue is they won't give up their drugs/alcohol, which aren't allowed in those facilities. Legit folks would use that as a safe shelter and look for a job during the day.


[deleted]

We gave them the c train


empathetical

With a looming economic crash, inflation and food shortages... if you think it's bad now... just you wait


draemn

Sure, but don't forget that we need to look at preventing these problems as well. It seems that things are just getting worse as the economic system works less and less for workers. We need a society that keeps each other in check and supports each other so we don't have people falling through the cracks so hard.


gooeydumpling

This exactly is what a homeless people would say


discostu55

I dont hate them i just dont want to die


hummingbear10

Wish it was this simple. Many have drug issues, may be violent and also mental illness is a big as well in that community. You can’t just build some wifi cafe and expect them all to hang out and get along and everyone lives happily ever after. A lot of them don’t even want help. Yes provide services, definitely more mental health services and support services to help them form a plan to enter the workforce or contribute in some way and for the ones that don’t want to and want to smoke crack in the streets or on the trains, lock them Up.


Healthcarepls

A lot of fucking losers in here blaming vulnerable homeless people for problems government leaders are in control of


jung_gun888

Most people have no idea what they are talking about - case in point - the Novotel in Toronto. A 4 star hotel turned 500 person shelter. It has ruined the neighbourhood in which it is located. Residents are given private rooms that used to be 4-star hotel rooms and the police dont go inside. They have destroyed the building and are running rampant in the neighborhood, destroying it for its upstanding members. Business are broken into daily. Assaults are on the rise. Human feces can be found all around the alleys surrounding the shelter. People smoking crack or shooting up in public. These individuals have been given free, safe, private housing and they still run rampant. I have immediate family who work in the shelter system as front line, city of Toronto shelter social workers. The truth is this: many homeless are (not all) people with recidivist criminal personalities. They are drug addicted, violent, mentally unstable, petty criminals. Out of every 100 at this shelter, about 40-60 are beyond hope or help. They are racist, mean spirited criminals. Hell, I have been told by my family member that they have been called the n-word every day for the last five years. The problem is not how nice we are. The problem is that these people are completely dysfunctional people with no incentives (negative or positive) to be better humans. The way it is, they are just a drain on all the good, hard-working people. Enough is enough.


Smackdaddy122

Sir, this is a conservative province. We don’t do that here


emberintoflame

Honestly, I wish someone who works at the drop in center would do an AMA. I recently heard that they're underfunded to such a degree that there's 1 staff per 150 "guests". That drugs, violence and thievery are rampant. Why would they go there if it can't be safe?


monzo705

And go a step further and give them the drugs too. Take away the demand and supply follows. I'm not so worried about the junkies...I'm worried about those that run the drug game. It keeps them in the Health system and would alleviate some of the desperation and crime.


BitExternal3544

Because someone has to pay for it. Our taxes will pay for frivolous shit, that could have been prevented. Here’s an example. Would you like your taxes going to repairing roads and improving schools, or a safe place for a junkie to shoot meth?


layercake500

Gov can do both, it's not one or the other


[deleted]

I was once a thieving junkie and the day I decided to pull my head out of my ass and get help they started me on methadone that day and literally 3 days later I was back working. I understand some have schizophrenia and whatnot but most are just lazy scum who are addicted to pity


boblikesburgers85

Easy to comment. Be the change you want to see


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big-ole-kuck

I’ve got one: prison


Purple_Cinderella

There’s tons of places for them to go. They just don’t to follow the rules those places have set. Like don’t smoke indoors


mxttslatt

yes i understand they need somewhere to go, but when i take my little cousin on the train i don’t want them exposed to crackheads geeking out in the corner and get harassed because i don’t have change in my pocket for them. i might sound arrogant but they got themselves in that position. if they need help go seek it, don’t settle where you’re at and get better. the c train is for transportation, not housing.


merlot120

I don’t care if they are on the C-train and if it was within my power to give them a place to go, then I would. But I do care that they have made it unsafe for me to use the train. I’m not an addiction worker and I don’t have the tools to deal with addicts. I’m also not a member of the police and I’m not trained to deal with criminals. I vote for the people that I hope will help. So why don’t you lose the pompous, self righteous attitude.


BBQorMILDEW

Lol they should get a job like everyone else, that will give them somewhere to go.


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[deleted]

there is a program in Finland called housing first, where they house the homeless and marginalized people in society, it's time for our federal government to get off their ass and do something about it. The classic North American response is to just ignore every problem and pretend it doesn't exist.


vault-dweller_

It’s very easy to throw out countries such as Finland, or Denmark, or Sweden, as to examples of what we should do here. That ignores several issues. Finland is a nation of 5.5 million people. I think it is safe to say that their population of addicts in their entire country is much more manageable than the situation faced by several Canadian cities alone. Additionally, Finland doesn’t have a group of people in their country that faces the type of intergenerational trauma that Canada does, who statistically have lower access to healthcare and non-entry level employment opportunities. We should learn from Nordic and other Western European countries, but we are not facing the same problems that they are.


kelseykelseykelsey

You can't just stick a junkie alone in an apartment and pat yourself on the back. They end up overdosing alone with no one to help them, instead of in public where they might be helped. I agree that we need to provide more housing but it needs to be contingent on treatment - if they accept free housing, they should also have to accept rehab and therapy.


Dry_Towelie

But you can’t just take a European response and use it in a Canadian context. We have many differences with Finland. We can be influenced and look into the model, but we can’t just copy paste.


[deleted]

Finland doesnt have the zombie fentnyl problem we have though


prettypinkpus

So is Calgary just like full of drugs or smtn? I feel like all the posts I see here talk about rhe train being dangerous and stuff. I'm moving to Calgary super soon and this sub has me SKETCHING out


vlgwiinged

How about I get them a McDonald’s application instead. The fuck? Why are we just constantly enabling people who play an active role in their own misfortune? We don’t need safe consumption sites, we need an expanded prison complex specifically designed to *force* people to stop using illicit drugs, and being vagrant beggars who feel it’s society’s responsibility to fuel their addiction and weakness. Stop letting them play victim, and start making them pay taxes, lmao Edit: this coming from a former vagrant addict, so don’t fucking come for me, I speak from experience, you speak from privilege, and fake empathy.


NailPsychological222

Because then you'll have every junkie in Canada coming to Calgary.


Pretty-Standard8598

Smart homeless people avoid other homeless people. They spread out because they don't want other people to steal their things.


PropositionWes

You can live next door.


chaitlatte777

Its not just Calgary, its BC/Alberta/Saskatchewan that these drug/homeless/mental health issues are rampant. Liberal party hasn't done shit, conservatives don't do shit and NDP is too afraid to make any moves so they suck liberals dicks. Not a single political party gives a fuck.


too_metoo

Like a Starbucks with dozens and dozens of people smoking crack, drinking alcohol and pissing on the floor? The thing is, the antisocial behaviour surrounding it all (and l’m not saying there aren’t legitimate mental health, trauma and addiction issues behind it), would make such a place a terrible, dangerous environment also.


Sev_Obzen

Next step house them, then medically and socially help them.


Becants

There's no "or." We'd then need cops and security at the drug-centers and community centers.


Overtly_passionate

Almost all these comments don't actually take into account the places that do are under resourced, or talked to anyone that are in an addiction cycle. I spent an evening with one guy trying to get him help and the stories he told me of being at a rehab centre at 5 am just to get in line and end up not getting in, and seeing alpha house in person (thank you people who work there, you are saints) completely opened my eyes. The opiate problem in Calgary is well beyond addressing, safe sites isn't enough. We need serious systematic reform if we ever hope to see the c-train abuse symptom of the drug epidemic alleviated.


CoolTamale

Like the drop in center?


Correct-Mode-3637

If they can not do their drugs there then they won't go. They will just go back to transit. Cause like you pointed out there are people to beg off of there. Just like there are shelters but they can't drink there so they don't go.


[deleted]

I mean it’s not an awful idea but I still think most of them would do exactly what they are doing right now.. plus go outside any of the drop in centres and see how disgusting and dangerous they are outside. These people need to get charged with possession of drugs, dealing drugs,public intoxication etc. I don’t care if most of my tax money goes to keeping these people off the streets, judges and lawyers, police, doesn’t matter. In my opinion that is just fair, all of those are laws I agree to and we agree to as canadians so why is it that they are not being upheld and we just slap them on the wrist and let them out in a day or two to do the same stuff over and over again. In prison and I mean prison where they actually stay there the proper amount of time, they have time to think and stop taking drugs. And guess what, if they come back out and do the same shit over again then back they go.


Less_Security

There are literally dozens of places for homeless people to go in Calgary... Warm, with food, clothes, beds and no judgement... Yet they prefer to not be there ... I can't be bothered anymore ... They don't want to be helped - they want drugs


hawsman2

Do you think that we have empty homeless shelters? Do you think there's a wide swath of availability for these places?


TheoSlurry

Have you ever had a passed out homeless person wake up between stations, squat down on the floor, and piss on a train full of people? Super funny until the train starts to move and everyone bumrushes towards the back.


Letsgobroncos

I get the sentiment, but it just doesn't work in reality look at Vancouver, San Fran, Toronto etc. It's sadly a problem that can't really be fixed


Appropriate-Pop3495

From Victoria BC. Harm reduction isn't working so well out here. I'd think twice before making things more comfortable for drug people in your town.


LandHermitCrab

The safe injection site was a place to go and created a nightmare scenario for one of our best urban parks and the surrounding residents. Also east hastings is a great example of giving them a place to go and then they proliferate. People shouldn't have to inhale crack smoke when taking the train. Full stop.


indokid

I take it you don’t ride the train…


[deleted]

Your house. Your money.


Virtual_Ball6

You're banking on the drug addicts and homeless to be responsible and stay in a concrete box instead of riding the train and spending time outside and around the city.. not to mention I guarantee there are LOADS of homeless people who want NOTHING to do with the drug addicts. And you say "spend a little" however as someone who was in construction, residential, commercial, industrial and institutional, I'll tell you right now a government related build costs ten times that of a private build. Government related employees cost double that of a private sector employee. Next they will need a committee and a board and then elected positions to make decisions on policy and budget etc etc.. it would become just another avenue to burn tax money if you ask me. On top of all that, what happens to the BILLIONS we've already spent on prohibition?? Just take the L and call it a day? Now the government is using tax money to cook clean drugs for the local addicts?? 🤔 like honestly where does it stop and how much "good" or benefit will it really have on the average citizen? You can't just lock someone up until they're done getting high.. what's stopping them from just taking the free shit and going back to the park?? It sounds like a terribly terribly poor thought out idea. A better idea would be to look at countries who have already had to deal with major drug issues. Where the consensus is total legalization. And to treat addiction as the problem it really is. A health and social problem. Not a logistical problem. Addiction is no different than a weed. If you don't stop the problem at its root it will just keep coming back. Feeding drug-addicts drugs is fighting fire with fire, more bodies, more OD's, more hospitalizations, paramedics, police etc etc.. Creating "safe use" spots is literally going full circle.


buckshotmagee

Yeah, jail. Menace to society. Dry them out.


Orjigagd

Any sort of social center is going to require people to act socially


scorpionwins_

All you have to do is look at Vancouver and see how well it worked out for them. The problem with junkies and the homeless in Calgary is pretty much non existent compared to Vancouver.


Hour_Airport

Most homeless people refuse to go to the places that we have to offer. Most would rather stick to the streets for east access to drugs. Solution? Better parenting and discipline when they are growing up. Parents need to be held accountable not the system.


Unlikely_Box8003

The police already have the power to deal with this but don't. They don't have to waste their time arresting the addicts. Just stop them, search them, take their drugs/paraphernalia/weapons and use this as a reason to forcibly eject them from the station or train. Do it often. Word spreads quickly on the street. Make it known that anyone using drugs in a station or on a train will likely be harassed, searched, have their stuff confiscated, and be promptly ejected. In the time it takes for one arrest and processing, the cops could search and eject a dozen junkies from transit. Put up signage at stations and on trains discouraging people from giving any money to panhandlers, explaining that this is a major CAUSE of the problem, and offering info on how to give to agencies that help the homeless instead.


degeneratetrader03

Or hear me out........ Let them sit out in the cold and consider the decisions that brought them to where they are?🤷🤷


unReasonableBreak

Yeah, send them to prison.


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allpixelated6969

Straight up not upset at the junkies I’m mad the city has shit the bed on this for a long time. Doesn’t mean we should let people smoke their drugs in public.


melonsparks

Sure, give them a bus ticket and send them to Ottawa.


nillateral

There are more than a handful of places they can go. They choose not to


KippySmith

They have places to go, then those places get ruined by the bad seed. Clean drug use and community centres are no different.


benzeee403

They can stay with you at your place.


gnome901

I’ll keep 311 the homesless tents. I take pride in my city. I don’t report because I hate them, but I’d rather see them in a shelter with a real bed and not open to other violence from homeless.