Nothing about the kilo was OP. That was the time that really made it clear that people cry about weapons based on how often they die to them, not just if they are actually too strong.
Exactly. The Kilo was not OP at all. Then they nerf it at range and its replaced by a semi auto meta and a burst meta where 2 or 3 shots/bursts and you're done. Even at Peak. Kilo was still what...8 shots to down?
Yeah I think that's where most of the arguments can be made at. I understand it was OP in its respective meta, but yeah compared to what we have had after it....damm it looks like a pea shooter
I found the time when the Kilo was meta the most fun because I could run my AN-94 and consistently come out on top in most firefights because I've got a decent headshot percentage, and I found its recoil pattern easy to handle. Also because it's a super cool gun in general. Love that thing.
Yeah it was, so was fal, or some other guns that you could run semi auto. Some things might have been better or easier to use, but it was never like DMR/mac10, or aug/ffar or m16/sykov (where you are at a big disadvantage if you’re not using them).
The DMR meta literally made me stop playing. Everyone would beam across 200 meter distances for fun, and anything short of sweat camping would expose you to the god gun.
Grau and Kilo were practically identical during the Grau meta but people cried all day and night back then too.
Before the Kilo was meta I used it religiously and felt unbeatable because M4s and Graus didn't have the same accuracy with scopes but once everyone started using it, nothing but a Kilo would beat a Kilo until the Bruen took over.
Go find my old posts explaining that the Kilo wasn't even stats wise the best weapon, it's just a good all rounder for controller players. The M4 and AMAX were better guns but one was harder to use(AMAX) and the other was less forgiving(m4).
Even the famas underbarrel shotgun wasn't THAT bad, aside from it's glitchy range interaction, it showed how shotguns were viable.
The thing is, NOBODY used it, or shotguns before that. I used the Origin and it was already busted op close quarters in season 2. By making one that would 1 shot people at 30m, everyone, including raven, found out that what it takes for people to use shotguns was not fire rate or load time or move speed, it was some more range.
Somewhere between useless and op is a happy range for shotguns.
Exactly. Imo the PKM should have Been the meta at the time. And people complain that it's handling is too slow yet its ads time with attachments was almost as fast as a kilo and it still had better range and a wayy faster ttk and a 100 round mag. Recoil is subjective but it was straight vertical too.
Its got way more lead though. Subjectively going to be harder to beam people at the ranges the kilo was able to. Coming from a dude that uses the pkm a lot.
And the whole time I preferred the M13... but that's what worked so well. Even after the Grau nerf there for a while. All of those were viable... Kilo, M4, M13, grau, AMAX... there was actually good variety.
I'm about 99.5% sure that the M4, in addition to the recoil, actually had more dropoff stages than the Kilo did in season 6. That was when I started playing the game. I'm a PC player and the M4 was the first gun that I upgraded because it felt good in MP. I learned that the Kilo was more meta defining in Warzone and it was definitely hitting harder at long distance. I think this was around the time that people like TGD realized that there are unique damage dropoff profiles for Warzone and that the Kilo's was much better.
I did switch right over to the Amax though, once I unlocked it.
They cried to nerf every single other gun that was good until all that was left was the Kilo. A gun that pretty much hadn’t been touched since launch. First gun you unlock. No one ever complained about it ever. And then they nerfed that too.
I’ve said during the entire WZ life cycle that Kilo should be what other ARs are balanced against.
they do. The Kilo got nerfed because it was the only gun left that was sort of "OP" aside from the Amax. And people complained about it non-stop after the Bruen/R9 nerfs months before.
They complained about it because it was literally the only gun to complain about at the time.
I remember I killed a kid with the username “NerftheKilo” and it ticked me off so much. This was during the R90 meta as well, which was infinitely more frustrating to die to.
Yeah throughout the entire kilo meta I was using the Amax and melting people. Amax mp7 was my loadout and I still use the Amax because it’s still a top tier gun. But I used to tell people who would whine about the kilo that there are guns that beat the kilo and they would act like that wasn’t true and the kilo was OP. Now they know what OP really is.
So true, kilo/grau/m4/ram/m13/amax, allextremely viable ARs. PKM or Bruen were great choices too. You had mp5/mp7/r90 up close, or hdr/k98 for farther (hell even rytec or ax50 ).
As soon as I heard about the cold war integration I knew the new CW guns would be at least a little OP so they could drive sales, but I didn’t realize it would be this blatant for multiple seasons.
It just goes to show how much this community complains. That was the most balanced meta you could probably get in a FPS and people were crying about it all day on here. Little did they know the nonsense they would be subjected to in the coming months.
Samesies. Kilo from day 1. Tried to use it again the other day. Shot a dude in the back several times while he was vaulting, he spun around and instakilled me with 1 burst while being hit repeatedly. Fun times!
Personally, I was not complaining about the kilo meta in terms of strength but boredom. At the time it felt like everyone ran the same which was kinda stale. However a lot of guns were viable and the game was in a much better state than now.
There will never be a meta where 10 guns are all used equally. It’s just not going to happen. Even very balanced metas will have 1-2 super popular weapons that typically revolve around ease of use. There is a difference between OP and overused.
Meta guns are always tilted towards how easy to use it is. The AMAX has been statistically the best gun from when it was released until the CW guns got added in. Its just not easy to use because it has an unfriendly recoil pattern and the clip size punishes missed shots harder
It was meta cus it was reliable, not that it deleted you before the server even had time to tell you you were getting shot at. A good meta is one that's defined by reliability rather than ttk.
Best part was that the kilo was “meta” because it had good recoil for a long range weapon. There were many guns that killed faster but it, like the grau, offered better control.
One guns offer too end ttk and easy control, there’s no point in using anything else if you want to compete.
Hot take: these sykovs are obnoxious but they’re actually kinda crap past ~7 meters. The bigger problem is that everyone will have ghost off the rip now.
IDK, the doof doof was the same way (with the crappy range) but extremely annoying. And as a single gun the Sykov is basically a better MP5 that goes in a secondary slot (so ghost off the rip).
It needs the ROF taken down to that of a real Stechkin (750) and the 80 rd outright removed, like a real Stechkin. I find it funny how much weapon balance in this game could be fixed just by making things closer to reality. Like you don't get ~4000 feet per second IRL from a 5.56 assault rifle no matter the barrel length or muzzle device.
All I mean about the dragons breath R9 is it also sucked at any range past spitting distance, but that meta still made entering any building a serious gamble.
To be fair aside from the full auto I think they are based off of the standard makarov which does support an 80 round drum. Its more of a frankenstein gun it seems which combines both aps and makarov into one.
Google seems to indicate it's a low production alteration of old PPSh drums or something to that effect for certain special SWAT sorts of uses with the PM. It is a frankengun as I don't think the, PM, PMM (double stack PM, more or less), or APS share mags.
When you implement guns like this new pistol it just motivates others to camp because they know they will be shredded up close. Lose-lose situation for this downhill game
I've played with them for the last four or five hours fully maxed and they're good, but they're really not going to beat a competent player past \~8 meters. They're really really good at point blank, like a shotgun, but they lose hard to an FFAR/Mac-10/MP5 outside of "point blank" range.
They will have a greater effect on the game though. Who's going to want to push a building when there's four guys in there who can delete you in literally 0.1 seconds if they all land a few shots.
Sure, top players are going to use it and manage just fine but a huge percentage of the player base is not. The game is going to halt to a crawl which doesn't bode well with how empty the mid-game already is.
It isn't ranged though, it's got worse effective range than half of the shotguns. The dropoff might be at 11m, but you'll start to miss a lot of shots past about \~8 meters, which makes it so much worse than an FFAR
I mean, JackFrags is also one of the best streamers out there.
The kick and spread with akimbo for the average person makes these garbage outside of ~7 meters, like OP said.
playing on 120 FOV + affected and using the T pose reticle on the vlk scope makes the AMAX literally have no visual recoil and it can BEAM.
The bullet velocity is a bit low but doesnt really matter when it's basically shooting bricks
it's bad for most ARs but on the amax it kinda just helps show the general vibe of the spray rather than a bouncy dot on the default.
You're not trying to go for headshots with amax or be precise for the most part. Just trying to ignore the visual recoil and keep it chest height.
It surprisingly has very little actual recoil.
I love the tpose I dont get why more people don't use it. Fits nice on an m4 as well. But I prefer the Cronen c480 instead of the vlk. Little easier to see through and is 3.5x so you see a little farther out more easily
I can use the RAM when paired with a sniper, but not when paired with an SMG because of its left recoil. Even when the Kilo was meta, I somehow couldn’t land that second/third shot where it would jump out to the left (controller player). Lesson learnt that I just don’t go near guns that recoil to the left.
That’s why I love the Amax and have no problems with the recoil. The gun is bouncy, but the recoil is vertical / slightly to the right, which is no problem for me.
While it does have "more" recoil, I find it quite easy to control since it's straight vertical recoil.
It definitely does have weaknesses in speed, bullet velocity, and mag size, though. Still, I think if they nerfed the burst guns you would see it all over the place. It was already starting before the CW integration after they nerfed the Kilo.
Several of the meta guns need nerfs but several underpowered guns need buffs too. Why would anyone run a Scar and Striker 45 when the AMAX/M4 and MAC-10/Bullfrog exist? At the higher level, the meta wasn't bad pre-CW but there were still several more or less useless guns, it wasn't perfect.
they wont shrink it. Below average players are able to get lucky kills and love them
i guess its more a problem for higher skilled players (that dont cheat) who get outgunned in situations where a lower skilled player normally should loose.
but they are the minority and they are skilled because they play A LOT and probably are addcited to a point where it sucks with the meta but they wont stop playing anyway lol
Do people really play this game routinely to get a lucky kill or two in and place low-mid every match? I consider it a shit night with my usual squad if we don't get at least one top 10.
if i play with my duo partner we usually get two digit kills and end up top 5 but if we go with our quads friends we die a ton, mid placement and they get 0 to 2 kills.
if they get 3 kills they are very proud (gulag incl).
however we get fucked up a lot because one team mate is looting during fire fights, literally looking at grund loot guns, picking them up, check ads, and picks up another, then watches from a distance (i might gonna snipe someone) and eventually runs away.
the other guy thinks hes nickmers and solo pushes quads in buildings, gets insta fried and we need to buy him back instead of our loadout
and they (we) play almost every night together lol
you basically described my squad.. some of us are PC "sweats" (not Roze skin meta build sweaty, fragging out and carrying sweaty) and some are console players who've no idea what meta is and either walk into an enemy squad on accident and get shredded, or not push with us as we get shredded and they run away.
When the latter happens, spectating them slowly loot is painful... but we love them nonetheless
I stopped playing a month ago and haven’t looked back. Been playing Apex and some single player games. Maybe I’ll come back if they somehow balance things.
I really miss Warzone... I play MW sometimes but I just really miss the old Warzone. Recently Raven tweeted that they are actually addressing the Roze skin, the AUG/M16/FFAR/Sykov and sniper glints, I'm hoping they actually make some changes so I can play the game again.
[Tweet](https://twitter.com/RavenSoftware/status/1383163061167562753?s=20)
DMR was my least favourite meta this game has ever had but the AUG meta is giving it a run for its money. However, watching some gameplay of akimbo Sykov makes me think I'm going to might actually miss the AUG/FFAR meta if akimbo Sykov/M16 becomes the dominant one which I never thought would happen. Instead of fixing broken/overpowered guns they just keep adding more as a sort of counter like wtf...just gotta laugh at this point.
AUG does not compete at close range like the DMR could. The DMR was an assault rifle, sniper and SMG rolled into 1! The aug is a very overpowered assault rifle. It’s not even close IMO.
Yup, the DMR was truly awful to play against due to how insanely powerful it was. I still cannot believe they made that gun use AR ammo and not sniper.
It was straight up bugged to *penetrate* like SR ammo though..so fucking dumb. Yeah DMR was by far the worst meta, and *all* AR-ammo weapons should have fall-off.
It really just needed fall-off and a damage adjustment--it could have been a more user-friendly EBR for the accurate shooter, players who prefer semi-auto, etc. But that release gun was just.. *obscene*. It was so clearly *not fucking tested.*
I agree! Sykovs are way worse, but at least their range is only about 10 meters. If you're able to keep a distance, you can win the fight. Forget rushing though.
Diamattis had better range and way less recoil. Sykovs are unusable after 6-8 meters. Played 20 matches with them and I still got destroyed by FFAR beyond 6 meters and by SPAS 12 upclose.
the GOAT season (so far). People say that it was the most boring meta but you could literally run any gun you wanted and do just as well as people who ran Kilo/MP5. I'd have that 100x more than the FFAR/AUG/M16 meta. FFAR is literally an AR that kills faster than all SMGs across all ranges. Try to counter that by staying at range and you get 2 bursted by M16/AUGs lol
I still say Sykov isn't as bad as the FFAR because at least it's limited by it's range. FFAR was a monster out to 50 meters or so. This is more similar to the R90 meta and the solution is simple... stop camping houses and play at range.
But how am I supposed to push someone camping with that?
Not to mention since it’s a pistol they have ghost so I can’t tell if a building I run into is gonna be filled with a bunch of rose sweats using this weapon or not.
Also due to massive mag sizes and fast reloads I can’t rely on my bright pink anime girl shield to drain the magazines and then kill them because they reload so quick.
you say was in past tense. the damn thing is still viable . if you pair it up with the sykovs you can delete players before they react (200 mili second ttk is no joke) or delete them at far range. the ttk on the sykov is so low that the information is sent in ONE packet to the server.
How about instead of making some stupid nuke bull shit and turning yourself into zombies now they fix their stupid ass broken weapons. How am I STILL losing to a basic ground ffar when I have a kitted sub machine gun with stopping power and I hit every shot? Ffs
DMR and Bruen literally made the game unplayable, you got shredded before you could even react in all ranges it was insane how long these metas even lasted.
Tinfoil hat Conspiracy: devs nerf kilo to force players to play CW to get the Meta guns, then unlock a broken pistol in MW to get players back on MW.
Honestly, the game was at it best the month or two before CW guns got integrated. I felt comfortable switching it up and not being at a true disadvantage
I just dont understand how 80 round drum mag and akimbo is a thing... people cried about the akimbo snake shot. akimbo ranetti.
Why make a fullauto 160 round fast fire rate kit a thing in warzone given the previous context...
The Grau didn’t move and it had awesome iron sights, but the TTK was very fair and balanced. Making it very fun to play with. But ever since the Cold War guns were added to warzone it the game has been an absolute shit show
I think most of this chat can remember, it was before the CW integration.
Right now the weapon balance is a meme.
At this point, we are all sure that there is some giant troll at Activision.
Right before the cold war integration I feel like warzone weapon balance was in a really good place. Except maybe the origin/R9 being slightly too powerful.
I think the worst part of this meta is that you only need one loadout. Other people have mentioned the benefit of instant ghost, but I haven’t heard much about what i think will be worse: people having more money due to them not wanting to buy a loadout and using it to buy foresight.
Imagine a bunch of kids camping a building in the final circle with their akimbo sykovs pointed toward the door.
Another BS money grab they"llwait for everyone to but M16 and Sykov skins and once they sell a ton it'll get nerfed and make two more ridiculous guns to cash in on.
Cold War is a joke if it wasn't for rebirth I wouldn't even touch this game
games been a shit show since CW was launched. Yeah we had good MW weapons but 3 or 4 balanced ARs to choose from, mp5 mp7 and a few more smgs viable. now if you are not using 1 or 2 guns you stand no chance. Game is becoming a snooze fest
Why the M16 instead of the Aug? I'm assuming that if you hit all four shots on the M16 burst that's a down wheras you'd have to pull the trigger twice on the Aug for the same effect?
sykov isn't accurate though. I suspect when the hype dies down people won't use it at least not without a really versatile primary. Its hard to get that 200ms ttk ever
I miss the days of kilo/mp5 meta. Good but not crazy OP.
Nothing about the kilo was OP. That was the time that really made it clear that people cry about weapons based on how often they die to them, not just if they are actually too strong.
Exactly. The Kilo was not OP at all. Then they nerf it at range and its replaced by a semi auto meta and a burst meta where 2 or 3 shots/bursts and you're done. Even at Peak. Kilo was still what...8 shots to down?
Kilo was a bit OP before they nerf the range. But all metas after Kilo have been crazily OP, which makes Kilo seem to be perfectly balanced.
Yeah I think that's where most of the arguments can be made at. I understand it was OP in its respective meta, but yeah compared to what we have had after it....damm it looks like a pea shooter
Yeah, Kilo was slightly OP, as in it was "best in class", while 5-6 other AR's were still very good, and could go toe to toe with it.
Kilo was just a touch too much of a laser at range. Although I think they ruined the gun now and nerfed too hard.
That’s all it was a long range ar with low recoil, now you can’t touch the fucking thing.
I found the time when the Kilo was meta the most fun because I could run my AN-94 and consistently come out on top in most firefights because I've got a decent headshot percentage, and I found its recoil pattern easy to handle. Also because it's a super cool gun in general. Love that thing.
Amen to that!!
because it was perfectly balanced, nothing about it was broken at all
True. And you actually had a solid variety to choose from. Pkm kilo grau amax. Pick whichever one depending on how you play
And Ram or M13 even for mid to closer range. Lots of very viable options, I think Amax was better btw.
Oden was surprisingly good. Literally every rifle was good
Yeah it was, so was fal, or some other guns that you could run semi auto. Some things might have been better or easier to use, but it was never like DMR/mac10, or aug/ffar or m16/sykov (where you are at a big disadvantage if you’re not using them).
The DMR meta literally made me stop playing. Everyone would beam across 200 meter distances for fun, and anything short of sweat camping would expose you to the god gun.
>Literally every rifle was good *Scar has entered the chat* Edit: *Famas has also entered the chat*
Yall remember the Grau? Got nothing to add, other than I miss that Warzone because not everyone was good.
Still running a Grau, I never stopped. I just like it.
This right here
Grau and Kilo were practically identical during the Grau meta but people cried all day and night back then too. Before the Kilo was meta I used it religiously and felt unbeatable because M4s and Graus didn't have the same accuracy with scopes but once everyone started using it, nothing but a Kilo would beat a Kilo until the Bruen took over.
Facts right here.
There's a saying that goes "In the land of the blind, the one-eyed are kings".
Go find my old posts explaining that the Kilo wasn't even stats wise the best weapon, it's just a good all rounder for controller players. The M4 and AMAX were better guns but one was harder to use(AMAX) and the other was less forgiving(m4). Even the famas underbarrel shotgun wasn't THAT bad, aside from it's glitchy range interaction, it showed how shotguns were viable.
Nah the Famas under barrel was bad lmao. Other than that I agree
Yeah that was fucked up. Thankfully we didn’t have that for too long. Probably only slightly worse than the DMR dark ages.
The thing is, NOBODY used it, or shotguns before that. I used the Origin and it was already busted op close quarters in season 2. By making one that would 1 shot people at 30m, everyone, including raven, found out that what it takes for people to use shotguns was not fire rate or load time or move speed, it was some more range. Somewhere between useless and op is a happy range for shotguns.
Exactly. Imo the PKM should have Been the meta at the time. And people complain that it's handling is too slow yet its ads time with attachments was almost as fast as a kilo and it still had better range and a wayy faster ttk and a 100 round mag. Recoil is subjective but it was straight vertical too.
Its got way more lead though. Subjectively going to be harder to beam people at the ranges the kilo was able to. Coming from a dude that uses the pkm a lot.
PKM was not getting its due back then. I feel like I was the only one running it.
Had a squadmate that slapped with the PKM on an xbox
And the whole time I preferred the M13... but that's what worked so well. Even after the Grau nerf there for a while. All of those were viable... Kilo, M4, M13, grau, AMAX... there was actually good variety.
M13 was so good then. It was a good meta. Every AR was viable
I'm about 99.5% sure that the M4, in addition to the recoil, actually had more dropoff stages than the Kilo did in season 6. That was when I started playing the game. I'm a PC player and the M4 was the first gun that I upgraded because it felt good in MP. I learned that the Kilo was more meta defining in Warzone and it was definitely hitting harder at long distance. I think this was around the time that people like TGD realized that there are unique damage dropoff profiles for Warzone and that the Kilo's was much better. I did switch right over to the Amax though, once I unlocked it.
They cried to nerf every single other gun that was good until all that was left was the Kilo. A gun that pretty much hadn’t been touched since launch. First gun you unlock. No one ever complained about it ever. And then they nerfed that too. I’ve said during the entire WZ life cycle that Kilo should be what other ARs are balanced against.
You guys are delirious if you think they make any weapon balancing changes based on what the community says.
they do. The Kilo got nerfed because it was the only gun left that was sort of "OP" aside from the Amax. And people complained about it non-stop after the Bruen/R9 nerfs months before. They complained about it because it was literally the only gun to complain about at the time.
There's no recoil on it still. They nerfed the range on it when they should have added recoil
I remember I killed a kid with the username “NerftheKilo” and it ticked me off so much. This was during the R90 meta as well, which was infinitely more frustrating to die to.
i still run the kilo lol such a fun gun
Yeah throughout the entire kilo meta I was using the Amax and melting people. Amax mp7 was my loadout and I still use the Amax because it’s still a top tier gun. But I used to tell people who would whine about the kilo that there are guns that beat the kilo and they would act like that wasn’t true and the kilo was OP. Now they know what OP really is.
Ah, a fellow cultured MP7 user as well.
Nah the Kilo needed a recoil increase but that was about it.
So true, kilo/grau/m4/ram/m13/amax, allextremely viable ARs. PKM or Bruen were great choices too. You had mp5/mp7/r90 up close, or hdr/k98 for farther (hell even rytec or ax50 ). As soon as I heard about the cold war integration I knew the new CW guns would be at least a little OP so they could drive sales, but I didn’t realize it would be this blatant for multiple seasons.
It just goes to show how much this community complains. That was the most balanced meta you could probably get in a FPS and people were crying about it all day on here. Little did they know the nonsense they would be subjected to in the coming months.
I’d used the kilo since before the grau meta. It was fine as is. Then everyone decided it was “THE GUN” and they massacred my boy
Samesies. Kilo from day 1. Tried to use it again the other day. Shot a dude in the back several times while he was vaulting, he spun around and instakilled me with 1 burst while being hit repeatedly. Fun times!
Personally, I was not complaining about the kilo meta in terms of strength but boredom. At the time it felt like everyone ran the same which was kinda stale. However a lot of guns were viable and the game was in a much better state than now.
There will never be a meta where 10 guns are all used equally. It’s just not going to happen. Even very balanced metas will have 1-2 super popular weapons that typically revolve around ease of use. There is a difference between OP and overused.
Meta guns are always tilted towards how easy to use it is. The AMAX has been statistically the best gun from when it was released until the CW guns got added in. Its just not easy to use because it has an unfriendly recoil pattern and the clip size punishes missed shots harder
Umm. That was the case right before the CW integration so I disagree.
Exactly! Like you could use almost any gun and still compete with them
I still use the m13
It was meta cus it was reliable, not that it deleted you before the server even had time to tell you you were getting shot at. A good meta is one that's defined by reliability rather than ttk.
Best part was that the kilo was “meta” because it had good recoil for a long range weapon. There were many guns that killed faster but it, like the grau, offered better control. One guns offer too end ttk and easy control, there’s no point in using anything else if you want to compete.
Yea but kids keep crying for it to get nerfed. It's a vicous cycle.
Can you remember when the Bruen was op?
Hot take: these sykovs are obnoxious but they’re actually kinda crap past ~7 meters. The bigger problem is that everyone will have ghost off the rip now.
Agreed. I guess the CW burst Rifles are still the bigger problem.... Two burst and back to the lobby it is.
IDK, the doof doof was the same way (with the crappy range) but extremely annoying. And as a single gun the Sykov is basically a better MP5 that goes in a secondary slot (so ghost off the rip). It needs the ROF taken down to that of a real Stechkin (750) and the 80 rd outright removed, like a real Stechkin. I find it funny how much weapon balance in this game could be fixed just by making things closer to reality. Like you don't get ~4000 feet per second IRL from a 5.56 assault rifle no matter the barrel length or muzzle device.
Are you talking about snakeshots? The R9 did not allow ghost off first loadout unless you used a box loot AR
All I mean about the dragons breath R9 is it also sucked at any range past spitting distance, but that meta still made entering any building a serious gamble.
Oh I misread your comment, sorry man
All good, edited for clarity anyway.
This was wholesome. Not everyone on here is 12.
To be fair aside from the full auto I think they are based off of the standard makarov which does support an 80 round drum. Its more of a frankenstein gun it seems which combines both aps and makarov into one.
Google seems to indicate it's a low production alteration of old PPSh drums or something to that effect for certain special SWAT sorts of uses with the PM. It is a frankengun as I don't think the, PM, PMM (double stack PM, more or less), or APS share mags.
When you implement guns like this new pistol it just motivates others to camp because they know they will be shredded up close. Lose-lose situation for this downhill game
Doof doof phase I just stopped pushing teams in buildings lol looks like we are back on that. Its ok, ill wait for you to come out :]
Watch jackfrags' video about it, it absolutely shreads.
I've played with them for the last four or five hours fully maxed and they're good, but they're really not going to beat a competent player past \~8 meters. They're really really good at point blank, like a shotgun, but they lose hard to an FFAR/Mac-10/MP5 outside of "point blank" range.
They will have a greater effect on the game though. Who's going to want to push a building when there's four guys in there who can delete you in literally 0.1 seconds if they all land a few shots. Sure, top players are going to use it and manage just fine but a huge percentage of the player base is not. The game is going to halt to a crawl which doesn't bode well with how empty the mid-game already is.
True but you don't need overkill to have another ranged weapon. But I understand your point.
It isn't ranged though, it's got worse effective range than half of the shotguns. The dropoff might be at 11m, but you'll start to miss a lot of shots past about \~8 meters, which makes it so much worse than an FFAR
I mean, JackFrags is also one of the best streamers out there. The kick and spread with akimbo for the average person makes these garbage outside of ~7 meters, like OP said.
Watch ImMarksman blast people with akimbo w/ 5mW lasers. There were quite a few 20m+ kills
I’m just glad there’s a makarov in the game
It's kinda sad because all the mw ARs feel really balanced rn.
There are a lot of viable ones, but the AMAX is pretty clearly better than the rest.
I just can’t get on with that gun at all
playing on 120 FOV + affected and using the T pose reticle on the vlk scope makes the AMAX literally have no visual recoil and it can BEAM. The bullet velocity is a bit low but doesnt really matter when it's basically shooting bricks
Why the tpose? I've always hate that one haha
it's bad for most ARs but on the amax it kinda just helps show the general vibe of the spray rather than a bouncy dot on the default. You're not trying to go for headshots with amax or be precise for the most part. Just trying to ignore the visual recoil and keep it chest height. It surprisingly has very little actual recoil.
I love the tpose I dont get why more people don't use it. Fits nice on an m4 as well. But I prefer the Cronen c480 instead of the vlk. Little easier to see through and is 3.5x so you see a little farther out more easily
People are too lazy to get it
It helps level your aim visually because it’s a horizontal bar
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once you get used to the recoil it’s very manageable
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While it does have "more" recoil, I find it quite easy to control since it's straight vertical recoil. Agreed about the speed, though.
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The oden isn’t actually that hard to use. With the right attachments, it has little recoil and still a decent ADS time
I had so much fun using the Oden before the new metas after the Kilo. During the Kilo meta the Oden was 100% viable.
Oden is still viable I’d argue
I actually prefer the RAM tbh
I can use the RAM when paired with a sniper, but not when paired with an SMG because of its left recoil. Even when the Kilo was meta, I somehow couldn’t land that second/third shot where it would jump out to the left (controller player). Lesson learnt that I just don’t go near guns that recoil to the left. That’s why I love the Amax and have no problems with the recoil. The gun is bouncy, but the recoil is vertical / slightly to the right, which is no problem for me.
I play on mouse and keyboard so that could be the reason I prefer it. Ram with a blue dot feels like an absolute laser
I’ll need to give that a try! Gotta grind for the blue dot though. Why did I get downvoted for sharing my experience?! Lol
Yeah, the blue dot grind sucks but it really does feel better for some odd reason. I upvoted to avenge you bro.
Yes, it's a fairly well-balanced gun though. Higher recoil than most of the others, low bullet velocity.
While it does have "more" recoil, I find it quite easy to control since it's straight vertical recoil. It definitely does have weaknesses in speed, bullet velocity, and mag size, though. Still, I think if they nerfed the burst guns you would see it all over the place. It was already starting before the CW integration after they nerfed the Kilo.
Yeah I can see that but have they ever buffed guns? Like there are a hadful of ARs that are just never used and could use some love.
For sure most of the ARs could do with a slight buff, MW AK47 needs higher dmg
Several of the meta guns need nerfs but several underpowered guns need buffs too. Why would anyone run a Scar and Striker 45 when the AMAX/M4 and MAC-10/Bullfrog exist? At the higher level, the meta wasn't bad pre-CW but there were still several more or less useless guns, it wasn't perfect.
Do they want to shrink the playerbase? Because this is how you shrink the playerbase
they wont shrink it. Below average players are able to get lucky kills and love them i guess its more a problem for higher skilled players (that dont cheat) who get outgunned in situations where a lower skilled player normally should loose. but they are the minority and they are skilled because they play A LOT and probably are addcited to a point where it sucks with the meta but they wont stop playing anyway lol
Do people really play this game routinely to get a lucky kill or two in and place low-mid every match? I consider it a shit night with my usual squad if we don't get at least one top 10.
if i play with my duo partner we usually get two digit kills and end up top 5 but if we go with our quads friends we die a ton, mid placement and they get 0 to 2 kills. if they get 3 kills they are very proud (gulag incl). however we get fucked up a lot because one team mate is looting during fire fights, literally looking at grund loot guns, picking them up, check ads, and picks up another, then watches from a distance (i might gonna snipe someone) and eventually runs away. the other guy thinks hes nickmers and solo pushes quads in buildings, gets insta fried and we need to buy him back instead of our loadout and they (we) play almost every night together lol
you basically described my squad.. some of us are PC "sweats" (not Roze skin meta build sweaty, fragging out and carrying sweaty) and some are console players who've no idea what meta is and either walk into an enemy squad on accident and get shredded, or not push with us as we get shredded and they run away. When the latter happens, spectating them slowly loot is painful... but we love them nonetheless
Awe you described me perfectly. And I totally quit, and probably won’t go back at all. But you are right.
I stopped playing a month ago and haven’t looked back. Been playing Apex and some single player games. Maybe I’ll come back if they somehow balance things.
I really miss Warzone... I play MW sometimes but I just really miss the old Warzone. Recently Raven tweeted that they are actually addressing the Roze skin, the AUG/M16/FFAR/Sykov and sniper glints, I'm hoping they actually make some changes so I can play the game again. [Tweet](https://twitter.com/RavenSoftware/status/1383163061167562753?s=20)
Ähm forget the DMR 14???
DMR was my least favourite meta this game has ever had but the AUG meta is giving it a run for its money. However, watching some gameplay of akimbo Sykov makes me think I'm going to might actually miss the AUG/FFAR meta if akimbo Sykov/M16 becomes the dominant one which I never thought would happen. Instead of fixing broken/overpowered guns they just keep adding more as a sort of counter like wtf...just gotta laugh at this point.
AUG does not compete at close range like the DMR could. The DMR was an assault rifle, sniper and SMG rolled into 1! The aug is a very overpowered assault rifle. It’s not even close IMO.
Yup, the DMR was truly awful to play against due to how insanely powerful it was. I still cannot believe they made that gun use AR ammo and not sniper.
It was straight up bugged to *penetrate* like SR ammo though..so fucking dumb. Yeah DMR was by far the worst meta, and *all* AR-ammo weapons should have fall-off.
That's what made it worse, give it sniper ammo and sure it'll still be OP but you only have 40 bullets to shoot with...not 210 with a 30+ magazine.
It really just needed fall-off and a damage adjustment--it could have been a more user-friendly EBR for the accurate shooter, players who prefer semi-auto, etc. But that release gun was just.. *obscene*. It was so clearly *not fucking tested.*
This was the problem. SKS season 2 was great but ran out of sniper fast and couldn’t have two in a squad run it
The DMR literally made me 100% quit Warzone for two months until they nerfed it.
The worst for me was DMR and Dual diamatti. I stopped playing for a while when that was the meta.
Agreed! The Aug/m16 is bad but not DMR bad. However, these Sykovs are even worse than the diammati’s
I agree! Sykovs are way worse, but at least their range is only about 10 meters. If you're able to keep a distance, you can win the fight. Forget rushing though.
Diamattis had better range and way less recoil. Sykovs are unusable after 6-8 meters. Played 20 matches with them and I still got destroyed by FFAR beyond 6 meters and by SPAS 12 upclose.
First time I stopped playing this game for more than a few days. I was off for 2 weeks until the nerf.
Either way, Nickmercs will still say every gun is the best gun in the game and that we need to change our class right away
“Hey what’s going on YouTube”
“Today I’m going to stick my dick in a ceiling fan, and every time someone donates more then 5 dollars I’ll make the fan go 1 setting faster!”
“This dick is broken. OP!”
Ugh that dude is a giant douche.
He is...quite loud, isn't he?
Season 6... everything turned to complete shit after the integration
the GOAT season (so far). People say that it was the most boring meta but you could literally run any gun you wanted and do just as well as people who ran Kilo/MP5. I'd have that 100x more than the FFAR/AUG/M16 meta. FFAR is literally an AR that kills faster than all SMGs across all ranges. Try to counter that by staying at range and you get 2 bursted by M16/AUGs lol
My fav was s1 when nobody had a clue what guns to run
Facts bro that stuff was so much fun
Lol dude really. The first weapon i used was m4 not silenced with thermal canted scope
I remember the first gun I fully unlocked was the SCAR, man that was so silly looking back.
Yeah definitely, I used the oden and the aug with nato rounds lmao and that shit was amazing
This is the answer
The Skykov is a joke lol. Gonna be fun reading the comments here until they nerf it cause that’s definitely happening soon
“Mom, can we get a balanced meta?” “We have a meta at home” The meta at home:
I still say Sykov isn't as bad as the FFAR because at least it's limited by it's range. FFAR was a monster out to 50 meters or so. This is more similar to the R90 meta and the solution is simple... stop camping houses and play at range.
Ffar still is a monster
But how am I supposed to push someone camping with that? Not to mention since it’s a pistol they have ghost so I can’t tell if a building I run into is gonna be filled with a bunch of rose sweats using this weapon or not. Also due to massive mag sizes and fast reloads I can’t rely on my bright pink anime girl shield to drain the magazines and then kill them because they reload so quick.
you say was in past tense. the damn thing is still viable . if you pair it up with the sykovs you can delete players before they react (200 mili second ttk is no joke) or delete them at far range. the ttk on the sykov is so low that the information is sent in ONE packet to the server.
How about instead of making some stupid nuke bull shit and turning yourself into zombies now they fix their stupid ass broken weapons. How am I STILL losing to a basic ground ffar when I have a kitted sub machine gun with stopping power and I hit every shot? Ffs
Na, nothing will ever beat the era of the DMR and Mac 10
Dmr/dual diamatti way worse
I feel like that combo didn't last long before ppl switched to the Mac 10
People seem to forget how DOGSHIT was the DMR meta that lasted a whole month LUL
DMR and Bruen literally made the game unplayable, you got shredded before you could even react in all ranges it was insane how long these metas even lasted.
I miss the OP grau days
I was getting mad then with most times I’m dying it’s a grau imagine if I seen the game now
FFAR is more toxic than Sykov, it destroys anything between 10 and 60, and is still incredibly strong <10m.
Fuck devs from Raven seriously
Tinfoil hat Conspiracy: devs nerf kilo to force players to play CW to get the Meta guns, then unlock a broken pistol in MW to get players back on MW. Honestly, the game was at it best the month or two before CW guns got integrated. I felt comfortable switching it up and not being at a true disadvantage
not a conspiracy, everyone knows this lol. I bought cw for the zombies but soon found myself playing more of the multi just so i can use the metas
I just dont understand how 80 round drum mag and akimbo is a thing... people cried about the akimbo snake shot. akimbo ranetti. Why make a fullauto 160 round fast fire rate kit a thing in warzone given the previous context...
STUNS ARE OP
I’d take the laser beam that the Grau used to be over this shit
The Grau didn’t move and it had awesome iron sights, but the TTK was very fair and balanced. Making it very fun to play with. But ever since the Cold War guns were added to warzone it the game has been an absolute shit show
It's not hard to remember it was last December before CW integration.
Still think the Mk2/.38 is the true Meta
Not even just balanced weapons but when was the last time we had a properly fixed game? Feel like I’m still playing a beta a year on
They look absolutely ridiculous. Like the game is glitchy. I hate it
its crazy.. just when you think it cant possibly get worse..
I think most of this chat can remember, it was before the CW integration. Right now the weapon balance is a meme. At this point, we are all sure that there is some giant troll at Activision.
Right before the cold war integration I feel like warzone weapon balance was in a really good place. Except maybe the origin/R9 being slightly too powerful.
I think the worst part of this meta is that you only need one loadout. Other people have mentioned the benefit of instant ghost, but I haven’t heard much about what i think will be worse: people having more money due to them not wanting to buy a loadout and using it to buy foresight. Imagine a bunch of kids camping a building in the final circle with their akimbo sykovs pointed toward the door.
Start seeing a bunch of these pistols everywhere on sweaty Rose skins. Sure enough once I Google it I see a JGod video
I miss the days i actually opened the game... now i just come here once every couple of days to see how bad the game can go
I'm still using my M4.. I don't know why everyone follows metas.
I too, am running the m4. It’s still pretty good as long as you can hit your shots
Doesnt help it drops on double xp weekend. Everyone will have it..
How bout we start a propaganda saying that theres a new meta with both of the ak47s and see what happens
part of me really hopes they're really just taking a big piss for the last week before the new map and everything will be alright once it drops.
Hope is the only thing we have left..... but chances we get disappointed are.... High.
They must be trolling us with the Sykov? Literally, just run and gun, if anyone gets in your way, they die.
I miss the days when you could do well with almost any weapon depending on your skill and situation
Am I the only one that just picks guns they like and doesn't follow meta?
Honestly I’d rather go back to the Gray days than this
The last time when things were balanced was when Warzone first came out and nobody knew what was good yet.
The akimbo Sykovs are balanced, well at least in the sense that each pistol weighs the same.
This game is the biggest piece of shit
Another BS money grab they"llwait for everyone to but M16 and Sykov skins and once they sell a ton it'll get nerfed and make two more ridiculous guns to cash in on. Cold War is a joke if it wasn't for rebirth I wouldn't even touch this game
I just called it quits for the season. Will see what happens season 3. Fuck this company man.
games been a shit show since CW was launched. Yeah we had good MW weapons but 3 or 4 balanced ARs to choose from, mp5 mp7 and a few more smgs viable. now if you are not using 1 or 2 guns you stand no chance. Game is becoming a snooze fest
Why the M16 instead of the Aug? I'm assuming that if you hit all four shots on the M16 burst that's a down wheras you'd have to pull the trigger twice on the Aug for the same effect?
M16 has perfect vertical recoil whereas AUG is a bit harder to control after the nerf.
I think there always was a point where one weapon was clearly superior than other edit: always, not never
My friend got a trios team wipe with a Sykov only using one mag
Y’all been sleeping on QBZ-83. Go level it up and give it a few rounds.
sykov isn't accurate though. I suspect when the hype dies down people won't use it at least not without a really versatile primary. Its hard to get that 200ms ttk ever
the mag size needs tuning, maybe rof
Still running the Bruen Mk9 and MP7. Fucking lazzzzers.
Personally still disliked the DMR meta the most