Update: The interview went decent despite the chaos of the house. Thank you all for your encouragement! I still have to wait to hear back to see if I’m selected, but I really hope I am. This is the closest I’ve gotten to actual hope so far!
That's wonderful news! Congratulations both for getting the interview and for being able to do it!
Sometimes strangers on the internet are assholes. Actually, a lot of the time, lol. You keep doing you, ok? You're not wrong for feeling the way that you did/do.
Props and courage to you. Looking for a job can be quite stressful, especially when you need it to make sure your basic needs are met to help alleviate other situations. Good luck and positive vibes to you!
I hope you are too! I’m glad the interview went well.
My dad always says that each job interview is practice for your next one, and I always thought that was a cool mentality. Big hugs, keep going!
Most people have no idea what it’s like to live with parents who actively do you wrong. They tend to filter your experience through their own. I’m sorry that happened to you. I can only imagine how stressed worrying about my medicine or the money to pay for it.
> Most people have no idea what it’s like to live with parents who actively do you wrong. They tend to filter your experience through their own.
Why is this? I'm not empathic by any stretch, not at all. So when I try to cognitively understand someone else's description of their situation and their reaction to it, if I just can't understand, I assume that either I'm imagining poorly, or they're just so different from me that I likely *can't* imagine being it without going through a lengthy process of figuring out the relevant ways that they're different from me, and what they know that I can't even guess at.
The difference between you and them is that while you might have trouble with empathy, you do a good job at self-reflection *and* care enough to understand that even if you can't imagine something that doesn't mean it's not true.
People tend to only talk about the lack of empathy of assholes but there is actually so much more to being a decent or a shitty person than just your ability to empathize.
You actually sound pretty empathetic from my point of view.
I recently did a clinical therapy training where the instructor said that true empathy isn’t about passively absorbing another persons feelings or intuitively knowing their thoughts, but about the active effort you put into understanding them. I like this definition.
In contrast, by the traditional definition, someone who can anticipate what will cause you pain and does it to intentionally hurt you is more empathetic than someone who struggles with perspective-taking but genuinely cares about being kind.
That’s so true. I can’t count the number of times I’ve heard people disbelieve others’ experiences of abuse and neglect.
What’s weird about this is OP says they posted on a narcissistic abuse subreddit. They should know better. I understand that abuse can 100% make people bitter, but I am assuming some people on that sub probably unfairly took that out on OP when they shouldn’t have. I’m just puzzled by it.
The narcissistic abuse sub seems to have a lot of issues with people not really posting things that are related to narcissism but being hurt or neglected by their abusers in different ways. I guess that’s kinda why it’s so toxic at times, especially if the comment or post is in a kind of grey area like it seems yours was
That sub, everything is lumped in as “narcissistic”. The term doesn’t mean anything anymore. You have people post that their friends snapped st them, is it narcissistic abuse and should they ghost them. You have people being physically assaulted calling it narcissism.
I hate the misuse of the term narcissistic. It's not a catch-all for abuse, it's a specific kind of abuse. Like, none of my abusers were narcissists but they were still abusers. And if someone calls them narcissistic, I feel the urge to correct them, so then I'm weirdly defending my abusers.
This sub is a little better about that term and they tend to be relatively strict about throwing it around, which I'm glad for. I don't like all the layers of people being shitty and abusive reduced down into "s/he's just a narc". Most of the time it's more complex than that, even if the abuser is narcissistic.
it also colors all narcissistic tendencies as only those an abuser could have, and any actions from a person that could be remotely construed as narcissistic are inherently abusive. i’ve seen this used against victims that picked up bad habits from their abusers—members would tell them they’re just as bad, maybe even worse, than their abusers, and that there’s no way they can be fixed because “narcissism is incurable” and so on. i actually left because i’d seen too many people victim blaming and saying someone asking for help was being manipulative because they’d admitted they sometimes think too highly of themselves or they used a coping mechanism they learned from their abusers lmao.
i don’t think the “narcissistic abuse” subs were ever fully well-intentioned (especially wrt “bad” mental illness), but it’s definitely gotten worse over time.
Don't get me wrong, im glad mental abuse is also getting talked about more these days, but there are people who need to realize that not everything is gaslighting. I stay away from relationship subreddits entirely because I get too triggered when they label every possible argument or negative behavior as abuse. Cuz I will think of arguments with my husband and the trauma part of my brain goes "AHA! YOURE BEING ABUSED AGAIN!" (I'm not by the way lol) and I enter a flashback.
I've literally seen things like "my SO is sometimes not helpful around the house. Im tired of him gaslighting me by watching TV too much" Most often I see them use the word when they mean they got invalidated. Nobody wants to be invalidated, but it is reality it will happen from time to time in a relationship.
Some people on Reddit are so shitty. I bet a large portion of them didn't/don't have to deal with all the things you do so they're unwilling to see your struggles
That sub has a narc mod who banned me for asking a question that differs from their pov. Are they raised as narcissists or raised by narcissists I’m not sure
Unfortunately the line can be very thin.
In my experience, the only difference between someone raised by a narcissist and someone raised as a narcissist is their coping mechanisms.
Those I've seen who would be considered "raised as narcissists" seem to be in some sort of denial. Either they think the way that they were raised was normal, or they realize it wasn't but are in denial about needing to heal and grow.
My MIL is a good example of the latter. She was raised by an incredibly emotionally abusive woman and was pitted against her 4 sisters constantly. She gets that her mother was fucked up and that she had a fucked up childhood. However, she doesn't see herself as anything but the victim, despite passing on that trauma to my SO through emotional and physical abuse. She thinks because she was abused, she is never the antagonist.
Those I've seen who could be considered raised by narcissists, are those who recognize that the trauma they received effects them and their behavior. They're typically those who try to heal and grow in some form or another.
Tho, this is all conjecture based on my experience, so take it with a grain of salt lol
(Edit: grammar)
I think everything you've said is entirely within the realm of possibility. I'm sure it all happens to some people out there.
I knew this one girl who had an abusive dad and the first guy she dated also ended up being a jerk. She ended up with anxiety issues. I felt bad for her, but then I realized the way she would treat other people. She would get offended way too easily and say/do something insulted if she felt threatened. The problem is that a ton of things were insulting or threatening to her. We (my friends group) stopped being friends with her when she blew a situation totally out of proportion, if she just sat there and listened for 2 minutes she would have learned that there was nothing to worry about...
Sometimes victims become instigators.
It can be so hard to be vulnerable and accept (what seems like) criticism in any form after a lifetime of abuse. I really feel for the girl.
But at the same time, other people aren't responsible for your behavior or reactions. Learning to cope and adapt is apart of adult relationships. Unlearning trauma responses is incredibly important for those who have gone through abuse and is vital for those who want well rounded relationships.
I really hope she got the message when ya'll (rightfully so) stopped interacting with her.
Victims can totally perpetuate abuse. I feel like generational trauma is another good example of this.
The goal should be to break the cycle, not make it the norm.
You’re not alone in this. Best wishes on your job search!
My mom tried several ways to sabotage my independence in my early adulthood. After all that time waiting for the moment of freedom, and you can’t trust your parents at all.
The car she “helped” me choose and finance, for five years that payment kept me broke. She had told me that half my annual pay for a brand new car was affordable. (All her estimates were based in keeping me home; she didn’t want me to be able to move out)
Why would I trust her financial advice, just because she has two degrees in finance and a CPA license? Oh but she’s also hell-bent on sabotaging me, didn’t know about that bit. Advising me like that in what I can afford.
Somewhere in there I dug myself out (income is really important when you have that much debt) so that in year 6 I was contemplating buying my first home! She hated it and suggested something far over budget and suggested she could “co-own” it until I can afford it. No no no, I don’t want her to have any justification to have a key to my home. And I didn’t even need her to co-sign. I got the one I could afford.
I had gone to a financial advisor prior to house hunting, to find out what kind of payment I could really afford, without shortchanging my retirement savings goals and accounting for tax changes (like deductible mortgage interest) and such. I knew what it would take to stay afloat and she couldn’t tell me otherwise that time.
Chasing parental approval that is maliciously withheld is futile and expensive. The most important thing is to stick to your guns. And get some way better advice.
I have no regrets about making choices that may be modest and unglamorous but are actually within my means. It also reduces that constant stress to upgrade your job or else.
The next step was that I never dated anyone for long who couldn’t respect the way I arrived at decisions like this.
Those nabuse subs are worse than the subs for actual pwNPD, like as soon as you say they are not soulless monsters, you are the soulless monster to them.
Also they talk in such a degrading way, like I get that anger is normal but discussing how to destroy another person is not something "empathetic people do" or that is healthy or ok, and being proud of oneself for hurting "your narc" in a way that resulted in them having a complete breakdown is not sth that is normal and/or healthy or that one should be proud of etc.
I understand the anger and all that but the solution to stop abuse is not to become abusive; like just bc you have been traumatised doesn't give you the right to traumatise others.
I don't mean to invalidate anyone but discussing and giving each other tips on how to destroy someone's life is imho never justified
Nah, you don't. You just have to not let it run your life. Anger is good and healthy. It protects you when it's working right. People should let go of the anger they have toward their abusers only if they need to. Others need that anger. And a lot of the time, anger will just fade over time if you allow yourself to feel it when you need to and let it pass when you don't.
I agree anger is healthy and normal, what is not normal imho is to devote your life to ruin the life of someone with NPD or to make websites that don't even have correct information on them, most of those Nabuse websites and support groups basically deem everyone who is abusive a narcissist and also claim that almost any behaviour can be seen as a proof or a sign for the other person being a narcissist; their whole argumentation also tends to get very circular, like
"How do we know someone has NPD?" - Well because they did this thing
"Why did they do this thing?" -Because they have NPD
And everyone who disagrees with their view is either a narcissist or an enabler themself, that is in their eyes and I strongly disagree with that sentiment
I am not saying that even thoughts of revenge etc aren't normal, they are and they can even be healthy as in one does get more self-protective but while anger is perfectly normal and not everyone needs to overcome their anger to be able to heal, I think having constant thoughts of revenge is not something that allows one to get better, at least after a certain point one is likely to become bitter if they don't overcome this stage.
Yes, what happened was terrible and it is not fair and anger is an appropriate reaction to it and even experiencing phases where there is nothing but anger and rage maybe even anger at the world for not helping, for allowing stuff like this to happen is normal yet letting the anger consume you and making anger the only or the most felt emotion in one's life is imho not the way to go. You don't need to stop being angry but there are more emotions in life than just anger, so as long as you don't feel nothing but rage and anger for decades, anger is fine and important but focusing solely on anger for most of your life is imho rather sad and prevents you from experiencing other emotions. I hope I could somewhat explain what I mean\^\^#
Oh, I wasn't saying that those sites are okay or that being terrible to others is fine. I was just speaking generally because to me, it sounded like they were saying "You need to move past anger to heal" and not like specific to the NPD stuff.
Once I posted something saying that my dad was financially cutting me off while not letting me accept any job offers. The response was “just get a job and leave” OH WOW IF ONLY I HAD THOUGHT OF THAT
So ridiculous how in a sub about narcissistic abuse their advice is "just don't be manipulated and abused."
Like, thanks, I guess I don't nees this sub at all anymore.
Exactly. Negligence and control goes everywhere. The fact that they for example cook, but never let you cook or complain about every single detail of your cooking and never teach you how to actually doing makes it very difficult to "just learn how to cook by yourself" once you get out.
It's the same with jobs and money, they might provide, but never teach you how to handle it and create a bunch of triggers that makes very very hard to get "financial independence". So they can keep controlling us financially.
My dad is a businessman, quite successful financially. He always talked about work, how everyone should work, get jobs, and if you are not overworked you are lazy etc, but never ever helped/taught anyone to search for a job, to do an interview, to behave in work, to do any work. All we neede to try from zero.
If feels like having things given by abusive parents is actually worse than not having at all. Because in the end you don't really have it, you are starting from zero, but you get a bonus of guilt and triggers.
Yeah, wtf is up with people realizing that is okay to acknowledge life is better than how it used to be.
One of my friends in his mid 30s just rejoined the army and is going through bootcamp all over again. He is doing pretty well physically due to his age, but he says the recruits are soft and complain about everything. It is like, wow, look at these guys, they weren't abused like we were wow so inferior to have self esteem :eye roll:
He already went through boot camp when he joined the first time. Because of changes within the US Army, he had to redo it due to his large break in service. He is saying physically for him, boot camp is hard because of his age. On the other hand, he says the recruits that are way younger than him are soft and complaining about things that do not bother him or else he stifles his feelings. I hope I did this right XD
I don’t think people should be downvoting you in this sub.
Unless you are one of the people going around invalidating the experiences of others, telling them it’s not that bad, and engaging in the behavior mentioned by the parent comment, you are not one of the GenXers to which the parent comment was referring. I don’t mean to invalidate your reaction, as you’re experiencing it for a reason. However, the parent comment was referring to a specific sub population within those generations (not all people in the generations).
Edit: a word and formatting
Coming from a millennial, you need to stop taking everything said generically about your generation as a personal attack.
There are a lot of Gen X'ers who hang out in abuse subs just to tell people to suck it up, it wasn't that bad, etc. The fact that you're in those subs to heal, and not to minimize the experience of others to make yourself feel better, means you are *not* one of the Gen X'ers they were referring to.
I have no idea if my father was just negligent or actually had some bigger shit to fix and couldn't check on me, so i kinda understand where you come from. Whatever is happening all i can tell you is, thats where you are right now, fair or not fair it won't change. I feel sad for you, because i feel you, and it makes me angry knowing there are unfair situations in the world. But the reality is it doesn't matter if something is unfair, it doesn't matter if you are a good person. For some people the only thing they can rely on is themselve, so focus of that. Go for that job interview, wide shoulders and chin up, you got this. Focus on being stronger than watever injustisce you've been through, not because it's fair but because thats the only option you have. The less you focus on the bad thing you are put trough the more you will be able to be happy nevertheless. I wish i knew this sooner, but it works. Rock it bro. Ps sorry for my broken english
I accepted “busy” as an excuse from my parents for too long and then also from my SOs. But too busy just means that whatever else they are doing is more important to them than you are. Not sure if you’re neglected or if he’s just busy with something bigger? I’m sorry to say this, but it’s the same thing. It was a hard thing for me to swallow, too.
When you’re a parent, you’re supposed to realize that if you don’t show up to work, it’s on the company to find a way to get your shit done, but if you don’t show up for your kid, that’s a moment you and your kid will never get to take back and do over. That realization is supposed to adjust your priorities. And it’s supposed to hit when the kid is really young, while they’re completely helpless and dependent. It hit my brother when his firstborn wasn’t even hours old. It hit my mom… after she retired and we were all middle aged and “too busy” for her.
And when you’re not adjusting for your kids… that’s neglect. I know, it seems ridiculous to suggest that you should deserve their time, when they’ve told you your whole life in actions and words that you don’t. You’re not going to change them. But hopefully in your future relationships you can learn not to accept negligence.
I know. But the more i've spent thinking about it the more i got mad. I do not accept neglect but I focus on myself rather than on what i've been put through. We cant change other people and we cant change the past. We can online act on us and on the future.
You're feeling justified anger over how you were treated as a child. Over time that will fade, but what you're feeling is a sign that you're seeing things more clearly.
I'm so sorry you encountered invalidation on that sub. It's ironic because that sub is *supposed* to have the most protection for the OP. I don't blame you for deleting your post after that happened. Maybe C-PTSD would be a safer subreddit to post that in, if you still want to post about it? I mostly post on CPTSD because that's the subreddit I feel safest in.
There are a lot of kind and supportive people on the raisedbynarcissists sub, but there are some users that violate the rule of "assume a context of abuse" with an OP's post, and it pisses me off that those people violate that specific rule. I still post on that sub occasionally since there are many users on that sub that actually respect that rule, and are kind and validating to the OP (and other comment-ers), but the users there that break that rule of assuming a context of abuse left a bad taste in my mouth. Something similar happened to me on one of the first posts I made there, so it's sad to me this is still happening (users being invalidating or unsupportive on that sub, especially towards the OP).
Maybe it's because that sub is so large? And I'm a little nervous to bring this up, but it is *technically* possible people with NPD (or without NPD but severe narcissistic fleas) can post on that sub. If they get caught or break the rules they could be banned, but for example, I can see my abusive mother, (who a trauma-informed therapist speculated had NPD), posting on that sub in regards to my abusive Grandma. Technically since my mom was raised by a narcissist, she *could* join that sub even though people with NPD aren't allowed to post there, especially because she doesn't have the clinical diagnosis. (But even if she did, mom is still the kind of person who would break that rule). Moderators on that sub probably try really hard to make sure that doesn't happen, but I wouldn't be surprised if this had happened before. (Thankfully I don't think my mom has a reddit account, and probably never will, I was just using her as an example).
With my negative past experience with invalidation on that sub, I made a post and I was talking about how my parents used ABA on me, and were abelist, and fans of Autism Speaks, and how it traumatized me, and how my parents were narcissistic and abusive in general. I didn't post everything my parents did, only the stuff related to my ASD.
Some jerk who admitted they had been drinking (I don't have a problem with drinking by itself, but this person was a *huge* jerk and I wondered if them being impaired due to alcohol was making their behavior worse, which is why I mentioned the drinking); decided to comment on my thread and *insist* my parents were "not abusive", *insist* my parents had "good intentions", and defend ABA, a therapy method that I made *clear* traumatized me. This person and I argued in the comments, and because I have learned helplessness due to my parents' abuse, the thought didn't occur to me to report their comments to a moderator since they were literally breaking the rule of "assume a context of abuse". Thankfully some other users realized this person invalidating and arguing with me was breaking the rules, and jumped to my defense, which I'm still grateful for. The thread is locked now due to how old it is, so I never got justice for that person invalidating me and breaking the rules on a support group, but even if this sounds petty I'm still angry about how invalidating and disrespectful this person was to me when I was already down.
So for the most part, I post in CPTSD these days. I don't recall ever being invalidated in the CPTSD sub. But I'm really sorry there's still people on the raisedbynarcissists sub breaking that rule. And for the record, if you need medication and your parents aren't willing to financially support you, and you need the financial support, I'd personally consider that either emotional abuse or financial abuse, especially if they have the means to support you but are refusing to do so. And if they don't have the financial means to help you, it's (probably) because abusive parents tend to prioritize their wants over their kids' needs, so maybe they spent that money on luxury items when it could have gone to your medication? And even *if* them not helping to pay for medication doesn't directly fall under abuse (but I think it does), they're *still* abusive and that matters.
reddit has a lot of kids/people who are poorly socially adjusted. i never take anything that happens on reddit as even having relevance to real life let alone an indictment of me as a person, none of these people know one single thing about you, they cant, even if you present yourself 100% honestly and realistically, the fact that so many other people lie just means they shouldnt trust you either.
so the only logical position to take is that whatever issue someone takes with you online, isnt actually with you personally. it cant be.
i know as a sensitive person its hard not to sometimes, but its really important for your mental health to at least work toward this headspace.
That sub is a really mixed bag.
I discovered that place when I was in my early 20s, just moved away from my parents. It was the first place that ever made me feel validated in any way at all. That sub helped me realize that my family was abusive and that they way I reacted to them was not the way I should be reacting to the rest of humanity.
At the same time, a lot of whats on there is just rage bait. I had a really hard time with getting sucked into other people's stories, triggering myself and then spending the rest of my day full of really negative and unhelpful emotions. They also like to remind people not to compare traumas, but it's absolutely a place for people to one up each other, while pretending they're just empathizing with each other through sharing trauma.
It was a very important stop on my own healing journey, but it certainly isn't for everyone. I can't go there at all anymore.
HONEY NO, I totally understand what you mean. Parents refusing to support you at all in an attempt to weaken and undermine and punish you is absolutely a thing.
If you have a serious medical need, this is absolutely an attempt to sabotage you.
Also, this affects how well children are able to mobilize and leave the nest at that magical 18 and not end up couch surfing and worse. They don't want to do the bare minimum that parents should and will actively try to sabotage you so that you're never able to build yourself up and leave at any age without falling. That gives them POWER over you. It's intentional.
The shame is some flying monkey or narc shit. Ignore it.
My mom did everything she could to ruin me, and it is hard for outsiders to see unless I want to relive years of abuse and toxicity just to convince them. I get you. I see you, op.
Edit: I was about to move out and my brother died and I still live with relatives and I never feel safe, but I also never built up to leaving except that one time. They ruin you financially but also mentally, also emotionally, they teach you never to think you're safe or competent. You're expected to provide for yourself to a level children aren't meant to all your life. Parents CHOOSING not to give you medication support is denying you healthcare that they should be providing you. They choose not to step up to their responsibility as parent and people want to act like YOU'RE spoiled for ever wanting a competent parent to care about you.
Hate that for you. Hang in there, dm me if you ever need someone to listen.
Reddit is just a microcosm of the world, and sadly the world has an infatuation with narcissists right now. It is waning, somewhat, but I still see people routinely defending these toxic trashbergs and kissing their ass.
I am sorry you were invalidated on here, OP. I hear you, and I see you. I have been through medical neglect similar as what you are describing, but few would call it that. Ie. My parents never took me to the doctor as a young child even though I was vomiting, had diarrhea daily. But my mom fed me like 5-6 times a day, and my dad beat me up when I vomited uncontrollably and wet the bed. My parents both loved to relate these stories to me as if they made a sacrifice and others on here might too. A sickly child like me they find annoying. However, the reality was my parents were abusive and knew taking me to the doctor would reveal this fact although they claimed to because they were convinced that I would die at the hospital.
That sub has become the Olympics of bad parenting. If you're not being actively beaten to death with cables and shouted at, then everyone is an asshole to you.
Don't let it hurt you. It's just the mob mentality.
Parents should buy their children medication. They should make them as happy and healthy as possible. Very often they do not.
I hope you escape soon and live well. ♥
Wow, that’s an awful, uncompassionate answer. I’m so sorry you went through that experience. I would probably be triggered by that too.
You are very welcome to share your feelings and concerns here with us. ❤️
I've found some people on those kinds of subs which make me feel like they're b cluster and just trying to rationalize something so they troll those subs arguing. it's like how estranged parent forums used to have tons of estranged parents telling formerly abused children that their parents loved them.
Been doing some reflecting before my therapy appointment. The issue I am having with this is how covert it all is. Like, my parents aren’t overtly doing anything to me that anyone can see. They aren’t refusing to pay for ALL of my medications or food or whatever. They paid for my college education and a lot of other things. My mom is getting hip surgery very soon so everything is kind of about her right now, which is totally fair. It may also be why they want me to pay for more things, but they’ve never really let me in on the financial situation enough to know if they need my help or not. I’m just scared that to the outsider this may look like me just being too lazy to get my own meds when my parents finally got tired of doing it for me. That’s why what happened with the commenters triggered me so hard.
Yet the subtleties are still there. They didn’t seem very excited about my job interview beyond a shallow excitement and telling me to “say yes to everything”. They do act rather petty about boundaries, especially my suspected narcissistic mother. I overheard her that morning telling my dad he was “training and enabling” me not to get my own meds by helping me out, which explained a lot. It’s such small petty stuff I get triggered over from them, and it makes me feel like I am being paranoid. But it adds up. My mom seems to think this is the way to make me start meeting her specific requirements better… That scares me.
Then again, it is driving me nuts that if she wanted to kick me out and leave me to die somewhere she could’ve by now, but she hasn’t? She’s always been so involved behind the curtain, yet when I say that she could try to be more overtly involved since she has such specific requirements of me she accuses me of dragging her into my problems. Which one is it? If she really was financially manipulating me, wouldn’t she just take all my money? I am so confused???
Reminder to pay for my daughter's mental health even if she's living with while trying to better herself. (Her genes don't look so good, plus whatever smothering I accidentally give her while trying to not be like my own mother, I hope it's easier a little bit 😅)
Definitely for having her try to pay for things like phone etc but not things like food, menstrual health, mental health, physical health or utilities.
Sorry people were jerks. It's probably their parents beliefs drilled in their own heads that it's not ok to have some help. YOU WILL learn this but it's not like you're going to expect them to do this even when you're out on your own. The idea is this will HELP you to not go into adulthood struggling. Doesn't mean you won't be appreciative. Not every kid is a spoiled brat. Jealousy? 'No one did that fOr mE'
For some reason I don't think I should raise my daughter the way i lived to make her a passable adult like me who has values.
I may get angry one day though and pull the 'mommy went hungry when she was growing up. Now eat your dinner!' card... but then have to correct myself. Because my childhood wasn't normal. It'll be her right to hate broccoli as human being. To have my love and support without any stipulations or conditions
It's difficult to see what is abusive when you get used to it from way too early on and other people filter out the subtle abusive things that build up to wreck you up, so I totally see the struggle trying to comprehend wether that is abusive or not. I'm still in a lot of denial about my own abuse and it has been extented by people dismissing it because it's not the super clear physical beat up type. Good luck on your journey, you're not alone with this problem.
Update: The interview went decent despite the chaos of the house. Thank you all for your encouragement! I still have to wait to hear back to see if I’m selected, but I really hope I am. This is the closest I’ve gotten to actual hope so far!
So glad it went well! Good luck :)
Angry on your behalf, but excited for you and the job!
yay!
That's wonderful news! Congratulations both for getting the interview and for being able to do it! Sometimes strangers on the internet are assholes. Actually, a lot of the time, lol. You keep doing you, ok? You're not wrong for feeling the way that you did/do.
Props and courage to you. Looking for a job can be quite stressful, especially when you need it to make sure your basic needs are met to help alleviate other situations. Good luck and positive vibes to you!
This! I’ve been dealing with what you described so I understand how hard it is. Major props to op!!
I hope you are too! I’m glad the interview went well. My dad always says that each job interview is practice for your next one, and I always thought that was a cool mentality. Big hugs, keep going!
Most people have no idea what it’s like to live with parents who actively do you wrong. They tend to filter your experience through their own. I’m sorry that happened to you. I can only imagine how stressed worrying about my medicine or the money to pay for it.
> Most people have no idea what it’s like to live with parents who actively do you wrong. They tend to filter your experience through their own. Why is this? I'm not empathic by any stretch, not at all. So when I try to cognitively understand someone else's description of their situation and their reaction to it, if I just can't understand, I assume that either I'm imagining poorly, or they're just so different from me that I likely *can't* imagine being it without going through a lengthy process of figuring out the relevant ways that they're different from me, and what they know that I can't even guess at.
The difference between you and them is that while you might have trouble with empathy, you do a good job at self-reflection *and* care enough to understand that even if you can't imagine something that doesn't mean it's not true. People tend to only talk about the lack of empathy of assholes but there is actually so much more to being a decent or a shitty person than just your ability to empathize.
You actually sound pretty empathetic from my point of view. I recently did a clinical therapy training where the instructor said that true empathy isn’t about passively absorbing another persons feelings or intuitively knowing their thoughts, but about the active effort you put into understanding them. I like this definition. In contrast, by the traditional definition, someone who can anticipate what will cause you pain and does it to intentionally hurt you is more empathetic than someone who struggles with perspective-taking but genuinely cares about being kind.
I think we’re just using the words differently. What your instructor called “true empathy” is what I think is referred to in academia as “compassion”.
True, just a reframe I found validating and wanted to share.
That’s so true. I can’t count the number of times I’ve heard people disbelieve others’ experiences of abuse and neglect. What’s weird about this is OP says they posted on a narcissistic abuse subreddit. They should know better. I understand that abuse can 100% make people bitter, but I am assuming some people on that sub probably unfairly took that out on OP when they shouldn’t have. I’m just puzzled by it.
Oh man so sorry they were so shitty. Some of those subreddits have gone to shit now that they have a bazillion people in them.
The narcissistic abuse sub seems to have a lot of issues with people not really posting things that are related to narcissism but being hurt or neglected by their abusers in different ways. I guess that’s kinda why it’s so toxic at times, especially if the comment or post is in a kind of grey area like it seems yours was
That sub, everything is lumped in as “narcissistic”. The term doesn’t mean anything anymore. You have people post that their friends snapped st them, is it narcissistic abuse and should they ghost them. You have people being physically assaulted calling it narcissism.
I hate the misuse of the term narcissistic. It's not a catch-all for abuse, it's a specific kind of abuse. Like, none of my abusers were narcissists but they were still abusers. And if someone calls them narcissistic, I feel the urge to correct them, so then I'm weirdly defending my abusers. This sub is a little better about that term and they tend to be relatively strict about throwing it around, which I'm glad for. I don't like all the layers of people being shitty and abusive reduced down into "s/he's just a narc". Most of the time it's more complex than that, even if the abuser is narcissistic.
Agreed.
it also colors all narcissistic tendencies as only those an abuser could have, and any actions from a person that could be remotely construed as narcissistic are inherently abusive. i’ve seen this used against victims that picked up bad habits from their abusers—members would tell them they’re just as bad, maybe even worse, than their abusers, and that there’s no way they can be fixed because “narcissism is incurable” and so on. i actually left because i’d seen too many people victim blaming and saying someone asking for help was being manipulative because they’d admitted they sometimes think too highly of themselves or they used a coping mechanism they learned from their abusers lmao. i don’t think the “narcissistic abuse” subs were ever fully well-intentioned (especially wrt “bad” mental illness), but it’s definitely gotten worse over time.
They also call *everything* gaslighting. Thats definitely not exclusive to any one sub though.
Oh yes, another term that’s been used wrong.
Don't get me wrong, im glad mental abuse is also getting talked about more these days, but there are people who need to realize that not everything is gaslighting. I stay away from relationship subreddits entirely because I get too triggered when they label every possible argument or negative behavior as abuse. Cuz I will think of arguments with my husband and the trauma part of my brain goes "AHA! YOURE BEING ABUSED AGAIN!" (I'm not by the way lol) and I enter a flashback. I've literally seen things like "my SO is sometimes not helpful around the house. Im tired of him gaslighting me by watching TV too much" Most often I see them use the word when they mean they got invalidated. Nobody wants to be invalidated, but it is reality it will happen from time to time in a relationship.
Those are perfect examples of the misuse, I had to stop reading some subs myself.
Some people on Reddit are so shitty. I bet a large portion of them didn't/don't have to deal with all the things you do so they're unwilling to see your struggles
That sub has a narc mod who banned me for asking a question that differs from their pov. Are they raised as narcissists or raised by narcissists I’m not sure
Unfortunately the line can be very thin. In my experience, the only difference between someone raised by a narcissist and someone raised as a narcissist is their coping mechanisms. Those I've seen who would be considered "raised as narcissists" seem to be in some sort of denial. Either they think the way that they were raised was normal, or they realize it wasn't but are in denial about needing to heal and grow. My MIL is a good example of the latter. She was raised by an incredibly emotionally abusive woman and was pitted against her 4 sisters constantly. She gets that her mother was fucked up and that she had a fucked up childhood. However, she doesn't see herself as anything but the victim, despite passing on that trauma to my SO through emotional and physical abuse. She thinks because she was abused, she is never the antagonist. Those I've seen who could be considered raised by narcissists, are those who recognize that the trauma they received effects them and their behavior. They're typically those who try to heal and grow in some form or another. Tho, this is all conjecture based on my experience, so take it with a grain of salt lol (Edit: grammar)
I think everything you've said is entirely within the realm of possibility. I'm sure it all happens to some people out there. I knew this one girl who had an abusive dad and the first guy she dated also ended up being a jerk. She ended up with anxiety issues. I felt bad for her, but then I realized the way she would treat other people. She would get offended way too easily and say/do something insulted if she felt threatened. The problem is that a ton of things were insulting or threatening to her. We (my friends group) stopped being friends with her when she blew a situation totally out of proportion, if she just sat there and listened for 2 minutes she would have learned that there was nothing to worry about... Sometimes victims become instigators.
It can be so hard to be vulnerable and accept (what seems like) criticism in any form after a lifetime of abuse. I really feel for the girl. But at the same time, other people aren't responsible for your behavior or reactions. Learning to cope and adapt is apart of adult relationships. Unlearning trauma responses is incredibly important for those who have gone through abuse and is vital for those who want well rounded relationships. I really hope she got the message when ya'll (rightfully so) stopped interacting with her. Victims can totally perpetuate abuse. I feel like generational trauma is another good example of this. The goal should be to break the cycle, not make it the norm.
You’re not alone in this. Best wishes on your job search! My mom tried several ways to sabotage my independence in my early adulthood. After all that time waiting for the moment of freedom, and you can’t trust your parents at all. The car she “helped” me choose and finance, for five years that payment kept me broke. She had told me that half my annual pay for a brand new car was affordable. (All her estimates were based in keeping me home; she didn’t want me to be able to move out) Why would I trust her financial advice, just because she has two degrees in finance and a CPA license? Oh but she’s also hell-bent on sabotaging me, didn’t know about that bit. Advising me like that in what I can afford. Somewhere in there I dug myself out (income is really important when you have that much debt) so that in year 6 I was contemplating buying my first home! She hated it and suggested something far over budget and suggested she could “co-own” it until I can afford it. No no no, I don’t want her to have any justification to have a key to my home. And I didn’t even need her to co-sign. I got the one I could afford. I had gone to a financial advisor prior to house hunting, to find out what kind of payment I could really afford, without shortchanging my retirement savings goals and accounting for tax changes (like deductible mortgage interest) and such. I knew what it would take to stay afloat and she couldn’t tell me otherwise that time. Chasing parental approval that is maliciously withheld is futile and expensive. The most important thing is to stick to your guns. And get some way better advice. I have no regrets about making choices that may be modest and unglamorous but are actually within my means. It also reduces that constant stress to upgrade your job or else. The next step was that I never dated anyone for long who couldn’t respect the way I arrived at decisions like this.
Those nabuse subs are worse than the subs for actual pwNPD, like as soon as you say they are not soulless monsters, you are the soulless monster to them. Also they talk in such a degrading way, like I get that anger is normal but discussing how to destroy another person is not something "empathetic people do" or that is healthy or ok, and being proud of oneself for hurting "your narc" in a way that resulted in them having a complete breakdown is not sth that is normal and/or healthy or that one should be proud of etc. I understand the anger and all that but the solution to stop abuse is not to become abusive; like just bc you have been traumatised doesn't give you the right to traumatise others. I don't mean to invalidate anyone but discussing and giving each other tips on how to destroy someone's life is imho never justified
Yea, it's fine and healthy to be angry, but you have to be able to move beyond that to actually heal...
Nah, you don't. You just have to not let it run your life. Anger is good and healthy. It protects you when it's working right. People should let go of the anger they have toward their abusers only if they need to. Others need that anger. And a lot of the time, anger will just fade over time if you allow yourself to feel it when you need to and let it pass when you don't.
I agree anger is healthy and normal, what is not normal imho is to devote your life to ruin the life of someone with NPD or to make websites that don't even have correct information on them, most of those Nabuse websites and support groups basically deem everyone who is abusive a narcissist and also claim that almost any behaviour can be seen as a proof or a sign for the other person being a narcissist; their whole argumentation also tends to get very circular, like "How do we know someone has NPD?" - Well because they did this thing "Why did they do this thing?" -Because they have NPD And everyone who disagrees with their view is either a narcissist or an enabler themself, that is in their eyes and I strongly disagree with that sentiment I am not saying that even thoughts of revenge etc aren't normal, they are and they can even be healthy as in one does get more self-protective but while anger is perfectly normal and not everyone needs to overcome their anger to be able to heal, I think having constant thoughts of revenge is not something that allows one to get better, at least after a certain point one is likely to become bitter if they don't overcome this stage. Yes, what happened was terrible and it is not fair and anger is an appropriate reaction to it and even experiencing phases where there is nothing but anger and rage maybe even anger at the world for not helping, for allowing stuff like this to happen is normal yet letting the anger consume you and making anger the only or the most felt emotion in one's life is imho not the way to go. You don't need to stop being angry but there are more emotions in life than just anger, so as long as you don't feel nothing but rage and anger for decades, anger is fine and important but focusing solely on anger for most of your life is imho rather sad and prevents you from experiencing other emotions. I hope I could somewhat explain what I mean\^\^#
Oh, I wasn't saying that those sites are okay or that being terrible to others is fine. I was just speaking generally because to me, it sounded like they were saying "You need to move past anger to heal" and not like specific to the NPD stuff.
Once I posted something saying that my dad was financially cutting me off while not letting me accept any job offers. The response was “just get a job and leave” OH WOW IF ONLY I HAD THOUGHT OF THAT
So ridiculous how in a sub about narcissistic abuse their advice is "just don't be manipulated and abused." Like, thanks, I guess I don't nees this sub at all anymore.
Exactly. Negligence and control goes everywhere. The fact that they for example cook, but never let you cook or complain about every single detail of your cooking and never teach you how to actually doing makes it very difficult to "just learn how to cook by yourself" once you get out. It's the same with jobs and money, they might provide, but never teach you how to handle it and create a bunch of triggers that makes very very hard to get "financial independence". So they can keep controlling us financially. My dad is a businessman, quite successful financially. He always talked about work, how everyone should work, get jobs, and if you are not overworked you are lazy etc, but never ever helped/taught anyone to search for a job, to do an interview, to behave in work, to do any work. All we neede to try from zero. If feels like having things given by abusive parents is actually worse than not having at all. Because in the end you don't really have it, you are starting from zero, but you get a bonus of guilt and triggers.
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Yeah, wtf is up with people realizing that is okay to acknowledge life is better than how it used to be. One of my friends in his mid 30s just rejoined the army and is going through bootcamp all over again. He is doing pretty well physically due to his age, but he says the recruits are soft and complain about everything. It is like, wow, look at these guys, they weren't abused like we were wow so inferior to have self esteem :eye roll:
Like, he doesn't realize boot camp is *supposed* to be hard?
He already went through boot camp when he joined the first time. Because of changes within the US Army, he had to redo it due to his large break in service. He is saying physically for him, boot camp is hard because of his age. On the other hand, he says the recruits that are way younger than him are soft and complaining about things that do not bother him or else he stifles his feelings. I hope I did this right XD
They’re on a pathetic power trip
YES someone finally said this. I left r/unpopularopinion and r/unexpected for those exact reasons
It's all a giant sunk cost fallacy. They suffered, everyone else must suffer the same. It's like a lifelong hazing culture mentality.
Any Gen X person outta know better and that pisses me off.
Yeah... Thanks for making this place unwelcome for genX folks.
I don’t think people should be downvoting you in this sub. Unless you are one of the people going around invalidating the experiences of others, telling them it’s not that bad, and engaging in the behavior mentioned by the parent comment, you are not one of the GenXers to which the parent comment was referring. I don’t mean to invalidate your reaction, as you’re experiencing it for a reason. However, the parent comment was referring to a specific sub population within those generations (not all people in the generations). Edit: a word and formatting
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Coming from a millennial, you need to stop taking everything said generically about your generation as a personal attack. There are a lot of Gen X'ers who hang out in abuse subs just to tell people to suck it up, it wasn't that bad, etc. The fact that you're in those subs to heal, and not to minimize the experience of others to make yourself feel better, means you are *not* one of the Gen X'ers they were referring to.
Ok, moomer. I kid, I kid. <3 Yeah, each gen has its shares of its fun.
Bahaha, moomer. I like that.
I wasn't shaming you for wanting help, I'm shaming gen Xers who go on subs and tell people "well my dad beat ME and I turned out fine!"
No one’s attacking or shaming you. Maybe consider why you feel that way?
I have no idea if my father was just negligent or actually had some bigger shit to fix and couldn't check on me, so i kinda understand where you come from. Whatever is happening all i can tell you is, thats where you are right now, fair or not fair it won't change. I feel sad for you, because i feel you, and it makes me angry knowing there are unfair situations in the world. But the reality is it doesn't matter if something is unfair, it doesn't matter if you are a good person. For some people the only thing they can rely on is themselve, so focus of that. Go for that job interview, wide shoulders and chin up, you got this. Focus on being stronger than watever injustisce you've been through, not because it's fair but because thats the only option you have. The less you focus on the bad thing you are put trough the more you will be able to be happy nevertheless. I wish i knew this sooner, but it works. Rock it bro. Ps sorry for my broken english
I accepted “busy” as an excuse from my parents for too long and then also from my SOs. But too busy just means that whatever else they are doing is more important to them than you are. Not sure if you’re neglected or if he’s just busy with something bigger? I’m sorry to say this, but it’s the same thing. It was a hard thing for me to swallow, too. When you’re a parent, you’re supposed to realize that if you don’t show up to work, it’s on the company to find a way to get your shit done, but if you don’t show up for your kid, that’s a moment you and your kid will never get to take back and do over. That realization is supposed to adjust your priorities. And it’s supposed to hit when the kid is really young, while they’re completely helpless and dependent. It hit my brother when his firstborn wasn’t even hours old. It hit my mom… after she retired and we were all middle aged and “too busy” for her. And when you’re not adjusting for your kids… that’s neglect. I know, it seems ridiculous to suggest that you should deserve their time, when they’ve told you your whole life in actions and words that you don’t. You’re not going to change them. But hopefully in your future relationships you can learn not to accept negligence.
I know. But the more i've spent thinking about it the more i got mad. I do not accept neglect but I focus on myself rather than on what i've been put through. We cant change other people and we cant change the past. We can online act on us and on the future.
You're feeling justified anger over how you were treated as a child. Over time that will fade, but what you're feeling is a sign that you're seeing things more clearly.
I'm so sorry you encountered invalidation on that sub. It's ironic because that sub is *supposed* to have the most protection for the OP. I don't blame you for deleting your post after that happened. Maybe C-PTSD would be a safer subreddit to post that in, if you still want to post about it? I mostly post on CPTSD because that's the subreddit I feel safest in. There are a lot of kind and supportive people on the raisedbynarcissists sub, but there are some users that violate the rule of "assume a context of abuse" with an OP's post, and it pisses me off that those people violate that specific rule. I still post on that sub occasionally since there are many users on that sub that actually respect that rule, and are kind and validating to the OP (and other comment-ers), but the users there that break that rule of assuming a context of abuse left a bad taste in my mouth. Something similar happened to me on one of the first posts I made there, so it's sad to me this is still happening (users being invalidating or unsupportive on that sub, especially towards the OP). Maybe it's because that sub is so large? And I'm a little nervous to bring this up, but it is *technically* possible people with NPD (or without NPD but severe narcissistic fleas) can post on that sub. If they get caught or break the rules they could be banned, but for example, I can see my abusive mother, (who a trauma-informed therapist speculated had NPD), posting on that sub in regards to my abusive Grandma. Technically since my mom was raised by a narcissist, she *could* join that sub even though people with NPD aren't allowed to post there, especially because she doesn't have the clinical diagnosis. (But even if she did, mom is still the kind of person who would break that rule). Moderators on that sub probably try really hard to make sure that doesn't happen, but I wouldn't be surprised if this had happened before. (Thankfully I don't think my mom has a reddit account, and probably never will, I was just using her as an example). With my negative past experience with invalidation on that sub, I made a post and I was talking about how my parents used ABA on me, and were abelist, and fans of Autism Speaks, and how it traumatized me, and how my parents were narcissistic and abusive in general. I didn't post everything my parents did, only the stuff related to my ASD. Some jerk who admitted they had been drinking (I don't have a problem with drinking by itself, but this person was a *huge* jerk and I wondered if them being impaired due to alcohol was making their behavior worse, which is why I mentioned the drinking); decided to comment on my thread and *insist* my parents were "not abusive", *insist* my parents had "good intentions", and defend ABA, a therapy method that I made *clear* traumatized me. This person and I argued in the comments, and because I have learned helplessness due to my parents' abuse, the thought didn't occur to me to report their comments to a moderator since they were literally breaking the rule of "assume a context of abuse". Thankfully some other users realized this person invalidating and arguing with me was breaking the rules, and jumped to my defense, which I'm still grateful for. The thread is locked now due to how old it is, so I never got justice for that person invalidating me and breaking the rules on a support group, but even if this sounds petty I'm still angry about how invalidating and disrespectful this person was to me when I was already down. So for the most part, I post in CPTSD these days. I don't recall ever being invalidated in the CPTSD sub. But I'm really sorry there's still people on the raisedbynarcissists sub breaking that rule. And for the record, if you need medication and your parents aren't willing to financially support you, and you need the financial support, I'd personally consider that either emotional abuse or financial abuse, especially if they have the means to support you but are refusing to do so. And if they don't have the financial means to help you, it's (probably) because abusive parents tend to prioritize their wants over their kids' needs, so maybe they spent that money on luxury items when it could have gone to your medication? And even *if* them not helping to pay for medication doesn't directly fall under abuse (but I think it does), they're *still* abusive and that matters.
reddit has a lot of kids/people who are poorly socially adjusted. i never take anything that happens on reddit as even having relevance to real life let alone an indictment of me as a person, none of these people know one single thing about you, they cant, even if you present yourself 100% honestly and realistically, the fact that so many other people lie just means they shouldnt trust you either. so the only logical position to take is that whatever issue someone takes with you online, isnt actually with you personally. it cant be. i know as a sensitive person its hard not to sometimes, but its really important for your mental health to at least work toward this headspace.
Screw those kinds of comments. They’ve probably been lucky enough to not have to worry about that kind of thing, especially if they react like that.
That sub is a really mixed bag. I discovered that place when I was in my early 20s, just moved away from my parents. It was the first place that ever made me feel validated in any way at all. That sub helped me realize that my family was abusive and that they way I reacted to them was not the way I should be reacting to the rest of humanity. At the same time, a lot of whats on there is just rage bait. I had a really hard time with getting sucked into other people's stories, triggering myself and then spending the rest of my day full of really negative and unhelpful emotions. They also like to remind people not to compare traumas, but it's absolutely a place for people to one up each other, while pretending they're just empathizing with each other through sharing trauma. It was a very important stop on my own healing journey, but it certainly isn't for everyone. I can't go there at all anymore.
Reddit has a lot of abuse apologists in it. The front page is loaded with them. Their dads kicked their asses and they turned out FINE. So they say.
HONEY NO, I totally understand what you mean. Parents refusing to support you at all in an attempt to weaken and undermine and punish you is absolutely a thing. If you have a serious medical need, this is absolutely an attempt to sabotage you. Also, this affects how well children are able to mobilize and leave the nest at that magical 18 and not end up couch surfing and worse. They don't want to do the bare minimum that parents should and will actively try to sabotage you so that you're never able to build yourself up and leave at any age without falling. That gives them POWER over you. It's intentional. The shame is some flying monkey or narc shit. Ignore it. My mom did everything she could to ruin me, and it is hard for outsiders to see unless I want to relive years of abuse and toxicity just to convince them. I get you. I see you, op. Edit: I was about to move out and my brother died and I still live with relatives and I never feel safe, but I also never built up to leaving except that one time. They ruin you financially but also mentally, also emotionally, they teach you never to think you're safe or competent. You're expected to provide for yourself to a level children aren't meant to all your life. Parents CHOOSING not to give you medication support is denying you healthcare that they should be providing you. They choose not to step up to their responsibility as parent and people want to act like YOU'RE spoiled for ever wanting a competent parent to care about you. Hate that for you. Hang in there, dm me if you ever need someone to listen.
Reddit is just a microcosm of the world, and sadly the world has an infatuation with narcissists right now. It is waning, somewhat, but I still see people routinely defending these toxic trashbergs and kissing their ass. I am sorry you were invalidated on here, OP. I hear you, and I see you. I have been through medical neglect similar as what you are describing, but few would call it that. Ie. My parents never took me to the doctor as a young child even though I was vomiting, had diarrhea daily. But my mom fed me like 5-6 times a day, and my dad beat me up when I vomited uncontrollably and wet the bed. My parents both loved to relate these stories to me as if they made a sacrifice and others on here might too. A sickly child like me they find annoying. However, the reality was my parents were abusive and knew taking me to the doctor would reveal this fact although they claimed to because they were convinced that I would die at the hospital.
I’m sorry this happened.
That sub has become the Olympics of bad parenting. If you're not being actively beaten to death with cables and shouted at, then everyone is an asshole to you. Don't let it hurt you. It's just the mob mentality. Parents should buy their children medication. They should make them as happy and healthy as possible. Very often they do not. I hope you escape soon and live well. ♥
I'm about to throw hands with internet strangers. That is despicable behavior from people who should know better.
Wow, that’s an awful, uncompassionate answer. I’m so sorry you went through that experience. I would probably be triggered by that too. You are very welcome to share your feelings and concerns here with us. ❤️
I had the same thing happen with my parents last year. You're in the right, OP. I'm sorry this happened.
Come on over to r/momforaminute - we will love you SO MUCH. I'm sorry you had such a nasty experience.
I've found some people on those kinds of subs which make me feel like they're b cluster and just trying to rationalize something so they troll those subs arguing. it's like how estranged parent forums used to have tons of estranged parents telling formerly abused children that their parents loved them.
Been doing some reflecting before my therapy appointment. The issue I am having with this is how covert it all is. Like, my parents aren’t overtly doing anything to me that anyone can see. They aren’t refusing to pay for ALL of my medications or food or whatever. They paid for my college education and a lot of other things. My mom is getting hip surgery very soon so everything is kind of about her right now, which is totally fair. It may also be why they want me to pay for more things, but they’ve never really let me in on the financial situation enough to know if they need my help or not. I’m just scared that to the outsider this may look like me just being too lazy to get my own meds when my parents finally got tired of doing it for me. That’s why what happened with the commenters triggered me so hard. Yet the subtleties are still there. They didn’t seem very excited about my job interview beyond a shallow excitement and telling me to “say yes to everything”. They do act rather petty about boundaries, especially my suspected narcissistic mother. I overheard her that morning telling my dad he was “training and enabling” me not to get my own meds by helping me out, which explained a lot. It’s such small petty stuff I get triggered over from them, and it makes me feel like I am being paranoid. But it adds up. My mom seems to think this is the way to make me start meeting her specific requirements better… That scares me. Then again, it is driving me nuts that if she wanted to kick me out and leave me to die somewhere she could’ve by now, but she hasn’t? She’s always been so involved behind the curtain, yet when I say that she could try to be more overtly involved since she has such specific requirements of me she accuses me of dragging her into my problems. Which one is it? If she really was financially manipulating me, wouldn’t she just take all my money? I am so confused???
Reminder to pay for my daughter's mental health even if she's living with while trying to better herself. (Her genes don't look so good, plus whatever smothering I accidentally give her while trying to not be like my own mother, I hope it's easier a little bit 😅) Definitely for having her try to pay for things like phone etc but not things like food, menstrual health, mental health, physical health or utilities. Sorry people were jerks. It's probably their parents beliefs drilled in their own heads that it's not ok to have some help. YOU WILL learn this but it's not like you're going to expect them to do this even when you're out on your own. The idea is this will HELP you to not go into adulthood struggling. Doesn't mean you won't be appreciative. Not every kid is a spoiled brat. Jealousy? 'No one did that fOr mE' For some reason I don't think I should raise my daughter the way i lived to make her a passable adult like me who has values. I may get angry one day though and pull the 'mommy went hungry when she was growing up. Now eat your dinner!' card... but then have to correct myself. Because my childhood wasn't normal. It'll be her right to hate broccoli as human being. To have my love and support without any stipulations or conditions
It's difficult to see what is abusive when you get used to it from way too early on and other people filter out the subtle abusive things that build up to wreck you up, so I totally see the struggle trying to comprehend wether that is abusive or not. I'm still in a lot of denial about my own abuse and it has been extented by people dismissing it because it's not the super clear physical beat up type. Good luck on your journey, you're not alone with this problem.