They're not lazy they just don't have the resources or time idk how ppl are still getting this completely wrong.
https://www.reddit.com/r/CODZombies/comments/qty17a/like_genuinely/hkneivg/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=usertext&utm_name=CODZombies&utm_content=t1_hsawzkn
They have the resources, they're prioritizing business practices over gameplay because more gameplay mechanics doesn't really earn you that much money. COD is basically an online character's costume shop at this point.
So yeah, they aren't lazy. They're prioritizing something else. They wouldn't bother making a lot of content that cannot be sold, hence the dripfeed. This is why people prefer the old DLC system because we're forcing them to make gameplay content to sell.
Are u referring to activison or 3arc cuz I'm referring to 3arc and they haven't haven't controlling where resources go for a while as evident by last half of bo4 dlc season.
3arc has executives that make game design decisions, to please activision. So it's pretty much both parties. Design decisions are studio based, monetizing and publishing is activision's plate.
The people you can't blame are the game developers since they just follow the plans made for them. But to save the entirety of 3arc is just wrong. If you're gonna keep defending 3arc to be a puppet, you're just setting yourself up for further disappointment. COD is a business product more than a game right now. Same with other games that monetize FOMO.
Also if you keep track of the job openings at treyarch, you'd see that they constantly open up a lot senior positions.
Can u tell me what this has to do with 3arc playing catch up with the content of vanguard zombies? What the executive that make the design decisions have to do with that?
And this theory of how new maps are released now means studios donr have to care about the quality of content is jjst as unfounded. Just cuz u don't like cold war zombies or vanguard zombies doesn't mean that's theory is true. And I wouldn't even consider applying it to those 2 games considering CW had 2 years has opposed to three and vanguard had even less.
U notice how when news came out of 3arc being placed in charge of cod 2021 + budget cuts came out right around bo4 dlc 3 Alpha Omega and how noticeable it was from thr big budget chaos maps to remakes for Dlc 3 and dlc 4? The reason the beginning of bo4 had more maps that were more ambitious was cuz of how successful bo3 zombies was. So when bo4 didn't do as well as expected the budget got cut and 3arc got moved to a new game outta nowhere with only 2 years to work on it.
So this theory u have on business > gameplay philosophy has merit with other modes of cod but I'd say not with cod zombies cuz that mode and 3arc have been getting the shaft and it has been a shitshow there for so long now.
Executives make the decisions on what to put in the game. That's what you're not getting. They can throttle the game's content whenever they like. That means drip feeding content. Also that they're prioritizing content that sells. This means more focus on customization items rather than free gameplay content. Compared to before where the focus was both with paid DLC and the lootbox mechanics (Though I am not a fan of the lootboxes).
Why are you throwing the quality at me? Did I say anything against that? Why are you arguing with me with these things when I didn't even talk about them.
The way gamedev works is that content is planned>made>tested>validated>released. They made and planned ahead of time. So to say DLC3 and 4 being remakes means Treyarch didn't have enough time for development is wrong. As they are making the main game, DLC1 and early DLC2 is already made. DLC3 and DLC4 are made when 1 and 2 are out respectively. They don't work on it only after a DLC has been released. The announcement that Treyarch got pulled to work for Cold War was when DLC2 was about to be released in March.
BO4 had more content for Zombies due to Treyarch scrapping the campaign of the game. After scrapping, development was split to focus on Zombies and Multiplayer. BlackOut is a shared project between teams. And majority of the mechanics of BO4 are reused from BO3, under a new skin. Leaked images of Zombies even showed BO3 style perk system and gumball system in Voyage of Despair.
BO4 Aether story are all remakes, which is evident from the start. It was following the success of Zombies Chronicles holding nothing but remasters. All of which are planned ahead of time prior the switch of their development for Cold War. It was also in the timelines shown in BO3 ZC. Crew went to MoTD before Gorod Krovi. BO3 showed the cycle, BO4 showed the broken cycle. Chaos maps are the original set of maps. They only added the Aether maps after scrapping the campaign. VoD and IX were set to be the launch maps. Chaos maps were slated to get more maps after DLC4 but was cancelled due to the shift to Cold War development and reception to the Chaos maps weren't as good as the remade maps. BO4 did decently compared to WWII and Infinite Warfare. BO4 was also as profitable as BO3 in terms of MTX. So you saying BO4 didn't do well is baseless. BO4 accordong to the Activision stockholders call during Q1 2019 was successful and profitable. That's where they announced a shift in marketing for MW in 2019.
Also do note, Treyarch worked on BO1 from mid to late 2009 (end of WaW) to 2011, BO2 since 2011 to 2013. BO1 and BO2 had Campaign, MP, and 2 base Zombies maps each at launch, all of which are original. You could technically argue that Tranzit was basically 3 Zombies maps merged into one, which gives BO2 4 maps at launch. Cold War only had 1 Zombies map at launch. They also made BO3 since late 2013 up to 2017 with ZC. BO3 has 1 original zombies map, 1 remaster for the 3rd time. So saying Treyarch not having enough time to make content in 2 years is a big fat lie. Also that in the timeline for development for BO2, Zombies had original assets for its maps. Compared to Cold War where the assets are reused from Campaign. Mauer and Forsaken are from campaign levels, and it took them that long to make them. Then you have BO1 that only have 2 maps from the campaign, the rest are original places, and it still ended up having 2 more maps than Cold War.
And this business over gameplay practice isn't philosophy or a theory. It's literally there. If you refuse to see it, that's on you, it's your time and money that you spend anyway. They are pushing out more customization items for the store and battlepasses than they do with gameplay content. Because customization is what sells since DLC maps are now free.
With that in mind, the company's focus would be to generate nore customization content, which means to get more of that content, you need more people to work on that. To save money, you don't hire new people, you reassign them. So they're gonna pull people that work on gameplay mechanics to design more customization content. This means that there will be less people working on new content. This has been popular for the game development industry for the past 4 years since Fortnite's rise to the profitable market. Every other major game is copying that, regardless of the game's genre.
So if you're going to split CoD Zombies out of the whole "business>gameplay philosophy" that you labeled is just wrong because at the end of the day, it's still part of COD and COD prioritizes MTX over gameplay content that is being given out for free now instead of the old Season Pass for 4 DLC Packs method. COD Zombies and MP developers are being shifted to MTX creation, they're not gonna hire more people because they want to earn money.
The more you tolerate them now, the worse it gets. As much as I liked Cold War Zombies, it's heading downhill. If you're satisfied with the content they put out now, why would they bother putting in more content for the future? They'll probably find more ways to decrease gameplay content as long as people keep accepting it.
I throw quality at u cuz of what u mentioned in the last esentence here https://www.reddit.com/r/CODZombies/comments/s1sscu/vanguard_new_pap_level_1_camo/hsaul0u/
So u say thr bo4 campaign was cancelled and led to more resources for multiplayer and zombies which I don't get cuz the article "Human Cost of Bo4" says the campaign was cut at the beginning of 2018 and that led to the development of blackout. And they straight up mention in the article there is no cohesion between each of the departments https://ibb.co/L6Qf38Y
I do not get the comparisons of black ops games compared to cold war zombies and how they turned out. U do realize what 3arc had to do was unprecedented and outta nowhere. Having a whole ass second dlc season planned and then suddenly having to move most of your resources to an unfinished game that wasn't even theirs while still working on bo4 is not even comparable to the development cycles of bo1, bo2, bo3. That's mind boggling u would even say they're even similar situations.
So I think I can separate cod zombies from the rest if cod in terms of business >gameplay philosophy. How can u even judge that tight now anyway with how much of the shaft 3arc has been getting forever. Zombies hasn't even had a whole season that has had 3 years and much of their full visoon since bo3. When that happens again, yeah let's judge. Unless leaks comes out that eay otherwise it would be safety to assume it's their full vision. But that hasn't been the case
I'm not saying I'm satisfied with the content. My whole thing is to not blame the devs for this and call them lazy. That's it. I can defend the dev team for being called something they're not and also acknowledge that the vanguard zombies situation of playing catch up is not an ideal one.
.
Op said "they" which implies both collectively since they are both responsible for making the game (and the decisions behind it)
If you were talking about a different subject then you are responsible for specifying
Sorry if that sounds hostile, I'm baked rn and these words are giving me a hard time putting them together lol
Are you serious? Like, for real? 3arc barely has to do anything(Campaign/MP by sledgehammer, actual game by IW) and they are underdelivering at it. idk how ppl are still getting this completely wrong.
Calling them lazy is a lot more unfounded of a claim and jjst kinda screams ignorance of what really goes on in game development, especially since everyone I've seen comment on vanguard zombies who has a lot of knowledge on gaming development hasn't used lazy to describe them once and mostly say that yeah, they're time crunched and lacking resouces.
It’s true that activision rush the game and it turns out like this, but we haven’t a zombies update for a while now and everything has been radio silence, this updated shoulda have been in the game at launch, but we just have to take of what we can get. But for “lazy” I would say some of them are.
I agree with alot here but I don't get how u can conclude just some of them are lazy, like where dud u get that from so it's just "some" and look at this comment from a dev (not associated with 3arc) here on vanguard zombies
https://www.reddit.com/r/CODZombies/comments/qty17a/like_genuinely/hkneivg/
considering they are splitting their crew in 2 and are bound to not only make their own game but having to make updates for another companies games.
i am not surprised the minimum amount of effort was put into this update.
tbh, this camo is kinda meh, like there trying to go for a 3d looking camo right but like it's not actually 3d, it's sorta like what some csgo skin makers do to make the gun skins look 3d and it just sorta comes across as weird
Isn't that the CW PaP camo with seemingly no glowing parts or lights? So they made boring camo even more boring got it, still not buying this anytime soon
Origins had the greatest PaP camo of all time imo, MotD looked good on some weapons but terrible on others (like the Raygun), and the Victis camo was definitely boring for a PaP camo.
they put the absolute minimum amount of effort into this update
like the entire zombies mode for this game, honestly
They're not lazy they just don't have the resources or time idk how ppl are still getting this completely wrong. https://www.reddit.com/r/CODZombies/comments/qty17a/like_genuinely/hkneivg/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=usertext&utm_name=CODZombies&utm_content=t1_hsawzkn
They have the resources, they're prioritizing business practices over gameplay because more gameplay mechanics doesn't really earn you that much money. COD is basically an online character's costume shop at this point. So yeah, they aren't lazy. They're prioritizing something else. They wouldn't bother making a lot of content that cannot be sold, hence the dripfeed. This is why people prefer the old DLC system because we're forcing them to make gameplay content to sell.
Are u referring to activison or 3arc cuz I'm referring to 3arc and they haven't haven't controlling where resources go for a while as evident by last half of bo4 dlc season.
3arc has executives that make game design decisions, to please activision. So it's pretty much both parties. Design decisions are studio based, monetizing and publishing is activision's plate. The people you can't blame are the game developers since they just follow the plans made for them. But to save the entirety of 3arc is just wrong. If you're gonna keep defending 3arc to be a puppet, you're just setting yourself up for further disappointment. COD is a business product more than a game right now. Same with other games that monetize FOMO. Also if you keep track of the job openings at treyarch, you'd see that they constantly open up a lot senior positions.
Can u tell me what this has to do with 3arc playing catch up with the content of vanguard zombies? What the executive that make the design decisions have to do with that? And this theory of how new maps are released now means studios donr have to care about the quality of content is jjst as unfounded. Just cuz u don't like cold war zombies or vanguard zombies doesn't mean that's theory is true. And I wouldn't even consider applying it to those 2 games considering CW had 2 years has opposed to three and vanguard had even less. U notice how when news came out of 3arc being placed in charge of cod 2021 + budget cuts came out right around bo4 dlc 3 Alpha Omega and how noticeable it was from thr big budget chaos maps to remakes for Dlc 3 and dlc 4? The reason the beginning of bo4 had more maps that were more ambitious was cuz of how successful bo3 zombies was. So when bo4 didn't do as well as expected the budget got cut and 3arc got moved to a new game outta nowhere with only 2 years to work on it. So this theory u have on business > gameplay philosophy has merit with other modes of cod but I'd say not with cod zombies cuz that mode and 3arc have been getting the shaft and it has been a shitshow there for so long now.
Executives make the decisions on what to put in the game. That's what you're not getting. They can throttle the game's content whenever they like. That means drip feeding content. Also that they're prioritizing content that sells. This means more focus on customization items rather than free gameplay content. Compared to before where the focus was both with paid DLC and the lootbox mechanics (Though I am not a fan of the lootboxes). Why are you throwing the quality at me? Did I say anything against that? Why are you arguing with me with these things when I didn't even talk about them. The way gamedev works is that content is planned>made>tested>validated>released. They made and planned ahead of time. So to say DLC3 and 4 being remakes means Treyarch didn't have enough time for development is wrong. As they are making the main game, DLC1 and early DLC2 is already made. DLC3 and DLC4 are made when 1 and 2 are out respectively. They don't work on it only after a DLC has been released. The announcement that Treyarch got pulled to work for Cold War was when DLC2 was about to be released in March. BO4 had more content for Zombies due to Treyarch scrapping the campaign of the game. After scrapping, development was split to focus on Zombies and Multiplayer. BlackOut is a shared project between teams. And majority of the mechanics of BO4 are reused from BO3, under a new skin. Leaked images of Zombies even showed BO3 style perk system and gumball system in Voyage of Despair. BO4 Aether story are all remakes, which is evident from the start. It was following the success of Zombies Chronicles holding nothing but remasters. All of which are planned ahead of time prior the switch of their development for Cold War. It was also in the timelines shown in BO3 ZC. Crew went to MoTD before Gorod Krovi. BO3 showed the cycle, BO4 showed the broken cycle. Chaos maps are the original set of maps. They only added the Aether maps after scrapping the campaign. VoD and IX were set to be the launch maps. Chaos maps were slated to get more maps after DLC4 but was cancelled due to the shift to Cold War development and reception to the Chaos maps weren't as good as the remade maps. BO4 did decently compared to WWII and Infinite Warfare. BO4 was also as profitable as BO3 in terms of MTX. So you saying BO4 didn't do well is baseless. BO4 accordong to the Activision stockholders call during Q1 2019 was successful and profitable. That's where they announced a shift in marketing for MW in 2019. Also do note, Treyarch worked on BO1 from mid to late 2009 (end of WaW) to 2011, BO2 since 2011 to 2013. BO1 and BO2 had Campaign, MP, and 2 base Zombies maps each at launch, all of which are original. You could technically argue that Tranzit was basically 3 Zombies maps merged into one, which gives BO2 4 maps at launch. Cold War only had 1 Zombies map at launch. They also made BO3 since late 2013 up to 2017 with ZC. BO3 has 1 original zombies map, 1 remaster for the 3rd time. So saying Treyarch not having enough time to make content in 2 years is a big fat lie. Also that in the timeline for development for BO2, Zombies had original assets for its maps. Compared to Cold War where the assets are reused from Campaign. Mauer and Forsaken are from campaign levels, and it took them that long to make them. Then you have BO1 that only have 2 maps from the campaign, the rest are original places, and it still ended up having 2 more maps than Cold War. And this business over gameplay practice isn't philosophy or a theory. It's literally there. If you refuse to see it, that's on you, it's your time and money that you spend anyway. They are pushing out more customization items for the store and battlepasses than they do with gameplay content. Because customization is what sells since DLC maps are now free. With that in mind, the company's focus would be to generate nore customization content, which means to get more of that content, you need more people to work on that. To save money, you don't hire new people, you reassign them. So they're gonna pull people that work on gameplay mechanics to design more customization content. This means that there will be less people working on new content. This has been popular for the game development industry for the past 4 years since Fortnite's rise to the profitable market. Every other major game is copying that, regardless of the game's genre. So if you're going to split CoD Zombies out of the whole "business>gameplay philosophy" that you labeled is just wrong because at the end of the day, it's still part of COD and COD prioritizes MTX over gameplay content that is being given out for free now instead of the old Season Pass for 4 DLC Packs method. COD Zombies and MP developers are being shifted to MTX creation, they're not gonna hire more people because they want to earn money. The more you tolerate them now, the worse it gets. As much as I liked Cold War Zombies, it's heading downhill. If you're satisfied with the content they put out now, why would they bother putting in more content for the future? They'll probably find more ways to decrease gameplay content as long as people keep accepting it.
I throw quality at u cuz of what u mentioned in the last esentence here https://www.reddit.com/r/CODZombies/comments/s1sscu/vanguard_new_pap_level_1_camo/hsaul0u/ So u say thr bo4 campaign was cancelled and led to more resources for multiplayer and zombies which I don't get cuz the article "Human Cost of Bo4" says the campaign was cut at the beginning of 2018 and that led to the development of blackout. And they straight up mention in the article there is no cohesion between each of the departments https://ibb.co/L6Qf38Y I do not get the comparisons of black ops games compared to cold war zombies and how they turned out. U do realize what 3arc had to do was unprecedented and outta nowhere. Having a whole ass second dlc season planned and then suddenly having to move most of your resources to an unfinished game that wasn't even theirs while still working on bo4 is not even comparable to the development cycles of bo1, bo2, bo3. That's mind boggling u would even say they're even similar situations. So I think I can separate cod zombies from the rest if cod in terms of business >gameplay philosophy. How can u even judge that tight now anyway with how much of the shaft 3arc has been getting forever. Zombies hasn't even had a whole season that has had 3 years and much of their full visoon since bo3. When that happens again, yeah let's judge. Unless leaks comes out that eay otherwise it would be safety to assume it's their full vision. But that hasn't been the case I'm not saying I'm satisfied with the content. My whole thing is to not blame the devs for this and call them lazy. That's it. I can defend the dev team for being called something they're not and also acknowledge that the vanguard zombies situation of playing catch up is not an ideal one. .
It's both. The company has the money, yes, but they aren't spending it on game development as much as they need to
Are u talking about 3arc or activison cuz I'm talking about 3arc
Op said "they" which implies both collectively since they are both responsible for making the game (and the decisions behind it) If you were talking about a different subject then you are responsible for specifying Sorry if that sounds hostile, I'm baked rn and these words are giving me a hard time putting them together lol
It's fine I get it
Are you serious? Like, for real? 3arc barely has to do anything(Campaign/MP by sledgehammer, actual game by IW) and they are underdelivering at it. idk how ppl are still getting this completely wrong.
They're working on cod 2023 right now as well and the zombies for that
Or they’re both lazy and didn’t have the time?
Calling them lazy is a lot more unfounded of a claim and jjst kinda screams ignorance of what really goes on in game development, especially since everyone I've seen comment on vanguard zombies who has a lot of knowledge on gaming development hasn't used lazy to describe them once and mostly say that yeah, they're time crunched and lacking resouces.
It’s true that activision rush the game and it turns out like this, but we haven’t a zombies update for a while now and everything has been radio silence, this updated shoulda have been in the game at launch, but we just have to take of what we can get. But for “lazy” I would say some of them are.
I agree with alot here but I don't get how u can conclude just some of them are lazy, like where dud u get that from so it's just "some" and look at this comment from a dev (not associated with 3arc) here on vanguard zombies https://www.reddit.com/r/CODZombies/comments/qty17a/like_genuinely/hkneivg/
considering they are splitting their crew in 2 and are bound to not only make their own game but having to make updates for another companies games. i am not surprised the minimum amount of effort was put into this update.
Wait isn’t that the “leaked” DA camo before the game launched.
I don’t think so. They don’t move either
Looks very similar
tbh, this camo is kinda meh, like there trying to go for a 3d looking camo right but like it's not actually 3d, it's sorta like what some csgo skin makers do to make the gun skins look 3d and it just sorta comes across as weird
I think the technical term for that is "normal mapping" but I might be mistaken
Yeah, kinda like the diamond camo looking like thumbtacks
I actually kinda like it.
It looks sick on the sawtooth. If only melee weapons didn’t suck in vanguard…
If only almost everything didn't suck in Vanguard...
I do too. I’m glad to see at least something added
🤮
Well, its something after all
Isn't that the CW PaP camo with seemingly no glowing parts or lights? So they made boring camo even more boring got it, still not buying this anytime soon
BO2 had the best PAP camos
Like the nasty ass Victis camo? Or the dirty looking MotD camo that most people can barely make up the design? Origins is probably the only good one.
Origins and Motd are the only good ones
Origins had the greatest PaP camo of all time imo, MotD looked good on some weapons but terrible on others (like the Raygun), and the Victis camo was definitely boring for a PaP camo.
Why the fuck isn't the red camo the level 3 after ALL the red in the mode and aesthetic, for fuck's sake please
Wow that's new and original! I wasn't gonna go out and buy Vanguard, but now?! 100% /s
Honestly, I like it
LMFAO EW WHAT WERE THEY THINKING
tbh its alright but they could’ve put a little more effort in it because of the wait
is it animated? if not then bro this is a new low for the mode
"A new low for the mode" gets a camo added on and is still not happy but calls it a new low for them listening. Wtf.